252[04:40:25] <hanasaki> on current stretch... any idea why the
default install leads to this and how to fix? kernel: [51865.316142]
audit: type=1400 audit(1519270782.274:1146):
apparmor="DENIED" operation="ptrace"
profile="/usr/sbin/libvirtd" pid=733
comm="libvirtd" requested_mask="trace"
denied_mask="trace"
peer="libvirt-654a2de1-6dbf-458b-ab54-15841da4fe53"
253[04:42:31] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
280[05:13:26] <hanasaki> what's value does firmware free
and irqbalance bring?
281[05:13:32] <somiaj> hanasaki: partly mine, I know that
apprmor is being tested in buster at the momement, didn't
realize it would affect the backports kernel though.
282[05:13:34] <hanasaki> I thought selinux was the standard?
283[05:14:03] <somiaj> debian is only recentally trying to
change from no tool to apparmor as default.
284[05:14:13] <hanasaki> somiaj: you are the backport builder?
285[05:14:33] <somiaj> hanasaki: not in debian. Anyways, there
are kernel parameters you can use to turn apparmor off, or you can
try to figure out how to write policy files for it.
286[05:14:38] <hanasaki> selinux is a pain to config :( RH has
it on by default
287[05:14:39] <somiaj> hanasaki: I am not, only a hobbiest
288[05:14:56] <hanasaki> tried kernel 4.15.x?
289[05:15:52] <somiaj> In this case it seems to me it is either
an issue with fixing the apparmor rules to meet your needs, or just
disable it.
291[05:16:46] <somiaj> apparmor is available in stretch, but is
not default. They are testing to make it default in buster, but so
far it is only testing, I don't think any decisions has been
made if it will be included by default in buster yet or not.
292[05:16:48] <hanasaki> true. however it should work as
installed and not block an install of another package from debian
293[05:17:08] <somiaj> hanasaki: and I think the backport
kernels which come from buster include this recommended package of
apparmor because of that.
294[05:17:22] <hanasaki> built 4.15.x ... fails to boot.. cannot
find the boot partition :)
295[05:17:40] <somiaj> hanasaki: well it does need to be tested.
You can disable/remove apparmor to go back to how stretch is by
'default'
296[05:18:15] <hanasaki> thanks
297[05:18:32] <hanasaki> the 4.15 issue is diff than appamor
302[05:22:02] <metalbat97> i try to use selenium but have a
problem configuring the PATH variable, what the right configuration
to do? and here
replaced-url
307[05:23:46] <somiaj> does echo $PATH return you something on
the outsdie. Are those two lines of code all that you are using in
your .py file, and the rest is just output?
441[07:42:29] <sleepingforest> I updated my debian machine
(outdated for 2 months) and i cant find out why my iprouting doesnt
work anymore. Notable packages that updated are iproute2 and
linux-image. Im kinda confused on how to debug this.
442[07:42:37] *** Joins: valerius (~valerius@replaced-ip)
443[07:43:10] <sleepingforest> is there a way i can inspect
IPTABLES rules to see where/why its failing?
444[07:43:54] <somiaj> iptables -L will list the rules, or
iptables -t nat -L for other tables.
470[08:03:14] <xtore> Why do we no longer hear any news about
spectre and meltdown; I thought they were a clear and present danger
and hackers were working fulltime to develop exploits around them
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
477[08:06:56] <Zyferus> as far as Mainstream seems concerned
there were software patches tossed out, and new hardware that you
buy 'isn't effected'. So they are lead to believe.
478[08:07:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1500
479[08:07:49] *** Quits: darkhanb (~textual@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
484[08:16:22] <Robby> I have an issue where postfix doesn't
seem to start and systemctl output is useless (simply states it
started, nothing useful) and /var/log/mail.log /var/log/mail.info do
not get written to at all, makes it hard to troubleshoot this
485[08:17:42] <Robby> I wanted to start this manually from the
shell, to see if I can see more, but
/lib/systemd/system/postfix.service contains ExecStart=/bin/true so
that doesn't help :P
516[08:40:19] <fightthewalrus> so, today I learned that
virtualbox is not completely free, and therefore not included in the
default debian repos. I never tried another virtualization solution
before, and I'm mostly a n00b in the field. What does debian
recommend?
517[08:40:21] *** Quits: aidaho (~aidaho@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
546[08:44:37] <fightthewalrus> ok, maybe I should give it a go
before installing virtualbox then. Try new things and stuff
547[08:44:40] <fightthewalrus> thanks guys
548[08:45:12] <alkisg> Many virtualbox drivers are in the
process of being mainlined upstream in the kernel, so it's
quite better that it used to be
549[08:45:17] <alkisg> *then
550[08:45:18] *** Quits: ToBeCloud (uid51591@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
551[08:45:19] <alkisg> *than, meh
552[08:47:15] <somiaj> fightthewalrus: if you install
virt-manager and qemu-kvm, that should pull in the rest.
virt-manager is a gui to manage virtual machines with libvirt.
555[08:50:24] <fightthewalrus> somiaj: that sounds like a sweet
deal. I'll give it a try. Sounds more unix-like too, having the
business and GUI layers provided by different packages and all
556[08:50:35] <fightthewalrus> I will definitely take a look
561[08:53:22] <fightthewalrus> btw, I don't know if
here's the best place to report this, but all pages of the
debian wiki are showing me a 403 - Forbidden page. Maybe it's
just me?
562[08:54:22] <somiaj> are you behind a vpn?
563[08:54:54] <somiaj> I heard mention that some vpns are
blocked due to abuse on the wiki. But it works for me.
583[09:07:02] <somiaj> xtore: any paticular info you are looking
for? There are a combination of software and firmware fixes avaiable
for both meltdown and spectre.
587[09:08:46] <xtore> somiaj, I guess my goal is to go through a
crash course in how it all works and then cook up a 5,000 word
article with a few cheesy infographs on how it works and how a
future app or JS script on a site can pwn the reader's box. And
get tons of reblogs of course.
589[09:09:36] <xtore> so the particular info I would be looking
for is something easily translatable into layman's terms so the
aveage joe can grasp it and choke on their coffee while reading my
entry
697[11:01:41] <jelly> does the controller have a separate HBA
mode for that?
698[11:01:50] <kale> i do not know
699[11:02:20] <jelly> if you haven't exposed the disks
somehow, either by creating arrays, or switching to dumb HBA mode,
there won't be any visible for the OS
700[11:02:52] <kale> jelly: ok, thanks, i'll look into that
701[11:02:55] <jelly> I'm assuming you have a hw raid
controller in there.
739[11:22:23] <kale> ok, have 4 disks now, thanks, next
networking ... i do not have drivers on netinst iso, will i have
more drivers on a bigger installation iso?
740[11:22:49] <jelly> you ought to have all the drivers for that
old a machine
741[11:23:11] <jelly> unless you put a recent card into the
system for some reason or a wifi one
766[11:42:16] <kale> jelly, RoyK and pingfloyd, thank you very
much for your help. This hardware is new to me, and boss wants the
system up soon, so helped me a lot here.
995[13:01:18] <jelly> those build deps look suspiciously dpkgish
996[13:01:33] <pragomer> when trying to build xfdashboard under
stretch I get this when configuring: configure: error: Your intltool
is too old. You need intltool 0.35 or later.
997[13:01:47] *** Joins: Madda (~Madda@replaced-ip)
1057[13:29:28] <fakefur> hi guys i just got this warning when
ssh'ing into my server after an absence of maybe 4 days - i
have changed nothing in the meantime
1058[13:29:31] <fakefur> The authenticity of host
'XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX (XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX)' can't be
established.
1059[13:29:35] *** Quits: e_xistense (~e_xistens@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1060[13:29:37] <fakefur> what does this actually mean?
1061[13:29:40] <sadtaco> Ah sury's. I think I used this
before
1116[13:37:23] <fakefur> i should have figured that out myself
1117[13:37:24] <fakefur> sorry
1118[13:38:26] <deadrom> upgraded deb8 in a VirtualBox to deb9,
upgraded vbox tools, now I cannot Xfwd certain programs anymore.
thunar works, gwenview works, gThumb for example won't:
Gdk-ERROR: "GLXBadContext"
1119[13:38:54] <deadrom> so what's off here, X, gtk3, VBox,
my client?
1219[14:30:46] <Iridos> mkdir -p would of course be a possible
application, although I'd still hate the outcome and want
something that contains the full date on the last level
1277[15:13:20] *** Quits: Riyria (~Riyria@replaced-ip) (Quit: His home wifi router cost more than his car... He is...
the most interesting network tech in the world...)
1362[16:17:53] <jhutchins_wk> Network drivers are rarely built
into the kernel.
1363[16:18:20] <rant> unless its an embedded system
1364[16:18:23] <jelly> !blacklist
1365[16:18:24] <dpkg> To blacklist a Linux kernel module,
create/edit /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.local.conf and add a line
similar to this (without quotes): "blacklist module_name".
If this doesn't work, do 'echo "install modulename
/bin/true" >> /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.local.conf'.
IMPORTANT: ask about <blacklist-initramfs>. To blacklist a
module at installation time, ask me about <installer
blacklist>.
replaced-url
1366[16:18:37] <NEOalquimista> My screen suddenly starts to
flicker on/off only when on Debian GNOME. I tried switching to
another TTY, and the console there flickers too. I need guidance on
which package to report the bug for.
1371[16:20:48] <g0zzy> I could possibly put that in grub.cfg?
1372[16:21:13] <NEOalquimista> jhutchins_wk: it doesn't
happen on other distros, so it couldn't be because of loose
cables on this laptop. I just came from Arch. This issue only starts
on Debian. Never elsewhere. I'm sure of it.
1373[16:21:22] *** Quits: karakedi (~eAC53C340@replaced-ip) (Read error: No route to host)
1381[16:22:45] <rant> NEOalquimista: I'd check dmesg and
Xorg.0.log.. but given all the information my best guess would be a
compositing manager or something and I dont know what if any GNOME
might be using these days
1391[16:27:13] <jelly> NEOalquimista: there are various issues
that can cause flickering, some related to power management issues
in some (older) versions of drivers. Amusingly a nice resource for
workarounds is arch linux wiki
1393[16:28:33] <jelly> NEOalquimista: could be the kernel part of
the driver, but it could be somewhere else in the stack (xorg / dri
/ mesa) that triggers it
1394[16:29:01] <jelly> NEOalquimista: you can try a newer kernel
and see if it accidentally fixes it
1395[16:29:05] <jelly> !bdo kernel
1396[16:29:05] <dpkg> Newer kernels for Debian stable releases
are available from the <stretch-backports> repository. After
modifying your sources.list, run «aptitude update». To
install the current backported kernel: «aptitude -t
stretch-backports install linux-image-`uname -r|sed
's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,'`». To list available backported
kernel image packages: «aptitude search
'?narrow(~nlinux-image,?origin(Debian Backports))'».
1397[16:29:18] <NEOalquimista> okay, i'll take a look
1398[16:29:43] <NEOalquimista> Maybe because it's only on
GNOME, it could be something related to it, like its compositing or
something..?
1399[16:30:33] <NEOalquimista> Oh, right, i'll see the logs
1400[16:31:32] <jelly> obviously gnome does something that
triggers it. Does it continue if you log off gnome and log in
something without a default compositor like xfce
1404[16:32:53] *** Quits: Krennic (~enrique@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1405[16:33:06] <NEOalquimista> I haven't tried it.
Initially, it only triggered it when I used gnome-terminal. I would
open it and type something. At the first keystroke, bang! SCREEN
moving out of place, flickering and all hell breaks loose. Now
it's worse. Out of nowhere.
1406[16:33:26] <NEOalquimista> but I can't reproduce it
reliably
1407[16:33:29] <bitess> i had a problem with a broadwell cpu,
where the screen went crazy after waking up from power savings.
flickered like a broken movie projector. i removed
xserver-xorg-video-intel and installed a newer kernel.
1465[17:06:20] <g0zzy> "blacklist r8712u" is the
content of /lib/modprobe.d/onboard-wireless-adapter AND
/etc/modprobe.d/onboard-wireless-adapter. The module is still
getting loaded. Why?
1472[17:09:31] <greycat> The recent trend of "your files
only get processed if they have the right extension" is super
annoying, especially when there's no obvious way to find out
this rule, or what the magic extension is.
1473[17:09:32] <g0zzy> Ah. So it's been debian-apache-ised?
;)
1474[17:10:32] <greycat> don't even get me STARTED on
apache...
1475[17:10:53] <g0zzy> Very Windowsish. The file extension is so
important and defining that it's hidden from you by default
1478[17:11:51] <greycat> No, not Windows-ish. Near as I can tell,
it's because some idiot left an emacs foo~ backup file in place
and it caused a problem, then someone decided "let's
exclude *~" which is fine, but then someone else decided
"nah, let's only INCLUDE *.conf or *.list or
*.squeegee".
1489[17:18:05] <rant> I suppose it'd be sane for such things
to log warnings or notices if it finds files in that dir that are
not the right extension
1490[17:18:18] <g0zzy> Yes
1491[17:18:37] <greycat> No, because then you get log-spammed by
the *.dpkg-orig files which were one of the original reasons for the
change.
1492[17:19:01] <pkutzner> greycat: However, apt still complains
about files that are named *.conf.* You have to use *.conf.bak to
get it to not complain about them.
1493[17:19:37] <pkutzner> If you want to temporarily disable a
ppa or the like.
1494[17:20:12] <g0zzy> The mentality is: we'll cater for the
moronic by kludge f
1495[17:21:07] <g0zzy> and not cater to traditions/standard
practice, breaking software
1515[17:33:41] <AE-35> is there an equivalent to osx "log
stream --syslog"?
1516[17:34:59] <metastable> AE-35: Given that this is #debian,
not sure if we're expected to know what osx does. What does
that command do, and maybe we'll have a better idea.
1517[17:35:11] <AE-35> mac os
1518[17:35:22] *** Quits: damiano (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1519[17:35:26] <AE-35> streams logs to stdout
1520[17:35:26] <metastable> AE-35: I know what osx is. That
doesn't help or answer the question.
1521[17:35:40] *** Quits: cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1522[17:35:50] <metastable> AE-35: Check out the journalctl
command manual.
1530[17:38:39] <jhutchins_wk> I think limiting the extension has
the valid function of making a human-readable way to have non-active
files in the directory.
1531[17:39:21] <jhutchins_wk> Supposedly linux only cares about
the "magic word", but that doesn't apply to text
config files.
1532[17:40:10] *** Joins: jazz (~jazz@replaced-ip)
1571[18:02:40] <_0x5eb_> hi, is there any way (even brutal) to
shrink a (R/O-)mounted root FS? (context: VPS configured with Debian
9 with 100% HDD taken by /, no other partition nor even swap)
1572[18:03:34] <rant> _0x5eb_: do you NEED another partition that
badly?
1573[18:03:37] <greycat> That is not unusual for a VPS. What
*kind* of VPS is it, exactly? Some of them cannot use swap, period.
1574[18:03:40] <_0x5eb_> (I was thinking of a custom initramfs
with a dropbear service as a last resort)
1579[18:06:28] <_0x5eb_> rant, actually my goal is to inject my
own installation through a second root; in such cases I usually use
the swap partition that I disable, format as ext4, and use for
deploying a temp install but here just a single partition
1581[18:07:33] <jelly> _0x5eb_: no, mount from a different device
1582[18:08:27] <_0x5eb_> jelly, there is just a single HDD with a
single partition using 100% of the space, no other device available
1583[18:08:28] <greycat> Not OpenVZ, then. So maybe swap is an
option? I don't know.
1584[18:09:23] <jelly> _0x5eb_: you need to fsck -f first, shrink
fs, then shrink the block dev, and first two will refuse to work on
a mounted fs or spew scary warnings
1585[18:09:23] <_0x5eb_> I was thinking of deploying a
debootstrap'd root in a tmpfs and pivot_root on it but it does
not seem to be allowed
1586[18:09:57] <jelly> that's a theory but I've never
managed to successfully pivot_root to tmpfs and umount the old one
1587[18:10:09] <jelly> tbh I tried twice and a long time ago
1614[18:15:43] <_0x5eb_> I was used to deploy OpenVZ kernels on
such kind of VPS (a long, long time ago)
1615[18:16:22] <_0x5eb_> jelly, would you mean some kind of
pygrub? ;)
1616[18:16:39] <jelly> possible strategy: install busybox-static
or sash or whatever, debootstrap into a separate /new dir, and VERY
CAREFULLY move all /* dirs to /old/ and move or copy /new/* to /
1617[18:16:55] <jelly> thus, no fs shrinking
1618[18:17:41] <jelly> all the dynamically linked commands WILL
break at "move all /* dirs to /old/" step :-)
1620[18:18:45] <_0x5eb_> well I don't care of keeping
anything from the current install but really need separate
partitions (actually a single LVM partition)
1621[18:19:35] <jelly> safer to have a separate /boot and then
one for LVM PV but yeah
1641[18:25:13] <jelly> _0x5eb_: stupid workaround: remove it from
/etc/mtab, if your mtab is a symlink remove it, copy /proc/mounts in
its place and then remove it :-)
1662[18:31:23] <jhutchins_wk> I wonder why you're working so
hard to do something that's not supported by your Provider. Is
it really that good a deal?
1663[18:31:43] <rant> especially when you already seem to have
Debian stable installed
1664[18:31:45] <jelly> curses!
1665[18:31:53] <jelly> areyouloco: it's the root fs
1666[18:32:04] <brw> Has anyone seen any major performance
impacts yet with these new Spectre/Meltdown patches?
1686[18:37:42] <tw> There's a recovery CD option in the ovh
console for handling exactly this kind of problem. You're going
about this in a very complex way.
1687[18:37:42] <_0x5eb_> ... and reboot very quickly hoping for
the best (I of course already killed all the non strictly essential
daemons) ;)
1688[18:38:06] <tw> _0x5eb_: if you booted with `single` nothing
should be running besides init and maybe your shell
1696[18:40:49] *** Parts: gridl0ck (~cube@replaced-ip) (""I am indeed amazed when I consider how weak my mind
is and how prone to error." --Rene Descartes")
1702[18:41:48] *** Quits: dpl (~dpl@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1703[18:41:51] *** cdown_ is now known as cdown
1704[18:42:29] <_0x5eb_> frostschutz, tw: thanks for the tips on
the "rescue mode" (I initially thought it was only booting
the OS in single user mode), seems indeed almost too easy,
investigating this now
1705[18:42:46] <jelly> <mika> yes <mika> I recommend
grml-rescueboot :)
1706[18:42:50] <jelly> says #grml
1707[18:44:12] <jelly> so if you have console access, booting
grml (it's a debian based live) with toram option would be a
workable way to nuke disk contents and reformat everything to your
liking
1708[18:45:00] <_0x5eb_> jelly, hmm great idea too! I keep that
in mind & will investigate that
1715[18:49:36] <Urangst> hello. could anyone point/link me
somewhere a begginer could start? Im planning to switch from win10
to either debian or fedora but dont know which one yet. Thanks
1720[18:51:16] <jelly> Urangst: live images might be nice to try
things out, just keep in mind perfomance will be lower on a live usb
than an installation on hdd or ssd
1726[18:53:39] <wigums> another issue imo is fedora is too
bleeding edge. bleeding edge tends not to be that great for new
users but absolutely try both
1741[19:00:33] *** errrasmus is now known as Erasmus
1742[19:00:37] <jelly> Urangst: is your hw platform a laptop or a
machine with wifi or a really new graphic card (say, model less than
2 years old)?
1743[19:00:47] <Urangst> <annadane> i downloaded the
version 9 and installed on a VM but the thing is, after i install it
i dont really know what to do. last time a spent a little time with
linux was on ubuntu and got really frustated because i was
struggling to install programs and couldnt use the things i use
daily in my win10
1750[19:02:58] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: There are some online
databases like equivalent.to that list equivalent programs.
Sometimes the process of accomplishing your goal is different in
Linux than in Windows.
1751[19:03:07] <wigums> Urangst, you will have that issue with
any linux. its gonna take time for you to learn
1752[19:03:07] <Urangst> <jelly> its a lenovo ideapad 310,
i5-6200U @ 2.30GHz, bought a Samsumg SSD 850 EVO and use it as the
main storage, DDR4 ram, GeForce 920MX
1757[19:04:12] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: There's also the fact
that rather than find a program from a third party then download and
install it, Debian maintains a library of over 50,000 programs that
are packaged for Debian and tested to work with the stable release.
1763[19:04:46] <somiaj> Urangst: part of what makes debian stable
great is all the software that debian provides is well tested to
work with debian. The drawback is, you should stcik only to software
provided in the debian repos, which means finding alternative
software and sometimes using older well tested versions of software.
1764[19:04:54] <Urangst> <jhutchins_wk> i tried to install
using the terminal, but could get past some things i dont remember
now
1765[19:04:56] *** Quits: nezZario (sid125746@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1766[19:04:57] *** Quits: alxy (uid115853@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1773[19:05:36] <Urangst> <somiaj> if there are substitutes
to things i can find on win10 im ok with it
1774[19:06:13] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: The important thing is to
focus on your goal, not what you think the process or program should
be.
1775[19:06:15] <Urangst> what are big downsides from someone
coming from windows?
1776[19:06:27] <somiaj> Urangst: depends on what you are willing
to use as substitutes, but there are plenty who use debian as their
desktop and software that can work. But you won't get
everything, there will be things that win10 can do you won't be
able to. On the other hand, there are things you can do in linux
that win10 can't.
1777[19:06:35] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: You'll need to get
used to the command line.
1778[19:07:00] <Urangst> <somiaj> yes, one things that im
keen on linux
1779[19:07:01] <somiaj> Urangst: biggest downside is thinking
about being an admin to your machine, not jsut being able to click
and things 'just work', stuff usually requires a bit of
research and sometimes configuration.
1783[19:07:55] <Urangst> <somiaj> thing is, my classes just
started and i really need some stuff working and thats my main
concern
1784[19:08:09] <jhutchins_wk> "Click and things just
work" doesn't happen in Windows unless you're
supported by a very competent IT department.
1785[19:08:14] <greycat> What stuff specifically?
1786[19:08:52] <Urangst> ill probably just try to learn on an VM
for now and when i get the semester break i can back up my music on
the HD im waiting to arrive and i can format and install linux as
main OS
1787[19:09:04] <wigums> Urangst, get a live usb OR simply install
linux to a usb just as if it were a hard drive or sdd. plug it in
and boot from the usb whenever you want and you get to keep your
windows on the main drive
1788[19:09:11] <jelly> if you choose to run Debian on hardware
instead of a VM you'll probably want to use
"unofficial" installation images with firmware
1792[19:09:31] *** Quits: fireant (~fireant@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1793[19:09:39] <jelly> or live images with firmware if trying
live
1794[19:09:43] <jelly> !firmware live
1795[19:09:44] <dpkg> Unofficial <live> images - containing
non-free Debian <firmware> packages - for Debian 9
"Stretch" as a live OS are available at
replaced-url
1796[19:09:49] <Urangst> another thing that im afraid of is
making a dual boot so i can have the possibility to have 2 OS
installed, i tried before but didnt felt confident about it
1797[19:09:59] <wigums> Urangst, get a live usb OR simply install
linux to a usb just as if it were a hard drive or sdd. plug it in
and boot from the usb whenever you want and you get to keep your
windows on the main drive
1798[19:10:09] <jelly> Urangst: nah, just keep using a VM then
1799[19:10:09] <wigums> so no need to dual boot
1800[19:10:18] <greycat> If you already have the knowledge and
infrastructure for the VM option, you can do that.
1801[19:10:22] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: Dual boot has been working
almost since Linux released the first kernel, it's very
reliable.
1802[19:10:24] <wigums> your best bet is vm
1803[19:10:29] <jelly> I run windows in a VM because dual booting
is a pain
1804[19:10:31] <Urangst> <wigums> in a USB doesnt it get
sluggish?
1805[19:10:42] <jair> hello all I am seeing a server crashing
because of memory usage...
replaced-url
1811[19:11:15] <somiaj> Urangst: live systems don't run off
the usb, they run off of memeory, so they load from the usb (this
makes them run okay even with slower usb read speeds)
1812[19:11:19] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: You're not going to
get great performance, but Live images have been optimized to work
better with a USB or disc.
1813[19:11:38] <Urangst> <wigums> on a usb is it less
painful to run on a VM?
1814[19:11:42] <somiaj> Urangst: dual boot is fine, but many
don't actually want to reboot just to testout another os.
1815[19:11:51] <jhutchins_wk> Actually running off of a normal
install on a USB is pretty slow and not enjoyable.
1816[19:11:54] <wigums> Urangst, your easiest way to learn will
be a vm
1817[19:12:05] <jair> I wonder if I can run something to stop the
server from crashing >> screenshot >
replaced-url
1829[19:13:33] <somiaj> jair: what makes you think it is memeory
problems, I dno't see any issue with your meminfo output, and
you aren't even using swap.
1830[19:13:38] <jelly> jair: that was for Urangst, not you
1831[19:13:50] <jair> jelly: Ok sorry
1832[19:14:07] <Urangst> jelly: theres any way i can copy ppl in
a easier way?
1833[19:14:16] <Urangst> jelly: theres any way i can copy ppl
names in a easier way?
1834[19:14:21] <greycat> most IRC clients will tab-complete a
name
1835[19:14:23] <jelly> Urangst: jsut start typing their nick and
press TAB
1836[19:14:29] <jair> somiaj: the server is using 12G or ram and
keeps growing after approx 19 hours the server crash
1837[19:14:30] <jelly> jel<TAB>
1838[19:14:39] <Urangst> jelly, ah ok didnt tought about that
1839[19:14:43] <jair> somiaj: did you see the htop screenshot?
1840[19:14:48] <somiaj> !free memory
1841[19:14:48] <dpkg> Unlike information, your computer's
memory does *not* want to be free. Free RAM is wasted RAM! Linux
tries to use free physical memory for caching files from disk which
speeds up disk access considerably. Linux releases RAM from these
caches if programs need it. If you want to know how much physical
memory the free(1) tool says you have left for program use,
it's 'free' + 'buffers' +
'cache'. Also ask me about <swapwake>.
1842[19:14:54] <somiaj> jair: using all your memeory is common in
linux.
1843[19:14:58] <Urangst> used to names appearing on screen on the
phone
1847[19:15:37] <Urangst> somiaj, so which is better USB or VM?
1848[19:15:39] <jair> somiaj: come on! the server crash every 19
hours, there is nothing running on the server other than ip tables
is a machine use as router
1849[19:16:00] <jair> jelly: just linux, a few gnu tools ip
tables that's it
1850[19:16:05] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: Most IRC clients will
auto-complete a name if you hit tab.
1853[19:16:49] <jhutchins_wk> jair: So reboot the server every 18
hours. Problem solved.
1854[19:16:52] <Urangst> jhutchins_wk, yeah, i just forgot that
was a thing since i got used to seeing the person name when you type
it some android apps
1855[19:16:53] <jelly> jair: what's iscsid there for?
1866[19:18:29] <somiaj> jair: you may want to actually test your
memory with memtest86, and see if you actually have bad memory. I
would expect the cahced meemory to be higher than in your paste, but
your system is not switching to swap, which is another 16gigs of
memeory that it is not using. I just wouldn't think a memeory
leak or using to much memeory is the culprit causing your system to
crash.
1867[19:18:32] <Urangst> jhutchins_wk, theres any way to quote
old texts? so i can comment on them?
1868[19:18:54] <jelly> jair: alright then. #ubuntu-server is that
way, and I'd advise against running non-LTS versions on
servers...
1869[19:19:09] <jair> jelly: thank you!
1870[19:19:10] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: Cut&Paste
1871[19:19:19] <jair> thank you all!
1872[19:19:30] <Urangst> oh, another thing i wanted to know is if
theres some website that points you to similar or alternative
programs you find on windows
1873[19:20:03] <somiaj> Urangst: probably not a single one, but
google can help on a per case basis, 'linux alternative to
office' for example might be a good search.
1874[19:21:02] <Urangst> <rant> Urangst: yeah you could try
both, but what got me was
replaced-url
1875[19:22:11] <Urangst> somiaj, theres any site where you can
find some kind of guide to like "things you should when you
begin" or something of the sort, just so i dont get lost not
knowing what to do
1876[19:22:37] <Urangst> normally i like to mess around with the
system right when i get it but i really dont know how to mess with
linux to begin with
1877[19:22:43] <somiaj> Urangst: there are lots, but they
sometimes get outdated or only cover what that paticular user
thought someone would need.
1878[19:23:07] <somiaj> Urangst: vague questions will get vague
answers, but if you had a more specific question, what is an
alternative to foo, you would get a more specific answer.
1879[19:23:20] <Urangst> somiaj, thats good enough for me, from
there i can get ideas to what i want to do/search for
1880[19:23:27] <greycat> On a desktop system, the critical early
things are usually "Do I have all the firmware installed that I
need", "Does my video card work properly"
1881[19:23:41] <somiaj> I mean to me, most users need a browser,
but both firefox and chromium are in debian, and office, which can
be done with libreoffice. After that I'm unsure what people
would want.
1882[19:23:42] <aispark[m]> Urangst: Arch wiki list of
applications page is wonderful
1883[19:23:46] <greycat> On a laptop, add "Does my wireless
interface work properly" to that.
1886[19:24:46] <Urangst> greycat, yes, how could i verify if the
drivers are working fine? because on my laptop manufacturer driver
page theres only win10 drivers, where would i find the drivers?
1887[19:24:58] <Urangst> aispark[m], gonna look for that
1888[19:24:58] <greycat> Oh god, you have a laptop? Ugh...
1889[19:25:06] <greycat> But you said you would be installing in
a VM, so that doesn't matter.
1890[19:25:20] <Urangst> greycat, notebook, dont know if theres
much difference
1892[19:25:37] <Urangst> greycat, im planning to leave win10
1893[19:25:44] <greycat> If you're installing in a VM, it
shouldn't matter, other than possibly installing "guest
extensions" or whatever they call that thing.
1894[19:25:58] <greycat> If you're installing natively, use
the netinst CD with nonfree firmware included.
1898[19:26:05] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD
installer images containing non-free Debian firmware packages are
available for installing Debian 9 "Stretch". See
replaced-url
1899[19:26:30] <Urangst> greycat, my goal is to use linux as main
OS
1906[19:28:27] <_0x5eb_> (estimated time to boot in rescue mode:
2mn, the web interface gave up after 30mn, connection to KVM lost,
impossible to reboot nor even reinstall the VPS)
1921[19:31:13] <jelly> some vendors are great at hiding
complexity
1922[19:31:35] <somiaj> Urangst: almost all drivers are contained
inside the linux kernel. In a laptop this most likely means you just
need non-free firmware and will have all drivers installed by
default. I noticed you had a nvidia card, you can optionally install
the nvidia non-free drivers, though the nouveau ones that are
included by default will work for most things.
1923[19:31:38] <tw> Most OS control panels. Security and privacy
settings in web browsers have a tendancy to go away.
1924[19:31:44] <tw> simpler ;)
1925[19:33:02] <annadane> most things aka probably not kde plasma
1932[19:35:00] <Urangst> another thing i noticed is when youre
installing debian you can select different UI (i guess, dont
remember the name) i think there are 4, KDE, xfce and the other ones
i dont remember. i was wondering where i can find info on those
1933[19:35:05] <greycat> Urangst: if you are installing natively
on a laptop, use the nonfree firmware netinst image.
1935[19:35:17] <jelly> Urangst: linux hardware supports lags a
year or two behind windows. If you plan to use Linux, the safest
option is to investigate linux compatibilty BEFORE buying
1957[19:38:14] <jelly> Urangst: I didn't say
"find" but "investigate". This usually includes
looking for reviews by people who're running linux on the same
hardware. Looking for specific components pci-id and usb-id numbers
and googling compatibility of each.
1958[19:38:16] <stoned> jelly: configs are all the same, I just
reinstalled OS
2007[19:43:26] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for
testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not*
on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is
invite only)." it means you did not read it's on
irc.oftc.net.
2027[19:45:39] <High> Neither do I actually. I ginroe NICKS,
JOINs, PARTS, QUITS, MODES, CLIENT CRAP, CLIENT NOTICES, ejust about
evrythign other than chat
2028[19:45:44] <Urangst> aispark[m], theres one thats similar to
mine
2029[19:45:45] <High> The only thing I ever see is people chat.
That's it.
2030[19:45:55] <High> if anyone wants, I can shre my irssi ignore
filters
2032[19:46:53] <Urangst> aispark[m], someone said on reddit
"The raid controller isn't detected properly. You have to
disable it." and "No, you won't have an issue after
that except losing a drive cache for raid that doesn't
work."
2046[19:48:28] <Urangst> aispark[m], found another topic of
someone trying ubuntu on it and they said is quite fine, just not
good to install alongside windows
2061[19:51:06] <apollo13> seriously, when red in a monitoring
system means danger you don't want to see that on your desktop
2062[19:51:07] <aispark[m]> Urangst: yeah its OK
2063[19:51:18] <greycat> High: please take it to #debian-offtopic
2064[19:51:18] <High> haha, makes sense.
2065[19:51:43] <aispark[m]> Problem installing with windows would
be just showing your Debian partition to windows boot manager
2066[19:52:26] <aispark[m]> You can use bcdedit command in cmd
and fix it nothing else I know
2067[19:52:29] *** Quits: HarveyPwca (~HarveyPwc@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2068[19:52:50] <annadane> Urangst, also you don't even need
a full desktop environment if you want; some people use window
managers
2069[19:52:59] <annadane> like i3 which is very keyboard driven
and productivity focused
2070[19:53:00] <Urangst> aispark[m], ill try to test thing out
and get used to the system in the VM and start to prepare the
switch. probably will do it in 5-6 months or in the end of the year,
or just when i have a good space of time to do it and can have time
to setup my things up
2095[19:58:07] <Urangst> aispark[m], yeah, the thing that is
keeping me the most is that i have around 60-70GB of music in my
main drive and my external HD is full, but i bought a 2TB one but
probably will take 2 months to arrive. so i have to wait either way
2098[20:00:09] <Urangst> aispark[m], oh, nice i just found a
github page dedicated to linux on my notebook
2099[20:00:15] <annadane> that's a lot of music
2100[20:01:02] <Urangst> annadane, its because i like to keep
lossless of my favorite things or the albums i think are really
good. but most of the time i use spotify
2101[20:01:17] <jhutchins_wk> Urangst: One thing about Linux:
don't go pasting commands you find on line or on IRC without at
least having some idea what the command does.
2110[20:01:44] <High> a good mp3 souns exactly the same
subjectively to most people on average as does a lossless
compression
2111[20:01:44] <dpkg> rumour has it, dont break debian is
replaced-url
2112[20:01:59] *** Quits: duracrisis (~kkh@replaced-ip) (Quit: Remember, smarter not harder!)
2113[20:02:27] <High> unless you have a soudn system or
amplification that touches higher harmonics and clipping threshold,
lossless won't matter.
2114[20:02:42] <jhutchins_wk> One of the biggest problems is that
online docs often lack date/version information and old advice never
gets cleaned up.
2115[20:02:43] <High> Only on audiphile professiona hardwre can
you even tell a differnce, and only when the scale is large.
2116[20:03:09] <greycat> unless they compressed it with a
stupidly low bitrate
2117[20:03:13] <High> On regular pc home theater stuff, yo
ucant' tell.
2118[20:03:15] <High> unless that, sure.
2119[20:03:25] <Urangst> High, yes, for a daily routine thing
when the music is just playing theres nothing much you can notice to
justify the space lossless takes. but when youre home really just
listening it there can be a huge difference
2134[20:05:53] <High> Given the similr/same bitrate, they sound
almost identical. I an't tell a diff. I've only been able
to when I take it to concert level
2135[20:05:55] <Urangst> when youre rushing i really dont notice
too much. but when its quite quiet you can hear things that got cut
off on lossy
2136[20:05:58] <tw> codec comparison is drifting into
debian-offtopic territory.
2137[20:06:05] <High> I used to work as sound engineer for a
production company
2138[20:06:10] <High> stage sound stuff.
2139[20:06:29] <Urangst> tw: yeah, sorry
2140[20:06:31] <High> unless you have high end audiophile
equipment, it's very difficult to tell the diff.
2142[20:07:34] <Urangst> High, i got a pretty nice headphone but
that just why i only keep lossless of things i really like to hear,
the other stuff i dont care too much so i just use spotify
2146[20:09:16] <Urangst> oh, other thing i remembered that i got
stuck on ubuntu when i tried using it was that text editor or
something like that. it opened when i was installing a package or
something and i had to type some commands, add info, but i tried
pressing the keys but nothing workded
2188[20:13:33] <tw> Urangst: If you're having problems with
ubuntu, there's #ubuntu, but you can't expect to have the
same issues with a 2 years newer OS install, much less one from an
entirely different group.
2193[20:14:50] <greycat> Then try the Debian install in a VM and
see how it goes.
2194[20:14:51] *** Quits: Sansar (~Sansar@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2195[20:14:52] <annadane> everyone has to start somewhere. the
important thing is just to be realistic about what you do and
don't know
2196[20:14:57] <somiaj> Urangst: no need to worry about things
that could happen. Until you actually install debian on your
hardware and see what sort of things need to be configured/tweak.
You learn by using, not by talking about stuff that may not even be
an issue.
2197[20:15:00] <annadane> you don't need to be an overnight
expert
2198[20:15:03] <High> vim is pretty dumb sometimes.
2199[20:15:13] <High> I'm on desktop, as most poeple have
access to a mouse.
2201[20:15:20] <High> Drag cursor, click place cursor wher eyou
want
2202[20:15:23] *** Quits: sh1ro (~sh1ro@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2203[20:15:29] <somiaj> Urangst: the best way is to deal with the
issues as you run into them, and here and google can be of great
help for specific issues.
2246[20:25:57] <metastable> anoki: Unless it's been updated
since I took those exams, it's very distro agnostic in most
respects, aside from discussing yum vs. apt.
2247[20:26:08] <metastable> And from the current exam codes, they
haven't been updated since I took them.
2263[20:29:59] <anoki> okay sorry ill keep on topic
2264[20:30:07] <Urangst> greycat, Mathisen how do i install that?
its using the terminal?
2265[20:30:40] <greycat> !vbox guest
2266[20:30:41] <dpkg> For Debian virtual machines
("guests") running under VirtualBox, install the
virtualbox-guest-utils package inside the guest to provide Guest
Additions; dependent Linux kernel modules are automatically built
using <DKMS>. For Microsoft Windows guests, install the
virtualbox-guest-additions-iso package on the host (ask me about
<non-free sources>) and see
replaced-url
2280[20:32:35] <greycat> Urangst: get to a terminal, get root,
and then run "apt-get install virtualbox-guest-dkms
linux-headers-$(uname -r)"
2281[20:33:04] <Urangst> where did you get all that info from?
2282[20:33:17] <Mathisen> there was one in here yesterday i
belive with same issue, he ended upp installing the guest addition
from the virtualbox-guest-iso that virtualbox provides.
2283[20:33:27] <bitess> virtualbox-guest-utils is there
2284[20:33:30] <greycat> From the bot's factoid, from
Mathisen's correction of the package name, and from knowing how
dkms works in general.
2290[20:33:57] <greycat> bitess: not in stretch apparently
2291[20:34:16] <tw> Urangst: either log in with the root
password, use `su` and provide the root password, or use `sudo -i`
with your user password (assuming it is configured for sudo)
2292[20:34:29] <bitess> because virtualbox is not in stretch.
2293[20:34:31] <Urangst> ok, ill try. tw
2294[20:34:47] <Urangst> writing su worked
2295[20:35:23] <bitess> it got removed together with virtualbox
because it's built from the same source.
2301[20:37:23] <Urangst> how do i do that, greycat?
2302[20:37:29] <jelly> !non-free sources
2303[20:37:29] <dpkg> Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the
two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib
non-free" rather than just "main", then
«apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be
installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms;
check the licenses. See also <sources.list>.
2304[20:37:36] <greycat> run "nano
/etc/apt/sources.list" and change the ending of each line from
"main" to "main contrib non-free" and then save
the file; then run apt-get update
2305[20:38:01] <Urangst> let me see if i can do that
2306[20:38:16] <bitess> if that's stretch you will also need
to add stretch-backports
2307[20:38:27] <greycat> not for the -dkms package, he
doesn't
2308[20:38:32] <greycat> that's why I changed the factoid
2337[20:43:05] <metastable> rant: Host not running the same
version of VirtualBox as the guest? The guest doesn't run VB at
all.
2338[20:43:05] <rant> I dont recall now off hand but I vaguely
remember looking into it months ago
2339[20:43:07] <Urangst> bitess ctrL+shift+c dont seems to copy
2340[20:43:17] <greycat> dpkg, no, vbox guest is <reply>For
Debian VMs (guests) under VirtualBox, install the
virtualbox-guest-utils package (from <stretch-backports>)
inside the guest to provide Guest Additions; Linux kernel modules
are built automatically by <dkms>. For MS Windows guests,
install the virtualbox-guest-additions-iso package on the host (see
<non-free sources>) and see
replaced-url
2346[20:44:06] <Urangst> greycat, how do i save this document?
2347[20:44:16] <greycat> nano puts a menu of control keys on the
screen
2348[20:44:17] <metastable> rant: And? That doesn't require
that the guest modules match the host's VB version.
2349[20:44:57] <rant> metastable: thats what I was asking..
I've had issues in the past where they didnt work.. I didnt
know if that was still the case or not
2350[20:45:37] *** Quits: sh1ro (~sh1ro@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2351[20:45:44] <_0x5eb_> jelly, I managed to shrink my root FS by
installing dropbear-initramfs cryptsetup and corrupting the root=
argument of the kernel cmdline, dropping me a dropbear shell from
initramfs ;)
2352[20:45:45] <rant> just wondering because I'm the one who
handled the issue the other day that was mentioned.. where we
ultimately used the iso
2358[20:46:53] <greycat> While you were learning nano, I was
informed that installing the vbox guest stuff is actually MUCH
harder than originally expected.
2359[20:47:09] <greycat> Because for some reason the package was
removed from stretch.
2360[20:47:36] <Mathisen> as i said before.. install it from the
virtualbox-guest-iso that virtualbox host provides
2361[20:47:41] <Urangst> greycat, what do i do after apt-get
update is finished?
2363[20:48:08] <greycat> Mathisen: feel free to take over here; I
have no idea what you just said.
2364[20:48:45] <Urangst> i was having problems with 4:3 screen
resolution
2365[20:48:50] <Mathisen> insert the guest-addition cd image in
your virtualbox host from the " devices " menu in
virtualbox
2366[20:48:52] <tempate> Hello. What is the best way to manage
virtual machines in debian? I've been using Virtual Box for a
long time now but I'm not to satisfied. My RAM use jumps when
using it and the PC slows down a lot. Is there a better solution?
2370[20:49:55] <jhutchins_wk> tempate: vbox is pretty good, the
nature of what you're doing means there's going to be a
load. I've found vbox better than VMWare Player.
2371[20:50:00] <Mathisen> step 3: run the .sh file the virtualbox
guest addition iso providies
2393[20:55:02] <Mathisen> ok does " lsblk " show
/dev/sr0
2394[20:55:18] <Urangst> Mathisen, but i dont know what do in the
step 3 you said
2395[20:55:55] <rant> step 3 depended on success of step 1 :P
2396[20:56:10] <Mathisen> yeah :)
2397[20:56:25] <Mathisen> but " lsblk " should show if
it is mounted
2398[20:56:27] <greycat> So... back to trying for the -dkms
package from stretch-backports now?
2399[20:56:39] <greycat> not yet, ok
2400[20:57:16] <Mathisen> Urangst, so look at the command output
and say what it says to the right of sr0
2401[20:57:35] <Urangst> i did apt-get install
virtualbox-guest-dkms ..., what do i do after that?
2402[20:57:41] <rant> the dkms is a better option, I just
recommended the iso yesterday or whenever that was because I was
concerned about version incompatibilities with the host. but idk if
thats still an issue or not
2420[21:02:16] *** Quits: ChunkzZ1 (uid233645@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2421[21:02:41] <Mathisen> yeah run it " ./autorun.sh "
2422[21:02:50] <somiaj> Urangst: you shouldn't need to do
that. I would not run that script.
2423[21:03:14] <somiaj> Urangst: dpkg -l | grep linux-headers (do
you have the linux headers for your kernel installed), if not
install them, apt install linux-headers-amd64
2424[21:03:23] <Urangst> hhow can i see whats inside these things
2438[21:08:33] <Urangst> greycat, how do i close this less? i
wrote less --help now i cant exit
2439[21:08:39] <greycat> q
2440[21:08:43] <deadrom> when I ssh -X from 64b ubuntu to a 32b
deb9 and run an GL program, it says "cannot find swrast",
does it need swrast from the ubuntu or the debian machine?
2449[21:10:51] <rant> deadrom: also, consider xpra for running
single programs remotely.. it can work with ssh and allows deatching
from the program without terminating among other things
2450[21:11:06] <Mathisen> deadrom, swrast is used for opengl to
render in headless
2451[21:11:38] <deadrom> Mathisen, strange, the machine is not
headless. has xfce.
2452[21:11:47] <rant> heh
2453[21:12:04] <Urangst> Mathisen, Error constructing proxy for
org.gnome.Terminal:/org/gnome/Terminal/Factory0
2456[21:12:54] <Mathisen> Urangst, never seen that error.....
2457[21:13:35] <greycat> Time to try -dkms from stretch-backports
yet?
2458[21:13:41] <Urangst> Mathisen, what else can i do?
2459[21:13:49] <tw> deadrom: generally speaking, you cannot use
gpu hardware without connecting to the attached display server.
There are exceptions to this rule, but it's pretty hard and
fast in the most common cases.
2460[21:13:51] <Urangst> greycat, its that for me to try?
2461[21:14:06] <Mathisen> Urangst, please double chekced you dont
got any other things "mounted" in the virtualbox host, any
other isos for example
2462[21:15:24] <Urangst> Mathisen, in the devices thres only the
guest image thing
2463[21:15:56] <Mathisen> Urangst, listen to greycat then. il
just go and stand in a dark corner now a feel ashamed
2464[21:16:13] <annadane> another casuality of the grey cat
2465[21:16:21] <Urangst> Mathisen, ohh :(. Thanks for the help
2466[21:16:23] <greycat> I barely know anything about VMs.
2467[21:16:35] <greycat> !stretch-backports
2468[21:16:35] <dpkg> Some packages intended for Buster (Debian
10) but recompiled for use with Stretch (Debian 9) can be found in
the stretch-backports repository. See
replaced-url
2493[21:25:49] <greycat> OK, you'll need to edit your
sources.list again, and on the stretch-backports line, change
"main" to "main contrib non-free", then apt-get
update again
2517[21:34:41] <greycat> Might be a good time for you to learn
about man pages, too. "man man" is one possible starting
point.
2518[21:34:56] <Urangst> whats that?
2519[21:35:07] <annadane> type in your terminal, "man
man"
2520[21:35:11] <annadane> man stands for "manual page"
2521[21:35:50] <greycat> man uses "less" to show the
manual pages, which is another reason why it was important for you
to learn about how to use less (and how to get out of it)
2522[21:36:05] <Urangst> oh tahnks
2523[21:36:23] <Urangst> i dont haeve much time now, so ill
probably leave that for later today or tomorrow
2559[21:54:39] <dpkg> Debian mirrors have timestamp files we use
to determine how recently they have been updated. Here are some
statistics the mirror maintainers provide:
replaced-url
2560[21:56:19] <somiaj> contrapumpkin: might just have to wait
until it comes back up. There might be a mailing list with info
about the site.
2561[21:57:48] <contrapumpkin> looks like it's
qa-debsources@lists.alioth.debian.org, which seems pretty dead
2562[21:58:00] <contrapumpkin> I'll see if I can find out
who runs it
2569[22:00:16] <rant> deadrom: usually, when I want it to work..
yeah.. heh
2570[22:01:02] <contrapumpkin> somiaj: ah yeah, not so concerned
about losing the content. I just have an automated build process
that tries to hit that server and it broke, so I was wondering :)
2571[22:01:05] <contrapumpkin> thanks though
2572[22:01:05] *** Joins: toli (~toli@replaced-ip)
2573[22:01:13] <rant> deadrom: winswitch is a neat lookin app
that seems to be an all around all-os kinda app for this kinda
stuff, wraps nx, xpra, vnc, etc.. but despite being rather graphical
I cant really figure it out.
2576[22:02:55] <deadrom> sorry I cant make this work, I started
xpra now in daemon mode and connected from here, does not work, says
"connection lost". ill lookk once more at the daemon
log...
2579[22:04:28] *** Quits: setham (~setham@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2580[22:04:35] <rant> idk I havent used it extensively, but it
does have GUI setup tools as welll the way I've used it is just
as I described. I ssh in and xpra start :100 --startchild=program
then axpra attach ssh/huser@host:port/:display
2581[22:05:07] <deadrom> startchild s wrong to begin with, does
not work
2582[22:05:14] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2583[22:05:33] <rant> --start-child=
2584[22:05:43] <somiaj> contrapumpkin: I would just wait, but if
it is down for a while, then might be worth sending an admin a ping.
2586[22:07:24] <rant> deadrom: all I know is this program blew me
away.. I was running Windows 7 in Virtualbox on an orange pi lite
over a shotty hotspot .. and it was smooth
2587[22:07:33] <deadrom> could not connect to X server on display
':100' after 3 seconds
2591[22:07:59] <rant> deadrom: are you starting one on ":100
2592[22:08:07] <deadrom> usr/lib/xorg/Xorg.wrap: Only console
users are allowed to run the X server
2593[22:08:31] <matu> The developpers of the open source are
wonderful, i was unable to use my 3440x1440 minotir on my Lenovo
X201 (an old laptop that was supposed to be able to support
2560x1440 max)
2594[22:08:40] <greycat> sounds like jessie or earlier...
2595[22:08:48] <matu> i updated my debian and plugged the
monitor, and my monotir works completely
2596[22:09:02] <toli> Today I had a strange feeling using Debian,
where I was always expecting to do whatever I want with it.
2611[22:12:11] <matu> It still works but it gave me some
headaches when i was playing
2612[22:12:21] <matu> but it is ok if you work with the monitor
2613[22:12:22] <toli> A guy was somehow converted his harddrive
of 6TB to MBR from Win10, he use to install Win10 on his SSD, where
the installation created its boot partition table to the 6TB drive.
No way to convert it GPT or what ever. I took the disk connected it
to my USB sata interface, and the system only saw 1 partition of
2TB, no way to convert it or do what ever with Debian, fdisk and
gparted. I had to use Windows VM to convert the disk to GPT and fix
it:)
2614[22:12:28] <toli> strange isnt it
2615[22:12:56] <matu> Iiyama E2403WS
2616[22:13:14] <toli> what is the biggest HDD debian can read out
of the box?
2617[22:13:31] <matu> but this is just wonderful i can use it on
this screen, if anyone can bring me an information about it would be
very appreciated
2618[22:13:40] <JustASlacker> debian is not limiting disc size in
any way
2619[22:13:42] <matu> any
2620[22:14:06] <JustASlacker> you run out of money before debian
runs out of manageable disks
2621[22:14:09] <matu> did they hack the driver ?
2622[22:14:11] <matu> wtf ?
2623[22:14:18] <toli> JustASlacker, then how do you explain that
I wasnt able to identify the partition
2624[22:14:25] <JustASlacker> gremlins
2625[22:14:49] <toli> JustASlacker, love it :)
2626[22:14:52] <deadrom> matu, enjoy your hardware, if you need
to know, read the driver src code. it's less mystery than you
think.
2629[22:15:39] <deadrom> toli, no limit, but if linux thinks it
is MBR not GPT because the disk announces it it will run with what
it can calc from the data.
2631[22:16:46] <matu> i did not practice C for a very long time
and i did not have the skill at that time
2632[22:17:02] <deadrom> toli, I think win10 uses this weird
system partition as a stub and then loads all drivers from there and
just ignores what the disks thinks or the uefi or whoever. sounds
like classic "we are MS and assume we are all there is"
stunt
2633[22:17:10] <matu> but the dev that corrected it is just
excellent
2640[22:20:44] <deadrom> matu, X201, so Intel GMA HD 5700MHD, so
#intel-gfx will appreciate your praise and might give you the
insight
2641[22:20:46] <tw> toli: You could always do it again and dump
the MBR, then math-out the partition size (hint, max partition for
MBR with 512-byte sectors is 2TB)
2642[22:21:05] <deadrom> it's not like they got *that* lot
of that :D
2643[22:21:18] <metastable> That's not how Windows 10
functions at all, but okay.
2644[22:21:18] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o eir
2645[22:21:19] <JustASlacker> when is the disk heavier
2656[22:23:10] <deadrom> JustASlacker, well, as ordering magnetic
patterns means destroying local entrophy which can me calculated
into energy, thus into mass we can establish that a full magnetic
disk is actually lighter than one on the full state of entropy -
unless it was bought as a certified media enterprise disk from the
beginning, of course
2657[22:23:19] <metastable> Mathisen: That's only correct
for disks with 512-byte sectors.
2672[22:28:46] <metastable> Mathisen: If the disk uses 4k
sectors, you can simply make it. In theory, MBR supports 16TiB
partitions using 4k sectors. Whether that's supported by your
BIOS, etc., is another question entirely.
2673[22:29:32] <Mathisen> metastable, i never heard of this.. or
seen it used.. would it not just be easyer to use gpt as intended
2674[22:29:45] <metastable> Mathisen: Oh, definitely. I use GPT
regardless of disk size.
2675[22:29:55] <NEOalquimista> bitess: i will do it now. Just for
the record, their symptoms are not exactly like mine. But whatever.
Breaking is fun.
2676[22:30:06] <Mathisen> metastable, anyway new info for me,
thanks for the lesson
2677[22:30:58] <metastable> Mathisen: The underlying reason is
that MBR deals with sector allocations, and is limited to 2^32
sectors. If those seconds are 512b in size, you get 2TiB. 4K sectors
yields eight times as much.
2688[22:37:26] <Mathisen> that you only seeing 2tb of the 6 that
it should ? do i understand it correct ?
2689[22:38:22] *** Quits: Darcidride (~Darcidrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2690[22:40:03] <toli> Mathisen, the disk was converted to MBR
from windows. we couldnt convert it from windows back to GPT, as
windows installation created the boot part on that disk, so I said
OK, bring it on. I plugged it to my debian, and then I saw that disk
had only 1 partition, and I cannot convert the MBR to GPT. I had to
do this with a Windows machine
2700[22:43:57] <Mathisen> im sure there is ways to convert in
linux also without data loss, but i would have done it win also if
win had its boot partition on it.. would have used diskparted there
and convert gpt
2701[22:44:14] <Mathisen> windows dont play along well with the
other kids as we all know
2702[22:44:26] <metastable> Converting a bootable MBR disk to
GPT?
2706[22:46:06] <metastable> Mathisen: It gets hairy because
there's no post-MBR cap for GRUB on GPT. It would require
reducing a partition and moving it over to make room for a BIOS boot
parittion.
2718[22:53:06] <Mathisen> im not a computer now with multiple
hd.s but if you would have removed the old partition table and
created a new one you could have made it gpt and used bigger then
2TB
2719[22:53:27] <toli> hmm
2720[22:53:29] <jhutchins_wk> toli: Microsoft plays fast and
loose with standards. It's one of the dangers of NTFS, and I
believe they have a new filesystem as of W10.
2723[22:53:54] <jhutchins_wk> toli: I know for a while you
couldn't use Linux tools to resize the Windows partitions, you
had to use the Windows Disk Manager.
2728[22:54:32] <jhutchins_wk> There's more than one variant.
2729[22:55:10] <Mathisen> jhutchins_wk, version 3.1 to be
specific
2730[22:55:16] <Mathisen> and that has been used sense XPP
2731[22:55:18] <Mathisen> XP*
2732[22:55:27] <Mathisen> anyway maybe offtopic in here
2733[22:55:32] <toli> :)
2734[22:55:50] *** Quits: LucaTM (~LucaTM@replaced-ip) (Quit: To infinity and beyond...)
2735[22:56:43] <jhutchins_wk> If it were possible to identify the
variant reliably we wouldn't have had problems with NTFS
drivers. MS obfuscates the differences.
2737[22:57:34] <rflec028> ...are there any reeeally important
channels on Freenode that I should join, as a newcomer, for
important announcements and junk?
2738[22:57:49] <rflec028> (Sorry, not totally on topic.)
2739[22:57:53] <annadane> debian related? not really
2740[22:58:02] <annadane> there's a few mailing lists
2741[22:58:11] *** Quits: nic_ (~nic@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2742[22:58:43] <annadane>
debian-security-announce@lists.debian.org being a good one
2743[22:58:52] <jhutchins_wk> rflec028: The important
announcements go to the lists. IRC doesn't reach people who are
off-line.
2744[22:59:42] <toli> But on NTFS you can more easily recover
formated partitions, and recover the files and folder structures,
where on EXT you cant
2759[23:03:11] <annadane> and also email is permanent
2760[23:03:18] <annadane> irc depends on whether you're in
the channel
2761[23:03:23] <annadane> and paying attention
2762[23:04:09] <annadane> there's also the point releases
but for important security stuff you wouldn't want to just wait
until 9.x
2763[23:04:32] <Mathisen> annadane, well there is way to keep
track lick notices and highlight can be saved and showed for later
if you use a bnc and irccloud works greate on your phone to keep
track of channles
2764[23:05:26] <annadane> yeah but... why
2765[23:05:35] <jhutchins_wk> toli: Most digital photos have
metadata that a good graphics program can read. It's a lot of
work, but you can do it. It could probably be scripted to pull dates
or geolocations.
2766[23:06:27] <toli> jhutchins_wk, Yes, I know, I already
separated the pictures in folders by year
2767[23:06:41] <toli> but 30% have no meta
2768[23:07:14] *** Quits: Saar (~Saar@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2790[23:29:18] <Mathisen> more like a file backup. it compress
the files and encrypts them, ofc it is incremental so it dont copy
files that has not been changed or added
2791[23:33:33] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2792[23:33:57] *** Quits: ghost43 (~daer@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)