35[00:09:41] <jmcnaught> Synaptic: "apt-get purge
nvidia-*" should do it, but very carefully review the list of
packages it will remove before approving
36[00:09:53] *** Quits: alexandros_c (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Disconnected by services)
41[00:13:51] <jmcnaught> Synaptic: if you decide to try
installing the nvidia drivers again make sure to follow these
instructions, you need to have kernel headers installed before
installing nvidia-driver, I suspect that's where things went
wrong:
replaced-url
58[00:27:05] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on
<debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for
sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable
debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install
build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source
packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation
options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid
see <uupdate>.
63[00:29:36] <carl_> okay i think the problem with these
backport instructions is that if I try to make a backport of guake
from testing to stable, it ends up being installed with broken
dependencies
64[00:29:38] <annadane> if i want to comment out a cron entry
is it just #'s?
74[00:37:04] <dpkg> uupdate (in the <devscripts> package)
upgrades a source code package from an upstream revision, or e.g. if
the newest foo in debian is 1.2, and upstream is at 1.4: apt-get
source foo; wget -nd
replaced-url
77[00:37:28] <dpkg> backports.debian.org (formerly
backports.org) is an official repository of <backports> for
the current stable (see <stretch backports>) and oldstable
(<jessie backports>) distributions, prepared by Debian
developers. Ask me about <backport caveat> and read
replaced-url
78[00:37:49] <carl_> dang i'm stumped
79[00:38:08] <carl_> these backport instructions aren't
working
80[00:38:59] <jmcnaught> carl_: there's an alternative
method here:
replaced-url
81[00:40:21] <carl_> jmcnaught, those don't work either
92[00:42:55] *** Quits: Sveta (~svetlana@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
93[00:43:16] *** Joins: Sveta (~svetlana@replaced-ip)
94[00:44:04] <carl_> aaand following the simple backport guide
I just get E: The value 'testing' is invalid for
APT::Default-Release as such a release is not available in the
sources
96[00:44:24] <jmcnaught> carl_: was guake rewritten in an
interpreted language like python between stretch and buster? That
could be why it's for all instead of amd64
97[00:44:48] <carl_> jmcnaught, i have no idea
98[00:45:03] <carl_> the newer one has python deps tho so
I'm assuming it's in python
99[00:45:04] <carl_> hmm
100[00:46:51] <carl_> well the current github repo is in python
alright
113[00:52:24] <jmcnaught> carl_: did you install it with dpkg
-i? Installing it with "apt install ./guake.deb" should
pull in dependencies that the package may need
129[00:58:36] <jmcnaught> carl_: well those packages simply
aren't in stretch or stretch-backports at the required
versions. I don't know why judd reports that guake can be
backported if that's the case. The bot's not perfect I
guess
130[00:58:43] *** Quits: woenx (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
131[01:00:08] <carl_> jmcnaught, what does backporting mean
exactly? Does it mean just making a newer package install on older
debians with older dependencies, or does it mean also pulling the
newer dependencies too?
132[01:00:36] <jmcnaught> carl_: it means compiling a newer
package from testing/unstable for the libraries in stable
133[01:01:23] <carl_> jmcnaught, so what happens if it needs
dependencies from testing? is it impossible to backport then?
134[01:02:18] *** Quits: humpled (~humbag@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
135[01:02:46] <jmcnaught> carl_: or you can end up in dependency
hell trying to backport dependencies of dependencies. I usually
don't bother unless it's something I can't live
without (zero manually backported software on any of my stretch
systems)
136[01:03:46] <carl_> jmcnaught, the dependency hell sounds like
less trouble than dealing with the ancient bugs in some packages of
stable though
137[01:04:01] <carl_> jmcnaught, maybe I'm coming at this
the wrong way
138[01:04:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1470
139[01:04:41] <carl_> jmcnaught, I figured that since I hate
troubleshooting and I can live without the newest version for most
of my software, I should use debian stable as opposed to testing
145[01:05:45] <carl_> jmcnaught, this seems to be working fine
in most cases, but occasionally I run into a package which is just
unreasonably old, so I figured I could just install those from
testing and hope for the best
147[01:06:43] <jmcnaught> carl_: well as you can see stable and
testing have diverged quite a bit in terms of library versions,
which is why mixing binary packages from both (as opposed to
backporting source packages) can easily mess up your system
148[01:07:20] <jmcnaught> carl_: buster is frozen now and
won't be changing much, if you can live without security
support upgrading to buster is an option.
149[01:08:10] <carl_> jmcnaught, what do you mean by security
support?
151[01:08:55] *** Quits: fedorafan (~fedorafan@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
152[01:09:19] <jmcnaught> carl_: only Debian stable gets
security updates from the security team, so buster lags a bit behind
getting security updates
153[01:09:46] <carl_> jmcnaught, ah
154[01:10:16] <carl_> jmcnaught, so I have to pick between
really old software in general but up to date on security issues,
vs. newer software but outdated on security
155[01:10:34] <carl_> oh well
156[01:10:54] <carl_> jmcnaught, my main concern really is that
if I switched to testing one of the drivers will randomly break
161[01:13:45] <jmcnaught> carl_: do you have third-party drivers
installed? If you follow the upgrade instructions in the (draft)
buster release notes it should be a smooth upgrade
162[01:15:19] <Synaptic> this is my sources.list
replaced-url
163[01:15:35] <carl_> jmcnaught, I didn't install any
drivers separately after installing debian but I did have to allow
the non-free repos
249[02:14:05] <somiaj> carl_: things offical in a debian release
are seldom if ever broken, what is broken for you?
250[02:14:38] <somiaj> often times when stuff breaks it is
because of mixing things. It is worth learning to do things the
'debian way',whcih basically is just some best practices
to keep from breaking your debian.
251[02:16:59] <jim> carl_, maybe apt -f install could make
things better
269[02:22:00] <jim> (idea being, let me tell them that, so they
can do it)
270[02:22:09] <somiaj> why do you want to generate a release
file, is this still about the fact the docker source you are trying
to use doesn't have one?
276[02:24:13] <somiaj> are you trying to build a docker
repository, or is this just one that isn't working? You
probably shouldn't work as the middle person to getting their
repository to work.
277[02:24:38] <somiaj> and I can't really provide you
enough details. The tools they are using to build the repository
should be building the release files.
278[02:25:22] <jim> nope, just trying to use one, and get
something to tell them how to generate that release file
280[02:26:10] <carl_> somiaj, well there's blatant bugs in
the package that's in stable, and when I look online I get lots
of non-working instructions, including on the debian wiki. Also
people here point me to help pages that turn out to be either
missing or incorrect
281[02:26:11] <jim> is it possible to proceed without the
release file? (it must be some switch of apt-get update)
283[02:27:26] <somiaj> this is not the channel to try to get
support on some third party repository. If the release file is
missing either you have not entered int he repository correctly or
the people who craeted it have a problem. Contact them.
284[02:28:09] <carl_> somiaj, I came here to get support on
installing a package from testing
285[02:28:16] <carl_> surely it is the correct channel for that?
286[02:28:17] <somiaj> carl_: what package again? Debian
isn't bug free, but most things work just fine. At the time of
the release debian is *almost* release critical bug free, but
sometimes these bugs are found after the release.
298[02:29:21] <Synaptic> but audio of movies is going out of
sync here
299[02:29:25] <Synaptic> all my movies
300[02:29:37] <carl_> somiaj, yes yes don't install any new
packages and just give up on having any updates even though current
version is broken and upstream fixed it
301[02:29:46] <jim> you can, however, build the package from
testing...
306[02:30:52] <somiaj> Synaptic: I personally with your
expeirnce would not suggest backporting from testing. Also since
buster is about to release, either use buster now (with limited
security support) or wait for the release.
307[02:31:02] <Synaptic> ok
308[02:31:06] <jim> not without a lot of work getting those
build dependencies satisfied
311[02:31:14] <Synaptic> but in this moment my movies are not
correctly sync
312[02:31:21] <Synaptic> and i dont know how i can fix it
313[02:31:39] <somiaj> carl_: Debian's frozen release
structure has some very good thigns about it, but it isn't for
all users. Personally I suggest just running buster at this time if
you want newer software from buster.
314[02:32:06] <somiaj> Synaptic: all your movies or just certain
ones?
315[02:32:23] <jim> somiaj, if this isn't the channel to
find out how the 3rd party repo admins can fix their repo, what
would be?
316[02:32:43] <carl_> somiaj, why can't I just install only
the package I want from testing, and also whatever dependencies are
strictly necessary, and if that breaks creates a frenkendebian and
something breaks then so be it?
317[02:33:01] <carl_> *if that creates
318[02:33:01] <Synaptic> somiaj, all
319[02:33:14] <jim> carl_, possibly, you'd break your
packaging db
320[02:33:16] <Synaptic> and same with mpv dragonplayer and vlc
325[02:34:35] <jim> carl_, well the only problem there, is
you'd end up with something you'd have to take over
support on
326[02:34:45] <somiaj> carl_: you can do with your system
whatever you want. We will not support you if you mix because it
leads to lots of crazy issues, including not being able to install
stuff and bugs that are due to mixing.
327[02:35:00] <Synaptic> i will keep testing it
328[02:35:08] <Synaptic> some adjustment on preferences
329[02:35:13] <carl_> fair enough somiaj, but HOW do I get the
testing package to install?
330[02:35:26] <carl_> that's really the only thing I'm
asking
331[02:35:50] <somiaj> Synaptic: hmm, I don't know vlc that
well, try to install mpv, then play the moving from the command
line, mpv filefoo. mpv should be able to play almost anything.
333[02:36:00] <carl_> if it's unsupported and I do it
anyway and something breaks because I did it obviously I'm not
going to come back here and complain it broke, I'm going to
uninstall it and give up
334[02:36:08] <carl_> But I haven't been able to even try
336[02:36:34] <somiaj> carl_: It is not supported, you will have
to figure out how to get it to install.
337[02:36:53] <carl_> argh
338[02:36:57] <somiaj> I would jsut install buster on your
system, it will be a far better experience than mixing.
339[02:36:58] <carl_> that's just unhelpful
340[02:37:30] <somiaj> buster is almost stable, many users run
it just fine, you just have limited security support until the
release which isn't that big of a deal for most desktop
systems.
341[02:37:43] <somiaj> you can even just upgrade stable to
buster if you like.
358[02:40:43] <carl_> somiaj, I mean it's a very simple
thing I'm asking - what command do I run to install a package
from testing, plus those dependencies which cannot be satisfied by
stable
359[02:40:54] <carl_> if this is impossible, okay
360[02:41:17] <somiaj> You may think it is simple but it is not,
due to shared libaries.
361[02:41:19] <dvs> carl_, If you do that then you will be
running testing
362[02:41:41] <somiaj> just upgrade to testing, it is for the
most part stable, has the software you want.
363[02:42:09] <carl_> there seems to be a fundamental break in
communication here
366[02:42:44] <somiaj> yes, you don't understand what
'we do not support mixing' means. It means we don't
support it, including figureing out how to do it in anyway what so
ever.
367[02:42:44] <carl_> like stable has 99 softwares I want, but
testing has 1 software I want, so I'm asking how to get the 1
from testing and you're telling me just switch to testing!
368[02:42:55] <jim> somiaj, ok. so in that case it doesn't
get fixed. so be it. so in the alternative, can I proceed without
them having a repease file?
369[02:43:20] <carl_> well what about the other 99 programs
which I want to run the stable version of?
370[02:43:21] <somiaj> jim: I'm unsure the best way to
install docker on debian.
371[02:43:21] <dvs> carl_, I'm telling you that that one
package in testing will pull in base libraries from testing
373[02:43:35] <carl_> yes guake has like 7 dependencies from
testing
374[02:43:42] <carl_> so I install 8 packages big whoop
375[02:43:44] <somiaj> carl_: simple case, that 1 package pulls
in some core libaries like libc6, and some other core stuff that
most of your system depends on.
376[02:43:51] <carl_> still not the same as switching to tetsing
377[02:43:59] <humpled> it seems you want something which is not
debian
378[02:44:08] <somiaj> carl_: now you have some core libaries
that are on testing, and this could break every one of those other
99 packages that also depend on this core package.
379[02:44:13] <dvs> carl_, No, it's called a frankendebian
380[02:44:36] <carl_> humpled, yes, I want to install the
working version of a program as opposed to the broken version, if
that is "not debian", then maybe I should step back and
reflect here I guess
381[02:44:44] <jim> somiaj, following that line of reasoning,
you're also not sure if debian properly supports docker... my
original intent was to learn something about it, so I'd be
better equipped to help people
385[02:45:47] <carl_> somiaj, why would it break them? maybe
they'll break and maybe they won't. I want to try it and
see, if it breaks I'll go back
386[02:45:47] <jim> yeah, I looked at the checkbackport for that
already
387[02:46:02] <dvs> !downgrade
388[02:46:02] <somiaj> jim: docker's development was moving
really quickly so the packages were pulled from stretch as debian
couldn't support them. Seems they are in buster now. I
don't know the best way to install docker in stable, which
isn't offically supported.
389[02:46:02] <dpkg> Downgrading is not, nor will ever be
supported by apt. Programs change their data in a way that
can't be rolled back, and package maintainer scripts support
upgrades to new config file formats but not downgrades. Try:
"dpkg -i olderversion.deb" or "aptitude install
package=version" using "apt-cache policy package" to
get the old version number. See also <partial downgrade>,
<unstable->testing>, <sdo>.
390[02:46:17] <humpled> doesn't gnome have it's own
drop-down terminal? i'm sure i used something that wasn't
guake
391[02:46:22] <somiaj> carl_: you can't just go back. Did
you read that don't break debian wiki page?
393[02:47:14] <carl_> somiaj, i don't get how i can't
just uninstall the handful of packages
394[02:48:11] <jim> carl_, you understand what a tree of package
dependency relations is?
395[02:48:26] <carl_> jim, yes and so?
396[02:48:37] *** Quits: Max_Rebo (~Max_Rebo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
397[02:49:14] <jim> if you install a package from another
version of debian, you also introduce a dependency tree that's
not compatible with the one you have
400[02:50:57] <jim> carl_, this could, for example, lead to the
installation of a later libc, and this would result in trying to
install every package containing binary executables linked against
libc
401[02:51:57] <carl_> yes jim i realize that
402[02:52:02] <jim> true, not necessarily compatible. if it has
binary executables linked with libc, then definitely incompatable
403[02:53:08] <somiaj> our basic policy here is to not suggest
or help someone break their system. That is what 'not
supported' means.
404[02:54:23] <carl_> somiaj, that policy doesn't seem to
mean much since the I did get suggested things that did break my
system
406[02:55:05] <somiaj> Sure, and there is a lot (and I mean a
lot) of bad advise about debian on the internet too.
407[02:55:47] <jim> looking at the original intent for having
this whole system, it's in order to afford some convenience in
installing software that wasn't originally installed when they
first installed debian
610[05:34:25] <ealfonso> Hi. I'm trying to help a friend
install debian on a MacBookAir (2010, 11', Oct 2010). I saw the
guide (replaced-url
611[05:39:27] <Synaptic> hello
612[05:40:17] <Synaptic> ealfonso, i dont want to say something
not true, but, installing debian on a macbook anyway is going to
scan and find all hardware components like all the other PC
613[05:40:30] <Synaptic> the only way you need to find the way
to boot the installer
622[05:48:13] <ealfonso> 3-2 is not the same as 3-1. Maybe it
doesn't matter, but the guide isn't explicit about this.
I'm also unsure about the rEFit step, which seems unmaintained
since 2013
623[05:48:32] <rant> the only thing special about apple machines
of the last 10 years is the EFI, other than that they are the same
as any other machine
624[05:49:09] <rant> older ones that arent amd64 (x86_64) are no
longer supported by debian
627[05:51:14] <ealfonso> rant are you aware of anything special
needed for dual-booting with the original OS X ? will grub do it?
628[05:51:21] <rant> personally if I had one I'd sell it
and get a 2013 era lenovo thinkpad X or T series.. which you should
be able to do with ease.. and it'd be way better hardware all
the way around
629[05:51:48] <rant> I have no idea about OSX
630[05:52:43] *** Quits: UniFreak (~UniFreak@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
646[05:59:38] <rant> Synaptic: yes well, when asking hardware
questions like that the names are irrelevant we need the vend/prod
id codes.. the software doesnt claim devices based on their names
and many different names could correspond to many different id
numbers
647[05:59:54] <Synaptic> ok
648[05:59:59] <Synaptic> i will be back from debian later
649[06:00:09] <rant> Synaptic: yes, it will send the pci/usb bus
info to a pastebin and return a URL
673[06:03:29] <midoriya> Hello all, running a fresh installation
of Debian unstable with GNOME 3. It looks and runs beautifully! :)
674[06:04:08] <rant> Synaptic: as I said I have on my USB bus,
my fingerprint reader, webcam, and bluetooth, without anything
plugged in.. all three of these devices are internal.. the bluetooth
is on the same mini pci express card as my wifi which is on the pci
bus
675[06:04:44] <rant> midoriya: I'm sorry to hear that
691[06:07:20] <Synaptic> maybe i will download xfce as well cuz
i like it
692[06:07:24] <Synaptic> plasma looks too delicate..
693[06:07:43] <Synaptic> jmcnaught, i installed nvidia drivers
at the end...
694[06:07:50] <Synaptic> thanks to the proper guide....
695[06:07:58] <midoriya> I do like Xfce, but I'll wait
until 4.14 is released before I try it out again. It just has too
much screen tearing and Compton isn't really that great of a
workaround :P
696[06:08:36] <rant> according to annadane about an hour or two
ago, it was already released
697[06:08:51] <Synaptic> installing them all, at the boot i can
choose it from the login page right? like i did from gome to plasma?
698[06:08:59] <rant> its not in debian yet of course cause
we're in a freeze
699[06:09:10] <rant> Synaptic: yes
700[06:09:17] <Synaptic> ok it will be just one more.. xfce
701[06:09:38] <midoriya> It just got its first pre-release, but
4.14 should be out by the time 10 rolls around... shame it
didn't mean the Buster freeze deadline, though
704[06:10:09] <rant> I think I may setup some VM and work on
that issue.. cause those cluttered menus do really bother me..and
its extremely difficult for average user to address that issue with
multiple DE
705[06:10:40] <midoriya> I think you could use MenuLibre to hide
a lot of applications that are built around different environments.
That's definitely what I'd do, haha
706[06:11:24] *** Quits: chet (~chet@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
707[06:11:26] <rant> yes well those menu editors are buggy and
complicated as all hell and dont make it easy if even possible to
edit menus on a per-de basis
719[06:13:55] <rant> by using the high-level task-foo-desktop
metapackages you make it easier to remove by just removing that task
package then doing apt autoremove
720[06:15:08] <Henry151> eliminate your DE entirely :)
730[06:20:16] <jmcnaught> Maybe sawfish was using Debian menu?
731[06:20:18] <jmcnaught> ,i menu
732[06:20:20] <judd> Package menu (admin, optional) in
stretch/amd64: generates programs menu for all menu-aware
applications. Version: 2.1.47+b1; Size: 370.7k; Installed: 1435k
762[06:40:02] *** Quits: dez (uid92154@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
763[06:40:12] <rant> my thought is to just make a simple
automated program that can quickly build you per-de menus in your
homedir.. and perhaps have several different pre-defined layouts..
where its DE-only, DE with all in seperate menu hierarchy, DE with
other in each submenu, etc.. and perhaps have a simple mechanism to
allow you to "import" apps from other DE to the current DE
menu
769[06:42:09] <rant> Synaptic: well thats kinda my point.. new
users I'm sure would love to just install multiple DE and mess
with each.. and its daunting when you goto your menu and you got 4
text editors, 4 calculators, 4 archive managers, 4 file managers
770[06:42:55] <Synaptic> true
771[06:42:59] <rant> somiaj: they usually need to be installed
seperately and the point is you start out using a global menu with
virtually everything.. newer users need to start out the way they
would get it if they had only installed 1 DE
772[06:43:06] <Synaptic> i just have 2 of each because i switch
from gnome to kde..
773[06:43:37] <Synaptic> if i dont like them i just go on
synaptic and select wich one need to be uninstalled
774[06:43:38] <Synaptic> no?
775[06:44:19] <rant> mixing and matchign components from various
DE is something you do AFTER you become acquainted.. this is why
seperating the redundant menu entries should be default behavior
776[06:44:50] <Synaptic> talking about desktops..... is it
possible to run a bash command, for example top on the background of
the screen?
783[06:47:01] <rant> Synaptic: technically the desktop and
wallpaper are just a frameless window.. last I used sawfish with
mate, the desktop was drawn at like -5 so putting something at -4,
ignored (without a window frame decor at all) and full-screen sized,
would make it appear above the desktop but below everything else..
787[06:47:41] <somiaj> Synaptic: you can get a terminal that has
psudotransparancy and uses your wall paper as the background.
788[06:47:42] <Synaptic> didnt know that could make it like that
789[06:47:46] <rant> but doing this requires support for doing
this in your WM, and should be possible with any EWMH compliant wm,
but it would then still be on top of your icons
790[06:48:16] <Synaptic> mhh
791[06:48:19] <rant> the other option would be to render the
output of the command using something like imagemagick to an actual
image
792[06:48:29] <Synaptic> long time ago i was using conky but im
not good anymore coding it
793[06:48:31] <rant> actually putting the text onto an image
file
794[06:48:36] <somiaj> there is actually a command that does
this, can't seem to recall its name though.
797[06:49:47] <somiaj> hmm, there is root-tail, but that
wasn't waht I was thinking off
798[06:50:04] <rant> Synaptic: its simple window stacking
order.. most windows are 0 and above.. but things like panels and
desktop apps that show icons or backgrounds are exceptions.. they
typically run at negative levels and often also change the usable
desktop size (for maximizing windows)
799[06:50:26] <rant> I recall xphoon which was one that showed
the phase of the moon on the root window
804[06:53:29] <somiaj> ahh there it is, xosd-bin is the package
name, there is also aosd-cat, or even osdsh, various tools for this
(osd = on screen display)
805[06:53:35] *** Parts: Sveta (~svetlana@replaced-ip) (".")
825[07:07:00] <somiaj> m4ch1n3znc: provided you have updated the
microcode/firmware of your machine the kernel should have protection
against those cpu flaws.
829[07:11:16] <tdn> somiaj, I do not want a 'fancy'
web front end. However, I do want to be able to check out via https.
Like I can do with subversion and apache
830[07:12:26] <somiaj> Maybe you can just ssl_proxy apache to
the port git-daemon is running on localhost, I haven't done
this though.
839[07:17:40] <themill> tdn: you can just expose a bare git repo
with any httpd and it is able to be cloned via http/https.
840[07:18:50] <themill> (that's readonly; pushing requires
more, but you did say "check out" not "commit"
so perhaps that is sufficient for your needs)
847[07:21:46] <somiaj> python is a fairly good general purpose
langauge that is still quite popular, has a good community, lots of
docs, and in my opinion easy to write.
848[07:22:17] <magic_ninja> It has to be easier than C
849[07:22:20] <rabbitear_sdf> use go instead
850[07:22:42] <somiaj> I find the syntax nice (once you get use
to it) and the code easily readable.
851[07:22:48] <rabbitear_sdf> actually you are suppose to write
stuff in c first
852[07:23:03] <magic_ninja> I don't have time to keep
screwing around with C
853[07:23:23] <magic_ninja> I need something that I can slap
together :)
855[07:23:26] <rabbitear_sdf> magic_ninja: oh, you will
856[07:23:32] <rabbitear_sdf> magic_ninja: you will my friend
857[07:23:40] <somiaj> scripting langauges are great for small
jobs, and overall python can be fairly quick, lots of times python
will use a compiled c libary for speed on complicated things.
858[07:24:01] <magic_ninja> rabbitear_sdf, I've written a
nice bit of C in the last year. I want something else.
865[07:25:55] <magic_ninja> somiaj, right on. I know python has
libs for a ton of things. I was kinda debating between that and
java.
866[07:26:12] <rabbitear_sdf> magic_ninja: I have to have to you
write a full report, why you need to talk to people and do something
else for me, okay?
867[07:26:47] *** Quits: thePiGrepper (~nagato@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
869[07:27:34] <somiaj> magic_ninja: I think on linux you'll
find python a bit easier since it is installed by default on linux,
and if you are wanting to get away from C syntax, java would be
similar, and require a lot of additional stuff to install.
870[07:27:59] <rabbitear_sdf> there's 3 kinds of people in
this world, but hopefully what to learn question gets gone, because
you're already learning what you do <-- do is a funny thing
these days too
871[07:28:01] <somiaj> I mean java has similar syntax to C.
873[07:28:15] <magic_ninja> I'm not worried about size.
874[07:28:20] <magic_ninja> 1TB SSD just for the linux install.
875[07:28:43] <magic_ninja> But, if java has a C syntax, I might
pick it up more quickly.
876[07:29:09] <magic_ninja> I'll go with python. It is one
of the main languages for Ignition HMI as well, so I could double
up.
877[07:29:23] <rabbitear_sdf> what you'll probably be
worrying about and taking up most of your energy is messing with
yourself saying 'why don't I know this'
882[07:30:32] <magic_ninja> rabbitear_sdf, I'm in my second
year of EE school, I've been programming PLC's for years,
been building networks since I was a teenager and I'm a
journeyman electrician. I think I can deal with technology.
896[07:34:15] <somiaj> magic_ninja: many like ipython when
learning python or the more fancy jyupter notebook if you want to
write it over a web front end.
897[07:34:20] <chet> I finally got sound coming the fromt aux
(3.5mm) port and the sound is switching back and forth if I unplug
but there is terrible feedback coming out the rear aux but no music
912[07:37:36] <somiaj> chet: I'm unsure. Is this on a
laptop?
913[07:37:48] <chet> when I unplug the headphones sound goes
back to the other device
914[07:37:55] <chet> desktop
915[07:38:36] <rabbitear_sdf> magic_ninja: drink a glass of
water, take shower, it'll be the same stuff when you're a
refreshed mind
916[07:38:38] <somiaj> yea, I'm unsure, is this the intel
hda sound card?
917[07:39:00] <rabbitear_sdf> magic_ninja: you are thinking too
much, i believe
918[07:39:10] <chet> the rear is hooked to sound system via
3.5mm but I want it to switch when I plug and unplug the headphones
919[07:39:31] <somiaj> magic_ninja: I was wrong there, turns out
what I was thinking of was a python bytecode. I haven't had to
use it, I would just start simple. Nice thing about ipython is you
can just start writting pythong in a shell to get use to it.
920[07:40:00] <rabbitear_sdf> somiaj: you are confusing the
users!
921[07:40:16] <m4ch1n3znc> so zombiload was patched with last
intel-microcode package update?
922[07:40:54] <rabbitear_sdf> m4ch1n3znc: they say
941[07:44:57] <somiaj> chet: I think that sound driver should be
able to detect if you plug in headphones and switch output
accordinglly. I have no clue how to configure this if it isn't
working.
949[07:48:35] <chet> just tons of bad feedback coming out the
rear when headphones plugged in
950[07:49:06] <chet> **headphones plugged into the front
951[07:50:59] <somiaj> as I said, maybe plugging in the
headphones in the front is switching the port in the back to be a
mic jack or something like that.
952[07:51:22] <Synaptic> just a thinking... right now, let say
with the incoming new stable release of debian, for a everyday usage
of a pc, lets say a normal user desktop user. debian start to be
more user friendly compared to the past? and compared with all forks
and derivated from debian that everybody says more beginners
friendly?
953[07:51:44] <somiaj> that snd_hda_intel card has lots of
models that have various different behaviors. But most the info I
have is kinda outdated.
954[07:52:47] <somiaj> Synaptic: debian does have improvements
on that front, but debian provides for a much bigger audience (both
in number of ports supported and number of packages supported), that
it most likely won't ever be as user friendly as some
derivatives that focus only on that.
955[07:52:52] <Synaptic> i will type again the questio on
#debian-offtopic if necessary
958[07:53:22] <Synaptic> me im not a linux expert, im not able
to compile manually
959[07:53:25] <somiaj> Synaptic: I think taking the time to
learn debian is worth it, but it maynot be as catered to say a
desktop on amd64 hardware as say mint is.
960[07:54:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1457
961[07:54:02] <somiaj> you shoudln't have to complie things
manually in debian. You may have to realize debian has a differnt
goal, and sometimes the software available is older, but in most
cases provided y ou are okay with the software provided, this
won't be an issue.
962[07:54:05] <Synaptic> im scared to do something wrong, but i
believe if i break a debian, i can break a mint in same way
964[07:55:42] <somiaj> That is correct, the basic thing is just
use official debian sources, and if software you want is not in
debian, it is often better to find an alternative that is than try
to add software to debian (until you better understand debian and
what you are doing)
965[07:56:41] <somiaj> this would be the same for mint. If you
choose mint, only use mint sources, and only use the software mint
has availabe in their sources if at all possible. Also realize that
your choice of distro comes with a support commuinty. You do get to
ask questions here if you choose debian, other wise you need to use
mints (or X distros) support community.
966[07:56:58] *** Quits: kapilp (uid36151@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
967[07:57:04] <Synaptic> i can tell you what im doing 99% with
my laptop. watching movies HD, listen to FLAC music or hi-res music,
photography editing with lightroom or darktable, i like a lot
graphical things, and normal internet browsing/yt and thats it
969[07:57:36] <Synaptic> im running debian at the moment
970[07:57:53] <somiaj> Synaptic: personally I would just install
buster at this point and see if it is what you want. It is basically
stable, and the limited secuirty support isn't that big of an
issue (for the most part)
972[07:58:16] <Synaptic> im trying to understand if im doing ti
right..... why im on debian? because i dont want to use a derivated
or fork system, if the original system is available
974[07:58:35] <Synaptic> ubuntu is debian based and mint is
ubuntu based... al coming down from debian, so i want to use debian
975[07:58:42] <Synaptic> thats my philosophy right now
976[07:58:50] <Synaptic> buster is testing? or unstable?
977[07:58:56] <somiaj> Though we don't support derivatives
here, they have their place, and sometimes focus more on a smaller
target (such as desktop use) which some users may find more to their
liking.
978[07:58:59] <somiaj> buster is testing.
979[07:59:17] <Synaptic> testing have plenty new software on it
right?
980[07:59:27] <Synaptic> also vlc 3.* if im right
981[07:59:34] <somiaj> but soon buster will be stable, which is
why I'm recommending it. This way you can get more moder
software and make sure debian suits your needs
992[08:00:59] *** Quits: sfvm (~sfvm@replaced-ip) (Quit: off to the basement, mixing up the medicine)
993[08:01:01] <somiaj> when a release happens, stable becomes
oldstable, testing becomes stable, a new testing is created (as a
copy of the old testing) and unstable is always unstable.
994[08:01:17] <Synaptic> but stretchs are stable and olstable?
995[08:01:27] <somiaj> right now stretch is stable and jessie is
oldstable
996[08:01:55] <somiaj> after busters release, stretch is
oldstable, and jessie is oldoldstable (though outside of server use,
most won't be using jessie)
997[08:02:09] <Synaptic> ok so stretch stable stretch testing
and buster unstable
1014[08:04:53] <somiaj> but yes, basically change your
sources.list to use 'buster' instead of 'stable'
(though it is always better to use codenames so it might be stretch)
1017[08:05:31] <Synaptic> i get always headache reading long
papers
1018[08:05:56] <somiaj> note that guide is covering worst case
scenerio, often times just chaging your sources and upgrading works.
But there are some best practices, and things to do to help save
things if it breaks
1019[08:06:18] <Synaptic> i installed clean stable 2 hours ago
1020[08:06:21] <somiaj> if you are okay with just reinstalling
from scratch (all your personal data is backed up) just change your
sources.list and upgrade.
1021[08:06:22] <Synaptic> almost nothing installed on it
1022[08:06:38] <somiaj> yea, then just change your sources.list
and then apt update && apt dist-upgrade
1023[08:06:49] <Synaptic> how many gb?
1024[08:06:51] <somiaj> If it breaks you can just install buster
from scratch, no loss
1025[08:06:56] <Synaptic> because i have limited internet traffic
1026[08:07:03] <somiaj> totally depends on the number of packages
you have installed.
1027[08:07:21] <somiaj> the dist-upgrade will tell you how many
gigs it has to download
1028[08:07:26] <Synaptic> lets remain on stable for the moment im
in a situation where if i loose the pc... im dead
1029[08:07:27] <Synaptic> :)
1030[08:07:35] <Synaptic> i will experiment once i wil be back
home
1031[08:07:43] <Synaptic> now im in the middle of the ocean
working
1032[08:07:55] <somiaj> Yea, always best to prepare for worse
case scenerios
1033[08:08:01] <Synaptic> true...
1034[08:08:06] <Synaptic> i will be home in 2 month
1035[08:08:15] <Synaptic> i think buster will become even more
stable
1036[08:08:34] <Synaptic> a question... who is working on that? i
mean.. people in that channel? or on the OFTC ?
1037[08:08:36] <somiaj> yea, by then buster might even be
released and offically stable.
1038[08:09:03] <somiaj> It is a combination of the release team
and the matainers of the packages that have rc-bugs in them.
1039[08:09:33] <somiaj> Some of these devs are in various
development channels on oftc, but the irc channels are mostly filled
with support volunetters such as myself.
1047[08:10:52] <Synaptic> and me breaking the balls to all of
them with my stupid questions :)
1048[08:12:06] <Synaptic> im not good reading guide.... i can
follow like STEP-guides... where i can read the actions i could do,
but im learning much faster listening experts and explaining my
needs
1049[08:12:53] <Synaptic> sometimes guides are old and not
suitable anymore for what i need
1126[08:52:49] <tdn> themill, so if I just serve the repository
via a std. httpd, git client will know how to check out and commit
via that? How to define and enforce who has read and write access to
what folders then ?
1154[09:09:27] <themill> tdn: If you do a simple http-served repo
like that, it can be cloned. You can commit to your local copy of
the repo. You can't push to the http-served repo, though, as it
is read-only. If you want to be able to push, then you need
something fancier.
1163[09:12:47] <jelly> rocketmagnet: if you have access to
oracle's downloads you can download the jdk or jre tarball
there, then use make-jpkg tool from java-package package to convert
it to an installable .deb
1193[09:27:14] <humpled> looks like it's in java-package
rocketmagnet,
1194[09:27:37] <themill> (just like jelly said)
1195[09:27:40] <jelly> rocketmagnet: I believe I said it was in
"java-package", make sure you jave contrib in sources.list
1196[09:27:47] <jelly> !contrib
1197[09:27:47] <dpkg> [contrib] Debian packages that contain
<DFSG>-compliant software, but have dependencies not in main
(possibly packaged for Debian in non-free). To get contrib packages,
add lines like "deb
replaced-url
1255[09:58:54] <afidegnum> here is my issue: I m trying to remove
the first enclosure of php file, and leave the rest out. i.e
<?php bla bla bla ?> <?php other codes .... this is what i
have come up with find . -type f -name "*.php" -exec sed
's/<?php/''/g' {} \; but it only removes
<?php
1516[12:07:50] <rocketmagnet> i downloaded the .deb file from the
oracle page and tried dpkg -i xyz-java.deb and it doesn't show
me any errors but it does not install oracle java
1517[12:07:54] <Fox> I dunno, but I wouldn't use ubuntu
software on my debian servers
1559[12:26:14] <starbuck> Will I have the same system if I
installed Debian Buster from an alpha ISO version and keep it
updated with the official repository compared to installing it after
it is released later this year? Or should I wait till release and
install a fresh system?
1560[12:26:16] <diffy> what does firejail protect
against?javascript attacks?side-channel attacks?
1573[12:34:41] <rocketmagnet> hi everyone, i've made changes
that i've not yet commited and want them to be undone and the
repo should be like the HEAD branch, how can i achieve that with git
?
1720[13:59:10] <rant> ksk: doesn't seem to be.. I removed
one of the disks, the one I had mounted to /media/HGST3TB but
I'd also stopped samba, nfs, removed it from fstab and exports
.. so idk why it'd be causing total system failure because I
removed a non-critical drive
1746[14:06:23] <aypea[1]> this is pre-profile it seems. the first
line in /etc/profile is 'if [ "`id -u`" -eq 0 ];
then' and it fails cos it cannot find 'id'
1747[14:06:53] <aypea[1]> in fact, ps auxwwe shows that the
process is started with PATH=:/bin
1748[14:07:22] *** Quits: apple123998939 (~apple1239@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1765[14:16:34] <kalsan> I'm trying to figure out why
systemctl won't let me run it as a normal user. For instance, I
cannot run systemctl --user mycommand because permissions are set to
-r-s------
1766[14:16:48] <kalsan> By permisssions I mean /bin/systemctl
1767[14:17:15] <olavx200> change permissions?
1768[14:17:39] <kalsan> Which permissions are safE?
1769[14:17:45] <ayekat> -r-s------ for /bin/systemctl seems wrong
- how did you end up with that?
1770[14:18:02] <kalsan> hahaha I never changed that :-D maybe
Buster update broke them?
1771[14:18:02] *** Quits: Guest88934 (~ina@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1772[14:18:07] <ayekat> regular -rwx-r-xr-x is fine (at least
that's the default, I think)
1830[14:39:27] <samba35> i add intel_iommu=on it
/etc/default/grub and then i update grub and reboot but when i could
not see expected outout i check with cat /proc/cmdline it show old
grub
1831[14:39:38] <samba35> any idea why ?
1832[14:39:54] *** Quits: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
1902[15:19:45] <horribleprogram> obviously I'm way too smart
to ask such a stupid question, but I'm just testing you guys.
Why does the files I create in /var/replaced-url
1936[15:25:37] <horribleprogram> ls -ld /var/replaced-url
1937[15:25:43] <dvs> horribleprogram, because the
replaced-url
1938[15:25:53] <xormor> horribleprogram, so you should use
"sudo starteditor filename" or "gksudo starteditor
filename" or "su" and then start the editor.
1939[15:25:54] <horribleprogram> doesn't say so in the dir
permissions
1940[15:26:07] <horribleprogram> xormor: sure, but that's
annoying af
1941[15:26:09] *** Quits: silicon_ (~silicon@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1948[15:27:42] <horribleprogram> it's just a basic
index.html skeleton
1949[15:27:53] <xormor> dvs, we are using the default
configuration of apache2 and debian. there the "root"
group owns all of those directories and files, /var/replaced-url
1950[15:28:05] <horribleprogram> ^
1951[15:28:24] <horribleprogram> maybe I should change those
particular directories to a new group
replaced-url
1952[15:28:26] *** Quits: P1ersson (~P1ersson@replaced-ip) (Quit: Älska inte din nästa, älska den du har)
1953[15:28:50] <horribleprogram> can a directory have more than
one group
2098[16:27:16] <horribleprogram> FinalX: this looks complicated
2099[16:27:16] <FinalX> and most webservers can deal with the
requests just fine.. plus the IP's could be different every
time.. so just blocking the IP won't really help much..
2105[16:27:48] <FinalX> personally I usually advice people the
latter of the two
2106[16:27:48] <horribleprogram> No, I take things personally, no
one messes with me.
2107[16:27:56] <horribleprogram> this guy is going down
2108[16:27:58] <FinalX> and then what? you're going to do
what exactly?
2109[16:28:17] <horribleprogram> report him to the chinese police
2110[16:28:21] <FinalX> if you attack that IP, you commit a
crime. and not just that, you will often attack an innocent
person's computer of someone that doesn't even know
they've been abused either.
2111[16:28:36] <horribleprogram> Idc there's no extradition
laws
2112[16:28:42] <Fox> you have your first vhost up for a couple of
hours and already take thnigs personnaly ? you'd better leave
internet
2113[16:28:44] <FinalX> haha, good luck on that one.. the Chinese
government is involved in espionage and these things as well
2114[16:28:56] <rany> horribleprogram, btw you can use a fail2ban
profile that reads http.log and bans too many 404 requests
2173[16:52:42] *** Quits: dadinn (~dadinn@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2174[16:52:50] <_Fremen_> Hello everyone
2175[16:52:51] *** Quits: argusbr (~tls@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2176[16:52:59] <_Fremen_> I have been thinking of migrating to
Debian KDE for a while, are there any guides that can help me make
it more user friendly? Like in the case of Manjaro KDE?
2177[16:53:09] *** Quits: chrissl (~chris@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2218[17:04:07] <_Fremen_> rany: well, You first need to change
your repo to testing from stable to get the latest KDE. then you
need to install KDE-full package to install all of KDE (just like
Manjaro maybe?) then finally, install and configure a time
machine/backup tool to protect your installation.
2228[17:06:32] *** Quits: babathreesixty (~babathree@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2229[17:07:27] <EdePopede> manjaro seems to have a different
package policy than debian. stable is "stable" because it
usually stays with the versions from the freeze stage. which of
course means that until the next release is about to reach stable
status the upstream versions of software under develpopment usually
has a clearly higher version number.
2230[17:07:37] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
2234[17:09:47] <_Fremen_> EdePopede: yeah and to be honest, I
prefer to sacrifice some stability for newer software versions.
That's why I changed it to testing after installation.
2235[17:10:09] <_Fremen_> by the way, which time machine or
system restore tool do you guys use?
2242[17:12:37] <jelly> time machine is OSX default backup tool.
2243[17:13:00] <RoyK> _Fremen_: Having worked in IT operation for
a couple of decades, I don't really agree with sacrificing
stability - but wth - if it's a simple thing and easy to
reinstall, whatever :)
2244[17:13:20] * jelly moves RoyK to Ops part of DevOps
2248[17:15:52] <jelly> _Fremen_: neither is a complete automated
system restore, but good enough for a start: dirvish (one of a dozen
rsync wrappers), restic (a bit smarter backup tool)
2263[17:20:38] <_Fremen_> EdePopede: hmm, if the same thing goes
with stability as well, I would use unstable then, instead of
testing, I will read about it later :).
2264[17:20:40] *** Quits: agowa338 (~agowa338@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2272[17:25:07] *** Quits: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2273[17:25:19] <EdePopede> having newest versions from upstream
*and* a stable system is something you can't get. testing
things is a question of time, no matter how many people are involved
in the process.
2274[17:25:25] <_Fremen_> EdePopede: in that case, I will
sacrifice some security for stability :D.
2275[17:25:51] <_Fremen_> EdePopede: yep, it is always a trade
off.
2276[17:26:02] <EdePopede> buster is about to come btw, so things
shouldn't be that bad anymore
2498[19:38:50] *** Dragone2 is now known as Dragone2|Away
2499[19:39:28] *** Quits: daniel_gc (~daniel_gc@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
2500[19:40:24] <JohnDoe2> I have a UEFI only amd64 system (hp
laptop). Installed Debian 9.9, selected to use the whole disk. Upon
install finishing, I rebooted the machine which is now displaying a
grub prompt. Am I missing something?
2546[19:57:50] <viqas> weird question - i did an apt-get upgrade
last night, it updated maria db (mysql-common
(1:10.3.15+maria~stretch) over (1:10.3.14+maria~stretch)) but now i
am facing a slowdown on my wedding site and wrath from my fiancee
2547[19:57:59] <viqas> is there a way to roll it back
2593[20:09:37] <JohnDoe2> initially it complained about 2004 not
existing, so I omitted that. Then it gave me
0002,0000,2002,3001,2001,0001 as stated. Then after -Bb 1 it made
ubuntu disappear and omitted 0001 at the end of the list.
2600[20:12:58] <JohnDoe2> well that's awkward, I'm
still getting the grub menu. I videotaped the screen to catch that
error that appears before the grub menu. it says "error: no
such device: fe44ab28-"
2601[20:13:05] *** Quits: ghoti (~paul@replaced-ip) (Read error: No route to host)
2615[20:21:55] <JohnDoe2> ok seems I was on the right path. if I
select the boot device manually, I get 2 entries for the same single
internal ssd. First one is ubuntu, second one is debian
2645[20:36:38] <rany> jhutchins, sorry if this may seem silly but
are you booting in uefi mode... usually mbr matters if you are doing
csm boot. check you bios settings
2726[21:12:28] <magic_ninja> I need to find a system-restore like
solution with a nice easy-to-manage GUI. I'm more worried about
system config getting messed up than I am losing my data.
2782[21:39:25] <jhutchins> Actually on the device now. fdisk
shows a gpt partition table. BIOS is set to boot in legacy mode. If
I switch to UEFI it says no bootable device.
2783[21:39:43] <jhutchins> fdisk does not appear to have the
option to mark a boot flag in gpt.
2784[21:40:13] *** Joins: hele (~hele@replaced-ip)
2793[21:43:23] <rant> jmcnaught: I removed one of two disks I had
on a USB dock I was using for file sharing.. the /media/HGST3TB, I
had stopped nfs, samba, did swapoff on the swapfile that was on the
disk, moved all the data from it to the other drive, removed it from
fstab and exports, and did exportfs -a and unmounted the disk
2794[21:43:25] *** Quits: banisterfiend (~textual@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2796[21:44:14] <jhutchins> It appears that the efi partition is
correctly the one with the boot flag.
2797[21:44:26] <rant> if this was the cause, systemd is total
shit.. I went through every process of properly removing a
non-essential disk and now the entire system is broken
2804[21:47:41] <rant> jhutchins: there is nothing to argue with
this.. if in fact removing a USB media from /media caused the ENTIRE
SYSTEM to fail, its shit.
2805[21:47:51] <jmcnaught> rant: which Debian suite is it?
2806[21:47:58] <jhutchins> rant: It's likely grub is the
culprit, not systemd.
2807[21:48:00] <rant> I'm still not convinced it is the
cause
2809[21:48:13] <rant> I dont see how grub has anything to do with
this
2810[21:48:20] <rant> the system has been up over two months
2811[21:48:28] <rant> the issue just occured within the last week
2812[21:48:35] *** Quits: dr_gonzo (~dr_gonzo_@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2813[21:48:44] <rant> jmcnaught: it is running buster amd64
2814[21:48:49] <jmcnaught> maybe ask in #systemd, they might have
seen that 'Failed to set invocation ID for unit: File
exists' error before
2815[21:49:52] <jhutchins> rant: Have you commented out any nfs
mounts in your fstab (assuming you're not automounting)?
2816[21:49:55] <rant> I googled the crap out of that error got
nowhere. I think this is related to dependencies.. some domino fell
and then they all fell
2819[21:51:31] <rant> jhutchins: as I said, and my history
reflects, when I removed that disk, I did swapoff
/media/HGST3TB/swap, commented out the lines for that disk in
exports and fstab, did the exportfs -a, stopped nfs and samba,
changed all samba entries to point to the new locations on
/media/WL3TB and then unmounted the disk
2823[21:53:10] *** Quits: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2824[21:53:18] <jhutchins> rant: I repeat my question. Have you
disabled all network filesystem mounts?
2825[21:53:34] <jhutchins> rant: Also, which release and kernel
are you on?
2826[21:54:09] <rant> jhutchins: I'm not going to repeat my
answer.. cause its obvious from looking at the log, samba, nfs, and
everything else can't start.. and I already said I stopped them
and redid their configs
2829[21:54:43] <rant> its the stock buster kernel 4.19.0-2-amd64
2830[21:54:52] <jhutchins> Well, there you go.
2831[21:54:59] <jhutchins> !debian-next
2832[21:54:59] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for
testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not*
on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is
invite only)." it means you did not read it's on
irc.oftc.net.
2833[21:55:30] <jhutchins> It's fairly likely to be kernel
related.
2838[21:56:41] <jhutchins> rant: "I redid the configs"
does not directly answer what I asked. It appears to be attempting
to mount network filesystems.
2839[21:56:59] <jhutchins> rant: You appear more interested in
complaining than in solving the problem though, so I'm done.
2840[21:58:09] *** Quits: pringau (~pringau@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2844[22:00:47] <rant> thats not complaining thats restating the
obvious.. I said multiple times I shut them down and changed their
configs and I already showed they wont restart
2845[22:01:08] <rant> so if you know how something can be
mounting shares when its not running, then you know something I dont
2846[22:02:30] <rant> I'll ask again later in #debian-next
and #systemd since this is obviously beyond our scope..
2847[22:04:23] <somiaj> jhutchins: I think efi partitions might
need more than a 'boot flag', for a GPT partition table
esp flag/efi flag as well.
2897[22:32:37] <somiaj> jhutchins: maybe its an issue with your
firmware, I know some uefi firmware is buggy.
2898[22:32:59] <somiaj> or check your firmware configuration. It
seems your firmware is catching something that makes it think it
can't boot, but then boots anyways.
2899[22:33:54] <jhutchins> I messed with it a bit, toggled
non-existant boot devices, didn't get anywhere.
2900[22:34:15] *** Quits: acitripper (~acidtripp@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2901[22:34:19] <jhutchins> I have yet to build a successful EFI
Debian.
2902[22:34:40] <somiaj> is this on multiple machines/firmware, or
just this one?
2911[22:35:26] <somiaj> for me, provided I boot the installer in
EFI mode, it 'just works'.
2912[22:35:32] <jhutchins> This particular symptom just one Del
Lattitude 6430u
2913[22:35:41] <somiaj> on my desktop I converted from legacy to
efi took me a bit of fiddiling around though.
2914[22:36:01] <somiaj> Hmm, I've installed UEFI just fine
on multiple dell machiens at work, 2 desktops and 2 laptops
2915[22:36:32] <somiaj> works just fine on my lattidue 3380 here.
2916[22:37:33] <jhutchins> When buster comes out I'll do a
clean install, see how it goes from scratch.
2917[22:37:56] <jhutchins> Basically all I use this for is
browser and ssh.
2918[22:38:19] *** Quits: we6jbo (~we6jbo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2919[22:38:51] <jhutchins> I only boot it for new kernels (or
messing with EFI), so having to hit a key to boot is not a big deal.
2920[22:40:55] *** Quits: forgotmynick (uid24625@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2921[22:41:01] <jhutchins> I wonder if VMWare offers an EFI boot
mode...
2922[22:41:44] <somiaj> even qemu does
2923[22:42:05] <somiaj> though I think you need some sort of uefi
virtual firmware for this, and on my vms I don't have it
installed, but I see the option in virt-manager
2966[23:05:45] <Synaptic> When buster will become the new stable,
(in the next few months), me, that im running on the current
stretch, in order to update to the new stable, i will just need to
use "apt update" ?
2969[23:07:03] <Nickholas_The_Ga> hi all. i'm having
problems with my personal assistant, Debbie. I keep telling her that
I need to google maps a place to eat, but I'm getting all of
these errors about cores fragmented and misplaced memory files, as
well as a fault in ultra threading. should I just recap my mobo?
i'm afraid that might melt the blast processing emulation chip.
does
2970[23:07:04] <Nickholas_The_Ga> anyone have any experience in
this? is it safe? help appreciated, thanks :)
2982[23:09:53] <Nickholas_The_Ga> does anyone here know how to
help me out with this?
2983[23:10:06] <somiaj> well you should have 'stretch'
in your sources, and need to change it to 'buster'. If you
have 'stable' in your sources, that is not recommended at
all.
2984[23:10:06] <Synaptic> Nickholas_The_Ga, if they know they
will read and they will reply to you
2990[23:11:14] <somiaj> if you see lots of errors about bad cores
in 'dmesg' you may just have a bad cpu/mobo.
2991[23:11:36] <Synaptic> somiaj, those are my current sources
replaced-url
2992[23:12:00] <Nickholas_The_Ga> i tried that on my windows
command prompt, but it gave me an error, sorry. I'll see about
replacing the blast processor chip tomorrow.
2994[23:13:06] <somiaj> Synaptic: Yea those are good sources,
you'll have to change stretch to buster before you upgrade.
This is what you want, as you should only dot he upgrade when you
have the time to do it right (and be prepared for the case it breaks
-- usually it doesn't but it can)
3010[23:18:43] <trCody> hello community, i'm on debian 9
since some time and i'm thinking about deb sid (testing) as
main os.. someone doing this and have some experience in this? like
how often does it crash? is it usefull as a main os? vanishing
programms? etc
3012[23:18:59] <Nickholas_The_Ga> Synaptic, every time i look at
you, i fail to comprehend how a neanderthal like you could have even
a single synapse fire any minute. if yuou open your fucking mouth
one more time, I will shit directly into it. I will cum straight to
your house and remove the blast processing unit straight from your
frame.
3013[23:19:26] <trCody> some content would be nice
3030[23:21:38] <somiaj> trCody: if you run sid, packages in sid
will break. Many use it as their main desktop just fine. But one
should knwo debian well to do this, and one should expect that they
spend time fixing their computer instead of using their computer.
3031[23:22:06] <somiaj> trCody: if, when, how it breaks always
changes. Sometimes the fixes are easy, others they are not.
3039[23:26:56] <ganoush> that was the end of the experiment,
fallen back to stable ever since, sometimes with backports
3040[23:27:05] <hypn0> there are sid based distros - vsido, etc
3041[23:27:05] <somiaj> trCody: what info do you want, you can
look up the freeze schedule, but testing right now is close to
stable, and the only changes are going to be mostly rc bug fixes. So
if you want something with newer software than stretch, but
don't want to wait for buster's relase, running it right
now will mostly be just fine, minus timely security fixes.
3058[23:29:40] <somiaj> Synaptic: be hard to list all the
differences, there have been lots of major software transitions
since stretch was released into buster.
3059[23:29:58] <annadane> Synaptic, if you just need bluetooth to
work you can try the kernel from stretch-backports
3073[23:34:44] <hypn0> you might need to install something
3074[23:35:31] <somiaj> Synaptic: try to see why it is not beign
detected (make sure it isn't a firmware issue, which might be
fixable on stretch)
3075[23:35:33] *** Quits: Nevermin_ (~Nevermind@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3076[23:35:57] <Synaptic> the problem is that i cannpot find
proper guide for my card
3077[23:36:02] <somiaj> Synaptic: but in general almost all
drivers are included in the linux kernel, installing the 4.19 kernel
from stretch-backports will see if the kernel supports that
hardware. If it doesn't, it won't in buster either.
3078[23:36:10] <Synaptic> for debian, found something for mint,
but i dont want to mess with it
3084[23:39:50] <somiaj> I don't know, look it up. But trying
a backports kernel isn't that hard and will quickly tell you if
it supports the hardware or not
3085[23:40:01] <raidghost> I wonder why i getting "Multicore
Par2 Not available" when its allready installed
3087[23:40:36] *** Quits: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3088[23:40:42] <Synaptic> somiaj, somebody told me to avoid to
backport too much.... but you can tell me way to do it?
3089[23:41:40] <somiaj> well one should only use backports for
software one needs (not just blinding install stuff from there
because it is newer). In this case a newer kenrel is something you
may need for that hardware
3090[23:41:56] <somiaj> also kernesl are quite standalone
packages, not much issue in getting one from stretch backports
3091[23:41:57] <ganoush> apt pinning
3092[23:42:00] <somiaj> !stretc-backports
3093[23:42:00] <Synaptic> 4.15 has last mint
3094[23:42:04] <somiaj> !stretch-backports
3095[23:42:05] <dpkg> Some packages intended for Buster (Debian
10) but recompiled for use with Stretch (Debian 9) can be found in
the stretch-backports repository. See
replaced-url
3096[23:42:44] <somiaj> Synaptic: go follow those instructions,
once you have the stretch-backports sources added, apt update, then
apt -t stretch-backports install linux-image-amd64
linux-headers-amd64
3097[23:43:03] <Synaptic> k
3098[23:43:21] <Synaptic> strwetch wich kernel it is?
3099[23:43:25] <Synaptic> stretch*
3100[23:43:49] *** Ametrine is now known as Butt3rfly
3101[23:44:19] <Synaptic> i will try that anywy
3102[23:44:39] <hypn0> I got 4.14.x
3103[23:45:06] <jhutchins> Synaptic: Is your PA software
something from debian?
3104[23:45:28] <jhutchins> ,kernels
3105[23:45:29] <somiaj> Synaptic: that will pull in the latest
stretch-backports kernel which is 4.19
3134[23:48:26] <somiaj> velix: I thought they served similar
purpose, of manging source installs in /usr/local
3135[23:48:27] <Synaptic> somiaj, after put source backports and
install it, i need to remove that source? or keep it there?
3136[23:48:44] <velix> somiaj: checkinstall is creating deb
files.
3137[23:48:55] <somiaj> Synaptic: the source is setup safely that
it can stay there. Note the command I gave you to isntall from it
had a -t stretch-backports in it. Packages will only be installed
from there if you explicity ask
3138[23:48:57] <velix> somiaj: So you can distribute it to other
computers.
3139[23:49:10] <Synaptic> ok
3140[23:49:24] <jhutchins> Synaptic: No harm in leaving it there,
you will get updates to only packages installed from backports (from
backports).
3141[23:49:29] <velix> somiaj & jhutchins: I'm really in
a small shock... checkinstall is damn useful.
3149[23:50:30] <jhutchins> velix: I hadn't seen your
(correct) syntax for the query. I can never remember it.
3150[23:51:04] <velix> jhutchins: Hehe, no problem. You've
helped me.
3151[23:51:31] <velix> Seems like checkinstall won't make it
in final release, since it's frozen?
3152[23:51:50] <velix> Just used the one from sid, works on
buster.
3153[23:51:50] <somiaj> velix: check that bug report I linked, if
you can fix that bug maybe it will be added. It also may appear in
buster-backports after the release.
3154[23:52:06] <jhutchins> Yeah, what somiaj said.
3155[23:52:11] <velix> somiaj: yeah, this might confuse many
users :/
3156[23:52:36] <somiaj> hmm, wonder why they didn't try to
fix it, says it was fixed upstream. Maybe the matainer didn't
have time to get a new package in before the freeze (That is an
older bug)
3163[23:54:43] <somiaj> yea, the fact that the bug report had no
reply, seems the matainer doesn't consider this a priority for
debian. There hasn't been any updates to check install since
2013
3169[23:56:46] <somiaj> velix: yea, just looks like no one is
using it much anymore, last major release was 2013, there have been
some bug fixes, but I think due to limited upstream support they
just removed it (maybe in favor of newer tools which you may want to
look into). If what you want is to nicely make .debs from source,
debian helper has improved a lot.
3170[23:57:15] <somiaj> On the webpage, last new istem was 2011
3171[23:57:31] <somiaj> and 1.6.2 (version in strech) was
released in 2009
3172[23:57:37] *** Quits: timahvo1 (~rogue@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3173[23:57:52] *** Quits: BlueByte (~walther@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
3174[23:58:07] <velix> somiaj: perhaps there's an
alternative I don't know. Thanks for investigating it