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• 42[00:19:57] <michael2> does anyone know what the error message "sap driver initialization failed" means in the context of /usr/sbin/bluetooth ?
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• 56[00:28:00] <lilith93> Hi, I'm on Debian 9.4 and using Chromium. Just realized that javascript is not working since recently... ?
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• 59[00:29:08] <lilith93> When trying to play these soundfiles here( replaced-url
• 60[00:29:30] <lilith93> I'm pretty this is new
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• 63[00:31:10] <michael2> how are you trying to run the javascript?
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• 67[00:34:15] <lilith93> michael2: Maybe not javascript ... just java ... It is activated in Chromium -> Settings -> Advanced
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• 70[00:34:41] <lilith93> I did not install any extra java stuff
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• 74[00:37:34] <rant> java and javascript have nothing at all in common other than 4 letters in their name.. designed/owned by different companies, totally different programming languages
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• 76[00:38:34] <lilith93> rant: ok, I'm talking about plane java then
• 77[00:38:40] <lilith93> plain
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• 79[00:39:03] <rant> if a plane ran on java I'd want to be as far from its flight path as possible
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• 81[00:39:55] <michael2> lilith93: the message javascript:void(0) is just a placeholder in the link element you clicked on - its purpose is simply to prevent the link from doing the things links normally do - navigate to a new page
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• 83[00:40:24] <rant> yes in such cases a script hooks an event to detect the click and do something
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• 85[00:40:47] <michael2> or to disable naviagation - then an event bound to the element executes the javascript code
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• 92[00:41:52] <lilith93> Hmmm... this is new and with Firefox I can listen to the wav files. What can be wrong here?
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• 94[00:42:14] <rant> lilith93: what version of chromium? Check "about" or dpkg -l chromium
• 95[00:42:34] <rant> cause it works for me.. and we just heard in here that there is a nasty bug in chromium
• 96[00:42:40] <lilith93> 67.0.3396.87
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• 98[00:42:48] <lilith93> ah
• 99[00:42:52] <lilith93> seems to be new
• 100[00:42:56] <lilith93> < 2 weeks
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• 102[00:43:07] <rant> ,v chromium
• 103[00:43:09] <judd> Package: chromium on amd64 -- wheezy: 37.0.2062.120-1~deb7u1; wheezy-security: 37.0.2062.120-1~deb7u1; jessie: 57.0.2987.98-1~deb8u1; jessie-security: 57.0.2987.98-1~deb8u1; stretch: 62.0.3202.89-1~deb9u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 63.0.3239.84-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 66.0.3359.117-1~deb9u1; buster: 67.0.3396.87-1; sid: 67.0.3396.87-1; experimental: 68.0.3440.33-1
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• 106[00:43:56] <rant> you're using testing/unstable which is not supported here. and that browser has a bug in it causing it to not be able to use all sorts of media
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• 112[00:44:31] <rant> ,bug 900533
• 113[00:44:33] <judd> Bug replaced-url
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• 115[00:44:46] <rant> !debian-next
• 116[00:44:46] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
• 117[00:45:02] <lilith93> I installed it from the Debian repo....
• 118[00:45:09] <lilith93> that's strange
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• 120[00:45:14] <rant> yeah but not the stable one obviously
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• 122[00:45:17] <michael2> lilith93: what branch of debian are you using?
• 123[00:45:25] <lilith93> 9.4
• 124[00:45:44] <lilith93> It's the only one I see in synaptic
• 125[00:45:46] <rant> lilith93: put the output of apt policy on paste.debian.net
• 126[00:45:50] <michael2> I mean are you using stable, testing or unstable?
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• 129[00:46:02] <lilith93> I thought stable
• 130[00:46:13] <lilith93> but maybe I did a mistake ... would be new to me
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• 132[00:46:46] <rant> judd isn't correct on that versions of chromium either
• 133[00:47:04] <lilith93> apt policy on paste.debian.net doesn't work
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• 135[00:47:20] <lilith93> package cannot be found ...
• 136[00:47:44] <annadane> no, type apt policy in a terminal and paste the output to paste.debian.net and post the link to it here
• 137[00:48:03] <rant> chromium:\ Installed: 66.0.3359.117-1~deb9u1\ Candidate: 67.0.3396.87-1~deb9u1\ Version table:\ 67.0.3396.87-1~deb9u1 500\ 500 replaced-url
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• 141[00:48:35] <rant> you'll notice the output from my system of apt policy chromium doesn't match judd's version table
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• 143[00:49:07] <rant> I'm avoiding that upgrade because we had just heard in here that that bug 900533 is in the stretch-security release
• 144[00:49:18] <lilith93> replaced-url
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• 149[00:49:46] <lilith93> I read that there was a security update ... I installed it maybe even yesterday
• 150[00:49:52] <lilith93> so that would make sense
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• 152[00:50:02] <rant> heh
• 153[00:50:17] <rant> you are not running debian.. you are running frankendebian
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• 155[00:50:36] <rant> do NOT _EVER_ use ubuntu ppa in debian
• 156[00:50:38] <lilith93> rant: It's debian + kxstudio repos
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• 158[00:51:07] <rant> did I mention _EVER_ as in _NEVER_ as in Fival Mousekawitz would change his song for this scenario..
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• 166[00:52:12] <lilith93> Is there a problem with my repos except of KXstudio repos?
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• 168[00:52:51] <rant> doesn't matter once you have a 3rd party repo it can ruin everything.. even one like debian-multimedia which is maintained by debian developers
• 169[00:53:23] <rant> but by the look of it, no its not right.. has redundant mirrors
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• 171[00:53:38] <lilith93> rant: Yes... but it's Desktop computer... not a server or something.
• 172[00:54:01] <themill> debian-multimedia is not maintained by debian developers btw
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• 174[00:54:19] <lilith93> Then I ask the dev of KXstudio
• 175[00:55:07] <rant> lilith93: you more than likely need to reinstall.. you even put what looks like duplicate mirrors for kxstudio some of which are ubuntu mirrors and all of which are same priority as your main mirrors
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• 177[00:55:12] <rant> your system is probably fubar
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• 181[00:55:43] <rant> lilith93: check dpkg -l libc6 and paste tthe version number here.. see if it went all the way down to libc
• 182[00:55:44] <lilith93> oh shit
• 183[00:56:20] <lilith93> 2.24-11+deb9u3
• 184[00:56:35] <rant> hmm.. thats odd
• 185[00:56:43] <rant> ,v libc6
• 186[00:56:44] <judd> Package: libc6 on amd64 -- wheezy: 2.13-38+deb7u10; wheezy-security: 2.13-38+deb7u12; jessie: 2.19-18+deb8u10; jessie-security: 2.19-18+deb8u10; stretch-security: 2.24-11+deb9u1; stretch: 2.24-11+deb9u3; buster: 2.27-3; sid: 2.27-3
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• 188[00:57:05] <lilith93> why?
• 189[00:57:10] <lilith93> It's stretch ..
• 190[00:57:22] <lilith93> That's what I have installed
• 191[00:57:38] <rant> yeah.. just seems strange to me the versions are backwards
• 192[00:57:46] <rant> showing older in security
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• 194[00:58:08] <lilith93> So, is my system screwed now?
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• 196[00:58:52] <rant> lilith93: well you might be able to clean stuff up but you'd want to first remove all 3rd party packages and those repos, and redo your sources.list
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• 199[00:59:22] <rant> idk how you got a buster package.. check apt policy chromium
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• 202[00:59:51] <annadane> !tell lilith93 about stretch sources.list
• 203[01:00:00] * themill has not seen any buster package hee
• 204[01:00:09] <lilith93> Installiert: 67.0.3396.87-1~deb9u1
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• 206[01:00:21] <rant> the chromimum version he had was only listed in buster
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• 208[01:01:15] <rant> and you have sources for that kx thing for 4 different releases all same priority as your main repos.. so depending on whats on those repos and what it depends on.. idk could be real bad or rather minor
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• 210[01:01:59] <lilith93> rant: I think this is normal. I'll ask the the guy from kxstudio
• 211[01:02:15] <lilith93> This is only stuff for music
• 212[01:02:19] <themill> rant: no, the chromium version is not from buster, it's from stretch-security
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• 214[01:02:58] <lilith93> replaced-url
• 215[01:03:17] <lilith93> I followed the website (see above) for Debian
• 216[01:03:19] <rant> yes well I see that now that he pasted the whole version string and as I said earlier thats confirmed by a user here a couple hours ago to be affected by #900533
• 217[01:03:36] <rant> which would explain why they cant play those audio files
• 218[01:03:58] <rant> the bug is said to break YT, gifs, etc..
• 219[01:04:06] <lilith93> youtube works
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• 221[01:04:50] <rant> I'm on 66.0.3359.117-1~deb9u1 and that site works for me
• 222[01:05:06] <lilith93> Did somebody send me message?
• 223[01:05:10] <lilith93> dpkg?
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• 225[01:05:34] <rant> lilith93: annadane had told dpkg to tell you about a stretch sources.list
• 226[01:05:57] <rant> because it looks to me like you have many redundant sources both officiall and 3rd party
• 227[01:05:57] <lilith93> I see
• 228[01:06:03] <rant> judging from the apt policy output
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• 232[01:07:25] <rant> both deb.debian.org and ftp.de.debian.org for example
• 233[01:07:34] <lilith93> I remember that the KXrepos look chaotic
• 234[01:07:46] <rant> and three different ubuntu releases for the KX
• 235[01:07:53] <lilith93> latter is ok
• 236[01:08:02] <rant> no, its really not :P
• 237[01:08:10] <rant> you don't want to use ppa in debian
• 238[01:08:25] <rant> find another way
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• 242[01:09:09] <lilith93> why? or what's the problem with it?
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• 247[01:11:29] <rant> perhaps nothing.. I'm no gonna scour the repo.. but any package on there with same name as a debian package or that requires a lib thats not in debian will break your whole system and the repo is at same priority as your debian repos so it'd get stuff from there unknowingly
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• 250[01:12:02] <rant> provided you can count on the fact that this repo has absolutely no packages that are same name and newer versions than debians repo, in theory its not a problem
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• 254[01:12:33] <annadane> hence the query about libc6, if that gets overwritten with a newer version you really are screwed
• 255[01:12:45] <annadane> because everything else basically relies on it
• 256[01:13:00] <rant> if ANYTHING gets overwritten it could cause anything that depends on that to be broken
• 257[01:13:33] <rant> idk what this KX thing is, but if its not in debian, a PPA is not the way to go.. better to build from source than do that
• 258[01:13:42] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 259[01:14:03] <lilith93> I hope so... but I'll ask the dev
• 260[01:14:24] <lilith93> where is libc6 written? Did I post something?
• 261[01:14:29] *** Joins: mazoltov (~iguana@replaced-ip)
• 262[01:15:38] <lilith93> I don't know where ftp.de.debian came from
• 263[01:15:53] <lilith93> maybe from activating the backports?
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• 267[01:16:36] <annadane> lilith93, the idea is that packages have dependencies, we say that a package "pulls in" those dependencies, and since large swaths of packages depend on libc6...
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• 270[01:17:15] <annadane> it's easy to end up with a different version of libc6 than debian stable supports, and because so much depends on it, you're more or less screwed at that stage
• 271[01:17:51] *** Quits: hele (~hele@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 272[01:18:12] <lilith93> ok
• 273[01:18:16] <annadane> i suppose if one *really* knew what they were doing they could rescue a system from such a state but it would at minimum be tedious and it would be easier to just start over at that stage
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• 276[01:18:52] <lilith93> So, the kxrepos are the problem here?
• 277[01:19:19] <lilith93> or also the ftp debian repo?
• 278[01:19:48] <annadane> (but your libc6 appears to be the one from stretch as mentioned so you could be ok)
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• 283[01:20:36] <rant> the problem here is judd outputted tthe wrong version numbers for some reason
• 284[01:20:47] <rant> which caused me to think you had a buster chromium
• 285[01:20:51] <rant> but you dont
• 286[01:21:06] <csmall> Can a bot hee tell me the latest kernel in sid?
• 287[01:21:10] <csmall> here
• 288[01:21:17] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 289[01:21:18] <rant> ,kernels
• 290[01:21:19] <judd> Available kernel versions are: experimental: 4.16.0-rc6-686 (4.16~rc6-1~exp1); sid: 4.17.0-1-686-pae (4.17.3-1); buster: 4.16.0-2-686 (4.16.16-2); stretch-backports: 4.16.0-0.bpo.2-686-pae (4.16.16-2~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.9.0-6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1); jessie-backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 3.16.0-6-686-pae (3.16.56-1+deb8u1); wheezy-backports:
• 291[01:21:20] <judd> 3.16.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.16.39-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-6-686-pae (3.2.102-1)
• 292[01:21:24] <csmall> pefect
• 293[01:22:05] <rant> as of right now there is no evidence to suggest your system is messed up other than your sources are not healthy.. you want to remove all but the debian KX repos if you insist on using them at all, and get a proper debian stretch sources.list
• 294[01:22:39] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 295[01:22:56] <annadane> also for future reference replaced-url
• 296[01:23:07] *** Joins: Spiffy (~Spiffy@replaced-ip)
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• 299[01:24:04] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 300[01:24:58] <rant> following some guide telling you to install a 3rd party package to manage your sources is just a REALLY bad idea
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• 304[01:25:46] <rant> you are putting a ton of faith in the hands of a 3rd party developer.. and personally I've seen apps look just like all those on that kx website by different names in debian so idk what it even offers
• 305[01:26:45] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 306[01:27:25] <lilith93> It's for music production and it's quite famous... beside AVLinux
• 307[01:27:35] * rant shrugs
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• 311[01:28:08] <rant> we have jackd, alsa, pulse, hydrogen, rosegarden, etc..etc.. hundreds of sound apps
• 312[01:28:27] <rant> if you really need something special for this you should probably just use their distro
• 313[01:28:30] *** Quits: eyalroz (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
• 314[01:29:22] *** Quits: Nekojimi (~jimj316@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 315[01:29:27] <lilith93> The Calf Plugins are quite old from Debian
• 316[01:29:28] *** Quits: ChinesiumX230t (~Funk@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
• 317[01:29:33] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 318[01:29:34] <lilith93> and make problems
• 319[01:29:44] *** Quits: MastaAce (~MastaAce@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 320[01:30:01] *** Quits: csmall (~csmall@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 2.1)
• 321[01:30:26] <lilith93> but back to chromium: So there's a bug in the latest security update?
• 322[01:30:41] *** Quits: blingrang (~blingrang@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 323[01:30:45] <lilith93> Then I just wait until it's solved, or?
• 324[01:30:51] <rant> idk, read the bug report the user here earlier said so and said he added to the bug
• 325[01:30:58] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 326[01:31:31] <rant> all I know is the site works for me.. for all I know any of the packages for audio you've installed could be why your audio doesnt play on that site in chromium
• 327[01:31:53] <annadane> i guess it's kind of a tradeoff whether you should hold off due to a bug or update because it's a security fix... i'd probably just update but idk how severe the bug is
• 328[01:32:05] *** Quits: janisvilcans (~janisvilc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 329[01:32:13] <rant> you can either use debian stable and get help here, or use kxstudio.. you can't use kxstudio on debian and still have us figure out why stuff doesnt work. its too complicated
• 330[01:32:41] *** Quits: darxun (darxun@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
• 331[01:32:46] <rant> I use debian stable, the site works for me
• 332[01:32:48] <lilith93> ok
• 333[01:32:49] *** Quits: solidstate (~SolidStat@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 334[01:33:10] *** Joins: j3kyl_ (~user@replaced-ip)
• 335[01:33:23] <rant> I'm not willing to taint my system to reproduce your issue, sorry
• 336[01:33:27] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 337[01:33:33] <lilith93> rant: Sure :D
• 338[01:33:50] <lilith93> rant: But you use a different Chromium version?
• 339[01:34:27] <rant> lilith93: yes, I am using the old stretch version.. that I COULD do.. though I don't want to cause I'm skert :P
• 340[01:34:36] <rant> I could install the security update
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• 342[01:34:47] *** Joins: darxun (darxun@replaced-ip)
• 343[01:35:08] * rant installs 12 pending updates
• 344[01:35:16] <lilith93> hm
• 345[01:35:19] *** Joins: nightw0lf (~nightw0lf@replaced-ip)
• 346[01:35:22] <lilith93> I'm curious
• 347[01:35:37] <rant> we're about to find out :P
• 348[01:35:55] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 349[01:36:34] <rant> would suck if this breaks chromium.. I use it regularly :P
• 350[01:36:53] <rant> though I'm planning a reinstall soon anyhow.. to get off this tiny ssd
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• 353[01:37:37] * rant shuts down chromium
• 354[01:38:04] <rant> Unpacking chromium (67.0.3396.87-1~deb9u1) over (66.0.3359.117-1~deb9u1) ...
• 355[01:38:21] <rant> meh.. crap
• 356[01:38:29] <J0ca_> hey guys
• 357[01:38:30] <rant> ran out of disk space.. heh..
• 358[01:38:36] <lilith93> what?
• 359[01:38:45] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 360[01:38:48] <J0ca_> where can i find sources.list -> debian 6
• 361[01:39:23] * rant rm -rf .cache
• 362[01:39:49] <rant> lilith93: I only have an 8gb ssd flat partition.. heh.. ran out of disk space upgrading.. dealing with it
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• 365[01:40:16] <annadane> what rant is trying to say is chromium OBLITERATED his computer and ruined EVERYTHING
• 366[01:40:32] <lilith93> And it 's all my fault :(
• 367[01:40:32] <rant> no, I just didnt have enough space to unpack it :P
• 368[01:41:00] <annadane> well if that's not a sign
• 369[01:41:07] <rant> usually removing ~/.cache is fairly safe and frees some hundreds mb.. gonna try thumbnails next if need be
• 370[01:41:15] <J0ca_> where can i find sources.list -> debian 6
• 371[01:41:17] <J0ca_> E: Unable to locate package gcc
• 372[01:41:18] <J0ca_> :S
• 373[01:41:27] *** Quits: janisvilcans (~janisvilc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 374[01:41:31] <annadane> well don't install gcc from squeeze on debian stretch
• 375[01:41:37] <annadane> what are you actually trying to do
• 376[01:42:03] <annadane> you can probably get gcc from snapshots but again please don't go mixing your system like that
• 377[01:42:06] <annadane> !snapshots
• 378[01:42:06] <dpkg> replaced-url
• 379[01:42:27] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 380[01:42:43] * rant has way too many pkgs installed for his puny ssd
• 381[01:42:46] *** Quits: wonderworld (~ww@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 382[01:43:17] <J0ca_> annadane how i do it?
• 383[01:43:32] <annadane> the website has instructions, i'm not really used to using that website
• 384[01:43:41] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 385[01:44:05] <annadane> again, do not *install* gcc from squeeze
• 386[01:44:38] <rant> lilith93: yes YT still works but freesound no longer works
• 387[01:44:49] *** Joins: gkwhc (~gkwhc@replaced-ip)
• 388[01:44:54] <J0ca_> annadane
• 389[01:45:15] <J0ca_> but i need
• 390[01:45:18] <lilith93> rant: Ok... same issue here
• 391[01:45:20] <annadane> for what?
• 392[01:45:22] <J0ca_> gcc in my system
• 393[01:45:23] *** Joins: kobain (~kobain@replaced-ip)
• 394[01:45:24] <lilith93> thanks
• 395[01:45:38] <annadane> what debian version are you running, and why do you need an ancient version of gcc
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• 398[01:46:07] <rant> lilith93: testing a reversion workaround
• 399[01:47:12] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 400[01:47:16] <lilith93> I'm writting a post concerning the source list meanwhile
• 401[01:48:22] <J0ca_> annadane hey
• 402[01:48:32] <gkwhc> Hi there! I've been a long time Archlinux user and recently have been thinking of switching over to Debian (testing/stable). In arch, i rarely update my system even tho it is a rolling system. Everytime i download a new package, things would often break due to dependencies in my system being alot older. Would this be true of Debian testing/stable?
• 403[01:48:35] <J0ca_> annadane replaced-url
• 404[01:48:43] <J0ca_> my sources.list is broken?
• 405[01:49:17] *** Quits: Bry2k200 (~bry2k200@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 406[01:49:17] <mtn> gkwhc: testing and stable are quite different. there is no testing/stable
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• 409[01:49:30] <annadane> J0ca_, post your sources.list to paste.debian.net
• 410[01:49:40] *** Joins: lektrik (~mayday_ja@replaced-ip)
• 411[01:50:04] <annadane> you're probably mixing debian releases which is bad
• 412[01:50:18] <J0ca_> annadane replaced-url
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• 415[01:50:37] <annadane> ok, so pure squeeze... be aware that support for it ended a long time ago
• 416[01:50:43] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 417[01:50:45] <annadane> i'd really consider upgrading to stretch
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• 420[01:51:29] <J0ca_> i cant update this machine
• 421[01:51:51] <gkwhc> mtn: i know, im just wondering if itd happen in either of them
• 422[01:52:04] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 423[01:52:08] <annadane> well fair enough, maybe someone can answer you better
• 424[01:52:11] <gkwhc> with installing packages and dependency issues/versions
• 425[01:52:12] <mtn> gkwhc: if you use any distro incorrectly it can break. use it properly and it will work fine.
• 426[01:52:16] <J0ca_> annadane 404 Not Found [IP: 200.144.183.235 80]
• 427[01:52:19] *** Joins: solidstat (~SolidStat@replaced-ip)
• 428[01:52:25] <J0ca_> can i use other source.list?
• 429[01:52:36] <annadane> not really because the debian mirrors won't be providing squeeze packages
• 430[01:52:39] <mtn> gkwhc: testing can break and does so. stable not hardly ever breaks, unless you do things incorrectly
• 431[01:52:53] <lilith93> like me
• 432[01:52:55] <lilith93> :D
• 433[01:53:16] <J0ca_> annadane can i install with dpkg ?
• 434[01:53:27] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 435[01:53:47] <annadane> gkwhc, well i don't know how pacman does things but apt has dependencies and packages pull in dependencies so things shouldn't break for that reason
• 436[01:54:00] <annadane> but stable has a much more conservative release cycle compared to arch
• 437[01:54:21] <annadane> J0ca_, um... maybe, i guess
• 438[01:54:24] <annadane> not certain
• 439[01:54:30] <gkwhc> mtn: i see. since arch doesnt split into stable/testing, does this mean dependency packages are tested and "locked in" so to speak for each release? what if a 3rd party package requires a newer version?
• 440[01:54:40] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 441[01:54:56] <mtn> gkwhc: using 3rd party software with debian is a very good way to break it ;)
• 442[01:55:00] *** Joins: lessthan0 (~lessthan0@replaced-ip)
• 443[01:55:10] <annadane> replaced-url
• 444[01:55:17] <annadane> gkwhc, ^
• 445[01:55:23] *** Joins: janisvilcans (~janisvilc@replaced-ip)
• 446[01:55:23] <mtn> gkwhc: replaced-url
• 447[01:55:49] <gkwhc> annadane: pacman also has dependency checks, but more often that not it could be like, oh as long has its newer than version xxx. all passes during installation, but breaks other packages
• 448[01:55:58] <lessthan0> replaced-url
• 449[01:56:01] *** Joins: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip)
• 450[01:56:02] <lessthan0> this failed for me
• 451[01:56:15] <mtn> gkwhc: with arch you must do all of your updates at once. or it will break, like it did for you
• 452[01:56:21] <lessthan0> it added the user but the password is not set to match the user password
• 453[01:56:25] *** Joins: eamanu (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip)
• 454[01:56:37] <lessthan0> in #debian they said to edit the sudoers file
• 455[01:56:45] <annadane> it depends on the third party software in question though. if you physically install it you can end up breaking your system, but if it just resides in its own folder... and i'm speaking in general terms, there are exceptions... generally third party software shouldn't break like that for most things, 2 years tends to be right in the sweet spot in terms of newness of software, relatively
• 456[01:56:50] <lessthan0> I looked at that but used adduser instead
• 457[01:57:00] *** Quits: Christian75 (~Christian@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 458[01:57:07] <lessthan0> do I need to also edit the sudoers file?
• 459[01:57:20] *** Quits: Nefertiti` (~Nefertiti@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
• 460[01:57:39] <annadane> debian has nothing like the AUR like arch has
• 461[01:57:40] <gkwhc> mtn: yeah i know haha. the reason i rarely update is really annoying, and configurations break sometimes
• 462[01:58:00] <mtn> gkwhc: then you should not run arch.
• 463[01:58:07] <gkwhc> annadane: ahh i see. is it possible to install ubuntu packages then?
• 464[01:58:10] <annadane> so just be aware if you come from arch, testing or unstable will be more familiar to you but stable is much more conservative
• 465[01:58:12] <annadane> gkwhc, no
• 466[01:58:14] <mtn> gkwhc: debian stable should work well for you
• 467[01:58:18] <lessthan0> woops
• 468[01:58:18] <gkwhc> mtn: yeah, which is why im thinking of switching over
• 469[01:58:20] <annadane> as DontBreakDebian in the wiki mentions
• 470[01:58:21] <lessthan0> I sorted it
• 471[01:58:27] <lessthan0> caps lock was on
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• 477[01:59:06] <annadane> stable is essentially frozen, but one can get newer packages via backports or by compiling it themselves or downloading it in its own directory
• 478[01:59:12] <lessthan0> this was a lot easier than editing sudoers file
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• 481[01:59:55] <lessthan0> and while we are here. what is the prefered file to edit?
• 482[01:59:57] <lessthan0> # Please consider adding local content in /etc/sudoers.d/ instead of
• 483[01:59:57] <lessthan0> # directly modifying this file.
• 484[02:00:01] *** Quits: janisvilcans (~janisvilc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 485[02:00:09] <lessthan0> one of them is not persistent?
• 486[02:00:27] *** Joins: Christian75 (~Christian@replaced-ip)
• 487[02:00:33] <gkwhc> hmm that is very true
• 488[02:00:47] <annadane> the thing *not* to do is go "hey, this package is in testing, i'll just add it to my sources list and install it from there", that's how you get a broken system (with exceptions, like apt pinning, if one knows what they're doing)
• 489[02:00:53] <gkwhc> i think i'll give it a shot then
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• 495[02:01:15] <annadane> you can run mixed testing/sid, but not stable with anything else unless it's backports
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• 497[02:02:07] <gkwhc> yeah, might have to rely on backports then. i'll be doing some development work and it seems like the tools arent readily available in stable
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• 500[02:02:25] <lilith23> annadane: Is it a problem to have replaced-url
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• 502[02:02:52] <lilith23> I did not add any other repos except the kxstudio one
• 503[02:02:53] <gkwhc> annadane: in your experience, does upgrading releases generally break in debian?
• 504[02:03:11] <annadane> lilith23, i'd just make it consistent and use the same one except security.debian.org which should always be that specific url
• 505[02:03:26] <annadane> if you read the message dpkg sent you about stretch sources.list
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• 507[02:04:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1597
• 508[02:04:38] <annadane> gkwhc, in my experience... no, but it comes down to philosophy, if you need your comptuer for work, the packages in stable were more tested and to a degree - i run unstable as a daily desktop so i find it stable enough - you're playing russian roulette with the next update
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• 512[02:05:22] <annadane> also depends on what you mean by break - break as in unbootable? rare and generally easily fixable, break in small but annoying ways? sort of depends on the package
• 513[02:05:32] <lilith23> I just did apt-get update and get : W: replaced-url
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• 515[02:05:43] <lilith23> hm
• 516[02:05:47] <lilith23> that's new
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• 518[02:05:59] <annadane> new to me too, so i don't know, maybe someone has a better idea
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• 520[02:06:14] <annadane> but can you post your actual sources.list to paste.debian.net, we can look at it
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• 522[02:06:38] <annadane> i've never seen that specific message though
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• 524[02:07:17] <lilith23> I posted it some minutes ago
• 525[02:07:18] <lilith23> replaced-url
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• 528[02:08:09] <annadane> gkwhc, basically one thing to watch out for in unstable in particular is not all the packages may be uploaded yet - times called "transitions" - where if you blindly upgrade it can remove packages from your system, the thing to do is then to wait a little while, but even then i'm oversimplifying it, i know how to untangle it because i'm more familiar with it, you may not
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• 531[02:08:30] <annadane> i'd probably start with stable and if you truly need something newer, install it using a trusted method (and ask here if you're not sure)
• 532[02:09:00] <annadane> lilith23, i was under the impression you changed your sources.list from that, though
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• 534[02:09:34] <gkwhc> ah okay, sounds good. thanks for the tips annadane!
• 535[02:09:43] <lilith23> annadane: No I did nothing with the source.list
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• 537[02:10:23] <rant> lilith23: there is def something fishy going on here I've not narrowed it down yet but its giving errors about demuxer when trying to play those sounds from freesound.org, gdb and strace arent helping so far :P
• 538[02:10:30] <annadane> i don't know about testing and how it deals with things like that (it's a lot more sane though as far as that goes) but i know in unstable you have to triangulate between, what's meant to be removed, when do i need to wait, how do i prune this or that to solve the blockade
• 539[02:10:52] *** Quits: mazoltov (~iguana@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 540[02:10:58] <annadane> you can also ask in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net for more info about development releases of debian, #debian is for stable, so debian-next may give you more info
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• 543[02:11:24] <annadane> lilith23, ok, well, i'm not familiar with that message, someone else will have to answer
• 544[02:12:06] <rant> and of the 12 packages upgraded none of them are sound related or chromium deps
• 545[02:12:11] <annadane> gkwhc, replaced-url
• 546[02:12:15] <rant> so whatever is wrong its in the chromium build itself
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• 548[02:13:12] <annadane> but essentially the most important thing is to keep backups of your files and don't just blindly press Y during upgrades, read what apt is telling you
• 549[02:13:50] <rant> replaced-url
• 550[02:13:53] <annadane> people using stable basically don't have to worry about this ever because it's meant to work but one should still read things
• 551[02:14:54] <annadane> (oh and install apt-listbugs)
• 552[02:15:03] <lilith23> rant: hope there's an update the next days which will fix it
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• 557[02:17:07] <rant> lilith23: YOU hope? mine was working! heh.. they removed the package I had from the repos.. I may look into it some more but I'm gonna run the the store before they close or it starts storming.. people are setting off a ton of fireworks and apparenly the heavens are taking it as a challenge cause everytime they set one off, the skies answer back
• 558[02:17:08] <annadane> so yeah it just comes down to philosophy, do you need something that always works or are you willing to deal with a bit of breakage and downtime (as i said, generally it's fine)
• 559[02:18:00] <annadane> many people find stable has just the right length of time between releases to be "new enough" while also providing debian's renowned stability
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• 561[02:18:15] <lessthan0> I need help with ssh
• 562[02:18:25] <lilith23> rant: Ahh ... independents day?
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• 564[02:18:42] <lessthan0> I have it firewalled to the outside world but I have connection refused on my home network
• 565[02:18:49] <rant> yeah.. missing the point as always.. this day is about not payin taxes! heh
• 566[02:18:56] <lessthan0> I know there is no IP conflict
• 567[02:19:00] <lessthan0> I can ping it
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• 572[02:20:34] <lilith23> I'm from Germany so ...
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• 575[02:25:41] <annadane> gkwhc, another solution if you need a lot of new tools is to run debian testing/unstable or even arch in a virtual machine so it doesn't touch the rest of your system
• 576[02:27:47] <annadane> which is really nice because you can keep snapshots of the vm in case an upgrade does go badly wrong (you can do this in debian proper too with things like btrfs snapshots but i'm not too familiar with that)
• 577[02:27:57] <annadane> so bascially i just gave you way too much information for a simple question :P
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• 580[02:30:49] <lilith23> concerning the error replaced-url
• 581[02:31:01] <lilith23> people advise to delete /etc/apt/trusted.gpg
• 582[02:31:08] <lilith23> the file was generated today
• 583[02:31:16] <lilith23> half an hour ago
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• 596[02:39:08] <MidTwitter> anyone recommend a good email client for debian that can only download the last say 50 messages from an email server when syncing?
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• 599[02:40:06] <k-man> a script I run for some purpose outputs a character that looks like a box with some 0 and 1s in it. i guess its a unicode character. but why does gnome terminal not show it as a unicode char?
• 600[02:41:03] <k-man> oh, if i paste it into google, it looks like a circle with a slash through it
• 601[02:42:08] <k-man> ah, ok, it seems to be: U+001F : <control-001F> (INFORMATION SEPARATOR ONE) {unit separator (US)}
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• 604[02:42:43] <gkwhc> annadane: haha that is actually a really great idea! thanks :p
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• 621[02:53:56] <rustbuckett> MidTwitter: you could probably do that with offlineimap or mbsync, then direct any client to the resulting maildir
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• 623[02:54:45] <MidTwitter> rustbuckett: nice, thx
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• 631[03:00:46] <rant> you could just as easily run it in a chroot and save resources, using schroot to help run the apps
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• 633[03:01:03] <rant> a VM just for testing/unstable is kinda overkill
• 634[03:01:34] <rant> unless you're looking for something huge like an Xorg or DE from testing/unstable
• 635[03:01:56] <rant> that can be a bit more tricky in a chroot
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• 645[03:09:20] <ryouma> is there anything funny about debconf inside a chroot, or if output or error is redirected?
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• 647[03:09:32] <ryouma> i am referring to dpkg-reconfigure grub-pc specifically
• 648[03:10:02] <rant> I didn't find it funny, but maybe I didn't get the joke
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• 719[04:02:02] <blackswan> where is the pointy clicky gui way to turn on multicast dns/bonjour/zeroconf networking?
• 720[04:02:29] <blackswan> wrt systemd
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• 734[04:11:27] <jim> well the networking guis I know of are wicd and nm
• 735[04:12:49] <jim> I dunno whether they do the specific thing you're after, or whether you have to configure it by editing plain text files
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• 742[04:14:35] <somiaj> networkmanager has plugins that can do most network configurations needed, but this isn't relaly a systemd thing. If you were wanting systemd, then look at networkd, and I don't think there is a gui for that
• 743[04:15:28] <Beggar> Hi, I am trying to use a different database for fortune, but this one contains devanagari characters. In an ordinary terminal the text is shown but in the login screen (before startx) the devanagari characters are show as question marks. LANG is set to UTF8. Any ideas ?
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• 745[04:16:52] <rant> you two always seem to get each other way off base from the original question
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• 747[04:18:07] <rant> blackswan: have a look at avahi-discover and avahi-ui-utils perhaps
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• 750[04:20:16] <ryouma> Beggar: utf-8
• 751[04:20:59] <Beggar> ryouma, yes it is set to UTF-----8
• 752[04:21:08] <ryouma> then no
• 753[04:21:19] <Beggar> वाच
• 754[04:21:40] <ryouma> 😈
• 755[04:21:44] <Beggar> this is shown correct in any terminal, but not in the login one
• 756[04:21:51] <rant> Beggar: its not clear what you mean. The things on tty 1-6 are called consoles or virtual terminals, the text login is typically agetty or getty, graphical login is called a Display Manager (DM) and the message displayed after a textt login is called Message of The Day (MOTD), where graphical terminals are called xterms. Figuring out why it works one place and not another you need to not confuse terms
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• 758[04:21:57] <rant> describing where it does and doesnt work
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• 762[04:22:26] <rant> xterms are also called x-terminal-emulators
• 763[04:22:26] <ryouma> i assume he means after login on vt
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• 765[04:23:00] <ryouma> is there anything unusual about debconf inside a chroot, or if output or error is redirected?
• 766[04:23:01] <Beggar> Ok, I was misunderstanding the console to be the login screen. Wel it works inside the terminal emulator and any text editor, but not in the Debian console.
• 767[04:23:03] <Beggar> rant
• 768[04:23:06] <rant> after login before or after the shell? and you only mention one.. he mentions two times one where i works and one where it doesnt
• 769[04:23:26] <ryouma> the console is pertty screwy
• 770[04:23:35] <ryouma> it needs a lot of work
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• 772[04:25:23] <Beggar> Well at this point I would not care if it is after login or before. After all fortune was aways run after sucessiful login...
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• 774[04:25:45] <Beggar> So after login it is the shell?
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• 776[04:26:47] <ryouma> probably you are running it in the early shell setup. lang should be befgore that.
• 777[04:27:07] <ryouma> but maybe your font is bad
• 778[04:27:08] <rant> yes.. the shell is typically bash, run after login
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• 780[04:27:33] <rant> but wha I am trying to figue out here is specifically where its being run from and where you say you can see these chars and where you cant
• 781[04:29:20] <rant> if by "shown correctly in any terminal" you mean any x-terminal-emulator thats different
• 782[04:29:35] <Beggar> rant, If I issue fortunes in the xfce4-terminal it show the characters in the way I want. But if I issue the same command in the console after sucessiful login it appears as question marks.
• 783[04:29:47] <rant> the virtual terminals (consoles) and x-terminal-emulators are totally seperate
• 784[04:29:56] <Beggar> And yes I mean any x-terminal emulator.
• 785[04:30:18] <rant> so you're not getting proper characters on the console/virtual terminals, but they work in X
• 786[04:30:41] <Beggar> Under slackware All I had to do is set LANG
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• 788[04:31:21] <rant> sounds to me like perhaps your console font does not have chars to print even though the encoding is correct (UTF-8)
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• 791[04:33:23] <Beggar> rant, thank you so much. I will research about the console fonts. I was probably getting bad stuff on web search because I was mixing the terms console, shell, terminal and using them as if they were all the exactly same thing.
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• 793[04:34:00] <Beggar> Thank you for pointing those. And thank you ryouma for the early mention to the fonts
• 794[04:35:47] <rant> Beggar: I'd install the fonts-deva and run dpkg-reconfigure fontconfig-config
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• 796[04:36:59] <rant> no wait thats not right
• 797[04:38:12] <rant> dpkg-reconfigure console-setup
• 798[04:38:23] <rant> is to change console settings
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• 800[04:40:31] <rant> though I dont think the linux console can display deva characters
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• 807[04:45:13] <rant> there are things like bterm though
• 808[04:45:16] <Beggar> well lets test it
• 809[04:45:19] <rant> ,i bterm
• 810[04:45:20] <judd> No package named 'bterm' was found in stretch/amd64.
• 811[04:45:32] <rant> ,i bogl-term
• 812[04:45:33] <judd> No package named 'bogl-term' was found in stretch/amd64.
• 813[04:45:49] <Beggar> /etc/default/console-setup
• 814[04:45:52] <rant> ,i bogl-bterm
• 815[04:45:53] <judd> Package bogl-bterm (utils, optional) in stretch/amd64: Ben's Own Graphics Library - graphical terminal. Version: 0.1.18-11+b2; Size: 31.3k; Installed: 68k
• 816[04:45:53] *** Quits: janisvilcans (~janisvilc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 817[04:46:13] <rant> its like an x-terminal-emulator but can run on tthe framebuffer
• 818[04:46:30] <rant> allows for running it on a console and have more advanced font support
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• 820[04:47:25] <rant> 'i mlterm
• 821[04:47:30] <Beggar> If ti fails I will consider trying something with the framebuffer or maybe using something different in the xfce4 panel isntead of the console.
• 822[04:47:30] <rant> ,i mlterm
• 823[04:47:31] <Beggar> brb
• 824[04:47:31] <judd> Package mlterm (x11, optional) in stretch/amd64: MultiLingual TERMinal. Version: 3.5.0-1+b2; Size: 191.5k; Installed: 469k; Homepage: replaced-url
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• 827[04:49:09] <rant> again you seem to be confusing terminology, you cannot have a console in xfce anywhere xfce is an X11 Desktop Environment
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• 829[04:49:42] <rant> X11 / Xorg etc.. is a graphical server application, the console is a driver in the linux kernel providing terminal support
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• 840[04:59:40] <ryouma> does this bogl-bterm get rid of that blinking underscore int he console (permanently; inb4 there are escape sequences byt htey get reset)?
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• 843[04:59:56] <ryouma> could i run emacs in this bogl-bterm?
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• 845[05:00:00] <ryouma> and get better keys?
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• 847[05:00:28] <rant> you know what you get when you cross an elephant with a rhino?
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• 850[05:01:02] <rant> elephino..
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• 852[05:01:18] <rant> heh.. I never tried it, just heard of it
• 853[05:02:36] <Beggar> rant, arabic, hebrew and cyrilic works pretty well, but devanagari does not. I will try to get deep on it latter. thanks again and see you all altter \o
• 854[05:02:51] <ryouma> i'm striking out with my quesitons today
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• 875[05:28:25] <lessthan0> the debian installer with LVM using the entire disk likes to format sda1 primary sda2 extended sda5 LVM
• 876[05:28:50] <lessthan0> what I would like to do is put sda2 as secondary partition LVM
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• 878[05:28:58] <lessthan0> without using extended partitions
• 879[05:29:32] <lessthan0> I have a 1TB drive that I will shrink the ext4 LV later
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• 882[05:30:24] <lessthan0> should I just give up on this or am I doing it wrong?
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• 894[05:42:47] * rant shrugs
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• 908[05:58:27] <heston> lessthan0, you should be able to manually set that up
• 909[05:58:59] <lessthan0> yeah thats what I was thinking
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• 911[05:59:10] <lessthan0> I'm gonna need to redo this install tomorrow
• 912[05:59:26] <lessthan0> manually set it up
• 913[05:59:34] <rant> you should also consider if you actually need it.. things like lvm, raid, luks, etc are just extra layers to complicate backup and recovery and introduce new means of failure and data loss
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• 915[05:59:49] <lessthan0> I actually do need LVM
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• 918[06:00:11] <lessthan0> I am making a headless SAN running debian
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• 921[06:00:33] <lessthan0> I have 3 machines and one of them is set aside for headless SAN
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• 925[06:01:31] <lessthan0> I need to shrink the debian root fs after I get it updated and configured. then the rest of the 1TB drive will be fore the shared virtual block device
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• 927[06:02:21] <lessthan0> and I also want to practice LVM since I am studying to be a cloud deployment guy
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• 929[06:03:01] <lessthan0> need to figure out how to setup loopback to the shared 950GB on the SAN
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• 931[06:03:59] <lessthan0> I think it will be easier to setup iSCSSI target over the network then it will be to have local access that is mounted while it is shared
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• 933[06:04:15] <lessthan0> I need to learn that
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• 947[06:09:52] <lessthan0> the debian installer is accessing the drive but stopped blinking the HDD light
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• 950[06:10:08] <lessthan0> and won't reboot only blinking cursor
• 951[06:10:13] <lessthan0> older intel i3
• 952[06:10:25] <lessthan0> I can hear the drive clicking
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• 954[06:10:59] <lessthan0> I thought the motherboard handles the HD LED?
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• 957[06:12:22] <rant> well some may but Im willing to bet they read from the disk rather than implement it themselves as the IDE on the disk implements that
• 958[06:12:42] <rant> back in the day you hooked directly to hte drive for indicator lights
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• 960[06:13:17] <lessthan0> going back before IDE?
• 961[06:13:42] <rant> well IDE is commonly misunderstood to mean PATA only
• 962[06:13:58] <lessthan0> I have been around since 1994 and I have never seen HD LED on the IDE controller on the drive
• 963[06:14:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1572
• 964[06:14:36] <lessthan0> so you are saying IDE before PATA?
• 965[06:14:42] <rant> IDE is Integrated Drive Electronics which refers to disks that have a controller with cache and smart and all that on the disk itself.. and all drives in the last 30 years are IDE
• 966[06:14:50] <rant> SATA is also IDE
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• 970[06:15:25] <rant> PATA/SATA/SAS/SCSI, etc are just the bus, they are still IDE drives
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• 972[06:15:30] <lessthan0> I thought SATA has no integrated controller?
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• 975[06:15:58] <lessthan0> so SATA is IDE but integrated is a misnomer?
• 976[06:16:33] <lessthan0> does this relate to ACPI also?
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• 979[06:17:25] <lessthan0> I think a lot of windows people refer to IDE as PATA since they understand the master slave stuff went away when PATA went away
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• 982[06:18:17] <lessthan0> and the retailer and manufacturers of SATA hardware never referred to it as IDE-SATA version
• 983[06:18:54] <lessthan0> the drivers are IDE
• 984[06:18:57] <rant> like many terms stupid people have made it to mean different things originally it was a term coined by WD for ATA
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• 988[06:19:25] <heston> it's a classification that doesn't need to be specified. a cpu is an IC
• 989[06:20:00] <rant> how news media refers to people who disrupt networks as hackers where a hacker is really just someone who chips away at things to make something else.. be it chainsaw sculptures or software or w/e
• 990[06:20:56] <lessthan0> I would prefer if the hollywood movies called criminals crimals and hackers hackers
• 991[06:21:06] <lessthan0> in a perfect world
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• 993[06:21:59] <lessthan0> and honestly lets call people who typed in a password someone who typed in a password
• 994[06:22:41] <lessthan0> calling them hackers and failing to mention the criminal aspect of un-authorized use or abuse is also bad journalism
• 995[06:22:53] <heston> that would be a cracker
• 996[06:22:56] <lessthan0> yes
• 997[06:23:08] <lessthan0> but I don't expect them to be super detailed
• 998[06:23:27] <heston> or there's white hat vs black hat hacker
• 999[06:23:34] <lessthan0> we just need to get away from the word hacker as pejorative
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• 1002[06:24:10] <lessthan0> yeah I would be fine with them calling them simply "black hats" stole some data blah blah
• 1003[06:24:54] <lessthan0> "black hats" used some celebrity's twitter for lulz
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• 1005[06:25:42] <rant> someone was asking earlier what the term was for that.. when you use someone else's social media. I couldnt think of it
• 1006[06:25:51] <lessthan0> maybe that is too offensive to the good people who wear black hats? and someone's 80 year old grandma doesn't understand the tv so she turns it off
• 1007[06:26:08] <lessthan0> impersonation
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• 1009[06:26:20] <lessthan0> and defacement
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• 1014[06:28:26] <rant> not that there is anything going on in here, but I invite you to use #debian-offtopic as people respond to activity in this channel to support debian
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• 1016[06:29:21] <lessthan0> ok
• 1017[06:29:34] <lessthan0> #debian-offtopic
• 1018[06:29:48] <lessthan0> forgot the /j
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• 1042[06:56:46] <pi__> I need to connect to my system through FTP Port 21 using a public IP Address. I dont have a router but connected through ethernet cable. My IP is a private IP. When contacted my ISP, they told me that the ports are forwarded. Any workaround?
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• 1047[07:07:02] <rant> pi__: do you have the gateway/modem physically accessible? login access to it?
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• 1049[07:07:15] <rant> ,i upnproutercontrol
• 1050[07:07:16] <judd> No package named 'upnproutercontrol' was found in stretch/amd64.
• 1051[07:07:39] <rant> ,i upnp-router-control
• 1052[07:07:40] <judd> Package upnp-router-control (comm, optional) in stretch/amd64: UPnP compliant router manager. Version: 0.2-1.2+b1; Size: 57.9k; Installed: 597k; Homepage: replaced-url
• 1053[07:07:51] *** Quits: ZetFury (~ZetFury@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 1054[07:08:02] <rant> if the router supports upnp you can add ports using that utility without logging in
• 1055[07:08:40] <rant> you can also do a reverse tunnel where a vpn or ssh connection from the machine at home connects to you and forwards the ports
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• 1058[07:09:43] <rant> upnp is simplest if its supported.. if you open that app and can see your routers info then you have upnp
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• 1069[07:17:31] <pi__> rant: i dont hav phisical access to gateway/modem. all i hav is an ethernet cable to connect my system.
• 1070[07:18:29] <rant> try insalling upnp-router-control it has a dead simple interface to forward ports with upnp wihout logging in
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• 1073[07:21:13] <rant> otherwise if not upnp or login access to router, you gotta tunnel even if you gotta use a middleman like a vps or such that both boxes can connect to
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• 1076[07:22:32] <rant> I hear riseup.net has free vpn services
• 1077[07:22:44] <pi__> ok
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• 1085[07:30:27] <deicide-> can someone help me with tlp? it was working and suddenly it doesn't
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• 1156[08:12:07] <nindustries> Hi. can I backup a server using rsync?
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• 1186[08:34:31] <nindustries> I may have removed files when sudo, any guidance to restore?
• 1187[08:35:13] <nindustries> \/etc and /home are gone, so /etc/sudoers isn't there to go to root
• 1188[08:35:20] <nindustries> I do have a backup in /tmp/
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• 1210[08:47:52] <somiaj> nindustries: if you can't become root with root's password, you'll need to boot up into a recovery mode and recover. Note /tmp maybe tmpfs, so maybe copy stuff elsewhere if possible
• 1211[08:48:33] <nindustries> aaaaand it's lost.
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• 1214[08:50:51] <nindustries> nvm :/
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• 1274[09:30:58] <jsavalle> quick question : nginx randomly crashing. Where can I find clue beside syslog and nginx logs?
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• 1283[09:35:45] <evilman_work> jsavalle: in core dump files. but better start from image name, in that sigfault happen (see dmesg output).
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• 1288[09:37:41] <jelly> jsavalle: nginx probably has increasingly verbose log levels, did you try using that to get more info in its log
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• 1291[09:38:23] <jelly> jsavalle: which debian release and which nginx build (package name) and version is this?
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• 1302[09:46:30] <e2> /msg NickServ help
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• 1315[09:57:49] <pi__> how to diable AudioCallbackDriver in firefox?
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• 1322[10:02:31] <ndroftheline> hey all, just need a little hint if possible, i'mt rying to mount a freenas iscsi target from a debian 9 install. i get to the point that i log into the target but it doesn't show up as a device.
• 1323[10:02:34] <ndroftheline> any suggestions?
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• 1331[10:08:27] <[E]sc> i'm trying to fix the sound on my system. i tried the systemctl command to enable and start, when i play a file on vlc or on youtube, it'll delay then play for 1/2 a second then cut off completely and won't return unless i reboot and the same thing happens. any idea how to fix this?
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• 1342[10:14:37] <FightingFalcon> is it necessary to install NTP in the system?
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• 1345[10:16:15] <somiaj> systemd comes with its own timesync service that will keep your time in sync, so no
• 1346[10:16:37] <wopi> Hi, How I can change the loglevel of cron to log the start and end time of a task? I read the manual and I see the values for LOGLEVEL 1 and 2 respectively, does it mean value "2" will log both values? I tried setting the EXTRA_OPTS="-L 2" in /etc/default/cron, restarted it and I see in the process list "/usr/sbin/cron -f -L 2", but don't see the starting time anymore, how I can log both?
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• 1363[10:28:29] <jelly> FightingFalcon: is it necessary to keep accurate time? No, not always
• 1364[10:28:30] <Srdeg> how do I change skins for LMusic ?
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• 1368[10:29:31] <jelly> but if you want to, and the system has internet access, some kind of ntp client is useful. Doesn't have to be the ntp package.
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• 1370[10:30:47] <Srdeg> how do I change skins for LXMusic ?
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• 1374[10:32:53] <pingwindyktator> Hello. Can someone here help me with upstart conf file? I was trying in #upstart but with no response
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• 1376[10:34:35] <deicide-> can someone help me with tlp? it was working and suddenly it doesn't
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• 1382[10:41:02] <FightingFalcon> is it necessary to install unbound dns server if im using postfix/dovecot for email server and nginx for web site server??
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• 1384[10:41:51] <colo-work> no
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• 1404[11:00:55] <jim> FightingFalcon, what you have to consider too, is the needs of the server... maybe when the mail server logs things, it wants to turn ip addresses into hostnames so that both can appear in the log entry, for that, it would be a good thing to have a fast way to look up names, and one of those ways is a dns server... any forwarding, say to the ISP's dns servers, is going to incur network latency
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• 1419[11:09:37] <benne> test
• 1420[11:09:57] <colo-work> the test has failed.
• 1421[11:10:02] <benne> roger
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• 1443[11:18:49] <FightingFalcon> is it unsafe to install unbound?
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• 1451[11:21:58] <petn-randall> FightingFalcon: Why would it be unsafe? And why are you crossposting from #postfix?
• 1452[11:22:01] <petn-randall> !crosspost
• 1453[11:22:01] <dpkg> Posting the same question in several places at the same time (IRC channels, news groups, mailing lists, forums) is impolite; your time is NOT more valuable than everyone else's. Your question might be answered elsewhere, meanwhile we are wasting our time doing research for a problem you've already solved. Cross-posting can also make you look like a spammer and get you k:lined. See also <multiple ask> <hurry>.
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• 1458[11:26:33] <deicide-> petn-randall, can you not help?
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• 1467[11:30:24] <annadane> he already asked a question
• 1468[11:30:35] <annadane> trying to get more information of what the original poster's motivations are
• 1469[11:31:12] <annadane> but you've apparently left anyway
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• 1487[11:43:45] <deicide-> msg dpkg guidelines
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• 1494[11:50:22] <deicide-> i'm done thanks for nothing
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• 1497[11:50:40] <petn-randall> deicide-: It helps being patient.
• 1498[11:50:43] <annadane> deicide-, /msg dpkg guidelines
• 1499[11:50:58] <deicide-> i been asking the same question for 2 days
• 1500[11:51:04] <deicide-> everyone ignoring me
• 1501[11:51:05] <annadane> oh, okay. i didn't see your question
• 1502[11:51:09] *** Parts: deicide- (~deicide-@replaced-ip) ("Leaving")
• 1503[11:51:11] <annadane> thought you were mad at msg dpkg not working
• 1504[11:51:18] <petn-randall> deicide-: That's not true, we were debugging the issue yesterday.
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• 1506[11:51:31] <annadane> what's the question? i may be able to help, though if other people can't figure it out i'm unlikely to know
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• 1509[11:52:37] <annadane> oh well
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• 1520[11:55:13] * petn-randall shrugs.
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• 1546[12:10:02] <eyJhb> Hey, I'm currently doing a official install with Debian (no custom stuff), but I keep getting "mirror does not support the specified version (stretch)" when using the official mirrors; ftp.dk.debian.org
• 1547[12:10:04] <eyJhb> Any ideas?
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• 1550[12:12:02] <petn-randall> eyJhb: That mirror ships with stretch. Which installer did you pick, and at which step are you getting the error?
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• 1552[12:12:55] <eyJhb> petn-randall, I think it's something with the network. The weird thing is, that it passed the networking step etc..
• 1553[12:13:13] <eyJhb> Using ip addr show, does not however, reveal the settings I manually set for it
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• 1559[12:18:23] <petn-randall> eyJhb: ... and this is with which installer?
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• 1570[12:22:29] <eyJhb> petn-randall, non-graphical installer :) "debian-9.4.0-amd64-netinst.iso"
• 1571[12:22:54] <eyJhb> petn-randall, how can I restart the networking service after manually editing /etc/network/interfaces from another prompt, doing installation?
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• 1576[12:24:14] <petn-randall> eyJhb: 'ifdown <interface>' and then 'ifup <interface>'
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• 1578[12:24:44] <eyJhb> petn-randall, not a command in the installer shell :/
• 1579[12:24:54] <eyJhb> I've got ip
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• 1598[12:45:12] <eyJhb> So anybody, how would I edit /etc/network/interfaces, and then reload the settings?
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• 1601[12:49:52] <Fox> eyJhb: did you try with /sbin/ifdown and /sbin/ifup ?
• 1602[12:50:36] <eyJhb> Fox, yeah :) /sbin is in $PATH, no dice
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• 1605[12:53:27] <petn-randall> eyJhb: Then it doesn't work. Just repeat the step in the installer.
• 1606[12:54:01] <eyJhb> petn-randall, and then it overwrites what I have added, and... I'm at the place I were before
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• 1611[12:58:31] <petn-randall> eyJhb: Why can't you just set it up correctly in the installer step?
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• 1616[13:00:32] <tya99> hi, can i use debian-live-9.4.0-amd64-gnome.iso to install debian?
• 1617[13:00:53] <eyJhb> petn-randall, trying, but does not work. Therefore, I have to manually do some fuckery magic... :/
• 1618[13:01:02] <abrotman> tya99: yes, though, the netinst is probably better
• 1619[13:01:04] <petn-randall> tya99: It should be possible, however we recommend using the network installer.
• 1620[13:01:15] <petn-randall> eyJhb: What "doesn't work"?
• 1621[13:01:19] <tya99> right, but if i have network in that i can do it?
• 1622[13:01:25] <tya99> with updated packages
• 1623[13:01:26] <petn-randall> eyJhb: Try with describing the actual problem.
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• 1626[13:01:55] <tya99> iirc netinst has no DE?
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• 1628[13:02:07] <abrotman> tya99: it can, you just have to get it from the internet sources
• 1629[13:02:13] <tya99> it would just save me having two usb sticks :)
• 1630[13:02:27] <tya99> abrotman: ah that's cool then i can just change sources.list and it's good
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• 1632[13:02:49] <petn-randall> tya99: You don't need to change any sources.list.
• 1633[13:03:02] <petn-randall> tya99: The is one stable repository, containing all 55,000 packages.
• 1634[13:03:08] <tya99> i guess the reason i asked is sometimes i want to install debian sometimes i just want to boot a live environment for some reason and had hoped to just have one debian usb stick
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• 1636[13:03:22] <tya99> like ubuntu does with their media
• 1637[13:03:55] <abrotman> tya99: if your internet works at install time, you'll have all the repos setup. If you think you'll need firmware for wifi, use the firmware-laden netinst (/msg dpkg firmware installer)
• 1638[13:04:09] <abrotman> eh, wait :)
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• 1640[13:04:24] <abrotman> tya99: /msg dpkg firmrware images
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• 1642[13:04:31] <abrotman> not installer (though, it probably links to the other)
• 1643[13:04:46] <eyJhb> petn-randall, everything network related. I can't ping or anything :) Currently I do not even get a timeout or anything, it just hangs on ping
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• 1649[13:06:19] <tya99> oh one other question is can you boot a live environment from the BD media?
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• 1651[13:07:18] <abrotman> blu-ray?
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• 1653[13:07:58] <tya99> well i assume that's what debian-9.4.0-amd64-BD-1 is
• 1654[13:08:15] <abrotman> tya99: that's not a netinst .. and they have a "rescue" mode, but I don't think that's what you're asking about
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• 1656[13:08:23] <abrotman> Really, the Live images aren't meant for installing
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• 1658[13:08:30] <tya99> there were three right
• 1659[13:08:33] <tya99> ah okay
• 1660[13:08:36] <abrotman> Right, that's blu-ray
• 1661[13:08:50] <abrotman> the netinst (with firmware) is typically the best way to install Debian
• 1662[13:08:58] <tya99> yeah
• 1663[13:09:00] <abrotman> unless you need offline installation for whatever reason
• 1664[13:09:10] <annadane> still, nice to have a live image around in case something does break catastrophically and you're unable to boot in or whatever
• 1665[13:09:18] <annadane> (generally not the case with stable but y'know...)
• 1666[13:09:19] <abrotman> or the destination system is saddled with slow internet while you have fast internet to download ISOs
• 1667[13:09:25] <tya99> yeah which is why i might make a debian live usb stick :)
• 1668[13:09:28] <tya99> for that purpose
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• 1671[13:09:31] <abrotman> annadane: the installers have a rescue mode, no need for the liveCD
• 1672[13:09:46] <annadane> oh so it is preferred to use the rescue mode? yeah fair enough
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• 1674[13:10:13] <abrotman> I'm saying that it's possible .. I can't speak to your preference.
• 1675[13:10:17] <tya99> sometimes i use it to backup other machines ie copying my root out of the lvm
• 1676[13:10:34] <tya99> so i guess i could use netinst for that but its nice to be able to use a web browser too
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• 1682[13:13:47] <tya99> oh actually i did notice there was an xfce disk in netinst
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• 1689[13:14:49] <abrotman> tya99: sure, but again, the 250MB netinst is usually preferred
• 1690[13:15:00] <tya99> ie current/amd64/iso-cd/debian-9.4.0-amd64-xfce-CD-1.iso
• 1691[13:16:35] *** Quits: xSmurf (~MrSmurf@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
• 1692[13:17:47] <annadane> that's not the netinst
• 1693[13:17:54] <annadane> oh
• 1694[13:17:58] <annadane> sorry, not reading
• 1695[13:18:14] * annadane crawls into a hole and dies
• 1696[13:18:20] <tya99> the weird thing is it's in the directory with the netinst replaced-url
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• 1699[13:18:50] <tya99> and i could have sworn previously they had a gnome and kde variant
• 1700[13:19:00] *** Quits: wutneim_2 (~builder@replaced-ip) (Quit: leaving)
• 1701[13:19:06] <tya99> around the time of debian 7
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• 1724[13:33:09] <deicide-> sudo tlp setcharge 70 80 BAT0 -> Error: ThinkPad extended battery functions not available.
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• 1738[13:38:12] <Fox> deicide-: what does "sudo tlp stat" say ?
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• 1742[13:40:26] <beepnboop-> it lists alot of things
• 1743[13:40:34] <beepnboop-> Fox,
• 1744[13:40:41] *** Joins: zub (~zub@replaced-ip)
• 1745[13:41:00] <Fox> beepnboop-: copy/paste here replaced-url
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• 1748[13:42:24] <beepnboop-> replaced-url
• 1749[13:42:46] *** Joins: foka (~foka@replaced-ip)
• 1750[13:43:21] <Fox> beepnboop-: did you read the end of the stats ?
• 1751[13:43:36] *** Joins: ehlodex_ (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 1752[13:43:38] <Fox> did you install/load tp-smapi ?
• 1753[13:43:39] <beepnboop-> yes, its already installed
• 1754[13:43:40] *** Quits: ehlodex (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 1755[13:43:47] <beepnboop-> how do i load?
• 1756[13:44:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1621
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• 1760[13:45:30] <beepnboop-> sudo tp-smapi start sudo: tp-smapi: command not found
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• 1765[13:48:40] <beepnboop-> replaced-url
• 1766[13:49:00] <beepnboop-> i did everything under "ThinkPads require an additional:"
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• 1768[13:49:08] <beepnboop-> Fox,
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• 1772[13:51:49] <rant> you probably could've just told people which hardware you had and what you were trying to do like I asked over a day ago, and had this solved by now
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• 1774[13:52:29] <Fox> beepnboop-: sudo modprobe tp_smapi
• 1775[13:53:10] *** Quits: micw (~micw@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 1776[13:53:51] <beepnboop-> sudo modprobe tp_smapi
• 1777[13:53:51] <beepnboop-> modprobe: FATAL: Module tp_smapi not found in directory /lib/modules/4.9.0-6-amd64
• 1778[13:54:13] <Fox> beepnboop-: could you answer rant please ?
• 1779[13:54:27] <beepnboop-> thinkpad t470
• 1780[13:54:30] <rant> yeah I said the module wasn't there like 48hrs ago or w/e
• 1781[13:54:36] <Project86__> I'm looking for a backup tool, or repo that can back up entire systems (all settings and permissions and configurations in tact), that also has ability to compress to iso. I've seen many different methods, and was wondering what y'alls choice advice would be
• 1782[13:54:39] <beepnboop-> i didn't see it i was on google
• 1783[13:54:42] <Fox> hell...
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• 1786[13:55:12] <beepnboop-> but its installed so how th fuck it isn't there
• 1787[13:55:36] <annadane> Project86__ i want to say rsync can do that
• 1788[13:56:14] <Project86__> annadane: I've heard that name a few times, let me look into quick
• 1789[13:57:09] <beepnboop-> what should i do? i don't even know what to ask google
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• 1791[13:57:47] <bumbar_> i'm trying to change (as root) net mask for ipv6 address of running interface, but am getting permission denied, with command: ip addr change <ipv6>/<mask> dev <name>
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• 1796[13:59:19] <annadane> replaced-url
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• 1798[14:01:03] <beepnboop-> i'm looking now in synaptic package manager and tp-smapi is installed rant Fox
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• 1802[14:03:03] <petn-randall> eyJhb: Is this with DHCP? Or are you setting it manually? If so, what do you have to manually fix to make it work?
• 1803[14:03:40] <rant> does debian virtualbox have crippled USB? its not showing any usb devices
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• 1805[14:03:54] <eyJhb> petn-randall, I've created a install without ethernet and configured the options i "want", or think is needed. After a restart, it still does not work
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• 1807[14:04:16] <nindustries> Hi, ideas? I'm root. error: fusermount: mount failed: Operation not permitted
• 1808[14:04:18] <eyJhb> I have no clue why, but it might have something to do with the netmask, and network, since I'm not entirely sure how it works
• 1809[14:04:34] <annadane> rant, usb devices on the host?
• 1810[14:04:38] <klys> nindustries, boot windows once, reboot normally.
• 1811[14:05:05] <nindustries> ?
• 1812[14:05:14] <klys> are you trying to mount ntfs?
• 1813[14:05:36] <nindustries> klys: no, plexdrive (a custom fuse implementation)
• 1814[14:05:43] * rant recalls something about OSE and USB
• 1815[14:05:50] <nindustries> doesn't even work with suid
• 1816[14:06:00] <beepnboop-> why am i being ignored again
• 1817[14:06:26] <klys> nindustries, there's likely an internal problem.
• 1818[14:06:37] <annadane> you're not being ignored consciously, rant addressed you before, we can answer other people's questions in the meantime
• 1819[14:06:52] <annadane> i'd answer you if i knew how to answer your question
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• 1822[14:07:04] <disconnecht> rant: has to do w/ the extension pack iirc, you did install that did you?
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• 1825[14:07:41] <annadane> i know you need spice or something to transfer data between host and guest
• 1826[14:07:49] <nindustries> klys: just before it mounts, it returns that error
• 1827[14:07:50] <annadane> usb device detection though, no clue
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• 1831[14:08:20] <Fox> beepnboop-: do you see the module here /lib/modules/4.9.0-6-amd64/updates/dkms/ ?
• 1832[14:08:23] <dreamer> hi all, anyone an idea why my htop looks different for user VS su ? replaced-url
• 1833[14:08:31] <dreamer> colours, but also the thread-layout
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• 1835[14:08:52] <annadane> scroll scroll scroll scroll
• 1836[14:08:53] <babilen> rant: virtualbox-ext-pack
• 1837[14:09:04] <klys> nindustries, are you saying it mounts with any degree of success?
• 1838[14:09:10] <babilen> rant: fwiw, virt-manager/virsh and qemu/kvm are nicer/faster/...
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• 1841[14:10:09] <nindustries> klys: i'm saying ptrace doesn't see anything except that error
• 1842[14:10:17] <nindustries> 2018/07/05 12:07:30 mount helper error: fusermount: mount failed: Operation not permitte
• 1843[14:10:22] <nindustries> [PLEXDRIVE] [2018-07-05 12:07] DEBUG : fusermount: exit status 1
• 1844[14:10:22] <beepnboop-> i don't have updates folder there
• 1845[14:10:33] <nindustries> well, strace that is
• 1846[14:11:00] <beepnboop-> this is the only folder /lib/modules/4.9.0-6-amd64/kernel/
• 1847[14:11:02] <klys> nindustries, and I'm saying the problem is likely more internal than what you can see. are you sure you have a valid filesystem?
• 1848[14:11:11] <FinalX> nindustries: with an error like that you probably want user_allow_other in /etc/fuse.conf
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• 1850[14:11:24] <FinalX> by default it's commented out
• 1851[14:11:30] *** Quits: sekizo (~schizo@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 1852[14:11:31] <beepnboop-> i found it here /lib/modules/4.9.0-5-amd64/updates/dkms/ Fox
• 1853[14:11:33] <nindustries> hmm, good idea
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• 1857[14:12:05] <annadane> dreamer, idk maybe some processes are hidden to normal user
• 1858[14:12:10] <nindustries> nope
• 1859[14:12:12] <annadane> most plausible explanation
• 1860[14:12:36] <dreamer> annadane: sure, but I'm particularly wondering about the thread layout. in 2 columns for su. but not for user
• 1861[14:12:48] <klys> nindustries, are you getting that error as root?
• 1862[14:12:52] <nindustries> yes
• 1863[14:12:56] <FinalX> well, htop is configurable, incl. layout and the config is saved in your .config dir iirc
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• 1865[14:13:38] <Fox> beepnboop-: dpkg -l tp-smapi-dkms
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• 1867[14:14:48] <klys> nindustries, I saw a reference to allow_root at replaced-url
• 1868[14:15:13] <petn-randall> rant: USB passthrough is a non-free extension, IIRC.
• 1869[14:15:23] *** Quits: argusbr (~down@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 1870[14:15:58] <nindustries> unknown parameter in /etc/fuse.conf at line 1: 'allow_root'
• 1871[14:16:05] <nindustries> user_allow_root doesn't work either, hm
• 1872[14:16:41] <FinalX> nindustries: for me, starting it as root but making plexdrive mount it as a different non-root user ("data" in my case) works just fine
• 1873[14:16:51] <klys> nindustries, can you specify it on the commandline with -o mount_root,allow_suid ?
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• 1875[14:17:06] <klys> s/mount_root/allow_root/
• 1876[14:17:19] <annadane> it's so active in here now but i guarantee no one will be talking at all in about 12 hours
• 1877[14:17:27] <annadane> totally dead at that time :P
• 1878[14:17:38] <nindustries> /plexdrive mount --verbosity=4 --config=/config --cache-file=/cache -o allow_root,allow_suid /data -> nope
• 1879[14:17:51] <nindustries> i'm stumped
• 1880[14:18:47] <FinalX> hum paths in the root? are you trying to do this in docker?
• 1881[14:18:56] <nindustries> Yes
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• 1884[14:19:14] <nindustries> I did add --cap-add SYS_ADMIN
• 1885[14:19:21] <nindustries> and --device /dev/fuse --cap-add=SYS_PTRACE --security-opt seccomp=unconfined
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• 1887[14:20:46] <FinalX> I haven't tried getting it to work in Docker, because it also defeats the point of Docker (run 1 single application in 1 container), and you can't really bind-mount fuse-mounts into other things (host => container, or even within the same container, let alone other containers) without running into issues
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• 1891[14:22:11] <FinalX> nindustries: but perhaps it will work if you start the docker container in privileged mode with --privileged=true
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• 1893[14:22:35] <FinalX> because by default, docker containers are *not* run privileged, and that might cause your issue with /dev/fuse not being usable
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• 1898[14:23:00] <nindustries> I'm looking through replaced-url
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• 1900[14:23:38] <FinalX> that's just the image, not the way of starting the image
• 1901[14:23:46] <FinalX> ee replaced-url
• 1902[14:23:50] <FinalX> see*
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• 1908[14:26:53] <nindustries> I am already passing /dev/fuse
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• 1911[14:27:28] <FinalX> yes, but I'm quite sure you're not _starting_ the container in privileged mode, in order to actually have proper access _to_ /dev/fuse
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• 1913[14:27:41] <FinalX> because normally, uid 0 / root in the docker container is _not_ uid 0 / root on the host
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• 1915[14:28:02] <FinalX> so in that case, perhaps even fixing /etc/fuse.conf on the host might help, instead of in the container
• 1916[14:28:15] <FinalX> but, I'd try starting the container in privileged mode first to see if that works.
• 1917[14:28:45] <nindustries> I am using namespace remapping, but that use is added to fuse group
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• 1919[14:30:21] <FinalX> well, it's not a debian issue and what you're currently doing is clearly not working the way you're expecting it to, hence me suggesting to try and see if giving the container full privileges (just to test for now), will actually make it work. because then you're lacking one privilege or another in either way.
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• 1922[14:32:40] <nindustries> I'm trying right now with namespaces off
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• 1925[14:33:47] <nindustries> heh!
• 1926[14:33:54] <nindustries> It works with privileged: true
• 1927[14:33:56] <nindustries> hm
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• 1945[14:47:17] <beepnboop-> Fox, still here?
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• 1952[14:50:06] <deicide-> ok i have different question now, how do i install this? replaced-url
• 1953[14:50:41] <aias> do you have perl (perl command)?
• 1954[14:50:54] *** Quits: Shifted_Synth (~LacksAgen@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1955[14:51:18] <Beggar> hi again. By now I have tried to install fonts, poke with console-setup and locales. But, nothing changes on the console screen, the devanagari is not shown and even symbols like A macron (ā) are shown as question marks.
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• 1960[14:52:17] <Beggar> if anyone have any idea of how to make bash show special characters in console, I would be happy to hear about.
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• 1966[14:55:02] <rant> as I said last night I dont think the linux console can show devanagari you may need something like bogl-bterm
• 1967[14:56:00] <aias> oh it must be able to, linux can do anything!
• 1968[14:56:05] <aias> what terminal are you using?
• 1969[14:56:09] <Beggar> rant "ā" is not devanagari AFAIK, this symbol is not supported also ?
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• 1972[14:56:50] <Beggar> well, the console says it is bash, I am almost sure it is bash and not dash.
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• 1976[14:58:19] <darxmurf> back
• 1977[14:58:29] *** Joins: j3kyl_ (~user@replaced-ip)
• 1978[14:58:35] <Beggar> forward
• 1979[14:58:37] <darxmurf> I just upgraded and dist-upgaded my testing machine and it killed my X :-/
• 1980[14:58:44] *** Joins: s8548a (~s8548a@replaced-ip)
• 1981[14:58:52] <darxmurf> it looks like nvidia is crashing
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• 1985[14:59:12] <darxmurf> I tried to reinstall the full package from the repo and the driver from nvidia website and same issue
• 1986[14:59:12] <aias> echo $TERM
• 1987[14:59:35] <darxmurf> with "nouveau" driver it's fine but the refresh rate is horrible
• 1988[14:59:44] <darxmurf> any suggestion ?
• 1989[14:59:45] <aias> bash is the shell
• 1990[14:59:58] <Beggar> darxmurf, if you were using the nvidia driver from their website and not noveau then you will need to uninstall the nvidia driver and reinstall it (it compile modules for the kernel in the install process).
• 1991[15:00:10] <petn-randall> !tell darxmurf -about debian-next
• 1992[15:00:20] <Beggar> it will work if your video card is still supported by nvdia driver.
• 1993[15:00:49] *** Joins: rounnus (~rounnus@replaced-ip)
• 1994[15:01:05] <annadane> before you go to #debian-next on irc.oftc.net i know there was a bug where the kernel would totally break people's nvidia systems
• 1995[15:01:11] <annadane> idk if that also got transferred to testing
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• 1999[15:01:49] <darxmurf> Beggar: I know
• 2000[15:02:07] *** Joins: freddy (~freddy_fc@replaced-ip)
• 2001[15:02:09] <darxmurf> I'll try to downgrade the kernel
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• 2003[15:02:25] <petn-randall> non-free drivers are most of the time broken on testing/sid.
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• 2005[15:02:38] <darxmurf> it was pretty ok until today :D
• 2006[15:02:50] <petn-randall> pure luck I assume :)
• 2007[15:02:51] <Peyam> how do I update my debian?
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• 2009[15:03:08] <Beggar> I hate those companies for that. they should simply make an completely opensource driver and not one that will expires in a year or 2
• 2010[15:03:29] <annadane> Peyam, apt update && apt upgrade, if you have no held back packages
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• 2012[15:03:52] *** Quits: beepnboop- (~beepnboop@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2013[15:04:01] <Peyam> why not sudo?
• 2014[15:04:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1628
• 2015[15:04:08] <annadane> sudo or su is implied
• 2016[15:04:14] <annadane> sudo apt update && apt upgrade
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• 2021[15:05:04] <petn-randall> annadane: sudo does not carry over, if you need sudo, it would be "sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade"
• 2022[15:05:10] <annadane> oh. whoops.
• 2023[15:05:20] <annadane> i never use it, which i think is pretty clear
• 2024[15:05:27] *** Quits: rounnus (~rounnus@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 2025[15:05:43] <opv> hey guys, i'm not sure why this doesn't work. i need to generate new ssh keys for my root users, so i'm trying to delete the existing keys with "sudo rm -f /root/.ssh/id_rsa*", but somehow the keys remain there. can anyone point me to what my mistake is? machines are a mix of jessie and stretch
• 2026[15:05:55] *** Quits: Plasmoduck (~chris@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 2027[15:06:27] <rant> why would you even have ssh as root configured?
• 2028[15:06:33] *** Joins: raidsec (~admin@replaced-ip)
• 2029[15:06:38] <rant> login as a user and become root like a sane person
• 2030[15:06:41] <opv> etckeeper
• 2031[15:06:51] <rant> ugh
• 2032[15:06:53] <opv> root pushes stuff
• 2033[15:06:56] <petn-randall> opv: What error do you get?
• 2034[15:07:04] <opv> petn-randall: none.
• 2035[15:07:05] *** Quits: cadillac_ (~omab@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 2036[15:07:18] <petn-randall> opv: What is the output of 'ls -al /root/.ssh'?
• 2037[15:07:18] <opv> it's as if i'd never issued that command
• 2038[15:07:27] *** Joins: Mercury55 (~naaaImgoo@replaced-ip)
• 2039[15:07:36] <petn-randall> --> replaced-url
• 2040[15:07:45] <opv> id_rsa with 600, id_rsa.pub and known_hosts with 644
• 2041[15:07:46] *** Joins: err404 (~err404@replaced-ip)
• 2042[15:07:48] <darxmurf> see you
• 2043[15:07:52] *** Quits: darxmurf (~darxmurf@replaced-ip) (Quit: reboot)
• 2044[15:07:57] <opv> ownership root:root
• 2045[15:07:59] <petn-randall> opv: Paste it verbatim to the paste site above, please.
• 2046[15:08:30] <opv> petn-randall: replaced-url
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• 2050[15:09:38] <petn-randall> opv: What happens if you run 'rm -fv /root/.ssh/id_rsa*', followed by "echo $?"? Also paste that.
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• 2056[15:10:35] <opv> petn-randall: replaced-url
• 2057[15:11:09] <rtp2342> lsattr /root/.ssh
• 2058[15:11:18] *** Joins: tikun (~David@replaced-ip)
• 2059[15:11:43] <opv> rtp2342: nothing special. replaced-url
• 2060[15:11:47] *** Joins: morphis (~morphis@replaced-ip)
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• 2062[15:12:04] *** Joins: cadillac_ (~omab@replaced-ip)
• 2063[15:12:19] <rtp2342> hmm, what is the "e" flag?
• 2064[15:12:42] <opv> according to chattr, "extend format"
• 2065[15:13:09] <opv> "the 'e' attribute indicates that the file is using extents for mapping the blocks on disk. It may not be removed using chattr(1)."
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• 2068[15:13:55] <rtp2342> opv: my idea was that maybe the "i" flag (immutable) was set. but it isn't.
• 2069[15:13:56] <petn-randall> opv: Does "rm /root/.ssh/id<tab> tab complete? What is the output of 'alias rm'?
• 2070[15:13:57] *** Quits: himuraken_ (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 2071[15:14:05] * petn-randall has a hunch that rm was replaced.
• 2072[15:14:07] <opv> rtp2342: yeah, i thought about that too, but no...
• 2073[15:14:22] *** Quits: sikun (~David@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 2074[15:14:26] <rtp2342> maybe use "busybox rm" instead
• 2075[15:14:30] <opv> petn-randall: it tab completes as root, but not as an other user, which is normal
• 2076[15:14:33] *** Quits: sigsts (~sigsts@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2077[15:14:39] <opv> petn-randall: rm is aliased to "rm -i"
• 2078[15:14:50] *** Quits: ehlodex (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 2079[15:15:00] *** Joins: ehlodex_ (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 2080[15:15:41] <petn-randall> opv: Try running 'sudo /bin/rm /root/.ssh/id_*'
• 2081[15:15:45] <rtp2342> sudo busybox rm /root/.ssh/id_rsa*
• 2082[15:15:57] <opv> no such file or directory. wtf
• 2083[15:16:11] <petn-randall> opv: Running what exactly?
• 2084[15:16:17] *** Joins: beepnboop- (~beepnboop@replaced-ip)
• 2085[15:16:34] <opv> sudo /bin/rm /root/.ssh/id_*
• 2086[15:16:43] <opv> i've also unaliased rm
• 2087[15:16:47] <rtp2342> which rm
• 2088[15:16:48] <elios> sudo su; rm ... ?
• 2089[15:16:48] *** Joins: darxmurf (~darxmurf@replaced-ip)
• 2090[15:16:55] <opv> but a sudo ls /root/.ssh/id_rsa also says no such file or directory
• 2091[15:17:07] <opv> i can remove the files as root just fine
• 2092[15:17:08] <darxmurf> ha !
• 2093[15:17:09] <elios> because you're not root
• 2094[15:17:10] <darxmurf> kernel issue
• 2095[15:17:23] <opv> elios: and what's the sudo supposed to do?
• 2096[15:17:27] <darxmurf> damn, it's fine with 4.16.0-1
• 2097[15:17:35] <darxmurf> and not with 4.16.0-2 Oo
• 2098[15:17:37] <opv> kernel is 4.9.0.6 right now
• 2099[15:17:38] <elios> give you super user privileges
• 2100[15:17:55] <elios> user has nothing to do in /root/
• 2101[15:18:07] *** Quits: hgfd123 (~hgfd123@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 2102[15:18:13] <darxmurf> opv: my kernel is bigger than yours
• 2103[15:18:22] <opv> funny how i can do anything else in /root/ by using sudo. i can sudo ssh-keygen and it'll ask me if i want to replace the existing files
• 2104[15:18:50] <elios> oh, then why use sudo if you're already root?
• 2105[15:18:58] *** Joins: cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip)
• 2106[15:19:00] <opv> i'm not already root
• 2107[15:19:33] <elios> what now?
• 2108[15:19:40] <opv> that's the question.
• 2109[15:19:47] <opv> can't script sudo -i that easily, can i
• 2110[15:19:53] <opv> just to remove some goddamn files
• 2111[15:19:54] <elios> root or not root, that is the question.
• 2112[15:20:19] *** Quits: dreamon__ (~dreamon@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
• 2113[15:20:44] <Beggar> rotten root
• 2114[15:20:54] <opv> i can sudo touch in /root/.ssh
• 2115[15:20:58] <rtp2342> opv: sudo /bin/bash && cd /root/.ssh && rm id_rsa* && exit
• 2116[15:21:04] <elios> ok
• 2117[15:21:11] *** Quits: m0j0dj0dj0 (~punk3r@replaced-ip) (Quit: go drink with my bitches!)
• 2118[15:21:38] <opv> rtp2342: uh, that doesn't work. the cd /root/.ssh/ is only being executed _after_ the sudo /bin/bash finishes
• 2119[15:21:41] <annadane> if this still doesn't work, we'll have to ask god
• 2120[15:21:44] <annadane> welp.
• 2121[15:22:21] <rtp2342> opv: sorry, i meant the commands starting with "cd" to be run inside the root bash
• 2122[15:22:37] <rtp2342> opv: (interactive)
• 2123[15:22:39] <opv> can't script that
• 2124[15:22:41] *** Quits: BWMerlin (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 2125[15:22:42] *** Quits: aias (~aias___@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2126[15:23:03] <rtp2342> opv: why do need to script that? can't you get an interactive shell?
• 2127[15:23:16] <opv> rtp2342: and do the same steps on 100 machines? no thank you
• 2128[15:23:31] *** Joins: sigsts (~sigsts@replaced-ip)
• 2129[15:24:08] <rtp2342> opv: just for testing on one machine. if that works, we can think about scripting.
• 2130[15:24:23] <opv> yes, if i enter an interactive root shell i can remove the files just fine
• 2131[15:24:30] <opv> be that sudo -i or sudo su or sudo bash
• 2132[15:24:34] <rtp2342> opv: okay
• 2133[15:24:35] *** Quits: platvoeten (~platvoete@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 2134[15:25:09] <opv> so sudo su -c "rm /root/.ssh/id_rsa*" works
• 2135[15:25:14] *** Quits: err404 (~err404@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
• 2136[15:25:21] <opv> but i'm still puzzled as to why it doesn't work the normal way
• 2137[15:25:22] <rtp2342> opv: maybe rm is handled special in your sudo config?
• 2138[15:25:26] <opv> nope
• 2139[15:25:29] <opv> sudo config is standard
• 2140[15:27:36] <elios> i don't even have sudo
• 2141[15:28:03] <rtp2342> me neither
• 2142[15:28:18] <rtp2342> i use plain old su with root password set
• 2143[15:28:58] *** Quits: HarveyPwca (~HarveyPwc@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2144[15:29:35] <FinalX> on our servers, direct root ssh is disabled, but you can log in through serial/ipmi console with a password. users can only log in with ssh key pairs, and to become root you have to use sudo with two-factor auth.
• 2145[15:29:49] *** Joins: maxzor (~maxzor@replaced-ip)
• 2146[15:29:49] <FinalX> user accounts have no password either.
• 2147[15:31:48] <FinalX> and sudo is common now that people just copy/paste commands with sudo in front of them from any random website, so it's not adding much security anymore anyway :) so.
• 2148[15:31:51] <opv> direct root ssh also disabled here, users have no passwords, keys are enforced
• 2149[15:32:31] <annadane> (not to mention that some websites will actually hide invisible text in the copy buffer so when you blindly copy+paste text, even if the command is correct ...
• 2150[15:32:44] <FinalX> yeah but then you can't use sudo with the user's own password and you're forced to use su, where everyone needs to know the root password
• 2151[15:32:51] <FinalX> here only the seniors know the actual root password
• 2152[15:32:59] <FinalX> and su isn't used :)
• 2153[15:33:01] <elios> nice
• 2154[15:34:15] *** Joins: dreamon__ (~dreamon@replaced-ip)
• 2155[15:34:16] *** Quits: danielgc (~danielgc@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
• 2156[15:35:12] <annadane> replaced-url
• 2157[15:36:31] <FinalX> annadane: yeah, I've seen that around as well, I'm trying to teach people to copy/paste it into an editor like vim/nano/notepad before actually copy/pasting something from the internet straight into their terminals
• 2158[15:36:40] <FinalX> but it only takes one.
• 2159[15:37:14] <FinalX> our sudo doesn't allow a session to remain, if you use sudo, it's only for that command. so if you need to do a lot as root, you'll have to sudo every time (or just sudo -s, do your thing and then exit)
• 2160[15:37:25] <annadane> i've only been able to avoid it via "tutorials on the internet are outdated"
• 2161[15:37:31] <FinalX> I find persisting sudo sessions extremely dangerous
• 2162[15:37:32] <elios> so you can't ls /root anymore but sudo su touch /root/down works.
• 2163[15:37:35] *** Quits: ehlodex_ (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
• 2164[15:37:43] *** Quits: lpouzenc (~lpouzenc@replaced-ip) (Quit: lpouzenc)
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• 2166[15:37:57] *** Joins: diniwed (~gavron@replaced-ip)
• 2167[15:37:59] <elios> how is this handled?
• 2168[15:38:38] <FinalX> how do you mean? plus sudo su is the most redundant thing ever
• 2169[15:39:25] <elios> well i can only write here in this example in /root/ after i logged in as root.
• 2170[15:40:26] <FinalX> ...sudo makes you root, so su is redundant
• 2171[15:40:27] *** Joins: err404 (~err404@replaced-ip)
• 2172[15:40:35] *** Joins: FySkammeDeg (~FySkammeD@replaced-ip)
• 2173[15:40:40] <elios> alright, reading the man page.
• 2174[15:40:53] <annadane> just say the word, su su ssudio
• 2175[15:41:13] <FinalX> (and both have the ability to perform commands as non-root)
• 2176[15:41:36] *** Quits: nindustries (~nindustri@replaced-ip) (Quit: used escape rope!)
• 2177[15:41:38] <FinalX> with sudo you can limit the commands that a user or group can do as root (or other users).
• 2178[15:42:20] <FinalX> we use it so that our application admins can view local log files and configuration, for example, but not do much else.
• 2179[15:42:25] <elios> oh, this works with su -c too. i didn't know that.
• 2180[15:42:49] <FinalX> yeah but sudo can use the password of the mortal user, su the password of root
• 2181[15:43:20] <elios> right.
• 2182[15:43:43] <FinalX> plus sudo allows you to limit what you allow to be done as root by that user/group of people
• 2183[15:43:52] <FinalX> ..or as other users
• 2184[15:44:05] <FinalX> su is just that, escalate to superuser (root0
• 2185[15:44:44] <FinalX> you can make it drop privileges again to another user, but you can't limit what a user can do with su.
• 2186[15:44:54] <elios> yes, but if you forget to log out i can use sudo too.
• 2187[15:44:59] <jelly> !sing sussudio
• 2188[15:44:59] * dpkg sings "Su, su, sudio...Su, su, sussudio"
• 2189[15:45:07] <FinalX> jelly :)
• 2190[15:45:27] *** Quits: AarKnos (~aarknos@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2191[15:45:32] <FinalX> elios: howso?
• 2192[15:46:02] <elios> er, with sudo su.
• 2193[15:46:22] <FinalX> sudo -s gives you a shell... really.. you should forget about sudo su :)
• 2194[15:46:26] <elios> if you entered the password once you just use it over again.
• 2195[15:46:37] <elios> that's what's sudo about no?
• 2196[15:46:40] <FinalX> not if you disable that, no
• 2197[15:46:45] <elios> for laziness
• 2198[15:46:52] <FinalX> we have it disabled, and it should be disabled imo
• 2199[15:47:00] <FinalX> it is indeed very dangerous.
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• 2201[15:47:13] <jelly> it's a matter of policy really
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• 2203[15:47:28] <imscaredman> How bad of an idea is it to run this:
• 2204[15:47:39] <annadane> every moment i'm using root my immediate thought is to exit it immediately
• 2205[15:47:40] <jelly> very old versions of sudo did not have "sudo -i" or "sudo -s"
• 2206[15:47:42] <imscaredman> apt-get purge $(dpkg-query -Wf '${Package;-40}${Essential}${Priority}\n'|awk '$2 ~ /nooptional|noextra/ {print $1}'|grep -v -E 'anacron|busybox|initramfs-tools|insserv|klibc-utils|libklibc|libsemanage-common|libsemanage1|libustr-1.0-1|libuuid-perl|linux-base|linux-image')
• 2207[15:47:54] <annadane> likely bad, what are you trying to do and why
• 2208[15:48:07] <imscaredman> A bare minimum debian setup
• 2209[15:48:17] <annadane> ok but do it in a vm
• 2210[15:48:22] <imscaredman> why
• 2211[15:48:32] <annadane> so you don't trash your system probably
• 2212[15:48:39] <imscaredman> I'm doing it on a dedi
• 2213[15:48:45] <imscaredman> So re-imaging is quick
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• 2215[15:48:48] <FinalX> if you want the bare minimum, why not just debootstrap into a dir?
• 2216[15:48:49] <annadane> then go nuts?
• 2217[15:48:52] <FinalX> ok :P
• 2218[15:49:15] <imscaredman> I love debian's rock solid stability but I want FreeBSD's minimalism
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• 2223[15:49:28] <elios> i think in jaunty it wasn't disabled.
• 2224[15:49:33] <annadane> debian... is already minimal
• 2225[15:49:39] <annadane> but whatever
• 2226[15:49:48] <imscaredman> I'm talking minimal like alpine
• 2227[15:50:16] <elios> don't know about later versions tho.
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• 2230[15:51:08] <deicide-> can i make dkms reconfigure the whole system? instead of doing it one by one?
• 2231[15:51:34] <deicide-> since everything on my laptop is installed on older kernel version
• 2232[15:51:38] <jelly> imscaredman: why not use debootstrap options to avoid installing things you don't need in the first place
• 2233[15:51:57] <imscaredman> jelly: Automated install provided by OVH
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• 2235[15:52:35] <FinalX> the one I got from Hetzner was already quite minimal as well, doesn't OVH have a minimal image?
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• 2238[15:53:20] <deicide-> reconfigure*
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• 2241[15:53:34] <imscaredman> nope
• 2242[15:53:38] <imscaredman> They also have a interesting selection, like centos with solus guest preconfigured
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• 2256[16:07:56] <linuxconformer> guys could i get a hand?
• 2257[16:09:10] <annadane> linuxconformer, sure
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• 2259[16:11:05] <babilen> dpkg: hand
• 2260[16:11:06] <dpkg> [hand] have a nice day
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• 2262[16:12:13] <linuxconformer> annadane: awesome, so i'm running apache on debian, but i'm having an issue. basically is it possible to redirect all users who are not on my website to a different url?
• 2263[16:12:35] <linuxconformer> e.g. if google crawls my website, can i change the urls that it stores?
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• 2271[16:14:44] <afidegnum> hello, i m using xfce, what is the recommended display manager ?
• 2272[16:14:48] <afidegnum> 4
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• 2274[16:15:20] <darxmurf> ?
• 2275[16:15:25] <darxmurf> I'm using XFCE too
• 2276[16:15:37] <babilen> linuxconformer: Look into matching on user agent and tailor your behaviour. robots.txt might also come in handy
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• 2278[16:16:22] <afidegnum> darxmurf: ah, good
• 2279[16:16:28] <linuxconformer> ok thanks
• 2280[16:16:30] <afidegnum> i m looking for a light and sleek display manager
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• 2282[16:16:53] <heston> the default, lightdm
• 2283[16:16:56] <whynot> *makes frankendebian*
• 2284[16:17:03] <whynot> *bitches debian is shit when it burts into flames*
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• 2289[16:19:18] <Beggar> display manager? Why not use the plain console instead of shinny uselessly dm?
• 2290[16:19:45] <psichas> comfortable
• 2291[16:19:48] <afidegnum> 4
• 2292[16:20:30] <zeratul976> Hi there. I need to install a piece of software on my Debian Stretch system that depends on "libqt4-gui", but this package does not appear to be present in the Stretch repositories. Is there something I can do to work around this / get it from somewhere else?
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• 2305[16:26:47] <heston> zeratul976, looks like it's only available in sid
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• 2309[16:27:50] <zeratul976> I found an application-specific workaround here: replaced-url
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• 2318[16:29:29] <heston> actually my mistake, it's there for wheezy and jessie but it's listed as a transitional package
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• 2323[16:30:42] <rant> zeratul976: you could setup an older chroot with jessie or such, would be a fairly simple and safe work around or you could provide the library and setup an equivs package to satisfy the package manager that it is there
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• 2325[16:31:20] <rant> zeratul976: if its not some big secret, it helps to know what you're looking to install and if you'd be willing to consider alternatives
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• 2327[16:31:42] <zeratul976> It's VidyoDesktop (see link above)
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• 2330[16:32:49] <heston> it's just a dummy package, I wonder if it would be easier to update the dependency list for the package you're trying to install
• 2331[16:33:05] <rant> zeratul976: and you're set on this speciically, can't use any more well maintained alternatives that may be in debian?
• 2332[16:33:36] <zeratul976> rant: I need it to dial into a meeting that someone else has organized, so I don't really have a choice. Anyways, I've already worked around it as described in that link.
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• 2334[16:34:48] <heston> looks like the workout describes editing the dependencies
• 2335[16:34:53] <heston> workaround
• 2336[16:35:07] <rant> same as using the equivs method I suggested
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• 2338[16:35:55] <rant> will only work if the dependency is actually satisfied though regardless if you use equivs, dpkg with a force option, or editing the deps
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• 2358[16:52:28] <tdkx> is there any workable openvpn init script available for debian?
• 2359[16:53:03] <tdkx> the shit which Alberto Gonzalez Iniesta and Robert Leslie cobbled together I guess no one understands what they are doing
• 2360[16:54:11] <FinalX> not sure what version you're speaking of, and I'm not doing openvpn on debian.. but on ubuntu you enable them with systemctl enable openvpn@configname, "just" openvpn is not enough, because you can enable/disable them per configured vpn
• 2361[16:54:18] <FinalX> and that works just greatly.
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• 2363[16:54:24] <tdkx> ubuntu is no problem
• 2364[16:54:35] <tdkx> just debian won't do
• 2365[16:55:06] <tdkx> just put the config file to /etc/openvpn was enough usually (except on debian thanks to that sick init script it seems)
• 2366[16:55:54] <FinalX> systemd is the default in jessie and stretch; wheezy is no longer supported. systemd doesn't use init scripts.
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• 2368[16:56:02] <FinalX> so i'm not sure what you're looking for here.
• 2369[16:56:29] <rant> systemd does use init scripts.. it just converts them to systemd units
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• 2374[16:59:04] <rant> but it can still make use of them
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• 2376[16:59:12] <[E]sc> how can i find out why my system crashed? i was playing urbanterror when it suddenly died on me. and i tried diagnosing the problem, but at first it wouldn't boot up, so i had to pull the ram, try reseating some cards, etc before finally i was able to get back on.
• 2377[16:59:25] <FinalX> rant: it uses unit-files, converted or not, it also manages /etc/fstab.. :) that's besides the point.
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• 2386[17:00:54] <rant> its all beside the point of that the wrong question was asked and none of this is helpful :P
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• 2389[17:04:15] <heston> [E]sc, if your system isnt booting up and you had to play with hardware before it would, it has nothing to do with debian. You need to test your hardware
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• 2391[17:05:25] <[E]sc> heston, thanks. any chance that there would be a log to say which hardware was causing the problem? like if the GPU or CPU was overheating? something like that...
• 2392[17:06:18] <FinalX> rant: coming in here and assuming that whatever was supplied by a debian package and then going "the shit..." wasn't very helpful to begin with, either :P was more of a statement than a question, so i'm not sure anymore whether he does actually want a solution to any problem, or just complain
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• 2396[17:07:11] <heston> [E]sc, im pretty sure those aren't logged by default but I'd suggest starting with memtest86 and smartmontools
• 2397[17:08:19] <heston> you can monitor system temps pretty easily though
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• 2399[17:08:24] <[E]sc> heston, thanks for the advice. i'll have a look at those.
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• 2402[17:09:16] <heston> no problem. May have just been a poor electrical connection that you already fixed
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• 2409[17:10:41] <rant> does sound like ram or psu issues
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• 2435[17:19:42] <Peyam> hp-toolbox wont start
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• 2440[17:22:09] <Peyam> this is the error I get when running hp-toolbox : replaced-url
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• 2442[17:22:59] <mtn> Peyam: which version of debian?
• 2443[17:23:28] <Peyam> mtn Linux debian 4.9.0-6-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.88-1+deb9u1 (2018-05-07) x86_64 GNU/Linux
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• 2445[17:24:19] <mtn> Peyam: that is the kernel, not the version. stretch? buster? etc.
• 2446[17:24:42] <Peyam> mtn, how do I get it?
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• 2448[17:25:10] <mtn> Peyam: lsb_release -a
• 2449[17:25:30] <Peyam> code name Stretch
• 2450[17:26:00] <mtn> Peyam: standard repos or did you add any?
• 2451[17:26:22] <heston> seems you're missing dem models
• 2452[17:26:25] <Peyam> mtn, I downloaded hp driver from their homepage
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• 2454[17:27:06] <Peyam> heston, where do I download those model?
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• 2458[17:29:26] <Peyam> heston, mtn replaced-url
• 2459[17:29:47] <mtn> Peyam: did you try the debian drivers first? they usually work just fine
• 2460[17:30:09] <Peyam> mtn, I tried but some options were disabled
• 2461[17:30:16] <Peyam> and not possible to turn on
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• 2463[17:30:50] <mtn> Peyam: sounds like it works better than the one you downloaded ;)
• 2464[17:31:02] <Peyam> it worked when I just installed it
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• 2473[17:33:41] <heston> so it was working at some point?
• 2474[17:33:46] <Peyam> yes
• 2475[17:33:57] <heston> from what i'm reading you need an updated hplip
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• 2498[17:44:36] <heston> Peyam, there's a less than ideal fix but just changing usb ports and power cycling sometimes works
• 2499[17:45:01] <heston> it's either that or you need to try different versions of hplip
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• 2509[17:49:54] <jelly> ,v hplip
• 2510[17:49:55] <judd> Package: hplip on amd64 -- wheezy: 3.12.6-3.1+deb7u1; wheezy-security: 3.12.6-3.1+deb7u2; jessie: 3.14.6-1+deb8u1; jessie-backports: 3.16.11+repack0-1~bpo8+1; stretch: 3.16.11+repack0-3; buster: 3.17.10+repack0-5; sid: 3.17.10+repack0-5; experimental: 3.18.6+dfsg0-1
• 2511[17:50:16] <jelly> oh dear, not present in stretch at all
• 2512[17:50:34] <jelly> oh, I can't read
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• 2514[17:56:09] <Peyam> heston, I installed it again and it works
• 2515[17:56:16] <Peyam> Im dure if I do a restart it wont work
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• 2520[17:57:34] <heston> Peyam, what exactly did you install again?
• 2521[17:57:46] <Peyam> hplip
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• 2523[17:58:18] <heston> so you just removed it and installed the same version?
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• 2525[17:58:46] <Peyam> it did all the uninstallationa and installation
• 2526[17:59:22] <heston> hmm, where and how did you do that
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• 2529[17:59:55] <Peyam> chmod +x hplip-3.18.6 && ./hplip...
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• 2532[18:00:41] <heston> oh ok then, thanks. well glad it works
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• 2535[18:03:03] <Peyam> same problem again
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• 2540[18:04:49] <heston> it didnt let you print or you rebooted? what happened
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• 2547[18:06:58] <Lope> I've expanded my LVM volume where my mounted root filesystem is. Now I tried resize2fs but it complains that it's in use.
• 2548[18:07:05] <Lope> Can I -f (force) or is that suicide?
• 2549[18:07:16] <Peyam> heston, It hanged for a minute and then terminated
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• 2555[18:10:03] <heston> Peyam, well try the different usb ports/power cycling or use an older version
• 2556[18:10:09] <jelly> Lope: don't.
• 2557[18:10:32] <jelly> Lope: which debian release is this and which filesystem type?
• 2558[18:10:39] *** Parts: Billy2 (~Billy2@replaced-ip) ()
• 2559[18:10:40] <Lope> ext4
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• 2561[18:10:46] <Lope> debian 9?
• 2562[18:10:49] <Peyam> heston, I have done that but yes I will use the old hplip
• 2563[18:10:53] <jelly> you're asking me?
• 2564[18:10:56] <jelly> !debian suite
• 2565[18:10:57] <dpkg> cat /etc/debian_version (or lsb_release -sc). Or check /etc/apt/sources.list. If unsure about the distribution, $ cat /etc/{*version*,*release*,*issue*} should grab almost all distributions.
• 2566[18:11:09] <Lope> not asking you
• 2567[18:11:19] <Lope> asking if it's okay to do an online resize
• 2568[18:11:29] <heston> Peyam, try hplip 3.13.9 if you can
• 2569[18:11:43] <Peyam> heston, yes I will in a sec :)
• 2570[18:11:54] <jelly> Lope: it ought to Just Work with a mounted ext3 or ext4 on anything newer than debian 7, so yes
• 2571[18:12:15] <Lope> jelly, but it does require a -f (force)?
• 2572[18:12:18] <Lope> if it's mounted
• 2573[18:12:25] <jelly> Lope: in fact, resize2fs should just do it, no -f
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• 2577[18:12:46] <jelly> Lope: assuming you're GROWING the filesystem
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• 2580[18:13:00] <jelly> shrinking cannot be done online
• 2581[18:13:21] <Lope> yeah, I am growing it, but I'm not specifying the size. I want it to determine the size from the LV
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• 2584[18:13:46] <Peyam> heston, I try to kill cupsd but it still comes back
• 2585[18:13:50] <jelly> Lope: the very fact it's complaining is weird, so can you pastebin the output of, say, "lsblk" and "df"
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• 2587[18:14:26] <jelly> Lope: it's so automatic now, even lvresize / lvextend has a -r option to call resize2fs automatically
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• 2589[18:15:09] <jelly> Lope: so pastebin the actual resize2fs command and the full output as well
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• 2591[18:15:26] * jelly does it routinely at work
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• 2594[18:16:44] <heston> Peyam, try `systemctl stop cups.socket cups.path cups.service`
• 2595[18:16:47] <jelly> Lope: and perhaps what the filesystem thinks its size is right now. dumpe2fs -h /dev/mapper/your-device | grep Block
• 2596[18:17:20] <Lope> jelly, I added another 1G and included the -r flag. It said online resizing required. then it just did it.
• 2597[18:17:42] <Lope> jelly, oh, it's because it's a luks volume.
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• 2599[18:17:51] <Lope> that's why resize2fs didn't just go ahead/
• 2600[18:18:17] <Lope> so `lvextend -r` did all kinds of magic
• 2601[18:18:35] <leewdch> hello. I installed debian with a i386 cd I had around and I'm working with a minimal install. I managed to install wpa_supplicant and the usb wifi firmware with an external drive
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• 2603[18:18:43] <leewdch> but I can't connect, anybody who can help me?
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• 2605[18:19:20] <leewdch> I set the wpa_supplicant.conf with my ssid and password but it fails to connect
• 2606[18:19:25] <jelly> Lope: "it's a luks volume" might or might not be relevant, depending on actual layering. Where's that output?
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• 2608[18:20:38] <dgp> leewdch: if you run wpa_cli you should be able to look at the events from wpa_supplicant and see what is going on
• 2609[18:20:39] <jelly> yeah -r does stuff.
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• 2613[18:23:32] <jelly> except if you run it on like debian 6, then it might break stuff
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• 2625[18:31:42] <Peyam> heston, Just done the same thing but with the default repo in debian
• 2626[18:31:49] <Peyam> still can't start
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• 2628[18:31:55] <Peyam> the hplip-gui
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• 2630[18:32:49] <Peyam> I can see the Fax adress book and everything. but not the hplip-gui
• 2631[18:33:28] <heston> are you able to find 3.13.9 from the hp website?
• 2632[18:34:03] <Peyam> ahh got in
• 2633[18:34:14] <Peyam> I shouldn't do sudo hplip-gui.
• 2634[18:34:22] <Peyam> I needed to do hp-toolbox
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• 2636[18:34:25] <Peyam> with out sudo
• 2637[18:34:43] <heston> so uh, was that the original problem
• 2638[18:35:00] <Peyam> No I first tried without sudo too
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• 2647[18:37:55] <Lope> jelly, thanks, it's working now
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• 2649[18:38:40] <heston> Peyam, so all good with 3.18.6?
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• 2663[18:45:43] <Lope> do you have to mount LVM volumes in /etc/fstab like "/dev/mapper/vgx-foo ..." or can you do "/dev/vgx/foo ..."
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• 2665[18:45:48] <Peyam> heston, no
• 2666[18:46:13] <jelly> Lope: both should work
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• 2668[18:46:33] <Lope> Thanks
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• 2670[18:47:23] <jelly> /dev/mapper/vg-lv was preferable for just the root filesystem a couple debian releases back, because it made initramfs assume things correctly
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• 2697[19:02:50] <Lope> jelly, "was", have things changed?
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• 2699[19:04:39] <jelly> apparently some bugs were fixed
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• 2716[19:15:05] <Lope> thanks jelly
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• 2744[19:33:45] <psichas> replaced-url
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• 2773[19:53:15] * ssot Hello!
• 2774[19:53:20] <ssot> Hello! *
• 2775[19:53:29] <ssot> Does anyone here run postgresql on a custom configured server? What model SSDs do you use? (ZFS)
• 2776[19:54:12] <rant> I like gqview (no longer in debian) which has been replaced with geeqie ..
• 2777[19:54:14] <ssot> (or any high load SQL server for that matter)
• 2778[19:54:43] <timeless> hi
• 2779[19:54:54] <timeless> i'm looking at replaced-url
• 2780[19:55:18] <timeless> i'm wondering if there's any way to get debian to recycle the zabbix upstream debian packages...
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• 2784[19:55:49] <timeless> -- replaced-url
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• 2787[19:58:01] <rant> I assure you all our packages use the maximum recyclable material allowed :P
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• 2790[20:00:34] <timeless> rant: hmm... the current zabbix upstreams are at 3.0.19 and 3.4.11
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• 2793[20:02:27] <rant> good to know.. if I knew what zabbix was or cared, or had any 'n clue what you were asking how why you're now telling me this
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• 2795[20:02:59] <timeless> trying to understand if there's a way to get the version of zabbix included in debian to be closer to current
• 2796[20:03:47] <rant> oh well then probably, sure..
• 2797[20:03:51] <ssot> 👋 Is there a channel where I can ask questions about server hardware?
• 2798[20:03:53] <rant> ,v zabbix
• 2799[20:03:55] <judd> No package named 'zabbix' was found in amd64.
• 2800[20:03:57] *** Quits: jcstaudt (~JC@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 2801[20:04:03] <timeless> ,v zabbix-agent
• 2802[20:04:04] <judd> Package: zabbix-agent on amd64 -- wheezy-backports: 1:2.2.5+dfsg-1~bpo70+1; jessie: 1:2.2.7+dfsg-2+deb8u3; jessie-security: 1:2.2.7+dfsg-2+deb8u3; jessie-backports: 1:3.0.7+dfsg-1~bpo8+1; stretch: 1:3.0.7+dfsg-3; stretch-backports: 1:3.0.17+dfsg-1~bpo9+1; buster: 1:3.0.17+dfsg-1; sid: 1:3.0.17+dfsg-1
• 2803[20:05:17] <rant> timeless: presumably you have a reason for needing something newer than 3.0.17?
• 2804[20:05:31] <ssot> 👋 Is there a channel where I can ask questions about server hardware?
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• 2806[20:05:57] <timeless> ssot: i'm lazy and use spinning disks w/ google cloud and zfs (w/ postgres)
• 2807[20:06:11] <timeless> (but repeating your question is unlikely to get positive responses)
• 2808[20:06:24] <rant> ssot: ##hardware, perhaps.. you keep repeating and using stupid icons in high volume channels and you'll probably wind up klined
• 2809[20:07:41] <ssot> Oh! I just realized I pressed the up arrow before pressing enter on my second message, which wasn't supposed to be the same!
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• 2812[20:08:17] <timeless> ssot: fwiw, there's a #zfsonlinux channel
• 2813[20:08:20] <ssot> I had no intention of repeating myself. Apologies.
• 2814[20:09:06] <timeless> but, i'd probably rely on stackoverflow/various blogs for that subject matter
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• 2825[20:11:30] <ssot> timeless, rant: Thanks..
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• 2829[20:13:19] <Tashtari> How can I get `apt-get source` to not give me signature verification errors? :( I've googled this and tried all the things that are suggested and nothing seems to work. Nothing I've done causes gpg to create a trustedkeys.gpg, and even after going so far as to copy /usr/share/keyrings/debian-maintainers.gpg to ~/.gnupg/trustedkeys.gpg, I get the same errors as before (minus not being able to find
• 2830[20:13:21] <Tashtari> trustedkeys.gpg).
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• 2837[20:16:17] <rant> timeless: 3.0.19 has no features and few and rather insignificant bug fixes over the available 3.0.17 which was just released a month or two ago
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• 2840[20:17:23] <rant> well unless you're looking for translations, which is the only thing listed in the release notes as feature improvements
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• 2849[20:20:04] <rant> not to mention the upstream devs seem to support debian and have repos for newer packages if somehow you are looking for non-existant feature updates
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• 2854[20:21:17] <lessthan0> I need help with manual install and manual partition of debian 9.4 amd64
• 2855[20:21:59] <lessthan0> I want to use a 1TB drive for debian only but I want to put ext2 partition 1 and LVM on partition 2
• 2856[20:22:03] <rant> Tashtari: if you are getting warnings (they're not errors) about signatures its probably due to the mirror you're using or you have not installed the keyring
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• 2859[20:22:29] <lessthan0> the installer always puts sda1 ext2 and sda2 extended sda5 LVM
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• 2861[20:22:58] <Tashtari> rant: I have debian-keyring installed already.
• 2862[20:22:59] <rant> lessthan0: stop using auto partitioning, use an expert install and manual partitioning
• 2863[20:23:03] <lessthan0> if I use guided partitioning it cannot remove LVM or sda2 after it is created
• 2864[20:23:10] <lessthan0> yes
• 2865[20:23:36] <lessthan0> I zeros the drive and I am in rescue shell
• 2866[20:23:42] <rant> Tashtari: my suggestion is to pastebin the error in full on paste.debian.net
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• 2868[20:24:05] <lessthan0> should I reboot and use expert graphical installer? or partition first from rescue shell?
• 2869[20:24:35] <greycat> "expert graphical" !?
• 2870[20:24:39] <greycat> what kind of nonsense is that
• 2871[20:24:54] <lessthan0> so I should use expert installer non-graphical?
• 2872[20:25:10] <rant> lessthan0: we cannot and will not support debian installer's guided partitioning. there is a specific channel for debian-installer and if you want something specific you should not be allowing d-i to do things for you, you should be using expert mode
• 2873[20:25:37] <greycat> Even the regular non-graphical non-expert installer lets you do manual partitioning.
• 2874[20:25:47] <rant> yes it does
• 2875[20:26:04] <lessthan0> ok I am advanced>expert install
• 2876[20:26:11] <lessthan0> should I switch rooms?
• 2877[20:26:25] <lessthan0> greycat it has its flaws
• 2878[20:26:29] <Tashtari> rant: replaced-url
• 2879[20:26:36] <greycat> you push the up and down arrow keys a lot.
• 2880[20:27:45] <lessthan0> #debian-install is invite only
• 2881[20:27:51] <greycat> wrong network
• 2882[20:28:09] <rant> Tashtari: yeah you could've just copied any text you could've found and it'd have been as meaningless to this issue as that is.. thats not the full output of anyhing.. such as apt source foo or such
• 2883[20:28:37] *** Quits: altin_ (~altin@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 2884[20:28:38] <rant> that doesnt tell me what mirror we're talking about or what command you ran
• 2885[20:28:44] <lessthan0> what irc network is it on?
• 2886[20:28:45] <klys> lessthan0, the correct network would be irc.oftc.net afaik.
• 2887[20:28:49] <lessthan0> ok
• 2888[20:29:02] <OS-3859> !payday
• 2889[20:29:05] <Tashtari> Sorry, you only mentioned the error text.
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• 2891[20:29:30] <rant> Tashtari: yes I suppose I was not clear :P
• 2892[20:29:49] <Tashtari> Anyway, if the mirror is potentially the culprit, it might be because I'm using devuan, which of course has its own mirrors...
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• 2895[20:30:00] <greycat> Then you're in the wrong channel.
• 2896[20:30:09] <rant> Tashtari: sure, and its not supported here ;)
• 2897[20:31:03] <Tashtari> All right, I'll ask there.
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• 2899[20:31:11] * rant grabs some tp and heads to the oval office, greycat is here there is no reason we should both be getting annoyed with this stuff :P
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• 2914[20:40:47] <FightingFalcon> What are the pros and cons of installing NTP?
• 2915[20:41:33] <greycat> Pros: your clock will be right.
• 2916[20:41:34] * dgp thought systemd did NTP too now..
• 2917[20:41:45] <greycat> dgp: it *can*, but it doesn't by default in Debian
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• 2927[20:45:01] <dgp> It's only 3:44am and I've already learned something new :)
• 2928[20:45:02] <rant> it does stop you from changing the time though
• 2929[20:45:22] <greycat> rant: two pros!
• 2930[20:45:43] <rant> I was referring to systemd not ntp
• 2931[20:45:47] <greycat> Oh.
• 2932[20:46:00] <rant> there is a service that stops you from changing the time
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• 2937[20:46:36] <rant> dont recall which one off the top of my head but there is def a default unit that keeps the time from changing
• 2938[20:46:57] <nkuttler> ntp?
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• 2940[20:47:06] <rant> no /me checks
• 2941[20:47:22] <dgp> rant: it stops the time from changing at all or stops you from manually changing it?
• 2942[20:47:49] <rant> timesyncd.service
• 2943[20:48:06] <greycat> I thought that was the one that runs pseudo-NTP
• 2944[20:48:07] *** Joins: afroboy (~afroboy@replaced-ip)
• 2945[20:48:08] <rant> stops date --set from working, I know that much.. havent investigated
• 2946[20:48:20] *** Joins: Kamilion (kamilion@replaced-ip)
• 2947[20:48:27] <dgp> They really do want to take over :/
• 2948[20:48:38] *** Joins: clemens3 (~clemens@replaced-ip)
• 2949[20:48:42] <rant> I'm still not used to systemd, but I know enough to get by
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• 2952[20:49:13] <greycat> I know enough to not use systemd-timesyncd
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• 2954[20:49:19] <rant> heh
• 2955[20:49:27] <dgp> I still use /etc/init.d/blah start|stop. Mainly because I don't have to look after servers anymore and I'm too lazy to bother learning anything new
• 2956[20:49:41] *** Joins: r00tobo (~r00tobo@replaced-ip)
• 2957[20:49:51] <rant> I got used to using service even before systemd
• 2958[20:50:02] <rant> so I still use that a lot
• 2959[20:51:12] <rant> though I know how to enable/disable and check status and such with systemctl
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• 2963[20:51:40] <dgp> I've only ever touched systemctl to disable pulseaudio ;)
• 2964[20:51:48] <rant> just more typing than service for start/stop/restart
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• 2969[20:53:33] <rant> i've never disabled pulseaudio.. unlike sound daemons of the past like esd and such its rather pleasant to work with
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• 2973[20:54:38] <dgp> I have headphones in one port and speakers in another and pulseaudio can't work that I want to 2.0 ports
• 2974[20:54:46] <dgp> s/to/two/
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• 2982[20:55:16] <rant> though it had and still does baffle me how I'm logged into my fathers computer as his user for my screen+irssi session since my connection is less reliable and the other day he was unable to play sounds cause the wrong card was selected in pulse.. yet when I'd run mplayer it made sound from his speakers but when he'd run it it didn work..
• 2983[20:55:31] <dgp> and the mixer app craps itself and crashes pulseaudio so I can't even fix it if I wanted to
• 2984[20:55:47] <rant> I dont understand how he was using differnent pulse config than I was when we were both logged in as the same user
• 2985[20:56:07] <rant> runnning the exact same command from terminal
• 2986[20:56:11] <greycat> but logged in by different methods?
• 2987[20:56:24] <rant> sure I was over mosh and he was in mate locally
• 2988[20:56:29] <greycat> probably has something to do with dbus user session buses and systemd-logind
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• 2990[20:57:17] <rant> I guess when I did the jessie->stretch on his system it had reverted to the built in sound card rather than the usb one on his hdmi adapter..
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• 2995[20:58:09] <rant> just puzzled me how the pulse daemon was started as part of his login session and was behaving differently for me over mosh
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• 2997[20:58:27] <rant> I guess I have no idea how that systemd login crap works :P
• 2998[20:59:02] * dgp lost track of how anything works when running startx manually was a thing
• 2999[20:59:45] <greycat> I don't understand it in detail either. I just know that it matters. It does things like assigning ownership and ACLs on device files.
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• 3002[21:00:44] <rant> you'd think it'd be irrelevant when you do mplayer -vo null -ao pulse cheers.mp3 as user roger, it's connecting to the pulsed running as roger.. which you'd think would be same config regardless of how roger is logged in
• 3003[21:01:13] <greycat> What exactly is a "pulsed" and how does mplayer know how to talk to it?
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• 3005[21:02:02] <rant> pulseaudio daemon and mplayer has an output plugin for it.. how it works idk.. perhaps as you suggest over dbus or some sort of IPC
• 3006[21:02:33] <greycat> chances are, something that happens during your login sets up whatever communication channels or environment variables are involved
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• 3010[21:03:53] <rant> yeah but even so, why would my mosh+screen setup be using the USB audio when his local lightdm+mate had selected the built in intel sound.. when neither of us explicitly configured anything :P
• 3011[21:03:53] *** Quits: blingrang (~blingrang@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
• 3012[21:04:20] <rant> I could imagine why it reverted to the intel when upgraded.. thats the first card.. and builtin.. kinda makes sense
• 3013[21:04:22] <FightingFalcon> Whats the difference between ntp and ntpdate?
• 3014[21:04:37] <greycat> (further wild-ass guessing: in the absence of whatever the MATE login did, it falls back to some sort of configuration defaults)
• 3015[21:04:42] <greycat> !ntpdate
• 3016[21:04:42] <dpkg> ntpdate is an obsolete and unmaintained program to set a system clock via <NTP>. Just install the ntp package instead. Since Debian 5.0 "Lenny", ntp's default configuration files (NTPD_OPTS='-g' in /etc/default/ntp, 'iburst' option for default servers in /etc/ntp.conf) make ntpdate unnecessary. See also <why not ntpdate>.
• 3017[21:04:47] <rant> FightingFalcon: ntpdate is like a one shot time updater where ntp is a daemon that manages drift
• 3018[21:05:24] *** Quits: Guest25805 (~dsps@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 3019[21:05:25] <dgp> FightingFalcon: you shouldn't use ntpdate
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• 3021[21:05:43] *** Joins: oerheks (~oerheks@replaced-ip)
• 3022[21:05:47] <greycat> Before ntpd had a "-g" option, in the olde days, a boot script had to run "ntpdate" precisely one time to slam the clock to approximately the right setting, before starting up ntpd to let it fine-tune things.
• 3023[21:06:17] <rant> yes, because ntp only allows for minor drift adjustments not large changes
• 3024[21:06:34] <greycat> !why not ntpdate
• 3025[21:06:34] <dpkg> Use a daemon like ntpd, chrony or openntpd instead of <ntpdate> to keep your time synchronised. Rationale at replaced-url
• 3026[21:06:38] <rant> if you were too far off, ntp couldnt correct it
• 3027[21:07:10] *** Joins: fax (~fax@replaced-ip)
• 3028[21:07:42] <rant> though I wasnt aware of all dpkg had just said
• 3029[21:08:59] <rant> with all these Soc, SBC, IOT, etc, its quite common to find things with no RTC or clock battery now.. so ntp is more useful than ever
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• 3032[21:09:40] <rant> especially since stuff like TLS wont work without it :P
• 3033[21:10:12] *** Joins: krytarik (~krytarik@replaced-ip)
• 3034[21:10:18] <rant> Jan 1, 1970? man this certificate is outdated.. its 48 years old..
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• 3037[21:10:37] <dgp> ntp without something like TLS is also a security nightmare waiting to happen. Major chicken and egg problem
• 3038[21:10:47] <rant> no wait.. its signed 48 years in the future.. say whaa?
• 3039[21:11:13] <rant> dgp: yeah never considered that
• 3040[21:12:01] <craftyguy> wow there's something wrong with the kernel in the debian testing netinst images. quite a few modules cannot load, originally I thought only NIC drivers, but just discovered dm-mod also fails
• 3041[21:12:32] <greycat> !debian-next
• 3042[21:12:32] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
• 3043[21:12:34] <dgp> rant: I work in "IoT" and the TLS and time problem is a major issue. Device have clocks but to avoid batteries companies use supercaps etc to keep the time. That's only really good enough for a for months (basically for reboots, offline time).
• 3044[21:12:53] <craftyguy> greycat: thanks
• 3045[21:13:03] <craftyguy> ugh. otfc..
• 3046[21:13:22] <greycat> All of the Debian channels are on OFTC except this one and #debian-offtopic.
• 3047[21:13:24] <rant> dgp: truth be told I still dont really know what IoT means.. but I think I get the idea :P
• 3048[21:13:25] <dgp> rant: and the drift on the clock can be massive so it can get messed up even if it's got juice. :(
• 3049[21:13:49] <dgp> rant: it means "I have an idea that only 10% of which is any good, give me some money"
• 3050[21:13:51] * rant was living under a "rock" for several years and came back to many new terms and things
• 3051[21:14:02] <greycat> "Internet of Things" -- toasters and flea collars with internet connectivity.
• 3052[21:14:56] <dgp> or saving energy, other resources by making automatic systems less dumb but the majority of "IoT" is junk
• 3053[21:15:06] *** Joins: user666 (~user666@replaced-ip)
• 3054[21:15:30] <rant> yeah well I was quite shocked when I saw Microsoft had released a Win 10 IOT and it was free (cost) blew me away that 1) they even had such a platform and 2) they were giving anything away for free
• 3055[21:15:34] *** Quits: Sir_Designer (~Sir_Desig@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 3056[21:16:21] <rant> though I couldnt imagine running Win10 on even a flea collar .. heh
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• 3060[21:17:30] <dgp> rant: anything running win 10 would be too expensive to mass-produce. It's a gimmick really
• 3061[21:17:40] *** Quits: bluenemo (~bluenemo@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 3062[21:17:44] <rant> every time the pooch got a new flea, it'd have to search for a new driver or something :P
• 3063[21:17:51] <dgp> Which is why Debian is great. Free of gimmicks ;)
• 3064[21:17:59] *** Joins: Sir_Designer (~Sir_Desig@replaced-ip)
• 3065[21:18:06] <greycat> *cough* gnome
• 3066[21:18:20] <rant> heh
• 3067[21:18:55] <dgp> greycat: Are there blogs about gnome on debian trying to get you to buy into "the debian way(tm)"?
• 3068[21:19:18] <rant> and making sure your GNOME is genuine advantage?
• 3069[21:19:23] *** chiluk_ is now known as chiluk
• 3070[21:19:38] <rant> that guy that wrote the linux genuine advantage cracked me up
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• 3081[21:29:00] <eyJhb> rant, " How to log in to enter the license key when logins are disabled is left as an exercise for the reader. "
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• 3085[21:29:58] <alfa_niceguy> help needed. helpers available?
• 3086[21:30:38] *** Joins: RebelCoder (~RebelCode@replaced-ip)
• 3087[21:30:39] <greycat> !ask
• 3088[21:30:39] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
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• 3093[21:32:25] <alfa_niceguy> My distro encounters multiple problems while booting up resulting in a slow boot process. I am using a debian based distro.
• 3094[21:32:54] <greycat> !based on debian
• 3095[21:32:54] <dpkg> Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare replaced-url
• 3096[21:33:04] <rant> eyJhb: yeah its a hoot :P
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• 3098[21:33:11] <dgp> debian based is a sneaky way of saying "they wouldn't help me on their channel"?
• 3099[21:33:26] <alfa_niceguy> However the problem that annoys me is: Root account is locked can't get access to shell. Press enter to continue
• 3100[21:33:40] <greycat> Boot-up is ESPECIALLY distro-specific.
• 3101[21:34:01] <rant> alfa_niceguy: replaced-url
• 3102[21:34:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1626
• 3103[21:34:17] <alfa_niceguy> dgp: xD
• 3104[21:34:30] <alfa_niceguy> My distro is Deepin
• 3105[21:34:40] <rant> sorry to hear that
• 3106[21:35:27] <greycat> !deepin
• 3107[21:35:27] <dpkg> deepin is a Chinese distribution <based on debian>. It is not supported on #debian. Try their forums at replaced-url
• 3108[21:35:57] <greycat> dpkg, deepin =~ s#/,#/#
• 3109[21:35:57] <dpkg> greycat: OK
• 3110[21:36:01] <dgp> Do you get deep-in trouble for using it?
• 3111[21:36:12] <rant> GFW blocking debian?
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• 3114[21:37:47] <alfa_niceguy> dgp: Yes, I do. My Wlan card is not supported, very week signals. My Radeon R5 M330 ain't supported, that's the whole linux problem and it doesn't seem to mount my ntfs drives properly.
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• 3123[21:40:32] <rant> best thing to do for ntfs on linux aside from not using it, is to make the fs on linux.. I always advise people to reformat even already formatted new drives under linux for compatibility sake
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• 3131[21:43:05] <RoyK> rant: I'd say "just don't use it"
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• 3137[21:44:31] <alfa_niceguy> rant: I use dualboot (deepin + windows). All the ntfs drives are for windows
• 3138[21:45:03] <greycat> So you use two things that aren't Debian, and yet you're still in #debian.
• 3139[21:45:18] <alfa_niceguy> Deepin is debian.
• 3140[21:45:26] <greycat> It is not. Go now or you will be removed.
• 3141[21:45:27] <alfa_niceguy> mOStly
• 3142[21:45:57] <alfa_niceguy> Convince me to switch to debian.
• 3143[21:46:32] <alfa_niceguy> can I get rid of deepin, install debian and that won't affect my windows drives?
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• 3161[22:01:26] <RoyK> alfa_niceguy: just try it and decide for yourself - noone but you should decide what to do or who to fuck
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• 3174[22:14:27] <JustTheDoctor> how do i find out my gcc version on ssh? i've already done gcc -v and get gcc: command not found ran as user and root
• 3175[22:14:51] <greycat> Then gcc isn't installed, or your PATH is screwed up.
• 3176[22:15:09] <greycat> how about "ls -ld /usr/bin/gcc" or "dpkg -l gcc\*"
• 3177[22:15:09] <JustTheDoctor> is there a way to find out without fixing path?
• 3178[22:16:07] <JustTheDoctor> user and root ls: cannot access /usr/bin/gcc: No such file or directory with first command trying second
• 3179[22:16:14] <greycat> then it's not installed
• 3180[22:16:28] <JustTheDoctor> doesnt gcc need to be installed to compile linux?
• 3181[22:16:39] <greycat> Yes, but most people never compile linux.
• 3182[22:16:53] <JustTheDoctor> ahh so if i am on a vps, its been presetup and gcc is gone ok
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• 3184[22:17:03] <greycat> If the next question is "how do I install it", try installing "build-essential" as root.
• 3185[22:17:11] <greycat> that will bring in gcc and related tools
• 3186[22:17:17] <JustTheDoctor> how can i find gcc 4.9.0 to self compile/setup on my linux machine?
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• 3189[22:17:45] <greycat> If it's a VPS, there's a chanced that bulding your own kernel would be pointless because you're using the host's kernel. What does "uname -a" say?
• 3190[22:17:46] <JustTheDoctor> im trying to use a specific set of components and would perf to use 4.9.0 but im on deb 8
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• 3195[22:17:57] <JustTheDoctor> im not trying to build my own kernal,
• 3196[22:18:11] <greycat> ...
• 3197[22:18:11] <JustTheDoctor> im trying to build a premade application that asks for certain librarys
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• 3199[22:18:44] <JustTheDoctor> it says that gcc 4.9.0 is what it was built on, so i'd like to compile that myself and place it myself rather then apt-get sometimes apt-get gives a lesser or newer version
• 3200[22:18:47] <greycat> 16:16 JustTheDoctor> doesnt gcc need to be installed to compile linux?
• 3201[22:18:51] <greycat> 16:17 JustTheDoctor> im not trying to build my own kernal,
• 3202[22:19:06] <greycat> Linux = kernel.
• 3203[22:19:36] <JustTheDoctor> well i figured if i had a linux server, it should have gcc installed as it should be needed to compile linux, im a little slow on the kernal side of linux im used to using vps's and install disc's, tho i have compiled gentoo myself, deb is diff.
• 3204[22:19:50] <greycat> MOST PEOPLE NEVER COMPILE LINUX
• 3205[22:19:51] <JustTheDoctor> im looking to specifically self compile / install gcc 4.9.0
• 3206[22:19:56] <greycat> LINUX *IS* THE KERNEL
• 3207[22:20:05] <greycat> ,v gcc
• 3208[22:20:06] <judd> Package: gcc on amd64 -- wheezy: 4:4.7.2-1; jessie: 4:4.9.2-2; stretch: 4:6.3.0-4; buster: 4:7.3.0-3; sid: 4:7.3.0-3; experimental: 4:8-20180425-2
• 3209[22:20:14] <JustTheDoctor> unless u use gentoo linux which the install process requires you to COMPILE linux (kernal)
• 3210[22:20:20] <greycat> jessie comes with gcc 4.9.2. Is that close enough?
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• 3213[22:20:36] <JustTheDoctor> well, if im on deb 8 and thats jessie it doesnt have gcc..
• 3214[22:20:41] <JustTheDoctor> i need specifically 4.9.0
• 3215[22:20:44] <greycat> INSTALL build-essential
• 3216[22:20:50] <JustTheDoctor> ok
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• 3220[22:21:47] <rant> if you need a specific version of gcc, you probably actually need to rm -rf that source and start over :P
• 3221[22:22:31] <greycat> You would need to install the OS version of gcc in order to be able to compile some OTHER version of gcc, so the starting point is absolutely "apt install build-essential" no matter what.
• 3222[22:22:53] <JustTheDoctor> gcc installed, i'll take my chance's on that version..
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• 3227[22:25:54] <rant> I never knew what to make of stuff like 4: in a version string.. the -2 stuff is fairly obviously a local maintainer revision and the major.minor.revision is fairly standard
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• 3247[22:38:28] <oaken-source> Hi, I'm trying to install mariadb-server on stretch in a script, setting a default password for root, but the usual debconf-set-selection approaches don't work anymore and the auth plugin is set to unix_socket, no password is set for root.
• 3248[22:38:48] <oaken-source> this breaks a lot of things on my end. Am I just doing something stupidly wrong or was this feature removed?
• 3249[22:38:50] <dka> Is it possible to do `source $(cat myfile.sh)`
• 3250[22:38:51] <dka> ?
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• 3254[22:42:20] <ryouma> dka: makes little sense
• 3255[22:42:31] <ryouma> but yes
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• 3257[22:42:49] <dka> can I do `source $(curl replaced-url
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• 3259[22:43:19] <ryouma> dka: what are you trying to do?
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• 3261[22:43:27] <FinalX> oaken-source: dpkg-reconfigure mariadb-server perhaps? if it doesn't work, you can always mysql -u root and change it in MySQL itself.
• 3262[22:43:28] <ryouma> we cannot answer a question like that
• 3263[22:43:29] <petn-randall> dka: You can do many things, the question is: "Does it solve your problem?"
• 3264[22:43:33] <FinalX> oaken-source: see replaced-url
• 3265[22:43:54] <ryouma> we ened to know your objective
• 3266[22:44:33] <ryouma> running code from curl is a bad idea unless you control the server
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• 3279[22:55:43] <oaken-source> FinalX: I don't think the password is the issue, I need to change the auth plugin
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• 3287[23:00:10] <oaken-source> and the ALTER USER statement doesn't exist in mariadb-10.1?
• 3288[23:00:15] <oaken-source> this is all kinds of weird.
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• 3290[23:00:48] <dka> I have created a bash file with `FOOBAR=hello`, I am doing `source <(cat test.sh)` and then `echo $FOOBAR`, but it is empty, why?
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• 3293[23:01:33] <oaken-source> dka: because `source` expects a filename to read and evaluate the contents of.
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• 3295[23:01:41] <oaken-source> do you maybe look for the command 'eval'?
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• 3300[23:03:05] <greycat> FYI dka is cross-posting from #bash and the problem has something to do with node, and npm, and npx, and who knows what else. I've had him on ignore for several minutes already. No telling how it has mutated since.
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