77[00:21:18] <mike__> but you must admit it is frustrating when
you wanna show someone a video about linux ,you just downloaded and
the moment you choose to go to "videos" folder vlc will
play a porn you downloaded by mistake :
145[00:35:44] <annadane> depends on the package, you may be able
to
146[00:35:45] <annadane> !ssb
147[00:35:45] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on
<debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for
sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable
debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) aptitude update; aptitude
install build-essential; aptitude build-dep packagename; apt-get -b
source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. To change
compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions
newer than sid see <uupdate>.
148[00:35:55] <Guest97377> here is 1.35 am
149[00:36:11] <Guest97377> i am new here . i mean on linux
225[00:45:47] <dpkg> pastebin.com mangles input, takes forever
to load, often makes us enter a CAPTCHA to see your paste and fills
the screen with ads. Please use a different site, like
replaced-url
251[00:51:54] *** Quits: hele (~hele@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
252[00:52:16] <mike__> i actually said that i did ask three days
ago and no answer . i am a kind of a bitch that will drill anyway
and i asked nicely here .Iv got responds and there we go now you
telling me politely to fk off ?
253[00:53:11] <annadane> fine, stay here then. *shrug*
254[00:53:12] <Kelsar> mike__: we don't know who parrot
handles those thing, which patches they added and so on, but yes,
basically you are right
255[00:54:00] <mike__> Kelsar, ok thank you wish you all the
best :)
256[00:54:18] <aokfire> Here is the full df -h sorry
replaced-url
257[00:54:30] <aokfire> it looks like various
"virtual" folders are using space?
260[00:54:58] <annadane> anyway, try using mozo if it's in
the parrot repository, it allows you to edit the MATE menu and you
may be able to change the file path so what you're trying to
open, opens
327[01:38:46] <petn-randall> maxcell_: `apt purge xfce4`, then
run `apt autoremove` and pay close attention to the list of packages
it wants to remove.
329[01:39:49] <agio> hi all, Im running minimal debian install,
yet something is causing my screen to turn off about every 5 or 10
minutes. does anyone know how to fix this?
340[01:45:40] <tomman> I need some advice for an update
341[01:46:06] <petn-randall> !ask
342[01:46:06] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For
example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian
version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I
expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if
anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all
volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get
an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org.
See <smart questions><errors>.
343[01:46:09] *** Quits: alxy (uid115853@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
344[01:46:15] <tomman> I have this old Wheezy setup on a i586
box (my routerbox, which is a Pentium MMX thing) which I'll
going to update to Jessie
345[01:46:28] <tomman> (sadly Stretch is not an option anymore
for i586 gear)
346[01:46:53] <tomman> would it be wise to switch to systemd
boot on it, or should I stick to sysvinit on such an old target?
347[01:47:18] <tomman> (I already imaged my boot HDD so rolling
back would not be an issue)
348[01:47:25] *** Quits: argus (~down@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
356[01:49:21] <tomman> I'm about to pull the trigger on
this, just need some advice on that point
357[01:49:25] *** Quits: todd_dsm (~todd_dsm@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
358[01:49:31] <petn-randall> tomman: The age or power of your
system is irrelevant for deciding for or against systemd.
359[01:50:21] <petn-randall> tomman: systemd also runs fine on
embedded systems (it even targets those systems), so it'll run
fine on your Pentium.
360[01:50:42] *** Quits: krabador (~krabador@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
361[01:50:43] <tomman> So I should give it a try there?
362[01:51:04] <petn-randall> tomman: However, IIRC systemd was a
tech preview in jessie, so you'd have to switch by hand,
whereas on an upgrade to stretch this would happen automagically.
363[01:51:21] <tomman> wasn't a tech preview in Wheezy?
364[01:51:42] <tomman> IIRC all of my Wheezy setups got switched
automatically to systemd when I migrated them to Jessie
390[02:00:25] *** Quits: nighty- (~nighty@replaced-ip) (Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke)
391[02:00:45] <maxcell_> petn-randall, when i apt purge xfce4 he
wants to remove openoffice as well, there is any way i uninstall
everything but openoffice?
392[02:00:54] <LtL> agio: its probably DPMS, type 'xset
q' in a terminal. no root perms required
393[02:01:06] *** Quits: de-facto (~de-facto@replaced-ip) (Quit: See you around.)
454[02:45:59] <dpkg> Debian strives to maintain your freedom
whilst also paying close attention to the technical aspects of
making a great OS. Debian is stable, upgradable and well tested. See
also
replaced-url
510[03:25:14] <A|an> why is there a transitional package (i
guess!) for icedove AND a separate package for thunderbird? Can you
place the contents of .icedove from a previous installation into
.thunderbird?
524[03:38:19] <buu> Hey, I have a debian box booted without a
monitor with an nvidia card as its only video output. Now that
it's running I can ssh into as normal but if I plug a monitor
into it, the monitor shows no signal, even when I tap on the
keyboard
525[03:38:30] <buu> Is there a trick to get debian to launch the
framebuffer?
526[03:38:34] <buu> (Since X isn't running)
527[03:39:32] *** doubledu1ch is now known as doubledutch
538[03:43:54] <wtfdeb> Is there something wrong with the repos?
I'm unable to get packages like sudo..
539[03:45:04] <somiaj> wtfdeb: what is the output of apt policy
on your system, and your /etc/apt/sources.list, and any files in
/etc/apt/sources.list.d/, put output at paste.debian.net
540[03:45:31] *** Quits: Zorroness (~Zorroness@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
550[03:50:04] <somiaj> you are missing the main stretch sources,
you only have secuirty updates, and stretch-updates, you don't
actually have 'stretch' repos
578[04:11:06] <rant> I'm a bit concerned about the way vlc
is behaving on my system I been using it to watch movies and tv and
its using a LOT of ram.. I've started it this time playing a
short 20mb or so 3min low res file on loop and its been going about
20min now and its using 1.8G of ram which is over half my ram
579[04:11:52] <rant> only a small portion of my nearly totally
used ram is showing as light green on my graph which is shared/cache
which can be reclaimed
580[04:13:24] <rant> just wondering what thoughts are on this
and if anyone can think of how I might be able to multi-task
better.. I got 4g ram I should be able to play a video and a game
I'd think
581[04:14:19] <rant> I could maybe see this kinda usage being
normal i I were decoding a dvd right now or playing a long high res
file thata was 1gb or more but to have it doing it with a small low
res clip seems ridiculous
582[04:14:49] <somiaj> ditch vlc and use mpv? I'm not quiet
sure why vlc is using so much ram, maybe it is just buffering things
because it can and the memeory is available
583[04:15:52] <rant> yeah but I'd think buffers would show
as light green my graph is more than 80% dark green which is not
buffers
584[04:16:07] <Javabean> are you upscaling the video you are
watching?
603[04:21:29] <rant> those are for getting streaming videos from
the internet.. which is an odd dep for a media player.. seems like
more a suggests/recommends kinda thing
604[04:21:35] <somiaj> yt-dl is recommended
605[04:21:40] *** Quits: todd_dsm (~todd_dsm@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
606[04:21:50] <rant> ah.. apt installs recommends by default?
607[04:21:54] <somiaj> yup
608[04:22:07] <rant> I started using apt but not fully aware of
all its diferences
609[04:22:29] <rant> i still use apt-cache at times cause it
doesnt format its output like apt search
610[04:24:14] <rant> somiaj: is there some trick to getting some
UI on this mpv? this having to drag/drop files thing is annoying
617[04:26:44] <rant> I dont readily see playlist functions, or
even simple load file with mpv.. which now that I recall is why I
removed it the first time :P
621[04:27:41] <Javabean> i did the same with dragon
622[04:28:09] <somiaj> rant: I don't think so, mpv is
command line which is why I like it. I did write a small python
script to control it.
623[04:28:20] <rant> the new style UI of many gnome apps like
the Videos, Boxes, etc where its sparse chrome is fugly to me too
624[04:28:36] <somiaj> mpv file.playlist will paly the play
list, or mpv *mp3 will create a playlist
625[04:28:46] <rant> yeah I know mplayer well I'd sooner
use that than this
626[04:29:37] <rant> really I like vlc.. it has a media browser
I can save all my various media locations and make playlists
easily.. has very flexible ui
627[04:30:22] <farruinn> Have you checked to see if there is a
bug filed for the memory behavior?
628[04:30:25] <Javabean> yes vlc is far better as a gui video
player, but i unfortunately don't know why you are having this
kind of issue
629[04:30:29] <somiaj> mpv is the mplayer fork, that I've
gotten use to
630[04:30:44] <somiaj> mplayer was dead for a while, it came
back, but I still think mpv has some nice features
631[04:30:50] <rant> gmplayer was never good but it had a better
ui than this
639[04:34:22] <rant> pretty sure I didnt compile it or anything
640[04:34:34] <rant> I havent compiled mplayer in like a decade
641[04:35:27] <somiaj> there was an mplayer transtiional package
that pointed at mplayer2
642[04:35:42] <somiaj> and mplayer was an alternative that could
either run mplayer2 or mpv
643[04:35:47] <somiaj> I switched to mpv at tha ttime.
644[04:35:55] <somiaj> then mplayer came back in stretch
645[04:35:58] <somiaj> and mplayer2 died
646[04:36:10] <somiaj> oh mplayer2 transitioned to mpv
647[04:37:15] <rant> oh well I guess I'll have to see i I
can lower usage o vlc and if not I either gotta find another
suitable player or write a script around mplayer
654[04:41:44] <somiaj> though there hasn't been much change
in mplayer, I think I went with mpv as it removed a good amount of
the older stuff from player, and suit my needs, though as I said I
use a python script to talk to its api
655[04:41:56] <somiaj> but still command line, I don't do
much with gui stuff
683[05:07:37] <dvs> strive, chances you'll need the
firmware iso to detect wifi
684[05:07:49] <strive> dvs: Ah, ok. Thanks.
685[05:08:21] <strive> I've got the dvd1 iso
686[05:08:31] <strive> Firmware not included on there, eh?
687[05:08:42] <dvs> probably not
688[05:08:51] <strive> Darn.
689[05:09:01] <strive> !firmware
690[05:09:01] <dpkg> Firmware is software to operate electronic
devices, usually contained in EPROM or flash memory. Some Linux
kernel drivers require firmware to be provided from userspace,
notably for <WiFi> devices. Most firmware files are not part
of a Debian release as they do not conform to the <DFSG>; some
are available via <contrib> and <non-free> packages, ask
me about <search>. See also <installer firmware>.
replaced-url
691[05:09:13] <dvs> !tell strive about firmware iso
846[07:37:43] <altker128> Hey guys. I want to copy a Debian 9.4
install from one HDD to another. I use gparted for that but I know
the UUID for the drive will be different. Besides updating grub
& fstab, what else needs to be done?
847[07:38:05] *** Quits: aeliton (~aeliton@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
893[08:07:38] <annadane> we went through this earlier
894[08:07:42] <Guest59144> yes :)
895[08:08:20] <its-a-me> hello guys, after fresh install, for
some reason sddm (KDE) doesn.t start immediately. Pc always boots in
a TTY1, then after a while I'm finally greeted by the KDE
login. "sudo systemctl get-default" gives
graphical.target.
896[08:08:22] <annadane> Kelsar suggested doing something with
mime types and i suggested using mozo to edit menu entries
897[08:08:25] <annadane> beyond that, we can't help you
898[08:08:44] <Guest59144> but they dont answer for ages ! :)
901[08:09:08] <annadane> at least say you're on parrot...
*i* happen to know this because i was here
902[08:09:13] <annadane> to everyone else, you're "on
debian"
903[08:09:14] *** Martyn is now known as Guest59875
904[08:09:41] <annadane> its-a-me, did you install KDE via the
installer?
905[08:09:53] <Guest59144> ok sorry .
906[08:09:58] <its-a-me> yes
907[08:10:37] <annadane> i would say we *may* be able to help
you if you're on parrot (even though as you've been told
it's against policy to do so) when there's no other
activity in the room. but now, someone has a debian question, so
that takes priority
908[08:10:47] <kupp> its-a-me: i had the same problem with
nvidia-driver recently
911[08:11:07] <dpkg> We're sorry your distro's channel
isn't being helpful, but that doesn't make it appropriate
to use #debian for non-Debian questions. Please go back to your
channel and wait patiently for better help, or install Debian and
party with us.
912[08:11:10] *** Quits: QcR (uid292442@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
913[08:11:21] <Guest59144> annadane, i can wait :) thank you
914[08:11:33] <annadane> so you can wait here, but not in the
parrot channel?
915[08:11:35] <annadane> ok
916[08:11:37] <annadane> whatever
917[08:12:33] <its-a-me> #kupp I only have igpu on a thinkpad
919[08:13:16] <Guest59144> dpkg, why are you so xenophobic ?
parrot is debian . and is linux and i dont feel (knowing how helpful
is a linux community) braking any "rools"
920[08:13:16] <dpkg> Guest59144: what are you talking about?
921[08:13:30] <annadane> dpkg is simply a bot, which i invoked
via !they don't know
922[08:13:30] <dpkg> annadane: I wish you would RTFM.
923[08:13:47] <annadane> the "rools" are in place for
a reason
928[08:15:17] <Guest59144> annadane, i am sure they are but ill
say again that parrot is still a debian and i could understand
complaining if i am looking for help on lets say arch or suse
channel
929[08:15:27] <annadane> !based on debian
930[08:15:27] <dpkg> Your distribution may be based on and have
software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't
and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare
replaced-url
931[08:15:36] <annadane> and now i'll say nothing more
about it, you've heard my point
933[08:15:43] <Guest59144> well ill really appreciate any help
934[08:16:04] <kupp> !dpkg
935[08:16:05] <dpkg> rumour has it, dpkg is the program used by
Debian to install and remove packages, "man dpkg". Also
ask me about <reference>. The main info bot in #debian is also
called dpkg; ask me about <dpkgbot>.
947[08:18:24] <Guest59144> annadane, "so you can wait here,
but not in the parrot channel?" i never said i am not waiting
there. you can go there and see if you "dont trust me "
956[08:21:57] <annadane> it's a "crime" according
to the other people who have asked you not to ask here about it.
sure, purge vlc and reinstall it, see if it helps, but i doubt it
985[08:31:39] <its-a-me> annadane: ty, was very helpul actually.
I run without 'blame' and it says that graphical.target
reached afet
986[08:31:48] <its-a-me> after almost 4seconds in userspace
987[08:32:41] <annadane> i know KDE can sometimes be slow on
some hard drives but it shouldn't take that long to go from tty
to sddm login screen
988[08:32:54] <annadane> graphics card issue? i rather doubt it
989[08:32:58] <its-a-me> and it's an ssd
990[08:33:04] <annadane> yeah, well, there you go
991[08:33:29] <annadane> its-a-me, it's also possible that
that was a one-time thing and the next time you startup your
computer the delay won't be as long
992[08:33:54] <annadane> initial post install configuration, or
something
993[08:34:00] <annadane> but i really don't know what
i'm talking about
994[08:35:35] <its-a-me> it does it always, I've rebooted
many times
995[08:36:14] <its-a-me> and if I don't login in the tty it
stays there
997[08:36:38] <annadane> perhaps also check out systemd-analyze
critical-chain
998[08:37:14] <its-a-me> after I login, a couple of seconds pass
and I'm greet by sddm's login screen - and have to type pw
again
999[08:37:24] <mike__> annadane, yes you was right . obviously
after "purge" it was ok but soon i installed it again same
problem
1000[08:38:02] <annadane> well then try the mozo package
1001[08:38:17] <annadane> i don't know why vlc opens the
same video
1002[08:38:23] <annadane> maybe something in /tmp being weird
1003[08:39:36] <mike__> it is not only why it opens same vide but
worst -why it opens it self without "askin" just the
moment i click on "videos" folder :P
1004[08:39:50] *** Guest59875 is now known as Martyn
1036[08:53:30] <annadane> vlc? not sure what you might look for.
maybe /var/log/syslog but i really don't know what'd help
you diagnose something like that
1037[08:53:34] <mike__> annadane, i never said you are :)
actually you seams to be really cool person
1038[08:54:03] *** Quits: dc13ff (uid190567@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
1039[08:54:08] <annadane> journalctl -f may be useful
1040[08:54:34] <annadane> from the man page of journalctl (in
debian unstable, anyway): "Show only the most recent journal
entries, and continuously print new entries as they are appended to
the journal"
1041[08:54:54] <annadane> (which is also the case in debian
stable, but that's irrelevant)
1042[08:56:12] <mike__> nope there is nothing about it :(
1044[08:56:43] <annadane> in other words, go to a terminal, type
journalctl -f, try to open your videos folder, and when vlc opens
instead you'll be able to see the output
1053[08:58:47] <mike__> that what journal shows me
1054[08:59:28] <mike__> but i think it is about firewall not vlc
1055[08:59:50] <annadane> mike__, this is from kali linux but
it's the same idea as parrot, see the section "is kali
linux right for you" and note that it advises against using it
as a daily desktop
replaced-url
1083[09:05:43] <annadane> i'll add that constantly switching
distros to solve problems is rushing solutions which you're
explicitly advised not to do in linux
1084[09:06:03] <annadane> linux is finding the cause of a problem
and then investigating a solution carefully
1098[09:08:24] <annadane> but the point is to accumulate
knowledge, not try random things until stuff works
1099[09:08:30] <mike__> no of course not but i just like the look
of it and after switching from so many distros i am really tired :)
i would love to just settle it and use it whatever distro it is as
long it is linux
1100[09:09:27] <mike__> you are absolutely right but noobs like
me probably would choose anything that works and then slowly learn .
1103[09:11:01] <annadane> debian is fine, the only sort of
problems people might have is debian's stance towards non-free
software, which might mean that things like wifi won't work
without installing firmware, and things of that nature
1104[09:11:19] <annadane> which we can tell you how to do
1105[09:11:38] <annadane> and i have nothing to argue for here,
the debian project isn't paying me to say this
1106[09:11:40] <mike__> linux is really addictive i would already
give up after all problems but after i tried once i simply dont see
me going back to windows
1107[09:11:57] <annadane> it's just simply more practical to
use a general purpose distro like debian, mint, ubuntu etc rather
than kali/parot
1122[09:16:01] <jim> annadane, another thing we often experience
is when people want to (for example) run make install into a dir
like /usr or /usr/local, because they don't think whatever
they're making is available in debian... often, it is
1128[09:16:58] <jim> yep, I watched part of its growth
1129[09:17:05] <annadane> anyway, this all comes across as a
sales pitch and it's not, i just think you're going to
have far less headaches with something like debian and have in the
long run fewer problems
1130[09:17:23] <annadane> as long as you *don't blindly try
things*
1131[09:17:27] <mike__> i am now really confused . (trying to
search for answer) if i do cd /home/mike/Videos then ls there is
nothing !
1155[09:22:55] <jim> annadane, if you want, you can tell me the
factoid name, it's less typing than all that ! stuff :)
1156[09:23:19] <annadane> pah. i'm on irc 14 hours a day,
i'm a fast typer
1157[09:23:41] <mike__> so jim if i click on "Videos"
immediately vlc opens with the same video every time by it self . on
"Videos" folder i have popcorn time folder but i can reach
it anyway since the vlc opens befor that action (if that make sense)
1158[09:23:47] <jim> wow, that's a lot!
1159[09:23:47] *** Joins: Madda (~Madda@replaced-ip)
1182[09:28:24] <jim> annadane, we've all done it, it's
not much of a big deal (one place where it might be is where
you're helping someone who is as yet unfamiliar with irc)
1183[09:28:32] <mike__> the videos are in Popcorn but via panel
the moment i click on videos istead of opening "Popcorn"
and then choose a video vlc opens immediately it self with one same
video over and over again
1184[09:29:01] <mike__> jim yes i am here few weeks
1185[09:29:06] <annadane> and so i suggested to mike__ to try the
mozo package (if it exists in parrot) to edit menu entries, and
another user earlier suggested to try editing mime types
1186[09:29:22] <mike__> solving problems and giving up again and
again :)
1187[09:29:56] <jim> yeah I kinda know how that can be
1188[09:30:12] <mike__> oh annadane i didnt knew it was to me
that mozo. sorry i thought you was helping the other guy
1202[09:32:37] <annadane> mike__, why not try asking reddit? go
on reddit.com/r/linuxquestions, specify you're using parrot,
they might be able to help you
1203[09:32:58] <mike__> sure
1204[09:32:59] <mike__> thx
1205[09:33:03] *** Quits: d-fence (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Quit: Cu, I leave)
1244[09:50:23] *** Quits: b (coffee@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1245[09:50:30] <gerforce_> how can i mount a usb stick with rw
permission when i try to. it prompts me: write protected, read-only
1246[09:50:37] <annadane> if you "delete" it by moving
it to the trash bin it ought to be recoverable, if you want to keep
it. if you delete it via rm, it's pretty much gone
1247[09:51:22] <annadane> gerforce_, using the mount command
normally doesn't work?
1276[09:57:29] <gerforce_> annadane: still write-protected
1277[09:57:32] <Linpassion> Ok whising dependieces it's
resolved
1278[09:58:38] <Linpassion> I must configure repository or
It's set-up by default?
1279[09:58:50] <peterfarge> Hi, I rented a vServer in the
Internet with Debain 9.4. "ip a" shows me his public IP
address. After I added a ICMP rule in the Firewall Interface, I can
ping him. I have installed openssh-server and added a rule for port
22 and restarted the server, but I cant reach him from outside.
"service ssh status" says that the server is running on
port 22. Is there something additional I have to do?
1280[09:58:55] <tdn> What is a good web forum software package
that is included in Debian? Or should I just avoid the debian
distributed packages for web applications and instaed go for
upstream dists?
1281[09:59:10] <annadane> Linpassion, it depends what you want,
if you want non-free software you'll need to add contrib and
non-free to your sources list
1282[09:59:18] <annadane> otherwise, it ought to have been
already set up by the installer
1283[09:59:45] <Linpassion> thanks annadane
1284[09:59:46] <annadane> web forum? hmm... no idea
1302[10:01:57] <annadane> well you can backport it yourself if
you have access to the source
1303[10:02:11] <annadane> not sure why you wouldn't just
want to enable the source though
1304[10:02:30] <annadane> source code i mean, in the first
instance, sources.list in the second instance
1305[10:02:58] <annadane> but anyway, packages in debian stable
do get the full support of the security team so wordpress should be
fine, but i'm unsure about forum applications
1306[10:03:07] <agio> tdn: you can download and install the
package manually - but without enabling the non-free section for
updates or security lists - you won't get automatic updates
1318[10:06:30] <FinalX> annadane: wordpress is one of the very
many pieces of software that's directly hooked into the web
that's being attacked. difference is that it gets security
fixes extremely fast after one has been found and is automatically
fixed. you do have to keep into account that 3rd party modules you
can install are _not_ part of wordpress and can be riddled with
malware themselves, or of bad coding quality and thus
1319[10:06:32] <FinalX> vulnerable. on top of that, you
can't always count on the creator of such a plugin or theme to
even fix problems. it's best to stick with wordpress itself and
major, trusted company plugins. but that's not just with
wordpress. goes for any CMS/software.
1330[10:10:03] <peterfarge> Hi, I rented a vServer in the
Internet with Debain 9.4. "ip a" shows me his public IP
address. After I added a ICMP rule in the Firewall Interface, I can
ping him. I have installed openssh-server and added a rule for port
22 and restarted the server, but I cant reach him from outside.
"service ssh status" says that the server is running on
port 22. Is there something additional I have to do?
1348[10:20:16] <altker128> Guys, I know this isn't a Debian
specific question but any thoughts on cloning drives? I did a test
install on a 500GB drive (used like 2-3GB of space) and I'm
trying to clone it into a 64GB SSD ; most clonetools freak out since
the disk SIZE is different but there's more than enough space
to make this work
1350[10:20:40] <peterfarge> petn-randall I configure the web
interface. There were some deactivated firewall rules.
1351[10:20:48] <tdn> agio, yeah, this is what I mean: I want a
single specific package to be installed from non-free, but without
"polluting" my available package space with other
non-free? Is this somethinfg that can be done via pinning?
1356[10:22:15] <peterfarge> petn-randall If I open a ssh
connection from outside, I get immediately the Permission Denied
answer.
1357[10:22:24] <petn-randall> altker128: You could of course
shrink the filesystem and then the partition, but that's quite
error prone. Also many clone tools don't always copy the boot
loader over, because this is not part of any partition.
1358[10:22:40] <petn-randall> peterfarge: What is the exact error
you get from ssh?
1365[10:26:04] <petn-randall> altker128: Reinstalling is like 10
minutes of time? I also don't understand what it has to do with
GPT or UUIDs.
1366[10:26:09] <altker128> petn-randall: I'm saying
re-installing is a really sad excuse for not being able to properly
clone partitions, something that's been possible for like 25-30
yrs
1367[10:26:22] <petn-randall> altker128: By all means, go ahead.
1368[10:26:25] <themill> cloning is still trivial; resizing is
not
1369[10:26:59] <altker128> themill: The copying should be
"smart enough" to effectively rsync the files from old to
new since there's a mismatch in partition size (i.e. not do a
dd / block-level copy)
1370[10:27:16] <petn-randall> altker128: That wouldn't be a
clone then, would it?
1371[10:27:17] <themill> make up your mind whether you want to
clone or rsync then
1372[10:28:31] <themill> The process is easy enough. It's up
to you whether you want to do that or just make a fresh
installation.
1373[10:28:48] <altker128> Well, the frustrating part is the GPT
aspect has be to re-created on the new drive, and the EFI partition
should be cloned. The data can be rsynched
1374[10:28:50] <altker128> rsync'd
1375[10:29:19] <themill> that's no different to any other
way of partitioning a disk
1376[10:29:36] <petn-randall> altker128: You can't use the
same GPT anyway, since the partitions are different sizes. However
clone GPT is a one-liner.
1381[10:31:03] <peterfarge> petn-randall It was I firewall
problem. If I start ssh client from another linux shell and try a
connection, the command give no answer. -> No connection. In the
web Interface, I forget a checkbox. I thought I had to add a linux
user to some kind of ssh group in debian. Thanks for your time :)
1555[12:04:01] <hans_> petn-randall, at first i thought it was a
problem with debian-testing, saying "debian 10's apt-get
update; has recently started waiting for like, what feels like 5-10
minutes, trying to connect to the ipv6 address (...)", but then
i realized it wasn't a debian-testing issue, it was a mirror
issue, sorry
1594[12:16:27] <petn-randall> altker128: What are you talking
about? lilo is still packaged in Debian and usable.
1595[12:16:47] <yokowka> heavenO, everysoul II
1596[12:17:43] <altker128> petn-randall: I haven't tried to
use LILO with the current Debian net-installer . I should probably
give it a shot. EFI and UUID didn't really provide me any real
benefits
1598[12:17:59] <rant> how can I make my system not wait on
interfaces? could someone with stretech installed normally show me
their /lib/systemd/system/networking.service when I installed from a
normal installer it didnt do this, the live installer seems to have
configured it dierently
1599[12:18:03] * petn-randall shrugs.
1600[12:18:24] <petn-randall> altker128: You're listing EFI
and UUID together as if they have any relation to each other.
1601[12:18:47] <rant> this is adding a minute or more to my boot
time.. its really annoying
1602[12:18:50] *** Quits: Zvmdyv (~Zvmdyv@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1604[12:19:51] <petn-randall> rant: networking.service will wait
on any configured devices in /etc/network/interfaces. If you take
them out and use network-manager, nothing will wait on them.
1605[12:20:12] <petn-randall> rant: Or just make sure it
doesn't use DHCP, or whatever is causing the long waits.
1606[12:20:26] <rant> its not waiting on that.. nothing in there
but lo and it ignores lo
1622[12:25:39] *** Quits: kryptoz (~kryptoz@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1623[12:25:53] <rant> it had installed probably 2GB or more of
language stuff.. special dictionary frontends, input utils,
manpages, translations for apps, you name it
1625[12:26:06] *** Quits: kryptoz (~kryptoz@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1626[12:26:08] <rant> I spent more time undoing crap than
installing
1627[12:26:18] <yokowka> rant, can You make unmistake? such
system mesage: /dev/sda2: clean, 204260/30295728 files [10.805148]
Error: [\_S8_.PCIO.GFXO.DDO2.BCL] Namespace lookup AE_NOT_FOUND
(20160831/psargs-359) How to unmistake it??
1652[12:33:45] *** Quits: xav92 (~xavier@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1653[12:33:48] <yokowka> rant - already do, where is the log to
find for paste?
1654[12:34:24] <rant> yokowka: it saved in the current working
directory which would have been most likely the users homedir
/home/user or /root depending on who ran it
1655[12:35:20] *** Quits: Haudegen (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1692[12:48:21] <rant> I wonder if those things just understand
any language or if they have to be reconfigured
1693[12:48:37] <babilen> → #debian-offtopic
1694[12:48:40] <yokowka> rant - Alexei = Lyohae, we says in
Rus': everyone got such friend Lyohae, which is dumb
malyohae(litlle bit) so you joke has three sentensses.
1706[12:52:00] <rant> yokowka: those messages are not a problem..
everyone has something like that.. the point of the systemd-analyze
commands was to see if something actually was slowing your boot
which it doesnt appear that is so
1713[12:58:37] <babilen> yokowka: That depends on your hardware,
it isn't really a Debian problem. I use fwupd, and typically
run "fwupdmgr refresh ; fwupdmgr update", but I have no
idea if that would work on your hardware.
1714[12:59:02] <babilen> You might want to contact your hardware
vendor for information on how to upgrade your firmware/bios/...
1716[12:59:44] <babilen> fwupdmgr is worth a look though
1717[13:00:01] <yokowka> babilen, dell 3537 inspiron i've
got. bios up to date is requied, how I think.
1718[13:00:27] <babilen> You could also start fiddling with acpi
options, but it looks as if the ACPI implementation of your hardware
is a bit wonky, so I'd start with upgrading that to the latest
version first
1720[13:00:49] <babilen> Once you've done that you could
also try a newer kernel from backports (see "/msg dpkg bdo
kernel" for succint information on that)
1729[13:02:23] <babilen> Just like you install any other package
on Debian
1730[13:02:39] <petn-randall> babilen: Note that we've been
trying to explain to yokowka that it's a purely cosmetic
message. There are no side effects on their machine beside that log
output.
1821[13:42:52] <strive> somiaj: "strive: note, you could
isntall from the dvd1 image you have, and just copy over the
firmware after the install is complete" <- Great idea!
Thanks!
1870[13:59:05] <rant> Thedarkb-M90: normally you could use
journalctl but persistent logging is disabled by default and so
there are no journals saved across reboots
1871[13:59:08] <ezname> Hello! is there a (simple) software that
will pipe sound output to (mic/)sound input
1886[14:01:41] <Thedarkb-M90> I wonder can you cat things to
them.
1887[14:01:59] <rant> journalctl is much more flexible it can
search more easily and display only what you want to see.. its logs
are binary and indexed
1905[14:08:16] <rant> ezname: linking your output to your input
would only result in echoing back what the other person said
1906[14:08:23] <ezname> so i need to pipe the audio i am hearing
on the machine since i need to show a person some music i made
without him stealing it. i need to pipe output sound to input sound
for discord to read it as a mic
1907[14:08:47] <ezname> there is this thing called "Stereo
mix" for windows
1908[14:08:51] <ezname> look it up :)
1909[14:08:59] <rant> there is this thing called alsamixer on
linux
1920[14:11:39] <gerforce> hi, i have recently got an old
server(manufactured about 8 years ago). I try to install debian on
it, but the installer couldn't recognize the hard driver which
is a raid with three sata disk. The Controller is "LSI MegaRAID
SAS 8208ELP" and "LSI MegaRAID SAS 8204ELP" according
to the message from the BIOS. So what should i do to make debian
installer see the raid.
1926[14:14:16] <gerforce> i think i should load the raid
controller driver before installing. But it seems no official driver
for linux. Is there an alternative driver?
1947[14:19:50] <rant> the wiki page for megaraid_sas is outdated
but doesnt list an 8204ELP
1948[14:20:35] <rant> and those sorts of names are useless for
determining support, only the vend/prod id codes matter, display
names could be the same on diferent actual hw
1949[14:21:44] <gerforce> petn-randall: i got the server today.
And it had windows 2003 installed. In BIOS i can use Ctl+k to
configure the Controller, i can see three disk online and be a
virtual disk(raid 5). I have no experience about raid before. I
think it's been configured, am i right?
1950[14:22:16] <rant> gerforce: use lspci -nn or in windows you
can usually get vend/prod ids in the device manager under properties
1951[14:22:54] <rant> it'll be 8 hex digits 1234:abcd on
linux, probably 0x1234,0xabcd on windows
1969[14:26:22] <rant> I use debian, and so I use alsa, jack, or
pulse
1970[14:26:37] <rant> which I recommended to you twice now
1971[14:27:26] <rant> jack has some rather pointy clicky kinds of
utils to plug one thing into another, alsa has a mixer where you can
select a capture device, and pulse has source/sinks
1972[14:27:57] <rant> alsa is built in, and pulse is usually
standard on desktops, jackd is not
1974[14:28:21] <rant> open your package manager (i.e. synaptic,
search, read)
1975[14:28:22] <jelly> ezname: so you want a virtual sound input
that your app would use. Probably best ask in a pulseaudio or alsa
channel what's the easiest way to accomplish that
1982[14:29:45] <rant> M6HZ: if you have a support question about
dash on debian stable this may be a place you could get help if you
quit beating around the issue and state it
1983[14:29:59] *** Quits: SebaBe (~SebaBe@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1984[14:30:10] <ezname> jelly thank you i will do that
1987[14:32:14] <gerforce> rant: the alias line of the paste seems
not match the pattern of 8 hex digits.
1988[14:33:03] <rant> gerforce: yeah I dont know why modinfo
shows it like that but you only need 8 digits out of that
pci:v00001028d00000015sv*sd*bc*sc*i* is 028d:0015
1989[14:33:25] <M6HZ> In the man pages of dash a builtin command:
"fc" is documented, but it apparently doesn't work,
is it a bug ?
1990[14:33:35] <rant> if someone knows about those pci strings,
I'd be interested in knowing about it :P
1997[14:37:17] <rant> yes the maintainer didnt feel inclusion of
fc was a priority
1998[14:37:33] <rant> dash is typically used in minimalistic
scenarios on Debian
1999[14:37:38] <gerforce> rant: also if the vend/prod isn't
supported by linux, If it's possible to disable the raid
controller and treat one of the three hard driver as normal hard
driver.
2000[14:37:41] <themill> no-one is interested in doing the work
to make dash usable as an interactive shell
2007[14:40:12] *** Quits: bvs (~beavis@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2008[14:40:38] <rant> gerforce: hwraid is a lesser used and
complex thing.. so figuring out first if the kernel has a module
that will claim the hw is the first step then we can go from there
and see if that is in the initrd of the installer or such
2016[14:43:32] <rant> gerforce: more than likely you will not be
able to use the standard installer even if this is supported as its
a proprietary hw with proprietary tools
2027[14:46:31] <rant> gerforce: were it my problem, I'd
either install to something else and setup the raid for storage
after install or try installing from an already working installation
after getting the raid up and running on there using a chroot
install kinda method
2028[14:46:35] *** Quits: SebaBe (~SebaBe@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2029[14:46:57] <rant> gerforce: or I'd sell it to someone
and make it their problem and go get something else :P
2040[14:49:07] <rant> the tools are all 3rd party not in debian..
but if the kernel module supports it, then you have hw support at
least, just no utils to control it.. which if its already setup via
the bios on the card then thats not real important
2052[14:57:03] <rant> gerforce: I dont really do raid but when
I've done it, it was an integrated.. these days if I could
afford a raid I'd get something external and use it just for
storage probably.. that way its less headache cause I'm just
accessing it over LAN, USB or something like that and the device is
doing all the magic
2055[14:58:35] <rant> gerforce: bottom line is getting any linux
on this device is not only a very advanced use case scenario, but
will require propriatary software that may be hard to find, and will
not be able to use a standard install method
2056[14:59:00] <FinalX> after nuking an external repo (dotdeb),
is there an easy way of reinstalling a list of packages and forcing
a specific apt source to make them come from? (like jessie default
in this case, instead of dotdeb .. dotdeb has a slightly higher
minor version)
2057[14:59:03] <rant> gerforce: as for scope of this channel the
bottom line is, its not supported
2065[15:00:50] <rant> FinalX: however you may have gotten to a
point where deps were installed that upgraded core components that
would require removal of nearly all your system to do so
2066[15:00:51] <gerforce> rant: Maybe i just need a new hardware
with all kinds of linux support.
2067[15:01:11] <rant> gerforce: yes that is preferable, though we
can't always get what we want
2068[15:01:38] <gerforce> rant: money is evil.
2069[15:02:03] <rant> gerforce: can you just hook the drives up
to a supported controller and do a software raid at least?
2070[15:02:24] <FinalX> rant: nah, it's not that bad. went
from wheezy+dotdeb php 5.6 => jessie, wanting to go back to
jessie's php 5.6. and you can forcibly reinstall a specific
version with apt, but.. this might be safer
2075[15:04:15] <rant> FinalX: sounds to me like you got some
serious issues.. heh. we'd be happy to help you with whatever
your devel/prod needs for php are if you go ahead and install a
clean Stretch system
2076[15:04:22] <gerforce> rant: but how can i power the drive?
there is no additional power connecter in the server, even i can
connect the drive to the motherboard
2083[15:06:24] <gerforce> rant: After i have done some searching,
i think about the method you mentioned. So i opened the server, and
nope. No power source.
2084[15:07:23] <gerforce> rant: maybe i can use a external power.
But seems a ugly solution.
2085[15:07:33] <gerforce> rant: anyway i'll try
2086[15:07:37] <rant> well we still support jessie too.. but
we'd suggest other methods than dotdeb which isnt supported
here
2087[15:07:46] <rant> !dotdeb alternatives
2088[15:07:46] <dpkg> Software from <dotdeb> historically
had a number of packaging or functional issues. If you require newer
versions than what <stable> offers, a lot of the packages now
have updates in backports.debian.org, ask me about <bdo> or
for php possibly <deb.sury.org>; to remove Dotdeb packages:
"aptitude purge '~Vdotdeb'".
2089[15:08:51] <rant> gerforce: the drives are powered by the
raid card?
2091[15:09:59] <FinalX> rant: ergo, you didn't read and just
want to tell people to upgrade? :) I'm moving away from dotdeb
to stock jessie... :) that does get LTS updates, still, at least
until the company that's been promising a new version of their
custom application actually keeps word :)
2092[15:10:14] <gerforce> rant: yes. you just insert the hard
drive to the card, and it's done.
2096[15:10:55] <rant> gerforce: hmm the megaraid sas cards I know
of are just normal pci(e) type cards with sas connectors like any
other disk controller card ever made
2121[15:17:34] <areckx> ok this is embarassing; after backup of
my server and reinstalling after some install ctrl-c mishap, I did
new install------but I did it in recovery mode without creating a
user or a root password....
2122[15:17:56] <areckx> tried root with no pass
2123[15:18:29] <petn-randall> areckx: How did you reinstall in
recovery mode?
2124[15:18:45] <rant> gerforce: when my father has gone to china
for business he said he was able to access the internet without
issues and view things the chinese could not which still confuses me
2125[15:18:48] <areckx> via the usb net install recovery mode
2157[15:25:48] <rant> gerforce: *shrugs* what stops anyone from
doing that? is it illegal or something?
2158[15:25:57] <petn-randall> areckx: "expert install"
is the same as regular install, but just adds more options. And
rescue mode only allows you to chroot into an existing installation.
So I still don't know what you actually did.
2161[15:28:01] <areckx> why are you insisting it doesn't? I
literally just did it
2162[15:28:28] <jken> Hello, I am setting up a new debian stretch
system and am having trouble getting HDMI audio working. HDMI is the
only possible audio output on this system but `cat
/proc/asound/cards` tells me "No Soundcards". I am not
sure where to start, can anyone point me in the right direction?
2163[15:28:31] <petn-randall> areckx: Because I just tried the
network installer in a VM and it does just what I said.
2164[15:28:37] <areckx> I was in graphical recovery mode which
did the initial hardware detect, setting time, etc, setting hostname
2165[15:28:42] <petn-randall> areckx: Which installation image
did you download?
2166[15:28:49] <areckx> note, not recovery mode, GRAPHICAL
recovery mode
2167[15:29:10] <areckx> I went into a shell and mounted my
volumes to backup to an external hdd
2168[15:29:18] <areckx> after I did that I went to select
installation step
2169[15:29:35] <areckx> and formatted partition, installed lxde
and base system, then when it was done, I rebooted
2170[15:29:55] <areckx> then when I got to the dm I realized I
have no user or password
2171[15:30:27] <areckx> I have no idea how
2172[15:30:42] <areckx> I input a hostname and it did the detect
time, etc,
2173[15:30:48] <petn-randall> areckx: Then you may, or may not,
have a complete installation. I'd just do it again cleanly. If
you want to reset the password, it's:
2174[15:30:52] <petn-randall> !frp
2175[15:30:53] <dpkg> For GRUB: 1) press 'e' to edit
the kernel setting in the grub command line (add
'init=/bin/sh' to the end of it) 2) 'fsck' your
root file system, 3) 'mount -o remount,rw /', 4)
'passwd root' 5) 'mount -o remount,ro /' 6)
'reboot -d -f' (exec /sbin/init should work); For LILO: 1)
'Linux init=/bin/sh' at the LILO boot prompt (hold Shift
while booting), steps 2-6 are the same; For yaboot: 1) 'Linux
init=/bin/sh' at yaboot prompt.
2176[15:31:09] <areckx> why wouldn't it be complete?
2177[15:31:20] <babilen> Because you - obviously - skipped some
steps
2178[15:31:28] <areckx> I only skipped the user create
2179[15:31:34] <petn-randall> areckx: Because if you skipped the
user creation step, you might have skipped others, too.
2180[15:31:38] <areckx> and I don't see why I couldn't
do that post install
2216[15:41:10] <babilen> So, you did not perform a complete
install. The best way to perform an installation is to use the
"install" or "expert" option of the installer
2242[15:48:11] <babilen> (the installer can always perform all
the steps you select)
2243[15:48:27] <areckx> (I mixed some packages from testing and
synaptic wanted me to remove a bunch of necessary files when I
marked eclipse for reinstallation, I thought it was doing an
autoremove so I did it but then did ctrl-C when I noticed it was
uninstalling the kernel)
2244[15:48:39] <babilen> ...
2245[15:48:42] <areckx> babilen: right but it let me do it anyway
2246[15:48:50] <babilen> Yes, why wouldn't it?
2247[15:48:57] <babilen> *you* are in control
2248[15:49:20] <areckx> right but I mean I forget where in the
process it made a password and user
2249[15:49:25] <areckx> and it never came up
2250[15:50:08] <areckx> I just find it strange that the installer
would do everything else but not include that
2260[15:54:20] <areckx> I followed the guide to getting
pepperflash, but when he goes into the game it says "flash
plugin is outdated" in the top right, even though the version
matches adobe's
2261[15:54:32] <areckx> I did the whole thing where I downloaded
it and copied the .so file
2262[15:54:38] <petn-randall> areckx: You read what babilen said,
right? The part about rescue mode not being an installer?
2267[15:55:22] <areckx> petn-randall: yes but I'm just
saying if it's a rescue mode, then why does it set the time and
ask for hostname but not create a user or pass? seems like it should
skip that entirely and go straight to recovery shell
2271[15:56:36] <petn-randall> areckx: because time and hostname
are relevant for a rescue system, creating users is not.
2272[15:57:06] <areckx> anyway I'm not sure if it's
just kixeye and their game or not but when he runs it chromium says
the flash plugin is outdated and then his system slows to a crawl
after some time
2273[15:57:18] <areckx> you're missing my point
2274[15:57:18] <bites> areckx: the easiest way to get flash is
installing google chrome.
2278[15:57:36] <areckx> my point is that if it's not
intended to install, why does it have the opption to install the
base system?
2279[15:57:47] <areckx> bites: I did that on his box too and same
problem
2280[15:58:05] <petn-randall> areckx: The ways of supported
installation are clearly documented in the release notes, if you
want to do it differently, by all means do, but it's completely
unsupported.
2281[15:58:18] <areckx> petn-randall: I don't want to do it
differently though
2282[15:58:23] <areckx> you're missing my point
2283[15:58:24] <bites> so the game desperately want adobe flash?
that sucks.
2331[16:19:06] <JohnA> OFF TOPIC: Recently a child died after
accidentally being left in its parents car during very hot weather.
I believe similar incidents have occurred in very cold weather. I am
thinking of drawing up a "standard" to be suggested to
government so that in the event that a child is left in a car if the
parents leave an alarm is sounded. Serveral things: 1 this is
obviously NOT the right place to discuss this idea. Is IRC a
suitable place and if so how
2332[16:19:06] <JohnA> does one set up a "chat room".
2, would github be a "good"lace to creat and such a
document ...
2343[16:25:59] <speechless> bites: I've progressed, found
the iptables on the machine does the following: REDIRECT tcp --
0.0.0.0/0 0.0.0.0/0 tcp dpt:80 redir ports 8080
2350[16:27:19] <speechless> yea, containers were on different
hosts, the one that kept failing is 2 years old, so there is a lot
of strange configuration...
2351[16:27:38] <bites> but it only blocked some of the http
requests apt made...
2352[16:27:53] <speechless> it blocked the http requests
__everything__ made
2439[17:12:31] <speechless> bites: i've completely solved
the issue, everything builds as expected, thanks for the hint. i
ended up deleting the redirect rules because it really wasn't
needed
2578[18:15:56] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with
apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information:
1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the
command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1
pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem,
and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use
replaced-url
2604[18:21:56] <dgp> Is there a way to disable the interface
renaming crap without rebooting? I did the fix for my kernel command
line but I can't reboot right now :/
2624[18:26:12] <rant> oo_miguel: look, keep in mind I know almost
nothing about docker and php, but I'm pretty sure this
configuration is telling apt not to install these things. I'm
not terribly familiar with a priority of -1 either
2628[18:26:59] <rant> oo_miguel: yes after looking at docs -1
means to never install the package
2629[18:27:30] <rant> oo_miguel: apparently this docker thing
which as I understand is for portable software, is distributing its
own php packages and doesnt want debian installing any
2636[18:30:44] <petn-randall> dgp: You can use `ifrename` to
rename you interfaces in the mean time.
2637[18:30:46] <rant> oo_miguel: yeah well beyond what we just
covered, doing so means they have to support it, else you gotta
figure it out yourself.. so consider than and which support
community you prefer to rely on :P
2638[18:30:48] <petn-randall> somiaj: err, yes.
2639[18:30:50] <somiaj> dgp: if you use tye systemd.link
definitions, you can just unload and reload the moudle and it will
rename the interface by your systemd.link setting.
2642[18:31:15] <somiaj> ahh didn't know about ifrename,
though with systemd.link, you don't need any command line
parameter (though you will have to rebuild your initramfs)
2643[18:31:42] <dgp> I'm writing something that is adding
interfaces and the renaming stuff is causing the interface to be
renamed right after I get a packet from netlink saying it was added
2644[18:31:57] <oo_miguel> rant: haha yeah. I am afraid I have to
rely on both
2648[18:33:38] <rant> oo_miguel: I'd think if one were to
make the effort to make things like docker/flatpack/etc..
they'd take care to isolate it so local packages from the OS
didnt interfere
2649[18:33:59] <rant> and using pinning to disable them
isn't a good way to go about it
2650[18:36:15] <rant> oo_miguel: to quote our wiki "Debian
does not encourage pinning without thorough consideration. ...
Seriously, don't do this. Doing this will break Debian and
leave you with a system that doesn't work and can't be
fixed."
2660[18:42:01] *** Quits: oish (~charlie@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
2661[18:42:24] <rant> oo_miguel: my problem with that logic aside
from the fact we dont encourage its use.. is that you are relying on
a maintainers decisions who neither has the knowledge or
responsibilty for your system nor it would seem the knowledge of
debian in general
2662[18:42:38] <rant> its a crude hack by someone with no dog in
the race
2674[18:45:50] <oo_miguel> debian.org states: Debian images
provided in docker.io's official repositories (their
"official images") are listed on their official debian
images repository. These images are generated by the stackbrew
application
2675[18:46:13] *** Quits: saurabh__londhe (~Saurabh@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2679[18:47:31] <rant> yes, because they're duplicating
essentially our whole system.. a whole seperate package manager,
repository, utility scripts, maintainers, etc.. and this use case
demonstrates they do so in a way that undermines our practices
2680[18:47:32] *** Quits: err404 (~err404@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2682[18:48:19] <dgp> At least the kernel can now compact all the
tens of copies of the same stuff you have in memory for no good
reason
2683[18:48:20] <oo_miguel> rant: hmmm never looked on that from
this perspective
2684[18:49:09] <rant> and having used and supported debian a long
time I know sometimes things can be a challenge.. but I have to ask
myself not only what I mentioned earlier about support, but also
about security.. do I really trust their maintainer to keep things
clean and secure and up to date over debian's?
2685[18:49:36] <rant> when clearly they dont have all that is
debian in mind when they're doing this
2688[18:50:02] <rant> they're just concerned with making a
neat little package that can be hacked into anything
2689[18:50:09] <dgp> rant: they don't care about stuff like
that. If they cared they would package stuff properly
2690[18:50:12] <rant> consequences be damned
2691[18:50:33] <rant> dgp: thats a concisely put rewording of my
point :P
2692[18:52:08] <rant> What made me a Debian user aside from what
sent me looking for a better platform.. was reading Why Debian? and
the Social Contract on Debian's website.. then I tried it, came
here.. and I hold this community and those ideals above all else
both in my use and support
2693[18:52:17] <rant> and to see people just crapping all over
that...
2694[18:52:25] <oo_miguel> hmmm, my main motivation in using
docker is having this "containers" running seemingly
independently of each other (over one single kernel) and the fact I
can easily back them up and move them around.
2696[18:52:40] <rant> I can't hardly trust them over DDs and
DMs and the support community
2697[18:52:48] <Brigo> oo_miguel, what about lxc?
2698[18:52:49] <dgp> mm I just use it by habit now. I've
used it for more than half of my life
2699[18:53:10] <dgp> oo_miguel: You can do that without having a
complete copy of the whole OS
2700[18:53:17] <oo_miguel> Brigo: is lxc the technology
underneath docker?
2701[18:53:38] <somiaj> lxc is another container method
2702[18:53:46] <rant> well thats why I got Crossover 17 last week
for much the same reason. but the difference there is, the stuff
I'm doing in crossover can't be done otherwise on debian
2703[18:54:03] <Brigo> oo_miguel, the kernel is the technology
underneath docker and lxc :)
2704[18:54:05] <rant> but it sure can bottle stuff up, archive
and distribute it nicely :P
2705[18:54:17] <somiaj> rant: wasn't the office you needed
to support old? I am able to use office 2007 just fine with the wine
in debian.
2708[18:54:35] <rant> somiaj: that was my father.. I'm using
it for games
2709[18:55:03] <somiaj> ahh, I've basically stoped playing
games that don't have a linux client, the selection is smaller,
but there are a decent number you can get for linux
2710[18:55:12] <oo_miguel> Brigo: ah ok. thougt docker runs on
TOP of something (beside the kernel of course)
2711[18:55:12] <rant> somiaj: I had him on that old Crossover 7
from the Lame Duck thing back in '08
2712[18:55:21] <dgp> somiaj: from steam?
2713[18:55:30] <somiaj> dgp: mostly, though not all
2724[18:56:32] <dgp> jak2000: apt-cache java and pick the jre or
jdk you want
2725[18:56:44] *** Quits: SopaXorzTaker (~SopaXorzT@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2726[18:56:47] <rant> dgp: read that again
2727[18:56:55] <somiaj> dgp: Often one just is missing the right
libaries. I have had to work to get them working some times, but so
far they have all worked.
2746[18:59:32] <judd> Package: openjdk-9-jre on amd64 --
stretch-backports: 9~b181-4~bpo9+1
2747[19:00:04] <somiaj> 0 is avaiablel in stretch-backports, but
my understanding is that version is dead, 8 is still supported and
so is the new version 10
2750[19:00:27] <dgp> oo_miguel: The sort of projects that use
docker are the sort of projects that have NIH problems so it
doesn't surprise me they would do that
2751[19:00:32] <rant> there seems to be a typo epidemic in here
:P
2773[19:03:20] <jak2000> dgp yes actually i have this java
version: 1.8.0_171 and fail to send email, a friend say me: need
version 9 or 8u151
2774[19:03:37] <jak2000> then i need uninstall 1.8.0_171 and
install this: 8u151
2775[19:03:37] <oo_miguel> allright, so after all this
"constructive criticism" ;) I will definitely try LXC for
my next project and decide how it compares to docker for my
scenarios
2776[19:03:44] <oo_miguel> thank you very much
2777[19:04:18] <oo_miguel> ... unless there is maybe another
container-technology I should also have a look at?
2778[19:04:18] <somiaj> jak2000: I don't see why downgrading
to 8u151 would help there, the main difference between 151 and 171
is securty fixes.
2779[19:04:32] <jak2000> see:
2780[19:04:49] <dgp> and 9 breaks more things than it fixes
2781[19:05:17] <jak2000> <Maldivia> jak2000: 8u161 changed
an internal class that java mail relies on, causing it to break i
know this issusue
2782[19:05:38] *** Quits: saurabh__londhe (~Saurabh@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2783[19:06:01] <jak2000> in my laptop i installed this version:
8u151 and my program worked... (downgrade)...
2797[19:08:38] <greycat> If a non-Debian channel is advising a
specific version of Java, then install that version in /opt or
/usr/local and make symlinks as needed by hand.
2798[19:09:05] <greycat> (or snapshot.d.o if it's an *older*
version that they want, which is uncommon)
2823[19:17:29] <greycat> FYI wheezy is beyond end of life and no
longer receives support.
2824[19:17:33] <somiaj> ahh okay, then listen to greycat. There
is just a bug affecting testing/unstable users where they are
loosing sound, but this does not affect wheezy.
2825[19:17:42] <diverdude> greycat: i know but i have to run
wheezy
2826[19:17:50] <somiaj> (there is ELTS on wheezy, but desktop
support has been dropped for a while)
2827[19:18:02] <greycat> OK. If you're using ALSA without
Pulse, just run alsamixer and unmute and raise the volume on the
master channel.
2840[19:21:22] <buu> I booted a debian box with a graphics card
plugged in but no monitor. Now I want monitor output. I plug the
monitor in. It tells me no signal. X isn't even installed.
2845[19:21:36] <diverdude> greycat: aha nice...sound plays
through speakers now
2846[19:22:18] <diverdude> greycat: i have also a headset
attached through USB (speakers is via minijack). Can i select
audiooutput somewhere so that i can select headset for output?
2847[19:22:43] <somiaj> if using alsa, you'll have to look
into .asoundrc configuration
2848[19:23:06] <diverdude> ok there is no UI where i can do it?
2849[19:23:10] <diverdude> in some system settings UI
2850[19:23:10] <somiaj> well that can change the default device,
you can also tell your app to use a different device
2851[19:23:21] <somiaj> this is why most people use pulse
2923[20:14:01] *** Quits: colinjmatt (~colinjmat@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2924[20:14:04] <Ignacy> When I run 'M-x term' I
can't switch between split windows, because terminal eats all
input. WHAT DO?
2925[20:14:25] <Ignacy> umm sorry, wrong window
2926[20:14:34] <yeik> Is debian sid having issues with the udev
and systemd, i saw bugs regarding udev, but now my system had things
like libvirtd masked and can't bring up virt-manager, several
other things seem off,
2941[20:17:45] <jak2000> i executed: on bin directory: ./java
-version and tell me the version of java, i think need 1) move the
jdk directory to /opt and add path right? how to
2942[20:18:03] <jak2000> friends, unpacked my file:
jdk-8u151-linux-x64.tar.gz
2949[20:20:09] <somiaj> I think if using /usr/bin/java, best just
use update-alternatives and add that java to the alternative system.
2950[20:20:24] <somiaj> though I would just have the app that
needs that java call it, and try to leave the system java alone, so
other apps can use the more secure java
2951[20:20:48] <greycat> I might be tempted to create
/usr/local/bin/java and REMOVE /usr/bin/java completely
2952[20:20:59] <greycat> but then I'm not sure something
wouldn't just recreate /usr/bin/java so ...
2953[20:21:02] <jak2000> somiaj i need java command are available
in all linux box (need add the path) because Glassfish and or tomcat
need excecute the command
2954[20:22:02] <somiaj> you could set up a PATH just for the
enviorments that run glassfish or tomcat, but again I would have
tried to fix the issue with the newer java as opposed to run
services on a java with known security holes
2955[20:22:37] <somiaj> but there are lots of options, if you
want to make it the default java, you can manually add it as an
alterative using update-alternatives and then not have to add any
other linkes
3083[21:29:18] <erabiltzaile__> Hi, I changed my external HD LUKS
pass and I forgot the new (yes, not proud of it), I don't know
why but Ubuntu forgot it too, is there a way to access the data?
there is some important work, please.
3084[21:29:25] <erabiltzaile__> I mean, is my PC, my machine, my
HD, my GNU LINUX with my user, I did all from here, no way to
restore it? Please, and thanks.
3111[21:35:50] <erabiltzaile__> jim, I have the 75% in DVDs...
Also some important work in Google DRIVE (that is not my decision,
but a team)...
3112[21:36:40] <zokum> As for my problem, i think the files have
been moved to: /usr/share/easy-rsa
3113[21:36:43] <jim> erabiltzaile__, oh good, maybe you can get
some of it back
3114[21:36:49] <erabiltzaile__> jim, I would like a tool for HD
clonning, I mean, same HD inside the laptop and the external one, is
it posible?
3115[21:37:42] <jim> you mean two copies both encrypted?
3116[21:37:55] <erabiltzaile__> I mean same cloned HD
3117[21:38:30] <erabiltzaile__> and if I make some change in the
external one (the one I move), then when I plug it to the laptop,
that tool can modify the changes automatically, or just a click.
3118[21:38:36] <erabiltzaile__> Is there something like that?
3119[21:38:36] <erabiltzaile__> xD
3120[21:39:32] <zokum> erabiltzaile__: there's a shell
command called "dd" try "man dd"
replaced-url
3121[21:39:34] <jim> there are probably tools like that
3122[21:39:38] <erabiltzaile__> ...
3123[21:39:46] <erabiltzaile__> zokum, I know dd, thanks
3124[21:39:46] <erabiltzaile__> xD
3125[21:40:02] <erabiltzaile__> I would like something automatic,
and with GUI
3126[21:40:02] <erabiltzaile__> ;D
3127[21:40:08] <zokum> like rsync?
3128[21:40:08] <erabiltzaile__> anyway thanks
3129[21:40:09] <greycat> He said he's going to keep making
changes, so a clone with dd is a really BAD idea.
3130[21:40:23] <greycat> You'd be better off copying files
at the file system level using rsync or similar.
3131[21:40:26] <zokum> well, it all depends on how identical you
want it to be
3150[21:43:34] *** Quits: argusbr (~down@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3151[21:44:00] <erabiltzaile__> zokum, Im not a developer, here
in my gnome shell you could see Autodesk 3D Maya, Blender,
Lightworks, Fusion, Unity... xD
3165[21:46:58] <jim> annadane, as you probably know, the issues
dd suffers from are for one thing, it will copy the -filesystem-,
meaning the size of the device has to be exactly the same, also, dd
will also copy free space; whereas a file copying method
doesn't suffer from either of those
3183[21:53:46] <jim> annadane, actually, if the destination is
larger and what you;'re copying is an extN partition, you could
do the copy then run resize2fs on the copy
3196[21:58:03] <jim> and on top of all of that, if you wanted to
change filesystem type, you could do so by formatting the
destination to be the type you want, and have both mounted before
using cp or rsync
3222[22:08:28] <greycat> The question is too vague.
3223[22:09:05] <greycat> If you've got a consumer-grade
router or modem+router with ethernet ports, just run an ethernet
cable from the computer to the router, install Debian, and let it
configure the network automatically, and it should just work.
3224[22:09:17] *** diverdude is now known as Guest51768
3285[22:45:14] <greycat> That's what I meant by "not
realistic". You're just using it as cp in disguise, not
copying raw devices (disks or partitions) the way most people use
dd.
3308[22:52:20] <jkcg> well, the debian ppc irc channel are so
death that is not even funny
3309[22:52:42] <jkcg> my true question is
3310[22:53:00] <jhutchin1_wk> jkcg: Marginal projects like that
are better supported in forums and mailing lists. There just
isn't the user density to keep an irc channel alive.
3311[22:53:07] <jelly> "death" seems to happen to old
architectures yes
3464[23:14:05] *** Quits: RedSoxFan07 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: Goodbye and [depending on the time] good night.)
3465[23:14:10] <_31N108E> A doorstop designed by Apple in
California.
3466[23:14:25] <jkcg> if I can get it to run debian 9 I will let
you know
3467[23:14:35] <zokum> jkcg: yes, gentoo compiles everything, so
if your architecture is supported, it might work fine for you
3468[23:14:59] <jkcg> maybe the unoficial port can work for it
3469[23:15:03] *** Quits: nylon (~nylon@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
3470[23:15:08] <petn-randall> jkcg: A Mac Cube user? Finally I
meet you!
3471[23:15:24] <jkcg> what tackles down the machine is the 400
mhz
3472[23:15:25] *** Quits: greycat (~wooledg@replaced-ip) (Quit: They see me clawin' the love seat / They won't
do nothin' 'cause I'm cute and furry)
3473[23:15:42] <jkcg> <petn-randall>
3474[23:16:26] <petn-randall> zokum: I don't quite
understand how gentoo helps with this. Either the architecture is
supported, or it's not. Same goes for Debian. I don't know
how recompiling helps there.
3475[23:16:36] *** Quits: BlueByte_ (~walther@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
3477[23:17:09] <M6HZ> Do you know how to increment a value with
the dash shell ? I normally use ((var++)), but there it's
apparently not working, which is supprising to me is that the
function seems to be documented here:
replaced-url
3480[23:17:52] <zokum> petn-randall: gentoo can more easily
support odd architectures due to the code being compiled for your
current arch, instead of being provided as precompiled packages
3481[23:17:56] *** Quits: tsuggs (~tsuggs@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3484[23:18:08] <petn-randall> M6HZ: I thought everything with
double brackets is a bash built-in, but I must admit I hardly write
shells scripts anymore.
3487[23:19:21] <jakes> running Raspbian (OSMC) & want to send
regular audio from video to my TV over HDMI (check) but audio from
my BT-connected mobile (a2dp) to my hifi over minijack, so that I
don't need to turn on the TV to listen to music
3489[23:19:59] <petn-randall> zokum: Well, I don't see a
difference when the user or the distro maintainer compiles it. The
distro maintainer still has to provide the bits to support the
architecture, and also the boot bits, which are different for every
arch.
3491[23:21:06] <karlpinc> How do I find the default values for
unattended-upgrade. I've tried "apt-config dump" and
it only shows me some values, not everything that's listed
(say, "Mail") in the conf file, 50unattended-upgrades.
3492[23:21:39] <jkcg> petn-randall: do you use your mac cube
currently?
3493[23:21:50] <zokum> i would think a lot of architectures are
abandoned due to the work needed to provide packages prebuilt that
works out of the box, moving more of the job over to the user makes
it easier for the maintainer to support
3494[23:22:04] <petn-randall> jkcg: No, I just always wanted to
meet one of the three remaining users.
3495[23:22:27] <zokum> besides, ppc seems to be a supported arch:
replaced-url
3496[23:22:31] <petn-randall> zokum: What you just said makes
zero sense.
3497[23:22:51] <zokum> petn-randall: what is it you don't
understand?
3498[23:22:51] *** Quits: sigsts (~sigsts@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3501[23:23:37] <petn-randall> zokum: As a Gentoo distro
maintainer you provide bits to make it compile on the user's
machine. Now just imagine the user being the Debian buildd. The work
is exactly the same.
3504[23:24:16] <jkcg> petn-randall: indeed, the machine is very
unusual
3505[23:24:25] <petn-randall> zokum: You don't magically
save maintenance work by letting the user running the build.
That's just cheap CPU cycles. The hard work is to make the
buildchain not to FTBFS.
3506[23:24:41] <zokum> petn-randall: gentoo packages are a bit
different, they're mostly the source code + patches and some
minor glue
3507[23:25:14] <jkcg> petn-randall and weird to obtain, the one
you got its stil functional?
3508[23:25:22] <zokum> so, it's the same basic package for
all archs, it's just the compiler, make flags etc that are
different
3509[23:25:34] <petn-randall> ... and build scripts that still
need to run on that architecture nonetheless.
3510[23:25:48] <zokum> yes, but those are shared
3511[23:26:00] <jkcg> zokum: IIRC you are correct, portage, which
is the package manager of gentoo is a bit different
3512[23:26:18] <petn-randall> zokum: They still need to get fixed
to build on architecture X. That doesn't just happen
automagically.
3514[23:26:27] *** Quits: BOSNA (~Sokol@replaced-ip) ()
3515[23:26:50] <jkcg> you may be able to do what you sya but, the
compiling time for, lets say, chrome takes like 2 days to compile
3516[23:27:16] <zokum> petn-randall: yes, but you can opt to do
it yourself if you want to very easily, and the mirrors need only
supply the source package, not precompiled binaries
3517[23:27:29] <petn-randall> zokum: Convincing gcc to build for
arch X isn't the hard part, it's a) making sure the code
actually builds on the arch b) making sure the build system runs on
the arch c) getting some boot loader to work on the arch to boot the
kernel + initramfs.
3526[23:29:21] <zokum> the point is, gentoo can provide you with
an os optimized for pentium 2 if need be, but it takes ages to
compile
3527[23:29:26] <petn-randall> zokum: Right! So a Gentoo
maintainer actually does b) and c) by hand. And of course a), too.
If it doesn't build (irrelevant if it's on the user or
buildd machine), it doesn't run for the user.
3533[23:30:19] <zokum> petn-randall: the maintainers generally
only test for the common architectures, it's up to the user to
fix things to a much higher degree if things go wrong
3538[23:31:27] <petn-randall> zokum: Right. So then it's no
different than Debian. In Debian you can also just pull the source
packages, fix any problems and compile for your arch. You can even
(semi-)automate that.
3539[23:31:53] <zokum> yes, you probably can, and gentoo is built
around automatically always doing that for you
3540[23:32:08] <zokum> they've focused on the automation of
that stuff
3542[23:32:25] <jakes> running Raspbian (OSMC) & want to send
regular audio from video to my TV over HDMI (check) but audio from
my BT-connected mobile (a2dp) to my hifi over minijack, so that I
don't need to turn on the TV to listen to music
3543[23:32:25] <jakes> hi. running Raspbian (OSMC) & want to
send regular audio from video to my TV over HDMI (check) but audio
from my BT-connected mobile (a2dp) to my hifi over minijack, so that
I don't need to turn on the TV to listen to music
3544[23:32:48] <petn-randall> !raspbian
3545[23:32:49] <dpkg> Raspbian is a distribution <based on
Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian
is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use
#raspbian on irc.freenode.net for support.
replaced-url
3546[23:32:58] <petn-randall> jakes: Try asking in their support
channel. ^^^
3547[23:33:17] <jakes> petn-randall: cheers
3548[23:33:22] <petn-randall> jakes: yw
3549[23:33:39] <jakes> have asked there, but only tumbleweeds
3550[23:33:44] <petn-randall> jakes: There's also
#raspberrypi.
3555[23:34:35] <petn-randall> jakes: The channel is a lot
smaller, so you need to be patient. Also it's night for EU/US,
so you might have more luck asking in 8h or so.
3556[23:35:00] <jakes> yea - I'm on the arse-end of the
world NZT
3557[23:35:06] *** Quits: loptr (~loptr@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3558[23:35:06] <petn-randall> jakes: Well, raspbian being the OS,
it looks like the right channel for me.
3566[23:35:47] <jakes> IRC is very sleepy when I'm up, so
need to kick up a fuss, work a lot harder to find anyone
knowledgable awake in any relevant channels
3567[23:36:01] <zokum> it's 23:35 in europe, so it should be
like 17:35 us east coast, so should be people awake
3582[23:38:48] <jakes> BCMM: I am (well, PulseAudio under
Raspbian)
3583[23:39:03] <jakes> running Raspbian (OSMC) & want to send
regular audio from video to my TV over HDMI (check) but audio from
my BT-connected mobile (a2dp) to my hifi over minijack, so that I
don't need to turn on the TV to listen to music
3584[23:39:23] <BCMM> jakes: i just joined so i'm guessing
from petn-randall's message, but i take it you had no luck on
#raspbian?
3591[23:40:18] <BCMM> jakes: i was just gonna point out that
#raspberrypi has much more raspbian chat than #raspbian does, ever
since the Foundation made Raspbian their favourite distro
3599[23:43:08] <BCMM> jakes: i'd like to hope communities
centered around open-source are slightly more resistant to moving to
proprietary communication platforms
3605[23:44:35] <petn-randall> Pff, discord. Slack is the shit for
this month!
3606[23:45:09] <jakes> I think it was a lot to do with shiny
interfaces - i.e. ability to communicate more expressive than just
type, such as anigif & memes - & that many FLOSS community
have some VERY TOXIC attitudes deeply entrenched
3619[23:49:07] <ryouma> does grub-install or update-grub run
os-prober? is it only for the purpose of populating the grub menu?
i.e. it won't change anything except a menu file right?
3620[23:49:17] <jkcg> hello debian users
3621[23:49:45] <jkcg> I would like to know, if some of you are in
deb testing of ppc64
3622[23:49:52] <jkcg> or ppc
3623[23:50:25] <ryouma> isn't that unsupported as of
post-jessie or something?
3624[23:50:32] <jkcg> well no
3625[23:50:36] <jkcg> you are right
3626[23:50:43] <jkcg> it is not officially supported
3651[23:56:54] <jkcg> power macs are divided in two periods,
powermac g4 and earilier, and power mac g5, g4 are 32 bit, the
standard powerpc target you see
3652[23:57:01] <BCMM> ryouma: all macs since '06 are
little-endian
3653[23:57:01] *** Quits: deicide- (~deicide-@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)