Realtime Nick Name Ticker of #debian at freenode (ICQ IRC service)

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5[00:02:33] <lope> I figured it out
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17[00:16:53] <t3st3r> Psi-Jack> nginx got one advantage. Being http server, it can serve static files, etc on its own like a boss. Provoding all features one could expect of HTTP server.
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20[00:17:25] <Psi-Jack> Yes, hence, you can use nginx to serve both static content and forward to PHP-FPM.
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43[00:23:42] <t3st3r> It can proxy whatever "application server" one has got. And I wouldn't dare to call nginx "suboptimal", it seems it gone great lengths to handle tremendous loads.
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45[00:24:22] <Psi-Jack> Perhaps, that is because you are unaware of how to run small to grand scale webservers. ;)
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50[00:28:43] <t3st3r> That's hardly a technical argument or so. Technically, event-based + threads architecture looks "grand enough" to me.
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61[00:33:56] <victorqueiroz> Guys I'm having some issues with stretch (stable): My Radeon RX 590 doesn't work unless using Linux 4.14 from stretch-backports and mesa drivers from stretch backports makes it impossible to auth through Xorg (GNOME), but Wayland session works. Can you please help me? Changing the hardware is not an option for me right now.
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64[00:35:13] <victorqueiroz> The same happens on Debian Buster. I'm talking about Mesa drivers from backports because I need more updated Vulkan drivers.
65[00:35:27] <victorqueiroz> So, maybe someone can help me? I really don't want to use Arch Linux or Ubuntu, Debian is my baby.
66[00:35:35] <t3st3r> Hmm I guess recent radeons inevitably need recent kernel, mesa and firmware.
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68[00:36:35] <annadane> i wonder what someone is supposed to do if their system won't even boot without a newer kernel, preseed? have base everything else debian + kernel from backports?
69[00:36:40] <annadane> thankfully i haven't had this happen
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74[00:37:49] <t3st3r> annadane> in case of GPU I guess you can try nomodeset kernel cmdline to boot in "vga mode". Enough to install newer kernel/mesa and firmware package.
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76[00:39:25] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: Yes, nomodeset works perfectly. That's the strategy I use to install newer kernel. But still, I'm not able to boot through Xorg, that's an issue that I could not overcome so far. That's my /var/log/Xorg.0.log: replaced-url
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85[00:43:40] <t3st3r> At first glance I get impression GPU isn't taking off. Do you have firmware-amd-graphics package installed at all?
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88[00:44:38] <t3st3r> (that's in "testing" and I'm not sure "stable" supports RX590 on its own at all)
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91[00:46:34] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: It works fine with Linux 4.14 and firmware-amd-graphics from stretch-backpors but Mesa drivers kind of break Xorg. Yes I have firmware-amd-graphics.
92[00:46:40] <maxxe> I have made a package of a program for Debian. How can I make it available via regular apt sources as part of the distribution?
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96[00:49:07] <t3st3r> victorqueiroz> Kind of break xorg? What happens in this case? Log you've posted tells KMS isnt supported and xorg happily pikes off at this point, logical enough.
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99[00:49:51] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: It just doesn't authenticate from gdm when I select Xorg session.
100[00:50:00] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: Is there a way to make Xorg work?
101[00:50:10] <t3st3r> also make sure libdrm is recent and you have libdrm-amdgpu1 installed.
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106[00:51:53] <t3st3r> well, I do run xorg/mesa/etc from testing and amd gpu (somewhat older though), so it could work on its own. Though I use lightdm and xfce.
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108[00:55:01] <jmcnaught> maxxe: check out replaced-url
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110[00:55:58] <maxxe> jmcnaught: will check it out
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113[00:58:11] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: It's the latest at least on Debian testing. But the same problem happens on Debian Stretch so I'm kind of confused. Should I reinstall stretch and see if Xorg will work?
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116[00:59:44] <wastedClown> hi can anyoone tell me whats the most compatible linux distro? compatible with my hardware
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121[01:00:41] <wastedClown> what is the best distro for a asus sonic master?
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123[01:01:44] <t3st3r> victorqueiroz> I don't think stretch on its own stands chance to light up that GPU properly, at most VGA/unaccelerated mode. That also lacks power and clock management.
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125[01:02:50] <t3st3r> wastedClown> something like recent ubuntu. But this channel is about debian after all...
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131[01:04:56] <wastedClown> does it support 32 bit? t3st3r?
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134[01:07:43] <Kremator> wastedClown, if that is a laptop, i have a golden rule: the better distro for an X laptop is the one that in the live boot does recognize the Wifi and sound cards
135[01:07:46] <Kremator> otherwise you would have to hunt for the drivers in internet and compile & install them
136[01:07:47] <Kremator> which is not bad, just not for everyone
137[01:08:25] <annadane> isn't ubuntu specifically dropping 32 bit?
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139[01:08:43] <RoyK> probably 64bit
140[01:08:52] <annadane> wastedClown, it depends what processor it has; most computers can probably run debian with some exceptions
141[01:09:00] <RoyK> there hasn't been much stuff on x86 for ages
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143[01:09:06] <Kremator> annadane, yeap, although they are sort of backpedaling for gaming community
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145[01:09:15] <annadane> i don't know enough to answer "will x computer run debian" but you can try a live image
146[01:09:21] <t3st3r> wastedClown> hmm... they recently dropped 32 bits.
147[01:09:22] <Kremator> now valve is going to drop support for Uboontoo
148[01:09:50] <annadane> i know the wiki has a bunch of "running debian on..." pages
149[01:10:07] <wastedClown> then how can i install a linux on my computer?
150[01:10:14] <RoyK> most 32bit stuff are either ARM or very old x86 hardware
151[01:10:28] <t3st3r> well, I'm not sure why ubuntu been so eager to drop 32 bits.
152[01:10:35] <Kremator> wastedClown, are you sure your machine is x86932 bits) only?
153[01:10:36] <RoyK> wastedClown: download an iso and put on some media and boot from it
154[01:10:49] <annadane> buster also has an installer now and it releases very soon so if it doesn't run on stretch, just try buster i guess
155[01:10:57] <Kremator> wastedClown, most computers although old have a processor capable of running 64bit (x86_64/amd64) code
156[01:10:58] <RoyK> Kremator: that was a lot of bits
157[01:11:01] <t3st3r> On related note, I do not use 32 bit on x86, my OSes are all-64, yet opencl debian package attempts to install me 32-bit legacy libs. Really annoying btw.
158[01:11:02] <wastedClown> what about fedora?
159[01:11:19] <Kremator> RoyK, lmao yeah, i just misstype'd... a lot
160[01:11:20] <RoyK> wastedClown: please don't swear on the forum ;)
161[01:11:26] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: Well and both in stretch and testing I'm not able to authenticate on a Xorg session so I think I'm going to go with Arch Linux. Ubuntu is definitely too buggy and slow for me :'(
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163[01:11:34] <Kremator> wastedClown, i wouldnt put my bet on fedora still running 32 bits
164[01:11:46] <t3st3r> victorqueiroz> try different login manager? Like LDM?
165[01:11:59] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: Hm. let me see
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167[01:12:26] <Kremator> it's a rolling release distro, and they put all efforts in modern things
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171[01:13:38] <RoyK> what sort of machine is it that needs 32bit?
172[01:13:51] <RoyK> even a raspberry pi is 64bit now
173[01:14:27] <t3st3r> Maybe something that intended for games? Like using steam? To my surprise plenty of games still release as 32-bit blobs.
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175[01:15:05] <RoyK> t3st3r: you can use 32bit blobs on 64bit OSes - just install the 32bit libs
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177[01:15:47] <t3st3r> RoyK> I know, but it really weird thing to do to my taste. Not to mention it doesn't takes advantage of instruction set, etc.
178[01:16:06] <Kremator> wastedClown, if you wanna keep using x86/32bits machine, your best bet is something where you compile things by yourself and it is extremely stable (a.k.a old), that leaves you 2 options: gentoo and slackware
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180[01:16:25] <RoyK> t3st3r: the blobs don't - the rest of the system will
181[01:16:59] <t3st3r> I guess debian would support 32 bits for at least few more years on x86. And technically one can get debian on nearly anything, it just not granted it would be bump-free ride.
182[01:17:26] <annadane> i mean isn't i386 specifically supported?
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184[01:17:35] <RoyK> t3st3r: you never get a bump-free ride ;)
185[01:17:39] <Kremator> t3st3r, i though debain was about to dorp 32 bits support in deb 10?
186[01:17:53] <t3st3r> RoyK> funny thing is that I do think games can benefit out of "guaranteed" SSE2, plenty of 64-bit regs, etc. So gamedevs eventually being "strange".
187[01:18:06] <Kremator> in any case, debian is WAY more free of bumps than gentoo or slackware
188[01:18:09] <annadane> i guess the distros with the widest variety of hardware support are: debian, netbsd, openbsd
189[01:18:16] <RoyK> t3st3r: I'm not that into gaming so I don't know - sorry
190[01:18:28] <annadane> for really obscure hardwre, sometimes
191[01:18:30] <t3st3r> <RoyK> t3st3r: you never get a bump-free ride ;) <- well, one can buy e.g. android phone ... and hope it close to it :D
192[01:18:33] <RoyK> Kremator: slackware??? do people still use that shite?
193[01:18:42] <annadane> haha
194[01:18:43] <Kremator> annadane, and only 1 of them have a cool kernel lol
195[01:18:47] <annadane> not a fan of the slack?
196[01:18:54] <Kremator> RoyK, IBM does
197[01:19:14] <Kremator> also the folks makers of SAP does use slack aswell
198[01:19:16] * RoyK setup slackware as his first linux desktop back in 1994 and used it a while before moving on
199[01:19:41] <t3st3r> RoyK> I'm not a hardcore gamer either, just got some ideas of gamedevs due to some interest to how GPU drivers work and surroundings.
200[01:20:04] <Kremator> using linux in early 90's was definitelly some kind fo computer sorcery
201[01:20:14] <RoyK> t3st3r: obviously they should, but I doubt that neither you nor I can do much about that
202[01:20:20] <Kremator> and it definitelly required best's wills for it to be mastered
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206[01:20:48] <Kremator> t3st3r, reminder that most gamedevs are shite at optimizing their products, specially because majority of them are close dsource
207[01:21:30] <Kremator> what does it have to be that is closed source? means that you cannot recompile them to take most advantages of the newer instructions in your hardware,s ince most programs have to be compiled with an way odler system's target
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209[01:21:51] <t3st3r> I guess they just never bothered self about portability - ending with ton of code that doesn't readily ports to 64 bits.
210[01:21:57] * Kremator daydreams about recompiling skyrim in a ryzen 3000 machine
211[01:22:10] <Kremator> just imagine all the perfromance lsot
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213[01:23:59] <RoyK> still, even if debian or ubuntu leaves 32bit for the distros, they'll probably keep compatibility for some time with the 32bit libs
214[01:24:36] <annadane> eww. replaced-url
215[01:24:46] <annadane> stupid debian wiki and its outdatedness
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217[01:25:36] <humpled> it's a wiki ;)
218[01:25:42] <annadane> i may edit that later myself so people don't think i'm bitching without offering solutions
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220[01:25:48] <humpled> :þ
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222[01:26:24] <RoyK> humpled: :þ
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224[01:26:44] <RoyK> (not many people use that emoticon)
225[01:27:38] <annadane> (full disclosure, the debian wiki is mostly fine)
226[01:27:46] <annadane> i haven't seen particularly horrible outdatedness too much
227[01:27:55] <RoyK> usually people saying things like "allt í lagi?" ;)
228[01:28:13] <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: LightDM doesn't even start
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265[01:56:27] <t3st3r> <victorqueiroz> t3st3r: LightDM doesn't even start <- sounds strange to me. Are there errors or someting?
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281[02:13:20] <roylaprattep> when i do my jessie to stretch upgrade, will it touch my manually installed debian package?
282[02:13:44] <roylaprattep> i mean, i dont want them to be removed when doing the autoremove
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285[02:14:30] <RoyK> roylaprattep: they won't, but they may not work after upgrading if they need different versions of libs
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288[02:15:06] <RoyK> roylaprattep: if you're using lvm, make a snapshot first
289[02:15:16] <roylaprattep> RoyK: No, they are pretty straightforward
290[02:15:51] <roylaprattep> i dont use LVM, but i always do a backup image before doing something big like this
291[02:15:58] <roylaprattep> clonezilla ftw
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293[02:16:34] * RoyK always uses lvm
294[02:16:42] <roylaprattep> the mysql to mariadb goes well?
295[02:16:52] <RoyK> should work well
296[02:16:57] <roylaprattep> ok thx
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299[02:17:09] <RoyK> better switch to postgresql, though ;)
300[02:17:31] <roylaprattep> i like mariadb3mysql
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303[02:17:39] <roylaprattep> mariadb/mysql
304[02:18:00] <RoyK> well, it works, and sometimes it's necessary, but postgresql beats the shit out of it
305[02:19:03] <RoyK> at work we use wordpress and ezpublish - both more or less bound to mysql/mariadb - for other use, we use postgresql
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308[02:19:50] <roylaprattep> Facebook and Google use MariaDB, I guess it's not that bad. ;)
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315[02:23:15] <RoyK> roylaprattep: facebook developed cassandradb - google uses its own thing - both used mysql/mariadb earlier, but not anymore
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317[02:23:30] <RoyK> mysql/mariadb scales terribly badly
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319[02:23:43] <roylaprattep> anyway. ;)
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322[02:24:22] <RoyK> postgresql scales rather well and has far less consistency issues than mariadb
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324[02:24:35] <RoyK> but hell - it's your choice ;)
325[02:24:36] <roylaprattep> never had issues.
326[02:24:48] <RoyK> famous last words :D
327[02:24:55] <roylaprattep> :D
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329[02:25:37] <RoyK> just keep dumping those databases regularly and back them up and you should be fine
330[02:26:11] <roylaprattep> my server is using mysql since 10 years, never backed up my db itself, never got down.
331[02:26:23] <RoyK> I've seen mysql making a havoc - never seen that on postgresql
332[02:26:46] <RoyK> and of course - if your server never died - never make a backup - it'll live forever!
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334[02:26:52] <roylaprattep> i understand that you like postgresql, it's okp.
335[02:26:59] <Chex> RoyK: I do that with my wordpress backed by mysql, keep backups of it that run every 6 hours
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337[02:27:33] <RoyK> Chex: wp needs mysql/mariadb - it's tightly tied to it - won't work with postgres
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339[02:27:55] <RoyK> Chex: but backing up regualarly is nice
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343[02:28:42] <Chex> RoyK: yeah.. thats fine.
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345[02:28:55] <RoyK> after working with computing for 25 years or so, I've learned one good lesson - backup your data!
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347[02:29:13] <roylaprattep> i do backup my data.
348[02:29:33] <RoyK> good - make sure to dump those databases as well
349[02:29:41] <RoyK> mysql doesn't like raw backups
350[02:29:44] <roylaprattep> and using raid-1
351[02:30:04] <RoyK> also good, but keep in mind that raid isn't a backup
352[02:30:08] <roylaprattep> RoyK: i did a dump before doing my dist-upgrade with mysqldump
353[02:30:22] <RoyK> good
354[02:30:23] <roylaprattep> RoyK: i know it isn't backup.
355[02:30:30] <RoyK> also good :)
356[02:30:32] <roylaprattep> itd for redundancy
357[02:30:35] <roylaprattep> its*
358[02:30:46] <RoyK> (or it's)
359[02:30:51] <roylaprattep> hehe
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361[02:31:08] <roylaprattep> rsync keep cares of my backup.
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363[02:31:25] <RoyK> to some other machine nearby?
364[02:31:33] <roylaprattep> a nas, yes.
365[02:31:36] <RoyK> I use rclone -> jotta
366[02:31:56] <RoyK> and some local stuff
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384[02:48:58] <roylaprattep> i am hesitatingto proceed to the dist-upgrade, dunno why, i always hate this
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386[02:49:38] <roylaprattep> and now that buster is nearly out, gonna have to do it 2 times haha.
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390[02:50:15] <dvs> what wrong with a dist-upgrade on the same release.
391[02:50:21] <annadane> don't worry, it's just like learning how to ride a bicycle and if you can't do that, i'm sorry, i can't help you
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397[02:54:57] <roylaprattep> annadane: Did I ask for help? No.
398[02:55:57] <annadane> i'm just being silly
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411[03:03:08] <RoyK> roylaprattep: it usually works out well
412[03:03:18] <RoyK> roylaprattep: but don't blame me if it doesn't ;)
413[03:03:54] <RoyK> roylaprattep: I haven't had any failures lately - from jessie to stretch
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417[03:07:13] <roylaprattep> ok thx
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445[03:45:37] <viaken> I accidentally ctrl-z'd while dpkg was showing a "configuring" prompt and now I can't get anything back. fg doesn't show anything, keys/ctrl-c doesn't do anything. All I can do is ctrl-z and fg again.
446[03:45:45] <viaken> Where do I go from here?
447[03:46:19] <Mr_Queue> just run it again?
448[03:46:39] <Mr_Queue> it will probably tell you how to proceed
449[03:46:44] <viaken> Well, I'll have to kill the first process and remove the lockfiles. I'd prefer to not, but if that's what needs doing.
450[03:46:58] <Mr_Queue> I don't think it will matter much.
451[03:47:21] <Mr_Queue> I think it will tell you to add --fix-broken or something to it.
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466[03:58:29] <t3st3r> viaken> you can re-configure package, just in case.
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468[03:59:56] <GenTooMan> why does apt-get need to remove ALL 64bit versions of python to install python:i386?
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471[04:02:13] <viaken> t3st3r: Yeah, I killed it, reconfigured, and am back up and running. Thanks!
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473[04:02:41] <luciano> olá
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477[04:05:22] <annadane> !es
478[04:05:22] <dpkg> Este canal es de soporte técnico en Inglés para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en Español, puede ingresar en #debian-es tecleando /join #debian-es en la línea de chat.
479[04:05:27] <annadane> luciano, ^
480[04:05:31] <annadane> !pt
481[04:05:31] <dpkg> Por favor use #debian-pt para ajuda em portugues ou #debian-br para ajuda em portugues do brasil. ( /join #debian-pt )
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492[04:10:27] <themill> GenTooMan: the binary names are not arch-dependent (it's just /usr/bin/python etc) and so you can't have multiple archs of the same package installed. I can't imagine why you'd want to either
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495[04:12:51] <sincere_fox> why does buster includes a dark-mode installer on the very first boot menu?
496[04:13:35] <annadane> because everything should be in dark mode, otherwise it makes people blind
497[04:13:49] <annadane> more seriously, i don't know, probably just a quality of life thing
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501[04:17:22] <karlpinc> I downloaded the pxeboot installer and it's giving me the option to install buster, which is what I want anyway. Any reason the installer installing buster would cause problems?
502[04:17:27] <sincere_fox> annadane: yeah I guess so too
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505[04:18:05] <sincere_fox> low memory mode is english only ( installer )
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514[04:23:45] <GenTooMan> themill I see, I am learning about the interesting things debian does the hard way... apparently. I'll need to figure out a different way to do things.
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528[04:42:52] <phillw> Hi folks, long story cut short... new computer and installing make... Now at the point where the following happens: replaced-url
529[04:42:52] <phillw> an attempt to check gives me: replaced-url
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532[04:45:48] <zophyx> i have galliumos 3 installed on my chromebook, does debian support the acer cb3-532 hardware so i can boot a live debian flash and install debian from it ?
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534[04:46:09] <zophyx> i know i can boot from a flash drive
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537[04:48:14] <roylaprattep> phillw: libkeybinder0
538[04:48:24] <roylaprattep> try to install this one
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541[04:51:04] <phillw> zophyx: have a read through replaced-url
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543[04:52:10] <phillw> roylaprattep: libkeybinder0 is already the newest version (0.3.1-1)
544[04:52:22] <karlpinc> phillw: You need to install the *-dev package to get the libraries headers and whatnot you need for compliation.
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548[04:53:52] <phillw> karlpinc: any particular one?.. replaced-url
549[04:54:23] <phillw> one of the things aptitude can do that apt cannot :P
550[04:54:44] <roylaprattep> libkeybinder-3.0-dev try this one it will work phillw
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552[04:56:03] <phillw> roylaprattep: libkeybinder-3.0-dev is already the newest version (0.3.2-1).
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554[04:56:35] <roylaprattep> the thing you try to install probably not looking in the right path then
555[04:56:37] <karlpinc> zophyx: If you can run live you can install debian. But you'd better be sure all the hardware works. Just what firmware and drivers or what not is installed matters, although the installer (especially the one with non-free-firmware included) should just do the right thing.
556[04:56:50] <zophyx> phillw, yes, but chromeos no longer exists on this laptop, so i'm wondering if just booting a live flash installer would work..
557[04:57:22] <zophyx> phillw, we cross talked a bit..
558[04:58:08] <roylaprattep> phillw: libkeybinder-dev
559[04:58:17] <roylaprattep> have you installed this one?
560[04:59:05] <zophyx> phillw, yep, that's the issue, the hardware, i've heard that galliumos mods have made it into mainstream
561[04:59:47] <zophyx> so to speak :)
562[05:01:06] <phillw> roylaprattep: thanks, another dependancy bites the dust... next up is libcurl development files .... Remind me to NEVER replace my computer!!!
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566[05:02:17] <roylaprattep> phillw: np
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569[05:02:44] <annadane> phillw, never replace your computer
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571[05:03:58] <phillw> annadane: I usually just slot the HDD in, but with all the messing about with interface names the new one refused to connect by WiFi...
572[05:04:04] <dvs> 83 bugs
573[05:04:17] * dvs unplugs reportbug
574[05:04:50] * annadane hooks up reportbug to the solar panels
575[05:05:36] <annadane> i kinda wanted to update to buster now but i'll wait just so it's as unbroken as can be :P
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578[05:13:12] <phillw> annadane: one of the guys on my system went to install buster, but then decided to give alpine a play :P
579[05:14:06] <t3st3r> * annadane hooks up reportbug to the solar panels <- so you it like something like web interface, with stats, etc?
580[05:14:09] <phillw> he changes OS more often than having meals it seems at times. So he has been taught how to do it
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586[05:16:58] <Arnold_X-P> hi
587[05:17:11] <dvs> goodbye! ;-P
588[05:17:52] <Arnold_X-P> I have an error in an installation, Can somebody help me
589[05:18:10] <dvs> Nope, we're not psychic
590[05:18:24] <annadane> they're going to think you're serious if you say that
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592[05:18:30] <annadane> Arnold_X-P, of course, go ahead
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594[05:18:48] <vibewill> Arnold_X-P: hello
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596[05:19:09] <Arnold_X-P> hi hi
597[05:19:28] <Arnold_X-P> try to install inspircd and I get this error
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600[05:19:57] <Arnold_X-P> irclatin@localhost:~/inspircd-2.0.18$ ./configure
601[05:19:57] <Arnold_X-P> Can't locate make/utilities.pm in @INC (you may need to install the make::utilities module) (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.24.1 /usr/local/share/perl/5.24.1 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl5/5.24 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl/5.24 /usr/share/perl/5.24 /usr/local/lib/site_perl /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/perl-base) at ./configure line 48.
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604[05:20:14] <annadane> try installing make
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606[05:20:44] <Arnold_X-P> apt-get install make
607[05:20:45] <Arnold_X-P> ?
608[05:20:49] <annadane> yep
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611[05:21:31] <Arnold_X-P> root@localhost:~# apt-get install make
612[05:21:31] <Arnold_X-P> Reading package lists... Done
613[05:21:31] <Arnold_X-P> Building dependency tree
614[05:21:31] <Arnold_X-P> Reading state information... Done
615[05:21:31] <Arnold_X-P> make is already the newest version (4.1-9.1).
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621[05:22:06] <Arnold_X-P> make is already the newest version (4.1-9.1).
622[05:22:06] <Arnold_X-P> The following package was automatically installed and is no longer required:
623[05:22:06] <Arnold_X-P> zlib1g-dev
624[05:22:06] <Arnold_X-P> Use 'apt autoremove' to remove it.
625[05:22:20] <Arnold_X-P> apt autoremove zlib1g-dev
626[05:22:22] <Arnold_X-P> ?
627[05:22:28] <annadane> in future, use paste.debian.net for long pastes
628[05:22:30] <annadane> but let me see...
629[05:22:35] <fraktor> I just recently switched from Fedora to Debian, and now all the commands in my ~/.profile file are not loaded. How can I configure my system to load this when I log in?
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632[05:23:39] <karlpinc> fraktor: You probably want to add a line like: source ~/.profile to ~/.bash_profile
633[05:23:49] <annadane> by the way, first of all, do you need to compile it? inspircd exists in the debian repo
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635[05:24:14] <karlpinc> fraktor: Or maybe ~/.bashrc would be better... I forget. (You could read the bash man page....)
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637[05:24:42] <annadane> sorry; "install make" was stupid advice, i really should have read more closely
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639[05:24:49] <annadane> that's my fault
640[05:25:47] <fraktor> karlpinc: Do most display managers read from ~/.bash_profile?
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642[05:26:11] <dcarmich> I've been working with an unattended-install script, and am able to get my script to copy my custom first-boot script to /root in my preseed file. But, I haven't been able to get the script to execute automatically during the installation process. Currently, I'm using: "d-i preseed/late_command string /bin/cp /cdrom/preseed/ncc-set-hostname.sh /target/root" in my preseed file. What do I need to add to successfully execute that
643[05:26:12] <dcarmich> script during the install process, or if that's not possible, on first boot?
644[05:26:41] <Arnold_X-P> help me solve the problem please
645[05:26:49] <fh388> Can you help me anyway?
646[05:27:06] <fh388> Can you help me anyway?
647[05:27:54] <fh388> How to corriger error apt-build world
648[05:28:16] <fraktor> fh388: What is the error?
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650[05:28:33] <annadane> Arnold_X-P, i guess what you're trying to compile requires a perl module and apparently the way to do this is perl -MCPAN -e 'install make::utilities' as per replaced-url
651[05:28:39] <fh388> He does not update
652[05:29:30] <fraktor> fh388: What are you trying to do?
653[05:29:44] <Arnold_X-P> :/
654[05:30:40] <jmcnaught> fraktor: I use gdm3 and GNOME/wayland and both ~/.profile and ~/.bashrc are read for me. bash(1) INVOCATION section explains which files bash executes. tl;dr is *profile is for login shells, *bashrc is for interactive shells.
655[05:30:48] <fh388> fraktor:
656[05:30:49] <fh388> Update the system
657[05:31:01] <fh388> Using apt-build
658[05:31:32] <annadane> i wonder if that requires root, installing modules in perl
659[05:31:44] <sincere_fox> the installer in low memory mode in virtualbox at the point where it ask for reading more cd/dvd, the frames of the ncurses installer become a lot of characters and the info can't be seen well.
660[05:31:52] <sincere_fox> Buster
661[05:32:12] <jmcnaught> Arnold_X-P: why don't you install the Debian package? "apt-get install inspircd"
662[05:32:25] <annadane> i did ask whether he needed to compile specifically
663[05:32:34] <fraktor> fh388: shouldn't that be "sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade"? Why would apt-build come into it?
664[05:33:03] <Arnold_X-P> yes annadane is root
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666[05:33:14] <Arnold_X-P> root@localhost:~#
667[05:33:35] <annadane> that isn't what i asked, though, but anyway...
668[05:33:37] <fh388> fraktor: To recompile system
669[05:33:47] <cam3lto3> hello, i just compiled python 3.7.3, how can i make that my default python version on debian 9?
670[05:33:52] <annadane> do you need to compile inspircd? can't just install it via apt?
671[05:34:03] <annadane> cam3lto3, not a good idea to do that
672[05:34:14] <Arnold_X-P> yes in user irclatin (no root)
673[05:34:17] <Arnold_X-P> irclatin@localhost:~/inspircd-2.0.18$
674[05:34:27] <jmcnaught> cam3lto3: don't change the default python on Debian, system utilities rely on the system python. Put your compiled python in /opt or $HOME
675[05:34:43] <fh388> fraktor:
676[05:34:51] <fh388> fraktor: apt-build would look like gentoo portage
677[05:34:51] <roylaprattep> cam3lto3: if you want to break your system, thats a good way
678[05:35:12] <annadane> Arnold_X-P, no, forget all that. i just went on the assumption you were compiling this program instead of installing it via apt for a reason (and we're asking you, do you need to do this?), and i just wondered aloud whether one needs to be root to add perl modules
679[05:35:14] <annadane> ignore all that
680[05:35:49] <annadane> if you just need the program in general, fine, install it via apt. if you need a newer version for some reason, say so, and we can work from there
681[05:35:56] <jmcnaught> ,v inspircd
682[05:35:57] <judd> Package: inspircd on amd64 -- jessie: 2.0.17-1+deb8u2; jessie-security: 2.0.17-1+deb8u2; stretch: 2.0.23-2; buster: 2.0.27-1; sid: 2.0.27-1
683[05:36:51] <Arnold_X-P> How do I install the perl module? in root
684[05:36:57] <jmcnaught> Arnold_X-P: see ^^ the version of inspircd in Debian stable is higher than the one you're trying to compile from source. Why do you need to compile an old version from source when a newer version has a package?
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688[05:38:36] <fh388> I use debian testing
689[05:38:52] <jmcnaught> sincere_fox: did you look to see if this bug is already reported for buster? replaced-url
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692[05:39:15] <jmcnaught> fh388: why recompile your system? Nobody on Debian does that.
693[05:39:22] <annadane> quite often, people find the programs that come in debian stable by default (inspircd being one of them) are good enough for their purposes and needing oher versions is generally unnecessary
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698[05:41:32] <annadane> and if not, most important things are backported
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700[05:42:15] <fh388> Usually I used gentoo
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703[05:43:25] <fh388> I found it fantastic apt-build
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706[05:43:47] <fh388> But it contains bugs
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708[05:44:11] <jmcnaught> fh388: you're allowed to enter more than five words per line :)
709[05:44:18] <annadane> it's fine if you do need an older or newer inspircd but let's determine that first so we minimize the work you need to do
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721[05:48:26] <annadane> if you're trying to compile an older inspircd because some website says "requires inspircd such and such version" it probably means minimum version below which something can't run, not "you need this specific version"
722[05:48:40] <jelly> ,v inspircd
723[05:48:41] <judd> Package: inspircd on amd64 -- jessie: 2.0.17-1+deb8u2; jessie-security: 2.0.17-1+deb8u2; stretch: 2.0.23-2; buster: 2.0.27-1; sid: 2.0.27-1
724[05:49:05] <annadane> like a website saying this program requires windows 7 doesn't mean it will only run on windows 7 but that you need at least windows 7 and not older
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728[05:52:32] <Arnold_X-P> inspircd-2.0.27 that version is installing very well
729[05:52:39] <Arnold_X-P> thanks all :D
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734[05:58:19] <annadane> i'm an idiot and i handled that question terribly =/
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737[06:00:28] <dgriffi> I followed replaced-url
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740[06:01:36] <jelly> dgriffi: where have they gone in the first place? Which Debian release?
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743[06:02:35] <dgriffi> testing (aka 10, aka buster)
744[06:02:42] *** Quits: preview (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
745[06:02:53] <dgriffi> jelly: I switch to a VC and I see just a blinking cursor
746[06:03:03] <jelly> and when you press enter?
747[06:03:07] <dgriffi> nothing
748[06:03:36] <jelly> was this an initial installation of buster or a release upgrade from stretch?
749[06:03:53] <dgriffi> clean install
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753[06:05:23] <jelly> dgriffi: what does "systemctl status getty@tty1.service" say
754[06:05:24] <jelly> !paste
755[06:05:25] <dpkg> Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: replaced-url
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760[06:08:32] <dgriffi> replaced-url
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762[06:08:50] * dgriffi likes pastebinit(1)
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764[06:09:28] <jelly> dgriffi: can you start that service manually?
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768[06:13:21] <dgriffi> tried. doesn't work
769[06:13:41] <jelly> dgriffi: what about systemctl status system-getty.slice
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775[06:18:47] <ranix> I don't know what the fuck is wrong with you package maintainers but a dist-upgrade from oldstable to stable fucks up libc6 and installs a version of libz that depends on a version of glibc not installed yet
776[06:19:10] <ranix> breaking wget, curl, apt, aptitude, and dpkg
777[06:19:28] <ranix> you fucking sacks of shit need to spend more time performing package maintenance and less time arguing about inclusiver terms
778[06:19:34] <jelly> ranix: calm your tits and show the actual output
779[06:19:35] <ranix> fuck you and the horse you rode in on
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781[06:20:31] <roylaprattep> hahahahah
782[06:20:38] <jelly> dependencies are there to prevent such things from happening
783[06:20:41] <roylaprattep> jesus-christ
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785[06:22:12] <jelly> or join, rant and leave, that is fine too
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810[06:45:33] <cybercrypto> hehehe
811[06:45:50] <dgriffi> jelly: replaced-url
812[06:45:53] <cybercrypto> unfortunatelly, it happens sometimes....
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833[07:01:04] <phillw> hi folks, well I have the .deb using checkinstall which duly made the .deb and installed it. Would Debreate be a better option to *just* create the .deb ?
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841[07:07:50] <phillw> roylaprattep: any views on ^^ ?
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962[08:37:45] <halt> Just found out that the python3.4 package security patch version 3.4.2-1+deb8u3 from the jessie/updates/main repo, is broken where can I report this ?
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970[08:38:58] <halt> the error btw replaced-url
971[08:39:12] <han-solo> Who uses 3.4 :)
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973[08:40:03] <han-solo> i was just kidding
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994[08:56:08] <blackflow> halt: replaced-url
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996[08:57:37] <halt> Thx I found it replaced-url
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998[08:58:22] <halt> severity -1 critical, so I guess it should be fixed soon
999[08:58:39] <han-solo> Yep
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1034[09:29:17] <GNU\colossus> huh. upgrading python-3.4 on jessie:i386 broke /usr/lib/python3.4/http/client.py for me
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1036[09:30:04] <GNU\colossus> replaced-url
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1040[09:31:17] <Orbstheorem> Hey, I just read about the planned release in two weeks ^^
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1043[09:32:09] <Orbstheorem> Where can I find the release notes? if/when it is released.
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1050[09:38:41] <blackflow> GNU\colossus: replaced-url
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1075[09:52:40] <KOJIbKA> Hi all! Do I have to worry if by some chanse there is no cursor present upon successfull login to GNOME DE in stable Debian? To correct the issue all I have to do is to logout/login again. But still. Do I have to worry?
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1085[10:02:57] <KOJIbKA> anyone?
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1099[10:09:28] <blackflow> KOJIbKA: Ordinarily I would, but this being gnome, it sounds.... like something I'd expect of it. So I don't use gnome. :) Sorry, no better answer from me.
1100[10:10:53] <J_C> blackflow: Out of pure curiosity, what do you use instead? :P
1101[10:11:29] <blackflow> i3
1102[10:11:47] <andi89gi> anybody know if Debian is going to stop 32bit support in the future? I'm asking bc of ruuning Steam on Debian and Valve stopps the support on Ubuntu.
1103[10:12:16] <blackflow> yeah it's not a desktop but a WM, but that's the thing. traditional desktop UI paradigms get in my way. Being a long time vim user, I like the environment where everything is keyboard based.
1104[10:12:40] <blackflow> andi89gi: "in the future"? yes. When? nobody knows, but probably not so soon.
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1106[10:12:55] <J_C> blackflow: to each their own :)
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1109[10:13:13] <J_C> whatever works for you, is what I say
1110[10:13:18] <blackflow> J_C: but if I were to use desktop, I'd prefer the simplicity of xfce.
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1114[10:14:25] <J_C> blackflow: oh yes, that is a popular choice. i'm not on debian right now, but as soon as debian 10 releases, I'll be switching to that and installing KDE Plasma
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1117[10:15:10] <b1nny> Hello, I seem to be getting a Python syntax error when upgrading the python3.4 package on Debian Jessie to 3.4.2-1+deb8u3
1118[10:15:51] <andi89gi> blackflow: ah okay - yeah I don't think it will stop the support in the common 2 years...; but I hope if the time comes Wine/Steam support will be granted on Debian in order to run Steam games ;)
1119[10:16:08] <blackflow> J_C: I used gnome shell a lot, especially in the early days. unlike the popular hate of it, the change in ui paradigm was actually welcome to me. meta key bringing out that dash, and you could start typing right away... something kde (which I used before that) didn't have at the time
1120[10:16:16] <b1nny> this is the error that occurs: replaced-url
1121[10:16:32] <b1nny> this is the package from security.debian.org
1122[10:16:59] <blackflow> andi89gi: btw, dunno if you heard the news but Ubuntu reversed the decision and will continue supporting 32-bit for WINE and Steam (and maybe some other stuff too, they'll be polling the community, they said)
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1124[10:17:29] <KOJIbKA> J_C: there's no trace of cursor but otherwise everything is operational. So using resulting interface output I try to navigate to Logout and then Login back. Everything turns back to normal.
1125[10:17:32] <blackflow> b1nny: replaced-url
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1127[10:18:22] <b1nny> blackflow: ah awesome, thanks! :)
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1129[10:18:50] <J_C> blackflow: i used GNOME for quite some time and liked the way I could do what you mention, but I always needed that dash-to-dock extension. Then, I enjoyed it a lot. Old habits die hard though and I always find myself coming back to Plasma 5. Or XFCE. XFCE recently published a release candidate for 4.14 as well
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1133[10:19:56] <andi89gi> blackflow: ah ok that's great! But Debian is Debian ;) and Ubuntu well ...
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1137[10:21:29] <J_C> andi89gi: A lot of people have been looking to Debian after the news of Ubuntu dropping 32bit libraries, myself included. I use Debian already but I figured that the 32bit library decision would give me perfect incentive to go Debian full-time. That's probably why he's mentioning it :P
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1143[10:26:29] <KOJIbKA> b1nny: what about this error?
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1145[10:27:07] <b1nny> KOJIbKA: I'm running into it :) and it prevents me from upgrading, and seems to break a bunch of python scripts for me
1146[10:27:21] <b1nny> but the bug has been reported already, see the link b lackflow posted
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1148[10:27:39] <KOJIbKA> b1nny: it did crush my browser
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1156[10:32:09] <han-solo> raise InvalidURL(f"URL can't contain control characters. {url!r} " # are those `f-strings`. What the heck ? Those were not implemented until 3.6 :/
1157[10:32:18] <KOJIbKA> b1nny: all of them actually
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1161[10:33:20] <andi89gi> J_C: yeah, I share your opinion and for sure I've used to use Ubuntu as well as one of my first Linux distros. After testing and using others. Finally I always come back to Debian bc it's stable, good workflow etc
1162[10:33:52] <blackflow> yeah, there's no NIH-soft-vendor-lockdown in Debian :)
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1165[10:34:08] <b1nny> han-solo: yap haha :D
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1168[10:35:10] <themill> yes, yay for completely untested upload to jessie-lts.
1169[10:37:12] <J_C> andi89gi: currently I'm on (K)ubuntu and it has been hassle free but I've also found that Debian Stable also has a lack of hassle for me too, so I use that on one of my other machines too. I'd like to go full Debian though, and will be doing that when Debian 10 hits soon so I can have recent software versions that I'm at least used to :P
1170[10:37:44] <themill> (and yeah, time to upgrade to a supported release)
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1178[10:43:24] <andi89gi> J_C: okay I see :-) True I use Debian 10 (still testing) but 6th July is not so far anymore :D It's really working fine on my daily machine.
1179[10:44:22] <J_C> andi89gi: oh yeah, I tested out debian 10 after the first freeze and I liked it. I just prefer to wait for the full release because I am odd :P
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1182[10:44:39] <themill> There's not much likely to change between now and then
1183[10:44:55] <blackflow> and it's in full freeze by now, no?
1184[10:45:28] <blackflow> oh yeah, since march lol.
1185[10:45:51] <andi89gi> J_C; ah okay I see. Yeah, no worries for waiting for the official release ;)
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1317[12:05:43] <Eryn_1983_FL> hi peeps
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1319[12:05:49] <ntz> hello
1320[12:05:49] <Eryn_1983_FL> how to keep messages out of /var/log/messages in rsyslog
1321[12:05:52] <ntz> eg I have md0/md1 aka sdaN+sdbN UU now set sdb to --fail so it displays as U_ in /proc/mdstat and I want to reboot on next boot that sdb will be active and sda failed (_U)
1322[12:05:59] <ntz> in theory .. how do I properly boot a remote system from md0/md1 disk that I previously set to be --fail ? (for backup for example)
1323[12:06:07] *** Parts: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip) ("vergissmeinnicht")
1324[12:06:08] <Eryn_1983_FL> i tried & stop on a bottom line but thats not working
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1327[12:06:33] <Eryn_1983_FL> & stop
1328[12:07:04] <Eryn_1983_FL> and i updated my generic line too *.info;authpriv.none;mail.none;cron.none;local1.none;local2.none;local3.none action(type="omfile" File="/var/log/messages")
1329[12:07:24] <Eryn_1983_FL> nothing seems to be preventing the logs from going into mesages or the log file numbered after...
1330[12:07:52] <Eryn_1983_FL> im running rsyslog.x86_64 8.34.0-2.el7.centos @rsyslog_v8
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1333[12:08:58] <blackflow> Eryn_1983_FL: and we're supposed to know about centos variant of rsyslog and what's specific to it?
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1336[12:09:12] <Eryn_1983_FL> lolol
1337[12:09:20] <Eryn_1983_FL> sorry im so use of coming here
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1341[12:11:19] <blackflow> ntz: if you --fail a member of md, it won't be used. so by "boot ... from" you can only talk about booting off of an md (and its active members), unless you're talking about early stages that don't consider raid yet? like bios_grub partition and all that
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1410[13:15:57] <j_wrok> snmpd: error on subcontainer 'ia_addr' insert (-1)
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1413[13:16:41] <j_wrok> snmpd: error on subcontainer 'ia_addr' insert (-1)
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1415[13:17:07] <j_wrok> snmpd: error on subcontainer 'ia_addr' insert (-1)
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1420[13:21:12] <j_wrok> snmpd: error on subcontainer 'ia_addr' insert (-1)
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1471[13:50:34] <mschorm> Hi folks. I'm a visitor from a different distribution. Can you please tell me, where Debian and Ubuntu license files of the installed packages are located in the OS?
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1473[13:52:00] <Habbie> mschorm, in /usr/share/doc/<pkgname>
1474[13:53:28] <mschorm> Thanks!
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1535[14:26:34] <jelly> mschorm: hiding in the file named "copyright" there
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1540[14:28:57] <mschorm> Okay, thanks. I was just seeking the difference in the path. We have "/usr/share/licenses/<pkgname>" in Fedora
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1577[14:51:56] <Kali_noob> /join #offsec
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1600[15:07:55] <BCMM> mschorm: by the way, you can list files a packages installed with `dpkg -L <package name>`. that will include docs and licensing files.
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1611[15:12:16] <ultrashell> hi
1612[15:12:29] <xormor> ultrashell, hi
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1616[15:15:30] <timdau> The latest jessie python3.4 package is uninstallable due to the CVE-2019-9740 patch
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1618[15:16:16] <timdau> "python3.4.postinst" gives the error:
1619[15:16:18] <timdau> File "/usr/lib/python3.4/http/client.py", line 1014
1620[15:16:20] <timdau> raise InvalidURL(f"URL can't contain control characters. {url!r} "
1621[15:16:22] <timdau> ^
1622[15:16:24] <timdau> SyntaxError: invalid syntax
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1627[15:17:12] <timdau> didn't feel like a flood :) Anyway, what steps do I do to resolve this?
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1629[15:17:22] <windchime> timdau, I have the same problem - what can we do?
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1631[15:18:31] <timdau> if you are doing it by hand you can commend out the lines around 1014
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1633[15:18:36] <timdau> not sure the implications
1634[15:19:18] <timdau> I am sure they aren't good
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1638[15:21:06] <windchime> # Prevent CVE-2019-9740.LINE 1012 match = _contains_disallowed_url_pchar_re.search(url)LINE 1013 if match: LINE 1014 raise InvalidURL(f"URL can't contain control characters. {url!r} " f"(found at least {match.group()!r})")
1639[15:21:06] <windchime> 1016 request = '%s %s %s' % (method, url, self._http_vsn_str)
1640[15:21:08] <timdau> replaced-url
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1642[15:21:35] <windchime> wHAT IS cve_2019-9740???
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1645[15:22:14] <hwm4rgs> windchime: replaced-url
1646[15:22:20] <timdau> looks like there is a patch coming down the shoot
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1648[15:22:29] <themill> you need to wait for an updated python3.4 package or downgrade it
1649[15:22:32] <timdau> based on bug 931044
1650[15:22:40] <greycat> (chute)
1651[15:22:49] <hwm4rgs> python3.4 is eol anyways
1652[15:23:19] <windchime> themill, How do you 'downgrade' an update?
1653[15:23:26] <greycat> by hand
1654[15:23:27] <themill> hwm4rgs: jessie is not going to magically pick up python3.7 however
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1656[15:24:07] <timdau> windchime: read the bug and apply the patch manually. Then upgrade in a couple days
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1658[15:25:03] <windchime> timdau, o~k~~~~? never done this before....
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1664[15:25:59] <Tenkawa> bbialw
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1668[15:28:29] <hwm4rgs> themill: doesn't mean 3.4 is any less eol
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1689[15:45:04] <han-solo> it's either 2.7 or 3.6
1690[15:45:10] <han-solo> nothing else :)
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1701[15:50:49] <ayekat> well, it's going to be 3.7 in buster :-)
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1703[15:51:26] <han-solo> Yeah
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1706[15:52:20] <greycat> and a few months after buster's release, I'm sure we'll be flooded with people demanding a newer python or PHP version
1707[15:52:41] <han-solo> haha
1708[15:53:09] <han-solo> i think, 3.6 can run for enough time, anyway, there's beta for 3.8, i guess, so might as well start using 3.7
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1711[15:54:04] <finn0> When I'm trying to compile a tex file but getting this (replaced-url
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1722[16:02:30] <finn0> seems like I've to install texlive-full package.
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1731[16:10:05] <horribleprogram> What's this Filesystem ID and how does it differ from EUID/UID?
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1738[16:11:20] <horribleprogram> I get when a process needs to read a file, the kernel checks the permissions of the file, EUID/GUID of the process, and determines whether the process is allowed to open it
1739[16:11:49] <horribleprogram> I just don't understand where this other ID fits into that
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1741[16:12:03] <greycat> If /var is a separate file system, it has a different file system ID from /
1742[16:12:25] <horribleprogram> greycat: ahh, so the filesystem ID corresponds to filesystems
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1744[16:12:41] <greycat> When something like find(1) is recursing down, and you use the -xdev option to force it to remain in one file system, and it encounters a new file system ID as it's recursing, it stops pursuing that branch.
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1746[16:13:19] <horribleprogram> so why does a process have a filesystem id
1747[16:13:38] <greycat> What observations have led you to form this belief?
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1749[16:13:58] <horribleprogram> Chapter.4 of UNIX and Linux System Administration Handbook
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1751[16:14:12] <horribleprogram> "Linux also defines a nonstandard FSUID process parameter that controls the determination of filesystem permissions..."
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1753[16:14:36] <greycat> Parameter to *what*?
1754[16:14:46] <horribleprogram> an attribute process
1755[16:14:51] <greycat> A what?
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1757[16:14:58] <jezebel> man 2 setfsuid
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1759[16:15:11] <horribleprogram> a process has a bunch of attributes associated with it, PID, PPID, UID/EUID, GID/EGID, etc.
1760[16:15:17] <horribleprogram> kk lemme read that
1761[16:15:41] <greycat> So you're not even using the right *words*. No wonder.
1762[16:15:53] <greycat> A file system ID is not the same as this FSUID thing which is a "file system user ID".
1763[16:16:03] <horribleprogram> oh :P
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1766[16:16:44] <horribleprogram> okay the man page clarified it a bit, when you set a fsuid, you're basically elevating or declining your access permissions
1767[16:17:01] <greycat> More like mapping.
1768[16:17:08] <horribleprogram> it shadows the EUID in terms of accessing files
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1771[16:17:24] <greycat> "user 1000 on this system is considered to be user 5552 for purposes of accessing this one specific remote file system"
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1773[16:17:32] <horribleprogram> ^
1774[16:17:33] <horribleprogram> yes
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1776[16:18:14] <greycat> As opposed to "file system ID" which you can see with e.g. stat -c %i (see stat(1))
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1781[16:19:22] <phil_azing> I want to set up upnp on my firewall and I am having problems with miniupnpd working with shorewall. Does anyone have the combination working?
1782[16:19:23] <greycat> actually make that stat --file-system -c %i
1783[16:19:52] <horribleprogram> greycat: I was going to say it says missing operand :P
1784[16:20:09] <horribleprogram> same error :'(
1785[16:20:10] <greycat> Really? On buster it just gives me the inode number instead of the file system ID.
1786[16:20:21] <greycat> With --file-system I get the file system ID.
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1788[16:20:42] <greycat> Same on stretch.
1789[16:20:51] <horribleprogram> stat --version -> stat (GNU coreutils) 8.30
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1794[16:21:38] <greycat> wooledg:~$ stat --file-system -c %i /
1795[16:21:38] <greycat> a4d060efa43af1e6
1796[16:21:51] <greycat> Maybe you forgot to give it the file name.
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1801[16:22:30] <horribleprogram> I did :P
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1807[16:23:44] <horribleprogram> 6b64eca1c1288bc3
1808[16:24:15] <horribleprogram> so basically, every file/directory on my filesystem will have this Id?
1809[16:24:16] <greycat> You should get the same file system ID for every node within that file system, and a different file system ID for any node on a different file system.
1810[16:25:02] <horribleprogram> kk
1811[16:25:15] <greycat> This has nothing to do with FSUID. It's just a side panel discussion.
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1814[16:25:55] <horribleprogram> yup, this number is called the FSID?
1815[16:26:08] <greycat> It's called the file system ID.
1816[16:26:15] <horribleprogram> kk
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1818[16:26:45] <greycat> if you just use stat --file-system / without -c, it's labeled "ID:"
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1820[16:27:28] <horribleprogram> greycat: will different partitions have a different ID?
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1822[16:28:05] <greycat> 10:24 greycat> You should get the same file system ID for every node within that file system, and a different file system ID for any node on a different file system.
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1824[16:28:57] <horribleprogram> *sigh* idk if I'm about to get kicked or not
1825[16:29:00] <horribleprogram> what's a "filesystem"
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1827[16:29:28] <jezebel> (and here i was thinking filesystem id as in the partition's filesystem identifier, (e.g. 0xEF for EFI, 0x83 for Linux ones)
1828[16:29:39] <horribleprogram> /boot is on a different partition, in the same filesystem
1829[16:29:50] <somiaj> which is also different than the UUID, gotta love all these ids. (:
1830[16:29:56] <greycat> Does "df" show separate lines for / and /boot ?
1831[16:30:02] <greycat> If it does, those are two different file systems.
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1835[16:31:34] <horribleprogram> understood
1836[16:32:01] <horribleprogram> /dev would be Filesystem ID 0 always?
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1838[16:32:26] <greycat> All of the in-memory file systems presented by the kernel seem to have ID 0 for me. At least the ones I checked.
1839[16:32:39] <greycat> You'd have to ask a kernel channel for more details about those.
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1844[16:33:28] <horribleprogram> well that makes sense now
1845[16:33:42] <greycat> The important thing is that it's a different number from root's file system ID, so find -xdev will know to stop when it hits one.
1846[16:34:04] <horribleprogram> yeah
1847[16:34:11] <jezebel> (/dev doesnt actually exist, it's kernel data presented to you as files, because everything is a file)
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1849[16:34:26] <horribleprogram> I was always wondering stuff like "how does a device on the filesystem /dev/sda1 for example, be mounted on the filesystem as /")
1850[16:34:33] <horribleprogram> jezebel: yeah :P
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1853[16:34:54] <horribleprogram> /dev is a lie
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1855[16:35:03] <jezebel> amongst others :)
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1857[16:35:15] <greycat> /etc/fstab tells where to mount which things
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1861[16:37:35] <horribleprogram> last noob question
1862[16:37:55] <horribleprogram> shouldn't ls -l /dev/sda1 or w/e give you the same results as ls -l /
1863[16:38:04] <greycat> Nope.
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1865[16:38:41] <petn-randall> horribleprogram: The one is the device permissions, the other is the contents of the filesystem.
1866[16:38:48] <horribleprogram> I see
1867[16:39:17] <horribleprogram> /dev/sda1 isn't a directory
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1870[16:39:59] <greycat> /dev/sda1 is a "block device". Specifically it's one partition of a random-access storage device.
1871[16:40:41] <horribleprogram> why give us access to it as a file?
1872[16:40:44] <greycat> If you like analogies, /dev/sda1 is the canvas, and / is the painting.
1873[16:41:02] <horribleprogram> oh wait nvm
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1877[16:41:10] <horribleprogram> there's times you gotta identify it
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1879[16:41:16] <horribleprogram> it's better than using its UUID
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1881[16:41:32] <jezebel> uuid is best actually
1882[16:41:32] <greycat> Programs like mount and fsck need the device name.
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1884[16:41:59] <greycat> UUID is better because sda1 is not consistent across boots. Next time you boot, it could be sdb1 or sdc1.
1885[16:42:02] <jezebel> what gets allocated sda1 can depend on the driver
1886[16:42:32] <horribleprogram> very interesting
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1889[16:42:58] <horribleprogram> you said earlier about a kernel channel?
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1891[16:43:14] <greycat> ##linux or something with #kernel in its name
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1893[16:43:35] <greycat> if you have technical questions about why the file system ID of /proc is the same as that of /sys and /dev, for instance
1894[16:43:53] <jezebel> those are all virtual fs's :)
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1957[17:17:19] <Freneticks> how can I completly disable rsyslog ? (I only use systemd) since rsyslog.service have a socket activation by syslog.service ?
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1959[17:17:42] <greycat> mask it
1960[17:17:52] <Freneticks> mask ?
1961[17:18:06] <greycat> man systemctl
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1963[17:18:17] <square_batman> Or uninstall rsyslog?
1964[17:18:23] <Freneticks> thanks didnt know about mask
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1966[17:19:00] <Freneticks> yeah I will unsinstall it but not now
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2052[17:55:56] <annadane> is there a way to diagnose why vlc's volume is so low on MATE? the output levels are fine on pavucontrol and the MATE system volume is set to 100
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2056[17:57:50] <diogenes_> annadane, tried with mouse wheel?
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2058[17:58:15] <diogenes_> i mean on vlc window.
2059[17:58:38] <annadane> oh okay unplugging and replugging headphones works
2060[17:59:06] <annadane> i'd accidentally pressed volume up on my keyboard and i guess it doesn't reset until you do that
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2065[18:00:11] <annadane> killing pulseaudio didn't work but that does
2066[18:00:11] <diogenes_> or pulseaudio -k
2067[18:00:21] <diogenes_> ok
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2074[18:04:44] <embden> hello, is there a ML dedicated to selinux in debian?
2075[18:05:26] <petn-randall> !selinux
2076[18:05:27] <dpkg> Security Enhanced Linux (SELinux) is NSA's port of the FLASK Security Architecture to Linux. Also it can make your system unbootable if you uninstall it. Unofficial FAQ: replaced-url
2077[18:05:36] <petn-randall> embden: Seems as though there's only a general channel. ^^^
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2079[18:06:39] <embden> petn-randall: thanks, though I thought there is a team working on integrating selinux into debian
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2082[18:07:31] <blackflow> heh, I wish.
2083[18:07:44] <BCMM> replaced-url
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2086[18:08:14] <embden> BCMM: thansk
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2088[18:08:19] <embden> thanks
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2092[18:09:22] <petn-randall> embden: Given that apparmor is more supported, I'm not surprised that it's hardly used in Debian. Although it's an interesting goal.
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2095[18:11:25] <embden> petn-randall: I mean that selinux already can work to some extent in Linux, so, it means someone has already worked on it a bit, so I wondered maybe there is a team of those people. Anyway, I'll ask on #debian-security then
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2098[18:12:40] <petn-randall> embden: #d-security is mostly about security updates in Debian, but you can give it a try.
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2108[18:17:45] <j_wrok> snmpd: error on subcontainer 'ia_addr' insert (-1)
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2131[18:30:43] <lukinhas> test
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2192[18:56:51] <tsglove> I am trying out LVM, and added a new device /dev/sdb to my main (and only) logical volume group. This was a rough guide replaced-url
2193[18:57:15] <tsglove> After I did the resize2fs , I now have the additional space in the main partition.
2194[18:57:32] <tsglove> Yet, I have a n00b question: If I have LUKS on the original drive... this new partition, is it also encrypted with LUKS?
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2226[19:14:25] <zoredache> tsglove: kinda depends on how you setup luks.
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2228[19:15:08] <zoredache> If your original drive had a lvm inside a luks volume, and you added a PV to the LVM that wasn't in a luks container, then any LVs that are on the new PV wouldn't be encrypted.
2229[19:15:13] <tsglove> zoredache, when I initially setup this Debian9 machine, I selected whole disk encryption via LUKS. I didn't specify certain partitions.
2230[19:15:27] <tsglove> I am reading the Debian LVM wiki page now --> replaced-url
2231[19:15:35] <tsglove> see if I can better wrap my head around this =)
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2237[19:19:16] <zoredache> Right so the standard luks+lvm configuration creates a partition, and configures luks(dmcrypt) on that and LVM the LVM PV is the dmcrypt volume.
2238[19:20:00] <zoredache> so if you added a new PV that wasn't created in luks your LVM wouldn't be fully encrypted anymore.
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2260[19:28:10] <tsglove> zoredache, ahh... that... that clears up my confusion.
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2266[19:29:34] <tsglove> dang... so if everything were to be encrypted, it would be: attach new physical drive. Create luks (dmcrypt volume) on it. Open the crypt, then setup new LVM PV using that new /dev/mapper/xyz opened by dmcrypt
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2270[19:31:34] <zoredache> If I were doing it, I would add the new drive, create a partition on the drive, run cryptsetup on that new volume. Setup your /etc/crypttab so that new volume gets unlocked at boot. Reboot, then add that new PVM to lvm.
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2273[19:32:25] <zoredache> You can do it without the reboot, but IMO, you probably should do the reboot to verify that you have your crypttab working before you start using it. Else you might make your system unbootable.
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2279[19:34:13] <zoredache> Though if you don't need the new drive to be part of your main volume group, then you could just skip the LVM part and put your filesystem directly on the dmcrypt container
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2289[19:36:08] <zoredache> The annoying thing I believe is that you would be prompted at boot time for each volume I think if you tried to make them part of the same volume group.
2290[19:36:22] <jhutchins_wk> It seems like having an encrypted pv and an unencripted one in one LV would be a bad thing.
2291[19:36:39] <greycat> you mean in one VG? yeah, I kinda agree.
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2306[19:43:40] <karlpinc> It's nice having the PV encrypted, and then have multiple LVs so that only one unlocking is necessary no matter your partitioning. But what would happen if you added another PV? You can use dm to concatenate your underlying hardware into a single "device". Would adding more storage the the "end" of a LUKS encrypted device play nicely? That way you could add drives and still need only unlock once.
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2311[19:45:55] <kalpu> I'm using multistrap to create a armhf debian, but I do get: "The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 7638D0442B90D010 NO_PUBKEY 04EE7237B7D453EC" Any ideas?
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2327[19:54:17] <tsglove> Good info zoredache jhutchins_wk greycat and karlpinc. Thanks.
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2332[19:56:49] <zoredache> karlpinc: you could probably do that, but I doubt you could easily do that on a running system.
2333[19:57:25] <greycat> I really don't recommend concatenating multiple devices into a single PV. If either fails, the whole thing fails.
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2336[19:58:48] <velix> I'm on buster netinstall right now. Will it be hard to switch to final or do I just need to apt dist-upgrade?
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2339[19:59:05] <greycat> It will be utterly trivial.
2340[19:59:18] <velix> let me look up "utterly"
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2345[19:59:48] <velix> greycat: ah. Nice to hear :D
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2347[20:00:10] <humpled> :D
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2350[20:01:42] <velix> Etymology: From Old English ūtera, comparative of ūt (“out”). Compare outer.
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2437[20:43:58] <donofrio> how do I live change package/mirror signature issue? see replaced-url
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2441[20:46:05] <jelly> donofrio: if /target is mounted you can probably just put an exported public key ring as etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/foo.gpg
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2444[20:47:15] <donofrio> jelly, I can do that.... how do I get the gpg I need....its for ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports mirror
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2447[20:49:07] <jelly> that's probably covered somewhere in ports.d.o documentation, I don't know where exactly
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2449[20:49:25] <zoredache> you should be able to grab the key from the keyserver or something.
2450[20:49:29] <donofrio> not looking for quick answer just looking...
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2453[20:50:04] <jelly> donofrio: I'd try the ports.debian.org web site
2454[20:50:33] <donofrio> I did that is how I got the ftp.ports info
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2457[20:51:20] <jelly> donofrio: maybe scroll down a little bit
2458[20:51:22] <donofrio> I think I'm the first person trying to get debian 10 'sid' working on powerpc with ftp.ports.debian.org (they changed it from ports.debian.org
2459[20:51:23] <zoredache> The key seems to be part of the replaced-url
2460[20:51:32] <donofrio> ah ok
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2463[20:53:07] <jelly> it's not said explicitely anywhere on the page but there's a mention of a 2018 key and you can probably extrapolate the URL for 2019 key from that
2464[20:53:10] <jelly> replaced-url
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2467[20:53:47] <jelly> ,v debian-ports-archive-keyring
2468[20:53:48] <judd> Package: debian-ports-archive-keyring on amd64 -- jessie: 2015.01.28; stretch: 2016.11.28; buster: 2018.12.27; sid: 2018.12.27
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2483[21:01:51] <donofrio> unable to locate package "debian-ports-archive-keyring" from live installer netinstall cdrom session
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2507[21:11:37] <donofrio> but I can install things I belive but right now I'm getting - replaced-url
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2513[21:13:43] <somiaj> donofrio: you may want to comment out the cdrom sources (since there isn't much there) and only use the ports sources.
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2522[21:16:15] <jordila> Is it possible to get PHP7.3 on a Stretch machine ? How to ? I'm wondering... maybe it is via Buster backports ?
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2524[21:16:28] <donofrio> only one line in the sources.list
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2528[21:16:40] <greycat> !stretch sources.list
2529[21:16:40] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Stretch" has three lines: "deb replaced-url
2530[21:16:41] <donofrio> (it is a live install session after all)
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2532[21:17:15] <donofrio> and I just change debian.org to ports.debian.org
2533[21:17:35] <donofrio> what about for debian 10 'sid?'
2534[21:17:39] <greycat> jordila: if I had the profound misfortune to require php 7.3 I would either go to buster now (if risk is manageable) or just wait a week and a half for buster's formal release
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2537[21:18:18] <greycat> Debian 10 is buster, not sid.
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2540[21:18:32] * jordila didn't knew Buster is soon coming to town !
2541[21:18:37] <jordila> ah
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2548[21:20:26] <donofrio> why does the cd have sources stating 'sid main' ?
2549[21:20:43] <donofrio> OI'm changing to buster main just maiking sure I'm doing this correctly
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2558[21:24:52] <jim> donofrio, sid never gets released, so it isn't / won't be debian 10... instead, when the current testing (I guess buster) is released as debian 10, I guess what happens first, is current sid is copied to a new testing, and given a codename
2559[21:25:12] <greycat> "copied" isn't correct.
2560[21:25:38] <jim> what happens then?
2561[21:26:04] <donofrio> right this is what I did - replaced-url
2562[21:26:06] <greycat> Think symlinks. Right now, stable points to stretch, and testing points to buster. In two weeks, stable will point to buster, and testing will point to bullseye.
2563[21:26:31] <jim> 2 weeks :)
2564[21:26:41] <somiaj> jim: the current testing is coopied, not sid.
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2567[21:26:57] <somiaj> first bullseye is created as a copy of buster
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2570[21:27:16] <jim> what's testing copied to? stable?
2571[21:27:26] <somiaj> no
2572[21:27:39] <somiaj> at the moment of the release of buster, a copy of buster is made, and named bullseye
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2574[21:27:58] <somiaj> this new copy is called testing from that point onwards
2575[21:28:05] <jim> and I guess sid just continues to "leak" packages into testing when they have less bugs?
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2577[21:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1533
2578[21:29:26] <somiaj> jordila: not offically, but sury.org seems to be one of the better third party places (as it is created by a debian matainer of php packages), but is still thrid party (hence not supported here)
2579[21:29:39] <somiaj> oh it is deb.sury.org
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2584[21:31:09] <jim> donofrio, what overall situation are you trying to get to?
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2586[21:31:17] <nkuttler> is there an official release date?
2587[21:31:23] <greycat> !buster release
2588[21:31:23] <dpkg> Buster's release is planned for 2019-07-06 (replaced-url
2589[21:31:24] <somiaj> !buster release
2590[21:31:31] <somiaj> haha
2591[21:31:38] <Battaglin> 21:31:20 up 1513 days, 9:22, 1 user, load average: 0.60, 0.26, 0.18
2592[21:31:41] <Battaglin> debian ftw
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2594[21:32:02] <jim> dpkg not posting it twice for the win :)
2595[21:32:02] <dpkg> jim: I wish you would RTFM.
2596[21:32:02] <greycat> 4 years of kernel bugs
2597[21:32:05] <somiaj> jim: they are installing the unoffical powerpc port from ports.debian.org, which is a bit different than an offical release.
2598[21:32:27] <jim> oh ok
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2600[21:32:38] <jim> so he can't just go for a netinstall
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2607[21:35:10] <jmcnaught> Battaglin: I would reboot just to make sure it starts okay, which is better than finding it doesn't boot properly at some random time you're not prepared for it.
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2615[21:39:46] <Battaglin> jmcnaught: I have running backups
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2618[21:40:28] <Battaglin> when buster is out stable I'll most likely kill this anyway
2619[21:41:12] <Battaglin> still 79 issues to go :-(
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2624[21:43:57] <donofrio> jim, trying to finish my install on my powerpc hardware, I have the netinstall iso burned to cdrom and it's booted and working fine, it just seems to be missing the gpg for the mirror ftp.ports.debain.org/debian-ports/
2625[21:44:04] *** Joins: Smooth_Btm (~Mutter@replaced-ip)
2626[21:44:41] <greycat> make sure it's debian.org not debain.org
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2629[21:45:04] <donofrio> ;P that is why I included screenshot here ;)
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2632[21:46:07] <somiaj> donofrio: replaced-url
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2634[21:46:44] <donofrio> no cause I've yet to type wget on client just went looking for the key in a browser, where should I put the file on the client?
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2639[21:48:37] <donofrio> donofrio
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2642[21:49:29] <greycat> he's a pokémon!
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2646[21:51:09] <donofrio> somiaj, and it was jelly that gave me the replaced-url
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2661[21:52:45] <greycat> probably something involving "apt-key add"
2662[21:52:59] <donofrio> perfect
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2664[21:53:26] <Junior> Hi again
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2666[21:54:25] <donofrio> argh, I cannot wget because it's not installed...yah me
2667[21:54:33] <somiaj> donofrio: man apt-key
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2669[21:54:59] <donofrio> I don't have wget so I don't need to 'yet' look up apt-key but thanks for the head's up
2670[21:55:02] <jhutchins_wk> donofrio: curl?
2671[21:55:06] <donofrio> trying
2672[21:55:25] <donofrio> for context this is a minimal build boot session chrooted and updating what I can
2673[21:55:31] <donofrio> not found
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2676[21:56:30] <donofrio> how do I bug this....because I cannot be the only one that found this.....I have six other hosts as well as this one that needs debian goodness
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2680[21:57:06] <somiaj> you can manually copy the .key file over on a usb stick
2681[21:57:11] <Tom01> Can I boot and use an SSD, which has been installed on a different Computer?
2682[21:57:22] <somiaj> (though I'm surprised wget or curl isn't in the minimial system, its been a while since I've used it though)
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2690[21:57:40] <somiaj> Tom01: in theory yes, you do have to ensure that the boot is setup for the new computer correctly
2691[21:57:47] <donofrio> it's less than minimal cause I'm still "booted into install"
2692[21:57:57] <somiaj> Tom01: but the linux kernel should correclty detect the new hardware and work (provided it is stock and hardware is supported by the kernel)
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2695[21:58:16] <somiaj> donofrio: just finish the install, don't worry about the mirror until the minimial install is done.
2696[21:58:30] <somiaj> the minimial shell provided may not have wget, but I think the minimial install will
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2699[21:58:35] <Tom01> somiaj: I see.
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2701[21:59:08] <greycat> wget is in the "Standard" set, curl is "optional"
2702[21:59:15] <zoredache> I thought the install had a busybox with the wget/curl features enabled
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2704[21:59:33] <zoredache> might need to make a symlink to busybox if it is there?
2705[21:59:45] <somiaj> zoredache: many additional shell features sometimes need to be explicity loaded during the install
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2707[22:00:09] <somiaj> but in donofrio case, they should be able to complete the minimial install without a mirror, finish that, then boot into the minimial install and then install the rest of their software.
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2711[22:01:31] <jim> donofrio, oh, so there -is- a netinstall :)
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2714[22:02:21] <somiaj> the netinstall just isn't setup for the unoffical ports mirrors, and it will just be easier to configure things once a minimial install is completed.
2715[22:03:41] <donofrio> no wget but it does have nano lol
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2725[22:07:49] <donofrio> somiaj, gotta question, this is debian.org so how is this 'unoffical port' just wonderin?
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2731[22:09:51] <jim> I think debian dropped support for ppc a few years back
2732[22:09:51] <debianuser> Hello. Trying to build a hello-world package. `curl ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/hello/hello-2.10.tar.gz | tar xz && cd hello-2.10 && dh_make -sy --createorig && debuild -uc -us` fails to build it with obscure "There seems to be no Makefile" message :'-( replaced-url
2733[22:10:00] <debianuser> Please, help, what am I doing wrong? Is this the right place to ask?
2734[22:10:03] *** Joins: zojka (~zoja@replaced-ip)
2735[22:10:07] <debianuser> Or at least is that just me? Does that same one-liner work for anyone?
2736[22:10:11] <somiaj> donofrio: because debian is not officially supporting it in any way, and it is ports.debian.org (which is not offically a debian release)
2737[22:10:26] *** Joins: maik (~maik@replaced-ip)
2738[22:10:32] <jim> debianuser, haven't I seen you on #alsa?
2739[22:10:45] <somiaj> debianuser: my guess is the source hello-2.10.tar.gz doesn't actually conain a Makefile
2740[22:11:18] <jim> wouldn't you run ./configure to get the makefile?
2741[22:11:26] <greycat> Most GNU programs will require you to run ./configure to generate.... yeah, that.
2742[22:11:42] <debianuser> jim: you probably did. :) I read it often.
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2747[22:13:35] <jim> so, the debianized source package of hello, would have an executable makefile called debian/rules (well most often it's a makefile anyway; could also be a script), and debian/rules will run the ./configure for you
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2750[22:13:52] <somiaj> the debian build process should run .configure, does this simiple hellp world source even have that?
2751[22:14:02] <debianuser> somiaj: Well, yes, it doesn't have a Makefile. And it's not supposed to. Makefile is generated by "configure" from "Makefile.in".
2752[22:14:12] <somiaj> jim: dh_make is creating a very basic (though often not appropriate) debian/
2753[22:14:14] <jim> yep
2754[22:14:42] <debianuser> I mean it was like that forever for almost all apps in the world: you run `./configure` (or `cmake .`) to generate a Makefile, and then you run `make`. So debhelper/dh_make probably knows it, if this has ever worked before...
2755[22:15:11] <jim> wait, debianuser, are you building your own hello package? or trying to build the existing one?
2756[22:15:19] <debianuser> And I guess debhelper still works, otherwise a lot of people would have already noticed that. :) So it must be me doing something wrong... But what?
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2759[22:15:50] <debianuser> jim: I'm trying to build a .deb package from hello-2.10.tar.gz source.
2760[22:17:14] <jim> debianuser, one thing it might be helpful to do... is read every file in hello-2.10.tar.gz, and also read every file in the debianized source package of hello
2761[22:17:33] <jim> see (among other things) what got added
2762[22:17:34] <greycat> Or... re-read whatever chapter of the NMG you're currently following, and see if you missed some steps.
2763[22:17:49] <jim> that too
2764[22:18:31] <jim> and, #debian-mentors on irc.oftc.net can be handy for packaging issues
2765[22:18:51] <somiaj> #packaging would be more appropriate for this question
2766[22:18:56] <debianuser> I'm actually trying to write one. :) Meaning, I'm mostly following `man dh_make` and `man debhelper`...
2767[22:19:07] <jim> didn't know about that channel
2768[22:19:12] <jmcnaught> #debian-mentors is for help making packages for Debian, not general packaging support
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2771[22:19:44] <jim> so, is it #packaging or #debian-packaging?
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2783[22:24:02] <somiaj> it is just #packaging on irc.oftc.net for general packaging questions.
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2788[22:27:43] <jim> somiaj, so not just debian packages?
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2791[22:28:16] <somiaj> well irc.oftc.net is debian's network, so it is gonna be about debian.
2792[22:28:20] <jim> any idea if oftc has a bot like alis?
2793[22:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1533
2794[22:29:03] <greycat> It doesn't, but "/list *packag*" worked for me.
2795[22:29:13] <jim> somiaj, oftc was started because people were tired of how lilo was running things
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2799[22:29:50] <jim> one person even wanted to hurt him financially to force him to sell the domain
2800[22:30:11] <somiaj> either way this is off topic here
2801[22:30:13] <somiaj> !oftc move
2802[22:30:13] <dpkg> irc.debian.org moved to OFTC on June 4th 2006, see replaced-url
2803[22:30:33] <somiaj> that is all #debian really needs to know, that irc.oftc.net is the offical network for debian irc channels.
2804[22:30:45] <jim> I know, because I was asked to make that happen with a loan I extended to him, but refused to force him
2805[22:31:44] <jim> because irc.debian.org (or something like that) was moved from pointing to freenode, to point at oftc
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2809[22:32:10] <greycat> There's a large difference between "OFTC is debian's network" and "OFTC is the official network for debian irc channels".
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2813[22:32:40] <jim> oftc does contain those channels, but it contains others. as far as I know, debian does not own or run it
2814[22:32:43] <annadane> oftc is now debian/parrot support questions
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2816[22:33:09] <greycat> According to replaced-url
2817[22:33:35] <jim> that may have happened after the fact
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2821[22:34:38] <jim> greycat, does spi have any kind of controlling interest in oftc?
2822[22:34:54] <greycat> I have no idea. I'm literally just reading the front page of their web site.
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2824[22:35:05] <jim> oh ok
2825[22:35:09] <jim> good enough...
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2827[22:36:40] <jim> I guess the most feasable thing is that since oftc is a member of spi, they may have to follow certain rules...
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2918[23:26:46] <horribleprogram> kill, the built-in command, *laughs*, more like politelyaskaprocesstoquit
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2923[23:27:44] <humpled> ?
2924[23:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1518
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2927[23:30:27] <somiaj> more like send the process signals so it can nicely shut down, look at the -9 option.
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2932[23:31:53] <horribleprogram> somiaj: well with a name like kill
2933[23:32:05] <horribleprogram> you expect the default signal sent to be... KILL
2934[23:32:28] <somiaj> as with most programs, read the man page to understand what it is you are doing.
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2936[23:32:36] <horribleprogram> This is why you can't do computer science stand-up
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2938[23:32:42] <somiaj> I personally am glad the default is to ask the program to shut down as opposed to terminate it.
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2941[23:33:42] <annadane> kill foo --with-extreme-smite-of-judgement
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2944[23:34:04] <somiaj> just get ahold of psdoom
2945[23:34:11] <humpled> i could have a knife called kill, doesn't mean someone will stand still and let me kill them
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2949[23:35:23] <horribleprogram> you can't block a kill signal
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2951[23:35:45] <horribleprogram> unless your process' name is Chuck Norris
2952[23:35:47] <humpled> can't you catch it
2953[23:36:07] <horribleprogram> humpled: no
2954[23:36:26] <horribleprogram> viruses and stuff
2955[23:36:41] <humpled> "the process held up a piece of wood"
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2958[23:37:37] <horribleprogram> humpled: good analogy
2959[23:37:56] <horribleprogram> kill throughs a signal at a process, some "signals" (aka balls) are too big to be caught and blocked
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2961[23:38:18] <humpled> are they?
2962[23:38:26] <humpled> i think it depends who throws them
2963[23:38:48] <horribleprogram> mhm interesitng, the pitcher is the process that sends the signal?
2964[23:38:50] <somiaj> though we should get back on topic, I would suggest #debian-offtopic, but hopefully this has run its course.
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2966[23:39:34] <windchime> G'day from New Zealand everyone. I am using jessie & I have had a few problems since I did an apt-get update/upgrade from CLI. I ran into a syntax error on python3.4; after much running around, I found that the syntax error changed to elsewhere in python3.4? Now I have lost the ability to start synaptic from the menu? (It still starts ok from CLI?) Any thoughts/
2967[23:39:59] <windchime> ?
2968[23:40:18] <somiaj> windchime: what did you do to your python? Also note that jessie no longer gets full security support, so if running a desktop you may want to run at least stretch.
2969[23:40:33] <horribleprogram> Debian Jussie Smollett
2970[23:40:55] <somiaj> windchime: but you will have to past the exact commands you typed and output to help debug what the issue could be.
2971[23:41:00] <somiaj> horribleprogram: please take off topic chatter elsewhere
2972[23:41:01] <jmcnaught> Sounds like it could be replaced-url
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2976[23:42:28] <windchime> somiaj, I did : apt-get purge python3.4-testsuite*
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2978[23:43:02] <somiaj> windchime: the bug jmcnaught linked has a workaround, seems a security issue from the lts team introduced this bug.
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2980[23:43:52] <somiaj> hmm, also looks like a fix was introduced today, so hopefully once you work around this bug things will go back to normal
2981[23:44:17] <somiaj> windchime: though agian, desktop side software (synamptic, and espically your browsers) are getting no security support in jessie. So be aware of this if you continue to run jessie.
2982[23:44:18] <horribleprogram> somiaj: why 3.4?
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2984[23:44:25] <horribleprogram> windchime: why 3.4?
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2986[23:44:29] <somiaj> !jessie lts
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2988[23:44:48] <somiaj> horribleprogram: because 3.4 is the version supported by jessie and the LTS team will continue to provide security support for server side software
2989[23:44:51] <somiaj> !lts
2990[23:44:51] <dpkg> Debian Long Term Support (LTS) is a project to extend the lifetime of all Debian stable releases to (at least) 5 years. Debian LTS is not handled by the Debian security team, but by a separate group of volunteers and companies. Ask me about <jessie-lts> and see replaced-url
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2992[23:45:05] <somiaj> !jessie-lts
2993[23:45:05] <dpkg> Security support for Debian 8 "Jessie" from the Debian Security Team ended on 2018-05-17. The amd64, i386, armel and armhf architectures will receive additional long term support (<LTS>) via <jessie/updates> until around 2020 for a 5 year lifetime total. See replaced-url
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2995[23:46:51] <horribleprogram> somiaj: so a particular version of Debian supports particular packages?
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2997[23:47:22] <horribleprogram> somiaj: i mean apt-cache show python3 --> Version: 3.7.3-1
2998[23:47:42] <somiaj> ,v pyhton3
2999[23:47:43] <judd> No package named 'pyhton3' was found in amd64.
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3003[23:47:53] <somiaj> ,v python3
3004[23:47:54] <judd> Package: python3 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.4.2-2; stretch: 3.5.3-1; buster: 3.7.3-1; sid: 3.7.3-1
3005[23:48:21] <somiaj> horribleprogram: yes, when debian releases a stable release, the versions are frozen and only recive security and grave bug fixes.
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3007[23:48:26] <horribleprogram> ahhh
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3009[23:48:31] <horribleprogram> kk that makes sense
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3011[23:48:48] <somiaj> by policy all secuirty fixes should be targeted (fix only the bug and add no new feature) and backported to the version in stable.
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3013[23:49:07] <horribleprogram> that's cool
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3018[23:49:31] <somiaj> webbrowsers are one exception to this rule (caused to much work and branding issues to keep backporting), and ocassionally fixes cannot be backported, so very rarely will stable bump a version for a security fix due to this
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3023[23:49:56] <somiaj> but this is mainly because browsers find new security holes every other week
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3040[23:51:14] <somiaj> though in this case, the backported fix included code that needed python3.6 and thus caused unxpected issues with 3.4
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3051[23:52:20] <dvs> 79 bugs? It went up!
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3054[23:52:55] <somiaj> It always goes up, stretch now has a few hundered rc-bugs last I checked.
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3057[23:54:04] <somiaj> oh 807 in stretch, and at one point that was near zero too.
3058[23:54:22] <dvs> O_O
3059[23:55:47] <somiaj> I like looking at the stretch graph, you can see where point releases hit.
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3061[23:57:38] <somiaj> though it might be that not all those bugs actually affect stretch, sometimes the bugs are only against the newer versions.
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