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• 16[00:08:51] <agio> If I make an entry in /etc/fstab to auto mount a partition on system boot - will that partition automatically be sync'ed/unmounted etc on shutdown?
• 17[00:09:04] <abrotman> yes
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• 20[00:10:14] <agio> nice, do you know of any doc's that provide details about this?
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• 22[00:10:25] <agio> man /etc/fstab doesn't
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• 26[00:11:28] <abrotman> details about which part?
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• 28[00:12:28] <agio> the unmounting on system shutdown
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• 31[00:14:11] <abrotman> man mount ? man fstab ?
• 32[00:14:40] <agio> tried those, didnt find anything
• 33[00:14:52] <abrotman> about what specifically?
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• 35[00:15:24] <agio> the unmounting on system shutdown
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• 42[00:19:58] <agio> for example what program is it that uses the info from /etc/fstab?
• 43[00:20:10] <agio> to mount partitions?
• 44[00:20:25] <kale> agio: mount :-)
• 45[00:20:59] <agio> but something must call mount?
• 46[00:21:19] <agio> Im assuming some systemd service?
• 47[00:21:44] <kale> i just got into the "conversation" so what is you original question?
• 48[00:22:42] <agio> If I make an entry in /etc/fstab to auto mount a partition on system boot - will that partition automatically be sync'ed/unmounted etc on shutdown?
• 49[00:22:57] <kale> agio: yes
• 50[00:23:10] <agio> 2nd part to question: do you know of any doc's that provide details about this?
• 51[00:23:58] <kale> about how startup and shutdown is ahndled?
• 52[00:24:10] <kale> s/ahndled/handled/
• 53[00:24:17] <agio> specifically the shutdown
• 54[00:24:50] <agio> especially the case where the mount point actually points to a device mapper
• 55[00:24:50] <kale> not really, i usually have a specific task to solve and go from there
• 56[00:25:52] <agio> the specific task is how is an encrypted LUKS partition /sync'd/unmapped/unmounted etc on shutdown?
• 57[00:26:27] <agio> where it was initially mapped via /etc/crypttab
• 58[00:26:40] <agio> then the mapper mounted via /etc/fstab
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• 60[00:26:54] <kale> agio: ahh, as much as it can be ... there are usually some stuff using the partitions on shutdown. but there is a difference between unmounting and closing the luks parition
• 61[00:27:24] <agio> definitely
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• 64[00:28:18] <agio> the mapper would need to be unmounted first, then the mapped closed, right?
• 65[00:28:35] <kale> agio: yes
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• 68[00:30:13] <kale> you should be able to unmount most partitions if you do it right. you should check FHS, that will describe the directories required to boot. usually you just have everythin in the root partition, but you could have sbin, var and runon seperate partitions.
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• 72[00:31:40] <kale> agio: this might give you a brief introduction: replaced-url
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• 74[00:31:56] <agio> Im planning to just host non-system data in the partition. so Im wondering if entries were made in /etc/crypttab and /etc/fstab, would the partition be both 1) unmounted 2) dm-crypt mapper closed?
• 75[00:32:30] <kale> agio: that should work fine.
• 76[00:32:47] <agio> kale: thanks for link, reading now...
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• 94[00:54:11] <roylaprattep> Yi
• 95[00:54:14] <roylaprattep> Yo
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• 110[01:05:58] <verblendet> i killed my apt :)
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• 114[01:06:44] <verblendet> i apt upgrade and then a few warnings came up, i use old jessie still. i pressed ctrl+c like hell.....
• 115[01:07:00] <verblendet> but apt doesn't stop, bitch
• 116[01:07:12] <verblendet> then it stopped...... and nothing was installed
• 117[01:07:33] <verblendet> but apt update and apt upgrade says there are NO new packages ------ liar!
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• 119[01:08:03] <verblendet> apt is a bitch when it come to ctrl+c.
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• 122[01:09:08] <verblendet> this sucks now as i cant get the security updates that were mentioned and why i started the update
• 123[01:09:11] <verblendet> GRRRR
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• 126[01:10:26] <verblendet> and it now mentions a lot of packages i can remove with autoremove that were installed or are installed right now as a predecessor for the abviously NOT installed update packages..... hahahahahaha
• 127[01:11:20] <verblendet> who pressed ctrl+c? me! who is the master?! ;)
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• 130[01:11:54] <verblendet> as it turns out now, my question is: how to fix that?
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• 142[01:15:26] <at0m> apt -f install. -f, for fix.
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• 147[01:16:20] <at0m> verblendet: please keep this channel family friendly
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• 149[01:17:05] <verblendet> sry
• 150[01:17:06] <verblendet> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
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• 152[01:18:18] <verblendet> what files from apt i need to restore? i have a fresh backup
• 153[01:18:33] <verblendet> .oO(i think so)
• 154[01:18:38] <at0m> verblendet: then you interrupted the apt update process, not the apt upgrade. if you want updates, if there is any, run apt update && apt upgrade
• 155[01:18:58] <verblendet> i did that 10 times at least
• 156[01:19:34] <at0m> "i cant get the security updates that were mentioned" were mentioned where?
• 157[01:19:42] <verblendet> apt is not so family friendly :)
• 158[01:20:05] <at0m> try emerge :p
• 159[01:20:08] <verblendet> i did apt update and then i get 11 and later 13 security updates
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• 161[01:20:30] <verblendet> when i do emerge, i would now what i do
• 162[01:20:48] <at0m> apt list --upgradeable
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• 164[01:20:58] <verblendet> why does apt not accept my ctrl+c anyway?
• 165[01:20:59] <at0m> if there's none there, there is none
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• 173[01:22:13] <verblendet> at0m, not true, even if there is none!
• 174[01:22:55] <at0m> i'm off. good luck :)
• 175[01:23:07] <verblendet> i replay a backup from /var or so
• 176[01:23:25] <verblendet> i scrolled back log and after 3 packages it stopped
• 177[01:23:34] <verblendet> there were 13 updates
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• 180[01:25:46] <aloo_shu> no space left on device ? <-- the error that returned with the ssd...
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• 182[01:26:14] <aloo_shu> guessing, but symptoms could fit
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• 250[02:04:13] <srruby> apt-get update is hanging on 0% I am on stretch. I tried apt-get clean but it didn't help
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• 260[02:11:18] <srruby> exit
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• 274[02:19:15] <lord_helmet> Anyone running testing with a RX Vega GPU? Just picked up an XFX Vega 56 but the amdgpu driver is reporting it as a Vega 64? Did I get lucky and someone at the factory stick the wrong card in the box or does amdgpu just report everything as a RX Vega 64?
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• 277[02:20:13] <lord_helmet> Don't have a Windows license and I don't want to be bothered with partitioning my drives anyway
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• 279[02:21:17] <dvs> I'm surprised the kernel picks up that card already
• 280[02:22:27] <lord_helmet> Testing runs 4.18.0 and the drivers were added in 4.15 I think
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• 282[02:22:49] <lord_helmet> Just trying to figure out if I got lucky or if I have a bad card or something
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• 308[02:33:26] <m_g_lewis> When I do apt update I get "Ign:1 replaced-url
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• 313[02:34:54] <milkt> m_g_lewis: Ign means there are no changes since last update
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• 316[02:35:54] <squarecircle> at0m: can't we just hang a sign on the saloon: "Swearing and cussing in progress, enter only if you stand bad words!"
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• 318[02:36:15] <m_g_lewis> milkt: Thanks! Had me wondering if something was wrong...
• 319[02:36:47] <milkt> m_g_lewis: also maybe check this link, replaced-url
• 320[02:37:14] <m_g_lewis> milkt: OK, I'll look...
• 321[02:40:23] <agio> I think apt checks the hashes in Packages.gz or contents or something? and not changed, it doesn't download the list file - to save time/bandwidth
• 322[02:40:35] <squarecircle> lord_helmet: two thoughts on this: as it is the same chip, selected, the driver may just misrecognize the card, second: what does the card and lspci say?
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• 331[02:49:06] <m_g_lewis> milkt: The URL returns 404 error if you click the links for replaced-url
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• 360[03:14:10] <RoyK> m_g_lewis: bad mirror, perhaps
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• 364[03:14:56] <m_g_lewis> Royk: Right...the InRelease file is missing...
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• 366[03:15:52] <RoyK> probably some server went down - try to choose another mirror manually
• 367[03:15:55] <cryptodan> or try again later
• 368[03:16:54] <RoyK> cryptodan: it may take a while for that mirror to sync up or for dns to update, though
• 369[03:17:02] <lord_helmet> squarecircle: 0b:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Vega 10 XT [Radeon RX Vega 64]
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• 371[03:17:29] <lord_helmet> I imagine that the amdgpu driver just lumps vega into one right now
• 372[03:17:31] <cryptodan> but if dns was down you wouldnt resolve the server to IP
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• 374[03:18:48] <RoyK> that's DNS for you - it'll resolv whatever's in the list - so will the mirror site, according to geoip or similar, but that probably doesn't update very often if the actual webserver goes down
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• 376[03:19:44] <cryptodan> so I would just wait it out as the server could be syncing at that time, or you could browse to the file and see if it exists via web browse
• 377[03:20:10] <Thedarkb-M90> When will the stable be getting gcc7?
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• 379[03:20:39] <dvs> Thedarkb-M90, debian 10
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• 385[03:22:46] <RoyK> cryptodan: just trying to give a simple advice here - dns has fairly low ttl on that one, but it clearly isn't updated, so it'll be easier to choose a mirror manually to make things work
• 386[03:23:10] <RoyK> Thedarkb-M90: probably never - you might find it in backports, though
• 387[03:23:14] <RoyK> ,v gcc
• 388[03:23:15] <judd> Package: gcc on amd64 -- wheezy: 4:4.7.2-1; jessie: 4:4.9.2-2; stretch: 4:6.3.0-4; buster: 4:8.2.0-1; sid: 4:8.2.0-2
• 389[03:23:23] <RoyK> ,v gcc7
• 390[03:23:24] <judd> No package named 'gcc7' was found in amd64.
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• 393[03:24:30] <cryptodan> Im not get a 404 not found on links within that mirror m_g_lewis
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• 396[03:26:32] <RoyK> cryptodan: you probably hit another mirror, then
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• 415[03:41:40] <zumba_addict> is it possible to set up a timeout in a shell?
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• 425[03:54:21] <karlpinc> zumba_addict: You set $TMOUT. "man bash". But, anybody can reset the value, I believe.
• 426[03:54:43] <m_g_lewis> milkt, RoyK, cryptodan: apt update error "Ign:5 replaced-url
• 427[03:55:03] <zumba_addict> karlpinc: I got it working
• 428[03:55:08] <karlpinc> Any clues as to how to change the paper layout to landscape in LibreOffice?
• 429[03:56:10] <karlpinc> Never mind. Got it.
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• 432[03:57:31] <cryptodan> m_g_lewis: that file is there
• 433[03:57:51] <cryptodan> m_g_lewis: you are right im mistaken
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• 435[03:58:35] <m_g_lewis> cryptodan: No problem :-)
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• 437[03:59:36] <cryptodan> m_g_lewis: then switch mirrors to something closer
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• 439[04:00:01] <m_g_lewis> cryptodan: Right...
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• 746[08:56:10] <mrig> Hello
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• 750[08:58:25] <mrig> I would like to learn how to use the encrypted system disk, once installed, when reinstalling or accessing the disk from a debian install medium. Can anyone help with this?
• 751[08:59:09] <SpeedyG> there's quite some good documentation on LUKS on the debian wiki
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• 755[09:00:04] <mrig> A second question, I am unlucky enough to have bought a skylake processor model : 78
• 756[09:00:06] <mrig> model name : Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-6500U CPU @ 2.50GHz
• 757[09:00:08] <mrig> stepping : 3
• 758[09:00:44] <mrig> which i think requires the intel-microcode; I am not able to install it.
• 759[09:01:33] <SpeedyG> not able? as in, you get errors, or as in, unable to find it?
• 760[09:01:34] <mrig> SpeedyG right I will take a look at that try to become more familiar with it. Does it mention activating the disk at install time though?
• 761[09:02:03] <mrig> I can not install a required package. I see it in the repo
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• 763[09:02:26] <SpeedyG> mrig: not sure, I know i've followed it about a year (or longer) ago... to get full disk encryption on my desktop and laptop.... and have used it for full disk encryption on an external USB-disk
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• 765[09:02:32] <mrig> intel-microcode : Depends: iucode-tool (>= 1.0) but it is not installable
• 766[09:02:34] <mrig> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
• 767[09:02:36] <mrig> y
• 768[09:03:15] <SpeedyG> iucode-tool seems to be in contrib
• 769[09:03:20] <SpeedyG> perhaps reinstall that?
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• 771[09:04:05] <mrig> SpeedyG right, yes the system and my disk are encrypted, I have all so partitioned the disk to have a separate /home this is where I would like to reinstall the system but keep /home I am not sure how to do this.
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• 774[09:04:42] <mrig> of right, I removed contrib from the address of the unfree software repo
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• 776[09:04:43] <SpeedyG> mrig: can you make a backup of /home? if you can, i'd backup, do a full reinstall and restore /home
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• 778[09:04:54] <mrig> thanks that must be the issue!
• 779[09:04:56] <tomreyn> sudo apt install pastebinit && pastebinit <( apt-cache policy; sudo apt -f install; )
• 780[09:05:07] <SpeedyG> (making a backup is advised anyway before messing around with disks ;) )
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• 782[09:05:41] <mrig> I have a backup, have several. I would love to be able to avoid coping everything over.
• 783[09:05:44] <tomreyn> ignore what i wrote, if it's just that contrib's missing
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• 786[09:06:13] <mrig> just need to add contrib at the end of the file I think :)
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• 788[09:06:49] <SpeedyG> mrig: i'm not sure how to do that kind of a reinstall... goes beyond my knowledge ;)
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• 792[09:08:00] <mrig> Ah the microcode is installing now! That is great thank you!
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• 797[09:08:50] <mrig> SpeedyG: right I will keep trying with it, read the doc as you say and perhaps make a test install to experiment with.
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• 799[09:09:16] <mrig> tomreyn thanks the contrib has solved the problem
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• 801[09:09:53] <SpeedyG> nice that the microcode issue is resolved now :) best of luck
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• 803[09:12:11] <mrig> Thank you, really appreciate the help.
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• 807[09:13:18] <mrig> Right, I best reboot after this one.
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• 820[09:21:03] <lazerlemon> hi
• 821[09:21:16] <lazerlemon> greasy hairy nigger nutsack
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• 855[09:49:24] <komunista> hi all
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• 891[10:01:26] <ruffni> i've just migrated my debian system from my external ssd to an internal partition on my mbp. now it won't boot. i can get grub to find the kernel and start booting it, but it hangs. do i need to reinstall grub and will that affect my macos installation? wouldn't reinstalling grub mash up my MBR?
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• 893[10:02:20] <rk4> is your fstab still relevant?
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• 903[10:09:59] <ruffni> i adjusted it to reflect the changes
• 904[10:10:53] <n4dir> the you might have to reinstall grub.
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• 906[10:11:46] <ruffni> you're positive i'm not gonna mash up my macos installation if i install grub on the MBR of my main drive?
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• 909[10:12:56] <n4dir> ruffni: did MacOS get added automatically the first time ? If so i wouldn't have a doubt it will work again
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• 912[10:13:27] <n4dir> but in general: rather not.
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• 914[10:16:47] <ruffni> i used refit which (i guess) found debian on my external drive itself
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• 922[10:17:10] <tdn> I know this is on archive somewhere, but I cannot seem to find working source URLs
• 923[10:17:19] <n4dir> !jessie
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• 925[10:17:37] <n4dir> tdn: the bot doesn't like me. Try the command /msg dpkg jessie
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• 933[10:18:42] <tdn> n4dir, did that. Not very helpful info I got.
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• 935[10:18:47] <tdn> n4dir, tried install jessie.
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• 937[10:18:54] <tdn> Basically I just got that it was dead
• 938[10:19:08] <tdn> Does this mean that sources no longer exist online?
• 939[10:19:13] <tdn> I thought that they did.
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• 945[10:19:53] <n4dir> tdn: the wiki page for Jessie also has no info. bummer.
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• 948[10:20:17] <n4dir> tdn: no, jessie is old-stable, it isn't "dead" yet.
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• 950[10:20:47] <tdn> n4dir, that was what I thought
• 951[10:21:06] <n4dir> tdn: right now is a day of the time when this channel is rather silent. Try again later, from what i hear quite a few still have jessie installations.
• 952[10:21:26] <n4dir> damnit: "right now is a time of the day". sorry, too early for me.
• 953[10:21:27] <tdn> I was hoping *someone* in here would be running debian 8 somewhere and maybe had a sources.list I could have copy from. Or maybe in an old backup somewhere
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• 955[10:22:01] <tdn> n4dir, is there a heatmap somewhere of when this channel is most active?
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• 959[10:22:33] <n4dir> i would say in ca 4 or 5 hours (it is as it is: can always be, but that's my experience)
• 960[10:23:08] <n4dir> tdn: if it was me i would use a stretch sources list and replace stretch with jessie, only do "apt-get update" and look if it will give errors.
• 961[10:23:18] <n4dir> for now. Then ask again later.
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• 969[10:27:17] <tdn> n4dir, do you know where to obtain jessie netinst iso?
• 970[10:27:22] <n4dir> tdn: that looks promising, have a look: replaced-url
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• 973[10:27:46] <n4dir> no, sorry, don't know that.
• 974[10:28:17] <Li> is it possible to intsall one debian distro with all available desktop environments like gnome,kde and mate then switch (logout/login) the same user from one environment to another/
• 975[10:28:21] <Li> ?
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• 977[10:28:53] <tdn> Found it replaced-url
• 978[10:29:11] <tdn> Li, yeah, just install the packages
• 979[10:29:35] <n4dir> Li: i would say it is tecnically possible, but for sure your menus will be ... well: full of application entries.
• 980[10:29:54] <jelly> Li: yes. You can install whatever packages you want from the repo after initial OS installation
• 981[10:30:12] <jelly> that includes task-blah-desktop packages
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• 985[10:31:26] <Li> so you guys say it's doable but not really recommended as it will make a the menus big mess! no problem it's just for testing things here.
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• 987[10:31:50] <Li> but how to switch from one environment to another?
• 988[10:31:53] <n4dir> I didn't say that. I only told you what you will run into. I think there are ways to work around though
• 989[10:32:01] <Li> is there a special command?
• 990[10:32:27] <n4dir> either edit .xinitrc or just use the display-manager to choose the environment you want to start
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• 995[10:33:02] <n4dir> if you use a display-manager, then editing .xinitrc doesn't make sense, of course. Only if you don't use one.
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• 1001[10:34:01] <Li> muchas gracias
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• 1003[10:34:26] <tdn> Li, I have multiple desktop envs. installed. it is no problem at all for at few at least. I have KDE, xfce and lxde. Most users use kde. But some prefer others and they just select their prefered session when logging in via SDDM
• 1004[10:34:32] <jelly> Li: most display managers (software that provides GUI login screen) give you a choice which session to start
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• 1006[10:35:00] <jelly> I almost always have xfce and kde installed. Sometimes one of them breaks.
• 1007[10:35:29] <tdn> Li, if you are doing a new installation and not sure what you like yet, just check them all in the selection during installation
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• 1010[10:36:59] <n4dir> jelly: whith xfce being rather small, so a good "fallback solution". the tasksel version i don't really recall though.
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• 1017[10:43:27] <Li> tdn: personally I prefer mate and gnome, however I learnt just yesterday about the new kde with plasma thingy!
• 1018[10:43:42] <Li> they claim 30% performance increase which I'd like to try :)
• 1019[10:44:00] <Li> anyway, thanks guys for the info
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• 1023[10:44:52] <Li> n4dir: I'm not sure about the "display-manager" I couldn't find any such command on strech
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• 1025[10:45:07] <Li> display-im6 display-im6.q16
• 1026[10:45:16] <Li> I've got only those
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• 1028[10:48:06] <n4dir> Li: display-manager is not a command. It is the thing you see when you login (gdm, ssdm, ligthdm, etc).
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• 1032[10:52:29] <AquaL1te> what's a good way to have a clean gnome installation on debian? i've tried the netinstall and deselected all options in tasksel (standard gnome install is too bloated and even standard includes stuff i don't want such as exim), after a reboot i did `apt install gnome-core`, which seems to do the trick. but there are errors passing by xserver-common (dependency problems prevent configuration of
• 1033[10:52:35] <AquaL1te> xserver-common) and /var/lib/usbmux (directory not found). that's just a few i just saw because now it's quite slow with configuring packages. so this doesn't feel like a really solid way to do this. what am i doing wrong? or are these bugs?
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• 1035[10:53:51] <AquaL1te> has been a while since i used debian, it could be 'business as usual', but i don't know. so i ask here :)
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• 1037[10:54:20] <jelly> use the task and replace exim with whatever MTA you want
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• 1039[10:54:59] <jelly> (task-desktop and task-gnome-desktop being the "standard gnome install")
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• 1041[10:55:11] <AquaL1te> jelly: exim is just one example, gnome is also a mess with games, double apps that do the same thing, nowhere near a clean setup
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• 1044[10:55:46] <csehl> where and how would i configure to startx, when i log in my non-root user on tty1?
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• 1047[10:56:52] <dionysus69> still couldn't figure it out, how can I source /etc/environment without relogin :S
• 1048[10:57:00] <AquaL1te> errors are mounting as the install progresses. i guess i'll stick to fedora just a while longer, maybe the ibm takeover isn't that bad (i hope)...
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• 1050[10:57:45] <csehl> dionysus69: source /etc/environment && env-update ?
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• 1059[11:01:08] <n4dir> csehl: /home/username/.xinitrc
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• 1064[11:01:56] <csehl> n4dir: but .xinitrc is run, when X is started, right? when my setup boots straight into tty1, noX, then it wont be executed yet?
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• 1066[11:02:32] <n4dir> csehl: i say: yes, right.
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• 1068[11:03:04] <n4dir> i am pretty sure, but what gets sourced when during tty-login and during gui-login is always a bit of a riddle.
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• 1071[11:03:20] <csehl> n4dir: see, if i just go with the flow and log into my tty1 text-login (which i want), then i'm logged into text tty1; done. but when i place startx in .bashrc of this non-root user, it's lacking permissions to rum Xorg, obviously
• 1072[11:03:30] <n4dir> for sure .xinitrc doesn't get sourced when you login to tty though.
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• 1074[11:04:28] <csehl> n4dir: because it wants to startx properly as root, while being logged in as non-root user
• 1075[11:04:47] <n4dir> might be you somehow gave ~/.xinitrc the wrong permissions. Might be something is wrong with you ~/.Xauthority file (permissions too, i'd say). Might be the content of .xinitrc is wrong
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• 1077[11:05:06] <n4dir> csehl: check the permissions of .Xauthority then, if in doubt, remove the file, run startx again.
• 1078[11:06:02] <bolovanos> hithere - where can I find this page (does not work) replaced-url
• 1079[11:07:22] <n4dir> csehl: you don't put the command "startx" anywhere, and sure not in .bashrc. use .xinitrc. And something like "exec openbox-session" in there. Then run the command "startx" from the terminal
• 1080[11:07:27] <csehl> n4dir: ah hm. non-root's .Xauthority doesn't have *+x
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• 1084[11:07:57] <n4dir> csehl: that file gets created automatically. I never mess with it, but simply rm it.
• 1085[11:08:08] <n4dir> well: if needed. Else not, of course.
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• 1088[11:08:58] <csehl> n4dir: but .xinitrc is not being run. i want to startx as soon as i tty1-login non-root. so when could there even be an X-start that would trigger .xinitrc? a pure tty1-login doesn't trigger .xinitrc to startx, no?
• 1089[11:09:07] <n4dir> also: debian sets a window manager or DE to be default. "mv .xinitrc xinitrc_backup", run "startx", same problem?
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• 1091[11:09:55] <n4dir> csehl: ah, automatically. back in the days you did that with /etc/inittab. No clue how it is done these days.
• 1092[11:10:39] <n4dir> over my head if it makes sense to put the startx command in .profile then, but sure not .bashrc
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• 1094[11:10:45] <csehl> n4dir: yes i thought it should be inittab. the joke is, i have this other linux here where exactly all of this is working. so i'm analyzing this /etc/inittab, but no luck. I forgot where and how i achieved this
• 1095[11:10:57] <n4dir> there should be more solid solutions, including systemd, but i don't know them.
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• 1098[11:11:30] <n4dir> csehl: see, i am a lazy guy. I would simply run startx manually.
• 1099[11:12:00] <csehl> n4dir: xD not me, i need to get it all smoothed out into the last pixel
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• 1101[11:12:27] <n4dir> yup, fine approach, thats for sure. Anyway: i sure don't know, so good luck. Keep having at it :-)
• 1102[11:12:40] <csehl> n4dir: thanks for your help :)
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• 1107[11:14:05] <n4dir> csehl: well, you could try the .profile hack, just put in "startx" there. imho it's rather dirty, but what do i know
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• 1121[11:25:28] <eugenmayer> can a debian repo be referenced using file:// and not http / ftp … similar how cdrom is working? The point is having a local mirror
• 1122[11:25:41] <eugenmayer> replaced-url
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• 1130[11:30:59] <jelly> eugenmayer: sure, I just mounted a mirror and tried this: deb file:/home/jelly/mnt/mirror/debian stretch main contrib non-free
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• 1132[11:31:34] <jelly> it's just a normal mirror with a pool
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• 1136[11:35:27] <eugenmayer> jelly: thank you!
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• 1245[12:28:35] <csehl> somehow conky as delivered by default debian apt doesn't run
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• 1248[12:30:03] <csehl> comes up with a whole pile of "unknown setting"s and doesn't show anything. do i really have to investigate every atom of conky now to get it running, or is there something obvious i'm missing? i'm just opening a terminal and running 'conky'. installed package: conky-cli
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• 1252[12:33:51] <petn-randall> csehl: which OS release are you running?
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• 1254[12:34:58] <csehl> petn-randall: debian 9.5 4.9.0-8-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.110-3+deb9u6 (2018-10-08) x86_64 GNU/Linux
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• 1266[12:40:54] <petn-randall> csehl: I see. I'd start with reading /usr/share/doc/conky-cli/README.md, there's also HTML documentation in that dir.
• 1267[12:41:10] <csehl> petn-randall: conky-all (X11) works though; just trying to get the cli-version. okay, reading, thanks
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• 1269[12:42:06] <csehl> petn-randall: /usr/share/doc/conky-cli/README.md: No such file or directory
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• 1273[12:44:41] <csehl> petn-randall: oh, i see. it isn't meant to be used like that, just for piping to dzen2 etc.
• 1274[12:45:41] <petn-randall> csehl: Why is that file missing for you? It's part of conky-cli.
• 1275[12:46:09] <csehl> petn-randall: not sure, i'm innocent :) i didn't do anything with is
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• 1279[12:48:46] <petn-randall> csehl: What does `apt-cache policy conky-cli` return?
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• 1282[12:50:19] <csehl> petn-randall: because the output consists of several lines: what would be a pipable paste-tool in debian, that just spits the url out? can't find wgetpaste
• 1283[12:50:57] <csehl> *pastebin-tool
• 1284[12:51:38] <csehl> found one, pastebinit
• 1285[12:51:58] <csehl> petn-randall: replaced-url
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• 1293[12:53:57] <csehl> petn-randall: it, uh, doesn't show that i installed conky-cli. not even with apt search conky-cli. it mustve removed it when i installed conky-all? no idea
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• 1296[12:54:52] <csehl> petn-randall: apt search conky: replaced-url
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• 1302[12:56:39] <csehl> petn-randall: i just explicitly 'apt install conky-cli'ed again. it moved conky-all to showing [residual-config] instead of [installed]. looks like i can only have one of them or something
• 1303[12:57:30] <csehl> now that conky-cli is [installed] again, i do have the README.md
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• 1326[13:09:00] <csehl> how would i best go on about installing software from a git repo, that is not found in apt?
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• 1331[13:13:12] <petn-randall> csehl: Ah yes, the conky packages conflict each other.
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• 1333[13:13:26] <petn-randall> csehl: It really depends on the type of software what the best approach to install it is.
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• 1337[13:15:34] <daniel-mcr> Hi all, On Debian 9, gnome 3, Software and updates, Updates tab, when there are other updates is greyed out, any idea's how to resolve please, thanks
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• 1349[13:24:06] <petn-randall> daniel-mcr: What kind of software is that?
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• 1356[13:28:05] <petn-randall> daniel-mcr: I mean, what packages are greyed out?
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• 1365[13:32:48] <banisterfiend> hi...what is the sanctioned way to change my dns servers on a typical arch linux install? i.e i dont want to edit resolv.conf if it's just going to get overwritten
• 1366[13:33:21] <csehl> petn-randall: i'm trying to get i3-wsbar from replaced-url
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• 1368[13:33:49] <themill> banisterfiend: wrong channel?
• 1369[13:34:01] <banisterfiend> themill sorry i meant debian install
• 1370[13:34:18] <jelly> !override dns
• 1371[13:34:18] <dpkg> To have dhclient etc not touch /etc/resolv.conf, the best plan is to configure it not to touch that file. See replaced-url
• 1372[13:34:27] <themill> that depends on how you choose to configure your networking
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• 1374[13:34:54] <jelly> that too!
• 1375[13:35:27] <daniel-mcr> petn-randall: I think it is referring to Recommended updates (stretch-updates)
• 1376[13:36:03] <jelly> banisterfiend: are you talking about a typical workstation install or a server or what
• 1377[13:36:09] <daniel-mcr> It is not the packages that are greyed out, it is the dropdown with the title 'when there are other updates'
• 1378[13:36:14] <banisterfiend> jelly just typical workstation
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• 1381[13:37:14] <banisterfiend> jelly when i ls -l /etc/resolv.conf it seems to say it's a symlink to /var/run/NetworkManager/resolv.con
• 1382[13:37:17] <banisterfiend> f*
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• 1386[13:37:36] <banisterfiend> jelly given that, how should i be setting/changing my dns servers?
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• 1399[13:44:28] <jelly> banisterfiend: you can override dns settings in network manager gnome applet then
• 1400[13:44:58] <banisterfiend> jelly sorry i forgot to mention, i have to do this programatically (in a script, not via the gui)
• 1401[13:45:49] <greycat> Then it's a server-in-a-can (docker, aws, some similar crap) so you are not using GNOME or N-M.
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• 1404[13:47:29] <banisterfiend> greycat no,k it's just i need to configure dns servers from a script
• 1405[13:47:36] <banisterfiend> as it's part of the installation of a program i'm writing
• 1406[13:47:38] <banisterfiend> so i want it to operate without user interaction
• 1407[13:47:48] <greycat> secrets and lies and silliness.
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• 1409[13:48:05] <greycat> "I can't tell you why. Just trust me. I know what I'm doing. I just don't know how to do anything."
• 1410[13:48:25] <SpeedyG> must be the best advice ever ;)
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• 1413[13:49:28] <greycat> banisterfiend: Serious advice: read how Debian's resolvconf package works.
• 1414[13:49:43] <banisterfiend> greycat hmm, what's secrets about that? i have a program that sets up a vpn
• 1415[13:49:50] <banisterfiend> greycat the program needs to set my vpn ip addresses for dns
• 1416[13:49:55] <banisterfiend> i'm distributing this program to a few friends and family
• 1417[13:49:59] <banisterfiend> so i want it to automatically set my vpn dns servers
• 1418[13:50:01] <banisterfiend> :)
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• 1420[13:50:34] <greycat> Because at the moment it sounds to me like you are doing the exact freaking OPPOSITE of what resolvconf does. You are trying to set up one of those evil programs that megalomaniacally assumes it has total control over the system and just throws its weight around and wrecks everything.
• 1421[13:50:55] <banisterfiend> greycat no....i am setting up a vpn so i want to ensure there's no dns leaks
• 1422[13:51:01] <greycat> So, read what resolvconf does, understand WHY it exists, understand that you are attempting to contribute to the cesspool of evil that it is fighting against.\
• 1423[13:51:03] <banisterfiend> it's quite a standard practice for vpns
• 1424[13:51:06] <greycat> *plonk*
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• 1426[13:51:58] <banisterfiend> so what's the point in having a vpn if dns is leaking to a possibyl insecure dns server?
• 1427[13:52:01] <SpeedyG> my openvpn connection sets a dns, as propagated by the vpn server once the connection is made.. but sets all its stuff in /etc/resolv.conf
• 1428[13:52:12] <greycat> I'm so sorry to hear that.
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• 1432[13:52:46] <greycat> Was Debian's resolvconf able to put a hack in place to fix it? Or did you just decide to live with it>
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• 1434[13:52:58] <banisterfiend> SpeedyG hm you mean it just overwrites /etc/resolv.conf, it doesn't try to work with whatever network manager is setting dns?
• 1435[13:53:41] <SpeedyG> banisterfiend: I guess (but thats where my knowledge is limited) that it just uses resolvconf to fix /etc/resolv.conf and add the appropriate search and dns stuff in there
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• 1448[14:02:11] <themill> banisterfiend: if you're doing network-manager and VPNs, why not configure the DNS via the n-m VPN config?
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• 1495[14:28:35] <annadane> is there a way to get scroll wrapping on the panel in xfce?
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• 1517[14:38:48] <jelly> annadane: scroll of what?
• 1518[14:38:58] <greycat> scroll of enchant armor
• 1519[14:39:04] <jelly> +2 ?
• 1520[14:39:28] <mason> vorpal config
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• 1522[14:40:58] <colo-work> secret word
• 1523[14:41:00] <colo-work> breach
• 1524[14:41:07] <annadane> jelly, cycling through open applications in the panel with the scroll bar
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• 1526[14:41:19] <jelly> oh, in the window list
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• 1529[14:41:34] * mason grits his teeth and installs the Kernel of Vecna.
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• 1531[14:42:50] <colo-work> oh crap
• 1532[14:42:53] <colo-work> timestop
• 1533[14:43:13] <colo-work> haste
• 1534[14:43:18] * colo-work runs away as far as possible
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• 1537[14:43:42] <jelly> rocks fall. everyone dies.
• 1538[14:43:53] <annadane> s/scroll bar/mouse scroll button
• 1539[14:44:09] <mason> annadane: scroll wheel?
• 1540[14:44:13] <annadane> yeah that
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• 1548[14:49:37] <mason> annadane: I don't know of one, but I find that keyboard navigation of windows (tiling navigation) works very well. I whipped up a script and I bind it to keys to change windows and desktops.
• 1549[14:50:01] <mason> Unfortunately, xfwm is a bit buggy in its handling of window activation events, but it works well with other windows managers.
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• 1569[15:07:17] <c0sm0s888> Can anyone help to disable built in wereless adapter ?
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• 1581[15:13:49] <RNM> hi c0sm0s888
• 1582[15:14:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1390
• 1583[15:14:07] <RNM> have you tried using iwconfig?
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• 1585[15:14:44] <RNM> ip link set wlp2s0 down
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• 1587[15:15:03] <RNM> that should work
• 1588[15:15:13] <RNM> replace wlp2s0 if your device
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• 1590[15:15:30] <RNM> * replace wlp2s0 with you device
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• 1598[15:19:06] <ruffni> is there a guide of how to move an external drive, which i run debian of, to an internal partition on my mbp? i copied it, but am afraid to mess up my macos configs if i install grub on /dev/sda. i get grub to start booting process manually, but it hangs..
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• 1601[15:20:31] <selckin> dangerous operation either way, so make a backup and start playing(aka learning)
• 1602[15:20:58] *** Joins: xsisec (~xsisec@replaced-ip)
• 1603[15:21:01] <m_g_lewis> c0sm0s888: Check your BIOS settings on boot to see if you can disable it...also, some laptops have a function key (example <FN+F8>) that disables it...
• 1604[15:21:07] <ruffni> :) so back to what i'm used to do
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• 1608[15:21:52] <dob1> hi, why this doesn't work: sudo iptables -A FORWARD -i enp0s3 -s ip1, ip2 -d ip3 -j DROP (ip1, ip2, ip3 are real ips). I an a lot of tutorials I see it working
• 1609[15:22:38] <greycat> if nobody here knows, try the #netfilter channel
• 1610[15:22:49] <ruffni> _can_ i actually back up the MBR of sda?
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• 1613[15:23:34] <colo-work> dob1, you can't have a list of ipaddrs in a source or destination match. you can have a cidr description, or you can look into ipsets.
• 1614[15:24:00] <colo-work> ruffni, the first sector of your disk contains it, along with the (MBR-based) partiiton table
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• 1616[15:24:11] <RNM> ruffni, i think ..it can be backup.. via DD
• 1617[15:24:22] <colo-work> dd if=/dev/sda of=backup count=1
• 1618[15:24:46] <greycat> I would explicitly give a block size.
• 1619[15:24:54] <colo-work> I doubt your mac cares about the content of the MBR, though
• 1620[15:24:58] <colo-work> (but I am not sure=
• 1621[15:25:11] <colo-work> greycat, POSIX should mandate that to be 512 bytes, I think
• 1622[15:25:16] *** Quits: st-gourichon-fid (~Stephane@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 1623[15:25:19] <ruffni> that's what i'm wondering. if i mess up, i might brick my mbp, right?
• 1624[15:25:29] <greycat> you're probably correct, but not seeing the block size there makes me *really* nervous.
• 1625[15:25:40] <colo-work> ruffni, you don't brick it, but you might have to reinstall (any) OS
• 1626[15:26:33] <m_g_lewis> ruffni: replaced-url
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• 1630[15:27:00] <ruffni> thanks!
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• 1633[15:27:20] <m_g_lewis> No problem...
• 1634[15:27:38] <colo-work> the MBR code is worth less than the partition table
• 1635[15:27:56] <colo-work> (grub can write a new one, if needed, for instance. but it can't re-create you partition table out of thin air.)
• 1636[15:28:19] *** Quits: beaver (~none@replaced-ip) (Quit: Viva Ubuntu & Debian like)
• 1637[15:29:09] <ruffni> how do i back up my partition table? just recreate from scratch before reinstalling the os-s?
• 1638[15:30:06] <ruffni> *if all fails
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• 1642[15:32:50] <inch> ruffni: parted /dev/sda unit b print
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• 1659[15:44:00] <uniqdom> Hello, I know what backport is, but, what is a backport-sloppy?
• 1660[15:44:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1397
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• 1663[15:45:27] <dob1> colo-work, I was reading this replaced-url
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• 1667[15:46:26] <bites> uniqdom: packages backported from testing to oldstable. they can mess with the upgrade path from oldstable -> stable
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• 1669[15:47:19] <uniqdom> I see, so jessie-backport get freezed, and jessie-backport-sloppy gets created?
• 1670[15:47:32] *** Quits: juko (~juko@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 1671[15:47:59] <bites> yes.
• 1672[15:48:15] <uniqdom> Thanks : )
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• 1768[16:43:19] <petn-randall> Can anyone recommend a label printer for Debian? The most common models seem to be from Brother, and their Linux support is very crappy.
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• 1774[16:44:11] <daniel-mcr> petn-randall: We use Dymo
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• 1779[16:48:32] <petn-randall> daniel-mcr: How is the Debian or Linux support? Does it work fine there?
• 1780[16:49:38] <daniel-mcr> We had it attached to a rasperry pi and now a laptop, Debian Stretch.
• 1781[16:49:44] <daniel-mcr> Works fine.
• 1782[16:50:20] <daniel-mcr> I think it is a Dymo Labelwriter 450
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• 1784[16:51:45] <petn-randall> daniel-mcr: Nice, thanks for the tip!
• 1785[16:53:10] <daniel-mcr> petn-randall: thank you for your input earlier regarding my issue, I have some clarification on my issue. It is the update manager (software-properties-gtk), when you click on the update tab the dropdown 'when there are other updates' is blank.
• 1786[16:53:12] <jelly> we have horribly old Dymo models without serial or usb, keyobard only, and we like them
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• 1788[16:53:30] <daniel-mcr> petn-randall: nps
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• 1806[17:02:08] <csehl> does anyone know by chance which package would contain the font "source code pro"?
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• 1810[17:03:50] <avu> csehl: apt-file may be able to help you figure that out
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• 1814[17:05:43] <csehl> avu: good one, thanks
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• 1823[17:09:51] <xsisec> hi guys I am uses debian stretch 9 see apt-cache policy here 'replaced-url
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• 1869[17:29:44] <annadane> xsisec, if you think you need to install qt5-default, install it? it's in stretch
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• 1873[17:32:04] <annadane> xsisec, that being said, i can't vouch for your entire list of errors. you may or may not need more than qt5-default, i have no idea. but you can check to see if packages exist in stretch and if they're there, well, then, install them, if you have the disk space
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• 1882[17:34:07] <annadane> xsisec, or of course contact the upstream authors to see what you truly need and mention you're on debian 9, etc
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• 1884[17:34:47] <csehl> what can i do if my fc-list shows my newly installed font, but xlsfonts doesn't?
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• 1890[17:36:45] <xsisec> annadane, i have completly a clean version of stretch now and this is exactly why I had multi different sources since this is almost not possible to compile this program
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• 1894[17:37:40] <csehl> maybe it will work, even though not listed in xlsfonts. brb, checking
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• 1898[17:39:17] <xsisec> ..
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• 1902[17:40:29] <Peyam> hi. where is that local source.list?
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• 1904[17:40:58] <Peyam> when I do apt update the error is not related to repos that are located in /etc/apt/sources.list
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• 1906[17:41:31] <annadane> /etc/apt/sources.list.d maybe
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• 1916[17:48:03] <bluenemo> I would like to ssh -A root@server then there use sudo to run a git clone git@github.com:foo/bar.git using the SSH_AUTH_SOCK of the user I logged in with. I've tried setting Defaults env_keep+="SSH_AUTH_SOCK" in /etc/sudoers and using sudo -HE without effect - the only thing that works is a chmod g=rwx $SSH_AUTH_SOCK which looks very ugly to me :(
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• 1922[17:52:10] <diogenes_> Happy Halloween!
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• 1925[17:54:33] <annadane> i'm going to dress up as a windows user
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• 1927[17:54:38] <annadane> help, my computer doesn't work
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• 1929[17:55:08] <diogenes_> lol
• 1930[17:55:19] <jelly> have you tried turning it off and on again
• 1931[17:56:24] <greycat> replaced-url
• 1932[17:58:48] <jelly> that's pretty much how some people would like this channel to operate
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• 1936[18:00:44] <andril> o/
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• 1940[18:01:23] <andril> i have a n00b question
• 1941[18:01:40] <jelly> !ask
• 1942[18:01:40] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
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• 1945[18:03:40] <andril> coming back to Debian how hard is it to upgrade to the next build after installing 9.5?
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• 1948[18:04:31] <greycat> 9.x is the current stable release.
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• 1951[18:05:12] <greycat> "upgrading" to a non-stable release isn't hard, if it works; it's just risky, because the non-stable branches may be broken, and they are definitely not supported by the security team
• 1952[18:05:13] <annadane> andril, it depends what you mean. regular package updates within releases are pretty simple. when buster becomes the new stable in july of next year (ish), there'll be release notes
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• 1955[18:05:34] <annadane> that's for stable. moving to testing/sid is another quesrion
• 1956[18:05:36] <annadane> question
• 1957[18:05:44] <andril> ok just wanting to know if it took tweaking or will it be simple
• 1958[18:05:57] <andril> trying to stay stable and current
• 1959[18:06:11] <annadane> subscribing to debian-security-announce@lists.debian.org is a good idea
• 1960[18:06:14] <greycat> receiving updates to the stable release is super easy
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• 1962[18:06:21] <andril> can't stomach Buntu life always loved Debian
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• 1964[18:06:52] <andril> upgrades to Buster
• 1965[18:07:07] <n4dir> andril: depends on your hardware. If you had to put in some extra work for this installation, it might also be the case for the upgarde stretch-buster. I for one was always lucky; and a simple apt-cache update; apt-get upgrade; apt-get dist-upgrade; was all which was needed.
• 1966[18:07:10] <greycat> !Buster
• 1967[18:07:10] <dpkg> The release following Debian 9 "Stretch" is codenamed "Buster" (Andy's pet Dachshund in Toy Story) and will be Debian 10. replaced-url
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• 1969[18:07:25] <greycat> Buster isn't stable yet. Probably in the middle of next year it will be.
• 1970[18:07:26] <jelly> andril: minor release points are just patches. Each major release comes with documented procedure for in-place release upgrade in the <release notes>. That procedure usually takes maybe 2 hours for an experienced debian user, not counting reading the docs.
• 1971[18:07:29] <annadane> buster is currently debian testing. is that really what you want? because testing can/will be more broken than stable sometimes. define your use case
• 1972[18:07:40] <andril> ok cool
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• 1974[18:08:14] <andril> n4dir: my laptop is capable and speced out just need to get back to something solid
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• 1976[18:08:32] <andril> thanks jelly
• 1977[18:08:42] <jelly> so going to 9.6 is jsut regular patches. Going to 10 when it's out will be covered in buster release notes.
• 1978[18:08:43] <andril> my ass done been learned lol
• 1979[18:08:59] <n4dir> andril: i meant hardware like nouveau. I hear stories about it, but never had the pleasure myself.
• 1980[18:09:06] <jelly> eg this is for 8 -> 9
• 1981[18:09:11] <jelly> dpkg, jessie->stretch
• 1982[18:09:11] <dpkg> Read (at least) the upgrading chapter of the <release notes> replaced-url
• 1983[18:09:34] <andril> yeah i recall some stuff and notice nouveau missing
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• 1985[18:09:40] <annadane> note that one shouldn't wait for the next point release to do upgrades, security fixes etc, and instead do them as they become available
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• 1987[18:10:04] <greycat> Most people, anyway.
• 1988[18:10:17] <annadane> hence the suggestion to subscribe to the aforementioned mailing list because security updates are the most common updates within Stable
• 1989[18:10:21] <andril> going to reinstall
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• 1992[18:10:34] <greycat> I could imagine a niche case where a non-Internet-facing machine is mission critical and cares more about stability and uptime than immediate security fixes.
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• 1994[18:10:39] <annadane> yep
• 1995[18:11:00] <annadane> point releases are more relevant to non internet facing machines
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• 2035[18:34:29] <andril> any one have any good extensions or themes to share?
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• 2054[18:43:00] <chele> hi there, is anybody experiencing high cpu load with firefox. just normal browsing. i am in testing...
• 2055[18:43:20] <annadane> !debian-next
• 2056[18:43:20] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
• 2057[18:43:42] *** Quits: daniel-mcr (~daniel-mc@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2058[18:43:55] <chele> annadane: aa sorry. wrong channel.
• 2059[18:45:26] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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• 2067[18:49:52] <andril> need some legit sourcelists
• 2068[18:50:08] *** Joins: RandomBooklo (~RandomBoo@replaced-ip)
• 2069[18:50:20] <greycat> !stretch sources.list
• 2070[18:50:21] <annadane> !stretch sources.list
• 2071[18:50:21] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Stretch" has three lines: "deb replaced-url
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• 2073[18:50:44] <greycat> This is not Ubuntu. We don't add a bunch of "repos" from all around the world.
• 2074[18:51:03] <andril> ununderstood
• 2075[18:52:10] *** Quits: Ilyas (uid43013@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
• 2076[18:52:55] <andril> just want to be functional
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• 2080[18:53:18] <greycat> Everyone has a different definition of "functional".
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• 2096[19:02:59] <flj> replaced-url
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• 2099[19:03:37] <greycat> It installs as much of Debian as you ask it to. Yes, this includes a boot loader (GRUB typically).
• 2100[19:03:38] <SerajewelKS> flj: the first ISO contains the complete installer with bootloader
• 2101[19:04:01] <greycat> Whatever packages you request that are not on the CD will be downloaded from the Internet.
• 2102[19:04:02] <SerajewelKS> and enough packages to have a running system. it doesn't contain all of debian but you can install packages from the network later.
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• 2104[19:04:32] <flj> Full system meaning after installing you can restart the computer and you have a working system?
• 2105[19:04:36] <greycat> yes
• 2106[19:04:38] *** Quits: Codyer (~user@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 2107[19:05:12] <flj> It should be no problem to install on an usb hdd?
• 2108[19:05:18] *** Quits: eddof13 (~eddof13@replaced-ip) (Quit: eddof13)
• 2109[19:05:40] <greycat> I've never done it personally, but it should work.
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• 2112[19:06:18] <flj> One person said he could not get the bootloader to work. That is why I am asking.
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• 2115[19:07:02] <flj> Thanks I stop.
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• 2117[19:07:30] <greycat> well, that was odd
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• 2124[19:08:08] <KdeKris> Quick question, I'd like to attempt to test or even full switch to wayland on my current Debian 9 laptop. However, I see on the debian wiki that Wayland requires plasma 5.4. My system info shows I'm on 5.13.5. Can I upgrade, and if so, how?
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• 2127[19:08:51] <greycat> wouldn't 5.13.5 be newer than 5.4?
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• 2129[19:09:19] <annadane> first off if you're on 5.13 you're not on debian 9
• 2130[19:09:30] <annadane> second, it surely means "requires 5.4 minimum"
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• 2133[19:10:01] <annadane> debian 9 has kde plasma 5.8
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• 2135[19:10:17] <KdeKris> annadane, I think you may have solved like 99% of my confusion just now.
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• 2138[19:10:49] <annadane> that's true in 99% of cases. if you see "requires blah" it's safe to assume it means "requires at least"
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• 2140[19:10:53] <KdeKris> A while back, I ran a test install of 9, and must have rolled back without remembering.
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• 2143[19:11:05] <annadane> and for those other 1%... then the people writing the documentation/making the product are usually just idiots
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• 2145[19:11:27] <KdeKris> I'm so sorry to bother you guys. I'll run 9 in a VM to test for a while, then just upgrade if I decide I like it.
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• 2151[19:12:37] <KdeKris> Yeah, I just ran "cat /etc/issue" I'm on sid
• 2152[19:12:42] <KdeKris> not stretch.
• 2153[19:12:53] <KdeKris> I feel like a moron now.
• 2154[19:12:58] <annadane> sid is the "unstable" branch of debian, with frequent changes and/or breakage
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• 2156[19:13:18] <annadane> and you can't really downgrade to stretch comfortably; if you want debian stable (stretch) i'd just reinstall
• 2157[19:13:32] <KdeKris> I switch to sid because it uses the version of mesa that I need for steam games to run properly.
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• 2159[19:13:51] <annadane> fair enough, just know what you're dealing with
• 2160[19:14:05] <annadane> also, pretty sure a lot of mesa is in
• 2161[19:14:06] <annadane> !backports
• 2162[19:14:06] <dpkg> A backport is a package from a newer Debian branch, compiled from source for an older branch to avoid dependency and <ABI> complications. replaced-url
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• 2166[19:14:47] <KdeKris> My brain has been kind of fried for the past couple of months
• 2167[19:14:50] <annadane> replaced-url
• 2168[19:15:24] <KdeKris> Wait, if sid is the unstable, and therefore "newer"? version of debian, wouldn't it use the newer version of plasma as well?
• 2169[19:15:30] <annadane> correct
• 2170[19:15:47] <KdeKris> So....5.13 is newer than 5.4?
• 2171[19:15:48] <greycat> And as I said before, 5.13 is newer than 5.4
• 2172[19:15:51] <greycat> Yes.
• 2173[19:15:54] <annadane> 5.13 is newer than 5.4.
• 2174[19:15:55] *** Joins: Strife89 (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 2175[19:16:03] <annadane> version numbers typically go higher, not lower
• 2176[19:16:06] *** Quits: m0j0dj0dj0 (~punk3r@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
• 2177[19:16:09] <KdeKris> wait, again. I feel like an idiot.
• 2178[19:16:19] *** Joins: eddof13 (~eddof13@replaced-ip)
• 2179[19:16:28] <KdeKris> I was looking at the 1, in 13, thinking 4 is newer than 1
• 2180[19:16:39] <annadane> nooooo.
• 2181[19:16:40] <KdeKris> Maybe I should try this when my brain has had some rest.
• 2182[19:16:51] <annadane> maybe. i took a nap yesterday. i felt better. same may apply to you.
• 2183[19:17:12] <jelly> KdeKris: if you want more confusion, do a web search for semantic versioning
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• 2186[19:18:08] <annadane> dpkg, notavailstable is <reply> replaced-url
• 2187[19:18:09] <dpkg> okay, annadane
• 2188[19:18:14] <KdeKris> jelly, no thanks. I'm good. hahahahaha
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• 2194[19:19:07] <KdeKris> What version is buster again?
• 2195[19:19:10] <KdeKris> 8?
• 2196[19:19:15] <jelly> to be 10
• 2197[19:19:31] <jelly> unless debian switches to X or whatnot
• 2198[19:19:44] <jelly> !release history
• 2199[19:19:44] <dpkg> Named after "Toy Story" characters. Buzz(1.1; 1996-03-14), Rex(1.2; 1996-10-28), Bo(1.3; 1997-05-01), Hamm(2.0; 1998-07-24), Slink(2.1; 1999-03-09), Potato(2.2; 2000-08-15), Woody(3.0; 2002-07-19), Sarge(3.1; 2005-06-06), Etch(4.0; 2007-04-08), Lenny(5.0; 2009-02-14), Squeeze(6.0; 2011-02-06), Wheezy(7; 2013-05-04), Jessie(8; 2015-04-25), Stretch (9; 2017-06-17). Next: Buster. replaced-url
• 2200[19:19:44] *** Quits: Itaipu (~itaipu@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2201[19:20:04] <annadane> 8 is jessie, oldstable, not supported any more except for the LTS initiative. stable is 9, the current "supported" and most recommended vesion of debian
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• 2205[19:20:15] <KdeKris> dpkg. Holy crap, I never new that. Now it makes sense. Thank you
• 2206[19:20:22] <annadane> (9 is also called stretch, the release name)
• 2207[19:20:23] <jelly> mostest recommendedest
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• 2211[19:21:02] <jelly> debian vernacular uses codenames more often than numbers because REASONS
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• 2216[19:21:22] <KdeKris> So, Since I'm on Sid, with Plasma 5.13, theoretically, Wayland should work perfectly?
• 2217[19:21:31] <jelly> it's not just to make people feel dumb, honest
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• 2219[19:21:44] <annadane> it's more supported than in earlier versions but it's still a developing technology and it probably also depends on your graphics card
• 2220[19:22:04] <jelly> KdeKris: well. "sid" and "perfectly" don't necessarily go together
• 2221[19:22:13] <jelly> !sid
• 2222[19:22:13] <dpkg> somebody said sid was the codename for <unstable>, named after the kid in Toy Story that breaks toys. The great thing about running sid is that when it breaks, you get to keep ALL the pieces!!
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• 2224[19:22:18] <KdeKris> jelly, it only made me feel dumb because I didn't know the reasons for the codenames.
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• 2226[19:22:43] <annadane> since you're on sid, the next upgrade may leave you with... interesting problems. stable won't have those and tries to not break people's stuff
• 2227[19:23:05] <KdeKris> now I understand sind dpkg showed the codenames info.
• 2228[19:23:43] <KdeKris> annadane, so when the next stable drops, I should probably just do a clean install if I want to switch to that?
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• 2230[19:24:09] <jelly> well, reinstallation is always an option regardless of what you have right before
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• 2233[19:24:39] <annadane> when the next stable drops there's what are called "release notes"
• 2234[19:24:50] <KdeKris> jelly, always AN option, but is it always the BEST option?
• 2235[19:24:51] <annadane> you don't have to clean install, some people do prefer that
• 2236[19:25:13] <annadane> if you're on sid however... none of that applies, you'll just still be on sid (unstable)
• 2237[19:25:15] *** Quits: Plan_IX (~P9@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
• 2238[19:25:27] <jelly> KdeKris: I like Debian's ability to do an in-place upgrade from release N-1 to release N.
• 2239[19:25:48] <KdeKris> My guess would be that the next stable will probably include a lot of the same packages that Sid is currently using.
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• 2241[19:25:54] <jelly> but you can't really go from sid to anywhere else
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• 2245[19:26:16] <annadane> correct, KdeKris
• 2246[19:26:18] <n4dir> if you got enough time you could probably go back to testing
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• 2249[19:26:33] <annadane> see replaced-url
• 2250[19:27:20] <jelly> KdeKris: testing and unstable are pretty close in package sets and versions right now, before the "freeze" part of the release process. "testing" points to "buster" right now and that's what's going to become Debian 10 eventually
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• 2252[19:28:13] <KdeKris> Unfortunately, I don't have that kind of time. It would be faster and easier to just clean install when the next stable hits. whenever that may be.
• 2253[19:28:38] <greycat> that is an option, yes
• 2254[19:28:41] <annadane> julyish of next year
• 2255[19:28:48] <annadane> "when it's ready"
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• 2257[19:29:20] <annadane> you can still clean install now if you want, and look into mesa backports, like i said most of it should be backported, from memory
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• 2264[19:32:38] <jelly> !buster pool 1
• 2265[19:32:38] <dpkg> ! themill=2019-06-15
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• 2267[19:33:15] <jelly> dpkg, buster pool 1 is also jëlly=2019-08-01
• 2268[19:33:16] <dpkg> okay, jelly
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• 2270[19:33:49] <annadane> that's a fist fight waiting to happen
• 2271[19:33:56] <tw> did you put an umlaut over that so it doesn't nick alert you?
• 2272[19:34:04] <jelly> KdeKris: we determine the release date through the exact science of "making a wild-ass guess"
• 2273[19:34:05] <tw> irc pro move right there
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• 2275[19:34:56] <KdeKris> jelly, that's my favorite kind of science.
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• 2277[19:35:23] <annadane> if you want stable to release earlier, volunteer to fix release critical bugs after the freeze
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• 2282[19:36:16] <KdeKris> annadane, how time consuming would it be to be part of that volunteer team?
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• 2285[19:36:31] <annadane> i dunno
• 2286[19:36:35] *** pav is now known as phd
• 2287[19:36:38] * jelly nods, nay, bangs head to Räṁṁṡẗëïṅ
• 2288[19:36:57] <greycat> who the hell made up an accented m
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• 2293[19:38:15] <KdeKris> time is gonna be the number one factor for me with this kind of thing. I'm in the military, but starting back in college with a goal of becoming a linux systems admin at some point.
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• 2295[19:39:01] <greycat> unless you are already an experienced programmer or sys admin, fixing bugs in packages is going to be rather daunting
• 2296[19:39:10] <jelly> tw: the Compose key can be very useful
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• 2298[19:39:25] <KdeKris> I've got a semi-decent foundation (primary distro has been some flavor of linux for ~5 years), but need to get educated on the backend workings before diving into the field head first.
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• 2300[19:39:51] <KdeKris> greycat, don't be discouraging.lol
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• 2307[19:40:51] <tw> We're not even at the buster freeze, so wild-ass guess is right.
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• 2311[19:41:35] <jelly> !buster freeze
• 2312[19:41:35] <dpkg> Buster will start the freeze process on 2019-01-12 see replaced-url
• 2313[19:41:41] <KdeKris> replaced-url
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• 2316[19:42:14] <KdeKris> Dunno how reliable phoronix is considered in the community, but I just spotted this from september last year
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• 2318[19:42:58] <KdeKris> short, but interesting, read
• 2319[19:44:09] <greycat> I'm still waiting for an end-user-friendly explanation of what it *means* to be using Wayland. How is it different from X11? What stops working? What new things start working?
• 2320[19:44:46] <mason> greycat: Remote display stops working. What starts working is shiny new software with a lack of features.
• 2321[19:45:06] <tw> I think nvidia stops working too, but maybe that got fixed.
• 2322[19:45:07] <KdeKris> According to wayland.freedesktop.org, it's supposed to be a "simpler replacement for X"
• 2323[19:45:21] <KdeKris> "Easier to develop and maintain"
• 2324[19:45:23] <greycat> Not sure what you mean by remote display. Setting DISPLAY=hostname:0.0 and using xhost +otherhostname? ssh -X?
• 2325[19:45:40] <tw> both.
• 2326[19:46:24] <tw> You can forward x11 windows over ssh to a wayland-hosted xorg proxy, but wayland windows can't traverse like that.
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• 2330[19:47:45] <csehl> is there any setting that sets xterm fontsize by default, other than the ones i can insert manually with .Xresources? i think my own is being overridden
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• 2332[19:47:58] <tw> ideally, we're getting improved window security because xorg UI event queue is pretty garbage for security. Keystrokes can be grabbed by any application at any time.
• 2333[19:48:01] <KdeKris> So, to build and use wayland, I could follow the simple directions here? replaced-url
• 2334[19:48:25] <greycat> KdeKris: I would suggest you ask in #debian-next on the other network, since none of us are likely to know much about Wayland on post-stable.
• 2335[19:48:47] <KdeKris> greycat. thanks.
• 2336[19:49:25] <greycat> csehl: command-line options should override X resources, which are set by xrdb which typically reads from a file in $HOME during X session startup
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• 2339[19:49:50] <tw> It's going to be interesting to see how wayland breaks UI automated testing and also assistive technology, or if that has already been worked out.
• 2340[19:49:51] <jelly> csehl: you have to tell the X server to (re)load and changes you make to .Xresources, otherwise it's only read once at login time
• 2341[19:49:59] <jelly> any* changes
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• 2346[19:50:29] <greycat> "xrdb -merge ~/.Xresources" or similar
• 2347[19:52:02] <jelly> yeah, sorry
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• 2350[19:54:17] <jelly> csehl: does "appres XTerm" show the expected values?
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• 2354[19:55:08] <jelly> (lots of output, pipe to grep or less)
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• 2374[20:01:13] <CountJordiGHula> Is there a Debian font for 𓂸?
• 2375[20:01:45] <CountJordiGHula> It's not in unifont. :-(
• 2376[20:01:53] <tw> going to need to be more specific about which codepoint you've sent.
• 2377[20:02:05] <CountJordiGHula> Well, I sent utf-8, I hope.
• 2378[20:02:36] <CountJordiGHula> 0130B8, is what I see in the little box.
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• 2383[20:04:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1408
• 2384[20:04:49] <greycat> hex-dumping that gives me f0 93 82 b8 and it took me several minutes of flailing around in Google to find U+130B8𓂸f0 93 82 b8EGYPTIAN HIEROGLYPH D052
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• 2386[20:05:02] <csehl> jelly: i have [[ -f ~/.Xresources ]] && xrdb -merge ~/.Xresources in .xsession and appres XTerm | grep size does not reflect my settings
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• 2388[20:05:40] <greycat> I guess I should have simply pasted the actual character into google instead of the hex digits
• 2389[20:05:46] * CountJordiGHula tries fonts-ancient-scripts
• 2390[20:05:48] <csehl> jelly: my .xsession is deffo ran though
• 2391[20:06:01] <CountJordiGHula> Ah, there we go, that worked.
• 2392[20:06:03] <CountJordiGHula> Unicode penis.
• 2393[20:06:07] <CountJordiGHula> 𓂸
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• 2396[20:06:13] <greycat> In a font that nobody can see.
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• 2398[20:06:21] <CountJordiGHula> I can now and that's all that matters.
• 2399[20:07:39] <jelly> ,file symbola.ttf
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• 2401[20:07:44] <judd> No packages in stretch/amd64 were found with that file.
• 2402[20:08:00] <CountJordiGHula> I'm just surprised it's not in unifont, though.
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• 2411[20:12:42] <jelly> at least you weren't asking for colored emoticons.
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• 2451[20:33:57] <cybrNaut> rm $HOME/.config/autostart/wire.desktop
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• 2453[20:34:11] <cybrNaut> ^ someone says to remove the "old" way of autostarting
• 2454[20:34:16] <cybrNaut> what's the new way?
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• 2460[20:36:06] <EdePopede> CountJordiGHula: Liberation Mono shows it (if hexchat isn't lying to me)
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• 2464[20:36:46] <CountJordiGHula> EdePopede: Pretty sure Hexchat is fillingin with another font because Liberation Mono certainly doesn't have it.
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• 2466[20:37:34] <noahmg123_> Activation: (wifi) association took too long
• 2467[20:37:46] <noahmg123_> (is an error I'm getting)
• 2468[20:37:56] <noahmg123_> When I try to connect to a specific access point
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• 2470[20:39:20] <Andrew_0010bit> Sounds like there's a part of the handshake that's failing.
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• 2472[20:39:25] <Andrew_0010bit> Four-way handshake, I believe it is.
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• 2474[20:39:28] <Andrew_0010bit> WPA2.
• 2475[20:39:33] <jelly> CountJordiGHula: yeah, hexchat will do that
• 2476[20:39:42] <noahmg123_> Andrew_0010bit: Yeah, is there a way to look closer into it?
• 2477[20:39:49] <Andrew_0010bit> Absolutely!
• 2478[20:40:20] <noahmg123_> Perfect, what log do I have to look at? I'm currently looking at my NetworkManager logs
• 2479[20:40:30] <noahmg123_> Or am I thinking about this wrong?
• 2480[20:40:49] <Andrew_0010bit> Actually, I may be lying to you unintentionally. I look at the AP logs, but I THINK tcpdump can capture these packets.
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• 2483[20:41:38] <noahmg123_> Hm, ok so run tcpdump and then try to connect to the access point?
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• 2486[20:43:30] <noahmg123_> Andrew_0010bit: ^?
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• 2488[20:44:06] <EdePopede> CountJordiGHula: tried a couple of fonts in Mousepad, sometimes it looks different after switching, sometimes i'm not sure. but there was never a box. even in a 3D font it looked pretty the same. could some other layer cheat on us which wasn't there in previous versions?
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• 2491[20:45:06] <Andrew_0010bit> noahmg123_, replaced-url
• 2492[20:46:01] <noahmg123_> Andrew_0010bit: thank you :)
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• 2495[20:46:58] <noahmg123_> Andrew_0010bit: wait, if I turn the interface on monitor mode, I can't connect to the access point, thus I can't figure out what's wrong with the handshake
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• 2502[20:51:00] <Andrew_0010bit> D'oh!
• 2503[20:51:10] <Andrew_0010bit> I had a second WiFi adapter when I used to do this.
• 2504[20:51:43] <Andrew_0010bit> That's going to really complicate things.
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• 2509[20:54:53] <noahmg123> Andrew_0010bit: I do have a second one, but not on me currently. I can try it later though.
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• 2511[20:55:31] <cybrNaut> something is auto-starting on my system at the user level, but I don't see a hook for it in ~/.config/autostart/. Where else should I look?
• 2512[20:55:58] <greycat> crontab, or whatever dot files your method of login uses
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• 2518[20:58:19] <cybrNaut> greycat: there has to be something else.. i think ~/.config/autostart/ was obsoleted and there's a new gnome way
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• 2520[20:58:42] <cybrNaut> crontab is empty.. .bashrc and .profile don't have the mystery app
• 2521[20:59:12] <cybrNaut> well, i say mystery, but I did install GNU Ring myself.. just not sure where it put the hook
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• 2533[21:03:45] <jelly> cybrNaut: I "solved" that by purging the "ring" package
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• 2535[21:04:28] <greycat> oh, it could also be a systemd user ... uh ... thing?
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• 2537[21:05:04] <jelly> I suspect a .desktop file somewhere with an autostart thingy inside
• 2538[21:05:20] <cybrNaut> jelly: that wouldn't work in my case, because i think wherever gnu ring puts the autostart hook is also where wire-desktop is also putting its hook, and it's wire-desktop that i need to troubleshoot
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• 2540[21:06:07] <cybrNaut> wire-desktop is launching on top of tor, which i don't always want.. but i cannot find the place to control that
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• 2565[21:19:25] <banisterfiend> hi, i'm trying to change my dns servers, but it seems no matter what i do i can only append to the dns servers that came from dhcp, i can't remove it
• 2566[21:19:27] <banisterfiend> why is that?
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• 2573[21:21:34] <jelly> banisterfiend: what did you actually try?
• 2574[21:21:44] <jelly> !override dns
• 2575[21:21:44] <dpkg> To have dhclient etc not touch /etc/resolv.conf, the best plan is to configure it not to touch that file. See replaced-url
• 2576[21:22:08] <banisterfiend> jelly nmcli con mod "Wired connection 1" -ipv4.dns 10.211.55.1
• 2577[21:22:16] <banisterfiend> where 10.211.55.1 is the gateway ip (from dhcp)
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• 2579[21:22:40] <banisterfiend> jelly i also tried just replacing ipv4.dns by using: nmcli con mod "Wired connection 1" ipv4.dns 8.8.8.8 8.8.8.4.4
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• 2582[21:23:02] <banisterfiend> nothing worked, they're all just appened to the list of DNS servers *after* the gateway ip
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• 2621[21:47:58] <jhutchins> banisterfiend: Maybe that's bcause you didn't follow the directions posted above.
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• 2679[22:22:34] <heller> hey guys
• 2680[22:22:42] <heller> does apt updates run at http?
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• 2682[22:22:59] <heller> could i use squid as a proxy to not have to always download everything from internet
• 2683[22:23:08] <heller> i mean if i have multiple debians under the same LAN
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• 2688[22:25:08] <bites> heller: yes and yes.
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• 2691[22:26:20] <qman> See also: squid-deb-proxy
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• 2698[22:31:35] <heller> well i might make use of squid anyway
• 2699[22:31:40] <heller> so its not bad to install it to a router
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• 2781[23:19:59] <no_gravity> Hello! When I type hieroglyphs in my terminal, they overlap with the ascii characters: for ($𓅨=0;$𓅨<10;$𓅨++) echo $𓅨;
• 2782[23:20:06] <no_gravity> Anything I can do to fix this?
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• 2787[23:22:45] <somiaj> sounds like a font issue, maybe find a different utf-8 font for hieroglyphs?
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• 2789[23:23:15] <no_gravity> I love the font of my terminal.
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• 2791[23:23:58] <somiaj> is the heiroglyph font monospace, maybe find a monospace version of it?
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• 2795[23:25:16] <no_gravity> Does the terminal use a different font for some chars?
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• 2797[23:26:00] <somiaj> It hsould use a single font, but it uses monospace (all characters take up the same width) while most modern fonts are not monospace, different characters can take up different widths. Which kinda sounds like what is going on with your hieroglph font
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