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• 4[00:00:25] <altker128> blackflow: I Believe the LXC mount shared solution will let me do what I want ; create a folder on the host machine, and then each container that needs access can mount it. Sharing it via SMB && using the same UIDs/GIDs should mean nothing gets jacked up
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• 18[00:07:09] <blackflow> altker128: yup.
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• 32[00:13:23] <altker128> blackflow: Have you worked with Samba server authenticating via LDAP?
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• 36[00:16:07] <rwp> FreeSpencer, snapshot doesn't seem to be hard down. Perhaps it is getting a DDOS attack against it? Maybe. Feels a little like it. In which case perhaps retrying significantly might get you the older version you are wanting?
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• 38[00:17:12] <rwp> FreeSpencer, Also let's not forget about replaced-url
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• 45[00:23:09] <blackflow> altker128: nope, sorry
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• 58[00:36:48] <m_g_lewis> I installed Debian 9 and it detects Windows 10 as Windows Vista while installing the GRUB boot loader...Is this normal? Will it still boot Windows 10 if I install GRUB to the MBR of the first HDD?
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• 61[00:38:53] <rant> m_g_lewis: grub cant and won't boot either, it merely chainloads NTLDR which is on the same partition as windows, so..
• 62[00:39:33] <rant> but feel free to wait for another response, as I dont use Win10.. haven't touched windows in ages and never plan to again
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• 69[00:44:30] <whislock> m_g_lewis: Windows 10 uses UEFI by default. Have you manually installed Windows 10 to use MBR?
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• 79[00:51:00] <jak2020> hi all, how to
• 80[00:51:09] *** Quits: skinhaptik (~skinhapti@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 81[00:51:12] <jak2020> disable startup on graphical mode?
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• 84[00:52:10] <whislock> jak2020: Which Debian release are you on?
• 85[00:52:31] *** Joins: slv (~slv@replaced-ip)
• 86[00:53:20] <nkuttler> !nodm
• 87[00:53:20] <dpkg> In systemd, "systemctl set-default multi-user.target", or remove the DM package(s) with "aptitude remove gdm3 kdm lightdm lxdm nodm sddm slim wdm xdm". "echo false >/etc/X11/default-display-manager" will also disable the DM, or just hit ctrl-alt-fN to get to a console. nodm is the name of a minimal/automatic display manager (replaced-url
• 88[00:53:34] <jak2020> stretch (lastest)
• 89[00:53:52] <whislock> jak2020: See the tip that nkuttler showed.
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• 91[00:54:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1428
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• 95[00:55:14] <jak2020> ok
• 96[00:55:21] <nrtriana> Hello
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• 98[00:55:46] <nrtriana> Greetings from Cuba to all #Debian community.
• 99[00:55:52] <Sveta> o/
• 100[00:56:03] <skinhaptik> Greetings from Australia
• 101[00:56:28] <jak2020> the best country: Mexico!!! grettings and Merry Xmas
• 102[00:56:38] <nrtriana> Thanks skinhaptik:!
• 103[00:57:13] <nrtriana> Have you installed the new Linux Kernel 4.20?
• 104[00:57:15] *** Joins: seekr (~seekr@replaced-ip)
• 105[00:57:43] <skinhaptik> I'm not sure what my kernal is at right now
• 106[00:57:44] <nrtriana> I just installed in my Debian box
• 107[00:57:58] <nrtriana> It´s amazing.
• 108[00:58:10] <skinhaptik> says I'm at 4.9.0
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• 110[00:58:31] <skinhaptik> 4.2 isn't new at all man
• 111[00:58:43] <whislock> 4.2 != 4.20.
• 112[00:58:58] <whislock> nrtriana: One assumes you compiled it manually.
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• 114[00:59:22] <nrtriana> Yeah whislock
• 115[00:59:23] <skinhaptik> what's the difference?
• 116[00:59:35] <skinhaptik> How is 4.20 newer than 4.9.0?
• 117[00:59:36] <whislock> skinhaptik: One came after 4.1, and the other came after 4.19.
• 118[01:00:05] <skinhaptik> This is oh so confusing but I'm sure you guys are right
• 119[01:00:06] <nrtriana> Yeah skinhaptik the prior stable was 4.19.10
• 120[01:00:12] <whislock> nrtriana: You do understand the disadvantages of running a custom-compiled kernel, yes?
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• 123[01:00:29] <whislock> skinhaptik: replaced-url
• 124[01:00:49] <skinhaptik> whislock: thanks
• 125[01:01:08] <nrtriana> Well whislock itś working ¨fast and furious¨!
• 126[01:01:16] <whislock> nrtriana: That wasn't the question.
• 127[01:01:49] <skinhaptik> I get it now - I was thinking it was like 4.2 not 4 point twenty
• 128[01:02:09] <nrtriana> So far I have not presented any problem whislock:
• 129[01:02:34] <skinhaptik> What are you guys running on? Debian stable is still on 4.9 right?
• 130[01:02:47] <nrtriana> Now the performance of all my machines are better...
• 131[01:02:54] <skinhaptik> unstable must be 4.20
• 132[01:02:54] <whislock> skinhaptik: Yes. And running a custom-compiled kernel without an INCREDIBLY good reason to do so is a very bad idea.
• 133[01:03:01] <whislock> sid is actually on 4.19, still.
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• 135[01:03:10] <nrtriana> 4.20 it´s stable\
• 136[01:03:20] <whislock> Not in Debian, it isn't.
• 137[01:03:23] *** Quits: pvdp (~pvdp@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 138[01:03:29] <skinhaptik> whislock: does not sound like the debain way
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• 142[01:03:51] <skinhaptik> is 4.2 even in any debian repos?
• 143[01:03:52] <whislock> nrtriana: So, the downsides: You get zero security support. You get zero support in case you run into any issues, packages or otherwise, related to running a custom kernel. etc.
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• 146[01:03:59] <whislock> skinhaptik: What doesn't sound like the Debian way?
• 147[01:04:12] <nrtriana> You can make deb-pkg
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• 150[01:04:35] <whislock> That doesn't mean you get security updates for it, etc.
• 151[01:04:35] <whislock> And making something into a package doesn't magically make it supported.
• 152[01:04:37] <skinhaptik> whislock: putting a custom kernel in or just making debian unstable in a drastic way. Debian is all about stability
• 153[01:04:45] <whislock> skinhaptik: Correct.
• 154[01:04:57] *** Quits: tradar (~tradar@replaced-ip) (Quit: tradar)
• 155[01:05:03] <nrtriana> Yeah I know whislock...
• 156[01:05:03] <whislock> Building a custom kernel because "faster" isn't going to turn out well.
• 157[01:05:05] *** Joins: whira_ (~whira@replaced-ip)
• 158[01:05:10] <skinhaptik> I guess if you want a more unstable distro arch is where it's at
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• 160[01:05:38] <whislock> stretch-backports has 4.18, and that, at least, is supported.
• 161[01:06:04] <nrtriana> whislock it´s working very, very well
• 162[01:06:21] <skinhaptik> Yeah I guess you can do it, it's just not recommended
• 163[01:06:36] *** Quits: tagomago (~tagomago@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 164[01:06:38] <skinhaptik> Linux 5 is coming out next year I hear
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• 166[01:06:52] <whislock> nrtriana: For this moment.
• 167[01:06:53] <skinhaptik> Debian won't be on that until probs 11 lol
• 168[01:07:13] <whislock> nrtriana: And that's the point you seem to be missing, here. There are things to be considered beyond "it works right now."
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• 170[01:07:36] <skinhaptik> whislock: unless of course he is distro hopping
• 171[01:07:49] <whislock> Not really relevant to the kernel you're running in Debian.
• 172[01:08:04] <skinhaptik> whislock: but for a stable long term system, sounds like a disaster
• 173[01:08:08] <nrtriana> 4.20 was launched after an exhaustive quality tests...
• 174[01:08:08] <whislock> Yup.
• 175[01:08:12] <skinhaptik> especially if it's self compiled
• 176[01:08:15] <whislock> nrtriana: So?
• 177[01:08:25] *** Quits: whira (~whira@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
• 178[01:09:50] <joepublic> quality tests? 4.20 was launched because they are on a timed release schedule and nobody could point to a specific reason why not. The "quality test" is "eh, it compiled successfully as-is"
• 179[01:10:07] <whislock> Heh, there's that, too.
• 180[01:10:23] <joepublic> I compile and run the kernel-of-the-week on my workstation, use supported distribution kernels on my servers.
• 181[01:10:29] <nrtriana> So you can use without fear whislock... of course I recommend you keep your dist kernel just in case something goes wrong.
• 182[01:10:41] <whislock> nrtriana: You -really- don't get the point. o.O
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• 184[01:11:49] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: why not just run something like arch instead?
• 185[01:12:01] <skinhaptik> arch is unstable but it would probably be more stable than ur system right now
• 186[01:12:28] <nrtriana> I don´t like arch
• 187[01:12:37] <whislock> 1. Very little quality control goes into mainline releases. 2. There is no guarantee that your new kernel version won't cause issues with the rest of the system/package tree. 3. You don't get security updates for your new kernel. At all.
• 188[01:12:43] <Mathisen> would replaced-url
• 189[01:12:51] <nrtriana> My system are very stable right now.
• 190[01:13:07] <whislock> nrtriana: "stable right now" is an oxymoron.
• 191[01:13:15] <whislock> Stability refers to availability over time.
• 192[01:13:26] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: well there must be other kind of rolling release distros other than arch though like void
• 193[01:13:30] <whislock> "Functional right now" might be a better phrase. For most of us, stability matters.
• 194[01:13:44] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: lol your system is not stable at all homey
• 195[01:13:44] <spidget> there's stability as in "won't crash all the time" and there's stability as in "will carry on working in the same exact way I expect"
• 196[01:14:04] <joepublic> if you start compiling your own kernels, your security support system is you, compiling your own kernel every time there's an update. it works if "the latest kernel" is your objective, for a reason such as "need newest driver for (whatever)" or "need kernel feature added in version (whatever)"
• 197[01:14:05] <nrtriana> Ok whislock
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• 200[01:14:30] <joepublic> but it makes certain people very unhappy as you can see.
• 201[01:14:40] <whislock> A bad reason for a new kernel is "i want go fast."
• 202[01:14:42] <whislock> !snss
• 203[01:14:42] <dpkg> Shiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time something new is released. If you have SNS, ask me about <backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>.
• 204[01:15:21] <skinhaptik> debian is all about not shiny new stuff syndrome
• 205[01:15:28] <whislock> joepublic: Yeah, because absent the specific use cases you've specified, running your own kernel is just plain stupid. Running out and telling other people to do the same is actively harmful.
• 206[01:15:35] <jasabella> i ran arch for a while but came back to debian, the package management is more curated and refined imho :) the packages in a release will play nicely together without issues such as "dll hell"
• 207[01:15:37] <skinhaptik> shiny new stuff sydrome is an unstable system
• 208[01:16:04] <joepublic> absent specific use cases, compiling your own kernel is educational and a great way to learn why or why not to do it. take a deep breath.
• 209[01:16:04] <nrtriana> Ok I will report about functionality and stability of my computer in three months
• 210[01:16:08] <ectospasm> I run Arch and Debian. Each has their strengths.
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• 212[01:16:17] <nrtriana> :-D
• 213[01:16:21] *** Joins: devbaka (~devbaka@replaced-ip)
• 214[01:16:38] <whislock> nrtriana: You'll be on a different kernel in three months. Won't really matter.
• 215[01:16:41] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: well with your system it may simply stop working within a day and then you may be done for
• 216[01:17:04] <spidget> it feels like it's a culture that's dying though. look at web development and it's releases measure in hz, swift with it's "we break all your code on every release"
• 217[01:17:11] <skinhaptik> ectospasm: agreed. I only run debian though
• 218[01:17:29] <whislock> If you want SNS, go run a distro that gives you SNS, and all of the fun times that come with it.
• 219[01:17:49] <skinhaptik> and the plus side is you will actually get support for your love for SNS
• 220[01:17:54] *** Quits: lead_pipe23 (~Lead@replaced-ip) (Quit: Bye)
• 221[01:18:01] <nrtriana> I hope that's not happen skinhaptik
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• 223[01:18:14] <ectospasm> Actually, I did my due diligence in research on Arch, and it has been quite stable. No less stable than Debian, but this is just anecdotal.
• 224[01:18:14] <skinhaptik> Arch linux has a huge community and a big wiki for help
• 225[01:18:33] <ectospasm> Yeah, that's what drew me to it.
• 226[01:18:35] <skinhaptik> I really do like the appeal of arch of a very minimal system
• 227[01:18:36] <joepublic> nrtriana, if it does, just boot into your older distribution kernel. these guys will find a new target for monomania by then.
• 228[01:18:37] <whislock> ectospasm: Sure, and I run Arch on a few things that I don't consider critical.
• 229[01:19:27] <Mathisen> arch works nice for desktop but i would never ever use it for anything server related
• 230[01:19:29] <nrtriana> Yeah joepublic I´m not crazy to leave the new kernel alone.
• 231[01:19:37] <spidget> stable in the sense of not crashing ectospasm maybe. not stable in the sense of things shuffling under your feet though, right? applications change, options appear and disapear, libraries change versions and code needs updating. configs update and break?
• 232[01:19:44] <jasabella> spidget… but software you build has different concerns from platform that you're building on top of, you dont necessarily want to build on sand!
• 233[01:19:56] <skinhaptik> I think I'd probably be running parabola now if the setup was easy with an encrypted drive. But also I don't want to occasionally be fixing my system if debian won't require any fixing
• 234[01:20:07] <ectospasm> Mathisen: Agreed. Except I use Arch for a plexmediaserver, and all the sundry trimmings (rip/encode, etc.)
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• 236[01:20:19] <watchcat> /topic
• 237[01:20:37] <ectospasm> /join #debian-offtopic
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• 241[01:25:04] <nrtriana> For now I can say that the new kernel make faster my computers... that's my first impression.
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• 245[01:25:57] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: well if speed is your only concern, then you're doing good. But for a stable system, unlikely
• 246[01:26:30] <whislock> Or security. Or compatibility. Or supportability.
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• 249[01:26:59] <nrtriana> I have old computers skinhaptik speed it´s crutial for me.
• 250[01:27:43] <n4dir> i would assume that the gui and the programs matter more than the kernel.
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• 253[01:28:57] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: well doesn't speed come a lot from DE/WM choice?
• 254[01:29:09] <nrtriana> Sorry for my grammar please
• 255[01:29:10] <skinhaptik> Why not use something lightweight like i3 or xfce
• 256[01:29:39] <skinhaptik> all good man
• 257[01:30:43] <nrtriana> English it's not my native language.
• 258[01:30:50] <skinhaptik> what desktop environment are you using?
• 259[01:31:05] <nrtriana> Cinnamon
• 260[01:31:08] <Sveta> It's important to choose a DE that you are comfortable programming for, and also that you don't use external (not-for-this-de) apps on.
• 261[01:31:13] <Sveta> For me, anyway.
• 262[01:31:31] <skinhaptik> sveta: well not everyone is programming on their system
• 263[01:31:47] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: try using something lighter like xfce4 or i3
• 264[01:31:56] <Sveta> Then pick your thing, like "a DE you are comfortable translating for" or "a DE you are comfortable reporting bugs for".
• 265[01:31:59] <skinhaptik> Then you should be able to run a stable debian system without the flaws
• 266[01:32:13] <n4dir> Sveta: well, or simply "comfortable using"
• 267[01:32:21] <skinhaptik> n4dir: yes exactly
• 268[01:32:26] <Sveta> n4dir: yes - comfortable using without not-for-this-DE apps.
• 269[01:32:42] <skinhaptik> I really like the minimalism of i3 tbh, I've tried most DEs though
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• 272[01:33:51] <joepublic> if you are using old slow computers, cinnamon may be too large and slow compared to other graphical environments.
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• 275[01:34:05] <nrtriana> I feel comfortable with my desktop.
• 276[01:34:12] <skinhaptik> joepublic: isn't cinnamon quite light weight though?
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• 278[01:34:30] <jasabella> is it me or do you really need a decent resolution screen to use a tiling wm most effectively?
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• 280[01:34:31] <joepublic> it's certainly lighter than the gnome3 on which it's based.
• 281[01:34:38] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: was it comfortable before the kernal update?
• 282[01:34:42] <n4dir> i never saw a big difference between xfce and any window-manager on my old hardware. imho it is a good choice (if that is the problem)
• 283[01:35:00] <skinhaptik> jasabella: nah I have a small screen on a thinkpad x200s and it works just fine for me
• 284[01:35:07] <nrtriana> Yeah skinhaptik, work faster...
• 285[01:35:30] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: did it work well at a slower speed before though>
• 286[01:35:32] <skinhaptik> ?*
• 287[01:35:37] <joepublic> I use xfce on older computers and find it the perfect balance of features I expect, and resouce-lightness. highly personal choice, I admit, but I tried many others before settling on xfce.
• 288[01:35:51] <jasabella> tile a few terms and i run out of width
• 289[01:35:52] <SerajewelKS> jasabella: depends what software you're running. lowering the system font size can be beneficial.
• 290[01:36:07] <jasabella> yeah
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• 292[01:36:14] <n4dir> joepublic: as said, same here ( i switched to window-managers, but i wouldn't hesitate to use xfce instead)
• 293[01:36:17] <nrtriana> skinhaptik now the desktop work more faster whit the new kernel.
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• 296[01:36:56] <nrtriana> with
• 297[01:37:10] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: well it's highly advised against what you're doing for stability. I recommend installing the old kernal again and trying something like xfce4 instead
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• 299[01:38:05] <joepublic> A few more times and you will have hit the magic 100 times to say the same thing. Dude don't use unsupported packages! Your computer will explode!
• 300[01:38:16] <skinhaptik> n4dir: yeah des work well too, I just prefer the minimal thing with wms. I'm probably just as productive with both
• 301[01:38:26] <jasabella> xfce4 is awesome
• 302[01:38:27] *** Quits: BrianG61UK (~BrianG61U@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 303[01:38:37] <nrtriana> skinhaptik the old kernel is still on the system.
• 304[01:38:44] <n4dir> but that name was already taken ? skinhaptik
• 305[01:38:47] <n4dir> :-)
• 306[01:38:48] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: your computer is a ticking time bomb, it's gonna blow man!
• 307[01:39:16] <skinhaptik> n4dir: what name was already taken? what>
• 308[01:39:17] <nrtriana> Well I hope not
• 309[01:39:31] <n4dir> skinhaptik: awesome. just a silly joke. late at night, i am getting foolish
• 310[01:39:41] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: Debian is not supposed to be an up to date distro
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• 312[01:39:54] <skinhaptik> n4dir: lol all good homey
• 313[01:40:07] <skinhaptik> n4dir: it's still morning for me
• 314[01:40:48] <nrtriana> Well skinhaptik for now I feel that´s a better machine.
• 315[01:40:56] *** Quits: pingfloyd (~pingfloyd@replaced-ip) (Quit: ☮ out)
• 316[01:41:09] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: but it's not. it may feel better, but your chances of it breaking is high
• 317[01:41:11] <joepublic> nrtriana, I do not think you are going to be able to explain that to everyone here.
• 318[01:41:32] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: just because something feels good doesn't mean it is
• 319[01:41:51] * watchcat watches nrtriana calmly deflect ocd
• 320[01:42:09] <nrtriana> I see joepublic, I see
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• 322[01:42:49] <skinhaptik> we are not getting anywhere with this. just keep running your system but you have been warned
• 323[01:43:21] <joepublic> I run a new kernel, hand-compiled. You run a new kernel, hand-compiled. That makes many people uncomfortable, and they perhaps feel threatened because we are responsible for our own actions. I don't know why.
• 324[01:43:25] <nrtriana> I have been warned skinhaptik
• 325[01:43:54] <jasabella> (or we dont have time)
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• 327[01:44:12] <skinhaptik> joepublic: nah it's fine you can do that - it's just not recommended. The main point is debian is all about stability, but the great thing with linux in general is there truly are no limits. do whatever you want
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• 332[01:44:44] <skinhaptik> I think it's just important to warn about these things, and discuss the risks involved
• 333[01:44:59] <joepublic> skinhaptik, 45 minutes ago you didn't even know what 4.20 was nor what kernel version you had. Don't try to impress the natives.
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• 336[01:46:36] <skinhaptik> joepublic: this is true, I am not an experienced linux user. I know enough about software engineering to know that the kernal is the lowest level of software on a device. It's important and if you fuck that up it can effect the whole system upward from there
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• 338[01:47:08] <themill> learning that it's "kernel" would be a good next step, then
• 339[01:47:40] <skinhaptik> oh yeah I was actually refering to a kernal not a kernel /s
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• 341[01:48:25] <nrtriana> skinhaptik but in linux you can have how many kernels installed as you wants
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• 343[01:48:43] <cryptodan_mobile> And here it is I thought firmware like bios was yue lowest level software on a device
• 344[01:48:54] <nrtriana> a kernel panic for example is not the end of the world!
• 345[01:49:22] <skinhaptik> cryptodan_mobile: well it's one of the lowest. Truly the lowest is binary
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• 349[01:49:38] <themill> skinhaptik: I think you should take a break now...
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• 351[01:49:42] <joepublic> A kernel panic is the end of the _uptime_
• 352[01:50:05] <nrtriana> If the the new kernel fails I throw it away and start with another.
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• 354[01:50:42] <annadane> panic! at the disco
• 355[01:50:45] <jasabella> if you want to talk bleeding edge, there are people out there who are blurring the line between kernel and user space with unikernels
• 356[01:51:06] <skinhaptik> themill: what I don't get how I am wrong in this?
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• 358[01:51:24] <nrtriana> My computers are not in a nuclear power stations
• 359[01:51:37] <joepublic> Cuba has nuclear power stations?
• 360[01:51:41] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: does kernel really work like that? can't you break a system that way?
• 361[01:51:54] <joepublic> no lo sabía
• 362[01:51:59] <nrtriana> LOL joepublic
• 363[01:52:00] <skinhaptik> nrtriana: yeah that's why it's not a big deal and I'm simply just not recommending it. If it breaks down and you are okay with this sure
• 364[01:52:18] <nrtriana> No, joe no hay centrales nucleares aquí.
• 365[01:52:31] <joepublic> skinhaptik, I do not know how old you are, so I do not know if you know what "a broken record" sounds like, and why
• 366[01:52:40] <nrtriana> Se intentó construir una, pero fue solo eso... un intento.
• 367[01:52:50] <joepublic> There is a nuclear power plant a few miles from here.
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• 374[01:55:53] <nrtriana> joepublic don´t use the new kernel in your nuclear power plant LOL
• 375[01:55:54] <rant> any thoughts on a thumbdrive only being accessible even by dd as read-only? [ 3.866004] sd 10:0:0:0: [sdb] Write Protect is on [ 3.866007] sd 10:0:0:0: [sdb] Mode Sense: 23 00 80 00 [ 3.866662] sd 10:0:0:0: [sdb] No Caching mode page found
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• 378[01:57:15] <blackflow> rant: no write protect switch?
• 379[01:57:17] <jasabella> no physical toggle on the thumbdrive? what's the filesystem?
• 380[01:57:59] <nrtriana> replaced-url
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• 385[01:58:54] <nrtriana> LOL
• 386[01:59:28] *** Quits: chalcedony (~chalcedon@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
• 387[01:59:54] <jasabella> ahhh you can mark a partition as RO in GPT
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• 391[02:00:48] <nrtriana> 1. If the drive appears to be write-protected, start by inserting the drive into another computer to isolate the cause of the issue.
• 392[02:00:54] <joepublic> looks like above, sdb is write protected, and not that sdb has a GPT with a partition such as sdb1 write-protected?
• 393[02:01:12] <nrtriana> If you're able to write to the drive from another computer, you might be experiencing one of the following problems:
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• 397[02:02:02] <nrtriana> Filesystem corruption. The drive might have a corrupted filesystem or other issue (possibly specific to a particular computer or OS) that can be corrected by using e2fsck or a similar utility. If this addresses the problem, your drive is probably working normally. It's also important to eject the drive properly before removing it or at least wait until the drive has finished writing, as removal of the drive while it is writing data
• 398[02:02:02] <nrtriana> can cause low-level data corruption.
• 399[02:02:27] *** Quits: LoudIntrovert (~LoudIntro@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 400[02:03:46] <rant> this has nothing to do with filesystem or partitions as dd is not working directly to the device node and its said it wasnt working on windows formatting it either
• 401[02:04:26] <rant> I assumed the drive is failing but I just figured I'd ask in case anyone else had heard of such things
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• 405[02:06:19] <skinhaptik> it could be, but I doubt it. Has the drive been use for anything else besides just storage? Like have you dd'd something on it before reattempting to dd?
• 406[02:06:29] <rant> a simple dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sdc isnt working, saying its a readonly device
• 407[02:06:47] <rant> it was attempted to be made into a debian netinst
• 408[02:06:54] <jasabella> it's not one of those write once kind of devices is it?
• 409[02:07:08] <rant> seems to just be an ordinary flash thumbdrive
• 410[02:07:13] <skinhaptik> are you using sudo?
• 411[02:07:20] <phd> rant: drive was working under windows? Can it be mounted anyhow?
• 412[02:07:28] <skinhaptik> could it possibly be physically damaged by your knowledge?
• 413[02:07:34] <rant> it can be read, just not written
• 414[02:07:59] <phd> rant: it's have NTFS on it now?
• 415[02:08:12] <rant> afaik its got the debian netinst image on it right now
• 416[02:08:19] <skinhaptik> rant: are you using sudo? the /zero should really work which is weird
• 417[02:08:21] <phd> hm
• 418[02:08:42] <rant> the user in question can't get in here right now.. I just was lookin for other ideas .. cause to me sounds like a broken thumbdrive
• 419[02:09:04] <skinhaptik> oh so it's not your problem?
• 420[02:09:22] <skinhaptik> Yeah it would be helpful if the person was here in real time
• 421[02:09:24] <phd> sometimes Linux don't want to mount NTFS for write if windows took a quick shutdown
• 422[02:09:25] <rant> no, someone /msg me earlier.. they are not at home and dont know their pw and cant talk here
• 423[02:09:32] <rant> due to the channel permissions
• 424[02:09:39] <phd> rant: which filesystem is on disk now?
• 425[02:09:55] <jasabella> rant… did you find this... and plugged it into your computer? ummmm
• 426[02:09:57] *** Quits: Greyztar_ (~irc@replaced-ip) (Quit: "")
• 427[02:09:59] <rant> if you really wanted to talk to them they're on freenode.. heh.. just can't get in #debian
• 428[02:10:12] *** Quits: nrtriana (~Triana@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 429[02:10:16] <skinhaptik> rant: well note down some suggestions from the chat then and go from there
• 430[02:10:38] *** Quits: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 431[02:10:42] <rant> you can use my personal channel ##nvz if you really cared.. I already suggested to them registering a new nick
• 432[02:10:59] *** Quits: skinhaptik (~skinhapti@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 1.6)
• 433[02:11:24] <jasabella> (if you're conscious of security, you should never plug random/unknown usb sticks into your devices)
• 434[02:12:13] <phd> rant: which filesystem is on disk now?
• 435[02:12:18] <rant> I'm just asking questions on behalf of another user who isnt registered with nickserv who had an issue with D-I sounded like the netinst didnt write cleanly
• 436[02:12:39] <rant> I'm over it now.. they're in my personal channel as I said if you care to follow up with them there :P
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• 440[02:16:20] <cluelessperson> can you encrypt ram?
• 441[02:16:34] <cluelessperson> like, literally, anything you place in ram for a specific program is encrypted?
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• 444[02:17:16] <joepublic> cluelessperson, you have just reinvented DRM for video games.
• 445[02:17:16] <cef> rant: there is a tool called blktool that might be useful for that drive. There's a readonly setting and if you pass that without on|off after it, it'll show the state.
• 446[02:17:35] <cef> rant: eg: `blktool /dev/sdc readonly`
• 447[02:17:41] <rant> cef: hmm.. interesting I never head of this
• 448[02:17:57] <cluelessperson> joepublic: well, how is it typically done, exactly what I'm describing?
• 449[02:18:17] <cef> rant: there's also ways to do similar in hdparm but blktool seems to be a bit easier to find this sort of stuff.
• 450[02:18:32] <joepublic> if you just want to encrypt your data structures, you may want to write functions that store and retrieve data, with it encrypted by the functions.
• 451[02:18:53] <cef> rant: fwiw: apparently Win10 likes setting some partitions and/or whole disks read only, especially if they've been used for something like fastboot, etc.
• 452[02:19:01] <rant> ah
• 453[02:19:06] <cluelessperson> joepublic: I'm hoping to also encrypt the RAM itself
• 454[02:19:32] <joepublic> that, I don't know how to do.
• 455[02:20:07] <cluelessperson> joepublic: I suppose my thinking is that the cpu encryption module can be used to decrypt things/values from ram before processing them
• 456[02:20:09] <cluelessperson> in certain caess
• 457[02:20:11] <cluelessperson> cases
• 458[02:20:15] <blackflow> AMD EPYC cand do it on the hardware level
• 459[02:20:18] <blackflow> *can
• 460[02:20:34] <joepublic> I don't see why not. there has to be a key somewhere though.
• 461[02:20:36] *** Quits: RebelCoder (~RebelCode@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 462[02:20:50] <whislock> EPYC does not just encrypt "everything" in memory.
• 463[02:21:04] <whislock> Specifically, they encrypt the memory allocated to virtual machines.
• 464[02:21:10] <cef> rant: blktool spits out stuff for full disks and partitions fyi, whereas I think hdparm only does full disks. I've used neither for write-porecting a block device, so YMMV with changing settings.
• 465[02:21:19] <whislock> cluelessperson: The problem with your concept is that the key used to encrypt and decrypt what's going in and out of RAM... is stored in RAM.
• 466[02:21:42] <blackflow> whislock: that's SEV, extension of SME
• 467[02:21:45] <cluelessperson> whislock: if done right, you'd store it in the CPU's cache
• 468[02:21:48] <cluelessperson> not in RAM
• 469[02:21:52] <joepublic> or in a register
• 470[02:21:53] <whislock> cluelessperson: That's not how CPU caching works.
• 471[02:22:04] <whislock> Also not how registers work.
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• 473[02:22:25] <cluelessperson> That's how TPUs work
• 474[02:22:34] <cluelessperson> and HSMs
• 475[02:22:40] <whislock> That is not how HSMs work.
• 476[02:23:15] *** Quits: Ruebezahl (~Alf@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 477[02:23:30] <whislock> As for TPUs, the key is still held in memory while the system is running.
• 478[02:23:45] <cluelessperson> not in the system ram that can be removed.
• 479[02:23:54] <cluelessperson> or dumped easily
• 480[02:24:00] <whislock> You've never heard of a cold boot attack, apparently.
• 481[02:24:27] <whislock> And yes, the key is stored in RAM while the system is running.
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• 486[02:30:35] <whislock> blackflow: Didn't know about SME, though. Thanks.
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• 489[02:32:35] <blackflow> whislock: there are rumors of it being already cracked :/
• 490[02:32:52] <whislock> Yeah, I saw that.
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• 492[02:35:19] <karlpinc> Every time I hear of about adding a new processor or imbedding new OS (i.e. UEFI) or new "management interface" all I can think of is the giant new attack surface that can't be fixed post-purchase.
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• 501[02:46:18] <altker128> Anyone here ever messed with Wazo as a SIP/VOIP server?
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• 506[02:50:24] <altker128> Anyone here running / using SIP?
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• 509[02:51:57] <VLMC> Which fonts should I install for Microsoft websites to render with the correct fonts? replaced-url
• 510[02:52:18] <joepublic> of the approximately thousand and a half people here, yes, some have used Wazo and/or SIP itself.
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• 515[02:55:57] <blackflow> VLMC: ttf-mscorefonts-installer iirc, but these days fonts-liberation should be adequate replacement
• 516[02:56:28] <altker128> joepublic: I figured :) . Trying to find out if anyone has anything overwhelmingly positive/negate about Wazo or if I should look into something else to handle SIP for a < 10 individual setup
• 517[02:56:55] <VLMC> blackflow: fonts-liberation is already installed, I'll try ttf-mscorefonts-installer
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• 523[02:59:46] <altker128> Ideally looking for an open-source / self-hostable replacement for Cisco Jabber / MSFT Lync
• 524[03:00:50] <mns> altker128: there is open source jabber, which is different from cisco jabber.
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• 527[03:01:47] <altker128> mns: You mean the XMPP protcol?
• 528[03:01:59] <mns> altker128: yes
• 529[03:02:28] <mns> jabber makes use of the xmpp, as does google talk and a bunch of others.
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• 531[03:02:40] <altker128> mns: Yeah. I've seen a bunch of XMPP/Server programs. I'm was hoping to find (yes, I'm likely dreaming) IM / text chat, 1:1 voice calls, screensharing and file sharing
• 532[03:02:52] <altker128> mns: Yeah...WhatsApp is even XMPP based
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• 534[03:03:39] <altker128> There's a few WebRTC based programs that are close (Jangouts, based on Janus WebRTC gateway), Jitsi Meet
• 535[03:04:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1408
• 536[03:04:49] <watchcat> retroshare?
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• 539[03:05:22] <jasabella> um, empathy? signal?
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• 541[03:07:40] <mns> I've never been interested in 1:1 voice, screensharing, etc. so not aware of anything that has to capabilites.
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• 545[03:11:01] <joepublic> altker128, I personally use wire desktop for that
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• 548[03:14:19] <altker128> joepublic: Thanks. I looked into Wire, I think all the clients are open-source but there doesn't seem to be a way to self-host
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• 551[03:15:07] <joepublic> That's my understanding as well. jitsi seems to be the closest thing to what you want.
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• 595[03:52:05] <karlpinc> debtags is your friend when it comes to searching the apt repo(s).
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• 619[04:08:40] <markc> altker128: spreed.me ?
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• 623[04:11:17] <cheapie> Is it just me or is one of the snapshot.debian.org servers down?
• 624[04:11:32] *** Joins: phebus (~phebus@replaced-ip)
• 625[04:11:40] <cheapie> The one at 2001:630:206:4000:1a1a:0:c13e:ca1b is working, but the one at 2001:1af8:4020:b030:deb::185 is giving me 503 errors.
• 626[04:12:50] <altker128> markc: Looking for self-hostable
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• 628[04:13:07] <altker128> Just installed Jitsi-Meet but doesn't seem to "work"
• 629[04:13:54] <markc> altker128: replaced-url
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• 631[04:14:57] <markc> altker128: replaced-url
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• 633[04:15:34] <altker128> markc: I think I tried out Spreed before actually
• 634[04:15:41] <altker128> markc: Thanks for reminding me, let me try it again
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• 638[04:17:29] <markc> altker128: I use the spreed.me site occasionally and find it's works well. I've never managed to get the Nextcloud Talk app to work though, otherwise I'd use it exclusively.
• 639[04:18:10] <altker128> markc: 10-4 . I also tried Nextcloud Talk w/o much luck. There were lots of complaints about STUN/TURN but I was running it all on a LAN so it should have just worked
• 640[04:21:20] <altker128> apt-cacher-ng f'ing ROCKS
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• 642[04:24:09] <markc> altker128: this seems to work for me -> docker run --rm --name my-spreed-webrtc -p 8080:8080 -p 8443:8443 -v `pwd`:/srv/extra -i -t spreed/webrtc
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• 647[04:25:50] <altker128> markc: I think I got Spreed to actually work fine too, when I tried it. Are you using a pre-built Docker image or did you compile Spreed?
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• 649[04:27:12] <markc> altker128: I just typed in the above docker command and now have a local instance that looks just like the hosted spreed.me interface
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• 651[04:29:26] <markc> altker128: I've just switched from using LXD to docker so I'm not sure how to best deal with docker containers yet, otherwise I'd investigate the container
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• 654[04:31:20] <altker128> markc: Where did the Docker image come from?
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• 656[04:35:00] <markc> altker128: a bit more rtfm and I will try this image on a public vps... replaced-url
• 657[04:35:30] <altker128> markc: 10-4. I just built spreed and I'm running it in my lxc-based container
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• 659[04:36:49] <altker128> markc: I did try this before actually
• 660[04:36:54] <altker128> markc: I think it worked reasonably
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• 662[04:37:31] <markc> altker128: is your container port forwarded to a pubic IP?
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• 668[04:39:36] <altker128> markc: No, but my intended usage is behind a VPN anyway, so I don't need to mess with that
• 669[04:40:31] <markc> altker128: no worries, I was just interested to do a test and see how well it worked, or not
• 670[04:40:33] <altker128> markc: I don't see screenshare in spreed just chat/IM/audio/video .
• 671[04:40:40] <altker128> markc: Does your have screen sharing?
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• 673[04:41:27] <markc> altker128: damn it, you are right, no screenshare icon
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• 675[04:42:52] <agio> hi all, does anyone know which channel is for thunderbird (email client) ?
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• 678[04:46:36] <altker128> agio: I'm guessing a Mozilla one
• 679[04:46:50] <altker128> markc: In the server.conf I do see a screenshare plug-in ; I enabled it but don't see any icons for it
• 680[04:47:02] <agio> altker128: thanks, yes I just tried irc.mozilla.net
• 681[04:47:15] <agio> er, irc.mozilla.org
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• 684[04:47:30] <agio> seems like it might be the right place :)
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• 688[04:49:04] <jasonwc> Hello everyone, I recently migrated my ZFS pool and OS disks from one server to another. On my old server, I had a bond made up of two Intel Gbit NIC ports named eth0 and eth2 (bond0). However, on the new system, 3 of the 4 ports aren't working and are named rename3, rename4, and rename5. The only port that is working is named eno1. How do I rename the other 3 ports so they can be used?
• 689[04:49:47] <whislock> jasonwc: Do you have files in /etc/udev/rules.d?
• 690[04:50:38] <altker128> markc: I did find this as well : replaced-url
• 691[04:50:52] <whislock> jasonwc: More specifically, 70-persistent-net.rules?
• 692[04:51:02] <jasonwc> whislock: Yeah, I see 3 files. 70-persistent-net.rules seems to be the relevant one
• 693[04:51:17] <whislock> jasonwc: If you moved your OS disks, you might have a udev rule in there that's specific to MAC.
• 694[04:51:28] <whislock> jasonwc: Change the MAC, or just remove the relevant lines.
• 695[04:51:39] <jasonwc> yup, indeed I do
• 696[04:52:03] <markc> altker128: fwiw I just did a quick test between chromium and firefox on the same laptop and now I have a screenshare icon and it's working :)
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• 699[04:53:05] <altker128> markc: Woah. What did you do? Just uncomment in the server.conf?
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• 702[04:54:02] <jasonwc> whislock: Do I need to reboot afterwards or can I force udev to refresh?
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• 704[04:54:15] <whislock> jasonwc: There's a command for udev to rerun rules, but I don't remember what it is.
• 705[04:54:22] <jasonwc> udevadm control --reload-rules && udevadm trigger
• 706[04:54:23] <jasonwc> I think
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• 708[04:54:33] <whislock> That sounds about right.
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• 710[04:55:24] <markc> altker128: no, I just started a session with myself and the icon appeared... yes, both ways chromium -> firefox and now firefox to chromium, showing this irc channel as a window
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• 713[04:56:36] <markc> altker128: perhaps the screenshare icon does not show until a session starts and spreed is aware that the browser involved are capable of screensharing
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• 718[05:00:39] <markc> altker128: replaced-url
• 719[05:00:58] <altker128> markc: Does file transfer work for you for the Docker instance you're hosting?
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• 721[05:03:51] <markc> altker128: I just uploaded a pdf and it rendered in bother browsers
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• 723[05:04:39] <altker128> Hrm. On the self-hosted instance I have chat works but images/audio/video kinda fail
• 724[05:04:47] <markc> altker128: same for a odt, it displays in bother browsers
• 725[05:04:59] <altker128> markc: I think when I tried this last time audio/video did work
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• 727[05:05:57] <markc> altker128: I can't really test audio because I'm on the same computer, but I can see myself on one side (see image I uploaded)
• 728[05:06:49] <jasonwc> whislock: No dice - even a restart didn't assign device names. In addition, there shouldn't be a conflict as the devices are different. The old one used driver e1000 and this is igb.
• 729[05:07:33] <altker128> markc: I'm also running spreed directly, and not behind nginx / apache, that might be an issue here
• 730[05:07:54] <markc> altker128: chat works, it shoudl but I just double checked... I can't figure out how to find the IP that this docker container is on otherwise I'd port forward to it and we could test it out
• 731[05:08:42] <markc> altker128: right, I'm not sure what this coker container is doing, not sure how to get into it to look around
• 732[05:10:36] <markc> altker128: replaced-url
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• 735[05:10:58] <markc> coker -> docker
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• 737[05:11:40] <markc> altker128: I should try and build it from the github repo
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• 741[05:14:45] <markc> altker128: doh, I removed my lxd package last night, otherwise I'd have a public IP to test in a few mins.
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• 758[05:21:04] <altker128> markc: I do see this on start-up after altering the server.conf : Enabled modules: [presentation contacts screensharing]
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• 768[05:35:10] <markc> altker128: nice to meet you, I'm happy to do any a/v testing sometime... gotta reboot
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• 879[06:55:03] <jelly> phd: nope
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• 890[07:02:49] <velix> What's the package, "networking.service" comes with?
• 891[07:03:17] <velix> fupdown! thanks
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• 894[07:05:52] <Wulf> $ dpkg -S networking.service
• 895[07:05:52] <Wulf> ifupdown: /lib/systemd/system/networking.service
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• 902[07:08:00] <velix> Wulf: yeah, just found it with apt-file ;)
• 903[07:08:01] <velix> Wulf: th
• 904[07:08:03] <velix> +x
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• 942[07:51:29] <tomreyn> hi! is there a way to create a gpt (GUID) partition table from the debian-installer shell?
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• 947[07:54:16] <Wulf> tomreyn: debian-installer sources mention "gpt". So maybe yes
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• 957[07:57:54] <whislock> tomreyn: I believe that, within the installer itself, it will automatically select MBR for disks smaller than 2TB, and GPT for disks 2TB or larger, or GPT if you're booted in UEFI.
• 958[07:58:12] <whislock> tomreyn: I don't recall if gdisk or similar utilities are available in the installer shell.
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• 961[07:59:03] <whislock> tomreyn: Does that help?
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• 963[07:59:47] <tomreyn> whislock, Wulf: thanks, this helped. also i found that i can "udpkg -i /cdrom/pool/main/p/parted/parted-udeb_3.2-15_amd64.udeb" and run parted from a shell.
• 964[08:00:12] <whislock> There you go. I'm a gdisk guy, myself.
• 965[08:00:39] <tomreyn> is gdisk also available as a udeb?
• 966[08:01:46] <Wulf> tomreyn: no
• 967[08:02:31] <whislock> Oh, udeb. Yeah, ignore me.
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• 969[08:02:45] <tomreyn> actually, yes it is
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• 973[08:02:57] <tomreyn> sorry, should just have checked
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• 977[08:08:24] <tomreyn> but then this is not so useful :) replaced-url
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• 1051[09:18:31] <leibniz> whos is here
• 1052[09:18:40] <leibniz> i need help with something
• 1053[09:19:03] <zamuro> !ask
• 1054[09:19:03] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
• 1055[09:19:13] <zamuro> !anyone
• 1056[09:19:14] <dpkg> Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>.
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• 1098[09:51:03] <Rhaegar1982> .ping
• 1099[09:51:17] <chire> .pong
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• 1101[09:51:39] <Rhaegar1982> .ping
• 1102[09:51:49] <Rhaegar1982> ;p
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• 1110[09:53:52] <zumba_ad_> Hi folks. How do I turn on debugging symbols in kernel?
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• 1126[10:00:24] <zumba_ad_> Got this error when I ran `make menuconfig` in /usr/src/linux directory - `/usr/src/linux-headers-4.9.0-6-common/scripts/Makefile.build:44: /usr/src/linux-headers-4.9.0-6-common/scripts/basic/Makefile: No such file or directory`
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• 1193[11:03:44] <pagios> hi all, i did a modprobe v4l2loopback and i got /dev/video0 how can i get /dev/video1 , 2 ,3 ,4 ?
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• 1222[11:14:27] <Fox> pagios: did you try "modprobe v4l2loopback devices=4" ?
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• 1241[11:23:30] <Fox> pagios: still alive ? :)
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• 1273[11:51:03] <rgammans> Does anybody know how to enable the Evdev "Wheel emulation" feature in buster; as a user(eg not-root) the old xinput script doesnot work, because X only sees a signle wayland pointer these days
• 1274[11:51:46] <Fox> !debian-next
• 1275[11:51:47] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
• 1276[11:51:54] <Fox> rgammans: ^
• 1277[11:52:05] <rgammans> Fox: thanks
• 1278[11:55:34] <Sveta> does replying to email add comment to a bug ?
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• 1285[12:00:35] <Fox> Sveta: sending mail to <number>@bugs.debian.org will add comments to that bug
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• 1288[12:01:27] <Sveta> Fox ok thanks
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• 1299[12:11:05] <blackflow> the Debian BTS scares me. Why can't it not have something like a bugzilla, like every decent FOSS project out there :) doesn't even have to fancy schmancy gitlab or anything. just good ol' Bugzilla.
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• 1301[12:12:22] <Sveta> email interface is a bit easy i think
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• 1308[12:15:33] <Fox> I use windowmaker and mutt, BTS is ok for me ;)
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• 1315[12:19:37] <Sveta> Fox: there is #windowmaker too :)
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• 1319[12:31:34] <Fox> Sveta: do you mean I'm a dinosaur and I should stay with otehert dinosaurs ? :p
• 1320[12:32:34] <Fox> s/otehert/other/
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• 1322[12:33:54] <blackflow> The Otehertsaurus went extinct 300M years ago. :)
• 1323[12:34:36] <Fox> :)
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• 1345[12:51:29] * [gnubie] waves
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• 1360[13:00:43] <tsglove> blackflow, areplaced-url
• 1361[13:00:53] <tsglove> Was that a dinosaur? The Otehertsaurus?
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• 1363[13:02:07] <mackerel449> what makes firefox open downloaded files with the wrong application? its mostly archives that get opened in the hex editor
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• 1371[13:07:45] <Fox> mackerel449: wrong application association in Firefox options ?
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• 1377[13:13:26] <blackflow> tsglove: yes. it typoed a lot and couldn't fill in the dyno evacuation papers when teh aliens came to pick them up after the Yucatan rock hit, so it went extinct :)
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• 1381[13:15:25] <serard> Hello, anyone using pdns_recursor ? I just apt-get install pdns-recursor but I don't get any bin (pdns_recursor)
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• 1385[13:17:27] <Fox> serard: it should be in /usr/sbin according to replaced-url
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• 1387[13:18:37] <serard> Fox, thank you very much, now I know how to find files :)
• 1388[13:18:57] <n4dir> you could also do "apt-file show pkg"
• 1389[13:19:06] <n4dir> apt-file needs to be installed.
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• 1392[13:20:58] <tsglove> blackflow, I ask because I recently read about pre-historic earth... and there were huge animals before the dinosaurs. Which most people mistakenly call dinosaurs.
• 1393[13:21:14] <Fox> serard: you can list files installed with dpkg -L pdns-recursor, and compare
• 1394[13:21:47] <serard> Fox thanks again for the command
• 1395[13:22:01] <Fox> tsglove: blackflow was refering to a typo a made, not an actual dinosaur ;)
• 1396[13:22:11] <blackflow> tsglove: ah, no I was joking about an earlier typo :)
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• 1398[13:23:07] <tsglove> lol oops sorry for being so dense
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• 1401[13:26:35] <blackflow> tsglove: no need to tar pit yourself :) (har har! :) )
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• 1406[13:28:23] * tsglove can't think of a good pun. I'll head over to #debian-offtopic to rant on =)
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• 1411[13:31:12] <Thedarkb-T60> Heh, I got sent to ##fix_your_connection
• 1412[13:31:20] <Thedarkb-T60> Haven't had that happen before.
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• 1449[13:56:53] <rattlebattle79> Is there any good reason to choose docker > LXC?
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• 1453[13:59:22] <tsglove> rattlebattle79, I think it´s done to preference. Opinions in that space are never-ending.
• 1454[13:59:33] <Brigo> rattlebattle79 docker gives you everything done, wiht lxc you have to do it yourself
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• 1457[14:00:55] <Fox> rattlebattle79: docker will let you run only an application, with lxc you have to run a complete system if I remember correctly
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• 1459[14:02:00] <[gnubie]> please pardon my newbie questions regarding my yubikey 4. i am on debian stretch, setup dm-crypt + luks with yubikey4 u2f as per replaced-url
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• 1466[14:06:41] <tsglove> [gnubie], did it throw an error msg?
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• 1474[14:10:14] <[gnubie]> tsglove: nope. however in yubikey personalization tool it already say that slot 1 and slot 2 are already used.
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• 1477[14:10:41] <[gnubie]> afaik, slot 1 has been reserved for yubico.
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• 1479[14:11:55] <[gnubie]> as for slot 2, i already used it for dm-crypt + luks which i followed the replaced-url
• 1480[14:12:13] <rattlebattle79> I've been running LXC and testing docker, but don't see any real benefits. I'm kind of "lost" when I want to add something to a docker image. Like when I had to add smbclient to Nextcloud, I found it easier in LXC because it's just like any other Debian install. Second drawback with Docker, is I find the docker hub kind of insecure and that I always need to verify the source.
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• 1482[14:12:52] <[gnubie]> i'm wondering though if i can still use my yubikey 4 for keepass...
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• 1486[14:14:45] <[gnubie]> i'm afraid if i proceed for keepass that it will overwrite for my dm-crypt + luks
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• 1492[14:16:33] <Lachezar> Hey all. Is there an iptables-save+restore thing in Debian Stretch?
• 1493[14:16:46] <apollo13> sure
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• 1497[14:17:57] <Lachezar> apollo13: How to add a rule to that?
• 1498[14:18:13] * Lachezar can't find jack with systemd :(
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• 1501[14:18:54] <apollo13> what did you install?
• 1502[14:19:19] <Lachezar> apollo13: Debian Stretch :)
• 1503[14:19:23] <apollo13> no which package
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• 1505[14:19:43] <apollo13> I doubt that by default anything is persistet
• 1506[14:19:50] <Lachezar> apollo13: None I suppose.
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• 1509[14:20:05] <apollo13> well if you didn't install anything it won't save anything ;)
• 1510[14:20:08] <Lachezar> apollo13: Hm. That and docker...
• 1511[14:20:11] <apollo13> you need iptables-persistent
• 1512[14:20:16] <apollo13> haha docker
• 1513[14:22:01] <Lachezar> Dang. So where would I add an 'iptables -I FORWARD ...' rule in Debian Stretch?
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• 1515[14:22:36] <apollo13> in the relevant config files from iptables-persistent
• 1516[14:22:50] <apollo13> like one did in debian before stretch
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• 1518[14:23:04] <Fox> or just add the rule and /etc/init.d/netfilter-persistent save
• 1519[14:23:08] <Lachezar> apollo13: No rc.local?
• 1520[14:23:19] <apollo13> noone ever did that in rc.local
• 1521[14:23:20] <apollo13> hopefully
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• 1523[14:23:44] <apollo13> Fox: that would probably also write down all the stupid autogenerated docker rules
• 1524[14:23:54] <Fox> apollo13: for sure
• 1525[14:23:56] <Lachezar> apollo13: My point exactly!
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• 1529[14:24:40] <Lachezar> So is there a way for me to add /"'something'"/ that would run just before docker and add that rule?
• 1530[14:24:59] <Lachezar> Like a custom systemd /"'script'"/?
• 1531[14:25:09] <apollo13> Lachezar: as I said, install iptables-persistent and read the docs
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• 1533[14:25:16] <apollo13> that __does__ what you want
• 1534[14:25:35] <Fox> Lachezar: config files are in /etc/iptables/rules.v{4,6}
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• 1540[14:28:13] * Lachezar thinks maybe add /etc/network/if-up.d and /etc/network/if-down.d scripts?
• 1541[14:28:34] <apollo13> do you ready __anything__ I write?
• 1542[14:28:48] <kirk781> I read you, apollo13
• 1543[14:28:54] <kirk781> How are things in space?
• 1544[14:28:57] <apollo13> if yes, what is wrong with using iptables-persistent to define your firewall
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• 1547[14:29:10] <apollo13> kirk781: good, but apparently my signals don't reach earth, or at least not Lachezar
• 1548[14:29:12] <Lachezar> apollo13: Yes, I did. Install *****.
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• 1550[14:29:18] <kirk781> Jeez, I thought you were role playing an astronaut
• 1551[14:29:43] <apollo13> you should know better kirk :þ
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• 1553[14:30:08] <Lachezar> apollo13: I doubt those would work, as the VPN would not have been started at that point.
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• 1555[14:30:54] <apollo13> Lachezar: and why does that matter?
• 1556[14:31:30] <Lachezar> apollo13: 'Cause the interfaces would be missing.
• 1557[14:31:31] <apollo13> also you can change the dependencies with system overrides to adjust that
• 1558[14:31:53] <apollo13> Lachezar: you do know that you can just write rules against non-existing interfaces and they will automatically start to apply once the iface exists?
• 1559[14:31:55] <Lachezar> apollo13: Changing order would pretty surely end up badly for me.
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• 1561[14:32:28] <Lachezar> apollo13: Nope. Didn't know that. My experience shows otherwise.
• 1562[14:32:49] <apollo13> mhm, unless I mix it up with other systems
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• 1567[14:33:13] <apollo13> but should be easy enough to test
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• 1569[14:33:35] <Lachezar> apollo13: In my case testing would probably end up requesting the VM to be reinstalled. No go.
• 1570[14:33:37] <apollo13> if-up stuff won't probably work if network manager is in use, but might be an option otherwise if your rules are simple
• 1571[14:33:45] <apollo13> lol?
• 1572[14:33:49] <apollo13> snapshots?
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• 1574[14:34:02] <apollo13> also don't test on your production system ;)
• 1575[14:34:39] <Lachezar> apollo13: How do I check if I have NM working? I can't see any, and the public IF is configured in /etc/network/interfaces
• 1576[14:35:13] <apollo13> systemctl status network-something (dunno what nm calls itself nowadays)
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• 1582[14:37:01] <Lachezar> I got networking.service
• 1583[14:37:15] <Lachezar> /lib/systemd/system/networking.service
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• 1587[14:39:18] <Lachezar> The only place where I have my IP configured is /etc/network/interfaces. Probably no Network Manager?
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• 1620[14:56:08] *** vash2511 is now known as vash2511_
• 1621[14:56:28] <S3xyL1nux> echo -e $(cat blah.txt | shuf -n 1 & shuf -i 1-100 -n 1) <----- i need to compile the two output without space
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• 1623[14:56:52] <technobi> Hello All, is there Unifont-APL8x16 variant in the 32x16 variant?
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• 1628[14:58:37] <abrotman> S3xyL1nux: sed ?
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• 1630[14:58:50] <transhumanist_> hi anyone know the forum for antix the debian based distro? thanks in advance
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• 1632[14:59:29] <blackflow> transhumanist_: google will know.
• 1633[14:59:45] <abrotman> dpkg: tell transhumanist_ about antix
• 1634[14:59:59] <vash2511> hello guys!
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• 1636[15:00:33] <transhumanist_> thanks abrotman
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• 1639[15:02:58] <vash2511> I installed zsh shell. sudo completions don't work with sudo command for commands located in /sbin and /usr/sbin. I've already put some zstyle entries like "environ" and "command-path" but it didn't work. I'm running Stretch.
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• 1730[15:50:45] <jhutchins> vash2511: So you are puzzled about why bash completion doesn't work when you're not running bash?
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• 1740[15:55:29] <Lachezar> Hm. Is it possible to use iptables-persistent in a way that does not include iptables-save and iptables-restore?
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• 1757[16:03:27] <Fox> Lachezar: if it doesn't save, doesn't restore, what is it useful for ?
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• 1764[16:10:43] <LtL> Lachezar: use netfitler-persistent
• 1765[16:10:58] <LtL> *netfilter-persistent
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• 1783[16:22:42] <Lachezar> LtL: That looks like it is a base for iptables-persistent to work on. Does netfilter-peristent work on its own?
• 1784[16:23:16] <LtL> Lachezar: it works thats all i'msure of.
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• 1786[16:23:50] <Lachezar> Fox: The iptables currently is a result of multiple things configuring it (ahm. docker ahm.). I want to add *one* rule to FORWARD, not wreak havok on the tables.
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• 1789[16:24:23] <jasonwc> I recently migrated my ZFS pool and OS SSDs from one server to another. The old system had two e1000 NICs while the new system has 4 igb NICs (i350). The old ethernet devices were named eth0 and eth1 based on /etc/udev/70-persistent-net.rules. However, the new NICs are named rename2,eno1,rename4, and rename5. I can't figure out what config file stores this naming or how to change it. I
• 1790[16:24:23] <jasonwc> thought it would be in 70-persistent-net.rules. Any ideas?
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• 1792[16:24:38] <jasonwc> This is on Debian Stretch
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• 1796[16:25:14] <vash2511> jhutchins, sorry I wrote you privately.
• 1797[16:25:29] <vash2511> jhutchins, I'm using zsh
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• 1898[17:20:40] <FreeSpencer> rwp I was able to use dpkg-repack on a different machine and make the deb file, pheww
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• 1927[17:42:41] <karlpinc> jasonwc: There's a new naming convention for nics, optional with stretch and mandatory thereafter. See the stretch release notes on how to migrate. I _think_ there may be a README.Debian somewhere too. I forget.
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• 1931[17:44:04] <greycat> mandatory in buster? oooh, that's gonna break some shit.
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• 1936[17:47:02] <HelloShitty> Hello
• 1937[17:47:11] <HelloShitty> I need help with my PATH varaile
• 1938[17:47:23] <HelloShitty> when I issue $PATH in terminal I get this error:
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• 1940[17:47:46] <greycat> $PATH is not a command. if you want to see the value of it, try echo "$PATH" instead.
• 1941[17:47:47] <HelloShitty> bash: /media/wdelements/Microchip/Downloads/avr8-gnu-toolchain-linux_x86_64/bin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/local/games:/usr/games: No such file or directory
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• 1943[17:48:18] <greycat> in any case, you appear to have a reasonable $PATH
• 1944[17:48:28] <HelloShitty> ok
• 1945[17:48:30] <HelloShitty> indeed
• 1946[17:48:35] <HelloShitty> I was missing the echo
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• 1948[17:48:41] <zumba_addict> Morning all. I'm trying to install kernel debugging symbols but I'm getting a failure. Looks like I'm passing a non-existent package - `linux-image-*-dbgsym`
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• 1953[17:50:35] <zumba_addict> this also failed - apt-get install linux-image-$(uname -r)-dbgsym
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• 1955[17:53:55] <zumba_addict> exact error is Couldn't find any package by glob 'linux-image-4.9.0-6-amd64-dbgsym'
• 1956[17:55:55] <greycat> you're -2- releases behind the stable kernel, that's probably why
• 1957[17:56:04] <greycat> wooledg:~$ uname -r
• 1958[17:56:05] <greycat> 4.9.0-8-amd64
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• 1960[17:56:29] <greycat> the debug syms for your older kernel may not be in the stable repositories any more
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• 1971[18:00:14] <Aebian> shouldn't be vortio be built-in into debian? I have a linux guest and when I set the NIC to virtIO the guest gets no internet. Using for e.g. the Realteak NIC however works
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• 1979[18:03:26] <jasonwc> It appears that the persistent network naming scheme in Debian wants to assign the same name to 4 NICs resulting in 3 being named "rename" followed by a number. replaced-url
• 1980[18:03:27] <Bjornn> 4.9.0-8-amd64 is a great kernel too.
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• 1983[18:03:44] <jasonwc> How do I force it to use ID_NET_NAME_PATH instead?
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• 1994[18:10:04] <mawk> on mine it's a module yes Aebian
• 1995[18:10:16] <mawk> but if you get an interface in the gues then virtio is working
• 1996[18:10:20] <mawk> you wouldn't have any iface at all
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• 2019[18:20:58] <Aebian> wdym? I got the default iface to the host for routing and internet. But the internet access will only work when using the Realtek driver and not the virtIO one replaced-url
• 2020[18:21:29] <Aebian> on a windows guest it works but there I was able to install the required dirver using the virtIO windows cd
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• 2022[18:21:44] <whislock> Linux isn't Windows. VirtIO works out of the box on Debian.
• 2023[18:22:10] <Aebian> yeah I thought so but it's not on mys side. Thats why I asked
• 2024[18:22:22] <Aebian> let me check again
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• 2032[18:30:08] <noln> zumba_addict, linux-image-4.9.0-6-amd64-dbg (''apt-cache search dbg | grep linux'')
• 2033[18:30:20] <noln> note it's -dbg not -dbgsym
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• 2081[18:53:30] <rwp> FreeSpencer, Cool! Glad to hear you were able to move forward. By staying held back! :-)
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• 2085[18:54:49] <zumba_addict> ah, thank you noln
• 2086[18:55:12] <zumba_addict> and thank you for the apt-cache search tip :)
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• 2091[18:57:21] <zumba_addict> the reason I'm installing linux-image*dbg is because I want to learn the output of perf
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• 2094[18:59:35] <mcgreg> hi
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• 2096[19:01:36] <mcgreg> I am using debian sid - and I experienced a strange things. I did some apt-get dist-upgrade recently and somehow I cant start minecraft anymore. ALL java version - starting with oracle java to oenjdk java 8 -11 are returning error and wont start minecraft anymore. anyone any idea?
• 2097[19:01:59] <annadane> !debian-next
• 2098[19:01:59] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
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• 2101[19:02:27] <greycat> "I used unstable and something changed. And I'm calling it 'strange'."
• 2102[19:03:44] <mcgreg> greycat: neither did the java packages change nor minecraft - but okay. perhaps my choosing of words were unfortunate
• 2103[19:04:17] <annadane> that said, when i used sid i also had java weirdness. i have no idea what the problem is. but #debian is for stable
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• 2106[19:05:12] <mcgreg> ok ok, I'm sorry - no more about this here#
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• 2112[19:09:25] <VLMC> My Gnome software centre is stuck on this screen with no useful information in the terminal, even with --verbose replaced-url
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• 2114[19:09:38] <VLMC> No amount of rebooting and clearing the gconf for the application helped
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• 2117[19:10:00] <VLMC> Gnome 3.30.2
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• 2119[19:10:59] <jhutchins_wk> VLMC: Use the CLI tools.
• 2120[19:11:06] <VLMC> jhutchins_wk: I am
• 2121[19:11:19] <jhutchins_wk> VLMC: The GUI is just one more thing to go wrong.
• 2122[19:11:21] <VLMC> But the store is useful for snaps and extensions
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• 2131[19:14:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1459
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• 2142[19:20:51] <rkw_inspiron> VLMC: You can to go to debian-next channel for not stable (Gnome 3.30.2)
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• 2144[19:21:42] <annadane> on irc.oftc.net, not this network
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• 2152[19:23:45] <jhutchins_wk> VLMC: Have you done an apt* update?
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• 2154[19:24:08] <jhutchins_wk> If it's stuck loading the catalog, maybe rebuilding the lists would help.
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• 2162[19:27:12] * Old_Dog is experimenting
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• 2174[19:33:40] <karlpinc> greycat: Vis interface name changes see: zless /usr/share/doc/udev/README.Debian.gz
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• 2176[19:34:00] <greycat> karlpinc: in stable?
• 2177[19:34:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1453
• 2178[19:34:07] <karlpinc> Yes
• 2179[19:34:29] <greycat> this will tell me, on stable, what is going to happen in the next release two years later?
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• 2183[19:35:12] <karlpinc> greycat: "This old schema is deprecated in Debian 9 ("Stretch"), and will not be supported any more in Debian 10."
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• 2188[19:36:07] <greycat> "... but they will need to be manually migrated by Debian 10"
• 2189[19:36:17] <greycat> Oh, this is going to be a clusterfuck.
• 2190[19:37:10] <karlpinc> greycat: I submitted some patches to the debian 9 readme in an attempt to make it more clear. (Or maybe to the new release notes. But probably not.)
• 2191[19:37:48] <karlpinc> greycat: For instance, the interface numbering is base 10 (based on something hardware, I forget.)
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• 2193[19:38:35] <karlpinc> greycat: It'll be wack when upgrading remote systems. Seems like you get one chance to get it right. Best to migrate now, on Stretch.
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• 2195[19:38:52] <karlpinc> (To the new naming system.)
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• 2204[19:40:36] <karlpinc> They really should have put this in the debian 9 release notes, under steps to get ready for the next release.
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• 2254[19:59:04] <azi`> so I've just installed a debian on a USB stick with debotstramp
• 2255[19:59:09] <azi`> debootstrap*
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• 2257[19:59:28] <azi`> I've read online that If I add the option toram to grub I am supposed to be able to boot the live USB and remove it
• 2258[19:59:45] <azi`> however, if I do that I at some point or another get squashfs I/O errors
• 2259[19:59:53] <azi`> anybody knows how to properly make a removable live USB?
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• 2261[20:00:29] <towo`> azi`, toram only works with live system of debian
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• 2264[20:00:54] <towo`> you have a "normal" install of debian on a usb device
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• 2266[20:02:22] <azi`> towo`: that's correct, yes
• 2267[20:02:38] <azi`> towo`: do you happen to know how could I make it work for a very tiny live USB debian
• 2268[20:03:19] <towo`> azi`, no, i don't and there is no easy way i know about
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• 2271[20:03:58] <azi`> :(
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• 2311[20:28:52] <karlpinc> azi`: Use the debian-live images.
• 2312[20:29:12] <karlpinc> !debian-live
• 2313[20:29:12] <dpkg> The Debian Live project provides pre-built Debian live system images and allows creation of your own. NOT recommended for installing Debian. Live images are available from replaced-url
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• 2317[20:29:28] <VLMC> jhutchins: Just ran an apt update, same situation
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• 2319[20:29:47] <Sveta> Fox: yes, you're a fossil :)
• 2320[20:29:53] <azi`> karlpinc: the thing is that I need a bare bone debian, is that also supported with these images?
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• 2322[20:30:30] <azi`> and I need to install some extra stuff on it, so using debootstrap & chroot to install & tweak extra stuff proved very fruitful
• 2323[20:30:31] <karlpinc> azi`: I think there's a minimal install. (You can then install more with apt, but it does not persist unless, maybe, you do other magic.)
• 2324[20:31:27] <karlpinc> azi`: And I'm not clear on if it supports your "toram" grub option, but my guess is that it would. It's been a while since I looked at the live stuff.
• 2325[20:32:37] <karlpinc> azi`: You can use the tools to make your own custom live stick.
• 2326[20:33:28] <azi`> replaced-url
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• 2329[20:34:40] <EdePopede> because > live.debian.net: Name or service not known
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• 2332[20:35:09] <jhutchins> EdePopede: Looks like the factoid needs updating. replaced-url
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• 2334[20:35:33] <EdePopede> replaced-url
• 2335[20:35:36] <EdePopede> hm, 2 days old
• 2336[20:35:45] <jhutchins> greycat: I don't remember the syntax to edit a factoid.
• 2337[20:35:46] <EdePopede> only google hit btw
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• 2339[20:37:22] <greycat> dpkg, debian live =~ s#replaced-url
• 2340[20:37:22] <dpkg> greycat: OK
• 2341[20:37:28] <greycat> that what you wanted?
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• 2349[20:41:05] <jhutchins> greycat: Yeah, thanks.
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• 2352[20:41:49] <uio> Hi! I am going to install Debian LXDE on a ThinkPad X61 and have a hardwarish question: The fan runs quite a bit... is it just me, or do newer laptops make much less noise, or does Windows just make fans run and this might go away in Debian?
• 2353[20:42:36] <azi`> my guess is you had CPU intensive malware running on windows :)
• 2354[20:43:16] <altker128> uio: My experience is hit and miss. I have several Dell laptops I work with ; one of them is ultra-portablish and the CPU fan wants to run constantly. I finally just physically unplugged it and just let the CPU throttle
• 2355[20:43:41] <whislock> azi`: Linux doesn't automatically power/freq throttle the way Windows does.
• 2356[20:43:53] <altker128> uio: Another Dell laptop is pretty reasonable on the fan ; it's running Debian Stretch and day-to-day stuff CPU fan doesn't run. When I'm compiling or something fan is running all the time
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• 2359[20:45:07] <altker128> uio: You can re-paste the heatsink, sometimes that helps. I've even tried the liquid metal stuff on a Quad-Core Sandybridge Dell Laptop and even with all of that since that laptop has an nVidia GPU that shares the same heatsink assembly the CPU idles > 50 degC
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• 2365[20:46:16] <uio> whislock: azi: altker128 Okay, so it should be a bit better... I think it might be because the machine was shipped with XP, but has windows 7 installed....
• 2366[20:46:46] <uio> I am just a bit surprised because even with W7 it is quite fast (very actually), but the fan kicks in quick soon...
• 2367[20:47:03] <altker128> Yeah, Windows often does file indexing and other stuff behind the scenes (even if you turn it off, I've never been successful at disabling that crap completely) so CPU fan tends to cycle
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• 2370[20:48:31] <uio> Oh, not good... I'm running the Graphical installer for Debian 9 on it and it is currently detecting the network and the fan just started humming...
• 2371[20:49:07] <petn-randall> uio: Yes, it's using echo location for that.
• 2372[20:49:15] <EdePopede> lucky you. my gpu fan is chirping, think i'll get a new one tomorow :(
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• 2375[20:50:13] <uio> If it's asking me for a firmware, does that mean that the WiFi hardware needs a non-free software?
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• 2377[20:51:20] <technobi> Hello All, is there any way to convert or find the Unifont.psf.gz in the 32x16 dimensions?
• 2378[20:51:24] <jhutchins> uio: There are utilities that can control fan speed according to temperature. Some laptop BIOSes do that, some don't. You might want to open it up and clean out the cooling path.
• 2379[20:51:41] <jhutchins> uio: As cooling fans age they tend to become noisier.[3~
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• 2382[20:54:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1463
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• 2384[20:54:32] <uio> Does every package from the debian site have a check sum system?
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• 2387[20:54:43] <greycat> !debsums
• 2388[20:54:44] <dpkg> debsums is a utility that will check a package's files against their checksums. The "-a" argument will instruct it to also check configuration files: "apt install debsums; debsums -a -s". Almost all packages come with md5sums included in the package or apt will have generated them for you; generate missing ones with "apt-get install --reinstall `debsums -l`". Ask me about <md5sums>.
• 2389[20:55:24] <greycat> In addition, the lists of packages are cryptographically signed.
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• 2391[20:55:53] <greycat> see /var/lib/apt/lists/*.gpg
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• 2401[21:03:57] <uio> greycat: I just downloaded the firmware file from the Debian site. I used shasum to check the package, but can't find the expected sum online...
• 2402[21:04:22] <greycat> Are you talking about installer images? That's a different matter than packages.
• 2403[21:04:53] <greycat> There should be sha1 or md5 or something files in the same directory as the installer images, if that's what you're talking about.
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• 2414[21:11:04] <uio> Found it!
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• 2416[21:11:27] <uio> greycat: Thanks. Yes, each package has a sha256 as well.
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• 2446[21:26:44] <rwp> uio, Finish the installation completely before being too concerned about the fan and heat. Install 'tlp' package to help reduce power when on battery.
• 2447[21:27:54] <rwp> uio, Also your X61 is not a spring chicken, is that fan making noise? It could be that you are noticing it more because the bearings are wearing and it is noisy. If the fan bearings get old and tired they make more noise. It is easy to replace if this bothers you or if the fan actually fails. Have replaced many thinkpad fans. Not too scary.
• 2448[21:28:01] *** Quits: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 2449[21:28:38] <uio> rwp: Thanks for the info! I must admit I am a bit concerned, but true, a bit of noise after a decade is normal!
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• 2456[21:30:11] <rwp> uio, The Linux kernel has several different power profiles. By default it is 'ondemand' when on AC power.
• 2457[21:30:16] <rwp> You can read about it here: replaced-url
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• 2476[21:42:31] <uio> rwp: it's installing...
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• 2478[21:43:02] <rwp> Good luck!
• 2479[21:43:03] <uio> wiping the disk to install Debian.
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• 2481[21:43:18] <uio> Good-bye Windows! We will miss you dearly!
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• 2483[21:43:28] <uio> lol
• 2484[21:43:33] <rwp> Miss you? How can we miss you if you don't go away? :-)
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• 2500[21:53:01] * HeXiLeD laughs
• 2501[21:53:09] <TReK> hey there, everytime i boot my dell e7440 up i get this msg: „mmc0: Unknown Controller version (3). you may experience problems.“ can someone assist me?
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• 2504[21:53:22] <mason> TReK: Your laptop is too new for the kernel.
• 2505[21:53:28] <mason> TReK: Ignore it.
• 2506[21:53:34] <TReK> ok :D
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• 2508[21:53:52] <TReK> laptop is 3-4 years old :)
• 2509[21:53:53] <mason> TReK: If it really bothers you, maybe try a backported/newer kernel.
• 2510[21:54:06] <mason> TReK: I get the same message on a couple of newer boxes here.
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• 2512[21:54:32] <mason> I ignore it, and so far that's paid off handsomely.
• 2513[21:54:34] <TReK> okay, i was just wondering and just thought there is a easy fix for it
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• 2515[21:55:36] <diogenes_> TReK, maybe disable the card reader in bios if you not using sd cards
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• 2522[21:56:25] <TReK> i‘ve to use them because my camera
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• 2525[21:56:46] <rwp> Where do you "get that message"? /var/log/syslog ? Or written to the console?
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• 2529[21:57:27] <TReK> before it starts up window
• 2530[21:57:32] <TReK> -window
• 2531[21:57:50] <rwp> That is still ambiguous to me... Please clarify further?
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• 2535[21:58:14] <rwp> If it is a console message then you can filter the console messages, pretty much must filter console messages, by setting the kernel message level.
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• 2538[21:58:21] <rwp> replaced-url
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• 2545[21:59:02] <rwp> I suggest at least "dmesg -n5" to keep things sanely and usably quiet. Otherwise I get a lot of console messages such as from the firewall.
• 2546[21:59:36] <TReK> let me try it
• 2547[21:59:45] <rwp> RH sets it to 3 by default. Debian defaults to the kernel default, which is to say 8 by default.
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• 2549[22:00:29] <rwp> For me using Shorewall as a firewall the best place to put that is in /etc/shorewall/init and therefore it is run when my network comes online and triggers a firewall rule refresh.
• 2550[22:00:45] <rwp> But there are many other ways to do it. I don't really know the best place for something like that.
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• 2557[22:02:41] <TReK> still get it with dmesg -n5
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• 2566[22:09:40] <TReK> anyway diogenes_, you are right, its the sd card reader, disabled it in bios and didnt get the msg
• 2567[22:10:09] <diogenes_> nice
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• 2569[22:11:25] <TReK> thanks :)
• 2570[22:11:35] <diogenes_> yw
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• 2572[22:13:33] <uio> diogenes_: Go back to your barrel! :)
• 2573[22:13:49] <diogenes_> uio, i'm actually chatting from it :)
• 2574[22:13:59] <uio> diogenes_: lol
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• 2577[22:14:10] <diogenes_> :)
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• 2625[22:47:00] <uio> What is the keyboard layout of the cryptsetup entry prompt?
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• 2627[22:47:40] <uio> Does it detect the language chosen during install, or does it revert back to US keyboard??
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• 2631[22:48:33] <petn-randall> uio: I'd assume it is US english, but maybe initramfs already sets up the keyboard.
• 2632[22:48:55] * petn-randall uses US english keyboard layout despite using other languages.
• 2633[22:49:06] <uio> petn-randall: Oh no...
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• 2635[22:49:12] <thatpythonguy> if I'm not using a DE, what tools are available (cli or gui) to set/choose qt theme?
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• 2640[22:52:46] <jhutchins> thatpythonguy: replaced-url
• 2641[22:52:46] <jhutchins> replaced-url
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• 2646[22:54:20] <uio> I'm locked out...
• 2647[22:54:24] *** Quits: dethos (~dethos@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 2648[22:54:24] <uio> damn
• 2649[22:54:43] <petn-randall> uio: You cna always recover with a life image to boot from.
• 2650[22:55:01] <uio> petn-randall: ie reinstall??
• 2651[22:55:09] <uio> petn-randall: That took ages!
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• 2658[22:57:03] <uio> damn
• 2659[22:57:23] <petn-randall> uio: I never said you should reinstall.
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• 2663[22:58:02] <petn-randall> uio: According to the package documentation, the local keymap is used. So you might just have mistyped or changed your layout.
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• 2666[22:58:28] <uio> petn-randall: Okay. So, assuming I've forgotten the pass, I must reinstall?
• 2667[22:58:38] <uio> because I keep trying and nothing is happneing.
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• 2670[22:59:14] <petn-randall> uio: Yes, if you don't know your password anymore, all the data is safe (and thus gone).
• 2671[22:59:26] <uio> petn-randall: sigh
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• 2673[23:00:09] <petn-randall> uio: That's why I said you should use a live system, to test the keyboard layout, and then verify the password.
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• 2677[23:00:59] *** rdv is now known as iLLuminAUGHTY
• 2678[23:01:00] <uio> it dropped to shell, and yes, the keyboardmap is local.
• 2679[23:01:14] *** Joins: devbaka (~devbaka@replaced-ip)
• 2680[23:02:09] <petn-randall> uio: Then try again to decrypt the LUKS container. If all attempts don't work, you either typed a different password or forgot it.
• 2681[23:02:23] *** Quits: mortn_ (~morten@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 2682[23:02:52] <uio> damn
• 2683[23:03:07] <uio> petn-randall: thanks for your help, but damn
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• 2685[23:03:38] <uio> can I brute force it if I remember most of it?
• 2686[23:04:07] <joepublic> is your species especially long-lived?
• 2687[23:05:00] <petn-randall> uio: Maybe. Maybe not.
• 2688[23:05:42] <petn-randall> uio: By default, every attempt will take a bit more than a second. Do the math yourself how long it would take to go through all relevant combinations.
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• 2695[23:08:32] <HeXiLeD> is there a standalone GUI IM app for facebook on any .deb repos ?
• 2696[23:08:44] <annadane> facebook's not federated
• 2697[23:08:53] <annadane> so you can't connect to it using stuff like matrix
• 2698[23:08:57] <uio> petn-randall: And there is no programme that can test it if I input what I remember - if it's wrong, I'm very close, so it wouldn't be real brute force.
• 2699[23:08:57] *** Joins: Wioxjk (~poppels@replaced-ip)
• 2700[23:09:06] <HeXiLeD> that really answers my question annadane ... :|
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• 2702[23:09:16] <annadane> it really does, though
• 2703[23:09:16] *** Joins: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip)
• 2704[23:09:22] <HeXiLeD> no it does not.
• 2705[23:09:23] <annadane> without the snide sarcasm
• 2706[23:09:37] <HeXiLeD> i can access fb chats with 3rd poarty im apps.
• 2707[23:09:42] *** Joins: beaver (~none@replaced-ip)
• 2708[23:09:46] <HeXiLeD> but i am loking for a gui one for someone else
• 2709[23:09:50] *** Quits: dionysus69 (~dionysus6@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.1+deb2+b1 - ##replaced-url
• 2710[23:10:28] <HeXiLeD> so if you are going to come with snide sarcasm, at least be well informed up to where you can take it.
• 2711[23:10:46] <uio> HeXiLeD: Wow!
• 2712[23:10:49] <annadane> you're the one who started using sarcasm, not me, and that's indisputable. but whatever. i'm done talking to you
• 2713[23:11:16] <uio> HeXiLeD: Breathe.
• 2714[23:11:18] <HeXiLeD> i simply asked if anyone knows of a gui app IM that can be used ti FB to chat.
• 2715[23:11:41] <whislock> HeXiLeD: You're not going to get much assistance with that approach.
• 2716[23:11:44] <HeXiLeD> then i was attacked with sarcasm. And i am the one at fault ?
• 2717[23:11:50] <whislock> HeXiLeD: You weren't attacked at all.
• 2718[23:11:51] <uio> HeXiLeD: You can imagine that these waters are perhaps not super pro-FB...
• 2719[23:12:09] <HeXiLeD> i am not even an FB user. i trying to help someone else.
• 2720[23:12:20] *** Parts: technobi (~Unknown@replaced-ip) ()
• 2721[23:12:22] <whislock> HeXiLeD: annadane responded to your inquiry simply and accurately. You blew up.
• 2722[23:12:43] <HeXiLeD> no. annadane told me FB is not federated.
• 2723[23:12:59] <HeXiLeD> that is not a direct question and also not well informed in regards to my question
• 2724[23:13:06] <petn-randall> Ok everyone, please adhere to standard netiquette. This also includes "assume good faith in the responses you read". Let's move on.
• 2725[23:13:11] <HeXiLeD> annadane: also admited snide sarcasm
• 2726[23:13:20] *** Quits: Brainium (~brainium@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 2727[23:13:37] <whislock> HeXiLeD: No part of what I said to you ended in a question mark. It was not an invitation to debate, it was a statement of fact. Good luck.
• 2728[23:13:53] *** Joins: Brainium (~brainium@replaced-ip)
• 2729[23:14:01] <petn-randall> uio: Sure. It just might need to run longer than you live, though.
• 2730[23:14:06] <n4dir> you could join fb chat with pidgin, in the past (iirc). But it was removed (again: iirc)
• 2731[23:14:06] <uio> HeXiLeD: Let's pretend that the last three minutes didn't happen. Try your question again...
• 2732[23:14:08] *** Quits: ml| (~ml|@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
• 2733[23:14:22] <uio> petn-randall: I'll just reinstall.
• 2734[23:14:32] <uio> petn-randall: I really kick myself though...
• 2735[23:14:40] <uio> petn-randall: So annoying!!!
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• 2739[23:15:40] <EdePopede> wait, there are fb alternatives on the desktop to the browser? i thought they'd throw some client to the usual mobile OS's and that's it. or is there really more?
• 2740[23:15:43] <HeXiLeD> n4dir: correct. I have tested that and hence why annadane federated answer does not address my basic question. bitlbee used to facilitate it too. However this methods are not very user friendly for a non techsavvy person. Hence my initial question.
• 2741[23:16:13] <HeXiLeD> i think/thought that there is a gui app for desktop.
• 2742[23:16:25] <petn-randall> uio: It's a good idea to have a backup keyslot, and put the key somewhere safe. I also recommend keeping backups of the actual data, too.
• 2743[23:16:25] *** Joins: otmi (~mito@replaced-ip)
• 2744[23:16:39] <uio> petn-randall: It was a fresh install.
• 2745[23:16:46] <HeXiLeD> and wondering if it is on any deb repos. i think i read something about being on ubuntu repos
• 2746[23:16:54] <uio> petn-randall: Which is why I'm irked.
• 2747[23:17:11] <uio> petn-randall: After a few hours of trying...
• 2748[23:17:21] <EdePopede> HeXiLeD: what 3rd party IM app were you talking about?
• 2749[23:17:31] *** Parts: jdlent (~jdlent@replaced-ip) ("until next time...")
• 2750[23:17:53] <HeXiLeD> EdePopede: i think it was called messenger but i am not sure. was a while ago.
• 2751[23:18:13] <EdePopede> isn't this their official app?
• 2752[23:18:15] <petn-randall> HeXiLeD: The reason there's no such tool is that Facebook Messenger is not a public protocol, so you won't find any libre apps for it. They also don't have a public API for the messenger, AFAIK. Which limits your options to anything that Facebook provides.
• 2753[23:18:37] <petn-randall> HeXiLeD: Facebook Messenger _used_ to be XMPP, which has about a dozen clients in Debian.
• 2754[23:18:40] <n4dir> HeXiLeD: the german ubuntu-wiki mentions instantbird (but that wiki can be out of date)
• 2755[23:18:54] <EdePopede> iirc they had XMPP many years ago, but since i never used it, not even sure about that
• 2756[23:18:56] <HeXiLeD> petn-randall: agreed. that much i know. and EdePopede i think it may have been.
• 2757[23:18:58] <n4dir> also says what petn-randall just said
• 2758[23:19:09] *** Quits: BlueByte (~walther@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
• 2759[23:19:12] <joepublic> apt search on Trisquel returns the following: unity-webapps-facebookmessenger/flidas 2.4.16+16.04.20151119-0ubuntu1 all - Unity Webapp for FacebookMessenger
• 2760[23:19:14] <EdePopede> HeXiLeD: don't expect fb&co to support linux
• 2761[23:19:22] <petn-randall> (which is a *federated* protocol, coming back to what annadane said)
• 2762[23:19:23] <HeXiLeD> EdePopede: yah with XMPP was easier to connect with 3rd party apps
• 2763[23:19:35] <HeXiLeD> EdePopede: agreed again. sadly
• 2764[23:19:37] <EdePopede> web..app... sounds like electron :o
• 2765[23:19:49] *** Quits: jcmesar (~jcmesar@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
• 2766[23:19:54] <HeXiLeD> ummm EdePopede that makes some sense....
• 2767[23:20:16] *** Quits: RebelCoder (~RebelCode@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 2768[23:21:18] <EdePopede> HeXiLeD: if you have the ressources *cough* maybe Fritz could help. i abandoned it after seeing how much it uses even without starting connections, only by activating the individual modules
• 2769[23:21:18] *** Joins: leorat (~rat@replaced-ip)
• 2770[23:21:48] <HeXiLeD> you mean the use of electron ?
• 2771[23:21:59] *** Joins: whira_ (~whira@replaced-ip)
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• 2773[23:22:25] <EdePopede> afaik they have still no clue how to push ads to their app users, this may be even worse with 3rd party xD
• 2774[23:22:39] <HeXiLeD> agreed
• 2775[23:22:50] <EdePopede> HeXiLeD: if you feel like torturing your pc, then yes :D
• 2776[23:22:57] <Bjornn> pidgen internet messaging, I can't remember if I installed it or it was part of my install or what. does this thing have any practical use? seems like an old software?
• 2777[23:23:01] *** Quits: pax (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: pax)
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• 2780[23:23:17] <uio> Bjornn: It's great!
• 2781[23:23:27] <HeXiLeD> eheh. well i do have electron but have not spend time playing with it. Resources being a potential barrier.
• 2782[23:23:28] <uio> Bjornn: I use it often for audio chat.
• 2783[23:23:33] <uio> Bjornn: Super light
• 2784[23:23:44] *** Joins: Thedarkb-M90 (~Thedarkb3@replaced-ip)
• 2785[23:23:51] <hypn0> hey, I use it on irc Bjornn
• 2786[23:23:53] <HeXiLeD> Bjornn: works with lots os IM protocols and supports otr and maybe omemo.
• 2787[23:23:54] <joepublic> a lot of people are down on electron, but it works crazy well
• 2788[23:23:56] *** Quits: vivid (~ViViD@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2789[23:23:57] <Bjornn> I first though it could be a front end for multiple chat programs.
• 2790[23:23:58] <EdePopede> seems rather versatile, Bjornn > replaced-url
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• 2793[23:24:10] <petn-randall> Bjornn: pidgin supports a bunch of protocols, so it's still current.
• 2794[23:24:22] *** Quits: krabador (~krabador@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2795[23:24:23] <Bjornn> facebook messenger?
• 2796[23:24:24] <hypn0> its pretty good Bjornn
• 2797[23:24:33] <HeXiLeD> Bjornn: at some point.
• 2798[23:24:36] *** Joins: krabador (~krabador@replaced-ip)
• 2799[23:24:50] <Bjornn> I use facebook messenger and what's app the most
• 2800[23:25:06] *** Joins: hiller (~ismail@replaced-ip)
• 2801[23:25:24] <HeXiLeD> can you elaborate on what you mean by facebook messenger ?
• 2802[23:25:25] <Bjornn> I'm using add-ins through opera for both. would this be better?
• 2803[23:25:30] <HeXiLeD> ah
• 2804[23:25:35] <skinhaptik> Bjornn: I don't use either - but signal is great app :D
• 2805[23:25:35] <HeXiLeD> ok.
• 2806[23:25:46] <HeXiLeD> yah signal and conversations/gajim
• 2807[23:25:53] <HeXiLeD> are the apps to go with but this is another topic
• 2808[23:26:11] <Bjornn> I'll look those up then.
• 2809[23:26:18] <EdePopede> wait... i read that fb shuts down xmpp (2015), but also how to use it (2017). and the plugin is from 2017 too, it seems.
• 2810[23:26:18] <Bjornn> thanks for the input everyone.
• 2811[23:26:22] <HeXiLeD> so at some point ... replaced-url
• 2812[23:26:32] *** Quits: tyranny12 (~blarg@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
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• 2814[23:26:54] <EdePopede> exactly that one, HeXiLeD
• 2815[23:26:57] <HeXiLeD> however the use of this, is not just plug and play.
• 2816[23:27:05] <HeXiLeD> and yes i tested it.
• 2817[23:27:15] <Bjornn> well, if anyone has this working for facebook msg please pm me and give me a tip on how to get it going?
• 2818[23:27:34] <HeXiLeD> but i am not the avg user and now am looking to help a senior person
• 2819[23:27:45] <EdePopede> would you recommend it? (just the plugin, not fb per se o/c)
• 2820[23:28:09] *** Quits: nyaomi (~naomi@replaced-ip) (Quit: meow)
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• 2825[23:28:15] <HeXiLeD> Bjornn: i would say to join oftc #bitlbee and ask there about the this plugin. the dev is usually there.
• 2826[23:28:23] <EdePopede> fb is a horror in the browser, even the chat....
• 2827[23:28:27] <babilen> Facebook messenger was built on top of XMPP before. Facebook then realised that it can't monetize that very well ...
• 2828[23:28:37] <HeXiLeD> EdePopede: sorry, are you asking me if i recommend?
• 2829[23:28:38] <Bjornn> ok thanks for the suggestion HeXiLeD
• 2830[23:28:42] <babilen> I also think this is better suited for -offtopic
• 2831[23:28:45] <HeXiLeD> babilen: correct.
• 2832[23:28:51] *** Joins: nyaomi (~naomi@replaced-ip)
• 2833[23:28:52] <EdePopede> HeXiLeD: indeed, since you said you know it :=)
• 2834[23:29:02] <HeXiLeD> it kind got off topic.
• 2835[23:29:06] *** Joins: Tarrasquero (~Tarrasque@replaced-ip)
• 2836[23:29:29] <HeXiLeD> EdePopede: well give it try is you tech savvy . I use bitlbee for a bunch of things in combination with weechat
• 2837[23:29:30] <babilen> Obviously third-party clients had a much easier time connecting to it back in the day. Not sure if any third-party client access is possible these days (don't facebook, so haven't kept up-to-date)
• 2838[23:29:47] <HeXiLeD> babilen: up. this is the current issue.
• 2839[23:30:56] <EdePopede> pidgin has 2.12 in the repo, so not even need to wake up Frankendebian
• 2840[23:31:00] <Bjornn> I get a channel unavailable for bitlbee
• 2841[23:31:14] <Bjornn> I'll search it. ..
• 2842[23:31:27] <HeXiLeD> Bjornn: nop. it is active on oftc
• 2843[23:31:35] <HeXiLeD> so there is or there was this replaced-url
• 2844[23:31:46] <babilen> tbh, I'd just use it i you *really* have to and get people to use saner clients like signal/jabber/irc/… for communication.
• 2845[23:33:04] * Bjornn likes sane
• 2846[23:33:28] <EdePopede> babilen: indeed. the problem as i've seen through the years are users of the kind using outdated mIRC because of their special scripts which had been abandoned years ago. just wanting something to klick on.
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• 2849[23:34:40] <Bjornn> I guess I need a definition of oftc to go forward
• 2850[23:34:41] <HeXiLeD> so, this url fb messenger, upon execution states that is no longer supported since march 3 -2014
• 2851[23:34:58] <EdePopede> Bjornn: topic ;)
• 2852[23:35:35] *** Quits: drax- (drax1-@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2853[23:35:46] <joepublic> dpkg: tell Bjornn about oftc
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• 2856[23:36:19] <EdePopede> this goes into the query then?
• 2857[23:37:03] <HeXiLeD> anyway guys, thanks for the honest feedback. was appreciated.
• 2858[23:37:05] *** Quits: noln (~noln@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2859[23:37:14] <EdePopede> good luck HeXiLeD
• 2860[23:37:27] *** Quits: dreamon (~dreamon@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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• 2862[23:37:53] <HeXiLeD> bitlbee is available for debian so if you ( Bjornn ) test it with fb, drop me a line in regards how it goes with fb.
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• 2867[23:39:05] <Bjornn> ok, I"ll install it and play with it.
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• 2870[23:39:31] <Bjornn> that's linux 101, jump in feet first delete the helpfile and run with it!
• 2871[23:40:11] <rwp> uio, I assume that most of the time it took on the first installation was laying down random bits on the device before the encryption step. You might save a lot of time by canceling out of that step this time since it was done last time.
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• 2874[23:41:03] <HeXiLeD> Bjornn: if you decide to keep biltbee. i would recommend to install from source on a specific user with limited rights
• 2875[23:41:13] <rwp> uio, At least it was a fresh installation though and so you haven't lost anything that you can't get back again by doing another fresh install.
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• 2884[23:44:35] <jhutchins> uio: Encryption wouldn't be worth much if it were easy to recover the password.
• 2885[23:45:22] <annadane> CorrectHorseBatteryStaple
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• 2887[23:46:05] <joepublic> hey. that's the password on my luggage.
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• 2890[23:47:48] <jhutchins> I've actually used variations of that when requirements get ridiculous.
• 2891[23:48:40] <joepublic> Error: your password must contain a farm animal. Error: Your farm animal may not match the last fifteen farm animals you have used. Error: That is anatomically impossible.,
• 2892[23:48:40] <uio> jhutchins: But what would be interesting would be a tool when one puts what they remember to make augmented brute force easy.
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• 2895[23:49:12] <uio> rwp: Right, it's at 82% wiping... is skiping serious??
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• 2897[23:50:08] <rwp> I believe that step is laying down nothing but random bits under everything. The noise hides the encrypted data which also looks like noise.
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• 2899[23:50:35] <uio> rwp: So it's pretty useless then!!
• 2900[23:50:37] <rwp> Since it was just done when you installed previously and you are doing exactly the same thing again then I think it would be okay to cancel out of that step.
• 2901[23:50:54] <uio> cool
• 2902[23:51:04] <rwp> When a new device arrives from the facotry it is mostly all zero data over everything.
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• 2904[23:51:54] <rwp> It is trivial to detect the start and end of file system blocks, encrypted or otherwise. Therefore putting random data everywhere first and encrypted file system also looks like random data. Makes everything look the same.
• 2905[23:52:08] <annadane> at that point, *you* are the farm animal, change your password to your name, get hacked, and have no idea what happened
• 2906[23:52:18] <annadane> what a sheep.
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• 2912[23:53:52] <rwp> Just to be clear, it was really useful to do the first time you did it. :-)
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• 2915[23:55:28] <rwp> The whole "password recovery" if possible is proof that the imlementation was insecure. If it is secure then there is no recovery.
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• 2919[23:57:50] <rwp> Interestingly though it is possible to have multiple LUKS passphrases active. I believe the procedure to change a LUKS password is to create another one in another slot. Then delete the first one.
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