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• 2[13:40:01] <Yaser_Amiri> Hi. I created a bridge and bounded aphisical interface to it (proxmox server), There is a behavior that I can't understand it. I ran tcpdum on the bridg and sent some traffic from outside and I could see that, but when I ran a ping from local shell I could'nt see any thing in tcpdum. why?
• 3[13:40:28] <Yaser_Amiri> *a physical interface
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• 5[13:41:32] <igneous> were you pinging yourself, by chance? In that situation, those pings would've been traversing your loopback interface.
• 6[13:43:44] <Yaser_Amiri> my bridge has a valid and public IP, A.B.C.D for example. I ran this command in local and from another server(outside): ping A.B.C.D
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• 18[13:55:21] <micw_> Hi. The wiki article replaced-url
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• 20[13:58:50] <jelly> that's a really bad idea
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• 23[14:00:46] <YesMan> Hello
• 24[14:03:01] <YesMan> From what I understand wake on lan has no standard, i've see example of magic packets being sent to port 5, 6, 7, 9 or more exotic even. How can I filter in a wol packet in my ip tables that default to drop
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• 38[14:18:25] <nemo> YesMan: can you not turn off wake on lan? ☺
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• 40[14:18:46] <nemo> YesMan: not to mention, how on earth would iptables prevent wake on lan since that's at a lower level
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• 45[14:20:54] <blackflow> nemo: well, there be programable NICs and it could be done with some BPF magick. just saying :)
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• 49[14:22:32] <YesMan> Yeah I was wondering how ip tables could affect the traffic while the system is halted, I thought it was writing it lower down maybe. Anyway I'm looking to enable the wake on lan feature. I tried it without iptables rules and I could wake the server via lan, now I can't but I must have broke it somewhere else then
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• 51[14:23:25] <nemo> blackflow: true true
• 52[14:23:46] <nemo> blackflow: but looks like I guessed right
• 53[14:23:54] <blackflow> nemo: sure, I was just being a smart donkey.
• 54[14:23:55] <nemo> blackflow: it was mostly due to how the question was phrased ☺
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• 56[14:25:08] <YesMan> ethtool is showing that eth0 is wol capable and that it's enabled (wol set to g)
• 57[14:25:18] <nemo> YesMan: checked your bios?
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• 62[14:29:26] <YesMan_> once wake on lan is enabled in bios you basically allow any computer on your network to wake your machine up? No way to set a whitelist or some kind of filtering?
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• 65[14:31:38] <colo-work> short version: yes. long version: yes, of course.
• 66[14:31:51] <blackflow> YesMan_: if there is it'd be in BIOS. nemo's comment still applies, it's off, cpu isn't processing instructions, NIC is probably not programmable, so the BIOS is where it's at
• 67[14:32:15] <blackflow> OR.... throw a firewall physicall in front of your NICs.
• 68[14:32:18] <colo-work> vPro or somesuch remote management/backdoor solution might be able to limit this to a whitelist
• 69[14:32:29] <colo-work> however, you can spoof hwaddrs fairly easily
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• 71[14:33:45] <YesMan_> Yeah so I would have to put a low power device in front of my computer to filter network
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• 74[14:38:35] <YesMan_> Ah it seems that the magic packet standard support a password system, I need to check if my hardware supports it
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• 76[14:39:16] <nemo> YesMan_: I'd say if you're trying to prevent wake-on-lan entirely in a device you still want connected to your network you might want to get a lot more aggressive in your packet filtering
• 77[14:39:42] <nemo> 'course I gotta wonder what's wrong w/ your network where this is an issue at all ☺
• 78[14:39:56] <nemo> not to mention why you can't just turn it on or off at the device.
• 79[14:43:02] <YesMan_> No my whole idea is the opposite, I want wake on lan activated. However as I configured my router to drop everything that is not whitelisted, I was initially asking how to filter IN wol magic packet. And if don't want to allow any computer on my network to send wake on lan is because I would like to prevent broadcast wake on lan to wake all my computers on the network
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• 84[14:49:43] <blackflow> YesMan_: question is, can you put your computer into "low enough" power consumption mode and keep it always on, and whether its lowest power usage is high enough to justify adding yet another device, with its own power usage, and the whole complexity of such a setup.
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• 87[14:54:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1125
• 88[14:55:22] <nemo> blackflow: idle RPi zero supposedly consumes less than half a watt of power ☺
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• 93[15:00:04] <YesMan_> From what I read a server with decent power supply should consume between 2 to 3watts in hibernation from something like 50 or so W when powered on, so that's plenty of savings, now yes the real question is do I want to go for a complex setup for my needs
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• 95[15:00:43] <YesMan_> 50W in the case of my machine, you definitly have powerhungry beasts out there ^^'
• 96[15:00:47] <nemo> hm
• 97[15:00:50] <nemo> YesMan_: what's your machine?
• 98[15:00:59] <blackflow> Unless you have them in dozens/hundreds/thousands, that's a light bulb powered on 24/7. I'd totally not complicate things.
• 99[15:01:04] <nemo> kinda curious just how much it would actually consume idle, it's probably possible to work out
• 100[15:01:05] <YesMan_> It's a dell laptop
• 101[15:01:13] <nemo> YesMan_: ok. can you get a little more specific 😝
• 102[15:01:26] <YesMan_> Inspiron E1501
• 103[15:02:11] <YesMan_> It's a 12yo laptop
• 104[15:02:35] <YesMan_> In perfect working condition I might add, that I use a gaming server
• 105[15:02:39] <YesMan_> as*
• 106[15:02:54] <nemo> mm
• 107[15:03:17] <nemo> if you're really looking to save power probably better off just using anything newer which would necessarily save tons more power even when not idle
• 108[15:03:25] <nemo> like the aforementioned rpi zero ☺
• 109[15:05:20] <nemo> YesMan_: anyway, it'd be kinda interesting to see how much it actually consumes when idle, assuming you turned off unnecessary services and such. you could probably measure it fairly accurately by taking a snapshot in powertop or whatever, idling w/ screen off for a few hours then measuring again. would work even better on battery I imagine
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• 111[15:05:28] <nemo> but wouldn't surprise me if it's 10W or so.
• 112[15:05:29] <colo-work> which grub package is a sensible choice for installing in a Debian Stretcht amd64 Xen domU, to support pygrub on the dom0?
• 113[15:05:36] <nemo> still way more than a raspberry pi ☺
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• 116[15:06:17] <blackflow> I'd write a custom systemd .target that activates no services, except one - socket activated (shell) script that switches the system back into graphical.target, as a poor man's WOL :)
• 117[15:06:45] <YesMan_> nemo you mean in idle or hibernation? because my goal is to have it in hibernation at all time and power it on through lan only when needed
• 118[15:07:07] <blackflow> nemo: question is, is the watts used by brain and fingers to setup and maintain the rpi (plus its price) actually a SAVING over leaving the laptop on 24/7
• 119[15:07:22] <blackflow> then again, non-server grade hardware left on 24/7 will wear it down quicker than usual
• 120[15:07:33] <YesMan_> blackflow, that could be a solution
• 121[15:07:56] <YesMan_> blackflow, it's 12yo, it is unbreakable I tell you ^^
• 122[15:08:11] <blackflow> that spinning rust in there, is 12yo too?
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• 129[15:10:07] <YesMan_> It's as clean as it's first day, always took good care of if, and I just strip it up, cleaned every corner of it and replaced thermal paste for it's reconversion to server work
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• 132[15:10:47] <blackflow> YesMan_: I was talking about the HDD :) 12y is very much a lot. I've seen dc-grade disks die sooner...
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• 140[15:12:47] <YesMan_> Ah yeah that's a different problem ^^, it'll be switched to an ssd soon enouth. I mean 20€ for 120GB, I can afford the upgrade even for this old thing
• 141[15:13:25] <f-a> hello, I am configuring schroot in /etc/schroot/chroot.d/some-file . I am not exactly sure that the `profile` option does
• 142[15:14:18] <f-a> here replaced-url
• 143[15:14:18] <YesMan_> nemo, I'll look into powertop
• 144[15:15:14] <nemo> YesMan_: what percentage of the time is it "hibernating" vs active?
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• 146[15:15:43] <nemo> blackflow: I dunno, debian on arm is not that much more painful really than debian on x86
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• 162[15:26:59] <YesMan_> nemo, it should be on about 5h a day
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• 165[15:27:48] <YesMan_> that's about 20% ;)
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• 168[15:29:24] <nemo> YesMan_: ok. if you had something like, oh, a raspberry PI 3, multicore, similar processor speed
• 169[15:29:33] <nemo> YesMan_: it would consume 5 watts of power maxed out
• 170[15:29:38] <nemo> YesMan_: more like 3 watts when active
• 171[15:30:37] <nemo> YesMan_: so, even if you left the RPI doing, oh, ripple mining all day (which is obviously dumb 😉 ) it would still use less power than that old laptop on only 20% of the time
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• 173[15:30:54] <nemo> or even 10% of the time
• 174[15:31:06] <nemo> YesMan_: old hardware is just too inefficient to keep around
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• 176[15:31:14] <nemo> only reason my server is still on an old box is laziness, nothing more
• 177[15:31:18] <nemo> really gotta fix that
• 178[15:31:47] <nemo> YesMan_: RPI idling you could still SSH into and it'd be using like a watt of power ☺
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• 180[15:33:28] <YesMan_> Yeah but the thing is that laptop runs x86 programs and the T7400 cpu is way more powerful than the RPi 3
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• 182[15:34:41] <YesMan_> I have a RPi2B at home for playing around with web services. But here I need a machine capable of running server side of modern games
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• 184[15:35:29] <nemo> YesMan_: guess it depends what the modern game is ☺
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• 186[15:35:40] <nemo> YesMan_: but same thing applies to modern x86 chips too
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• 189[15:35:59] <YesMan_> It's not that modern but in this instance its America's Army:Proving Ground
• 190[15:36:26] <nemo> replaced-url
• 191[15:36:41] <nemo> "At the time of announcement the TL-60 was produced in 90nm and specified with a TDP of 35W."
• 192[15:36:44] <nemo> 90nm!
• 193[15:36:47] <nemo> LOL
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• 196[15:38:26] <YesMan_> What a crappy olf tech, my beauty is 65nm ^^
• 197[15:38:45] <YesMan_> No need for that 7nm bullshit ^^
• 198[15:38:55] <nemo> haha
• 199[15:39:17] <YesMan_> It's bigger and larger, so obviously better
• 200[15:39:19] <nemo> anyway, if you bought an intel NUC from like 2 years ago for same price as an RPI you'd still get similar savings on power
• 201[15:39:30] <nemo> you know something between 14-20nm
• 202[15:41:09] <YesMan_> I'll benchmark the powerdraw of this machine, but I'm pretty sure that buying a newer machine would take ages to be profitable
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• 205[15:42:46] <yareckonirc> having boatloads of fun debugging firewalld and docker compose interactions today...grrr
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• 209[15:46:40] <YesMan_> yareckonirc, go back to 2006 with me, docker wasn't a thing and Word designed websites were not the worst you could stumble upon while browsing the internet =D
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• 214[15:50:59] <Akuw> hi
• 215[15:51:21] *** Joins: mauz555 (~jimmy@replaced-ip)
• 216[15:51:25] <Akuw> any sotware to QA (Quality Assurance) for tsting software?
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• 219[15:53:34] <YesMan_> You mean testing developper side like xunit or the like and software like sonarcube?
• 220[15:53:51] <YesMan_> q*
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• 228[16:00:30] <JustASlacker> Software QA is a pretty big field
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• 340[17:37:07] <Fusl> anyone here able to tell me why a preseed config with "tasksel tasksel/first multiselect" and "d-i pkgsel/include string openssh-server" installs the full desktop stack and how to prevent it from doing so?
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• 377[18:01:59] <jolt> Fusl: do you really need to run tasksel then?
• 378[18:02:21] <Fusl> i tried without tasksel before and that resulted in the same thing
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• 380[18:02:54] <jolt> I use "tasksel tasksel/first multiselect none"
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• 382[18:03:17] <jolt> and then the d-i pgksel as you, and I get bare minimum
• 383[18:03:24] <jolt> (if that was the goal :)
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• 385[18:03:33] <jhutchins_wk> Just a WAG, but it's possible your glob is including a graphical client.
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• 387[18:05:11] <Fusl> my full preseed config, if anyone wants to take a look: replaced-url
• 388[18:05:22] <jhutchins_wk> I've aways found that in automation, using wildcards and relative paths leads to bad consequences. Full paths, specific filenames.
• 389[18:05:52] <jolt> Isn't tasksel tasksel/first multiselect standard supposed to install the desktop stuff?
• 390[18:06:46] <jolt> Or am I missing your goal here Fusl ?
• 391[18:07:00] <Fusl> is it? then what am i supposed to write there instead of "standard", a non existing string or completely omitting the tasksel part?
• 392[18:07:13] <jolt> Fusl: I just told you mine: tasksel tasksel/first multiselect none
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• 397[18:08:50] <Fusl> lets see, trying with `none` now
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• 402[18:10:45] <jolt> Fusl: Actually, the replaced-url
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• 405[18:11:22] <jolt> Fusl: so maybe somthing else is triggering your desktop stuff. But I use none and install whatever I need in the d-i part. I'm off, so hope it works for ya
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• 426[18:26:39] <amsaal> hi
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• 429[18:28:52] <Fusl> "tasksel tasksel/first multiselect none" also installs the desktop environment
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• 450[18:41:35] <jolt> Fusl: Then you have something on d-i that triggers it, like jhutchins_wk said
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• 455[18:45:00] <jolt> Fusl: here is mine: replaced-url
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• 507[19:06:41] <Fusl> oh for fox sake, it kept installing the debian system on another hard disk (sda) than it was booting from (sdb)
• 508[19:06:54] <Fusl> fixing that, `none` does seem to work fine. thanks jolt
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• 511[19:07:39] <jolt> :D
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• 513[19:08:39] <h0027> tokеᥒs."
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• 516[19:10:04] <brigo> hi, Fusl .
• 517[19:10:11] <Fusl> ohai brigo
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• 523[19:12:51] <Brigo> Fusl, in my experience preseeding is tricky, i did it once and was a PITA.
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• 526[19:13:56] <Brigo> Fusl, have you checked the wiki?
• 527[19:14:04] <Fusl> i have
• 528[19:14:22] <Fusl> documentation on preseed is almost non-existent
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• 534[19:15:39] <Fusl> and most documentations about "tasksel/first" don't even show "none" as an option for it
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• 538[19:16:47] <pongo> hii
• 539[19:17:11] <pongo> anyone help me?
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• 542[19:17:38] <jgkamat> its hard to tell until you ask a question
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• 544[19:18:01] <Fusl> that was their question :P
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• 546[19:18:34] <pongo> is it possible to keep windows session same after shut down
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• 549[19:19:26] <pongo> i mean after shutting down i just keep my pc as same sleep mode
• 550[19:20:07] <pongo> hello????
• 551[19:20:24] <jgkamat> hello! :)
• 552[19:20:39] <pongo> its possible???
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• 554[19:21:02] <jgkamat> it's almost certainly possible, but if you wait for more than 10s, there's a much higher chance someone who has done this will see it
• 555[19:21:22] <jgkamat> I recommend hibernation myself, I haven't had much luck even with mac save/restore working well
• 556[19:22:06] <Kobaz> sooooo what's a good way to debug a mount() system call that just hangs
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• 558[19:22:11] <Kobaz> (smb/cifs)
• 559[19:22:48] <Kobaz> replaced-url
• 560[19:22:53] <Kobaz> it'll sit there forever
• 561[19:23:03] <Brigo> pongo, that is what hybernate is intended to.
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• 563[19:23:23] <pongo> ok
• 564[19:23:32] <Brigo> Fusl, the installing wise debian people use to be in #debian-boot. You can try there
• 565[19:23:37] <pongo> tx
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• 570[19:25:59] <Fusl> Brigo: #debian-boot: Cannot join channel (+i) - you must be invited
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• 573[19:27:15] <Brigo> Fusl, it means you have to use the OFTC one, OFTC is the debian official network, and some channels only exists there (as debian-next)
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• 578[19:28:29] <SerajewelKS> pongo: the short answer is "maybe"
• 579[19:28:42] <SerajewelKS> pongo: the longer answer is: yes, if you NEVER mount any volume that windows is using
• 580[19:29:01] <SerajewelKS> if you sleep/hibernate windows and then boot linux, windows has not unmounted any of its filesystems, and may still have filesystem structures cached
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• 583[19:29:21] <SerajewelKS> if you mount those volumes on linux, the stuff windows has cached isn't going to match the disk, and you are going to corrupt your filesystem
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• 585[19:29:52] <SerajewelKS> hibernating one OS and booting another OS on the same machine is a danger zone
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• 598[19:32:49] <kion> If I hook my telephone to the computer I can see all my pictures but without thumbnail previews, is there a way to make debian show them?
• 599[19:33:24] <SerajewelKS> that depends entirely on the filesystem explorer you're using
• 600[19:33:29] <Brigo> kion, it is a desktop configuration issue
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• 611[19:39:38] <kion> Brigo, I am using Gnome3
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• 615[19:40:41] <Brigo> kion, then check the gnome3 configuration or search google for tips.
• 616[19:41:02] <kion> Brigo, where is the gnome3 configuration?
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• 618[19:41:27] <Brigo> kion, err, i have really never used it.
• 619[19:41:53] <kion> Brigo, no problem I think I found an option in the file explorer...
• 620[19:41:55] <kion> thanks
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• 622[19:42:08] <Brigo> kion, nice
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• 642[19:51:04] <deadrom> hi
• 643[19:51:34] <deadrom> what's a good GUI firewall builder? I noticed firestarter is not in deb9 anymore
• 644[19:52:14] <jhutchins_wk> Kobaz: You need more information. If you don't find anything in the logs, increase the log level on the server and the client.
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• 646[19:52:34] <jhutchins_wk> Kobaz: Remember to reset the logging when you get it fixed, it has big performance issues.
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• 652[19:54:43] <jhutchins_wk> Kobaz: You didn't say where that paste was from, what command you tried to use, and it was obviously incomplete.
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• 689[20:18:09] <jhutchins_wk> !firewall
• 690[20:18:09] <dpkg> A firewall is a boundary - usually a computer or network appliance - between your private network and the Internet. A firewall cannot protect the computer it is running on. Ask me about <iptables>. See also <arno-iptables-firewall>, <ferm>, <firehol>.
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• 729[20:42:49] <kion> is it possible to encrypt the whole disk if while installing one didn't choose that option?
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• 734[20:44:42] <SerajewelKS> kion: yes, but not without having a free disk at least the same size, because you have to copy the data off, set up the encrypted volume, and copy the data back
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• 736[20:45:01] <SerajewelKS> if you are using LVM then this process might be possible online, but you still need the second disk
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• 739[20:45:22] <kion> say an external drive would work?
• 740[20:45:31] <kion> what is the process?
• 741[20:45:33] <SerajewelKS> the process will be slower, but it would work
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• 743[20:45:42] <SerajewelKS> did you use LVM?
• 744[20:45:58] <kion> I am almost sure no LVM
• 745[20:46:00] <SerajewelKS> the process is very technical and involves lots of command-line stuff
• 746[20:46:16] <SerajewelKS> okay then you will have to boot into a live environment (the installer CD could work)
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• 748[20:46:52] <kion> ok... go on
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• 751[20:48:02] <SerajewelKS> basic steps are: image the partition you want to encrypt to the external disk, use cryptsetup to create the encrypted volume over the old one, image the copy onto the encrypted logical device
• 752[20:48:26] <SerajewelKS> you may need to shrink the filesystem before imaging it back, because the encrypted logical volume will be slightly smaller (to account for the luks metadata)
• 753[20:48:51] <SerajewelKS> then you have to set up /etc/crypttab and rebuild your initramfs
• 754[20:48:56] <SerajewelKS> note that a separate /boot volume is required
• 755[20:49:01] <SerajewelKS> because grub doesn't know how to read encrypted volumes
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• 757[20:49:37] <kion> SerajewelKS, Seems like it is easier to backup my data, reinstall selecting encrypted!
• 758[20:49:38] <SerajewelKS> so if you don't have one, you will definitely need to shrink your root filesystem to make room for a /boot, and you'll have to repartition your system disk appropriately
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• 760[20:49:41] <tmroland> hi
• 761[20:49:44] <tmroland> annyone
• 762[20:49:44] <tmroland> here
• 763[20:49:45] <SerajewelKS> kion: that may very well be true :)
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• 768[20:49:59] <tmroland> 390 is slow af on nvidia , im on sid, was on stable before with 380 , desktop was fast af. what to do
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• 772[20:50:17] <SerajewelKS> tmroland: what to do? don't use sid.
• 773[20:50:28] <tmroland> but shouldnt it be psosible to use sid without such a dealbreaking bug?
• 774[20:50:34] <tmroland> i mean animations are slow
• 775[20:50:35] <kion> SerajewelKS, for now I will keep using only some ecryptfs folders
• 776[20:50:50] <SerajewelKS> tmroland: sid is the bleeding edge, yes, there will be dealbreaking bugs in sid
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• 778[20:51:19] <SerajewelKS> tmroland: don't use sid unless you're willing to deal with such bugs, and report them to the debian bts
• 779[20:51:20] <tmroland> yes but ubuntu 18.04 uses same driver version, 390 and its also slow af. resulting in the probable scenario that its a driver issue more than a distro one
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• 782[20:51:29] <jhutchins_wk> tmroland: Deal-breaking bugs are what sid is all about.
• 783[20:51:50] <SerajewelKS> tmroland: then you should be talking to nvidia because it's their driver
• 784[20:51:56] <SerajewelKS> assuming you are using the nonfree driver package
• 785[20:52:04] <jhutchins_wk> tmroland: In which case it would more likely need to be fixed upstream than patched by Debian.
• 786[20:52:10] <tmroland> i was thinking maybe there are people with ideas or that have dealt with this issue
• 787[20:52:18] <tmroland> cause i got gtx 1080 and desktop animations are slow
• 788[20:52:30] <jhutchins_wk> tmroland: See how it runs with stable, or ask in #debian-next on oftc.net
• 789[20:52:34] <bites> tmroland: experimental has a newer driver version.
• 790[20:52:51] <tmroland> how do i try that one?
• 791[20:52:51] <SerajewelKS> it's also possible that X is using a different display driver
• 792[20:52:59] <tmroland> its using 390 , i checked
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• 794[20:53:13] <tmroland> i used 380 before on debian 9.5 and it was fast, no issues, upgraded to sid and 390 and bang
• 795[20:53:20] <SerajewelKS> you checked the X logs to verify it has loaded the nvidia driver?
• 796[20:53:22] <tmroland> yes
• 797[20:53:25] <tmroland> and the packages
• 798[20:53:28] <tmroland> that are installed
• 799[20:53:42] <tmroland> its 390 atm
• 800[20:53:42] <SerajewelKS> okay
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• 803[20:53:47] <SerajewelKS> so again, the solution is don't use sid
• 804[20:53:56] <tmroland> how about use sid with a lower driver version ie 380
• 805[20:54:00] <tmroland> wouldnt work?
• 806[20:54:17] <SerajewelKS> you could try it, but there are no guarantees the stretch packages will work on sid
• 807[20:54:19] <tmroland> cause thats my only problem so far and i want gnome 2.30
• 808[20:54:29] <tmroland> 3.30
• 809[20:54:45] <tmroland> ok i get it
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• 811[20:54:57] <tmroland> official response is to go back to stable for any kind of issues on sid
• 812[20:55:02] <SerajewelKS> tmroland: also googling "linux nvidia 390 slow" gives me a slew of threads on this issue
• 813[20:55:13] <tmroland> yes, thats why i came here to ask
• 814[20:55:19] <tmroland> cause i tried a solution from there
• 815[20:55:22] <tmroland> disabling wayland
• 816[20:55:25] <tmroland> and it doesnt work
• 817[20:55:52] <tmroland> says wayland doesnt play nice with restricted nvidia drivers, i tried modifying gdm config, but same stuff happening
• 818[20:56:23] <SerajewelKS> also FWIW we are all volunteers and debian users in here so saying that's the "official response" is incorrect
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• 820[20:56:41] <SerajewelKS> some people may be DDs but you won't get anything resembling an official statement in here
• 821[20:56:45] <tmroland> i also tried apt'ing 380 from stable after modifying its config but it fails cause of diff versions of packages
• 822[20:56:56] <tmroland> i know, it was just a figure of speech
• 823[20:57:09] <tmroland> that most people would rather do that instead of trying to fix the issue
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• 825[20:57:24] <SerajewelKS> well the issue is likely a regression in the driver itself
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• 827[20:57:33] <SerajewelKS> i'm not sure how anyone can be expected to fix it except nvidia
• 828[20:57:39] <tmroland> yes, thats my suspicion too
• 829[20:57:39] <SerajewelKS> you can try the driver in experimental as bites suggested
• 830[20:57:43] <tmroland> how ?
• 831[20:57:49] *** Parts: gman733t (~gman733t@replaced-ip) ()
• 832[20:57:53] <SerajewelKS> !experimental
• 833[20:57:54] <dpkg> experimental is the bleeding edge of Debian Development. Packages here have been deemed unfit/DANGEROUS/untrustworthy/etc for release by the maintainer responsible for them. DO NOT INSTALL PACKAGES FROM EXPERIMENTAL WITHOUT KNOWING EXACTLY WHY AND WHAT YOU ARE DOING. #debian does _not_ support experimental. For an actual description, see section 4.6.4.3 of the Developer's Reference. replaced-url
• 834[20:58:20] *** Parts: Pareidolyer (~2black2bl@replaced-ip) ()
• 835[20:58:31] <tmroland> so add experimental to the apt lines near unstable in apt config
• 836[20:58:37] <SerajewelKS> basically
• 837[20:58:41] *** Quits: colinjmatt (~colinjmat@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 838[20:58:45] <tmroland> then update repositories
• 839[20:58:48] <tmroland> then grab nvidia-driver
• 840[20:58:50] <tmroland> ?
• 841[20:58:53] <SerajewelKS> and pray
• 842[20:59:00] <tmroland> ok then
• 843[20:59:22] <jhutchins_wk> tmroland: You can also try installing the latest one direct from Nvidia - but all warnings about third-party packages apply. You might want to snapshot the system before you do it.
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• 845[20:59:40] <tmroland> is that one newer than the one already in experimental?
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• 847[21:00:28] <lopta> Alright. I have been persuaded to have another go at installing Debian
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• 849[21:00:45] <jhutchins_wk> They do have a newer one, yes, but it's their equivalent of testing.
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• 854[21:02:17] <OS-40281> hi
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• 856[21:03:04] <tmroland> one more t hing, do i put "experimental" in sources.list besides unstable or replace unstable with experimental ?
• 857[21:03:26] <bites> neither. you create an additional line.
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• 859[21:03:35] <tmroland> can you give me that line ?
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• 861[21:04:21] <bites> the same as your sid line but with experimental instead of sid or unstable.
• 862[21:04:27] <tmroland> ok
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• 864[21:06:17] <tmroland> nvidia-driver is already the newest version (390.87-2).
• 865[21:06:22] <tmroland> after apt update with experimental
• 866[21:07:09] <bites> like backports on stable, you need to pass the -t experimental flag when installing packages from there.
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• 868[21:07:20] <tmroland> ok
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• 871[21:09:27] <tmroland> │ The free nouveau kernel module is currently loaded and conflicts with the non-free nvidia kernel module.
• 872[21:09:39] <tmroland> does this mean i have nouveau runnign at same time with the restricted nvidia driver?
• 873[21:09:52] <jhutchins_wk> tmroland: Nope, one or the other.
• 874[21:10:05] <SerajewelKS> tmroland: you've probably been using nouveau the whole time?
• 875[21:10:11] <SerajewelKS> which would explain the slowness
• 876[21:10:16] <tmroland> how do i check for sure
• 877[21:10:28] <SerajewelKS> the X logs should tell you what driver is being used
• 878[21:10:43] <jhutchins_wk> ...also if there are errors.
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• 882[21:11:52] <tmroland> well I see NVIDIA all over in the X log but also lines that say LoadModule nouveau LoadModule nvidia
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• 884[21:12:19] <tmroland> and nvidia-ssettings gui works , shows all info
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• 888[21:13:00] <jhutchins_wk> tmroland: So it should show the version being used.
• 889[21:13:45] <tmroland> 390.87
• 890[21:13:49] <tmroland> so i guess thats what im running
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• 894[21:17:30] <jhutchins_wk> nouveau should be blacklisted, I'm surprized it show up in the log.
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• 899[21:19:20] <jhutchins_wk> Doesn't show up in mine.
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• 943[21:42:52] <Eightynine> Has Debian support of Intel Wi-Fi cards out of the box?
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• 947[21:43:28] <egrain> this might be a dumb question, but how can i see the vote count on github?
• 948[21:43:45] <diogenes_> Eightynine, nope
• 949[21:44:15] <Eightynine> So I need iso with non-free firmware?
• 950[21:44:22] *** Quits: leerg319 (~alexey@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 951[21:44:39] <diogenes_> even that most likely won't work
• 952[21:44:47] <diogenes_> at least for my intel wifi
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• 954[21:44:57] <diogenes_> you still need ethernet to install it
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• 957[21:46:18] <bites> !firmware images
• 958[21:46:18] *** Joins: beaver (~none@replaced-ip)
• 959[21:46:19] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD installer images containing non-free Debian firmware packages are available for installing Debian 9 "Stretch". See replaced-url
• 960[21:46:45] <bites> Eightynine: ^ you can try with this.
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• 963[21:47:40] <Eightynine> diogenes_ Where did I see you? Aren't you from OpenSUSE chat?
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• 965[21:48:09] <diogenes_> Eightynine, and i wanted to ask, are you done with opensuse? :)
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• 969[21:50:05] <Eightynine> diogenes_ Not yet, but still in search for alternative :)
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• 979[21:54:31] <Eightynine> diogenes_ Maybe we can save it somehow? :D
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• 981[21:55:27] <lopta> Well, that didn't work.
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• 984[21:55:38] <diogenes_> Eightynine, :))
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• 1032[22:27:57] <annadane> i'm not sure what's going on. i installed nemo, and when i start it, the file manager opens but so does this black box which fills up the whole screen on top of it
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• 1034[22:28:14] <annadane> is it just a graphical thing, due to using nouveau?
• 1035[22:29:16] <annadane> i'm using i3, and recently when i killed nemo i had to meta + d (to bring up the dmenu) to get the black box to clear
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• 1038[22:30:47] <bites> i't not due to your graphics driver. happens on intel too.
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• 1043[22:33:11] <annadane> oh well. i'll just uninstall it. i don't need nemo specifically
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• 1046[22:34:04] <annadane> using cinnamon it does work, of course
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• 1052[22:35:43] <annadane> i wonder if i should file a report, dunno if it works properly in sid, if it does then there's no point
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• 1061[22:37:18] <bites> nemo has the --no-desktop flag.
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• 1065[22:39:17] <annadane> ok, --no-desktop makes it work properly
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• 1071[22:42:09] <annadane> still, invoking it via the cli and closing it apparently takes the process a long time to close, i don't get my prompt back for some time
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• 1083[22:46:28] <tmroland> isnt there gnome 3.26 or 3.30 in backports?
• 1084[22:46:35] <tmroland> i browsed the site but found nothing
• 1085[22:47:24] <bites> no
• 1086[22:47:37] <tmroland> so if i want stable im stuck with 3.22
• 1087[22:47:38] <bites> not everything gets a backport.
• 1088[22:47:44] <bites> pretty much.
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• 1091[22:47:59] <tmroland> how about testing, waht gnome version does it have
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• 1093[22:48:21] <bites> ,v gnome-shell
• 1094[22:48:22] <judd> Package: gnome-shell on amd64 -- wheezy: 3.4.2-7+deb7u2; jessie: 3.14.4-1~deb8u1; stretch: 3.22.3-3; buster: 3.30.0-2; sid: 3.30.0-2
• 1095[22:48:53] <tmroland> ,v nvidia-driver
• 1096[22:48:55] <judd> Package: nvidia-driver on amd64 -- jessie/non-free: 340.106-1; jessie-backports/non-free: 384.130-1~bpo8+1; stretch/non-free: 384.130-1; stretch-backports/non-free: 390.87-2~bpo9+1; buster/non-free: 390.87-2; sid/non-free: 390.87-2; experimental/non-free: 396.54-1
• 1097[22:49:25] <tmroland> 390 series are bugged
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• 1099[22:49:33] <tmroland> confirmed and tested on both debian and ubuntu
• 1100[22:49:46] <tmroland> its a serious performance issue with the desktop, both KDE and NGOME
• 1101[22:50:03] <tmroland> only good driver is 384 which basically confines me to stretch
• 1102[22:50:09] <tmroland> oh well
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• 1108[22:53:00] <tmroland> i got a wlan usb stick issue at the debian installer, detects it and asks for ESSID beacuse it cant detect a list of network.
• 1109[22:53:17] <tmroland> i do that, and put password, sends me back to ESSID name
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• 1113[22:53:53] <tmroland> doesnt debian support well wireless dongles?
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• 1116[22:55:25] <bites> one of VTs in the installer has a log. check if you find something there.
• 1117[22:55:36] <tmroland> i will
• 1118[22:56:04] <Eightynine> tmroland you nead non-free firmware or install system using cable and then connect to non-free repositories and install non-free firmware.
• 1119[22:56:20] <tmroland> whats teh package or metapackage name for that firmware
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• 1125[22:58:56] <Eightynine> You have to open Software and Repositories in Synaptic as far as I remember, edit repositories by adding contrib nonfree everywhere. And then install firmware-nonfree or linux-nonfree, I don't remember. I think someone here will help you.
• 1126[22:59:16] <tmroland> thanks a lot
• 1127[22:59:22] <tmroland> ill handle it
• 1128[22:59:35] <tmroland> any idea when gnome 3.30 will come to stable ?
• 1129[22:59:40] <tmroland> i mean when do we get a stable update
• 1130[23:00:21] <n4dir> never for stretch, the actual stable.
• 1131[23:00:36] <tmroland> so we'll probly just get 3.26 or 3.28
• 1132[23:00:45] <tmroland> or another stable release
• 1133[23:00:47] <tmroland> ?
• 1134[23:01:05] <Eightynine> I hade same question about Ubuntu, they told me it will be in next LTS.
• 1135[23:01:21] <tmroland> at least they got 3.28
• 1136[23:01:23] <tmroland> so not that far behind
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• 1138[23:01:44] <n4dir> yup, the next stable release will offer newer versions of gnome (or any other software). and only the next.
• 1139[23:01:57] <tmroland> that will probly come next year right?
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• 1144[23:03:22] <n4dir> i would say yes. releases usually happen all 2 years, plus or minus a bit. imho.
• 1145[23:03:33] <tmroland> holy sht
• 1146[23:03:40] <tmroland> the price of running stable software
• 1147[23:04:28] <tmroland> i would love to run sid, i have no issues with it and i can deal with other issues, but nvidia 390 is a dealbreaker.. just slows down all window and app animaitons in both gnome and kde, very stuttery
• 1148[23:04:45] <tmroland> and thing is, its not even a distro problem. its the same on ubuntu 18.04
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• 1154[23:10:43] <hypn0> well it is debian, changed
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• 1160[23:14:30] <tmroland> hate ubuntu
• 1161[23:14:41] <tmroland> cant even properly detect usb removable media in gnome
• 1162[23:14:52] <tmroland> do that in debian stable, no issues
• 1163[23:15:18] <tmroland> ubuntu is debian handicapped
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• 1167[23:19:26] <tmroland> any idea on how to install nvidia 380 in sid?
• 1168[23:19:47] <tmroland> i tried doing it, but it fails on dependencies, diff versions
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• 1181[23:24:10] <hypn0> is it recommended to install in stable only?
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• 1184[23:24:55] <tmroland> i know
• 1185[23:25:04] <Brigo> tmroland, you can try to get the debian sources and compile it.
• 1186[23:25:24] <hypn0> is there 390? replaced-url
• 1187[23:25:34] <tmroland> yes but its bad for me
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• 1189[23:25:35] <tmroland> i need 380
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• 1191[23:27:41] <hypn0> you've seen this? no 380? replaced-url
• 1192[23:28:07] <hypn0> maybe 380 is bad?
• 1193[23:28:21] <hypn0> try 375.66?
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• 1195[23:29:34] <somiaj> ,v nvidia-kernel-dkms
• 1196[23:29:35] <judd> Package: nvidia-kernel-dkms on amd64 -- wheezy/non-free: 304.131-1; jessie/non-free: 340.106-1; jessie-backports/non-free: 384.130-1~bpo8+1; stretch/non-free: 384.130-1; stretch-backports/non-free: 390.87-2~bpo9+1; buster/non-free: 390.87-2; sid/non-free: 390.87-2; experimental/non-free: 396.54-1
• 1197[23:29:47] <somiaj> What version of debian are you running?
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• 1199[23:31:14] <deadrom> have an application that keeps binding to ipv6. I put a line in /etc/sysctl.d to disable v6 on all adapters, reboot, did not help, ifconfif still shows inet6.
• 1200[23:31:25] <deadrom> how do I disable v6 on deb9?
• 1201[23:31:33] <somiaj> deadrom: what is wrong with this? In most cases you don't want to disable ipv6
• 1202[23:31:36] <somiaj> !disable ipv
• 1203[23:31:38] <somiaj> !disable ipv6
• 1204[23:31:42] <somiaj> !disable ipv6
• 1205[23:31:42] <dpkg> From Debian 6.0 "Squeeze" onwards, <IPv6> is built into the Linux kernel (excluding the loongson-2f flavour). To disable IPv6, add the kernel command line option ipv6.disable=1 to your bootloader.
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• 1207[23:32:29] <tmroland> im on sid
• 1208[23:32:52] <deadrom> side topic: how do I go to localhost/v6 in a browser? ::1 does not work
• 1209[23:32:59] <deadrom> (as a URL)
• 1210[23:33:37] <somiaj> tmroland: sid support should be address in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net, and you can get older debian packages from snapshot.debian.org, though older nvidia drivers may not compile against newer kernels.
• 1211[23:33:51] <somiaj> in the end it is worth following bugs and seeing what is needed to make the current version work in buster/sid
• 1212[23:33:51] <tmroland> thank u
• 1213[23:34:06] <tmroland> yewa its annoying
• 1214[23:34:11] <tmroland> gtx 1080 and desktop stutter
• 1215[23:34:12] <tmroland> srsly
• 1216[23:34:16] <tmroland> in 2019
• 1217[23:34:37] <somiaj> I don't notice such problems in buster with a 1070ti, but I also only use fvwm.
• 1218[23:35:03] <somiaj> but anyways, #debian-next on irc.oftc.net is a better place to discuss sid woes. Wonder how stretch + backports driver is working.
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• 1220[23:36:02] <tmroland> probly same
• 1221[23:36:05] <tmroland> its a driver issue
• 1222[23:36:09] <tmroland> it happens on ubuntu 18.04 too
• 1223[23:36:31] <tmroland> minimize/maximize/moving windows and any desktop animatiosn are randomly stuttering and getting slower
• 1224[23:36:58] <somiaj> if it is a widespread issue you should be able to track down bugreports.
• 1225[23:37:02] <tmroland> frobly in that wm u don thave what to notice
• 1226[23:37:11] <somiaj> so far you are the first I've heard with such problems
• 1227[23:37:17] <tmroland> if u google u can see
• 1228[23:37:20] <tmroland> others too
• 1229[23:37:24] <tmroland> 390 performance issues on linux
• 1230[23:37:42] <tmroland> think ill go back on stable then
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• 1241[23:44:34] <tmroland> is there a possibility to run windows games on linux with near native speeds and hardware acceleration to the full but in a virtual machine environment?
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• 1249[23:50:49] <somiaj> tmroland: depends on the game and how well wine supports it
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• 1251[23:51:15] <tmroland> but without wine
• 1252[23:51:18] <tmroland> i was thinking vmware
• 1253[23:51:19] <somiaj> tmroland: if the game support vulcan that helps, there are also vulcan compadabble dx10, 11 and maybe 12 support
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• 1256[23:51:35] <tmroland> world of warcraft and elder scrolls online and guild wars 2
• 1257[23:51:36] <igneous> tmroland, I believe there are some hardware caveats but assuming you've got another discrete gpu you can dedicate to the VM, you could use the new 'looking glass' project
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