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• 2[00:02:03] <FIUBOT> Thanks a lot guys
• 3[00:02:08] <FIUBOT> Have a nice weekend
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• 86[01:09:09] <Unplesantry> how come i cant ping my own machine
• 87[01:09:16] <Unplesantry> from aws
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• 90[01:10:25] <emlen> how to lunch a program from terminal minimized
• 91[01:11:11] <HelloShitty> hello peeps
• 92[01:11:21] <HelloShitty> What does this command do:
• 93[01:11:41] <HelloShitty> cat > /some/folder/some.file <<EOF
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• 95[01:11:59] <emlen> lunch it minimized to ....not minimize it later
• 96[01:12:27] <Unplesantry> why cant i ping my computer
• 97[01:12:30] <Unplesantry> from outside
• 98[01:12:48] <HelloShitty> Shouldn't this create a file called some.file inside /some/folder and store the contents of stdin until EOF is found?
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• 103[01:17:36] <uio> Hi! Would you recommend Thunderbird or Evolution? Or neither?
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• 108[01:23:42] <trek00> uio: thunderbird is really easy, but i use claws-mail that is much much more faster and with better fine grained configuration, i don't know evolution
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• 110[01:24:39] <uio> trek00, Cool. Yeah, I've tried Claws, but have found it kinda complicated...
• 111[01:25:08] <uio> How is my Thunderbird the most recent version ? I thought the Debian repos would be a bit behind...
• 112[01:25:17] <uio> Thunderbird 60.8.0
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• 114[01:25:52] <uio> and it's same version as this one here (which I didn't download: replaced-url
• 115[01:27:18] <uio> It says I'm using the 'daily' version.
• 116[01:27:22] <trek00> uio: debian uses the last LTS release of firefox/thunderbird
• 117[01:27:34] <uio> I don't get it. I'm sure I got this from the repos.
• 118[01:28:04] <uio> trek00, Ah, so maybe 60.8.0 is LTS?
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• 121[01:28:48] <uio> Yep, same as on packages.debian.org
• 122[01:28:50] <uio> Cool.
• 123[01:28:59] <uio> Anyway, don't get that, but works for me.
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• 129[01:31:34] <trek00> Unplesantry: the instance is up and running?
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• 132[01:33:36] <trek00> HelloShitty: yes
• 133[01:34:11] <HelloShitty> what does COMMIT do before I type EOF?
• 134[01:34:36] <HelloShitty> like I run that command,
• 135[01:34:43] <HelloShitty> I type some commands to stdin
• 136[01:34:46] <HelloShitty> and then
• 137[01:34:48] <HelloShitty> COMMIT
• 138[01:34:49] <HelloShitty> EOF
• 139[01:34:55] <HelloShitty> what oes COMMIT do?
• 140[01:35:24] <trek00> HelloShitty: COMMIT will be written to the file, it seems an sql command
• 141[01:35:53] <HelloShitty> ok, ok
• 142[01:36:12] <hop> context is for peasants
• 143[01:36:22] <HelloShitty> So looks like all commands typed into stdin, stays there until COMMIT is issued and EOF simply closes the file pointer
• 144[01:36:27] <HelloShitty> probably just like in C
• 145[01:36:41] <humpled> heredocs :þ
• 146[01:37:19] <trek00> HelloShitty: all lines typed to stdin are sent to stdout until EOF is encountered
• 147[01:37:43] <hop> like, it's exactly like that, only not at all ;)
• 148[01:37:46] <HelloShitty> ahh, I see
• 149[01:37:52] <HelloShitty> ok, I got it now
• 150[01:37:57] <HelloShitty> I misunderstood you
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• 160[01:47:23] <uio> How can I look in a tar archive wihout extracting?
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• 180[02:11:56] <jim> uio, man tar, look for the t command
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• 190[02:26:36] <qid|ydl> is there a programming API to interact with apt/dpkg and/or any language bindings? I think the answer is yes because there seems to be a python module with some support but its documentation site is down so I can't find any information on using it
• 191[02:27:47] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 192[02:28:01] <qid|ydl> replaced-url
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• 196[02:33:25] <trek00> qid|ydl: you can install python-apt-doc package
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• 201[02:45:11] <qid|ydl> trek00: thanks! that helps, at least there's some docs
• 202[02:49:27] <trek00> :)
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• 210[03:01:34] <jim> SerajewelKS, hi, around?
• 211[03:02:58] <ZaZaGX> hi
• 212[03:03:15] <ZaZaGX> you remind me of Jimbuntu
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• 233[03:29:02] <SerajewelKS> jim: here and there. kids' bedtime.
• 234[03:29:08] <SerajewelKS> jim: i can reply when i'm able
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• 236[03:30:41] <jim> SerajewelKS, oh, hi.
• 237[03:32:13] <jim> SerajewelKS, here's my present situation: I think it was you who gave me the commands to stop pulseaudio, and to start it up again... so I put those in a pair of shell scripts
• 238[03:32:35] <SerajewelKS> jim: nice. you could do it in one script too
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• 242[03:33:17] <jim> well I just wanted those two so I could stop it, examine or edit things, and start again
• 243[03:33:45] <jim> so, what can I provide you in the way of info?
• 244[03:33:55] *** Quits: vdehors (~vdehors@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 245[03:34:35] <SerajewelKS> well... i don't know. :)
• 246[03:34:53] <SerajewelKS> i don't know what the question is or what you're stuck on
• 247[03:35:46] <jim> ok, brief aside: a couple times, I tried to call you from this channel, and a couple of folks complained...
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• 251[03:36:10] <jim> so, is there a different or better way of contacting you?
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• 253[03:36:25] <SerajewelKS> nobody should complain if you're only pinging me once an hour or so
• 254[03:36:56] <SerajewelKS> if they are then just ignore them
• 255[03:37:05] <jim> oh believe me, there were complaints... and at that point, my rate was like once a day
• 256[03:37:07] <SerajewelKS> i'm usually on here when i have free time
• 257[03:37:07] *** Quits: sidmo_ (~ident@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 258[03:37:25] <SerajewelKS> unless it's the ops telling you to stop then just ignore them
• 259[03:37:39] <jim> not that I know of
• 260[03:37:55] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 261[03:38:09] <SerajewelKS> you're welcome to PM me too, but once you reach me we should continue discussing here, because others might learn from the discussion
• 262[03:38:13] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
• 263[03:38:35] <jim> that sounds like a good solution
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• 265[03:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1492
• 266[03:39:30] <jim> ok, when I stop pulseaudio, I can start jack, and then audio works through it (tried jack_metro)
• 267[03:40:30] <jim> what I want to have, is jack and pulse running at the same time... that way, youtube videos work, and jack connected things work as well
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• 273[03:42:53] *** Parts: Guest39 (adefe8aa@replaced-ip) ()
• 274[03:43:46] <jim> I'm about to see if that all still works
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• 277[03:46:00] <jim> another question I had, is how do you programmatically get which sockets have plugs in them
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• 285[03:52:15] <SerajewelKS> jim: "what I want to have, is jack and pulse running at the same time..." <-- this is exactly what will happen if you run "pulseaudio --start" while jackd is running. at least, it happens for me.
• 286[03:52:34] <SerajewelKS> jim: pulse should start with two sinks: a dummy sink (which is always there and sends audio nowhere) and a jack sink, which will send audio to jack
• 287[03:52:50] <SerajewelKS> jim: the corresponding jack source should automatically get patched to the jack hardware sinks
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• 290[03:56:51] <SerajewelKS> jim: as far as the programming question, there's probably multiple ways to do that. it would help to know which programming language you're using. (e.g. bash, python, etc.)
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• 300[04:02:39] <jim> well I am pretty handy with pyton (sorry for delay, fell asleep in chair)
• 301[04:02:42] *** Joins: detre (uid338027@replaced-ip)
• 302[04:02:49] <detre> Hello
• 303[04:02:56] <jim> hi
• 304[04:03:00] *** Joins: Dio2O (~tma@replaced-ip)
• 305[04:03:07] <detre> I'm having driver install problem
• 306[04:03:21] <detre> replaced-url
• 307[04:03:49] <magic_ninja> guys, I can't get anything to work right :(
• 308[04:04:06] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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• 311[04:04:15] <detre> Debian installer is refusing to detect the firmware
• 312[04:04:38] <jim> turn 180 degrees, and try getting it to work left :)
• 313[04:04:43] *** Quits: Whiskey (~Whiskey@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 314[04:04:48] <magic_ninja> detre, you trying the non-free installer?
• 315[04:05:29] <detre> Magic_ninja I'm using the debian 10.0 gname+nonfree
• 316[04:05:58] <detre> And I have a second drive with firmware too
• 317[04:06:14] <jim> detre, one sec, I have an image you can try... what cpu?
• 318[04:06:55] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 319[04:07:01] <magic_ninja> jim, lol my repairs have failed on most things this week.
• 320[04:07:02] <jim> magic_ninja, what are you having problems with right now?
• 321[04:07:12] <magic_ninja> thankfully, not debain :)
• 322[04:07:15] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
• 323[04:07:32] <detre> its the wifi drivers right?
• 324[04:08:10] <SerajewelKS> jim: replaced-url
• 325[04:08:51] <magic_ninja> I installed a brand new flow switch on a heat skid for a glycol cooling system for a winery I built. Then, went to do a quick repair of the door luck actuator on my car, and can't get the linkage connecting rods to come loose. Then, this morning, I went to stack two cups "into" each other to take to the sink and didn't realize one was full of water. It splashed all over my keyboard.
• 326[04:08:55] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 327[04:08:57] <magic_ninja> What a day. I'm taking this weekend off.
• 328[04:08:58] <jim> which wifi card do you have? could you run: lspci -nn | grep -i net # look at that output and I'll tell you what info I need once you do that
• 329[04:09:15] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
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• 332[04:13:22] <detre> jim: that command is not working when i drop to console
• 333[04:13:38] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
• 334[04:13:55] <detre> got it
• 335[04:14:13] <detre> just ran lspci -nn
• 336[04:14:22] <magic_ninja> you need all of it
• 337[04:15:29] <detre> replaced-url
• 338[04:16:14] <detre> broadcome limited BCM43228
• 339[04:16:24] <detre> broadcom limited BCM43228
• 340[04:17:18] <jim> how many lines do you get when you run it with the grep?
• 341[04:17:45] <detre> it gave me a error
• 342[04:18:00] *** Quits: tnozyrox (~tnozyrox@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 343[04:18:02] <jim> also... a handy pastebin: if you have nc installed, you can pastebin the output of an arbitrary command, for example ls -CF if you run it like this: ls -CF | nc termbin.com 9999.
• 344[04:18:07] <coruja> ,i broadcom-sta-dkms
• 345[04:18:08] <judd> Package broadcom-sta-dkms (non-free/kernel, optional) in buster/amd64: dkms source for the Broadcom STA Wireless driver. Version: 6.30.223.271-10; Size: 2156.0k; Installed: 14139k; Homepage: replaced-url
• 346[04:18:23] *** Quits: diniwed (~gavron@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 347[04:18:36] <detre> jim: The laptop has no network access because no driver
• 348[04:18:57] <jim> ok
• 349[04:18:57] <magic_ninja> plug it in with a cable to do the install, then get your wireless working.
• 350[04:19:11] <magic_ninja> replaced-url
• 351[04:19:26] <magic_ninja> so, I'm going to butt out now. Hope that helps. Sorry for interrupting jim.
• 352[04:19:31] <jim> howbout: you could install just the base, and then configure the net after?
• 353[04:19:41] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 354[04:19:59] <detre> yeah ok
• 355[04:20:06] <jim> one sec
• 356[04:20:27] * detre goes to grab a network cable
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• 360[04:23:00] <detre> ok i'm booted to the desktop
• 361[04:23:11] <detre> so how should i go about installing the driver?
• 362[04:23:58] <ksk> detre: what is your initial question/problem? are you trying to install debian and you are in need of non-free drivers? Might I then suggest you take a look at the (non-official) installer with added non-free firmare?
• 363[04:24:29] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
• 364[04:24:34] <detre> ksk that is what i'm using but its still not working
• 365[04:25:00] <detre> ksk so the last option i have is manuel driver install then?
• 366[04:25:03] <detre> right?
• 367[04:25:05] <ksk> !not working
• 368[04:25:05] <dpkg> "Doesn't work" is a vague statement. Does it sit on the couch all day long? Does it procrastinate doing the dishes? Does it beg on the street for change? Please be specific! Define 'it' and what it isn't doing. Give us more details so we can help you without needing to ask basic questions like "what's the error message?". Ask me about <smart questions>, <sicco> and <errors>.
• 369[04:25:23] <trek00> detre: if it booted and you have the package, you can install with dpkg -i package.deb
• 370[04:25:27] *** Quits: Thedarkb-X40 (~beno@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 371[04:25:52] <ksk> If you grabbed a cable, just install the driver? :)
• 372[04:25:55] <detre> dpkg: debian is telling me that no wlan card is detected
• 373[04:25:55] <dpkg> cannot alter locked factoids, detre
• 374[04:25:55] <EdePopede> for mpv there don't seem to be any extra packages installed. in mpv there's nothing related to scripting. but the manpage talks all the time about scripting and ytdl seems to be a script which is nowhere but still works. so where is all this stuff on debian?
• 375[04:25:56] <dpkg> i don't know, detre
• 376[04:25:57] <jim> ohhh,,,, there's my factoid!
• 377[04:26:03] <jim> !sicco
• 378[04:26:04] <dpkg> Please ask sicco questions, questions that are Specific, Informative, Concise, Complete, and On-topic. Ask me about <research> and <cooperation in asking for help>.
• 379[04:26:26] <jim> wow, that's an old one :)
• 380[04:26:51] <ksk> EdePopede: did you try the obvious "apt search mpv | less"?
• 381[04:27:09] <ksk> often, software has -extra packages in Debian.
• 382[04:27:12] *** Quits: Cabanossi (~Cabanossi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
• 383[04:27:30] <EdePopede> i did the obvious dpkg -l *mpv* and there's nothing else. and no dependencies on mpv or recs or suggestions. just plain nada.
• 384[04:27:31] <trek00> EdePopede: it should be a youtube-dl packge
• 385[04:27:35] <jim> detre, are you trying to install debian right now?
• 386[04:27:56] <ksk> detre: I think someone already told you -which- package to install, right? And you have a running debian without network connection?
• 387[04:28:13] <EdePopede> trek00: sure. but youtube-dl doesn't implement interpretation of youtube-dl stuff into mpv
• 388[04:28:14] <detre> jim: I have it installed and booted now but no working wifi driver
• 389[04:28:18] <ksk> detre: dpkg is a bot btw.
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• 391[04:29:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1485
• 392[04:29:03] <ksk> detre: so, can you easily plugin a cable, and make that debian box connect to the internet this way?
• 393[04:29:10] <jim> detre, did you have to "leave the net unconfigured" to get it to install?
• 394[04:29:19] <trek00> EdePopede: about scripting, as mpv can be called from command line, you can include it in a shell script easily
• 395[04:29:34] <detre> ksk: Yes i have a network cable connected now
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• 397[04:29:46] <detre> jim:
• 398[04:29:47] <EdePopede> ostinato/oldstable,oldstable 0.8-1+b1 amd64
• 399[04:29:47] <EdePopede> Packet/Traffic Generator and Analyzer
• 400[04:29:55] <EdePopede> 'apt search' is really strange
• 401[04:30:04] <detre> no i just configed the lan network at setup
• 402[04:30:26] <trek00> EdePopede: it search on descriptions too
• 403[04:30:35] <jim> SerajewelKS, I'll look at the python jack client module another time... the main thing now is to get both working and coexisting
• 404[04:30:56] <EdePopede> trek00: that's not the point. there's NOTHING related to scripts in the package and it is the only one. and the manpage clearly mentions a ytdl script.
• 405[04:31:19] *** Joins: kts (~kts@replaced-ip)
• 406[04:31:30] <jim> detre, was it able to get an IP address from dhcp?
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• 409[04:31:52] <detre> jim: yes, with a network cable
• 410[04:31:56] <trek00> EdePopede: what's your question?
• 411[04:32:08] *** Quits: shirak (~shirak@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 412[04:32:16] <jim> perfect... then you can install as much as you want...
• 413[04:32:48] <jim> did you connect the cable just before booting the netinstall image to install debian?
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• 417[04:33:19] <jim> or, did you install the base, reboot and then connect the cable?
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• 421[04:33:49] <EdePopede> and as a bonus i can't even find out about build options. replaced-url
• 422[04:34:00] <detre> jim: I installed base+gnome then connected after the install
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• 425[04:34:30] <EdePopede> and as an extra bonus the manpage doesn't even mention JS, only Lua.
• 426[04:34:33] <jim> detre, so you have a gui going now?
• 427[04:34:42] <detre> jim: yes
• 428[04:34:52] <jim> perfect...
• 429[04:34:53] *** Quits: digin4 (~digin4@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 430[04:35:00] <EdePopede> trek00: so where's the scripting stuff on debian? ytdl wrapper script, files for lua and js support...?
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• 434[04:36:01] <jim> detre, let's see if you can install the package referred to earlier...
• 435[04:36:40] <detre> jim: Ok, what was it called? apt-get to install it?
• 436[04:36:47] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 437[04:36:54] <trek00> EdePopede: there is nothing special on debian about mpv, you should ask these questions to mpv community
• 438[04:37:14] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
• 439[04:37:38] <EdePopede> sure it is. citing from the manpage: /etc/mpv/mpv.conf mpv system-wide settings
• 440[04:37:47] <EdePopede> debian is special most of the time
• 441[04:37:53] *** Quits: code_falcon (~hugo@replaced-ip) (Quit: leaving)
• 442[04:38:04] <EdePopede> like this file exists only in the man page, which wasn't updated
• 443[04:38:05] <jim> yes, I can't tell the package name yet;;; looking
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• 448[04:39:38] <jim> detre, since your net is now up, could you run: lspci -nn 2>&1 | grep -i net | nc termbin.com 9999
• 449[04:39:41] *** Joins: Abdullah (~ak@replaced-ip)
• 450[04:40:11] <EdePopede> "By default, the youtube-dl hook script (enabled by default for mpv CLI)" <--- again, on debian there is no such script in the mpv package. all i have is the ytdl executable, which isn't part of mpv
• 451[04:41:13] <trek00> EdePopede: this section of the manual page says mpv will call the youtube-dl script if requested, but youtube-dl is another package
• 452[04:41:50] *** Joins: jmnk (~jargonmon@replaced-ip)
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• 454[04:42:44] <jim> detre, still here?
• 455[04:42:50] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 456[04:42:51] <EdePopede> which is what i just said. of course it does it, but where is this ominous hook script?
• 457[04:42:55] <detre> jim: Just ran that command
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• 460[04:43:22] <detre> replaced-url
• 461[04:44:22] <detre> Unassigned class [ff00]: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTS5209 PCI Express Card Reader [10ec:5209] (rev 01)
• 462[04:44:45] <trek00> EdePopede: you must install youtube-dl package, apt install youtube-dl
• 463[04:44:50] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
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• 465[04:46:09] <trek00> detre: are you sure to have a bcm card?
• 466[04:46:11] <EdePopede> no, ytdl has to be updated much too often to wait for debian to update it. that's one of the packages which are better used from their homepage.
• 467[04:46:45] <detre> trek00: This laptop worked no problem with linux kali without any driver config....
• 468[04:46:58] <trek00> EdePopede: i still don't understand your question, sorry
• 469[04:47:06] *** Quits: jmnk (~jargonmon@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
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• 471[04:47:20] <trek00> detre: bcm card or not?
• 472[04:47:28] *** Joins: jmnk (~jargonmon@replaced-ip)
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• 475[04:48:24] <detre> trek00: right its not evening showing up now
• 476[04:48:33] <detre> trek00: even*
• 477[04:48:40] <detre> trek00: yes 100% sure
• 478[04:48:52] <trek00> well install firmware-b43-installer
• 479[04:49:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1492
• 480[04:49:16] <trek00> detre: but you need to add the non-free repository, if not already in
• 481[04:49:26] <EdePopede> 1. mpv 2. youtube-dl --- but where in the mpv package on debian is this "hook script" mentioned in the manpage? not there. and no other mpv related package in the repo. seems debian removed it from mpv, but it still works with youtube-dl.
• 482[04:49:56] <detre> trek00: I already have it installed
• 483[04:50:06] *** Quits: ChmEarl (~chmearl@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 484[04:50:20] <detre> trek00: Just ran it again, it just tells me i have the latest version
• 485[04:50:54] *** Quits: digin4 (~digin4@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 486[04:51:12] <trek00> detre: your lspci output is really short and there is not a wifi card
• 487[04:53:16] *** Quits: MACscr (~MACscr@replaced-ip##) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: ##replaced-url
• 488[04:53:24] *** Quits: russw (~russ@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 489[04:53:33] <jim> detre, hmm, strange. I see your ethernet card, and also your card reader... could you check the command, make sure the grep argument is net?
• 490[04:54:26] <trek00> EdePopede: if you are talking about the ytdl_hook.lua script, it is compiled in
• 491[04:54:55] <trek00> detre: or better, lspci without grepping
• 492[04:55:30] <detre> replaced-url
• 493[04:55:37] <EdePopede> oh. a lua script compiled into a binary? so the interpreter is also part of it? software should really mention it, people usually are expecting a .lua file or similar in such a case.
• 494[04:55:37] <jim> yeah, then lspci -nn 2>&1 | nc termbin.com 9999
• 495[04:56:20] <trek00> EdePopede: it mention that lua scripting is in very early stage
• 496[04:57:14] <detre> replaced-url
• 497[04:57:33] <detre> replaced-url
• 498[04:57:36] *** Joins: dvs (~hibbard@replaced-ip)
• 499[04:57:41] <detre> that's more!
• 500[04:57:47] <trek00> detre: 03:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Broadcom Limited BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n [14e4:4359]
• 501[04:57:51] <detre> 03:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Broadcom Limited BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n [14e4:4359]
• 502[04:57:52] <EdePopede> trek00: only this doesn't tell me anything, just that's still a long way to go. it's just they shouldn't talk about files where there are no files.
• 503[04:58:26] <trek00> EdePopede: you can propose a patch or I bet there is a #debian-rants for these remarks
• 504[04:58:48] *** Quits: shirak_ (~shirak@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 505[04:59:19] <trek00> detre: the correct driver should be wl
• 506[04:59:38] <trek00> detre: replaced-url
• 507[04:59:51] <detre> trek00: yep tried installing that before, no dice
• 508[05:00:33] <detre> i might have done it wrong??
• 509[05:00:35] <EdePopede> trek00: i ain't no dev so i prolly have no github account. even if, i'd forget about it after a few weeks.
• 510[05:00:42] <jim> detre, could you try: modprobe bcma # as root?
• 511[05:00:49] <detre> sure
• 512[05:00:53] <trek00> detre: may be, try to mimic all the steps
• 513[05:01:30] <jim> EdePopede, you don't like to program?
• 514[05:01:54] <detre> jim: does nothing
• 515[05:01:59] <EdePopede> jim: there's by far too much junk code around, the world really doesn't need more of it.
• 516[05:02:38] <jim> EdePopede, ok... wasn't my question tho :)
• 517[05:03:18] <jim> could you show us what it says (should be one line) when you: ls /sys/class/net
• 518[05:03:48] <jim> detre ^^
• 519[05:04:07] <detre> sure one sec
• 520[05:04:46] <detre> replaced-url
• 521[05:04:51] *** Quits: gatekeep (~gatekeep@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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• 523[05:06:24] <detre> hope that means something to you :P
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• 526[05:07:20] <trek00> detre: to install wl driver, you should install that dkms package, it will compile a new kernel module, then you should remove all the similar modules and then load the new module, if one of these steps fail, it don't run
• 527[05:08:20] <EdePopede> jim: programming which deserves that name is a fulltime job including regular schoolings. K&R C isn't a thing anymore today in software development i guess and every few years a new method of handling the whole structures is invented. the bit of shell hacking i do atm is something i definitely wouldn't call programming. i don't even like to call it like i just did, i only don't have another word for it.
• 528[05:10:08] <detre> trek00: Should i try a fresh install?
• 529[05:10:19] <jim> detre, no, just one sec
• 530[05:10:22] <trek00> detre: after completing all the steps you can check if it is loaded properly before configuring the interface with: ifconfig -a
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• 532[05:11:17] <jim> detre, got something else to try
• 533[05:12:09] <jim> we'll try a different driver this time
• 534[05:12:30] <jim> let me know when you're ready
• 535[05:12:38] <detre> go for it
• 536[05:12:51] <jim> ok, as root: modprobe wl
• 537[05:13:07] <detre> nothing
• 538[05:13:13] <detre> no error nothing
• 539[05:13:17] <detre> :(
• 540[05:13:24] <jim> detre, then show us what it says (should be one line) when you: ls /sys/class/net
• 541[05:13:42] *** Quits: tgunr (~davec@replaced-ip) (Quit: My Mac Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
• 542[05:13:46] <jim> actually no news might be good news
• 543[05:14:05] <detre> jim: enp9s0 lo
• 544[05:14:15] <jim> so, the same thing
• 545[05:14:40] <detre> yes
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• 548[05:17:23] <jim> one more thing... try: modprobe ssb
• 549[05:17:54] <detre> ok
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• 551[05:18:58] <detre> does nothing replaced-url
• 552[05:19:26] <jim> ok, try: modprobe -r wl ; modprobe wl
• 553[05:19:45] <trek00> jim: pay attention that all these drivers loaded can conflict themselves
• 554[05:20:23] <trek00> detre: modprobe -r b44 b43 b43legacy ssb brcmsmac bcma; modprobe wl
• 555[05:20:37] <detre> replaced-url
• 556[05:20:39] <trek00> detre: then ifconfig -a
• 557[05:20:53] <jim> does he have ifconfig?
• 558[05:21:06] <jim> (I don't anymore... snif...)
• 559[05:21:35] <detre> I don't have it installed
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• 561[05:21:55] <jim> what is that, net-tools?
• 562[05:22:09] <trek00> yes
• 563[05:22:35] <tds> just use iproute2 though, net-tools is old and deprecated
• 564[05:22:56] <jim> detre, maybe ls /sys/class/net # would give the info he wants
• 565[05:23:22] <jim> but I'd like to see: dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999
• 566[05:23:25] <trek00> tds: do you have the correct syntax? i'm familiar with ifconfig
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• 569[05:24:08] <jim> trek00, notice he had to install it... it's going away eventually...
• 570[05:24:30] <detre> so what should i run first?
• 571[05:24:32] <alkisg> I tried `add-apt-repository ppa:my-own-ppa` in buster and it works. It used "eoan" for the release series. I'm looking to find out how it did the buster<=>eoan mapping, any ideas?
• 572[05:25:21] <jim> first: modprobe -r b44 b43 b43legacy ssb brcmsmac bcma; modprobe wl
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• 574[05:25:47] <jim> then ls /sys/class/net
• 575[05:26:11] <jim> any change in that output?
• 576[05:26:22] <tds> `ip addr` / `ip link` are probably what you want for just basic info
• 577[05:26:37] <trek00> tds: it will shows unconfigured interfaces?
• 578[05:26:46] <tds> yes
• 579[05:26:53] <detre> modprobe -r b44 b43 b43legacy ssb brcmsmac bcma; modprobe wl shows nothing
• 580[05:26:54] <trek00> good
• 581[05:27:44] <detre> jim: replaced-url
• 582[05:27:48] <jim> that removed all the modules we inserted over the last half hour, and inserted the wo module
• 583[05:28:13] <detre> link is the output of dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999
• 584[05:28:33] <trek00> wl: module verification failed: signature and/or required key missing - tainting kernel
• 585[05:28:53] <detre> what does that mean?
• 586[05:29:30] <jim> detre, did the output of: ls /sys/class/net # change at all?
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• 588[05:30:13] <detre> nope still the same
• 589[05:30:43] <jim> trek00, so do you think we need that key/
• 590[05:30:47] <jim> ?
• 591[05:30:59] <trek00> no, just install unsigned kernel it should fix it
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• 593[05:31:38] <jim> which package for that?
• 594[05:32:00] <detre> is this install worth saving?
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• 596[05:32:48] <trek00> detre: if you have amd64 install linux-image-4.19.0-5-amd64-unsigned
• 597[05:33:24] <trek00> detre: the problem is, the module can't load because it is not signed as it is not free, so you can install an unsigned kernel and try again
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• 599[05:35:35] <detre> trek00: so should i get that image and do a fresh install with it?
• 600[05:35:39] <trek00> jim: for more info replaced-url
• 601[05:35:40] <judd> Bug replaced-url
• 602[05:36:06] *** Quits: RedSoxFan08 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: RedSoxFan08)
• 603[05:36:18] <trek00> detre: not, you should only install the package named linux-image-4.19.0-5-amd64-unsigned
• 604[05:36:49] <detre> installing
• 605[05:36:55] <detre> fingers crossed
• 606[05:37:16] <trek00> detre: then you should reinstall the wl driver (or rebuild it, but i don't remember the command)
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• 609[05:38:13] <trek00> detre: but you should reboot at first: install new kernel, reboot, reinstall wl driver, try again with modprobe -r.....
• 610[05:39:46] <detre> replaced-url
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• 612[05:39:50] <detre> yes?
• 613[05:40:15] <trek00> detre: no
• 614[05:40:32] <detre> do i click yes or no?
• 615[05:40:46] <trek00> detre: click no
• 616[05:41:07] <detre> install continues..
• 617[05:41:09] <trek00> detre: this is an alternative package, they can't live both
• 618[05:41:42] *** Quits: AndrewMC (~amc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 619[05:41:57] <detre> do i need to worry about this replaced-url
• 620[05:42:30] *** Quits: dvs (~hibbard@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 621[05:42:46] <trek00> detre: not for your wifi card, this is the network card
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• 623[05:44:20] <jim> is he doing a full wipe/reinstall?
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• 625[05:44:56] <jak2000> !tell me aptupdate
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• 627[05:45:16] <detre> ok
• 628[05:45:22] <detre> done and rebooted
• 629[05:45:41] <jim> did you just install a later kernel?
• 630[05:45:46] <detre> reinstalling wl...
• 631[05:45:51] <detre> done
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• 633[05:46:19] <detre> modprobe -r gives me: command not found
• 634[05:46:37] <detre> do i need to be root?
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• 636[05:47:13] <jim> for a modprobe, yes
• 637[05:47:36] <detre> jim: i installed linux-image-4.19.0-5-amd64-unsigned
• 638[05:47:46] <jim> oh ok
• 639[05:48:02] <detre> wifi is still dead
• 640[05:48:06] <detre> :(
• 641[05:48:14] <trek00> detre: now after the modprobe part please to do again a dmesg
• 642[05:48:36] <trek00> dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999
• 643[05:49:11] <detre> replaced-url
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• 646[05:50:07] <trek00> detre: try again: modprobe -r b44 b43 b43legacy ssb brcmsmac bcma; modprobe wl; dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999
• 647[05:50:09] <jak2000> trek00 wich /msg to dpkg need for list the lines for up to update?
• 648[05:50:38] <trek00> jak2000: sorry i don't know dpkg bot commands
• 649[05:51:18] <detre> modprobe -r b44 b43 b43legacy ssb brcmsmac bcma; modprobe wl; dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999
• 650[05:51:18] <detre> replaced-url
• 651[05:51:31] <trek00> detre: now it is loaded!
• 652[05:51:39] <trek00> detre: wl 0000:03:00.0 wlp3s0: renamed from wlan0
• 653[05:51:52] <trek00> detre: you should configure wlp3s0 for wifi
• 654[05:52:02] <jim> ls /sys/class/net # let's see it :)
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• 657[05:52:53] <jim> let's test the card first...
• 658[05:53:10] <detre> enp9s0 lo wlp3s0
• 659[05:53:18] <detre> that is good right? :D
• 660[05:53:18] <jim> there it is
• 661[05:53:22] <jim> yes
• 662[05:53:28] <jim> looks promising
• 663[05:53:42] <detre> testing
• 664[05:53:47] <jim> now: ifconfig wlp3s0 up
• 665[05:53:58] <jim> iwlist scan
• 666[05:54:10] <jim> do you see your neighbors?
• 667[05:54:21] <detre> I'm on my wlan network now
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• 670[05:54:37] <jim> you are? great, the card works then :)
• 671[05:54:42] <detre> THANKS for helping me!!!
• 672[05:55:10] <detre> i would not have figured that out myself
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• 674[05:55:16] <trek00> :)
• 675[05:55:24] <jim> SerajewelKS, I know it's midnite for you... we'll give a shot tomorrow
• 676[05:55:36] <detre> i much appreciate it jim and trek00
• 677[05:56:12] <detre> I will stick around to give some help back to the channel :)
• 678[05:56:21] <trek00> jak2000: may be !buster ? :)
• 679[05:56:30] <trek00> !dpkg buster
• 680[05:56:30] <dpkg> Buster is the codename for the current <stable> release, Debian 10, released 2019-07-06. "Buster" is Andy's pet Dachsund in Toy Story, see replaced-url
• 681[05:56:48] <trek00> uhm
• 682[05:57:05] <jak2000> !dpkg buster
• 683[05:57:05] <dpkg> Buster is the codename for the current <stable> release, Debian 10, released 2019-07-06. "Buster" is Andy's pet Dachsund in Toy Story, see replaced-url
• 684[05:57:25] <jim> it just dooed it again
• 685[05:57:40] <detre> so what was the main thing that fixed it?
• 686[05:58:12] <detre> the new unsigned kernel?
• 687[05:59:02] <trek00> detre: well, at first you needed the wl driver, then you needed an unsigned kernel to load it
• 688[05:59:46] <trek00> detre: and looking your dmesg you need also firmware-realtek for your gigabit ethernet card
• 689[05:59:57] *** Quits: Abdullah (~ak@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
• 690[05:59:59] <trek00> (unrelated)
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• 694[06:01:34] <trek00> jak2000: found it: !dpkg stretch->buster
• 695[06:01:45] <trek00> !dpkg stretch->buster
• 696[06:01:45] <dpkg> Read (at least) the upgrading chapter of the <release notes> replaced-url
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• 716[06:36:40] <ZaZaGX> i read elite hackers use BSD
• 717[06:36:46] <ZaZaGX> is Debian not for elite?
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• 721[06:42:37] <kirk781> the fsck?
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• 725[06:50:45] <annadane> um...
• 726[06:50:54] <annadane> debian... can be used for a lot of things
• 727[06:50:58] *** Joins: HeXiLeD (~grumpy@replaced-ip)
• 728[06:51:11] <annadane> i'm sure you can "hack" just as easily on any platform :/
• 729[06:51:41] <annadane> (resisting urge to smash my head repeatedly onto my desk here)
• 730[06:52:03] <kirk781> lol
• 731[06:53:07] <HeXiLeD> can you get it on video if the urge is stronger?
• 732[06:53:38] <winny> ^ please and thankyou
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• 735[06:57:33] <annadane> unless in an extremely roundabout way you're using the original meaning of hack as in hacking code which is probably slightly easier to do on debian due to sheer number of packages and the fact debian is specifically set up to be easy to manage whereas in BSD land so many things require manual configuration
• 736[06:58:00] <annadane> just different paradigms
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• 740[07:00:24] <kirk781> Few people use BSD eitherways
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• 746[07:07:28] <annadane> they have their positive points i'm sure but with the amount of developers and packages and debian blends and the debian policy and social contract... i find it hard to consider using anything else
• 747[07:07:38] <diogenes_> Linux Journal has shut down :(
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• 757[07:14:52] <kirk781> It shut down a couple of days ago
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• 792[08:26:17] <deadmarshal> I've created a compose key on right ctrl key, and I have removed it from keyboard option in settings. but it didn't remove and it is still the compose key, how can I remove it? (xfce debian 10)
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• 802[08:32:59] <alkisg> deadmarshal: how about `dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-configuration`? Doesn't that work in both console and xorg?
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• 806[08:36:09] <rant> hmm.. that at least makes more sense than xfce4-keyboard-settings :D
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• 808[08:36:33] <rant> it wasnt immediately apparent to me what xfce4-keyboard-settings was even asking
• 809[08:37:13] <rant> though it would seem to me that anything changed in the layout using that xfce thing is only applied after a relogin
• 810[08:37:18] * alkisg finds it very silly that each DE offers its own way to reconfigure something that has been working properly for ages; and they do so in usually broken ways..
• 811[08:37:25] <deadmarshal> alkisg: when I chose no compose key option in terminal, nothing happened and compose key didn't remove.
• 812[08:37:40] <rant> I'm not going to test it cause I don't really care and I'm not in XFCE anyhow
• 813[08:37:42] <deadmarshal> I re login also
• 814[08:38:02] <alkisg> deadmarshal: test it in the display manager, at the point when you try to login, where you type the username
• 815[08:38:23] <deadmarshal> ok
• 816[08:38:26] <alkisg> If it works there, but not inside the session, then xfce applies its own settings, which you'd need to remove, in order to let the xorg setttings work
• 817[08:38:49] <rant> check the "Use system settings" in xfce2-keyboard-settings
• 818[08:38:56] <rant> erm.. w/e
• 819[08:39:15] <alkisg> E.g. mate and gnome have gsettings for that, by default they respect xorg defaults, but if one sets the gsettings, they override xorg
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• 825[08:41:27] <deadmarshal> I checked system defaults in keyboard settings, no luck, the compose key is still rctrl.
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• 827[08:42:00] <alkisg> Did it work in the username text box?
• 828[08:42:18] <deadmarshal> yes, in username rctrl is not compose key.
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• 830[08:43:09] <alkisg> I'm not using xfce anywhere, sorry; check for specific xfce keyboard settings, like the ones you see, or also check if fcitx or ibus are running
• 831[08:43:22] <alkisg> Because if xfce runs those, those have their own settings as well, overriding xorg
• 832[08:43:34] <alkisg> ps aux | grep ibus, ps aux|grep fcitx, start there
• 833[08:43:48] <deadmarshal> yes I have ibus
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• 843[08:49:08] <deadmarshal> A music messaging session has been requested. Please click the MM icon to accept.
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• 847[08:55:54] <ZaZaGX> hi
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• 859[09:08:41] <rant> tell it to use the system settings
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• 862[09:09:08] <rant> xfce4-keyboard-settings > [Layout] > [X] Use system settings
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• 865[09:13:21] <deadmarshal> rant: I checked use system settings, but it doesn't work
• 866[09:13:37] <rant> did you logout and back in afterward?
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• 868[09:14:13] <deadmarshal> yes
• 869[09:14:20] <alkisg> deadmarshal: try to temporarily chmod -x ibus, then relogin; does it work if you disable ibus?
• 870[09:15:15] <alkisg> AFAIK, ibus overrides anything in xorg or DE settings
• 871[09:15:46] <deadmarshal> ibus is in /usr/lib/ibus?
• 872[09:16:12] <alkisg> try `which ibus` or `which ibus-daemon`, I don't remember
• 873[09:16:18] <alkisg> Or ps aux | grep ibus
• 874[09:16:26] <alkisg> And see what name the ibus binary has
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• 882[09:18:16] <basilic_> hello all
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• 884[09:18:49] <basilic_> my firefox crash all time since I have update stretch to buster
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• 888[09:20:15] <basilic_> I use Firfox-esr (60.8)
• 889[09:20:52] <luna> replaced-url
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• 916[09:43:35] <jvava> An application throw exception that says 'no enough file descriptor', so I try modify the limit of open files, I write two line in the file of /etc/security/limit.conf, after restart the box, the limit still remain the old value, but login from ssh, the value is new, why?
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• 937[10:08:05] <Amun_Ra> jadax: /etc/sysctl.conf
• 938[10:10:59] <detre> hey trek00 and jim, i rebooted and its not working agian XD
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• 940[10:11:49] <detre> we are back to ls /sys/class/net #
• 941[10:11:49] <detre> enp9s0 lo
• 942[10:11:58] <detre> :(
• 943[10:12:03] <Alina-malina> i am not sure why this is happening but everytime i create and save a screen session on remote host it destroy when i disconnect ssh and connect back
• 944[10:12:31] <detre> i checked and its telling me that the unsigned kernel is still installed so i'm stumped
• 945[10:13:32] <trek00> detre: try again to do modprobe wl
• 946[10:14:10] <detre> command not found
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• 949[10:14:28] <trek00> detre: my be you need to add the module loading at startup
• 950[10:14:31] <trek00> detre: as root
• 951[10:14:53] <detre> do you know the command to do that?
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• 953[10:15:10] <trek00> detre: sudo modprobe wl
• 954[10:15:45] <detre> yes! now its working
• 955[10:15:57] <detre> how do i keep that in place now?
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• 959[10:18:16] <trek00> detre: sudo sh -c 'echo wl >>/etc/modules'
• 960[10:18:50] <detre> thanks trek00!
• 961[10:19:09] <detre> ok, im going to reboot and see if all is well
• 962[10:19:33] <trek00> detre: if it does not load the module, may be you need to update-initramfs too
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• 966[10:22:13] <detre> it did not load
• 967[10:22:32] <detre> update-initramfs??
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• 970[10:23:54] <trek00> detre: sudo update-initramfs -u
• 971[10:24:19] <trek00> detre: but wait
• 972[10:24:34] <trek00> detre: do sudo modprobe wl before to do update-initramfs
• 973[10:24:43] <detre> i did
• 974[10:24:47] <trek00> good
• 975[10:24:55] <trek00> it should be ok now
• 976[10:24:57] <detre> ok done
• 977[10:25:03] <detre> rebooting
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• 980[10:27:16] <detre> trek00 :( nope still had to sudo modprobe wl to get wifi
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• 984[10:30:16] <trek00> detre: sorry i don't know why this, i must go away now, but what you need now is simply a generic way to load a module at boot, may be someone can help you
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• 988[10:30:50] <detre> trek00 thanks i will continue googling
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• 990[10:32:12] <trek00> detre: for me it works even without update-initramfs you should have a the last line of /etc/modules containing wl
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• 992[10:32:48] <trek00> detre: hope you can find a solution, if not you have the manual workaround at least for now
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• 997[10:34:19] <trek00> detre: if you are using systemd may be you should add wl to a file under /etc/modules-load.d like here replaced-url
• 998[10:34:21] <trek00> detre: ciao!
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• 1000[10:35:11] <jvava> Amun_Ra, do I have to put something into /etc/sysctl.conf?
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• 1006[10:36:12] <jvava> Amun_Ra, I did, but no use, is it this line, fs.file-max=100000
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• 1009[10:37:09] <Amun_Ra> jvava: have you run sysctl -p?
• 1010[10:37:24] <jvava> yes
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• 1012[10:40:05] <jvava> I have done the same operation long before, which was ok. recently I have upgraded to the stretch, is that reason?
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• 1017[10:41:54] <jvava> And if I can not run the modification directly on command line, it say 'can not modify the limit value, notpermit operation'
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• 1041[11:01:13] <Filip> hi, I installed debian 10 but my wireless card isn't being detected
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• 1043[11:01:32] <Filip> I have iwlwifi installed
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• 1057[11:13:30] <brutser> hi, i got an issue with lightdm on a deb10+mate install, when i create auto-login by enter user name in lightdm.conf < the login takes too long, screen stays black lit, takes about 40-60secs before desktop shows - anyone can help me try to tackle this, where does the problem come from?
• 1058[11:19:41] <diogenes_> bruslighdm is historically slow, especially with some older radeons.
• 1059[11:19:55] <diogenes_> brutser, ^^
• 1060[11:20:44] <brutser> diogenes_: it's an older amd laptop with radeon, so that could be the reason
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• 1062[11:20:53] <diogenes_> try: systemd-analyze blame
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• 1064[11:21:19] <diogenes_> and yes, if that's an older radeon then most likely yes.
• 1065[11:21:34] <brutser> it's a lenovo g505s laptop
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• 1067[11:21:56] <diogenes_> model is not that relevant, gpu is.
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• 1069[11:22:15] <brutser> sec, let me get exact info
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• 1077[11:25:39] <brutser> diogenes_: 8.237s (kernel) + 32.003s (userspace)
• 1078[11:25:54] <brutser> 30.773s apt-daily-upgrade.service
• 1079[11:26:23] <brutser> it's a Radeon HD 8570A/8570M
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• 1081[11:27:10] <diogenes_> i don't what what is apt-daily service
• 1082[11:27:13] <brutser> why is the apt-daily-upgrade.service taking this much time?
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• 1085[11:27:32] <diogenes_> disable it and reboot and see if that makes things better.
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• 1088[11:28:07] <brutser> diogenes_: it's a minimal deb10 install clean, with only mate-core and lightdm
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• 1091[11:28:33] <diogenes_> then it's a mate thing which i'd not advice to use.
• 1092[11:28:47] <diogenes_> it uses your bandwidth without any reason.
• 1093[11:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1509
• 1094[11:29:04] <brutser> is it mate you not advice to use, or the service?
• 1095[11:29:30] <diogenes_> the service of course
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• 1099[11:33:11] <BCMM> brutser: do you have packagekit?
• 1100[11:33:58] <brutser> diogenes_: weird, services disabled, now systemd-analyze show 8.685s (kernel) + 1.464s (userspace) which seems ok, but the login process take even longer, black screen shows for almost minute+
• 1101[11:33:59] <BCMM> iirc if that's installed, then `apt update` downloads icons for all available packages, for display in GUI package managers
• 1102[11:34:28] <BCMM> which can potentially take a while on slow connections
• 1103[11:34:42] <brutser> BCMM: apt update < All packages are up to date.
• 1104[11:34:53] <BCMM> it doesn't re-download them every time
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• 1106[11:35:46] <brutser> ok, but i have not installed packagekit <
• 1107[11:35:54] <diogenes_> brutser, then i'd blame radeon, try a live iso with gnome and see if it boots faster.
• 1108[11:36:00] <BCMM> brutser: sorry, i think i meant appstream
• 1109[11:37:01] <BCMM> brutser: /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50appstream is the hook responsible, so if you don't have that file, ignore what i said
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• 1111[11:37:32] <brutser> only installed minimal deb10 + mate-core + lightdm
• 1112[11:37:37] <TheDcoder> Hi, does the first CD/DVD image come with all of the mentioned desktop environments in this article?: replaced-url
• 1113[11:37:38] <brutser> don't have that file ^^
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• 1115[11:38:44] <brutser> diogenes_: it's ok to blame radeon, but then i would expect a similar delay when i disable auto-login in lightdm.conf and i don't, without auto-login, all speed is normal
• 1116[11:39:48] <brutser> yes i just tested that ^^
• 1117[11:40:06] <brutser> directly onto the desktop
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• 1119[11:40:12] <BCMM> TheDcoder: which ISO are you talking about specifically?
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• 1121[11:40:22] <aexl> TheDcoder: dvd, yes. cd, no. cds are named accordingly.
• 1122[11:40:25] <TheDcoder> DVD1
• 1123[11:40:31] <aexl> yep
• 1124[11:40:33] <TheDcoder> Ah, okay, thanks
• 1125[11:40:42] <diogenes_> brutser, it's radon + lightdm.
• 1126[11:40:47] <BCMM> TheDcoder: you know netinst is available, which just downloads packages during the install, right?
• 1127[11:40:51] <diogenes_> try gdm+radeon
• 1128[11:40:54] <aexl> np
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• 1131[11:41:15] <BCMM> that way you don't have to download any packages you won't use, and you don't need to immediately update the system after install
• 1132[11:41:15] <aexl> just torrent dvd1 :)
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• 1134[11:41:30] <TheDcoder> BCMM: Yes, but I prefer to have the full copy on hand... and to help conserve bandwidth on the servers, I am torrenting it :)
• 1135[11:41:36] <BCMM> ok
• 1136[11:41:38] <aexl> :)
• 1137[11:42:03] <brutser> diogenes_: ok i will try gdm, but what i mean is, when i disable the auto-login in lightdm.conf < then i boot directly to login screen and after instant to desktop < it's only when i put "bob" in the lightdm.conf as auto-login when i have the long delay <
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• 1144[11:43:31] <diogenes_> brutser, i understand that moment and that's goes down to the lightdm, probably a bug.
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• 1147[11:43:55] <Guest60277> Hi there, is this a debian chat ?
• 1148[11:44:05] <TheDcoder> If I am understanding this about Debian correctly, software updates are not really frequent as each version of Debian only caters for packages with specific versions, am I right?
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• 1153[11:45:43] <aexl> if you install testing or even unstable you will get more updates. but also more instability
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• 1156[11:46:36] <TheDcoder> I understand
• 1157[11:46:58] <Guest60277> I want to switch to debian. I'm currently using Linux mint. Whata are the differences ?
• 1158[11:47:07] *** Quits: soee (~soee@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 1159[11:47:17] <TheDcoder> My main operating system is Fedora and I get updates quite frequently since the update policy is less strict
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• 1161[11:47:37] <TheDcoder> that is why I was asking, I have a habit of upgrading regularly :)
• 1162[11:47:39] <aexl> TheDcoder: i mean you first install stable and then add sources for testing or unstable
• 1163[11:47:53] <TheDcoder> aexl: got it, thanks
• 1164[11:47:54] <diogenes_> Guest60277, debian is the father for both.
• 1165[11:48:09] <TheDcoder> Isn't Mint based on Ubuntu?
• 1166[11:48:10] <aexl> both?
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• 1168[11:48:21] <Filip> effective difference between debian and ubuntu: debian lacks PPA (if you use that)
• 1169[11:48:29] <diogenes_> well and ubuntu is based on debian
• 1170[11:48:35] <BCMM> TheDcoder: Stable has timely security updates, but not "new features" updates
• 1171[11:48:37] <diogenes_> so they are both based on debian.
• 1172[11:48:49] <TheDcoder> diogenes_: In that case it makes Debian the grand-father :)
• 1173[11:48:51] <aexl> right
• 1174[11:48:57] <diogenes_> lol
• 1175[11:49:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1520
• 1176[11:49:06] <diogenes_> that was more accurate.
• 1177[11:49:11] <TheDcoder> BCMM: Got it, only the required updates
• 1178[11:49:19] <Guest60277> diogenes_ so what does that mean ? Which one is better ?
• 1179[11:49:22] <aexl> i gots a problems too: /var/log/messages and /var/log/user.log are littered by qcomicbook. it works though but the files grow about 1 mb per 10 comicbook pages. any ideas? replaced-url
• 1180[11:49:42] <Guest60277> Like, security wise, usability and so. Which one to consider ?
• 1181[11:49:43] <BCMM> TheDcoder: basically, new versions (other than when required for security reasons) come in a big batch every ~2 years when there's a new version of Stable available
• 1182[11:49:43] <diogenes_> Guest60277, i personally prefer the source (grandfather)
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• 1184[11:50:04] <diogenes_> because grandchildren could get quite noisy and disobedient with time :)
• 1185[11:50:11] <TheDcoder> ha ha ha
• 1186[11:50:21] <BCMM> TheDcoder: this means that you get to deal with all the potential breakages to your workflow that is inevitable with new versions of software in one go
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• 1188[11:50:25] <pragomer> hi, how can I check what bluetooth chip I got? I have a bought a intel nuc (tuxedocomputer mini) and got problems connecting my bluetooth speakers
• 1189[11:50:32] *** Joins: etech (~philippe@replaced-ip)
• 1190[11:50:39] <Guest60277> diogenes_ So you use debian ?
• 1191[11:50:39] <aexl> pragomer: usb?
• 1192[11:50:40] <BCMM> pragomer: check lspci and lsusb
• 1193[11:50:51] <pragomer> no its onboard
• 1194[11:50:51] <diogenes_> Guest60277, right.
• 1195[11:50:56] <TheDcoder> BCMM: 2 years is sort of a longish time to wait... but I understand how this can be a benefit. Though I am more used to being on the bleeding edge of software (hence the usage of Fedora)
• 1196[11:51:11] <BCMM> TheDcoder: there's debian unstable if that isn't what you want
• 1197[11:51:26] <Guest60277> diogenes_ Understood, but what is the difference between mint and debian OS ? Which is more secure ? which one's usability is better (for daily use and so) ?
• 1198[11:51:35] <etech> There's also Debian "testing"
• 1199[11:51:55] <BCMM> TheDcoder: unstable is approximately equivalent to Rawhide, i guess
• 1200[11:52:00] <TheDcoder> BCMM: "Unstable" sounds a bit scary to be honest... but we will see, this is my first time trying debian :)
• 1201[11:52:06] <pragomer> replaced-url
• 1202[11:52:08] <Guest60277> diogenes_ i was told to switch to debian since it is more secure and better. That is why i am here, asking to confirm it.
• 1203[11:52:10] <pragomer> this is my lspci
• 1204[11:52:17] <BCMM> TheDcoder: eh, it's still more stable and reliable than other distros
• 1205[11:52:22] *** Joins: X_Aftermath (~Aftermath@replaced-ip)
• 1206[11:52:29] <TheDcoder> In that case it might do for me...
• 1207[11:52:45] <pragomer> there is not "bluetooth" in lspci
• 1208[11:52:51] <TheDcoder> Though I still prefer to stick with something which is tested...
• 1209[11:52:56] <diogenes_> Guest60277, there is no such thing this one is better and this one is worse, all depends on taste, ubuntu tends to have more up to date kernel and packages, that's basically it, some can call it advantage some disatvantage.
• 1210[11:53:00] <BCMM> TheDcoder: i think the equivalent of Stable in the RH world is probably RHEL. it's the "final product" of the process, and puts everything else secondary to not breaking just because you updated
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• 1212[11:53:50] <aexl> pragomer: you might need firmware-linux-nonfree or other firmware-intel*
• 1213[11:53:54] <BCMM> makes for a mildly irritating desktop, or a fantastically easy server
• 1214[11:53:55] <TheDcoder> BCMM: Right, but RHEL is a commercial distribution, Fedora is more suited for home usage I think...
• 1215[11:54:11] <pragomer> these are installed
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• 1217[11:54:24] <BCMM> (or a pretty decent desktop for the kind of user who isn't really interested in new versions of stuff)
• 1218[11:54:33] <TheDcoder> No wonder why I had so much trouble when using Fedora for a server, should have went with CentOS :)
• 1219[11:54:41] <pragomer> is it possible that bluetooth "sits on top of" Intel wireless ?
• 1220[11:54:47] <pragomer> or is this really just wifi?
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• 1224[11:55:15] <TheDcoder> BCMM: I know some people who prefer a stable system over new software
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• 1226[11:55:33] <Bushmills> going for unstable as first time Debian exposure may not be a good idea. a. it's not a "distribution" (as in "branch"), and b. it's assumed that you know how to deal with misc problems yourself, for example how to deal with dependency problems.
• 1227[11:55:38] <aexl> pragomer: if it's kinda new maybe the drivers aren't just there
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• 1229[11:55:45] <BCMM> pragomer: i don't know about the NUC specifically, but there are quite a few integrated wifi/bluetooth chips around
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• 1231[11:56:09] <TheDcoder> BCMM: I agree, I will try the latest stable release first
• 1232[11:56:14] <Bushmills> for frequent enough updates, testing should be more suited
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• 1234[11:56:25] <humpled> frequent enough for what?
• 1235[11:56:39] <TheDcoder> for testing software I reckon
• 1236[11:56:42] <Bushmills> for TheDcoder's needs
• 1237[11:56:51] <brutser> diogenes_: apparently this is the reason -> replaced-url
• 1238[11:56:53] <humpled> in 10 years i don't remember a feature update that i needed
• 1239[11:56:53] <TheDcoder> not sure about that...
• 1240[11:56:55] <aexl> TheDcoder: bleeding edge is also not server friendly xD
• 1241[11:57:09] <brutser> lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter need entropy before starting the session
• 1242[11:57:10] <BCMM> pragomer: if you've got the exact model of your wifi chip, you could google it and see if it does BT too
• 1243[11:57:29] <TheDcoder> aexl: That is why I would not use Fedora on my next server
• 1244[11:57:57] <Bushmills> unstable is essentually a pile of untested packages. review went to the point of "they seem to work"
• 1245[11:58:04] <Bushmills> or "they start"
• 1246[11:58:24] <TheDcoder> which one is more stable? "unstable" or "testing"
• 1247[11:58:29] <aexl> testing
• 1248[11:58:38] <TheDcoder> oh, I was thinking the other way around
• 1249[11:58:45] <Bushmills> how do you define "stable"? what does that term mean to you?
• 1250[11:58:48] <aexl> pragomer: can you connect to other bt devices?
• 1251[11:58:51] <TheDcoder> as in, testing is where all the untested stuff goes
• 1252[11:59:06] <TheDcoder> Bushmills: I was talking in relative terms :)
• 1253[11:59:08] <diogenes_> brutser, did it work for you?
• 1254[11:59:20] <BCMM> i must admit to being slightly confused as to the purpose of running testing, other than literally "testing" whether your stuff will work on the next debian release
• 1255[11:59:22] <Bushmills> i was talking in terms of semantics
• 1256[11:59:38] <Bushmills> many associate "stable" with "doesn't crash"
• 1257[11:59:41] <BCMM> aren't the slower security updates kind of a problem for a daily-driver desktop?
• 1258[11:59:48] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 1259[11:59:51] <brutser> diogenes_: when apt-get install haveged < systemctl enable haveged < yes, auto-login has no longer that long of a delay
• 1260[11:59:55] <Bushmills> but that's not what Debian understands as "stable"
• 1261[11:59:59] <humpled> it's misleading to say debian doesn't get updates
• 1262[12:00:20] <humpled> there are security updates all the time, there just aren't feature updates generally
• 1263[12:00:30] <diogenes_> brutser, awesome :)
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• 1265[12:02:10] <brutser> diogenes_: yes great, not always easy to find the right article among the zillion of google results from 2009 or whatever
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• 1267[12:04:13] <aexl> /var/log/messages and /var/log/user.log are littered by qcomicbook. it works though but the files grow about 1 mb per 10 comicbook pages. any ideas? replaced-url
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• 1274[12:09:09] <Bushmills> those liines compress well. once logrotate took care of it, it will be compressed into virtual oblivion
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• 1284[12:14:19] <aexl> both files are now 360 mb. how do i start logrotate? i tried "sudo /etc/cron.daily/logrotate" and "sudo logrotate /etc/logrotate.d/rsyslog"
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• 1302[12:19:43] *** Greyztar- is now known as Greyztar
• 1303[12:19:53] <TheDcoder> Sorry, I got disconnected, did I miss any messages?
• 1304[12:20:26] <TheDcoder> I received no messages after my last message (which I am assuming reached here)
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• 1307[12:21:30] <humpled> nothing was said
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• 1310[12:23:36] <humpled> oh sorry, nothing was said since your client timed out but that was 15 minutes after you said Bushmills: I was talking in relative terms :)
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• 1312[12:24:12] <TheDcoder> Oh, so my messages must have gotten lost
• 1313[12:24:18] <TheDcoder> I will repost them
• 1314[12:24:23] <TheDcoder> I don't really see the "Alternative desktop environments" option in the boot menu for DVD1 :-/
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• 1316[12:24:31] <TheDcoder> The closest thing is "Expert Install"
• 1317[12:24:36] <TheDcoder> I tried graphical expert install but I can't really be bothered with going through most of the steps manually
• 1318[12:26:36] <aexl> did you try what your link said? replaced-url
• 1319[12:27:11] <TheDcoder> Yes, there is no "Alternative desktop environments" option under advanced options :(
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• 1325[12:31:52] <aexl> maybe it's just under "advanced options"?
• 1326[12:32:15] <humpled> is this the isolinux menu we're talking about?
• 1327[12:32:23] <TheDcoder> yes
• 1328[12:32:43] <Bushmills> just install any or even none - choose your DE later when installation has been completed and you booted into the new system
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• 1330[12:33:12] <TheDcoder> aexl: There was a non-related option below advanced options, cannot recall it now
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• 1332[12:33:37] <aexl> i meant in the "advanced options" menu
• 1333[12:33:51] <TheDcoder> Bushmills: I am using the default graphical installer to install the base system... I hope it will offer a choice after the base packages are installed
• 1334[12:34:17] <Bushmills> anything can be added at any point.
• 1335[12:34:44] <Bushmills> consider first installation as something with the goal to get the system running
• 1336[12:34:49] <Bushmills> customize later
• 1337[12:34:53] <TheDcoder> okay
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• 1339[12:35:06] <aexl> that's still a bug if it doesn't show at installation
• 1340[12:35:36] <Bushmills> there may be a choice under "tasks"
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• 1342[12:35:57] <TheDcoder> I did not get the tasks screen in the default installer
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• 1346[12:36:17] <TheDcoder> and could not find any task to choose the desktop environment in the expert installer
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• 1348[12:36:27] <Bushmills> but my feeling is that those predefined purpose oriented blocks of packages tend to install too much
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• 1351[12:36:48] <humpled> as it is most people here aren't familiar with the large installers, most use the netinstall then select tasks near the end
• 1352[12:37:04] <TheDcoder> Oh
• 1353[12:37:16] <TheDcoder> I never really used net installers
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• 1355[12:37:51] <TheDcoder> I always go with the full installers since I like to have copies in my hand, and internet isn't something which is readily available everywhere here
• 1356[12:38:00] <humpled> sure fair enough
• 1357[12:38:36] <humpled> even then though, most of us would rather do the expert install, so we can see all the choices being made
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• 1360[12:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1519
• 1361[12:39:09] <aexl> just make your own installer :P
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• 1364[12:39:36] <TheDcoder> I went with it as my first choice, but didn't want to go through all of the steps manually... especially when I couldn't find the step that I need
• 1365[12:39:37] <Bushmills> also, many choose as initial installation a compact one, when they intend to change to "testing" after installation
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• 1367[12:40:00] <Bushmills> the less was installed initially, the fewer packages need to be upgraded
• 1368[12:40:15] <humpled> oh i didn't realise they wanted testing
• 1369[12:40:27] <TheDcoder> no, not really, I am planning to test stable first
• 1370[12:40:30] <Bushmills> TheDcoder was even contemplating unstable ...
• 1371[12:40:57] <TheDcoder> I was just going through my options by getting to know more about them, but stable it is for now :)
• 1372[12:41:04] <diogenes_> TheDcoder, live images have calamares installer now.
• 1373[12:41:13] <humpled> looks like dvd1 has gnome, cinnamon, kde, lxde, lxqt, mate and xfce, amazing
• 1374[12:41:23] <Bushmills> ah, there were messages after you timed out, related to "stable":
• 1375[12:41:27] <Bushmills> (11:59:21) Bushmills: i was talking in terms of semantics
• 1376[12:41:27] <Bushmills> (11:59:37) Bushmills: many associate "stable" with "doesn't crash"
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• 1378[12:41:45] <Bushmills> (11:59:55) Bushmills: but that's not what Debian understands as "stable"
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• 1380[12:42:42] <Bushmills> testing doesn't mean "crashed more frequently" (as being "less stable") - it means there's higher package mutation rate
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• 1384[12:43:23] <TheDcoder> I understand
• 1385[12:43:33] <Bushmills> (and, naturally, packages not tested in depth)
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• 1387[12:43:51] <TheDcoder> and the good news is that I got to choose what needs to be installed after the base system was done
• 1388[12:44:12] <Bushmills> yes. add or remove as you feel fit
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• 1393[12:44:55] <diogenes_> TheDcoder, you can create your own custom debian iso with all you need removed/installed/configured etc.
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• 1395[12:45:09] <Bushmills> though, no. not "needs to be installed" - what needs to be installed was installed with your base system already
• 1396[12:45:26] <Bushmills> (more than that, actually)
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• 1399[12:46:35] <TheDcoder> in that case, I have selected the packages that I want to be installed :)
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• 1406[12:51:30] <aexl> (12:14:19) aexl: ... how do i start logrotate? i tried "sudo /etc/cron.daily/logrotate" and "sudo logrotate /etc/logrotate.d/rsyslog"
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• 1410[12:53:09] <Bushmills> aexl: it's done automatically, periodically, if installed (most likely it is)
• 1411[12:54:24] <Bushmills> it may be set to rotate those logs weekly
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• 1429[13:10:19] <Alina-malina> my debian box is killing screen session after i disconnect from it
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• 1433[13:11:17] *** Quits: TheDcoder (~TheDcoder@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 1434[13:12:07] <aexl> Bushmills: i think this is still a bug. as a workaround i put messages and user.log to daily in /etc/logrotate.d/rsyslog
• 1435[13:12:38] *** Joins: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip)
• 1436[13:12:55] <aexl> Alina-malina: i guess you need to run screen as another user then
• 1437[13:13:07] <Alina-malina> hmmm let me try that
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• 1441[13:15:49] <Alina-malina> aexl, same
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• 1443[13:16:30] <diogenes_> Alina-malina, maybe with a crontab?
• 1444[13:16:42] <Alina-malina> diogenes_, crontab?
• 1445[13:16:46] <abrotman> how are you disconnecting?
• 1446[13:17:20] <Habbie> is anything logged when screen is killed?
• 1447[13:17:21] <diogenes_> yes a cron job that will re-run the command after your disconnect.
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• 1449[13:18:16] <Habbie> replaced-url
• 1450[13:18:17] <judd> Bug replaced-url
• 1451[13:18:24] <Alina-malina> it used to work before the server reboots, i disconnect regularly just detach the screen session and exit from it or just leave ot idling until it dies
• 1452[13:19:22] <Alina-malina> judd, ye i already set this KillUserProcesses=no but i guess its ignoring that rule or not using that
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• 1454[13:19:36] <Alina-malina> i edited the logind.conf and restart it, but it still the same
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• 1462[13:22:57] <olf-folks40> This guy is using the Debian logo for something not Debian is it not copy write replaced-url
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• 1477[13:34:30] <coruja> is there a way to get what 'apt list --upgradeable' delivers by using apt-cache, dpkg-query etc (to avoid using apt for scripting purposes)?
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• 1481[13:36:15] <mykijez> hello
• 1482[13:36:18] <coruja> i know it's possible to create a formatted overview with aptitude but i would prefer using apt-* or dkpg-* if possible
• 1483[13:36:37] <mykijez> anyone using parrot os?
• 1484[13:36:44] <coruja> !parrot
• 1485[13:36:44] <dpkg> Parrot OS (replaced-url
• 1486[13:38:45] *** Quits: CrazyEddy (crazyed@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
• 1487[13:38:53] <mykijez> is there any highly traffic serevrs for chatting
• 1488[13:40:22] <mykijez> hlo
• 1489[13:40:27] *** Quits: gigetoo (~gigetoo@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 1490[13:40:27] <mykijez> anyone?
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• 1493[13:40:50] <aexl> chatting about what?
• 1494[13:41:24] <mykijez> subjects based on hacking
• 1495[13:42:34] *** Quits: ooAoo (~username@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 1496[13:42:34] *** Quits: sedrosken (~sedrosken@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 1497[13:42:35] <mykijez> aexl
• 1498[13:42:45] *** Quits: sidmo (~ident@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 1499[13:42:52] <mykijez> do you know anything about it?
• 1500[13:43:04] <bad_cat> define "hacking" - but #debian is probably not the right place
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• 1507[13:44:23] <aexl> maybe ##linux
• 1508[13:44:40] <mykijez> yep, i know that so any different servers or channel?
• 1509[13:44:48] <mykijez> k
• 1510[13:45:04] <bad_cat> well, again, it's hard to tell without knowing what you mean with "hacking"
• 1511[13:45:06] <aexl> or ##hackers
• 1512[13:45:59] <aexl> there's also #parrotsec
• 1513[13:47:42] <mykijez> how invite on a server
• 1514[13:48:30] <aexl> not sure there's any more tech-friendly server than freenode?
• 1515[13:48:53] <aexl> i don't understand your last question
• 1516[13:49:07] <mykijez> actually i am new to this hexchat and these irc chatting XD
• 1517[13:49:20] <bad_cat> freenode is mostly FOSS-friendly - not sure if there are any servers more specialised in certain technical topics
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• 1520[13:50:06] <mykijez> when i attempt to connect on linux they showed its invite only
• 1521[13:50:11] <coruja> !irc tutorial
• 1522[13:50:11] <dpkg> "A Short IRC Primer": replaced-url
• 1523[13:50:32] <mykijez> thanks
• 1524[13:51:17] *** Quits: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 1525[13:52:31] <aexl> i can join just fine. maybe you need to register
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• 1528[13:53:57] <aexl> heh
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• 1534[14:00:43] <Bushmills> "once I learn about IRC, I gonna be great hacker"
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• 1538[14:10:06] <bad_cat> also "once I install pentesting distro, I gonna be great hacker"
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• 1540[14:12:46] <Bushmills> "then can buy me black T-shirt with white large letters 'HACKER' written on it"
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• 1542[14:14:23] <aexl> bitter
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• 1574[14:39:07] <jim> detre, hi. still here?
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• 1576[14:39:44] <brutser> in general do i still need a swap partition if my system has 32GB of ram?
• 1577[14:40:20] <jim> that's a lot of ram...
• 1578[14:40:22] <jim> and
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• 1580[14:40:33] <jim> it's not an infinite amount...
• 1581[14:41:07] <brutser> jim: ok, i assume you mean that it's always better to just create swap partition
• 1582[14:41:27] <brutser> if i want encrypt the drive, and only want enter password once, i need LVM if want encrypt swap and root?
• 1583[14:42:03] <jim> brutser, maybe. what I actually mean, is no matter how much ram you have, you could fill it up
• 1584[14:42:31] <brutser> yes
• 1585[14:43:09] <jim> what do you want that much ram for?
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• 1587[14:43:27] <brutser> for play the ping pong
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• 1592[14:44:13] <jim> a game?
• 1593[14:44:20] <Bushmills> brutser: sure
• 1594[14:44:49] <jim> is this a laptop?
• 1595[14:45:14] <brutser> yes
• 1596[14:45:38] <jim> ok, do you want to be able to suspend to disk (hibernate)?
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• 1598[14:45:49] <Bushmills> "my system has any number of RAM"
• 1599[14:45:58] <brutser> no
• 1600[14:46:04] <Bushmills> sry, incomplete ...
• 1601[14:46:44] <Bushmills> "my system has <any amount of RAM>" does not mean "my system will never need the amount of RAM or more than it has"
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• 1603[14:47:02] <brutser> true
• 1604[14:47:12] <brutser> so swap part can't do any harm
• 1605[14:47:28] <jim> brutser, ok... to suspend to disk, you would need a swap that's a bit larger than your entire ram... that way, the thing that suspends can write your ram to the swap
• 1606[14:47:33] <Bushmills> means - it depends what you're doing. for some systems, 32 GB RAM is very little.
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• 1608[14:48:10] <jim> and if you don't want that, you could run without swap I guess
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• 1612[14:50:11] <aexl> you can set swappiness (how quickly the system will put cached files into swap) with sysctl
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• 1618[14:51:49] <aexl> i've set vm.swappiness = 20 in sysctl.conf - i think that's the default value and it works good for me. don't set it too low
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• 1624[14:59:48] <kojibka> since the very beginning of Buster I had no updates/upgrades in other packages then Opera Browser. Any news on coming upgrades?
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• 1628[15:01:58] <aexl> there should have been several replaced-url
• 1629[15:03:18] <Bushmills> given that Opera isn't a Debian package - maybe you're missing the relevant entries in sources.list?
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• 1641[15:11:39] <kojibka> Bushmills: seems OK to me so far: replaced-url
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• 1644[15:13:27] <aexl> "sudo apt update" runs fine?
• 1645[15:14:25] <kojibka> aexl: yes but with notice that all packages have their latest versions
• 1646[15:14:43] <kojibka> Quite strange for last couple months
• 1647[15:15:05] <kojibka> from time to time Opera got upgraded and that's all
• 1648[15:15:36] * humpled wonders howw
• 1649[15:15:57] <alkisg> kojibka: check /var/log/apt/history.log, are you sure you don't have automatic updates running?
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• 1652[15:17:33] <kojibka> aexl: here it is replaced-url
• 1653[15:18:05] <alkisg> This means updates install just fine with unattended-upgrade :)
• 1654[15:18:37] <kojibka> aexl: does it mean all done behind the curtain?
• 1655[15:18:53] <alkisg> kojibka: note that this is another user now, called "alkisg" :)
• 1656[15:19:01] <aexl> ^^
• 1657[15:19:17] <alkisg> Yup, behind the curtain
• 1658[15:19:25] <aexl> ^q^
• 1659[15:21:20] <kojibka> alkisg: I preferred to maintain a bit of control over packages upgrades. How come I don't have it anymore?
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• 1661[15:22:39] <aexl> buster changed some stuff in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades
• 1662[15:22:50] <aexl> and elsewhere
• 1663[15:23:23] <alkisg> replaced-url
• 1664[15:23:29] <kojibka> aexl: OK. it explains a lot. Thank you.
• 1665[15:23:44] <kojibka> alkisg: extra thank you for the link
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• 1671[15:30:04] <brutser> when i install debian alongside another debian as a dual-boot, when i install the 2nd debian, i get "an unsasfe swap space has been detected" < how can i bypass this and create a new encrypted swap for the 2nd os?
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• 1674[15:31:51] <aexl> replaced-url
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• 1677[15:32:22] <brutser> aexl: yes but that is when you have a live iso running
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• 1683[15:35:27] <antto> ,v kicad
• 1684[15:35:28] <judd> Package: kicad on amd64 -- jessie: 0.20140622+bzr4027-3; stretch: 4.0.5+dfsg1-4; stretch-backports: 5.0.2+dfsg1-1~bpo9+1; buster: 5.0.2+dfsg1-1; bullseye: 5.1.3+dfsg1-2; sid: 5.1.4+dfsg1-1
• 1685[15:35:34] <aexl> brutser: swap file is okay too
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• 1690[15:37:35] <brutser> aexl: i just have the debian installer running and i created a new primary partition as a physical volume for encryption, now when i click configure encrypted volumes and i assign the partition that has to be encrypted, it gives the message for the unsafe swap space
• 1691[15:37:49] <brutser> but that's the swap space of the other debian install
• 1692[15:38:10] <brutser> i guess i can do the installation of the encrypted OS first
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• 1694[15:38:17] <ilikeyou> morning. just fyi, it seems this server, security-cdn.debian.org (2a04:4e42:46::204)] [Connecting to cdn-fastly.deb.debian.org, is causing hangs. Past 2 days i noticed.
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• 1696[15:38:38] <aexl> brutser: maybe with this workaround at the bottom? replaced-url
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• 1760[16:34:41] <aZz7eCh> hi #debian. Again I'm wondering how to go about upgrading LibreOffice to 6.3. I have installed 6.2.* by downloading the deb pack from LibreOffice and dkpg installing all the debs for it. It created a folder under /opt/ called Libreofice6.2 ... i can delete that obviously ... but somehow I dont think it constitutes all the system integration / all those deb files i installed for 6.2.
• 1761[16:35:10] <aZz7eCh> is it safe to just download the 6.3 debs and run dkpg to install them over the top? will it automaticallyd etect the 6.2.* install and overwrite any system integration?
• 1762[16:35:32] <aZz7eCh> I cant pruge or uninstall 6.2.* because it will also try and remove gnome and every other system default packagae - NOT what i want obviously ..
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• 1769[16:38:35] <trek00> aZz7eCh: it should not remove gnome, but anyway upgrading a package should be fine
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• 1777[16:45:30] <geek1011> trek00: it conflicts with the debian version of libreoffice, which is depended on by the metapackage gnome
• 1778[16:45:39] <geek1011> ,i gnome
• 1779[16:45:40] <judd> Package gnome (metapackages, optional) in buster/amd64: Full GNOME Desktop Environment, with extra components. Version: 1:3.30+1; Size: 26.1k; Installed: 35k; Screenshot: replaced-url
• 1780[16:45:48] <geek1011> ,i gnome-core
• 1781[16:45:49] <judd> Package gnome-core (metapackages, optional) in buster/amd64: GNOME Desktop Environment -- essential components. Version: 1:3.30+1; Size: 26.2k; Installed: 34k; Screenshot: replaced-url
• 1782[16:46:34] <geek1011> If you use aptitude, you should be able to keep the rest of the GNOME packages, switch the metapackage to gnome-core, and install the LO packages.
• 1783[16:46:38] <trek00> geek1011: gnome never ceases to amaze me :)
• 1784[16:46:39] <geek1011> But I don't recommend doing it.
• 1785[16:47:10] <geek1011> You may break upgrades which modify the gnome package, and the LO packages don't auto-update.
• 1786[16:47:40] <geek1011> It's in backports
• 1787[16:47:42] <geek1011> ,v libreoffice
• 1788[16:47:44] <judd> Package: libreoffice on amd64 -- jessie: 1:4.3.3-2+deb8u11; jessie-security: 1:4.3.3-2+deb8u12; stretch: 1:5.2.7-1+deb9u7; stretch-security: 1:5.2.7-1+deb9u9; buster: 1:6.1.5-3; stretch-backports: 1:6.1.5-3+deb10u2~bpo9+1; buster-security: 1:6.1.5-3+deb10u2; buster-backports: 1:6.3.0~rc2-1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 1:6.3.0~rc2-1; sid: 1:6.3.0-2
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• 1792[16:48:30] <geek1011> So if you add the backports repo, you should be able to do apt install -t buster-backports libreoffice to install LO 6.3.
• 1793[16:48:41] <geek1011> And there won't be any conflicts.
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• 1795[16:49:46] <geek1011> !backport
• 1796[16:49:47] <dpkg> A backport is a package from a newer Debian branch, compiled from source for an older branch to avoid dependency and <ABI> complications. replaced-url
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• 1798[16:50:29] <geek1011> !backport caveat
• 1799[16:50:30] <dpkg> Remember that in installing backports, you will be using an unusual configuration of packages that has not been tested as thoroughly as Debian stable and that newer packages have both newer features and newer bugs. Ask me about <version chasing>. Also note that you can't rely on backports to be patched quickly if vulnerabilities are discovered.
• 1800[16:50:46] <trek00> geek1011: they should definitively use a recommends field for this type of dependecies, so it will be installed but not unistalled if one need to change a packaged
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• 1803[16:52:06] <geek1011> trek00: that would make upgrades more complicated, and for a minimal installation, use gnome-core
• 1804[16:52:10] <geek1011> ,i gnome-core
• 1805[16:52:11] <judd> Package gnome-core (metapackages, optional) in buster/amd64: GNOME Desktop Environment -- essential components. Version: 1:3.30+1; Size: 26.2k; Installed: 34k; Screenshot: replaced-url
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• 1808[16:52:42] <trek00> geek1011: to use recommends vs depends how it would make upgrader more complicated and not the opposite?
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• 1811[16:54:57] <aZz7eCh> geek1011, when i installed 6.2.* .. i simply downloaded the debs from lo's website, it installed just fine along side the default gnome/debian LO
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• 1814[16:55:12] <geek1011> trek00: --no-install-recommends/--without-recomends prevents recommends from being installed automatically (and can be set as a global option, which quite a few people do), and depends also means that dist-upgrade/full-upgrade installs things properly.
• 1815[16:55:28] <aZz7eCh> has not had any conflicts or problems and I was able to tell all my spreadsheet files to open in 6.2 ... i simply ignore the launchers for the default LO launchers
• 1816[16:55:34] <geek1011> aZz7eCh which DE metapackage do you use?
• 1817[16:55:38] <aZz7eCh> its just this one I want to r3emove
• 1818[16:55:42] <aZz7eCh> so i can do the same with 6.3
• 1819[16:55:47] <trek00> geek1011: this is the good part of recommends, you can disable them :)
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• 1821[16:56:05] <aZz7eCh> geek1011, sorry but i dont know what DE metapackage even means
• 1822[16:57:21] <geek1011> aZz7eCh: then you probably use gnome. I'm going to have a look at the LO packages now.
• 1823[16:57:47] <geek1011> also:
• 1824[16:57:48] <geek1011> !frankendebian
• 1825[16:57:48] <dpkg> When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall>
• 1826[16:57:51] <aZz7eCh> oh default gnome yeah ((i'm using deb 9))
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• 1829[16:58:45] <geek1011> I really suggest you just use backports
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• 1836[17:01:38] <aZz7eCh> and well i would not have installed 6.2.* seperately if i wasnt forced to by that security update that was released that broke all our LO Calc functionality
• 1837[17:01:44] <aZz7eCh> i didnt exactly have an option
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• 1839[17:02:15] <aZz7eCh> 5.* was screweed for good
• 1840[17:02:28] <trek00> aZz7eCh: you should get rid of gnome package and instead use its dependencies
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• 1847[17:04:50] <aZz7eCh> i really am too much of a novice to even know what you mean by that ... all i know is ... deb9 stable's LO (V5.*) was completeyl screwed by that securuity update that was released ... other than that i'v ebeen running this install stable and no dramas for years now..
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• 1850[17:07:20] <trek00> aZz7eCh: do you have both libreoffice versions installed?
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• 1852[17:07:46] <aZz7eCh> between here and #libreoffice we tried to make an appimage version of lo 6.2.* solve my problems which it 95% did ... and then you guys lead me into just downloading LO's debs for 6.2 and it installed fine and has no issue running alongside the default lo install
• 1853[17:08:05] <geek1011> oh, and if you must insist on using the LO packages, use aptitude when doing the package stuff (it will stop the worst of the dependency issues)
• 1854[17:08:08] <aZz7eCh> yep i have the efault libreoffice for deb 9 ... and i now alos have 6.2.* running fine
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• 1857[17:08:43] <aZz7eCh> i want to delete the /opt/folder for libreoffice 6.2.* and repeat the process to upgrade to 6.3 which was just released
• 1858[17:08:57] <jhutchins> aZz7eCh: libre office is independent of gnome. Separate project.
• 1859[17:09:02] <trek00> aZz7eCh: then it should not ask you to remove debian, if you remove only the newer libreoffice package
• 1860[17:09:08] <aZz7eCh> how to remove ?
• 1861[17:09:12] <trek00> jhutchins
• 1862[17:09:15] <aZz7eCh> #libreoffice are telling me to apt uninstall
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• 1865[17:09:22] <aZz7eCh> which will try and make my gnome and everything uninstall
• 1866[17:09:24] <aZz7eCh> i dont want ot do that
• 1867[17:09:28] <trek00> jhutchins: see the dependencies of gnome package, it's a mess
• 1868[17:09:28] <aZz7eCh> i only want to remove the 6.2
• 1869[17:09:50] <jhutchins> aZz7eCh: You could try marking it as manually installed, then uninstalling.
• 1870[17:09:54] <aZz7eCh> i cant just dkpg -uninstall *.deb like i did to install it
• 1871[17:10:05] <trek00> aZz7eCh: can you past somewhere the output of dpkg -l | grep libreoffice-calc?
• 1872[17:10:13] <aZz7eCh> k sec
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• 1874[17:10:36] <jhutchins> trek00: I have libreoffice on xfce with no gnome components.
• 1875[17:11:02] <aZz7eCh> replaced-url
• 1876[17:11:15] <trek00> jhutchins: gnome package hard depends on libreoffice, this is crazy i know, but it's the actual problem
• 1877[17:11:23] <jhutchins> aZz7eCh: Is there an open bug for your problem with calc?
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• 1879[17:11:38] <geek1011> trek00: it's for tasksel
• 1880[17:12:00] <trek00> aZz7eCh: well this command shows only the debian libreoffice package, do you know the name of the new libreoffice package?
• 1881[17:12:17] <trek00> geek1011: they don't use recommends, it's wrong :)
• 1882[17:12:26] <geek1011> oh, and:
• 1883[17:12:27] <geek1011> ,why gnome libreoffice-writer
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• 1885[17:12:54] <judd> Packages gnome and libreoffice-writer in buster/amd64 are linked by 2 chains: gnome ▶ libreoffice-writer; gnome ▶ gnome-documents ▷ unoconv ▷ libreoffice-writer
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• 1890[17:14:23] <aZz7eCh> how would i know what it is named trek00 ? i simply downloaded the 6.2.5 debs from LO and ran dkpg -i *.deb like its insructions say. it created a folder under /opt/LibreOffice6.2.5 an di manually make a profile folder for it in my home folder for its settings etc.. i have launchers for it menu and I can right click on my spreadhseet files, go to properties and tell them to open with 6.2.5 instead of the default 5.*
• 1891[17:14:51] <aZz7eCh> other than this i am clueless.
• 1892[17:14:52] <trek00> aZz7eCh: this command could be better: dpkg -l | grep -i office
• 1893[17:14:59] <aZz7eCh> k sec
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• 1898[17:15:31] <aexl> you can /msg dpkg paste
• 1899[17:15:38] <aZz7eCh> replaced-url
• 1900[17:16:02] <geek1011> I think it's called libreoffice6.2 and libreoffice6.3
• 1901[17:16:16] <trek00> aZz7eCh: good, found it, you can apt remove libobasis6.2-core
• 1902[17:16:24] <aZz7eCh> okay will try it now
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• 1905[17:17:13] <trek00> aZz7eCh: or may be better apt remove  libreoffice6.2
• 1906[17:18:05] <aZz7eCh> replaced-url
• 1907[17:18:14] <aZz7eCh> kinda looking to me like it wants to remove a lot of linux header stuff see
• 1908[17:18:58] <aZz7eCh> but udner packages to be REMOVED it looks good like only 6.2 packages
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• 1911[17:19:32] <trek00> aZz7eCh: they should be automatically installed in the past and now unused
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• 1922[17:32:09] <jak2000> hi all wich lines write in apt/sources.list ?
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• 1924[17:33:02] <trek00> jak2000: it depends what you need, this file will tell apt from where to dowload packages
• 1925[17:33:11] <jak2000> yes
• 1926[17:33:24] <jak2000> not remember the /msg to dpkg for tell me
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• 1929[17:34:18] <trek00> jak2000: may be stretch->buster ?
• 1930[17:34:50] <EoflaOE> stretch->buster tells you how to upgrade from Stretch to Buster.
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• 1932[17:35:52] <jak2000> stretch->buster
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• 1939[17:37:11] <jak2000> i am on buster
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• 1944[17:38:15] <EoflaOE> jak2000: What exactly do you want to do?
• 1945[17:38:16] <aexl> man sources.list
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• 1947[17:39:21] <Mathisen> jak2000, replaced-url
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• 1951[17:40:05] <jak2000> something: A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for Debian 7 "Wheezy" has three lines: "deb replaced-url
• 1952[17:40:21] <jak2000> wich lines need on sources.list?
• 1953[17:40:51] <Mathisen> jak2000, read my link it is all there.
• 1954[17:42:06] <jak2000> ok thnks reading
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• 1956[17:43:38] <jak2000> sorry for paste, replaced-url
• 1957[17:43:45] <jak2000> not take the config
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• 1959[17:45:01] <jak2000> i think fixed (the eth0)
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• 1964[17:47:06] <jak2000> done
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• 1968[17:48:13] <humpled> deb wiki still recommending gksu :þ
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• 1976[17:52:58] <jak2000> sudo: add-apt-repository: command not found :(
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• 1983[17:55:07] <humpled> why did you think it would be?
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• 1996[18:01:14] <jhutchins> !sources.list
• 1997[18:01:14] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Buster" has three lines: "deb replaced-url
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• 2008[18:11:20] <jak2000> installed
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• 2013[18:18:48] <jak2000> anyone know how to install java8 ? thanks
• 2014[18:19:41] <jak2000> i followed some guides on google but not luck by moment
• 2015[18:20:29] *** Quits: sedrosken (~sedrosken@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2016[18:20:48] <aexl> ,i openjdk-8-jre
• 2017[18:20:49] <judd> No package named 'openjdk-8-jre' was found in buster/amd64.
• 2018[18:24:18] <aexl> ,i default-jre
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• 2020[18:24:19] <judd> Package default-jre (java, optional) in buster/amd64: Standard Java or Java compatible Runtime. Version: 2:1.11-71; Size: 1.0k; Installed: 6k; Homepage: replaced-url
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• 2026[18:26:15] <jak2000> judd how to install?
• 2027[18:26:20] <aexl> stupid judd replaced-url
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• 2033[18:33:21] <meeseekms> I have a riddle for you. please help. Chrome can't get my VPS's microphone whenever I open it in a vncserver session, nor in a Xvfb session, it returns the same error. But if I open it through ssh with X11 forwarding on my windows pc with Xming it actually gets the microphone fine. I don't know what this is implying could be the issue or what I ev
• 2034[18:33:22] <meeseekms> en need to do to troubleshoot or try
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• 2037[18:38:05] <EoflaOE> jak2000: sudo apt install default-jre
• 2038[18:38:17] <aexl> what's a "VPS microphone"?
• 2039[18:38:43] <aexl> EoflaOE: althought that will install "java" 11 on buster
• 2040[18:39:16] <meeseekms> ah a virtual input source created in pulseaudio. Firefox and every other program will see the "monitor of dummy output" as an input, but chrome refuses so I had to make an actual virtual one
• 2041[18:39:20] <jhutchins> ,v openjdk
• 2042[18:39:21] <judd> No package named 'openjdk' was found in amd64.
• 2043[18:39:31] <geek1011> !install java
• 2044[18:39:31] <dpkg> To install the java runtime environment (JRE) to run java programs, install 'default-jre'; to compile java sources, install 'default-jdk'. You will often find additional openjdk-$X-jre or openjdk-$X-jre versions in <backports>. See also <java alternatives>, <java plugin>.
• 2045[18:39:42] <EoflaOE> aexl: Thanks. Didn't know.
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• 2048[18:40:52] <meeseekms> I don't understand X11 and things related to it. What's the difference between an X screen created by vncserver or Xvfb and one created via X11 forwarding and Xming?
• 2049[18:40:53] *** Quits: sentreen (sentreen@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 2050[18:40:57] <jak2000> done
• 2051[18:41:32] *** Quits: [Brain] (~brain@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2052[18:41:38] <jak2000> sudo apt install default-jre and sudo apt install default-jdk
• 2053[18:42:19] <geek1011> meeseekms: not much, it's a networked protocol, and even when running locally, it depends on the networking stuff
• 2054[18:42:25] *** Joins: spiros (~spiros@replaced-ip)
• 2055[18:42:47] <geek1011> jak2000: you actually don't need both
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• 2057[18:43:10] <jhutchins> geek1011: How do you know what he needs?
• 2058[18:43:39] *** Quits: Sanwas (~frankdnj@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2059[18:44:07] <geek1011> openjdk is enough (you can run stuff with it too)
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• 2062[18:48:16] <meeseekms> geek1011 any idea why chrome can get my mic via forwarding, but not via vncserver or xvfb? Or like how to get a log that's more detailed than "Could not start audio source"?
• 2063[18:48:40] *** Quits: Haudegen (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Quit: Bin weg.)
• 2064[18:48:49] <geek1011> vncserver doesn't have audio support
• 2065[18:49:00] <meeseekms> "NotReadableError Although the user granted permission to use the matching devices, a hardware error occurred at the operating system, browser, or Web page level which prevented access to the device."
• 2066[18:49:02] <geek1011> X2Go and NoMachine do though
• 2067[18:49:30] <meeseekms> ahwhat does that mean? It's just pulseaudio or whatever isn't it?
• 2068[18:49:31] *** Quits: patterson (~patterson@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 2069[18:49:44] <geek1011> that error isn't very descriptive
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• 2072[18:50:19] <geek1011> and I've never used audio remotely much though, so I probably won't be able to figure it any better than you, sorry
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• 2074[18:50:24] <meeseekms> Oh and firefox and every other program can grab the mic fine
• 2075[18:50:34] <meeseekms> darn. Thanks though
• 2076[18:50:35] <geek1011> That might be helpful
• 2077[18:50:42] <geek1011> Wait a sec, let me check something
• 2078[18:51:28] <geek1011> Try running with pasuspender
• 2079[18:51:40] <geek1011> Close all chrome windows, then run pasuspender google-chrome
• 2080[18:51:51] *** Joins: oft_gegong (~mint@replaced-ip)
• 2081[18:52:02] <geek1011> That will force the audio to use ALSA
• 2082[18:52:05] <meeseekms> ah
• 2083[18:52:11] <meeseekms> ok let me try it real quick
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• 2086[18:54:52] * extor has a customized install of "testing" from a few months ago and wonders if by switching the word "testing" in sources.list to "buster" the version would be stable debian now instead of testing
• 2087[18:55:48] <oft_gegong> does Buster allow playing DVD's with vlc out-of-the-box?
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• 2090[18:56:36] <meeseekms> geek1011 just 'pasuspender google-chrome' right?
• 2091[18:56:38] <meeseekms> got the same error
• 2092[18:56:40] <weedloser> sure oft_gegong
• 2093[18:57:15] <weedloser> extor: as long as it isn't updated to current yet, i *think* that should be fine.
• 2094[18:57:16] <geek1011> meeseekms: then I don't know off the top of my head anything else you could try from there
• 2095[18:57:22] <oft_gegong> weedloser: seriously? Don't I need to install the non-free libcss2 or something first?
• 2096[18:57:27] <meeseekms> dang. Thanks though!
• 2097[18:57:49] <geek1011> meeseekms: you should probably try running pavucontrol and see if that works remotely
• 2098[18:57:58] <weedloser> there's no such package oft_gegong, but it has worked for me.
• 2099[18:58:05] <geek1011> meeseekms: that would allow you to see if it's pulseaudio which is the issue
• 2100[18:58:09] <weedloser> DVD/CD players shouldn't require firmware.
• 2101[18:58:28] <geek1011> weedloser: but some disks are encrypted with non-free software
• 2102[18:58:29] <meeseekms> It does, everything works fine except for chrome. I'd just use firefox but I'm making an electron app for it
• 2103[18:58:57] <weedloser> I was under belief most just worked out of the box nowadays, that's sad.
• 2104[18:59:01] <weedloser> I'll look into it.
• 2105[18:59:27] *** Quits: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip) (Quit: vergissmeinnicht)
• 2106[18:59:35] <geek1011> meeseekms: I see, is there a reason why X forwarding isn't suitable?
• 2107[19:00:02] *** Quits: selea (~wiox@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
• 2108[19:00:13] <meeseekms> Well I don't need to see. The electron app is just for the server side, it's just going to run in the bakcground and stream the desktop and audio to a webpage room
• 2109[19:00:20] <meeseekms> with webrtc
• 2110[19:01:04] <meeseekms> This already all works fine serverside in firefox, but I need it to run invisibly in the background so I'm making it an electron app and have to use chrome which is fucked for some reason unless the X it's running in is via forwarding
• 2111[19:01:43] <geek1011> I see
• 2112[19:01:51] <meeseekms> I don't know what could possibly be different between vncserver/Xvfb and forwarding that would make it nto be able to get the mic
• 2113[19:02:08] *** Quits: NetTerminalGene (~NetTermin@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 2114[19:02:21] <geek1011> I was thinking it might be issues with the connection to the audio server (maybe auth or something)...
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• 2120[19:08:21] <meeseekms> geek1011 replaced-url
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• 2126[19:14:05] *** Joins: mykijez_ (~mykijez@replaced-ip)
• 2127[19:14:35] <mykijez_> helo
• 2128[19:16:12] <mykijez_> "/msg dpkg guidelines"
• 2129[19:16:12] *** Quits: tagomago (~tagomago@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2130[19:16:28] <mykijez_> "/msg dpkg guidelines"
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• 2132[19:17:10] *** Joins: tagomago (~tagomago@replaced-ip)
• 2133[19:17:41] <geek1011> meeseekms: not really
• 2134[19:17:49] <geek1011> mykijez_:
• 2135[19:17:51] <geek1011> !ask
• 2136[19:17:51] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
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• 2142[19:21:44] <annadane> mykijez_, you don't need the quotation marks. commands in irc like /msg are just one forward slash followed by the command
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• 2145[19:26:33] *** [Prints] is now known as Prints
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• 2157[19:33:28] <cbthree> I get this red text message during bootup: "failed to start set console font and keymap." i am running buster
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• 2160[19:34:22] *** Quits: kri5t0f (~Kri5t0f@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2161[19:34:43] <meeseekms> Oh another weird thing is that playback on chrome works fine lol.
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• 2165[19:35:34] <jak2000> sudo apt install default-jre and sudo apt install default-jdk
• 2166[19:35:43] <jak2000> but installed jdk 11 :( it have cost :(
• 2167[19:36:08] <cbthree> jak2000, are you talking to me?
• 2168[19:36:19] *** Joins: ilikeyou (ilikeyou@replaced-ip)
• 2169[19:36:41] <jak2000> yes
• 2170[19:36:49] <jak2000> :) any advice
• 2171[19:37:00] <mykijez_> how to give a replay in irc?
• 2172[19:37:01] *** Joins: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip)
• 2173[19:37:25] <cbthree> will sudo apt install default-jre and sudo apt install default-jdk solve the problem i just reoprted?
• 2174[19:37:54] <annadane> jak2000, what are you trying to do, install java to run programs? you just need default-jre, and java 11 is the only one available in debian buster
• 2175[19:38:09] *** Quits: sidmo (~ident@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2176[19:38:18] <annadane> default-jdk is for development and you don't need it to run things
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• 2178[19:39:15] <mykijez_> jak2000
• 2179[19:39:42] <annadane> mykijez_, what do you mean by replay
• 2180[19:40:29] *** Joins: sidmo (~ident@replaced-ip)
• 2181[19:40:32] <mykijez_> yes this type of msg you writing with my name embbeded
• 2182[19:41:07] <annadane> mykijez_, type the first few letters of the person's name and press tab
• 2183[19:41:21] *** Joins: debsan (~debsan@replaced-ip)
• 2184[19:41:56] <mykijez_> annadane, ok :)
• 2185[19:42:49] <mykijez_> annadane, is this correct?
• 2186[19:42:59] *** Joins: lf94 (~lf94@replaced-ip)
• 2187[19:43:34] <annadane> well, you're certainly typing my name which is pinging me so i assume so, unless you're sneakily typing it manually without pressing tab because you're a masochist :P
• 2188[19:44:14] *** Joins: humpled (~i@replaced-ip)
• 2189[19:44:43] <lf94> Hey! I'm attempting to package an old game server (ut2004) for debian in the quilt format. It comes with a "patch" which is just a directory with directories that will overwrite files. What I've done is started with the "base" version, did `quilt new`, applied the "patch" with rsync, and yeah, saved the patch.
• 2190[19:44:59] <lf94> The issue is: my final .deb appears to not include any of the files...
• 2191[19:45:27] <lf94> The .orig does though
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• 2193[19:45:58] *** Joins: x0n (~x0n@replaced-ip)
• 2194[19:46:13] <lf94> I have no idea how to proceed past this
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• 2204[19:49:41] *** Joins: mykijez__ (~mykijez@replaced-ip)
• 2205[19:49:59] <mykijez__> NICK hiker
• 2206[19:50:06] <mykijez__> hi
• 2207[19:50:18] *** mykijez__ is now known as hiker
• 2208[19:50:18] *** Joins: czesmir (~stefan@replaced-ip)
• 2209[19:50:28] <hiker> hi
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• 2213[19:52:22] <ChmEarl> lf94, is the patch in debian/patch/series?
• 2214[19:52:29] <lf94> yep
• 2215[19:52:48] <lf94> I'm starting to think it's my lack of .install file....
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• 2217[19:53:22] <jak2000> annadane: i want run my Java programs
• 2218[19:53:26] <lf94> Yea, it must be
• 2219[19:53:30] <jak2000> with java11 can i do?
• 2220[19:53:37] <annadane> jak2000, most probably yes
• 2221[19:53:41] *** Joins: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip)
• 2222[19:53:49] <annadane> depends on the program... try it and if you have any problems ask here about it
• 2223[19:53:58] <annadane> java -jar <program>
• 2224[19:54:19] *** Joins: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip)
• 2225[19:54:22] <jak2000> its java web based Java EE i use glassfish
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• 2227[19:55:16] <jak2000> annadane: sudo /opt/glassfish5/bin/asadmin create-domain swItsol <--- this command on java oracle 8 run perfectly
• 2228[19:55:25] *** Joins: VadPerevad (~vadpereva@replaced-ip)
• 2229[19:55:38] <annadane> jak2000, i'm afraid i don't know enough about your specific program to comment
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• 2234[19:57:50] <annadane> try searching their documentation, or asking the authors, or using google
• 2235[19:58:01] *** Joins: jezebel (jasabella@replaced-ip)
• 2236[19:58:09] <annadane> or your favorite privacy respecting search engine
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• 2238[19:58:29] <HelloShitty> hello
• 2239[19:58:32] <hiker> how to delete a msg i sented in this chat?
• 2240[19:58:36] <annadane> you can't
• 2241[19:58:50] *** Joins: sobkas (~sobkas@replaced-ip)
• 2242[19:58:54] <HelloShitty> when I issue the following command, wget -O - replaced-url
• 2243[19:58:57] <hiker> ok
• 2244[19:58:58] <HelloShitty> it says
• 2245[19:59:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1530
• 2246[19:59:02] <HelloShitty> saving to STDOUT
• 2247[19:59:10] <HelloShitty> how can I see what was saved in STDOUT?
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• 2249[20:00:14] <jelly> HelloShitty, it will have been displayed on the same terminal the command was run at
• 2250[20:01:03] <HelloShitty> I can only see the usual speed of the transfer, time taken and nothing else
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• 2255[20:01:10] <HelloShitty> it also says:
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• 2257[20:01:13] <jelly> if you want to save to a file for later use, put a file name after -O instead of -
• 2258[20:01:37] <HelloShitty> 2019-08-09 18:56:18 (1.23 MB/s) - written to stout [6]
• 2259[20:01:49] <HelloShitty> ok
• 2260[20:01:52] <HelloShitty> let me try
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• 2269[20:06:06] <ZeroBeholder> Heyo, I bet an intermittent lurker like me completely didn't get to see the good advice you all have given multiple times by now. I went to install Debian on an actual machine. "which iwlist" didn't work among other things. "find iwlist" worked fine and returned the expected result. Boom, path is missing the directory one would think would be there by default. But it wasn't.
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• 2272[20:06:27] <ZeroBeholder> I added it in /etc/environment and to each user's .profile file.
• 2273[20:06:40] *** Quits: nazar (~nazar@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 2274[20:06:43] <ZeroBeholder> Is there a better way or more recommended approach?
• 2275[20:07:13] <lf94> Yeah. It's `iw list`
• 2276[20:07:17] <lf94> Not iwlist :)
• 2277[20:07:29] <lf94> You will need to have super user priviledges
• 2278[20:07:40] <lf94> (sudo iw list)
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• 2280[20:07:46] <devuan> Hello, i have problem with xfce4-terminal.It simply does not dispaly the output of w,who and users command.Any idea what is wrong?thanks
• 2281[20:08:36] <ZeroBeholder> You are probably right-- I have to look those ones up when I need them. But, the $PATH thing-- anybody do anything different or in my own personal interest better?
• 2282[20:08:53] <lf94> I usually set $PATH stuff in .bashrc
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• 2284[20:09:06] *** Joins: Uranium (~Uranium@replaced-ip)
• 2285[20:09:15] <ZeroBeholder> /sbin & /usr/sbin weren't in my path on a fresh install...
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• 2289[20:10:00] <annadane> devuan, are you using debian or devuan?
• 2290[20:10:07] <weedloser> o no
• 2291[20:10:17] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: that sounds weird and like something has messed up :)
• 2292[20:10:31] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: sbin is only accessible by super users.
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• 2294[20:10:41] <lf94> "sudo /sbin/..." would work.
• 2295[20:10:41] <magic_ninja> can anyone suggest a guide to linux networking? Configuration and perhaps something a bit lower level, like layer 3 for the OS ?
• 2296[20:11:15] <devuan> annadane:Devuan but i think it might be the same problem regardless the init system
• 2297[20:11:44] <ZeroBeholder> I am going to give sudo /sbin/some-command a try.
• 2298[20:11:51] <annadane> okay, well, generally, distributions may change some things that we may not be aware of which affects behavior and so it's generally better to ask your distribution's support resources
• 2299[20:12:00] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: you don't need to prefix it either :)
• 2300[20:12:04] *** Quits: hiker (~mykijez@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2301[20:12:10] <lf94> as long as you are a super user, it will find some-command
• 2302[20:12:23] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2303[20:12:39] <lf94> magic_ninja: like firewalls and routing?
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• 2307[20:13:05] <lf94> I'm not familiar with it at all, but today, there are a couple tools / paths to take regarding this...
• 2308[20:13:22] <ZeroBeholder> Super weird, the single user created by the install is not in the sudoers file...
• 2309[20:13:32] <weedloser> how to do linux networking: ignore it and do it on openbsd instead
• 2310[20:13:36] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: that is normal
• 2311[20:13:44] <lf94> weedloser: lmao yeah basically.
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• 2313[20:13:49] <ZeroBeholder> lf94: thanks
• 2314[20:14:00] <alkisg> devuan: devuan probably misses systemd-logind too, so it sounds like a devuan bug, not a debian one
• 2315[20:14:05] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: there is an option if I remember to enable it when installing but its no big deal
• 2316[20:14:08] <ZeroBeholder> I usually install with an image on pretend servers.
• 2317[20:14:20] <ZeroBeholder> I can add the user to sudoers, NBD
• 2318[20:14:21] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: you just add it to /etc/sudoers if I remember
• 2319[20:14:22] <annadane> right, systemd isn't limited to just init
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• 2321[20:15:28] <magic_ninja> lf94, yes. Pretty much. Something a bit more general knowledge perhaps, that will give an overview of how it works on debian-based systems.
• 2322[20:15:36] <devuan> alksig:It worked once, i could display it once in xfce-terminal and mate-terminal.But after that it just stopped to dispaly anything
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• 2324[20:16:10] <trek00> annadane: i think devuan uses elogind, that was added to debian with buster
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• 2326[20:16:31] <devuan> alksig:In Xterm and Uxterm it works fine
• 2327[20:16:34] <magic_ninja> I'm think that way gets the general idea across, as it is kind of a broad topic. Structured linux networking (particularly debian) for someone that knows something about networking.
• 2328[20:16:48] <annadane> devuan, may honestly just be a bug in xfce4-terminal in devuan
• 2329[20:16:59] <annadane> they'd appreciate your report
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• 2331[20:17:49] <trek00> devuan: may be related to the sgid flag in xfce-terminal?
• 2332[20:17:53] <ZeroBeholder> ...It seems my biggest problem is that my hand was held for too many years. That /usr/sbin & /sbin were not in the root user's path was weird for me. I think my other half of problems was that I was expecting my user to have sudo access-- which isn't strange for a new true install.
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• 2334[20:18:32] <trek00> devuan: here with urxvt I have it installed sgid utmp, if not it can't write to utmp and then no users displayed
• 2335[20:19:13] <annadane> ZeroBeholder, how are you becoming root, su - will get you sbin access in buster, su by itself won't
• 2336[20:19:14] *** Joins: mikkel (~rusty@replaced-ip)
• 2337[20:19:18] <annadane> unless i'm misunderstanding the problrm
• 2338[20:19:19] <annadane> problem*
• 2339[20:19:39] <annadane> i did scroll up to try to make sense of it
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• 2342[20:22:10] <devuan> trek00:How do you explain that it worked once?In mate-terminal the same problem, i tried to reset both terminals, worked once and than nothing again.It worked after fresh install
• 2343[20:22:16] <annadane> as to sudo with multiple unprivileged users, i don't know how you do that
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• 2345[20:23:42] <trek00> devuan: first we need to be sure what is the problem
• 2346[20:24:20] <annadane> sorry ZeroBeholder, i see lf94 solved it, i didn't see that
• 2347[20:24:57] <trek00> devuan: please paste somewhere the output of ls -l /usr/bin/xfce4-terminal* /usr/bin/*xterm
• 2348[20:25:03] <devuan> trek00:well frankly i do not know, i used debian before then devuan 1.0 no problems.Now devuan 2.0 this issue.I really do not know what could be the culprit
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• 2350[20:26:27] <jelly> devuan, can you reproduce the issue on an actual debian 10 or debian 9?
• 2351[20:26:43] *** Quits: jlbuckner (jlbuckner@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 2352[20:27:27] <devuan> jelly:I am on the machine right now
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• 2355[20:28:10] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: many distributions have different initial behaviors - dont beat yourself up about it :)
• 2356[20:28:25] <lf94> In many installs, the user _is_ in the sudoers file by default.
• 2357[20:28:28] <jelly> devuan, I mean booted into debian, not devuan
• 2358[20:29:04] <trek00> devuan: i wait for your output
• 2359[20:29:08] <lf94> ZeroBeholder: as long as you tell yourself "maybe this distro doesnt do that", you'll be ok
• 2360[20:30:11] <devuan> trek00: replaced-url
• 2361[20:30:13] *** Joins: Marajxa (~Marajxa@replaced-ip)
• 2362[20:30:41] <trek00> lf94: on my install i have selected to have the root user, thus no sudo, and the user was not added to /etc/sudores, I need to type the root password (and it's fine for me)
• 2363[20:31:18] <trek00> devuan: xterm is actually working fine?
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• 2366[20:31:58] <devuan> trek00: well yes it seems that only xfce-terminal and mate-terminal are affected
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• 2369[20:32:44] <lf94> trek00: yes, that's fine too
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• 2374[20:34:02] <trek00> devuan: given that output I excepted xterm was not working too, sorry I can't help you, may be this issue is very specific to devuan, may be xterm is linked to elogind? this command could answer: ldd /usr/bin/xterm | grep -i login
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• 2378[20:35:53] <devuan> trek00: Anyway thank you for trying i will try google one more time
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• 2380[20:37:00] <Soo_Slow> hello. What s the best way to backup multimedia on debian? I mean - rsync is nice for text files and configs. But for daily backups of large data... or is it?
• 2381[20:37:05] <trek00> devuan: if you can't find a solution, you could try to open a bug report to devuan, may be they are not aware about the issue
• 2382[20:38:02] <trek00> Soo_Slow: rsync is the best if you don't need to reupload only parts of a file
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• 2385[20:39:08] <jelly> Soo_Slow, it's nice for large files, if said large files do not change on a daily basis
• 2386[20:39:49] <jelly> but rsync is just a tool for copying, it's not a complete backup solution
• 2387[20:40:00] <jelly> it can be part of one.
• 2388[20:40:18] <Soo_Slow> I've heard of rsync-based tool called timeshift, if thats what you mean
• 2389[20:40:19] <trek00> yes, there are many "frontends" to rsync, like rsnapshot or your script :)
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• 2392[20:41:03] <Soo_Slow> but I just want to backup some folders inside my /home/. While said tool by default, tries to backup whole /
• 2393[20:42:13] <trek00> Soo_Slow: if you are comfortable with command-line, rsync is your best friend :)
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• 2396[20:43:49] <Soo_Slow> the deal with rsync is that I cant select the most optimal way to perform backups of large data. I mean - for configs and such, I can just create date-named folders each time. So it will be easy to revert back to some specific day if something will go wrong. But for large media it means using enormous amount of space each day... Or, well, losing ability to revert back to few days before, in case something went
• 2397[20:43:50] <Soo_Slow> wrong and you didnt notice it asap. Or did I miss something?
• 2398[20:43:56] <trek00> Soo_Slow: there are many frontends to rsync, you can check them with: apt-cache rdepends rsync
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• 2402[20:45:43] <Soo_Slow> the cool thing about timeshift is that it also uses symlinks to previous backups. Like I said, it create new folders for each new backup, but only copy new/changed files - while for old data it just create symlinks from previous backups
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• 2405[20:46:07] <trek00> Soo_Slow: you can do it with nearly all frontends to rsync
• 2406[20:46:12] <Soo_Slow> I wonder if "vanilla" rsync is capable of something like that
• 2407[20:46:15] <Soo_Slow> can I?
• 2408[20:46:17] <trek00> Soo_Slow: yes
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• 2410[20:46:38] <Soo_Slow> can you link me some guide regarding how to achieve that?
• 2411[20:47:03] <annadane> semi but mostly un - relatedly, there was this really cool website which i now forget that allowed you to plug various options into a unix command, which may help if you're trying to do something very specific
• 2412[20:47:09] <annadane> i've lost it now unfortunately
• 2413[20:47:18] <annadane> it'd be useful for something like rsync
• 2414[20:47:19] <trek00> Soo_Slow: I suggest you to use a frontend to rsync, they are made exactly for these things (I suggest rsnapshot as it is really simple to configure)
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• 2416[20:47:44] <annadane> yeah or use a frontend
• 2417[20:48:08] <trek00> Soo_Slow: but internally they all do: rsync original dest; then the next month they do: rsync --link-dest dest dest.1 && rsync original dest
• 2418[20:49:02] <Soo_Slow> trek00, thanks, will check that too. As for rsnapshot - for some reason, I can only find related articles on german. Even on archwiki :D
• 2419[20:49:07] *** Quits: CaptainN (~KevinKeen@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 2420[20:49:12] <Soo_Slow> (I mean - regarding how to configure it)
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• 2422[20:49:32] <trek00> Soo_Slow: check the rsnapshot config file, all you need is to configure the paths at the end
• 2423[20:49:36] <annadane> resisting urge to make dumb jokes
• 2424[20:49:42] <magic_ninja> looks like pgrep returns an exit code after displaying output on stdout.
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• 2427[20:50:02] <magic_ninja> How can I catch the output to stdout? It doesn't seem that I can catch the exit code.
• 2428[20:50:03] <Soo_Slow> trek00, and it will do everything else by its own?
• 2429[20:50:18] <trek00> magic_ninja: pgrep; echo $?
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• 2432[20:50:28] <trek00> Soo_Slow: yes
• 2433[20:50:35] <Soo_Slow> interesting, thanks
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• 2436[20:51:06] <annadane> replaced-url
• 2437[20:51:33] <annadane> man pages work too :-)
• 2438[20:51:37] <magic_ninja> trek00, I believe that echos the return code from pgrep.
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• 2441[20:52:02] <trek00> magic_ninja: is it what you need?
• 2442[20:52:13] <magic_ninja> I just want to search for a process and use it in a conditional statement.
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• 2445[20:53:12] <trek00> magic_ninja: may be: variable=$(pgrep processname)
• 2446[20:53:48] <magic_ninja> I don't know what that returns when the process isn't present
• 2447[20:54:16] <trek00> magic_ninja: if it isn't present, variable will be empty
• 2448[20:54:27] <magic_ninja> is that zero or NULL
• 2449[20:54:37] <magic_ninja> Or is it a return code from pgrep?
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• 2455[20:56:23] <trek00> magic_ninja: if [ -n "$(pgrep processname)"]; then echo the process exist; else echo the process was not found; fi
• 2456[20:56:51] <magic_ninja> okay, so I need semi-colons on the command line?
• 2457[20:56:57] <magic_ninja> or do they work in bash as well?
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• 2460[20:57:15] <trek00> magic_ninja: semicolons are like a new line
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• 2462[20:58:44] <trek00> magic_ninja: there was not a space before ], so the fixed one: if [ -n "$(pgrep processname)" ]; then echo the process exist; else echo the process was not found; fi
• 2463[20:59:28] <magic_ninja> Didn't know about the new line. The quotes signify?
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• 2466[21:00:06] <trek00> magic_ninja: yes, you should always quote variables inside a test statement [ ]
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• 2471[21:01:22] <magic_ninja> so the quotes means that bash makes a string comparison?
• 2472[21:01:50] <trek00> magic_ninja: it means "threat it as a single string"
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• 2474[21:03:03] <magic_ninja> so, $(pgrep pithos) and $(echo pgrep pithos) are not the same thing
• 2475[21:04:35] <trek00> magic_ninja: well $() is a variable that contains the output of the command: so echo $(pgrep pithos) is equal to 1234 and echo $(echo pgrep pithos) is equal to "pgrep pithos"
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• 2481[21:07:24] <magic_ninja> trek00, okay, so, pgrep has an exit status when you call it. 0 - 3 for various flags. Wouldn't that mean that it will return 0-3 after printing out the PID in the terminal ?
• 2482[21:08:53] <trek00> magic_ninja: the exist status will go to $?, but you can ignore it
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• 2486[21:10:00] <trek00> magic_ninja: if pgrep output a pid, exit status will be 0, if it has an empty output, exit status will be not 0
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• 2488[21:10:33] <magic_ninja> Okay, so there is a difference between its output an exit status.
• 2489[21:10:46] <trek00> magic_ninja: yes, they are separated
• 2490[21:11:25] <trek00> magic_ninja: just for curiosity, what are you trying to achieve?
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• 2492[21:13:52] <magic_ninja> if [ "$(pgrep pithos)" = "$(echo pgrep pithos)" ]; then echo equal; fi <--this shows that they are not equal. At least as strings.
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• 2494[21:14:30] <trek00> magic_ninja: yes, you can compare the output by hand: pgrep pithos; echo pgrep pithos
• 2495[21:14:33] <magic_ninja> I'm just writing a little script to see if pithos is running. If so, kill it. Then start pithos. It is for kde connect.
• 2496[21:14:48] <magic_ninja> I believe they are different types.
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• 2500[21:16:04] <trek00> magic_ninja: if [ -n "$(pgrep pithos)" ]; then echo "restarting"; killall pithos; pithos; else echo "not running"; fi
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• 2503[21:17:03] <magic_ninja> thanks.
• 2504[21:17:05] <trek00> :)
• 2505[21:17:17] <magic_ninja> Still going to find the answer to my question, though.
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• 2508[21:17:42] <trek00> magic_ninja: i missed it, what question?
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• 2510[21:17:51] <magic_ninja> an integer comparison doesn't work, so it has to be a string comparison.
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• 2513[21:18:10] <magic_ninja> Well, what does pgrep actually send to stdout
• 2514[21:18:17] <trek00> magic_ninja: posix shell does not have typed variables, anything is a string
• 2515[21:18:33] <magic_ninja> So, how do you access the exit codes, then?
• 2516[21:18:45] <trek00> magic_ninja: pgrep will output the pid of the processname
• 2517[21:18:58] <magic_ninja> It will output it to stdout as a string, right?
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• 2519[21:19:09] <trek00> magic_ninja: with the $? variable, that contains a number stored as string
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• 2521[21:19:51] <magic_ninja> so that variable gets updated each time a command is ran?
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• 2525[21:20:20] <trek00> magic_ninja: pgrep output a pid number to stdout and its error code is stored in the $? variable, but even if they are both integers, they are stored as strings
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• 2527[21:20:47] <trek00> magic_ninja: yes, the $? variable is a special variable that begin updated at each command
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• 2529[21:21:04] <magic_ninja> I'm comfortable with the string thing and will assume everything is a string at this point, and to do numerical comparisons I need to specify it is a number.
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• 2532[21:21:53] <trek00> magic_ninja: but it works only inside the calling shell, not in subshells: pgrep process; echo $? works, but not var=$(prgrep process); echo $?
• 2533[21:22:11] *** Joins: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip)
• 2534[21:22:46] <magic_ninja> So you can run a command, see how it went, and act accordingly
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• 2536[21:22:49] <finn0> GNOME terminal is not detecting ~/.profile file present in "$HOME" directory (both of them ~/.bash_profile & ~/.bash_login are absent). Whereas, console and tmux detects ~/.profile file. I also tried to move ~/.profile to ~/.bash_profile but still GNOME terminal is not detecting.
• 2537[21:22:52] *** Joins: kupi (uid212005@replaced-ip)
• 2538[21:22:55] <finn0> *I've also
• 2539[21:22:58] <trek00> magic_ninja: exactly
• 2540[21:23:29] <trek00> finn0: .profile should be read only by shells, not terminals
• 2541[21:23:36] <magic_ninja> finn0, your Gnome config is not the same as your Gnome terminal config. Gnome doesn't depend on Gnome Terminal.
• 2542[21:23:48] <magic_ninja> You have to copy your config for Gnome terminal specifically.
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• 2548[21:26:15] <finn0> trek00: Then why does console on tty detects ~/.profile file whereas, login from same user in GNOME shell is not working?
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• 2551[21:27:42] <trek00> finn0: because on tty, login calls sh --login that reads /etc/profile and ~/.profile
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• 2553[21:27:59] <trek00> finn0: you should put these things in .bashrc
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• 2560[21:30:46] <magic_ninja> So here another way that works okay. pgrep pithos; if [ $? = 0 ]; then kill $(pgrep pithos); pithos; else pithos; fi
• 2561[21:31:14] <magic_ninja> And actually it could be pgrep pithos; if [ $? = 0 ]; then kill $(pgrep pithos); fi; pithos
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• 2563[21:31:25] <trek00> magic_ninja: good!
• 2564[21:31:47] <Bushmills> same as ... && kill # no need to compare $? explicitely
• 2565[21:31:48] <trek00> magic_ninja: killall pithos should be better than kill $(prgrep pithos)
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• 2567[21:32:17] <Bushmills> there's also pkill, combining pgrep and kill
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• 2569[21:32:35] <trek00> magic_ninja: as Bushmills said, you can pgrep pithos && killall pithos; pithos
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• 2571[21:32:43] <magic_ninja> So there is 5 ways to do it, heh.
• 2572[21:32:58] <magic_ninja> Gotta start somewhere :)
• 2573[21:33:15] <magic_ninja> So what is the && shorthand for?
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• 2575[21:33:24] <trek00> magic_ninja: is a contracted if statement
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• 2578[21:33:49] <Bushmills> you know you can also do if command; then to check and act according command return value
• 2579[21:33:50] <trek00> magic_ninja: command && echo true || echo false
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• 2581[21:34:05] <Bushmills> again, no need for explicite testing of $?
• 2582[21:34:06] <finn0> magic_ninja: Sorry for my bad english. I think, I didn't explain my problem clearly. I don't have any configuration for GNOME terminal. I only want GNOME terminal to have detected all of my env variables, aliases and functions defined in ~/.profile which will source bashrc file.
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• 2585[21:34:32] <trek00> magic_ninja: it's the same as: command; if [ $? = 0 ]; then echo true; else echo false; fi
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• 2587[21:35:02] <trek00> finn0: you should define these variables in you .bashrc not .profile
• 2588[21:35:06] <magic_ninja> Oh, I remember tose from that C class
• 2589[21:35:13] <magic_ninja> I forgot those existed.
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• 2591[21:35:38] <Bushmills> though many would simply use pkill
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• 2593[21:36:13] <magic_ninja> Well, the point of the exercise was to explore bash scripting a bit more so than to just get a solution.
• 2594[21:36:21] <trek00> Bushmills: yes the shorter command would be a=pithos; pkill $a; $a
• 2595[21:36:23] <magic_ninja> trek00 gave me the solution a while back :)
• 2596[21:36:47] <magic_ninja> or just pkill pithos; pithos
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• 2599[21:37:41] <finn0> trek00: According to bash manual first looks for /etc/profile file then ~/.bash_profile -> ~/.bash_login -> ~/.profile in following order such that if any one found, ignore all later files. And source bashrc file from anyone of file.
• 2600[21:38:07] <trek00> finn0: according to the manual page it looks for profile ONLY when login shell
• 2601[21:38:36] <trek00> finn0: for a simple interactive shell it reads only .bashrc
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• 2604[21:39:51] <trek00> magic_ninja: if you are interested in posix shell programming, i made an implementation of compress written in shell
• 2605[21:39:55] <cbthree> I get this red text message during bootup: "failed to start set console font and keymap." i am running buster
• 2606[21:40:23] <finn0> trek00: sorry for my ignorance. Does GNOME shell read ~/.profile file after user login?
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• 2608[21:41:01] <trek00> finn0: not
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• 2610[21:41:55] <trek00> cbthree: may be this help you? replaced-url
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• 2622[21:45:21] <magic_ninja> trek00, just a bit of tinkering at the moment so that I can use kdeconnect to relaunch some stuff. It is cool to be working out in the yard or something and be able to control my music.
• 2623[21:45:48] <jhutchins> cbthree: Have you set a locale?
• 2624[21:45:51] <jhutchins> !locale
• 2625[21:45:51] <dpkg> A locale is a set of rules for presenting information to humans according to local conventions (date format, thousands separators, language, etc.). Ask me about <locales> to establish on a Debian system. replaced-url
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• 2628[21:46:12] <humpled> yuck pkill
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• 2633[21:47:17] <finn0> trek00: And I have defined all my PATH and some infrequently changing env variable in ~/.profile as per suggested by some people from #bash IRC channel. Because variables in ~/.profile file is read only once at time login and preserve for whole session and then source bashrc file from ~/.profile file.
• 2634[21:47:19] <jhutchins> Whatever works.
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• 2636[21:47:56] <trek00> magic_ninja: just for advertising :) replaced-url
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• 2638[21:48:10] <humpled> pkill can give a multi line output
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• 2642[21:49:08] <trek00> finn0: it depends wath you want: if you want some variable stored for the entire session, store it in .profile, but don't except it will be available on interactive shells, only other programs
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• 2647[21:50:36] <HelloShitty> Guys, I need help again... lol
• 2648[21:50:44] *** Joins: asterismo_l (~asterismo@replaced-ip)
• 2649[21:50:47] <HelloShitty> I was using an alias inside my .bash_profile
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• 2651[21:51:02] <HelloShitty> that was messing with one other program I need to use
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• 2654[21:51:16] <HelloShitty> and I went there an changed the alias to another name
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• 2656[21:51:25] <HelloShitty> but the alias seems to be still there
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• 2659[21:51:49] <jhutchins> HelloShitty: Did you restart the shell?
• 2660[21:51:50] <HelloShitty> because when I run the command, I still get the old output and not the expexcted one
• 2661[21:52:01] <trek00> HelloShitty: you need to logout the shell or unalias these aliases :)
• 2662[21:52:04] <HelloShitty> I did source .bash_profile
• 2663[21:52:18] <jhutchins> HelloShitty: That will add but not delete.
• 2664[21:52:25] <HelloShitty> hum, ok
• 2665[21:52:25] <finn0> trek00: Thanks for clearing my doubts. Now, I will try to fix my problem.
• 2666[21:52:34] <HelloShitty> Hoe do I unlias it?
• 2667[21:52:38] <trek00> finn0: hope helped you :)
• 2668[21:52:45] <HelloShitty> other than closing and reopen the shell?
• 2669[21:52:49] <trek00> HelloShitty: unalias nameofalias
• 2670[21:52:58] <HelloShitty> ok, thank you again
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• 2672[21:53:15] <trek00> HelloShitty: really like your nickname :)
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• 2676[21:53:40] <HelloShitty> :p
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• 2694[22:00:14] <cbthree> trek00, i did sudo systemctl restart console-setup.service and did not solve the issue
• 2695[22:00:44] <cbthree> jhutchins, locale?
• 2696[22:00:49] <trek00> cbthree: and the journal what it says?
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• 2710[22:05:01] <cbthree> trek00, systemd[1]: console-setup.service: Failed with result 'exit-code'.
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• 2712[22:05:48] <trek00> cbthree: well it says anything useful, sorry I don't use systemd
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• 2715[22:06:13] <trek00> cbthree: did you try to dpkg-reconfigure console-setup ?
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• 2721[22:08:09] <cbthree> trek00, i just did dpkg-reconfigure console-setup and it made no difference
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• 2723[22:08:57] <jhutchins> cbthree: Did you see the message above from dpkg?
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• 2727[22:10:00] <trek00> jhutchins at boot
• 2728[22:10:28] <cbthree> jhutchins, afaik i have not set any locale
• 2729[22:11:59] <trek00> cbthree: this show any useful output? service console-setup start
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• 2731[22:13:18] <trek00> cbthree: or may be some related output in /var/log/messages or /var/log/syslog ?
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• 2734[22:14:12] <cbthree> Job for console-setup.service failed because the control process exited with error code.
• 2735[22:14:12] <cbthree> See "systemctl status console-setup.service" and "journalctl -xe" for details.
• 2736[22:14:56] <trek00> so nothing :(
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• 2747[22:16:57] <cbthree> console-setup.sh[1714]: /usr/bin/ckbcomp: Can not find file "symbols/en" in any known directory
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• 2749[22:17:42] <HelloShitty> trek00: after deleting wallt.dat, will it be created again when I run getnewaddress again?
• 2750[22:17:50] <HelloShitty> What about wallet.lock file?
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• 2752[22:18:39] <HelloShitty> or better .walletlock file
• 2753[22:18:44] <HelloShitty> ?
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• 2782[22:30:40] <trek00> HelloShitty: I really don't know what is wallt.dat
• 2783[22:30:50] <HelloShitty> wallet.dat
• 2784[22:31:14] <melpy> if you're talking about bitcoin-core, then no the getnewaddress command alone won't create a wallet.dat
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• 2787[22:31:42] <HelloShitty> so, if I delete the wallet.dat, how will it be re-created?
• 2788[22:31:48] <HelloShitty> Next time I start bitcoind ?
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• 2790[22:32:08] <trek00> cbthree: is it a fresh buster install or an upgrade?
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• 2792[22:32:14] <mvaenskae> how do i enable persistent logging in debian? it seems like syslogs are lost upon a reboot
• 2793[22:32:33] <melpy> HelloShitty: yes
• 2794[22:32:39] <HelloShitty> I think I'm in the wrong channel
• 2795[22:32:40] <HelloShitty> lol
• 2796[22:32:40] <trek00> HelloShitty: hope wallet.dat is not your bitcoin private wallet or if you delete it you will never recover your bitcoins...
• 2797[22:32:51] <jmcnaught> mvaenskae: /var/log/syslog should be persistent, see /usr/share/doc/systemd/README.Debian for how to enable persistent journal
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• 2801[22:33:14] <trek00> mvaenskae: they are rotated, like /var/log/syslog.0 .1 .2.gz and so
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• 2803[22:33:23] <HelloShitty> yeah, I thought I was in another channel... Shitty me
• 2804[22:33:24] <HelloShitty> lol
• 2805[22:33:32] <cbthree> trek00, managed to solve the problem. i edited /etc/default/keyboard and changed the line XKBLAYOUT="en" to XKBLAYOUT="us"
• 2806[22:33:51] <trek00> cbthree: good! :)
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• 2808[22:34:12] <mvaenskae> hm, how come journalctl -b -1 doesn't find my previous reboot then?
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• 2811[22:34:39] <trek00> mvaenskae: syslog and journal are different things
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• 2816[22:36:24] <yurakeshi> is it possible to create an backup initrd.img? I'm trying to make vfio work, but every time I get it wrong I need to use an live usb to fix it. Anyway to have a backup img to run if the moprod.d/ settings give me a black screen?
• 2817[22:36:48] <mvaenskae> what differentiates the journal from the syslog?
• 2818[22:36:54] <trek00> yurakeshi: just make a copy of it
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• 2821[22:37:34] <trek00> yurakeshi: cp -ia /initrd.img /boot/initrd-backup.img
• 2822[22:38:30] <trek00> yurakeshi: then at boot with grub you could do: initrd /boot/initrd-backup.img
• 2823[22:38:39] <yurakeshi> trek00, I tried making a copy of initrd.img-$(uname -r), vmlinuz- and /lib/modules, and then I run update-initramfs and update-grub. The bkp image did show on grub, but I got a black screen trying to use it
• 2824[22:39:12] *** Quits: hybrid (~hybrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2825[22:39:13] <mvaenskae> also looking at the debian info it tells to uninstall the syslog-daemon; which is the default one in debian and why isn't the use of systemd, if already existent fully embraced?
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• 2827[22:39:36] <yurakeshi> trek00, I see, just make a backup of it and change the cmd line on grub? I'll try it, thanks
• 2828[22:40:24] <trek00> yurakeshi: if you make changes only to initrd, without recompiling the kernel, only initrd should be backup and only change this parameter on grub at boot
• 2829[22:40:41] <ratrace> mvaenskae: "how come journalctl -b -1 doesn't find my previous reboot" :: because by default journald is not configured for on-disk persistence
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• 2831[22:40:58] <EDMhotdog> hey guys :))) have a great day and please have a look at my friends house music productions!!!! THANKYOU so much!!! replaced-url
• 2832[22:40:59] <EDMhotdog> The music will give you smiles, happiness and boing boing jump up energy! :D REMEMBA 2 SUBSCRIBE :D
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• 2837[22:41:33] <trek00> mvaenskae: journal is another method to save system logs other than syslog
• 2838[22:41:37] <jmcnaught> mvaenskae: 'journalctl -b -1' doesn't find the previous boot because systemd-journald is not persistent on Debian by default, but the rsyslog that it forwards to is, so you can just look at the text files in /var/log if you want, or make the journal persistent.
• 2839[22:41:41] <ratrace> mvaenskae: the difference between them is that the journald is a event logger, functionally solves a very similar problem like syslog, but in more detail and with more capability
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• 2842[22:41:59] <yurakeshi> trek00, ty, gonna try it now
• 2843[22:42:00] <trek00> mvaenskae: if you need to find old logs, simply ignore journalctl and check under /var/log
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• 2854[22:46:00] <mvaenskae> uncommon to me at least -- why not gut out the journaling if it's not "used"?
• 2855[22:46:23] <jmcnaught> it's still handy for the current boot if it's not persistent
• 2856[22:46:49] <mvaenskae> it requires the user to learn two interfaces in interacting with logs
• 2857[22:46:59] <trek00> mvaenskae: may be these instructions are written for something else than debian?
• 2858[22:47:29] <humpled> "the debian info"
• 2859[22:47:34] <trek00> oops
• 2860[22:47:58] <jmcnaught> I make journald persistent on my system and don't bother to remove rsyslog, it leads to duplicated logs but I don't care it's not very much space.
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• 2864[22:48:16] <humpled> but what info, we don't know
• 2865[22:48:26] <trek00> mvaenskae: this is not an ideal situation, but the systemd migration is pretty new and not all the things are fine
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• 2869[22:50:26] <mvaenskae> ah, i thought that part of the migration would have finished by now as systemd feels kinda old
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• 2871[22:51:20] <trek00> mvaenskae: my very personal opinion is that systemd is still unfinished by now :)
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• 2877[22:52:29] <yurakeshi> trek00, ty, it worked =)
• 2878[22:53:13] <trek00> :)
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• 2882[22:56:02] <mvaenskae> i find it funny how everything jumped ship before the product was finished
• 2883[22:56:36] <jhutchins> mvaenskae: Old is relative, systemd's still new enough that not all projects have started working with it, and it's also a moving target with features and functions changing pretty constantly.
• 2884[22:56:37] <mvaenskae> anyways, thanks for the help guys and bearing with my inquiries :)
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• 2887[22:56:53] <trek00> mvaenskae: may be the issues it resolves are more than the issue it takes, on the overall userbase
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• 2891[22:58:14] <trek00> jhutchins: i agree, it's difficult to have documentation and programs up to date with systemd
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• 2907[23:03:59] <mvaenskae> another matter while on logs; how can i stop this spam in my syslogs? replaced-url
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• 2910[23:04:41] <mvaenskae> this is but a subsection of the messages, there are a lot more floating around and it's somewhat annoying to have a couple screen-heights of useless lines there
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• 2913[23:05:15] <trek00> mvaenskae: may be your monitor get disconnected and the reconnect?
• 2914[23:05:33] <srukle> Looks like monitor connection logs. Check cables?
• 2915[23:05:59] <mvaenskae> yeah but does my syslog need to log that?
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• 2917[23:06:37] <trek00> mvaenskae: may be this is a bug with a workaround replaced-url
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• 2919[23:07:32] <mvaenskae> going to newer commits it seems to suggest that unless the user touched something it should be disabled
• 2920[23:07:38] <mvaenskae> and i never enabled anything to my knowledge
• 2921[23:08:25] <trek00> mvaenskae: anyway i'll give a try to add kscreen.xcb.helper=false to ~/.config/QtProject/qtlogging.ini
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• 2930[23:12:15] <mvaenskae> seems like kscreen has an implicit wontfix on this the more i read up on it...
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• 2933[23:13:32] <mvaenskae> thanks for notifying me of earlier working solutions; i will experiment around a bit see if i can get something to work
• 2934[23:13:51] <trek00> mvaenskae: bugs are inside programs like ants are inside their colonies :)
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• 2938[23:15:44] <mvaenskae> so the more you prod the program the more bugs you find?
• 2939[23:15:48] <mvaenskae> nice analogy
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• 2943[23:17:14] <trek00> mvaenskae: it's inevitable to have bugs developing thousands lines of code, we can only reduce them with time passing, but we also introduce new of them when developing new features :)
• 2944[23:18:19] <yurakeshi> the developer life cycle... add features, fix bugs...
• 2945[23:18:26] <trek00> eheheheh :D
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• 2949[23:20:47] <humpled> an ant colony without ants is pretty pointless
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• 2952[23:23:14] <trek00> humpled: nice, philosophically speaking, an ant colony without ants is dead, like a software without bugs as it would act deterministically like a not-living-thing :)
• 2953[23:23:44] <humpled> it wouldn't act at all
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• 2957[23:25:05] <trek00> humpled: planets are not-living-things but they acts: they orbits around the center of mass.. but may be too much off-topic :)
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• 2959[23:25:28] <meeseekms> geek1011 I finally figured it out. All it needed was a delay before trying to grab it. It was working when I tried with X11 forwarding because that method takes so long to start up lol..
• 2960[23:25:57] <geek1011> meeseekms: lol, that would explain everything!
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• 2962[23:26:29] <meeseekms> I spent all day yesterday and most of today bashing my head from this :weary:
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• 2968[23:28:43] <Peyam> Hi, I'm just doing some C++ and Matlab on my machine and sometimes Python. Do I need all of these compilers? replaced-url
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• 2970[23:29:26] <geek1011> Peyam: you don't need clang and gcc, one is enough
• 2971[23:29:28] <trek00> Peyam: clang and gcc/g++ are alternatives
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• 2974[23:31:21] <geek1011> meeseekms: I can relate (I spent a week trying to figure out why zips created by an app I wrote appeared corrupted in some applications when the app was run on Windows, and it turned out to be that the zip standard only officially supports forward slashes internally, even if the host OS uses backslashes [cough, cough, windows])
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• 2983[23:33:49] <meeseekms> oooh lmao
• 2984[23:34:23] <meeseekms> windows has to be special lmao
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• 2987[23:34:44] * geek1011 doesn't like windows
• 2988[23:35:24] <roylaprattep> have a question, running postfix and dovecot with Maildir format.... but still receiving in /var/mail....
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• 2995[23:38:56] <meeseekms> btw lol, switching the stream server from firefox to chrome (I'm doing all this to stream desktop and audio to browsers with webrtc) made the cpu usage drop from 70% on both cores peaking to 100, to only 30% peaking to 40 lol
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• 2999[23:39:37] <yurakeshi> trying to setup VGA passthrough but getting black screen on host after setting vfio-pci ids. I want to pass the GTX 960 and use intel integrated on the host. I've been banging my head on this for days, any help is welcome. replaced-url
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• 3002[23:42:28] <skittle_> .
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• 3019[23:52:25] <trek00> roylaprattep: if you receive mail in /var/mail you should change configuration to postfix
• 3020[23:53:12] <trek00> roylaprattep: may be this help replaced-url
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• 3023[23:53:50] <raidghost> When upgrading from debian stretch to buster. Do i need to setup Uniform resource identifier for LDAP-host ?
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• 3025[23:54:14] <raidghost> or can i press cancel ?
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• 3033[23:56:39] <trek00> yurakeshi: as last chance you could try to pass the intel one to the guest as the opensource drivers could be simpler to debug than nvidia closed ones
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