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• 62[00:49:39] <Lady_Aleena> Is 269GB enough disk space to install Stretch?
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• 64[00:50:16] <mtn> easily
• 65[00:50:25] <Lady_Aleena> Good.
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• 67[00:50:35] <mtn> you could do it in 20G or less
• 68[00:51:32] <Lady_Aleena> Now to get the nerve to move onto the next steps.
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• 73[00:53:17] <Lady_Aleena> I didn't go through this between wheezy and jessie, I just installed a new hard drive and installed jessie from scratch. I am really nervous about using dist-upgrade. Anyone have anything that can sooth my fears?
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• 75[00:53:47] <ryouma> in stretch, the /root directory's ctime and mtime keep getting changed when i am not using the computer. what could cause this, and are there straightforward steps i can take to find out what is doing it?
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• 81[00:54:40] <Chex> Lady_Aleena: take a image backup of your boot drive before you start the upgrade, if it screws up, just restore it back
• 82[00:54:49] <Chex> easy peasy
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• 84[00:55:51] <Lady_Aleena> I don't know how to make an image.
• 85[00:55:53] <ryouma> you can rsync root and boot partitions and then restore them to the same place. but make sure uuid same etc.
• 86[00:56:00] *** Quits: dreamon (~dreamon@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 87[00:56:02] <ryouma> i.e. don't re-do the filesystems
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• 89[00:56:06] <Lady_Aleena> Do you mean just copy the whole thing and save it somewhere.
• 90[00:56:10] <ryouma> yes
• 91[00:56:23] <ryouma> but do not try to run from the new place
• 92[00:56:40] <ryouma> just rsync back (with --delete and stuff)
• 93[00:56:50] <Lady_Aleena> Well, if something goes splat, then I won't have access to anything on this computer.
• 94[00:57:25] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: this assumes youh ave something you can boot from and use comfortable to copy it back
• 95[00:57:42] <ryouma> s/le/ly/
• 96[00:58:24] <ryouma> live cd works for many, but are totally inaccessible for some; a spindle anywhere will do
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• 100[00:59:23] <ryouma> there is also doing it right, wihch is much more complex than people say it is: you copy your running config to a spindle and make that bootable. this is possible, but you have to edit fstab crypttab, get uuid's right, deal with mtab, understand chroot, etc.
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• 102[01:00:08] <Lady_Aleena> ryouma, then I am out of luck, I don't know how to deal with any of that.
• 103[01:00:35] <ryouma> do you hafve a spindle you can isntall to and be comfortable with? install to that, then dist-upgrade.
• 104[01:00:46] <Lady_Aleena> What's a spindle?
• 105[01:00:49] <ryouma> any disk
• 106[01:00:52] <ryouma> any drive
• 107[01:01:09] <Lady_Aleena> I've got some writable dvds around here somewhere.
• 108[01:01:11] <ryouma> (it used to mean the axis of a winchester hard drive)
• 109[01:01:23] <ryouma> ok, maybe not that
• 110[01:01:32] <ryouma> anything you can install to
• 111[01:01:43] <Lady_Aleena> All my flash drives are full and two are non-functional.
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• 116[01:03:21] <ryouma> why would stretch change mtime and ctime of /root when nobody using computer, every night?: the only thing i can think of is that for some reason it is saving to ~ and then deleting or something
• 117[01:03:46] <Lady_Aleena> Is is okay to do all this while in a DE, or should I try to figure out how to shut down the DE and do it all from plain command prompt?
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• 119[01:04:30] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: the instructions tell you to do it from vt. but you can keep teh de running. but it is probable that you can do it from a terminal in your de. but possible that it will tell you to reboot x or something.
• 120[01:05:05] <ryouma> the instructions say apt-get, which is perforce cli
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• 122[01:05:45] <Lady_Aleena> Would you all mind if I think this process that I think I have to do out loud and offer advice if I am wrong?
• 123[01:05:47] <jmcnaught> Lady_Aleena: also definitely recommended to do the upgrade inside a GNU screen session that you can reattach to in case something happens like your terminal emulator gets closed
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• 125[01:06:13] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: you could think offline, post it as a pastebin all figured out, and get lots of comments, probably
• 126[01:07:02] <ryouma> jmcnaught: great idea. got any turnkey instructions there? i thinkt here is also... um, some kind of alternative to screen that just does that. like tmux or something?
• 127[01:07:14] <Lady_Aleena> Here is what I know so far: 1) Change my sources.list to the stretch. 2) Run apt-get update. 3) Run apt-get dist-upgrade. 4) Done.
• 128[01:07:29] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: read instructions! definitely!
• 129[01:07:39] <ryouma> but yeah
• 130[01:08:26] <Lady_Aleena> ryouma, I have been, and they are really confusing for me. I've had replaced-url
• 131[01:08:27] <ryouma> also if you are me then do dpkg-reconfigure debconf and set to critical or high so you don't get bombarded with quesitons all the time. but htat depends if you are a control freak
• 132[01:08:41] <Lady_Aleena> I'm a control freak.
• 133[01:08:46] <ryouma> hehe
• 134[01:08:58] <ryouma> then it will take forever :)
• 135[01:09:02] <jmcnaught> ryouma: you can just start screen with "screen" and if you get detached from it somehow, run "screen -DR"
• 136[01:09:16] <Ede|Popede> Lady_Aleena: if you have some spare DVDs you could backup the pendrive to them (take two maybe just to be safe) and put a live iso to the stick then.
• 137[01:10:47] <Lady_Aleena> I just wish there were a way to upgrade that didn't take so much guesswork.
• 138[01:10:51] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: so with what jmcnaught said you can probably risk an xterm in your de instead of using the vt and having to switch 100 times to answer debconf
• 139[01:11:02] <ryouma> (no guarantees)
• 140[01:11:37] <ryouma> the guesswork could be eliminated with a vm. but i find those pretty inscrutable.
• 141[01:11:41] <ryouma> and inaccessible.
• 142[01:13:14] <Lady_Aleena> I'm also sorry for being so whiny, it is just that wheezy=->jessie (even with the fresh hard drive install) nearly destroyed me.
• 143[01:13:50] <Lady_Aleena> I remember crying a LOT.
• 144[01:13:51] <ryouma> you don't need to shuyt down de
• 145[01:14:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1472
• 146[01:14:18] <ryouma> you can do tail -f on the script(1) output, but beware that that buffers
• 147[01:14:26] <ryouma> (i.e. you can keep using your de)
• 148[01:14:30] <ksk> Lady_Aleena: judging from your talk in here all the day, this most likely comes because you add shitty repositories of everything to your system. never really had any problems upgrading myself..
• 149[01:14:45] <ryouma> she said fresh install
• 150[01:14:51] <ksk> be sure to check the release nodes though.
• 151[01:14:53] <Lady_Aleena> ksk, what repositories are you talking about?
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• 154[01:15:23] <ryouma> installation is more annoying than upgrading
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• 158[01:17:34] <Lady_Aleena> ryouma, I am planning a plain upgrade this time, not a fresh install.
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• 161[01:19:47] <Lady_Aleena> Now I'm worried about what repositories that I use that are so bad.
• 162[01:20:48] <ksk> Lady_Aleena: basicly everything that is not official debian repos. (you mentioned for example having notepad++ - I dont remember that being part of debian)
• 163[01:21:08] <Lady_Aleena> ksk, I have removed notepadqq.
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• 165[01:21:48] <Lady_Aleena> All I have left that isn't part of Debian are my printer stuff, discord, and org.jessies.terminator (my te).
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• 167[01:24:29] <Lady_Aleena> If discord and org.jessies.terminator are removed during upgrading, that's okay, since I have the debs for them saved. I would just need to find the printer drivers again.
• 168[01:25:20] <Lady_Aleena> If I have to do that though, since the upgrade may come with the drivers that work with my printer.
• 169[01:26:06] <Lady_Aleena> So, I am NOT too worried about that.
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• 185[01:37:28] <ryouma> te?
• 186[01:37:32] <tehnull> rip me
• 187[01:37:42] <tehnull> for using the nvidia drivers from their site
• 188[01:37:56] <Lady_Aleena> ryouma, terminal emulator
• 189[01:37:58] <tehnull> probably going to have to just reinstall
• 190[01:38:34] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: buckle down on the instructions. if something is unclear, ask. much of it will not apply to you as it is designed fore verybody.
• 191[01:39:22] <Lady_Aleena> ryouma, it is hard to get through them since I don't know what I need and what I don't.
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• 193[01:40:56] <Lady_Aleena> Like under section 4.4, it says to "# mount -o remount,rw /mountpoint". I don't know if I need to do that.
• 194[01:41:30] <ryouma> um, idr that but that is proably just for special purposes that do not apply
• 195[01:43:57] <Lady_Aleena> See? That is why the instructions are hard to get through. I don't know what applies to me, and what doesn't. There isn't a "simple upgrade" page that has just the bare bones upgrade instructions that apply to a single user system that isn't on a network.
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• 198[01:50:57] <jmcnaught> tehnull: there is an nvidia-installer-cleanup package that might help if you're trying to switch to the packaged nvidia drivers
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• 200[01:51:50] <tehnull> nice
• 201[01:52:14] <tehnull> do you think upgrading to buster will break apache or nginx?
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• 203[01:53:39] <jmcnaught> it's not supposed to, if there are extra steps to take for apache or nginx during the upgrade they should be in the buster release notes
• 204[01:53:54] <jmcnaught> keep in mind that buster won't get security support until it becomes stable
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• 208[01:59:09] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: debian is partly made for sysadmins of like a biillion machines, partly for home users who are new. you will get crazy stuff that does not apply and youa re like wtf is this.
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• 212[02:01:09] <ryouma> 16:07 <Lady_Aleena> Here is what I know so far: 1) Change my sources.list to the stretch. 2) Run apt-get update. 3) Run apt-get dist-upgrade. 4) Done.
• 213[02:01:15] <Lady_Aleena> Yes, I am usually saying wth (not wtf).
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• 215[02:01:40] <ryouma> you may choose your swear words as you like. i am pretty sure they do not affect debian. (not completely sure.)
• 216[02:01:51] * Lady_Aleena laughs.
• 217[02:02:19] <Lady_Aleena> So, I just need the bare bones I outlined in that message, right?
• 218[02:02:30] <ryouma> maybe.
• 219[02:03:00] <rant> apparently someone felt they affect linux.. cause now there are almost no swearwords in the linux source code.. now idk how I'm suppose to tell which sections need attention
• 220[02:03:02] <ryouma> but the instructions have instructions. like ... apt-get autoremove or whatever
• 221[02:03:04] <jmcnaught> The instructions recommend doing "apt-get upgrade" and then "apt-get dist-upgrade" but it's not strictly necessary
• 222[02:04:05] <rant> there are no such things as "bad words" just whiny little sissies who should be crying and wetting themselves in their damn safe zones and leave everyone else alone
• 223[02:04:44] <ryouma> Lady_Aleena: also, you ned to remove some repos iirc
• 224[02:05:06] *** Quits: mvaenskae (~mvaenskae@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
• 225[02:05:21] <Lady_Aleena> Do I HAVE to remove these? replaced-url
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• 227[02:06:35] <rant> Lady_Aleena: try aptitude why on them and see their dependencies
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• 231[02:07:55] <rant> Lady_Aleena: chances are nothing depends on them and they're not in debian, so it makes no difference, worst case scenario is they dont work anymore
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• 233[02:09:15] <Lady_Aleena> replaced-url
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• 236[02:09:51] <Lady_Aleena> Only cndrvcups-common has something with "why".
• 237[02:10:10] <rant> Lady_Aleena: and its not in debian, so it doesn't matter..
• 238[02:10:32] <Lady_Aleena> So, they can stay or go?
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• 240[02:10:56] <rant> it won't affect upgrade, but I can't say they'll still work
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• 242[02:11:10] <Lady_Aleena> I don't remember where I got the cndrvcups stuff.
• 243[02:11:13] <rant> you'd have to check that their dependencies could still be satisfied
• 244[02:11:22] <rant> to know if they'd still work
• 245[02:11:51] <rant> if not they will likely be removed anyhow
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• 249[02:12:16] <Lady_Aleena> So, if I don't remove them, they MIGHT be removed during the dist-upgrade.
• 250[02:13:17] <rant> if a package has unmet dependencies it could break and be removed, sure
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• 255[02:21:04] <Lady_Aleena> I ran apt-cache depends on them, here is what was returned: replaced-url
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• 265[02:28:05] <qih> o/ What is the most reliable and practical Pinyin install method to use Simplified Chinese on Debian Stretch?
• 266[02:29:01] <cbilt> i always used scim
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• 272[02:37:21] <qih> cbilt: K, I think I have before, when I was using Ubuntu
• 273[02:37:34] * qih checks out 'scim'
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• 276[02:40:38] <ryouma> if you use emacs, the most available/protable im is emacs's
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• 278[02:43:07] <ryouma> i do 嗯ot spe阿k 吃呢色 so this is 阿 嗯on森色 额x阿呒p了 (is what came out when i said i do not speak chinese so this is a nonsense example)
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• 282[02:45:37] <ryouma> lol don't try what i did or a bot will warn you
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• 288[02:51:21] <cbilt> but that only works within emacs presumably
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• 291[02:51:35] <ryouma> yeah
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• 293[02:51:54] <cbilt> scim will give you pinyin input/ completion for any program
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• 298[02:52:26] <ryouma> maybe the emacs window manager im will work anyplace, dunno
• 299[02:52:46] <ryouma> but yeah scim is well known
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• 317[03:08:48] <magic_ninja> anyone know how I can pick a specific mouse button and make it do something? I want it to launch the task picker in KDE, particularly
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• 324[03:14:00] <ryouma> is there anything like xkill that will kill the process with signal 9? my deluge keeps blanking out and i do not want to use the kyboard.
• 325[03:14:07] <ryouma> (accessibility reasons)
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• 329[03:18:05] <magic_ninja> kill
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• 333[03:20:37] <annadane> kill -9 deluge?
• 334[03:22:09] *** Quits: waflessnet (~waflessne@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
• 335[03:22:09] <annadane> ah no sorry i guess it'd be the pid for deluge, whatever that is
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• 337[03:22:20] <ksk> killall helps with that.
• 338[03:22:27] <ksk> !kill9
• 339[03:22:27] <dpkg> No, no, no! Don't use kill -9. It doesn't give the process a chance to clean up after itself. See: replaced-url
• 340[03:22:29] <ksk> btw
• 341[03:22:36] <annadane> oh. TIL.
• 342[03:24:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1458
• 343[03:24:07] *** Joins: ArchDebian (~us@replaced-ip)
• 344[03:24:17] <ArchDebian> 10 Open Source Stickers for only $1 replaced-url
• 345[03:24:42] <annadane> ...ryouma also just said "i don't want to use the keyboard"
• 346[03:24:46] <annadane> so my answer is doubly useless
• 347[03:24:53] <annadane> sorry for being an idiot
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• 353[03:32:13] <cbilt> ArchDebian: how is that not advertisement
• 354[03:33:52] *** Quits: msimpson_ (~msimpson@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 355[03:33:52] <ArchDebian> cbilt: is just to inform, just information
• 356[03:34:08] * Lady_Aleena calls shenanigans.
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• 365[03:41:13] <arosusi> Hello. I've coded a online image gallery under and using Debian. Maybe someone has interest in it: replaced-url
• 366[03:41:30] *** Quits: p2hc (~p2hc@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 367[03:42:46] <cybercrypto> arosusi: what is an "online gallery"?
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• 369[03:43:12] <kanliot> ryouma, lxde had a task manager to do kill -9. should be something. qps does the same thing under lxqt
• 370[03:43:22] <cybercrypto> arosusi: and what is that have to do with debian support channel?
• 371[03:43:25] <arosusi> cybercrypto: You can view your uploaded images like in a gallery using your web browser.
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• 374[03:44:03] <cybercrypto> arosusi: you facing problems or issues related to debian while serving the gallery?
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• 376[03:44:46] <kanliot> arosusi, i can't zoom in on your slideshow, and what language did you use?
• 377[03:44:59] <arosusi> cybercrypto: I've used a Debian system as workstation and server to finish this.
• 378[03:46:34] <arosusi> kanliot: Click in the middle bottom of the image to see it full size. It's written in Perl.
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• 380[03:47:18] <cybercrypto> arosusi: great, you can try debian off-topic to discuss about it. Feel free to use this channel later in case you have any topic related to support. I normally do not see non-support related conversation in this channel. Good luck with your new gallery system!
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• 396[04:10:12] <ryouma> kill -15 = kill, right? thanks for the sequence. but i want something like xkill that will do all that, culminating in kill -9. i want to call it from my fluxbox menu, and point it at deluge's blank screen, and have everything named deluge killed. i am not always able to use keyboard. it is a hardship to have to go to cli in those cases.
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• 398[04:10:47] <ryouma> ArchDebian: you and all of us know it is an ad
• 399[04:11:18] <ryouma> it's like pointing to an apple and calling it an orange. you are fooling nobody.
• 400[04:11:50] <ryouma> kanliot: i will look those up to see if they are separate packages that i can use under fluxbox
• 401[04:12:54] <ArchDebian> ryouma: man, is just an information, there is a Debian sticker over there... other people could be interested.
• 402[04:15:17] *** Parts: teslations|2 (~kvirc@replaced-ip) ("Once you know what it is you want to be true, instinct is a very useful device for enabling you to know that it is")
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• 404[04:15:28] <ryouma> i tried qps. it is small (thus requiring scrolling) and has white bg that i cannot use at night (and you can't point to the window of the process to kill), but i'd do something like that if it could be modded to do that. but was hoping there was an xkill-alike.
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• 409[04:18:04] <ryouma> if there were something that could get the command name of a pointed window maybe i could script it?
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• 413[04:21:43] <ksk> ryouma: then just put "killall -SIGNAL $YOURAPP" into the fluxbox menu - or put a shellscript into the menu, that does that (++ for fluxbox!)
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• 434[04:44:12] <ryouma> ksk: good idea, but i want it to work for a poitned window. i guess if nobody knows of an xkill that kills with progressive signals then it doesnot exist.
• 435[04:44:23] <ksk> ah okay.
• 436[04:44:39] <ryouma> but maybe some idk window scripting thingie could find the window .... then do it. devilspie or whatever.
• 437[04:44:52] <ryouma> but it would take me forever to figure out even whether that owuld work or not
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• 442[04:45:25] <ksk> Im totally not into X, sorry :D
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• 444[04:45:47] <ksk> also, as far as I know, you do not want to get deep into it, its a 1980 style of doing things-mess
• 445[04:46:59] <ryouma> i guess i will do a fluxbox menu item for each app :)
• 446[04:47:12] <kanliot> ryouma just make a desktop file (.desktop) tat links to "pkill -9 deluge"
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• 449[04:48:14] <ryouma> huh, i found an old script hta did xwit, dunno if that could do it
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• 451[04:48:25] <ryouma> oh everything is always maximized. so no icons for me.
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• 455[04:49:19] <ryouma> no i guess xwit just does basic things
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• 463[04:54:37] <rant> ryouma: why are you dancing around this and not just using xkill?
• 464[04:54:50] <rant> it does EXACTLY what you've been describing
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• 466[04:55:50] <ryouma> rant: xkill fails. it kills the window but then when i run deluge it does not run
• 467[04:56:04] <ryouma> so i have to do pkill -9 deluge then run deluge
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• 469[04:56:37] <ryouma> i wouldn't ask for a replacement for xkill if it worked :)
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• 471[04:59:23] <jmcnaught> is using a different bittorrent client an option?
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• 474[05:02:15] <ryouma> jmcnaught: i think just killing it until buster comes around is more possible
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• 478[05:03:48] <ryouma> (it has to be x; transmission never made sense to me; azureus is big; idk transferring my many torrents and my file states like do not download which indicate whether i have watched; etc.)
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• 481[05:10:36] <rant> ryouma: replaced-url
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• 483[05:11:09] <rant> your new and improved xpkill
• 484[05:11:47] <rant> save that to /usr/bin/xpkill and chmod +x /usr/bin/xpkill and viola
• 485[05:12:01] <rant> erm /usr/local/bin rather
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• 489[05:13:52] <rant> I only tested the pid lookup with xdotool cause it was cleaner.. but I included the xwininfo anyhow
• 490[05:14:32] <rant> xwininfo should already be installed, xdotool however is probably not
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• 492[05:15:47] <rant> ryouma: and transmission IS available for Xwindows its in transmission-gtk it has a curses, web, and gtk interface available
• 493[05:16:05] <rant> its by far the best torrent client available for Debian IMHO
• 494[05:16:34] <rant> both the client and the remote are available in GTK flavor
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• 497[05:20:36] <rant> but that script with a .desktop entry for it, would make it appear in your menu and would give you the same interface as xkill, to pkill
• 498[05:21:01] <rant> the cursor would be slightly different depending on whether or not xdotool is installed
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• 502[05:26:56] * rant considers installing wireguard
• 503[05:27:40] <rant> ,checkbackport wireguard --from-release sid --to-release buster
• 504[05:27:42] <judd> (checkbackport <packagename> [--fromrelease <sid>] [--torelease <stable>] [--arch <amd64>] [--verbose]) -- Check that the build-dependencies listed by a package in the release specified as "fromrelease" are satisfiable for in "torelease" for the given host architecture. By default, a backport from unstable to the current stable release and amd64 are used.
• 505[05:27:51] <rant> ,checkbackport wireguard --fromrelease sid --torelease buster
• 506[05:27:52] <judd> Backporting package wireguard in sid→buster/amd64: unsatisfiable build dependencies: Build-Depends: debhelper-compat (= 12).
• 507[05:28:06] <rant> ,v debhelper
• 508[05:28:07] <judd> Package: debhelper on amd64 -- jessie: 9.20150101+deb8u2; jessie-security: 9.20150101+deb8u2; stretch: 10.2.5; stretch-backports: 12.1.1~bpo9+1; buster: 12.1.1; sid: 12.1.1
• 509[05:28:24] <rant> judd, you smokin eggnog?
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• 511[05:29:36] <rant> ,builddep wireguard sid
• 512[05:29:37] <judd> Package wireguard in sid -- Build-Depends: debhelper-compat (= 12), dkms, libmnl-dev, pkg-config, systemd.
• 513[05:31:19] <rant> guess manually fetching the package would be the same as a backport.. pinning would just allow for updates
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• 515[05:34:30] <ryouma> rant: thanks i will try the script. i meant that transmission ui model, while being x, did not make sense to me. deluge and azureus ui models make sense to me.
• 516[05:35:17] <rant> they're fugly, java, and ridiculously over complicated?
• 517[05:35:25] <rant> that sort of thing makes sense to you?
• 518[05:35:42] <rant> cause I could add some extra shit to that script to make it make more sense if that's the case :P
• 519[05:36:32] <rant> I once put a line "_ == __" in a python program.. it was totally useless, the script would've ran without it, I just did it because it let me and I found that amusing
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• 526[05:47:10] <ryouma> deluge is python
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• 536[05:55:44] <rant> ,depends transmission-gtk
• 537[05:55:45] <judd> Package transmission-gtk in stretch/amd64 -- depends: transmission-common (= 2.92-2+deb9u1), libc6 (>= 2.14), libcurl3-gnutls (>= 7.18.0), libevent-2.0-5 (>= 2.0.10-stable), libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0 (>= 2.25.2), libglib2.0-0 (>= 2.37.3), libgtk-3-0 (>= 3.3.16), libminiupnpc10 (>= 1.9.20140610), libnatpmp1 (>= 20101211), libpango-1.0-0 (>= 1.14.0), libssl1.1 (>= 1.1.0), zlib1g (>= 1:1.1.4).
• 538[05:56:11] <rant> looks like transmission is written in C
• 539[05:56:39] <rant> I'm usually against unnecessary use of C but this isn't an unnecessary use..
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• 559[06:15:12] <annadane> what are CLI tools to indicate exactly the space individual files take up on a device? aka if my hard drive is x% full, is there something that shows in detail what takes up which portion of that space
• 560[06:16:14] *** Quits: diegomb (~diegomb@replaced-ip) (Quit: diegomb)
• 561[06:17:23] <rant> annadane: is an ncurses frontend acceptable?
• 562[06:17:29] <annadane> sure
• 563[06:17:56] <rant> ,i ncdu
• 564[06:17:57] <judd> Package ncdu (admin, optional) in stretch/amd64: ncurses disk usage viewer. Version: 1.12-1+b1; Size: 40.3k; Installed: 92k; Homepage: replaced-url
• 565[06:18:07] <annadane> thanks
• 566[06:18:09] <ryouma> annadane: du not good enough? it can show files.
• 567[06:18:15] <rant> ,i boabab
• 568[06:18:16] <judd> No package named 'boabab' was found in stretch/amd64.
• 569[06:18:35] <rant> yeah thats a gtk tool that does the same but the name is so goddamn stupid I can't ever remember it
• 570[06:18:52] <rant> ,i baobab
• 571[06:18:53] <annadane> i could just use du, yeah
• 572[06:18:53] <judd> Package baobab (gnome, optional) in stretch/amd64: GNOME disk usage analyzer. Version: 3.22.1-1; Size: 371.5k; Installed: 1719k; Homepage: replaced-url
• 573[06:19:04] <rant> ncdu is cooler :P
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• 576[06:19:59] <rant> automatically does sorting and can navigate within the interface cleanly to narrow it down
• 577[06:20:02] <ryouma> it is a type of tree in madagascar. they are the only trees remaining in that area, which is denuded by people. it is not denuded becuase of religious rule or something. that is why they look so sparse.
• 578[06:20:28] <rant> ryouma: did you just fgi?
• 579[06:20:35] <ryouma> fgi?
• 580[06:20:41] <rant> dpkg, fgi
• 581[06:20:41] <dpkg> well, fgi is replaced-url
• 582[06:20:49] <ryouma> no, long ago
• 583[06:21:02] <rant> due to the package name?
• 584[06:21:12] <ryouma> so it could be a name that is useful to warn people
• 585[06:21:21] <ryouma> no
• 586[06:21:34] <ryouma> because i wanted to know why those trees were so sparse
• 587[06:22:06] <rant> which implies you'd have had to already have heard of the tree
• 588[06:22:31] <ryouma> or seen it
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• 598[06:27:28] <annadane> "what could be taking up all that space, do i have any vm images lying a- oh. torrents. ...right."
• 599[06:27:49] <annadane> thank you ncdu for revealing me yet again to be a brainless zombie idiot
• 600[06:28:12] <ryouma> annadane: there is a sparsify command that will craete sparse files out of files taht are not sparse
• 601[06:28:26] <ryouma> vm images, torrents
• 602[06:30:15] <ryouma> xdu is also useful
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• 604[06:31:38] <annadane> worse is that i'm pretty sure i've done that before
• 605[06:32:01] <annadane> "it MUST be images i didn't delete properly!"
• 606[06:32:10] <annadane> no, you idiot
• 607[06:32:33] <ryouma> oh, i have a q. i did rm on a file,and it took forever so i killed it. but it seemed to work. could this create a bad fs state?
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• 611[06:39:11] <rant> so... I've had some errors in the journal of my server lately.. not really sure whats happening.. this is the current output of journalctl -xe replaced-url
• 612[06:39:17] <rant> filesystem that is mounted just fine..
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• 638[07:18:30] <vandermar> Hey has anyone asked for a child pornography links? I have only this image for now replaced-url
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• 652[07:40:05] <DerpGusta> wtf vandermar
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• 655[07:41:14] <Amun_Ra> it's just some kind of vengence spam (the good guy's name on #nginx is vandemar)
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• 657[07:41:34] <vandemar> Yo i got some nice pics on my old truecrypted HDD replaced-url
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• 660[07:41:45] <rant> ah.. I wasn't getting the reference or purpose
• 661[07:42:16] <soul-d> ah like couple months back also some weird spam
• 662[07:42:36] <soul-d> probably discord or other type of services trying to show how evil irc is
• 663[07:42:46] <DerpGusta> oh.
• 664[07:42:59] <DerpGusta> I'm kinda new to IRC so..
• 665[07:43:07] <Amun_Ra> and the real one is offline so here's that
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• 668[07:47:03] <rant> yeah well some folks can't get along with others and then they go do /real mature/ stuff like that
• 669[07:49:00] <rant> if such things didnt happen at least a dozen times a year, it wouldnt be IRC
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• 673[07:56:01] <vandemar_> Sup nerds, I've got some fine cp there i.imgur.com/pfnPKlW.jpg check it out, you can always find me on #nginx or /msg vandemar
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• 675[07:57:02] <rant> I'd like to make a simple way to re-enable my touchpad on the rare occasions I'd like to use it but cant even think of a good key combo or something much mess a command to hook it to
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• 678[07:59:21] <rant> really I'd like to disable it as a pointing device and use it for gestures only and perhaps make a gesture to use it as a touchpad on rare occasions
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• 724[08:34:19] <Synaptic> morning
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• 859[10:47:36] <elm_> I tried to make mmcblk0 (sdcard) mountable by user by adding an udev rule to assign group floppy to it
• 860[10:47:48] <elm_> however fuse still can not mount it:
• 861[10:48:02] <elm_> fusermount: unknown option 'user=elm'
• 862[10:48:32] <elm_> before I had to specify user_allow_other in /etc/fuse.conf
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• 873[10:54:15] <elm_> I see a gid option in man fuse but it does not allow that option in /etc/fuse.conf
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• 877[10:58:34] <jvv_> hello, I am trying to build a package however it fails with error 'recipe for target "override_ah_auto_configure" failed'... how can I make it more verbose to know why it failed? (I have DH_VERBOSE=1)
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• 879[10:59:58] <elm_> make --debug?
• 880[11:00:16] <icarious> Hi. Does "linux-source" contain the Debian's Kernel sources as it is and patched?
• 881[11:01:18] <elm_> I believe you would have to query for dpkg -l | grep linux-image
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• 885[11:02:24] <icarious> elm_: I mean my question is how does one downloads the Kernel Source as shipped by the release? apt-get or apt-src?
• 886[11:03:06] <elm_> it could be kernel-source, yes
• 887[11:03:19] <elm_> kernel-source will install into something like /usr/src
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• 889[11:03:29] <elm_> while apt-src would install in the local directory
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• 891[11:04:15] <icarious> Ah but both are basically the same. The other confusion I have, will it be automatically patched with Debian's modifications post installation or it needs manual patching?
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• 894[11:06:18] <elm_> I would believe it to be already patched
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• 896[11:06:46] <elm_> though you could download both and see with patch --forward whether patches have alrady been applied
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• 899[11:07:10] <elm_> Yes, I believe it to be the sense of kernel-source that you do not have to apply patches manually
• 900[11:07:27] <icarious> Yes that is what I wanted to know
• 901[11:07:27] <elm_> as with apt-src you will download the sources + patch files unapplied
• 902[11:07:28] <icarious> Thanks
• 903[11:07:39] <icarious> Oh
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• 905[11:08:02] <icarious> So apt-get will download it in /usr/src "patched" and apt-src will download in local directory "unpatched"
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• 907[11:08:09] <elm_> apt-src should download a .tar.gz for the kernel sources yet uninflated
• 908[11:08:20] <icarious> Got it
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• 916[11:12:34] <jvv_> elm_: cmake variant would be?
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• 920[11:17:44] <elm_> jw_: qwant returned me the following search result: replaced-url
• 921[11:17:55] <elm_> jvv_: see above
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• 985[12:08:05] <nifker> how do I check if ASLR is enabled?
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• 1111[13:58:06] <SpeedyG> nifker: cat /proc/sys/kernel/randomize_va_space
• 1112[13:58:18] <SpeedyG> at least, thats the first hit if I google that question :P
• 1113[13:58:36] <nifker> it returns 2
• 1114[13:58:42] <nifker> for what does that stand
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• 1116[14:00:03] <SpeedyG> Normally you might expect a value of 0 (disabled), or 1 (enabled). In the case of the randomize_va_space setting, this is true as well. When setting the value to 1, address space is randomized. This includes the positions of the stack itself, virtual dynamic shared object (VDSO) page, and shared memory regions. Setting the option to value 2 will be similar to 1, and add data segments as well. For most
• 1117[14:00:09] <SpeedyG> systems, this setting is the default and the most secure setting.
• 1118[14:00:25] <SpeedyG> not my wisdom though... that comes from replaced-url
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• 1121[14:02:14] <nyuszika7h> selinux is denying write for postfix to /etc/aliases.db on stretch, any idea? replaced-url
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• 1130[14:08:21] <SpeedyG> nyuszika7h: did you check if the context of the file is set correctly ?
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• 1132[14:08:49] <nyuszika7h> per my paste I tried restorecon but it did nothing
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• 1134[14:08:59] <nyuszika7h> unconfined is probably not correct but not sure what it should be
• 1135[14:09:37] <SpeedyG> not entirely sure how to configure it for postfix, but guess it has something to do with that postfix is not allowed by policy... add it by using semanage-fcontext (theres examples in its manpages for how to do such stuff)
• 1136[14:09:54] <SpeedyG> check config files of postfix using ls -Z
• 1137[14:10:00] <SpeedyG> and see what its context is
• 1138[14:10:09] <SpeedyG> then configure it using semanage-fcontext
• 1139[14:10:36] <nyuszika7h> replaced-url
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• 1141[14:11:16] <nyuszika7h> semanage fails with MemoryError...
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• 1144[14:12:03] <nyuszika7h> also blocked by selinux
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• 1146[14:13:17] <nyuszika7h> replaced-url
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• 1151[14:16:39] <SpeedyG> hm... dunno about that... been a long time since I played around with selinux
• 1152[14:16:58] <SpeedyG> guess i'd set it to permissive mode and start figuring out how I can fix stuff...
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• 1168[14:32:16] <satori> Trying to build some source that requires libtool, "apt-get install libtool" reports "libtool is already the newest version", but when I run make for this source I get "make: libtool: Command not found" any suggestions?
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• 1172[14:36:28] <OerHeks> i was looking for libtool-dev, but it seems to be libltdl-dev replaced-url
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• 1176[14:40:54] <satori> ah! Needs libtool-bin package.
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• 1279[16:01:55] <bora> hello everyone do you know why debian default desktop enviroment using Gnome3
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• 1281[16:02:15] <bora> I can not any idea about that
• 1282[16:02:50] <mtn> bora: many distros use gnome as the default
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• 1284[16:03:24] <bora> this is just reason it could be ?
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• 1287[16:03:45] <cybercrypto> bora: Hi. I would recommend you taking a look into the wiki project. There may have some discussions about that long ago. Gnome is default to several distros. I personally do not use it (I am running KDE since 2001)
• 1288[16:04:03] <mtn> bora: obviously someone likes it ;)
• 1289[16:04:16] <OerHeks> there is choice, KDE, Gnome3, Cinnamon, XFCE ..
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• 1292[16:04:21] <cybercrypto> bora: most distros uses Gnome, due to Debian is using it... mostly.
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• 1294[16:05:12] <cybercrypto> bora: you can have any graphicall environment in Debian. Just try them and sticky with the one that suits you.
• 1295[16:05:20] <ghasem> cybercrypto: Gnome it's easy to use, and simple.
• 1296[16:05:40] <cybercrypto> ghasem: I dont disagree with that.
• 1297[16:06:03] <bora> well ; which desktop are you using and can anyone give the some advice
• 1298[16:06:18] <ghasem> i try Gnome, KDE Plasma, Xfce, awesome, openbsd-cwm, i3-wm, i3-gaps and ... . but i only easy with i3-wm.
• 1299[16:07:04] <bora> i3-wm
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• 1301[16:07:09] <abrotman> bora: There isn't truly a default anymore, it sort of depends on which installation image you use.
• 1302[16:07:11] <cybercrypto> bora: I am using lumina at this moment... it is very ligh and getting quite stable, I migth say.
• 1303[16:07:57] <bora> lumina he thats interesting
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• 1305[16:08:13] <bora> cybercrypto
• 1306[16:09:39] <cybercrypto> currently running freebsd. I was using blackbox on it... and I am trying lumina for quite a while.
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• 1308[16:10:18] <bora> well what you think about xfce or mate
• 1309[16:11:49] <NetTerminalGene> i use gnome. i got used to it
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• 1311[16:12:12] <NetTerminalGene> with dash to dock, it is good
• 1312[16:12:50] <bora> and also stable ? isn't it NetTerminalGene
• 1313[16:13:02] <NetTerminalGene> yes very stable
• 1314[16:13:32] <cybercrypto> bora: what is it you are looking for? most people like gnome due to smart way of simplifying setup things. Another note is that gnome is getting good investiments with regards X server replacement's Wayland.
• 1315[16:14:16] <ghasem> bora: what is exactly you are looking for ? stable ? depends on you to how to use it
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• 1317[16:14:52] <bora> ghasem:yes I am looking for stable and rock solid de
• 1318[16:16:38] <ghasem> there is no such thing, if you can't use it correctly it's will broken.go and learn how to use your tools.
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• 1321[16:18:00] <cybercrypto> bora: i got a server running KDE on slackware since 2013 with no issues at all (of course it is a very old KDE version... not even close to the plasma features we have today). You will have to choose between stable/new features. In my opinion, Debian delivery both of those options in a very nice format, rock solid.
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• 1324[16:19:06] <bora> I am thinking Debian is using Gnome3 Default Desktop and if there are using it is rock solid .
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• 1326[16:20:14] <jean0x7be> Like most stuff in debvian stable? :D
• 1327[16:20:23] <jean0x7be> debian* geez.
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• 1329[16:20:49] <cybercrypto> bora: is this for your own workstation? if so, Debian options are very stable (independently if you choose Plasma, Gnome or even Xfce...) i believe.
• 1330[16:22:32] <annadane> KDE kind of suffers in debian stable, it's a fast moving target
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• 1332[16:22:56] <annadane> but some people like 5.8 in spite of the bugs, who knows
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• 1335[16:23:51] <jean0x7be> You always have backports to try
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• 1337[16:23:56] <bora> cybercrypto: Yes This is my workstation if I choose one of the desktop enviroment , I can choose one which I want . Because Debian is rock solid system actualy
• 1338[16:24:07] <bora> I understood
• 1339[16:24:23] <annadane> not for KDE
• 1340[16:24:41] <jean0x7be> oh :/
• 1341[16:24:46] <annadane> the only desktop environment i've personally seen backported - there may be others - is MATE
• 1342[16:25:39] <annadane> 5.8 for debian stretch and what, 5.16 or so for debian buster? 8 fairly major revisions
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• 1344[16:25:47] <annadane> ,v plasma-desktop
• 1345[16:25:48] <judd> Package: plasma-desktop on amd64 -- jessie: 4:4.11.13-2; stretch: 4:5.8.6-1; buster: 4:5.14.5.1-1; sid: 4:5.14.5.1-1
• 1346[16:25:55] <annadane> oh 5.14
• 1347[16:25:55] <cybercrypto> annadane: I really enjoy KDE, and it is quite fine and stable. Not much suffering with bugs :-)
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• 1350[16:26:19] <annadane> oh, sure. if it works for you then go ahead, some people may not even be aware of the bugs and be happy
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• 1355[16:29:19] <annadane> desktop environments in general probably suffer, even xfce has one or two annoying bugs and it's a more simplistic desktop
• 1356[16:29:38] <cybercrypto> annadane: yeap.
• 1357[16:29:48] <annadane> (though xfce likely doesn't have enough developers but i digress)
• 1358[16:30:15] <bora> I think and I am using Gnome3 which is the default ones
• 1359[16:31:06] <bora> maybe I can try other de
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• 1361[16:31:26] <bora> kde , xfce etc;
• 1362[16:31:40] <bora> thank you for your helping
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• 1367[16:33:29] <annadane> and then if you're really unlucky then a desktop gets released with major usability improvements right around the time of freeze or just after so you're stuck with a buggy product for ~2 years
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• 1374[16:35:56] <bora> annadane: is that true , well that time I was giving true discuss about gnome
• 1375[16:36:51] <annadane> (also ugh KDE 4. poor jessie users)
• 1376[16:37:17] <bora> :D
• 1377[16:38:58] <bora> what about xfce what you think ?
• 1378[16:39:12] <bora> can you say something
• 1379[16:39:17] <annadane> xfce is fine, it's more slow moving
• 1380[16:39:41] <annadane> but like cybercrypto says KDE works fine for them... it really depends on what you want in a desktop
• 1381[16:40:52] <bora> I saw somewhere the people say usually xfce is rock solid than the other desktop
• 1382[16:41:03] <annadane> GNOME can be confusing to new users because it doesn't have a minimize/maximize button by default, no desktop icons, it's keyboard oriented; you can change all that and customize it but...
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• 1384[16:42:39] <bora> but it has tweak tool and you can customize over there
• 1385[16:42:41] <bora> :D
• 1386[16:42:51] <annadane> frankly i think for a full desktop environment xfce is probably the least amount of work for new users, it has sane defaults and some cool applications especially if you install xfce4-goodies, it's what i tend to use
• 1387[16:45:09] <bora> but if I use Gnome or Kde its more proffesional viewing
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• 1391[16:48:00] <annadane> i feel like buster is going to fix many annoyances i have with xfce
• 1392[16:48:48] <bora> annadane: are you advice xfce =
• 1393[16:48:57] <annadane> sure
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• 1395[16:49:57] <annadane> also you probably get less junk with it if you're installing it from the installer, the installer installs tasksel packages for all the desktops which include "common applications" and in GNOME you get a lot of games people may not want
• 1396[16:50:11] <cybercrypto> annadane: Yeap. if the software has no bugs... it means that it is not yet discovered :-)
• 1397[16:50:16] <annadane> KDE... i forget how much is included in tasksel but xfce is nice for being more minimal
• 1398[16:50:27] <cybercrypto> bora: how new are you to gnu/linux?
• 1399[16:50:30] <annadane> i'm actually going to fire up a virtual machine to check because i'm curious
• 1400[16:50:54] <bora> do you advice kde , gnome and xfce and leave the personal choice this subject
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• 1402[16:51:45] <bora> cybercypto: I love gnu/linux and I am linux system admins
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• 1404[16:52:26] <bora> I am using Linux mint and now ı am going to install debian
• 1405[16:52:49] <bora> and than I will be back to here
• 1406[16:52:53] <cybercrypto> bora: i suggest you to try the few and choose the one that fits you. I still have an old machine that I code with and it is running afterstep. Yes.. i know it is old and buggy... but works like a charm... and I am used to it.
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• 1409[16:54:45] <bora> ok thanks cybercrypto
• 1410[16:54:51] <bora> I ll be back
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• 1415[16:59:32] <annadane> a sysadmin is getting caught up on what *desktop* to use? well, okay
• 1416[16:59:46] <cybercrypto> annadane: :-) sure
• 1417[17:00:25] <ksk> s/Desktop/terminal-emulator
• 1418[17:00:49] <annadane> i still haven't found one i like more than xfce4-terminal
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• 1420[17:01:06] <annadane> xfce is practically worth it for the applications alone
• 1421[17:01:29] <ksk> been using terminator, but not really its features sice Im using tmux anyway ;)
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• 1424[17:02:27] <cybercrypto> annadane: i am using qterminal now... it gives me the some of the flexibility of the screen (when I am not in X) and does not consumes much memory either...
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• 1426[17:03:07] <annadane> as for KDE users 5.14 is pretty decent but i'm pretty sure upstream is on like 5.18 by now already
• 1427[17:04:45] <annadane> or... not. lol.
• 1428[17:04:48] <cybercrypto> annadane: hehe.. yeap... for me that still runs afterstep and wmaker, that is not an issue....
• 1429[17:04:50] <annadane> 5.15
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• 1431[17:05:00] <annadane> i'm an idiot, and should really research first
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• 1433[17:05:07] <strk> it loosk like fetchmail doesn't work anymore on upgrade
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• 1437[17:05:34] <cybercrypto> brb
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• 1454[17:19:58] <annadane> strk, what debian release, and can you post the output of any error messages?
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• 1461[17:23:55] <Synaptic> I have small problem with the Video players on Debian, and i had same problem on Mint and on Manjaro. But, on Windows was working fine.
• 1462[17:23:55] <Synaptic> The problem is that the Movies, are going out of Audio sync. not immediately, but after few minutes of play, and going worst.
• 1463[17:24:12] <Synaptic> i try with VLC, Dragonplay, and mpv, same result, with many different movies. then if i close the program, and start again, maybe going
• 1464[17:24:13] <Synaptic> good on sync for 30 mins, then again start to loose.
• 1465[17:24:39] <Synaptic> i think something need to be fixed maybe on the audio drivers?
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• 1486[17:35:51] <strk> annadane: it actually works, my fault :)
• 1487[17:35:59] <strk> I thought the message about LAST being unsupported
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• 1513[17:46:32] <morf> hi, what was the debian mobile channel pls? :)
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• 1526[17:52:14] <morf> yay it's debian.org server ... nevermind
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• 1701[18:29:10] <bora> Hello I am here
• 1702[18:29:12] <maudivino> Ola! Um help rapidinho, nome de pacote p/ debian 9 openbox p/ som na tint2?
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• 1712[18:33:38] <ksk> maudivino: english in here, please.
• 1713[18:33:44] <at0m> !es
• 1714[18:33:44] <dpkg> Este canal es de soporte técnico en Inglés para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en Español, puede ingresar en #debian-es tecleando /join #debian-es en la línea de chat.
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• 1724[18:38:21] <Syna> I have small problem with the Video players on Debian, and i had same problem on Mint and on Manjaro. But, on Windows was working fine.The problem is that the Movies, are going out of Audio sync. not immediately, but after few minutes of play, and going worst.
• 1725[18:38:37] <Syna> i try with VLC, Dragonplay, and mpv, same result, with many different movies. then if i close the program, and start again, maybe going good on sync for 30 mins, then again start to loose. i think something need to be fixed maybe on the audio drivers?
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• 1741[18:42:06] <bigMouthCommie> i am running xfce. i just added a usb device for bluetooth. how do i ... use it, i guess.
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• 1745[18:43:18] <ghasem_> bigMouthCommie: you most install bluetooth driver. read Wiki for this.
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• 1747[18:44:12] <weedloser> that doesn't look like spanish
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• 1752[18:46:48] <bora> cybercrpto: I was install Xfce
• 1753[18:47:43] <bora> hope so it will go good
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• 1756[18:48:09] <Synaptic> weedloser, portuguese maybe :D
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• 1760[18:51:53] <Tenkawa> df -m
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• 1762[18:51:57] <Tenkawa> oops sorry
• 1763[18:52:49] <Tenkawa> trying to determine the best thing to do with my two drive setup in this notebook
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• 1768[18:59:11] <Tenkawa> f2fs is pretty fast even on platter drives
• 1769[18:59:55] <Tenkawa> well one platter one flash
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• 1774[19:02:18] <bigMouthCommie> blueman
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• 1811[19:37:33] <pie3> is there any program/tools whcih enables custom program to run/open once machine is booted/started up.
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• 1813[19:40:19] <jmcnaught> pie3: you don't need a custom program, you can create a systemd service unit to have a program run at start. Or a quick and dirty hack way to do it is to create a script at /etc/rc.local and make it executable
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• 1815[19:41:18] <pie3> jmcnaught: i want to resume reading & hence open the pdf/ebook durign startup
• 1816[19:42:15] <jmcnaught> pie3: okay if you mean a GUI program it could depend on your desktop environment or window manager, some have a session manager that will run all the programs that were running during the previous session
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• 1819[19:44:13] <jmcnaught> pie3: there is also /etc/xdg/autostart where there are .desktop files for launching programs when a graphical session is started, or for a per-user autostart there is ~/.config/autostart
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• 1821[19:45:44] <pie3> so do i need to add that pdf in under /etc/xdg/autostart?
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• 1823[19:46:45] <pie3> how to create .desktop file? jmcnaught
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• 1825[19:48:14] <jmcnaught> pie3: if it's only for your user then you could put a .desktop file for your pdf reader in ~/.config/autostart. Copy or link one from /usr/share/applications
• 1826[19:48:21] <jmcnaught> pie3: which PDF viewer do you use?
• 1827[19:48:42] <pie3> yes it is for user basis
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• 1829[19:49:41] <pie3> Xreader
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• 1836[19:51:53] <jmcnaught> pie3: I'm not familiar with that one. And which desktop or window manager are you using?
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• 1845[19:59:51] <phazon> !tell pie3 about mint
• 1846[20:00:21] <phazon> jmcnaught: it's from linux mint...
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• 1857[20:10:14] <nifker> is it possible to increase audio amplitude without increasing overdriving?
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• 1859[20:11:23] <pie3> jmcnaught: debian
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• 1861[20:12:09] <phazon> pie3: we dont offer support for linux mint here
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• 1863[20:13:00] <RoyK> !mint
• 1864[20:13:01] <dpkg> Linux Mint is not Debian and is not supported in #debian. Please use their forums at replaced-url
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• 1888[20:31:58] <jaggz> I'm getting lots of errors in apt update. Seems it's an apt-key error on pretty much every non-debian repo
• 1889[20:32:43] <petn-randall> !bat
• 1890[20:32:43] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
• 1891[20:32:58] <petn-randall> jaggz: Can you provide all the info above in a single paste? ^^^
• 1892[20:33:57] <jaggz> trying. was gonna update because my copy/past from terminal wasn't working
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• 1894[20:34:26] <petn-randall> !pastebinit
• 1895[20:34:26] <dpkg> A command-line tool to send data to a <pastebin>. To paste e.g. your sources.list do "aptitude install pastebinit; pastebinit /etc/apt/sources.list"; to paste the output of a program do e.g. "dmesg 2>&1 | pastebinit". See also <pastebinit config>, <nopaste>.
• 1896[20:34:36] <jaggz> piping into xclip works.
• 1897[20:34:49] <petn-randall> though pastebinit won't work if apt is broken :/
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• 1900[20:34:56] <petn-randall> work to install
• 1901[20:36:02] <pie3> how to open the pdf during next start which i closed at last in previous session?
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• 1908[20:40:08] <phazon> pie3: ask in the linux mint support channel as you've already been instructed; not here
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• 1911[20:40:37] <mohsen_1> Hi what is the default desktop environment in deviant
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• 1913[20:41:04] <pie3> this is not related to mint phazon
• 1914[20:41:16] <mohsen_1> *debian 9 dvd -1 image?
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• 1918[20:43:33] <jaggz> petn-randall, pastebinit also doesn't give you the delete url
• 1919[20:43:41] <weedloser> You'll be able to choose during installation mohsen_1
• 1920[20:43:57] <jaggz> petn-randall, replaced-url
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• 1923[20:45:22] <jaggz> ... are deleted lines
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• 1926[20:45:50] <mohsen_1> weedloser: what is your suggestion?
• 1927[20:46:00] <petn-randall> jaggz: Is the time maybe off? I also can't see which command you're running. You're also missing the other info from the factoid.
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• 1929[20:46:31] <weedloser> mohsen_1, you'll be able to choose between xfce, kde, cinnamon, mate and lxde during install. My personal favourites are mate and xfce.
• 1930[20:46:39] <weedloser> They're both simple and lightweight.
• 1931[20:46:48] <Habbie> weedloser, no gnome?
• 1932[20:46:55] <weedloser> Yes, forgot that.
• 1933[20:47:00] <Habbie> ack
• 1934[20:47:12] <jaggz> petn-randall, apt-get update dumps out what appears to be the same
• 1935[20:47:14] <mohsen_1> weedloser: ok thanks
• 1936[20:47:30] <jaggz> petn-randall, about "not been updated and the old index will be used"?
• 1937[20:47:33] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 1938[20:47:40] <jaggz> time .. seems ok
• 1939[20:47:53] * weedloser secretely wishes gnome would dissapear >:D
• 1940[20:48:39] *** Joins: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip)
• 1941[20:48:57] <phazon> pie3: lying again isn't going to gain you favour, or get support. go ask mint about their session managers
• 1942[20:50:47] <petn-randall> phazon: How do you know they're on Linux Mint?
• 1943[20:51:15] *** Joins: ghasem_ (~Ghasem@replaced-ip)
• 1944[20:53:11] *** Joins: Yinuqa (~cerberus@replaced-ip)
• 1945[20:53:28] <phazon> because they are inquiring about mint's forked pdf reader, xreader
• 1946[20:54:17] *** Joins: patanga (~oliver@replaced-ip)
• 1947[20:54:21] <patanga> how can i read the ram of a computer which had a kernel crash, after I have connected it with a cable?
• 1948[20:54:39] <phazon> pie3: please paste this into a terminal and provide us with the URL it spits out: cat /etc/os-release | nc termbin.com 9999
• 1949[20:55:10] <petn-randall> patanga: That's not how things work.
• 1950[20:55:28] <petn-randall> patanga: If the OS is unresponsive, you can't read out any RAM.
• 1951[20:55:37] <patanga> petn-randall: why? do You think the file system is deleted?
• 1952[20:55:51] <jaggz> something happened and I can't even drag my windows around now
• 1953[20:56:02] <patanga> petn-randall: the FS should be still there in RAM, even if the kernel has stopped working
• 1954[20:56:12] <jaggz> (the clipboard issue, and that, were why I was doing the update. I'm currently running an upgrade with --fix-missing )
• 1955[20:56:36] *** Quits: troulouliou_div2 (~troulouli@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 1956[20:56:48] <petn-randall> patanga: Sure. And how do you get DMA with "a cable"?
• 1957[20:56:53] <pie3> phazon: i want you not to assume things, in case of any doubt, pelase ask
• 1958[20:56:59] <jaggz> patanga, that's kind of high level stuff. :)
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• 1960[20:57:41] <patanga> petn-randall: in theory, even after switching off power some things can be read from RAM, even if few. Even more so, if power remains on.
• 1961[20:57:43] <petn-randall> patanga: Maybe it would help if you tell us what you're trying to achieve, instead of how you want to achieve it.
• 1962[21:00:00] <petn-randall> patanga: Sure. How is any of this related to Debian, though?
• 1963[21:00:35] <patanga> petn-randall: on a computer which was low in memory I wanted to start X, when I got this message "Kernal panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill xinit! exitcode=0x0000000b" now that i am on the console again I put a cable to another computer, but this one does not find anyting in /dev
• 1964[21:00:48] <patanga> petn-randall: because the system with the kernel crash was debian
• 1965[21:01:34] <petn-randall> patanga: What is "the cable"?
• 1966[21:01:39] <patanga> USB
• 1967[21:01:54] <patanga> usb 2.0 A. male-male
• 1968[21:01:56] <patanga> :D
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• 1970[21:02:15] <petn-randall> patanga: And how is that supposed to help in this situation? You can't read memory out via USB.
• 1971[21:02:24] <patanga> hm. why not?
• 1972[21:02:43] <patanga> thought I could recognize a device
• 1973[21:02:56] <patanga> something like /dev/mem
• 1974[21:03:15] <petn-randall> patanga: Because your computer is a usb *host*, not device. Best case is you get to short-circuit the 5V lane on one of the machines.
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• 1976[21:03:38] <petn-randall> patanga: That wouldn't even work if the computer wasn't crashed.
• 1977[21:03:40] <Habbie> note that there are other busses (like firewire) that can in fact do DMA
• 1978[21:03:42] <Habbie> but USB cannot do that
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• 1981[21:04:13] <patanga> petn-randall: ? if I put any drive on with usb, it will be recognized in /dev.
• 1982[21:04:23] <petn-randall> patanga: That would be a huge security issue if you could just plug some USB device and read out the memory.
• 1983[21:04:31] <patanga> petn-randall: ok.
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• 1986[21:05:03] <petn-randall> patanga: Only if there's a USB client on the other side, and the host has a driver for it. host-to-host connections don't work.
• 1987[21:05:44] <patanga> petn-randall: thought the file system would be recognized. and there should still reside some file systems in Ram at the other side
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• 1990[21:06:07] <at0m> patanga: better start the system that fails to start x in safe mode/single user
• 1991[21:06:07] <gffg> hi all
• 1992[21:06:34] <patanga> at0m: the system was in ram only. via a usb-stick-debian.
• 1993[21:06:52] <patanga> at0m: otherwise i would easily start it again in any mode
• 1994[21:06:57] <petn-randall> patanga: For that to work your PC would need to be a USB *client*, and would have to have that feature programmed in. That's how some mobile phones offer it. You don't get straight filesystem access, though.
• 1995[21:06:59] <at0m> patanga: should have single user boot mode just the same
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• 1998[21:08:08] <patanga> petn-randall: ok. i have never connected 2 computers and tried if one recognizes the file system of the other.
• 1999[21:08:36] <patanga> petn-randall: so what can i do to access the file system which for sure sits still in the ram of the first computer?
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• 2005[21:09:31] <patanga> petn-randall: ls /dev does not show anything. is there anything which can be done?
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• 2007[21:09:48] <Habbie> patanga, nothing, unless you somehow prepared thataccess beforehand - as several people have said here, it would be a huge security risk if accessing RAM over USB 'just worked'
• 2008[21:10:12] <patanga> Habbie: ok. thanks. interesting.
• 2009[21:10:18] <Habbie> patanga, also, disconnect that cable before, as was also pointed out, you damage the electronics on either or both sides
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• 2011[21:10:29] <patanga> ok
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• 2013[21:10:51] <patanga> Habbie: actually i dont believe that. why should I damage the electronics?
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• 2016[21:11:09] <Habbie> patanga, because the A side is expected to provide power
• 2017[21:11:13] <Habbie> patanga, and now both sides do
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• 2020[21:11:43] <patanga> Habbie: ? A means USB version 2.0 plug type A.
• 2021[21:11:52] <Habbie> yes
• 2022[21:11:58] <Habbie> which provides power to B
• 2023[21:12:09] <patanga> Habbie: there is no B
• 2024[21:12:14] <Habbie> exactly
• 2025[21:12:16] <Habbie> yet you are providing power
• 2026[21:12:18] <Habbie> from both sides
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• 2028[21:13:53] <patanga> Habbie: if i put an usb stick version 2.0 plug type A I provide power to the usb stick. and if I connect 2 computers with the same plug then? really i dont understand.
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• 2031[21:14:06] <Habbie> i see that you don't
• 2032[21:14:10] <Habbie> i cannot do more than i have done
• 2033[21:14:24] <Habbie> the cable that you plugged in is useless; it may also be dangerous; just unplug it
• 2034[21:14:56] <patanga> Habbie: have done that. but it there really no way to access the Ram of the first computer?
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• 2037[21:15:24] <Habbie> patanga, if you had the ability to connect some fancy hardware (that you don't have) to the right pins on the motherboard of the first computer, maybe
• 2038[21:15:27] <patanga> Habbie: and for what use are the cables USB 2.0 A male to male?
• 2039[21:15:30] <Habbie> patanga, that's high level expensive forensics
• 2040[21:15:34] *** Quits: arosusi (~arosusi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 2041[21:15:46] <Habbie> patanga, there are devices with A ports that can be configured (usually by a hardware switch) to make that port behave like a B port
• 2042[21:15:52] <Habbie> patanga, in which case that connection is legal
• 2043[21:16:04] <Habbie> patanga, but even those devices don't let you read their RAM over that connection
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• 2049[21:17:31] <patanga> Habbie: A and B are ports? I thought they are just plug types.
• 2050[21:17:43] <Habbie> they are plug types that map to roles
• 2051[21:17:45] <Habbie> A for host, B for device
• 2052[21:17:58] <Habbie> unless a machine has explicitly documented that it can behave like A on a B plug, or the other way around, don't mix them up
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• 2054[21:18:17] <patanga> Habbie: slowly i start to understand
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• 2056[21:18:23] <Habbie> patanga, ok :)
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• 2059[21:19:37] <patanga> Habbie: so what is the A-A cable for? the chines shop has plenty of them. who could configure of end of them to behave live a B?
• 2060[21:19:59] *** Joins: Vizva (~Vizva@replaced-ip)
• 2061[21:20:01] <patanga> *chinese* *configure on end of them*
• 2062[21:20:09] *** Joins: Krennic (~Krennic@replaced-ip)
• 2063[21:20:13] <Habbie> patanga, as i said, some devices can behave like B on an A port
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• 2065[21:20:23] <patanga> Habbie: which devices?
• 2066[21:20:25] <Habbie> patanga, and many devices can behave like A on a B port, it's called usb on the go - it's how SD card readers for mobile phones work
• 2067[21:20:38] *** Quits: steveB1 (~steve@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2068[21:20:38] <patanga> Habbie: ok.
• 2069[21:20:56] <Habbie> patanga, i only have one example of an 'B on A' device and i cannot immediately find it online, it's quite old, but usb on the go ('A on B') is easy to find
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• 2072[21:22:26] <patanga> Habbie: thanks. this experience made me feel very unexperienced.
• 2073[21:22:39] <Habbie> patanga, without wanting to be rude, that can be a good thing
• 2074[21:23:15] <patanga> Habbie: humbleness is a religious experience. linux is a religion of its own.
• 2075[21:23:29] <Habbie> i don't do religion, but whatever framework works for you :)
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• 2078[21:24:16] <patanga> Habbie: you type quickly. and know how to metaphor religion and computers.
• 2079[21:24:25] <Habbie> thank you :)
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• 2084[21:26:08] <Hot_Blonde_98> Meet girls that are looking to get fucked tonight in your Area. EXCLUSIVE SITE! If you don't find a GIRL TO FUCK, we will pay you 500 Dollars! ---> replaced-url
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• 2092[21:29:34] <patanga> the Hot Blonde has disappeared. now /me is sad.
• 2093[21:29:52] <Habbie> she kindly left a url
• 2094[21:30:01] *** Quits: olegfusion (~olegfusio@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2095[21:30:01] <Habbie> that you should only open on a box you're willing to set on fire right after
• 2096[21:30:06] *** Joins: xSmurf (~MrSmurf@replaced-ip)
• 2097[21:30:16] <patanga> Habbie: oh. like a hair of the beloved one.
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• 2099[21:30:29] <Habbie> well those don't tend to come with ransom crypto lockers
• 2100[21:30:34] <patanga> Habbie: do You really think the url is dangerous?
• 2101[21:31:05] <Habbie> probably not
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• 2103[21:31:09] *** Joins: Luve (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 2104[21:31:13] <Habbie> but there won't be anything interesting on it either
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• 2106[21:31:33] <patanga> Habbie: really. would like to connect the pins of the ram of the first computer to some device which can recognice it and read it.
• 2107[21:32:10] <Habbie> patanga, so, what's in that RAM that is so interesting?
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• 2109[21:32:21] <patanga> Habbie: two diary files.
• 2110[21:32:32] *** Quits: gusnan (~gusnan@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 2111[21:32:42] <patanga> Habbie: with URLs of scientific articles. and other notes.
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• 2118[21:33:24] <Habbie> patanga, ah
• 2119[21:33:37] <patanga> Habbie: yes
• 2120[21:33:55] <Habbie> patanga, redoing the research is probably the right answer at this time..
• 2121[21:34:01] <patanga> Habbie: ok.
• 2122[21:35:25] <patanga> Habbie: now i really got paranoid and thought that something was burning in these computers. then I realised that somebody is smoking a cigarette on the terrace right behind me. argh. oh. argh.
• 2123[21:36:25] * patanga in any case is clever enough to know that he can type on a computer only if the computer is not burned.
• 2124[21:36:28] <patanga> argh
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• 2134[21:40:04] <patanga> Habbie: tomorrow there will be a program to read the ram of any computer. it will be the best ram reading program. accessing memory address is an easy feat. right? children's imagination is always right. children's religion is true religion.
• 2135[21:40:52] <patanga> Habbie: seriously why would it be dangerous to access the ram of one computer with another computer? if the physical connection is permitted then that shoudl be perfectly legal!
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• 2140[21:43:14] <sourcream> I need to store domain name somewhere so when my app starts it will know the domain. Could I set it as global environment variable in /etc/environment, would that work? Or any other ideas
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• 2143[21:44:07] <ayekat> sourcream: can't the domain name be resolved as usual?
• 2144[21:44:21] <cybercrypto> sourcream: is your localdomain not working? what about name resolution... why is it failing?
• 2145[21:44:41] <sourcream> ayekat, THe problem is, my application will ping the server tracker so it will send the domain name of that host
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• 2148[21:45:00] <patanga> ayekat: he has to store it in /etc/sourcream so that nginx can find out the domain without accessing environment variables.
• 2149[21:45:03] <sourcream> In server tracker I need to know the hosts domain instead of ip
• 2150[21:45:33] <sourcream> I have node app which send pings to "tracker" server to know that its alive
• 2151[21:45:53] <ayekat> sourcream: wait... so you want the application to know the domain name of the *local* host?
• 2152[21:45:56] <patanga> Habbie: have You dispeared? please tell me Your opinion regarding the mem reader
• 2153[21:46:02] <sourcream> @ayekat, yes
• 2154[21:46:03] <ayekat> patanga: how is nginx related to this?
• 2155[21:46:13] <sourcream> yep nginx is not related
• 2156[21:46:33] <patanga> ayekat: i thought he was talking about his nginx web server.
• 2157[21:46:41] <tds> sourcream: do you need the full fqdn, or just the hostname?
• 2158[21:46:48] <patanga> ayekat: but is was wrong.
• 2159[21:46:57] <tds> one option would be to resolve it in the same was as `hostname --fqdn` if you need the full thing
• 2160[21:47:02] <sourcream> The server im pinging needs "subdomain.domain.com"
• 2161[21:47:04] <tds> s/was/way/
• 2162[21:47:21] <ayekat> sourcream: the problem is that multiple network domain names may point to a single host, so there is no real way to find out *the* name
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• 2165[21:47:47] <ayekat> (also, that's typically not information stored on the host itself, but on some DNS servers potentially elsewhere)
• 2166[21:47:49] <patanga> ayekat: he can talk about his domain without the regex tds needs for he conwersation. multiple network domain names point to hosts. so this is the true solution.
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• 2171[21:48:26] <sourcream> In bash script which starts the node app i could set "export DOMAIN=asd.domain.com"
• 2172[21:48:36] <ayekat> sourcream: e.g. a host may be both "foo.bar.com" and "goo.tar.net"
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• 2175[21:48:37] <sourcream> but would be easier if I could set that asd.domain.com to global env
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• 2177[21:49:40] <Zta77> In a world where Unity was the best Desktop ever, but Ubuntu has turned to crap... how does one install the Unity Desktop on Debian? Or make it behave as close as possible to Unity?
• 2178[21:49:40] <ayekat> sourcream: does that "app" not have a configuration file for that kind of thing?
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• 2180[21:50:17] <ayekat> sourcream: or at least, can it be invoked with an appropriate command line option?
• 2181[21:50:22] <sourcream> ayekat, yep there is config file where I could put that but I push that config to git so hardcoding this servers domain name to there wouldnt be good
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• 2183[21:50:29] <sourcream> if i add the app later to other box
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• 2188[21:52:01] <ayekat> sourcream: so the issue is how you use git, and that you want to synchronise the config file between multiple hosts, and your solution is to displace the problem elsewhere
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• 2191[21:52:28] <ayekat> (if one day you decide to put that hypothetical configuration file into git as well, you'll have the same problem again)
• 2192[21:52:35] <sourcream> ayekat, the issue is that I dont want to hardcode specific domain name to general config file
• 2193[21:53:08] <ayekat> sourcream: yes, but what if you put /etc/environment into git?
• 2194[21:53:24] <sourcream> What would be point of that :D
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• 2196[21:54:23] <ayekat> well, you already track /etc/{your-app} with git, so tracking /etc/environment doesn't seem too far off
• 2197[21:54:41] <sourcream> The app is in home folder
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• 2199[21:54:52] <sourcream> but whatever
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• 2201[21:55:29] <ayekat> ah... but then using system-wide configuration files for a user-specific configuration isn't very appropriate
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• 2203[21:55:48] <ayekat> (but the issue remains the same, ultimately)
• 2204[21:55:54] <sourcream> Nono, only thing which is system specific is the domain name
• 2205[21:55:58] <sourcream> Not really config
• 2206[21:56:09] <sourcream> but that app needs to know only the domain name, config stay same
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• 2208[21:56:25] <ayekat> yes, but as I wrote above, there is no single domain name for a host
• 2209[21:56:39] <ayekat> the closest thing would be a reverse DNS lookup, but that's likely not what you want
• 2210[21:57:25] <sourcream> ayekat, since I know the domain name could I set it to global env variable
• 2211[21:57:28] <ayekat> I don't have an elegant solution for your problem - personally, I just keep around multiple host-specific config files side-by-side, and then use symlinks to "enable" the right one for a given host
• 2212[21:57:30] <sourcream> or is there something bad in that
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• 2214[21:57:43] <sourcream> hmm
• 2215[21:57:48] <ayekat> sourcream: well, that environment variable would be set specifically for the needs of your application, so no
• 2216[21:58:11] <ayekat> it would still be a "user XYZ needs this" setting in a system-wide config file, which I consider rather unelegant
• 2217[21:58:39] <sourcream> Hmm okay. I dont know I cant think of better solution. Somewhere i need to store it xd
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• 2221[22:00:00] <ayekat> sourcream: can the application read from multiple configuration files? if so you could store the fqdn information in a file that is not tracked by git
• 2222[22:00:36] <sourcream> ayekat, yep actually I could make domainname file which is ignored by git
• 2223[22:00:41] <sourcream> and that script would read it from there
• 2224[22:00:49] <sourcream> thanks a lot for the insight
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• 2226[22:00:58] <ayekat> for instance - that wouldn't be too dirty
• 2227[22:01:06] <sourcream> yeah thats good solution
• 2228[22:01:10] <sourcream> better than the env thing
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• 2231[22:01:27] <sourcream> thanks a lot budd
• 2232[22:01:30] <ayekat> well, the env thing would also work (but don't use the global /etc/environment, but rather your user-specific ~/.pam_environment)
• 2233[22:01:38] <sourcream> yeye
• 2234[22:01:54] <ayekat> but I guess, given that it's app-specific, it makes sense to use its own config files
• 2235[22:02:07] <tds> sourcream: does hostname --fqdn get you right the full domain name? that's a reasonably sensible strategy for getting it, and on most systems will end up reading /etc/hostname and /etc/hosts and nothing more
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• 2237[22:02:58] <sourcream> tds, I havent set those thing in the host, I set only hostnam
• 2238[22:03:03] <ayekat> tds: the hostname may not necessarily correspond to the "domain name" they want, though - your host may be named "pineapple.foodfarm.lan", but you may want "mycorp.com"
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• 2240[22:03:26] <sourcream> if I have domain called "eu.domain.com"
• 2241[22:03:37] <sourcream> do some ppl set that fqdn as hostname?
• 2242[22:03:56] <sourcream> and lets say that domain is as example domain you created in cloudflare
• 2243[22:04:05] <sourcream> to point the server ip
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• 2253[22:09:42] <karlpinc> sourcream: I generally make /etc/hosts not-fully qualified.
• 2254[22:10:17] <sourcream> What does it mean fully qualified
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• 2256[22:10:44] <karlpinc> sourcream: Fully qualified usually means that it has no "."s in it.
• 2257[22:10:52] <karlpinc> Er, _not-fully qualified.
• 2258[22:11:05] <karlpinc> Fully qualified means all the dots are there.
• 2259[22:11:26] <Habbie> there are setups in which 'a.b' eventually maps to 'a.b.example.com'
• 2260[22:11:29] <Habbie> now, people should stop doing that
• 2261[22:11:31] <Habbie> but dots are not a guarantee
• 2262[22:12:15] <karlpinc> sourcream: /etc/hosts on the other hand has all the dots, as the first entry for 127.0.0.1.
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• 2265[22:13:20] <karlpinc> Habbie: Nothing wrong with lots of dots. They're administrative hand-off points, if not more.
• 2266[22:13:35] <sourcream> oh okay I see
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• 2269[22:15:23] <karlpinc> sourcream: Sometimes you need to tell your daemons more about domains. The MTA may need to send or receive from various domains. The webserver serve various domains, etc.
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• 2274[22:17:52] <Habbie> karlpinc, yes, just saying they're no proof of 'not fully qualified'
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• 2277[22:19:43] <sourcream> hmm
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• 2373[23:24:57] <zoeurk> hello there are a probleme when you compile with dpkg-buildpackage bind9 (source from stable). I have correct the export.diff but i don't finish to see If the compilation work.but my patch work. see this link for the export patch: replaced-url
• 2374[23:25:03] <zoeurk> good night
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• 2379[23:25:41] <zoeurk> I try to compile bind9 tomorrow (sorry for my english, I'm French Amateur/Geek)
• 2380[23:25:49] <zoeurk> good night
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• 2383[23:27:12] <annadane> people who say sorry for my english are far more adept in english than i would be at their languages...
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• 2395[23:32:53] <zoeurk> sorry i try to recompile and I forgot to say that you need to remove build and build-udeb berfor re-run dpkg-buildpackage
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• 2397[23:33:22] <zoeurk> It's seem's to work :)
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• 2399[23:34:02] <zoeurk> I don't know where I need to post that.It 's for that who I say taht here.
• 2400[23:34:07] <zoeurk> bye
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• 2408[23:36:49] <booyah> hello guys anyone used BTRFS for longer time, and had it working well? or any problems?
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