4[00:01:39] <dstaring> Does anyone know of a reliable site
which lists the actual e-mail addresses for companies to contact
them? I've wasted a million hours by now looking through
Bosch's website and all they have is a retarded e-mail form
which forces me to send a bunch of data to Google, and lacks a file
upload feature, so I can't attach my photo which is required to
get help.
5[00:02:06] <emyd> got it, reloading amdgpu brought up the
relevant message
29[00:13:05] *** Quits: twobitsprite (~isaac@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
30[00:13:45] <Lady_Aleena> During the upgrade from Stretch to
Buster, I got two messages that concern me. 1) LOCALE: Can not set
LC_ALL to default locale: No such file or directory. 2) ...
dependency problems, but removing anyways as requested. Should
either of those bother me after the upgrade?
49[00:21:00] <petn-randall> Lady_Aleena: You can probably fix
the locale by running `dpkg-reconfigure locales`, and then ensuring
the one you use is selected.
50[00:21:04] <zumba_addict> what is GREB?
51[00:21:40] <klys> zumba_addict, those are flags to prevent
dpkg from doing something unexpected, you can read `man dpkg'
for more info.
52[00:21:48] <zumba_addict> k
53[00:21:55] <zumba_addict> like a safety measure
54[00:22:17] <Lady_Aleena> petn-randall, how do I find out if
it were set after reboot?
55[00:22:51] <mutante> apt or apt-get install should work on
local files but you have to copy them to /var/cache/apt/ first afair
56[00:23:02] <zumba_addict> is -B safe? kinda worried about it
57[00:23:13] <Lady_Aleena> I mean, I just looked up
"locale", and everything seems to be in order.
58[00:23:45] <klys> zumba_addict, if it installs your package
it will tell you that it did.
59[00:23:53] <zumba_addict> k
60[00:23:55] <petn-randall> Lady_Aleena: Was that during
upgrade, or when you also open console?
61[00:24:05] <zumba_addict> The default action is to keep your
current version.
62[00:24:06] <petn-randall> Lady_Aleena: During upgrade that
can happen and I'd consider it normal.
63[00:24:16] <zumba_addict> I should say Y because i want my
old config
64[00:24:20] <zumba_addict> correct?
65[00:24:32] <zumba_addict> oh no, it should be N
66[00:24:40] <Lady_Aleena> petn-randall, only during the
upgrade process. That message came up several times. In the
terminal, "locale" seems to have everything set.
67[00:24:41] <mutante> zumba_addict: just Enter is default
68[00:25:03] <Lady_Aleena> Oh, except LC_ALL is not set.
69[00:25:31] <LtL> Lady_Aleena: ignore the LC_ALL
70[00:25:39] <petn-randall> Lady_Aleena: That's sensible,
as LC_ALL overrides every other setting.
81[00:29:24] <Lady_Aleena> LtL, I did see that during the
upgrade a lot. I'm all upgraded, and no BIG issues. I am in my
DE, listening to music, and on IRC. I even checked Facebook and
Twitter in Firefox, so I think I'm okay for now. My issues are
minor, like making my DE look the way I want it too again.
82[00:30:09] <klys> that's interesting. I usually use
LC_ALL=en_US.utf8 except you have en_US.UTF-8
83[00:30:16] <LtL> Lady_Aleena: congratulations, its downhill
from there
84[00:30:34] <Lady_Aleena> I didn't want until a little
over a month to upgrade this time. (I waited until about a month and
a half ago to upgrade from jessie to stretch.)
87[00:31:27] <dvs> Lady_Aleena, well, the next major upgrade
should be in over 2 years now.
88[00:31:41] <Lady_Aleena> dvs, so no stress until then.
89[00:31:47] <LtL> buster's kernel made my touchpad work
like a rock star
90[00:32:35] <Lady_Aleena> My ONLY major issue is that my
favorite terminal emulator stopped working. Now I have to use others
that don't have horizontal scrolling.
91[00:32:59] <emyd> interesting. after every reboot i need to
reload the amdgpu kernel module to make lightdm/start/X work
158[01:00:35] <BCMM> i think sometimes graphics drivers are
installed to the initramfs in order to provide native resolution via
kms as early as possible in the boot process
174[01:03:11] <humpled> vim has horizontal scrolling
175[01:03:22] <Tom-_> Lady_Aleena, is there no new version?
176[01:03:41] <emyd> BCMM: good idea, when i run
'update-initramfs -u' it warns about missing possible
firmware files but they are definitively present because
firmware-amd-graphics is installed
177[01:04:13] <emyd> *possible missing
178[01:04:23] <Lady_Aleena> LtL, apt show terminator shows the
wrong one.
190[01:07:56] <dpkg> If you were already using Debian 10
"Buster" prior to it being released as stable, or you use
'testing' in your sources.list, apt-get will complain
about changes to the release information on the mirror. apt(8) will
prompt you to accept changes; apt-get(8) will need
--allow-releaseinfo-change
193[01:08:37] <BCMM> ok it turns out i *really* don't know
how a debian initrams works, because mine appears to be much larger
than the files extracted from it...
194[01:09:43] <petn-randall> BCMM: If you have microcode
installed, it gets prepended to the initramfs in a really weird way.
195[01:09:57] <BCMM> petn-randall: yeah, microcode is all
i'm seeing
206[01:12:03] <tfgbd_> Why did my debian come with Matlab?
207[01:12:06] <Minall> Hello!
208[01:12:25] <Minall> I'm having a strange bug, I really
need help since I don;t know what to do
209[01:12:45] <petn-randall> !ask
210[01:12:46] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For
example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian
version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I
expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if
anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all
volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get
an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org.
See <smart questions><errors>.
211[01:12:57] <Minall> Thank you, ok!
212[01:13:15] <n-iCe> dumb question, is I go for testing, do I
need to uprade or change the iso to get a new version of debian? or
will it be updated by itself
213[01:13:18] <petn-randall> BCMM: Indeed, it's a weird
setup.
214[01:13:42] <BCMM> i guess that's why unmkinitramfs
exists...
215[01:13:45] <Minall> I'm trying to install debian on an
old computer, but just by plugin the USB it freezes totally my pc,
to the point when I have to restart manually.
216[01:13:58] <BCMM> and wow this initramfs is kind of huge. why
is ntfs-3g in here? does debian support NTFS boot???
248[01:19:10] <n-iCe> i'm going to install debian too
249[01:19:10] <n-iCe> brb
250[01:19:14] <Minall> Maybe I can't install debian in this
pc exactly...
251[01:19:18] <BCMM> n-iCe: i'm not quite sure i understand
the question. do you already have a debian install, that you want to
upgrade? or are you asking which ISO to use for a new install now?
254[01:20:37] <n-iCe> BCMM: I'm just asking if the testing
version upgrades to the new version of debian with update &&
upgrade when a new version is released
255[01:21:08] <BCMM> n-iCe: ok, so i'm going to assume
you're talking about an already-installed copy of debian...
256[01:21:30] <Tom-_> Lady_Aleena, either that or you can show
us the java error
257[01:21:34] <BCMM> n-iCe: you can upgrade to a new debian
release from within debian. you don't need to download a new
iso and install it again
258[01:21:35] <n-iCe> BCMM: no no
259[01:21:49] <BCMM> n-iCe: but the process is not automatic.
you will need to change your sources.
260[01:21:54] <n-iCe> I don't use Debian, I WANT to install
debian.
261[01:22:10] <n-iCe> I need to change sources in stable
262[01:22:12] <n-iCe> But what about testing
263[01:22:36] <n-iCe> is my question, I'm a guy who hates
upgrade to a new version from an already installed system I always
do a clean install
264[01:22:42] <BCMM> n-iCe: oh, hang on... is your question
about what happens when you're running testing, and the release
you're running becomes the new stable?
265[01:23:00] <n-iCe> question is, is testing like a rolling
release that I never need to do a clean install?
266[01:23:07] <n-iCe> BCMM: yeeees
267[01:23:19] <Minall> nice question btw
268[01:23:22] <BCMM> n-iCe: in that case, it depends on whether
you used the distro codename in your sources, or the word
"testing"
269[01:23:36] <n-iCe> but testing will be always testing,
isn't?
270[01:23:53] <n-iCe> so means I will have the lastest files and
distro codename, and base, files etc?
271[01:24:01] <n-iCe> no need to do a clean install anymore?
272[01:24:03] <BCMM> n-iCe: i think a couple of examples will
help. last week, buster was the testing distro, but now, it's
the stable distro
273[01:24:13] *** Quits: Minall (~user@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
274[01:24:56] <BCMM> n-iCe: a user who had "buster" in
their sources.list will still be on buster. so they will have
switched from testing to stable, but not switched debian release
276[01:25:44] <n-iCe> but If I download testing, will it say
testing or buster
277[01:25:45] <BCMM> n-iCe: a user who had "testing"
in their sources.list will have automatically upgraded to bullseye.
they have switched to the next debian release, and stayed on testing
285[01:26:21] <n-iCe> you will be always be in the last codename
and in the last files
286[01:26:34] *** Quits: The_Blue_Eyed_Gi (cc2c7048@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
287[01:26:37] <BCMM> n-iCe: i think the default sources.list
uses the codename. but i'm not sure about that. i usually use
debootstrap and write my own sources.list.
288[01:26:38] <tfgbd_> Why did my debian come with Matlab?
294[01:27:20] <n-iCe> think I'm just gonna install stable
295[01:27:29] <BCMM> tfgbd_: is it debian for arm, or raspbian?
296[01:27:32] <n-iCe> anyway, takes years to release a new
update, right?
297[01:27:38] <tfgbd_> begins with an r
298[01:27:39] <BCMM> n-iCe: usually about two years, yes
299[01:27:45] <n-iCe> is not like ubuntu that releases every 2
months
300[01:27:47] <BCMM> !raspbian
301[01:27:48] <dpkg> Raspbian is a distribution <based on
Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian
is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use
#raspbian (or #raspberrypi) on irc.freenode.net for support.
replaced-url
302[01:27:49] <n-iCe> 6 months*
303[01:28:31] <BCMM> tfgbd_: see above. personally i'd try
#raspberrypi, #raspbian has been pretty quiet since the Foundation
officially adopted raspbian
304[01:28:48] <BCMM> tfgbd_: the debian project does not decide
what goes in to raspbian images
305[01:29:03] <tfgbd_> You mean I can't apt-get it back?
306[01:29:52] <BCMM> tfgbd_: i don't know. i only use
lightweight raspbian installs with no desktop. if you want to find
more people who know about raspbian, try an appropriate channel
308[01:30:21] <BCMM> n-iCe: debian releases approximately every
two years, and it just released a couple of days ago. so stable is
about as cutting-edge as it's ever going to be right now :)
309[01:30:47] <n-iCe> BCMM: :D
310[01:30:50] <n-iCe> what de do you use
311[01:30:51] <n-iCe> DE
312[01:31:04] <tfgbd_> Perfect. But 14 years would be even
better.
313[01:31:17] <BCMM> n-iCe: who, me?
314[01:31:29] <BCMM> n-iCe: kde plasma, on desktop
321[01:33:10] <disi> i'm having an issue upgrading... i was
tracking buster before, now i updated sources.list to stable and
I'm trying to run `apt upgrade` but i'm getting "
unable to make backup symlink for
'./usr/lib/apt/methods/https': No such file or
directory" I was able to install apt-transport-https
successfully, but to no avail. any tips?
333[01:35:07] <tfgbd_> Did Douglas Boling ever come here?
334[01:35:20] <mutante> what's his nick?
335[01:35:22] <BCMM> disi: that might actually be a good
point... some string to integer functions are liable to decide
things are binary for no good reason
350[01:41:12] <disi> huh... that doesn't seem right
351[01:41:31] <Tom-_> i don't know much about java, is this
jessies.terminator (unrelated to Debian jessie, for those playing
along at home) free and open source?
377[01:46:12] <Lady_Aleena> Tom-_, I am okay using a terminal to
install packages. I just needed to know what to do. This may be the
only thing that I have ever installed with a .deb file. I use
apt-get 99.99% of the time.
378[01:46:31] *** Quits: n-iCe (~nice@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
379[01:47:11] <Tom-_> that's allowed :)
380[01:48:21] <disi> mutante: ugh... there are a bunch of others
that get hit behind that if i fix that manually
381[01:48:30] <Lady_Aleena> Trying it now.
382[01:48:47] <LtL> Lady_Aleena: i think apt install ./debfile
will solve dependencies
406[01:57:42] <LtL> well, columns show up fine as do file lists
407[01:58:00] <Lady_Aleena> So for example, if I run dpkg -l,
EACH row is one program without the end wrapping to the next line
making the columns look bad.
408[01:59:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1519
409[01:59:03] <LtL> Lady_Aleena: with a term maxed dpkg -l
doesn't need to wrap
417[02:00:11] <disi> mutante: 3301 seems irrelevant because i am
not interacting with any windows programs for this (apt is tripping
up on something in /usr/lib)... still looking at the other
418[02:00:14] <Lady_Aleena> mutante, I still get line wrapping
in another terminal.
419[02:00:14] <disi> (ty, btw)
420[02:00:32] <disi> what should /usr/lib/apt/planners/dump
point to tho?
421[02:01:06] *** Quits: de-facto (~de-facto@replaced-ip) (Quit: See you around.)
443[02:13:01] <disi> aaaaand I'm back from a BSOD. windoze
is grayt
444[02:13:06] <tehnull> ewlol
445[02:13:23] <mutante> Lady_Aleena: so you are saying it worked
in jessie and changed in buster?
446[02:13:52] <Lady_Aleena> mutante, redmond changed between
stretch and buster.
447[02:13:58] <Chex> I wonder if buster supports my Ryzen 2400G
CPU now
448[02:14:11] <Chex> should try to install on a thumb-drive for
s&g's
449[02:14:12] <mutante> Lady_Aleena: i think i can confirm
that.. i tried in buster and indeed no horizontal bar.. but for
Jessie it is advertised as a feature
450[02:14:27] <mutante> Lady_Aleena: eh. i use terminator all
day but what's the relation to Redmond?
498[02:24:05] <mutante> and i did not even select anything
because i just picked MATE desktop
499[02:24:17] <mutante> and i got Xorg apparently
500[02:24:31] <disi> debian is amazing... move broken stuff out
of the way and let it fix itself... upgrade seems to be going fine
now. can't fix the broken, double-pain windoze tho,
unfortunately XD
540[02:28:21] <disi> it makes sense now that i understand it,
but ya, i agree: you shouldn't really _need_ to understand it
541[02:28:22] <petn-randall> tehnull: The reason it doesn't
exist is that people are even less inclined to read the release
notes, and then cry when things go wrong.
542[02:28:32] <cshzg> abrotman: i see...
543[02:28:41] <tehnull> things shouldn't go wrong
544[02:28:42] <Lady_Aleena> tehnull, I too wish for a gui
upgrade program. My eyes are still tired of watching lines scrolling
in my terminal.
545[02:28:48] <l337f00l> can't wait for buster on devuan
its gonna be soo sweet
550[02:29:04] <abrotman> Didn't see that coming ...
551[02:29:16] <Lady_Aleena> abrotman, 8)
552[02:29:22] <mutante> so something like "sed -i
stretch/buster/g /etc/apt/sources.list ; apt-get update ; apt-get
upgrade" to turn it into a single command and then alias that
639[02:49:07] <l0rdN1k0n> free my nukka ba55 he didn't do
nothing .... HACK THE PLANET!!!!!! HACK THE PLANET!!!!!! WOOOOOOOOOO
MESS WITH THE BEST DIE LIKE THE REST!!!!!
860[04:06:59] <Resilience> a little bit ooftopic, and I know
this is _not_ the right channel for testing, but the right channel
seems to be dead or sleeping, what's going with testing
version? why can't be updated && dist-upgraded?
862[04:07:22] <mason> Resilience: The right channel is
#debian-next on OFTC, not on Freenode.
863[04:07:48] <sleepingforest> congrats on Buster, thank u all
for your work
864[04:07:58] <Resilience> mason, I said it in the first part
" I know this is _not_ the right channel for testing, but the
right channel seems to be dead or sleeping,"
867[04:09:11] <mason> Resilience: Ah, common error for people to
not realize it wasn't on the same network.
868[04:09:26] <dvs> !wwbr
869[04:09:27] <dpkg> Debian 10 "Buster" started the
<freeze> process on 2019-01-12 and should release on July 6,
2019. See
replaced-url
870[04:09:35] <dvs> hmmmmm....
871[04:09:41] <nonicknamegivenh> Fresh install of Debian 10,
after installing firewalld, I used "firewall-cmd --zone=public
--add-service=http --permanent" and called --reload. Firewalld
is not completely broken and spits out error regarding iptables. Any
suggestions?
872[04:09:45] <Resilience> mason, I am onth eother network, but
everyone seems to be sleeping or disappeared
896[04:25:59] <Resilience> binaryhermit, don't know, it is
the first time I get t this, a respository change (security) changed
without being listed, a complete freeze ontesting and some extrange
messages with apt_get, the craziness of modern times I am afraid
898[04:27:45] <laughingtiger> hi, is avahi-daemon useful in
debian? I recently disabled it, but found no malfunction of the
system. everything seems normal.
899[04:27:53] *** Quits: Shmam (4b64572e@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
900[04:28:27] <zoredache> it can be useful if your network is
shared with Mac (OSX) devices and you want automagical name
resolution to work
901[04:28:40] <zoredache> for file sharing and other resources
902[04:28:49] <zoredache> probably not as useful for a single
computer
903[04:28:55] <jmcnaught> Shmam: have you checked
/var/log/syslog for errors?
908[04:33:39] <Resilience> laughingtiger, I have the same issue
with you, avah is a uppn server, that allows o annoucnce every
service you want by means of upnp, unless you want to do that, you
don't need to and debian works the same
914[04:37:45] <laughingtiger> Resilience, thank you for that,
I've Bing'ed and google'd a lot, but still can't
have a clear conception about it, now I understand.
918[04:38:48] <Resilience> laughingtiger, it took me 3 years to
udenrstand that, upnp announces things (like the rendezvous or
wahtever is called i now MacOS service) and by configuring avahim,
yo ucana nnounce EVERYTHING (which neither wise nor safe, of course)
920[04:40:12] <Resilience> laughingtiger, yes, 3 years, until I
found a little link that make a configutarion for a VBUS service and
I have my a-ha moment
921[04:40:21] <Resilience> VBUS*DBUS
922[04:41:12] <laughingtiger> Resilience, I guess the total time
accumulated couldn't excess 3 months, you just expanded it into
3 years, is that right?
965[04:51:35] <Bjornn> except Sid should be a gangster, not a
toy.
966[04:51:36] <Bjornn> :)
967[04:51:39] <Resilience> somebody is something is wrong with
bullseye or if sources.list must be changed? there are no updates in
testing since deb10 release (I know, offtopic, but debian-next is
full of dead7selept people)
970[04:53:09] *** Quits: torbo (~user@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
971[04:53:50] <jmcnaught> Resilience: have you tried asking in
#debian-next? Just because nobody else is talking doesn't mean
nobody will see your question.
972[04:54:35] <Resilience> jmcnaught, yes, I did, I don't
meant "nobody is talking" but "nobody asnwered"
(sorry for being ambigous) that's why I ask here
973[04:54:54] <Resilience> jmcnaught, and I know is a
"little" off-topic, but...
974[04:54:58] <jml2> Resilience, deb10 is like 2 days old..
975[04:55:08] <jml2> Resilience, don't see why you would
have testing in your repo settings
976[04:55:11] <addviking> Resilience, annadane has answered you
in this thread. packages have to go thru unstable first. expect 10
days before packages in testing
981[04:57:05] <Resilience> addviking, ok, as I said, it tis the
first time it happens to me, and it's been a non-reported
change in security reports wtich rasie an error
982[04:57:18] <Resilience> no matter, thanks to all ofo you
988[05:00:43] <Resilience> jml2, Starting with the next release
(bullseye), the security archives were renamed from xxx/updates to
xxx-security, but this doesn't seem to be documented yet. There
was a short mailing list post, but I figured it out by browsing the
archive
992[05:03:31] <jml2> Resilience, try it without
"debian-security" in the path...
993[05:03:34] *** Quits: icarusfactor (~factor@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
994[05:04:10] *** Quits: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
995[05:04:43] <jml2> Resilience, here I get a redirect to
replaced-url
996[05:04:56] <Resilience> jml2, I configured the paths as is
said in that post, and now it raises no erro rnor warn, but there
are no updates, and is the first time it happnes to me, that's
why I was asking too, but if you said it is normal, well, it will be
the new normal, no problem
998[05:05:16] <jml2> Resilience, maybe they're upgrading
the way their redirects work..
999[05:05:57] <jml2> Resilience, if you use your webbrowser , it
probably would redirect to a closer cdn near you .. maybe the
"cdn" actually means content-delivery-network ..
1000[05:06:12] <Resilience> jml2, wahtever, as I said, it just
urged me alittle bit to know if there was something new, or if I was
making something wriong, seems neither of them, so I can wait
1001[05:07:20] <jml2> Resilience, where did you read about that
particular way of setting the security repo to ->
"debian-security" ?
1006[05:08:28] <jml2> Resilience, um, i was expecting a
mailinglist topic from a dev team..
1007[05:08:40] <jml2> Resilience, reddit is reddit
1008[05:08:48] <Resilience> jml2, as I said, in an answer someone
says he read ti in a mailinglist
1009[05:09:10] <jml2> oh
1010[05:09:14] <jml2> i c
1011[05:09:33] <jml2> Resilience, but they're using
"bullseye-security", not "debian-security" .. i
did not bother to look at that
1012[05:09:38] <Resilience> jml2, reddit points to the mailing
list, the fact is that with the raditional path raises errors and
warnings, and with the reddit path it beahves as a cahrm, so...
1013[05:09:53] <jml2> or maybe this -> "bullseye-security
instead of bullseye/updates"
1016[05:11:17] <Resilience> jml2, I am using testing, not
bullseye, you will say "they are the same", no they
aren'tm bullseye is testing now, two days ago wasn't and
some months inthe future won't be, so I _alwys_ point my
repositories to testing, and someone roke that and it was not
documented, you know, the "new normal"
1018[05:11:39] <Resilience> jml2, I don't care about
bullseye and names, I care about stable, testing, etc
1019[05:11:51] <jml2> Resilience, never claimed correction to
that. I am just trying to access the next release security repo.
1020[05:11:54] <Resilience> someone broke that
1021[05:12:02] <themill> !bullseye-security
1022[05:12:02] <dpkg> Security updates in testing are delayed by
the normal testing migration *and* may be further delayed by missing
dependencies, etc. See
replaced-url
1023[05:12:30] *** Joins: Immanuel (~Manu@replaced-ip)
1024[05:12:37] <themill> (you can s/bullseye/testing/ on that,
but you may as well delete the line)
1025[05:13:32] <Resilience> themill, I can as well delete it..
today, but a few weeks, month years down the line I wouldn't
delete it :)
1026[05:13:33] <jml2> (Resilience is the one that has the issue)
1047[05:21:02] <Resilience> but pleae, jml2 stop talking about
this, I don't to talk of testing here, just asnwering you about
"oh, but it isnormla", no, it is nor moral and never
happened
1048[05:21:26] <Resilience> but as I said, I don't want to
talk of etsting hee, because peoplep will be upsetted
1049[05:21:33] <jml2> Resilience, according to what themill who
knows more than me.. it appears to be a recurring theme during
migration
1050[05:21:56] <jml2> Resilience, (according to the factoid and
official debian.org site)
1051[05:22:08] <Resilience> jml2, hat si blatanly not true, in
fact, a day after migration uses to be an avalanche of new updates
1052[05:22:14] <jml2> Resilience, I don't know if its new..
1053[05:22:23] <jml2> Resilience, I'm not contesting
anything, just stating what is out there
1054[05:22:26] <Resilience> jml2, how long are you using debian?
1060[05:24:17] <jml2> I just upgraded my debian system since good
ol little wheezy :) (I've used debian much earlier than this)
1061[05:24:45] <jml2> I just upgraded 2 days ago, and the upgrade
went pretty well. I was previously on and off with testing as well,
but lingered off testing some time ago..
1062[05:25:12] <jml2> I keep testing in other places, not this
workstation atm
1063[05:27:26] <jml2> Resilience, its funny, if you've been
on linux for that long, I wouldn't consider reddit a valuable
resource to look up issues
1064[05:28:02] <Resilience> jml2, but I am NOT upgrading, I am
KEEPING ON running testing, do you understand now the difference? I
am NOT asking anything about updatign to the new version, I am
asking about something BROKEN in te repos for testing SINCE the new
version, and as I said, it is a esting question, that I asked here
as a last resort try, I don0t really want to talk about this, but
you keep on talking and talking and talking wantig to have a reason
that you don't have
1065[05:28:02] <Resilience> man
1066[05:28:41] <jml2> Resilience, I never claimed. You seem to
put a lot of goofy words in my mouth.
1069[05:29:15] <Resilience> jml2, are you a woman?
1070[05:29:55] <jml2> don't give me a "reddit"
post on me. that's for children.
1071[05:30:00] <Resilience> jml2, are you a woman?
1072[05:30:08] <mason> Isn't sexism generally in violation
of whatever Code of Conduct you'd care to select?
1073[05:30:10] <Kon-> Could any KDE Plasma users on Buster please
check to see if Keyboard Navigation options are accessible from
System Settings? I've got a report that they're not, but
I'm on a newer version of Plasma.
1081[05:32:37] <jmcnaught> jml2: if you just called that person a
woman because they were being annoying then that is pretty
misogynist which has no place in this channel.
1082[05:32:41] <mason> Let's see...
1083[05:33:04] <mason> !next
1084[05:33:04] <dpkg> Another happy customer leaves the building.
1090[05:36:16] <jml2> jmcnaught, oh yeah, that's true. I
should have never said the one word that is ultimately mysogynistic.
You are 100% correct... "politically" speaking. You must
be a really really wise man and you should be proud of yourself.
1091[05:36:27] *** Quits: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1093[05:37:11] <mason> jml2: Stop while you're only a little
behind, mmkay? Not acceptable.
1094[05:38:17] <jml2> mason, that guy Resilience was already
having been triggered before I showed up here. He was crying before
I can place out the bucket for him... probably has been doing this
on other channels as well. Can't help you there buddy mmkay?
1106[05:48:18] <finn0> Still, facing same problem despite of many
no. of reboots. Couldn't open Chromium in
"workspace-1". I'm using GNOME desktop evironment.
Here problem description:
1110[05:50:46] <finn0> When I'm trying to open Chromium
browser from workspace-1 workspace automatically switched to 2 and
then Chromium opens (i.e. chromuim opens in workspace-2).
1126[05:59:59] <finn0> jmcnaught: Yep, I'm using "auto
move windows". But, getting same result after disabling this
extension. Do I need to restart system/logout after disable the
extension to affect the results?
1129[06:00:58] <finn0> jmcnaught: And also same results for
opening chromium from terminal in current workspace.
1130[06:01:41] <jmcnaught> finn0: disabling the extension should
be enough, or deleting its rule for Chromium. Do you have anything
else that might be moving windows around?
1133[06:06:10] <awal1> I have made a few changes in / and home
config files but i don't remember which ones; nothing
complicated, almost config files regarding theming, energy and some
kernel, systemd and X login boot stuff. How can i find which files
have been modified manually by my single user?
1135[06:07:59] <awal1> it is bcoz I want switch to stable, bcoz i
have no really time to maintain Sid, and I want a really frech
install than modify stuff manually, no a reinstall from a backup
1162[06:26:01] <dstaring> I thought it was a Linux distro.
1163[06:26:16] <dstaring> Sounds like a right nightmare to try to
get all that crap working on FreeBSD as well.
1164[06:26:38] *** Quits: ghoti (~paul@replaced-ip) (Read error: No route to host)
1165[06:27:16] <awal1> finn0, I haven't used gnome since a
few years, but a few yeas ago, after disabling x extension
gnome-shell restart is needed (ctrl-r-restart/r)
1171[06:30:34] <jml2> dstaring, yeah the kfreebsd kernel.. i
tried it like 2 years ago.. they suspended the project for some
time...
1172[06:30:56] <jml2> dstaring, couple days ago debian released
(unofficial) gnu/hurd..
1173[06:30:58] *** Quits: inoderrant (~inoderran@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1174[06:31:03] <dstaring> kfreebsd? Is that a typo or a special
version of FreeBSD's kernel?
1175[06:31:07] <jml2> dstaring, i tried that as well recently in
a virtualbox..
1176[06:31:25] <jml2> dstaring, yeah a freebsd kernel that's
suited to work for debian..
1177[06:32:31] <jml2> dstaring, i haven't tried it since
that 2 year ago mark
1178[06:32:43] <jml2> dstaring, after they announce suspending
supporting it.. it may be back on track dunno
1179[06:32:59] <dstaring> I'm purely interested because it
surprised me. I wouldn't ever want to use it, because I wasted
17 years of my life wrestling with that garbage OS FreeBSD.
1180[06:33:32] <dstaring> Interesting that Hurd apparently is
finally "ready for action" in some sense.
1181[06:33:50] <zoredache> I think some people wanted it for ZFS
or something
1198[06:46:45] <jim> is debian's policy on any configuration
changes made by the person who installs debian or otherwise has
admin rights, that the installation would keep that change?
1199[06:46:48] <finn0> awal1: which version do u use? Mine is
"Chromium 73.0.3683.75 built on Debian 9.8, running on Debian
9.9"
1214[06:50:57] <jml2> finn0, worked fine for me and I have over
20 gigs of app data intalled
1215[06:51:43] <finn0> I'm using some third party
application and added some third party repos in my source list.
Shoud I remove those before upgrading?
1216[06:51:46] <awal1> finn0, before migration read
replaced-url
1217[06:52:23] <jim> finn0, upgrading to the new dist from the
previous stable, is one of the things that would stop a release if
there were any problems
1219[06:53:44] <awal1> migration from current stable to new
stable is only guaranteed almost without breakage for a pure debian
system
1220[06:53:47] <jml2> finn0, should disable imho all non-debian
non-official repos and place them in a subdirectory , eg,
/etc/apt/sources.list.d/_dis , then do apt-get update -- also be
sure to remove anything backports and "stretch"
1221[06:54:01] <jim> finn0, turn those 3rd party repos off during
the upgrade
1222[06:54:12] <jml2> finn0, so don't keep stretch-backports
or stretch, disable/comment those lines out..
1223[06:54:20] <jml2> finn0, and just buster
1224[06:54:32] *** Quits: kreyren (~kreyren@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1277[07:27:42] <jim> dgriffi, and add lots of informative details
1278[07:28:03] <mataniko> So any python code that calls
MySQLdb.thread_safe() is now broken in Buster, should return
something but the method doesn't exist. Worked just fine in
stretch
1307[07:34:38] <Nz17> Hello. Unhappily upgraded to Debian 10. Now
sound playback won't work right. Sound plays via USB but not
PCI. Tried purging ALSA and PulseAudio packages and messing with
configs for the last several hours. alsa-info.txt has been uploaded
to
replaced-url
1308[07:34:38] <Lady_Aleena> Damn it! I can't use reportbug.
1312[07:36:23] <rwp> Lady_Aleena, Bugs submitted to Debian are
simply email. If you can send an email by any method then a bug may
be submitted by email.
1313[07:37:03] <dead_> im probably in the wrong chatroom?
1314[07:37:16] <Lady_Aleena> jim, my minor issue is with apt.
1315[07:37:18] <rwp> Lady_Aleena, For help
replaced-url
1317[07:37:31] <Lady_Aleena> rwp, I'm there now. 8)
1318[07:37:37] <jim> Lady_Aleena, -or-, you could download the
software involved from upstream, test to see if the bug exists
there, and if so, report the bug upstream... if not, you know the
bug is with the debian package
1336[07:44:35] <Lady_Aleena> How do I get my kernel version?
1337[07:45:33] <jim> I have a situation... I'm using okular
to print a pdf, and I select the lp printer... then okular says file
/usr/bin/lpr not found, but when I ls it, it's there
1355[07:48:36] <laughingtiger> finn0, have you tried move your
mouse to the top of the screen and right click it on the chromium
browser or whatever the name it is, and choose "move to
desktop" option?
1364[07:50:50] <dead_> please forgive me. i have a disk drive
from a playstation 3 i corrupted by plugging it into a windows pc.
what other format tool other than g-parted is new user friendly
1365[07:51:26] <jim> dead_, what do you want to do with the
drive?
1366[07:52:09] <rwp> Plugging a playstation disk into ms-windows
system should not be enough to corrupt it.
1367[07:52:19] <jim> dead_, (notice... someone is responding to
your question)
1368[07:52:34] <dead_> format. and update
1369[07:52:51] <eb0t> stretch is debian 4.9.0-9-amd64
1370[07:53:03] <jim> you want to format the whole drive?
1371[07:53:05] *** Quits: kopper (~mrbabar@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1372[07:53:15] <jim> how large is it?
1373[07:53:16] <dead_> its corrupt as far as the ps3 says..
1387[07:55:30] <dead_> im not sure ... i dont ps3 runs anything
important from the hardrive
1388[07:55:33] <jim> Lady_Aleena, there is the bug tracking
system, at bugs.debian.org
1389[07:55:50] <dead_> know*
1390[07:55:55] <finn0> laughingtiger: I didn't find any
"move to desktop" option. I moved cursor to top bar of
chromium browser and right click on it getting these options
"Minimize/Restore/New tab/Reopen closed tabs" etc. but not
"move to desktop".
1391[07:56:29] <dead_> lets just say no... nothing important..
1392[07:56:38] <jim> dead_, ok. you need to make that decision
first before you do anything to the drive
1393[07:56:58] <dead_> ok. just a sec..
1394[07:57:06] <laughingtiger> finn0, looks like your system is
indeed broken.
1395[07:57:35] <laughingtiger> finn0, or you're not using
kde? in that case I'm useless to you now.
1396[07:58:00] <finn0> jim: as you suggest comment out 3rd party
repo. Shouldn't I first uninstall those apps?
1397[07:58:21] <jim> dead_, the decision is: do you care
what's on the hard drive (could be your saved games), or do you
want to blow all of that away, and format the drive new?
1398[07:58:34] <Lady_Aleena> jim, the problem is that bugs filed
by email may take days to get filed and show up on the appropriate
page.
1399[07:59:14] <jim> finn0, you can take care of that after the
upgrade. and, it's possible if the 3rd party packages depend on
packages in stretch, it will remove them for you
1400[07:59:14] <dgriffi> I'm trying to get QEMU to emulate a
sparc or sparc64 such that networking works. All the guides I find
on doing this are either dreadfully out of date or just plain
don't work.
1401[07:59:30] <Nz17> Upgraded to Debian 10 from 9. Now sound
playback won't work properly. Sound plays back via USB but not
PCI. Tried purging ALSA and PulseAudio packages and messing with
configs for the last several hours. alsa-info.txt has been uploaded
to
replaced-url
1405[07:59:55] <finn0> laughingtiger: I'm using GNOME.
1406[08:00:26] <jim> Lady_Aleena, ok, check the bug tracking
system. by the way, when you file a bug that way, the system will
send an email to the maintainer
1407[08:00:45] <Lady_Aleena> Well, I hope I formatted it
correctly.
1408[08:00:46] <laughingtiger> finn0, I see, I've only used
gnome once or twice. you should try to take the upgrade. good luck.
1410[08:00:48] <jim> it will also do that with reportbug
1411[08:01:33] <jim> it should also send you emails
1412[08:01:40] <finn0> laughingtiger: Thank you.
1413[08:01:46] <sleepingforest> whats a good firewall solution
for a desktop? I know firewalld and the firewall-config exist but im
curious about alternatives and what other people use
1414[08:01:58] <dead_> nothing important on the drive.. i just
need to format the whole thing no space fat32
1415[08:01:58] <sleepingforest> I know on mac os alot of people
use LittleSnitch
1416[08:02:08] <Lady_Aleena> And sent it to the correct email
address. The only one I could find was submit@bugs.debian.org
1417[08:02:48] <jim> Lady_Aleena, yeah, that's the right
address
1438[08:09:45] *** Quits: dude187 (~chris@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1439[08:10:20] <blackflow> finn0: it totally is.
1440[08:10:53] <finn0> I think, upgradation will probably broke
3rd party app because their dependency (library/package) will be
replaced by newer one and may be that app is not compatiable with
those libs/packages.
1447[08:12:10] <Lady_Aleena> Well, it looks like #qt and #xfce
are both very very very quiet right now, so I am not going to get
much further tonight setting up my de.
1448[08:12:12] <dead_> i smell sarcasm?
1449[08:12:46] <finn0> blackflow: Then, what would you suggest?
First should I uninstall 3rd party app then upgrade to Buster or
reverse (i.e. upgrade to buster then uninstall)?
1450[08:13:50] <finn0> I think first one is better and safe.
1451[08:13:58] <blackflow> finn0: probably the best thing is to
uninstall, upgrade, then reinstall with proper support for bustre
(eg. from a repo that's for buster)
1452[08:14:39] <jim> dead_ sec
1453[08:14:43] <blackflow> mixing and matching repos and packages
is a yak-shaving infinite rabbit hole even most advanced users can
get caught into...
1454[08:14:51] <dead_> ty
1455[08:15:13] <jim> finn0, yep, that's a bad idea because
you could import an incompatible dependency tree
1456[08:15:27] <jim> and that can lead to dependency hell
1461[08:16:38] <finn0> blackflow: Should I also take proper
backup of system first? (means Is there any chance that after
upgradation system will not boot?)
1463[08:16:58] <jim> Lady_Aleena, that should be fine
1464[08:17:23] <blackflow> finn0: you should always keep proper
backups of your data and config, yes, not just for upgrades. and if
things go wrong for some reason you can always reinstall.
1465[08:17:39] <jim> dead_, you might want to check the drive for
bad blocks
1466[08:18:01] <finn0> blackflow, jim: thanks.
1467[08:18:17] <deego> Lady_Aleena: did you say xfce? I used
xfce, and haven't upgraded to buster yet. Is it broken or
something in buster?
1470[08:18:25] <jim> Lady_Aleena, and, you should be able to
check bugs.debian.org to see if your bug report made it there
1471[08:19:34] *** Quits: tyranny12 (~blarg@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1472[08:20:34] <jim> finn0, so dependency hell and plain not
working could be the result of installing a BINARY package that
comes from a dist or branch you don't run... HOWEVER, you could
build the package from -source- from the same place, and it usually
works fine
1479[08:21:38] <Lady_Aleena> deego, one of the themes in
appearance appears broken, but other than that, everything seems
okay. My problem is setting up the Applications Menu to have many
levels of sub-menus.
1488[08:23:53] <jim> Lady_Aleena, wait, did you file the bug
against apt? or against xfce or a package within that?
1489[08:24:11] <Jck_true> During the Debian Buster upgrade
yesterday I must have clicked the wrong option during the GRUB
update dialog....My server now refuses to boot from my SSD. I
swapped in a drive with Debian 9 on it and ran grub-install and gave
it the path to the drive with Debian 10
1505[08:26:18] <Jck_true> deego: No my bios simply report it as a
non bootable drive... (Sadly it's an HP microserver and the
BIOS is not very user friendly)
1506[08:26:20] <Lady_Aleena> jim, bright yellow on a white
background doesn't work well.
1513[08:28:03] <jim> Lady_Aleena, what title did you give to the
apt bug?
1514[08:28:17] <Lady_Aleena> jim, the apt issue is something that
can only be fixed by the maintainers, so I filed a bug. I have
questions pending in #xfce and another in #qt for my other two
issues.
1515[08:28:42] <Jck_true> deego; Thanks :)
1516[08:28:49] <Lady_Aleena> jim, "apt uses yellow for
warnings"
1532[08:35:54] <Lady_Aleena> jim, it might take a major overhaul
of apt to allow user set their own colors, though it would be a nice
feature. However, how many people would really set up a config for
say apt-colors?
1533[08:37:53] <Lady_Aleena> I am in a very small minority
(though sometimes I feel so alone) that use a white background in
terminal emulators and elsewhere. Dark backgrounds with bright text
seems to be more prevalent.
1534[08:39:09] <Haohmaru> it's gotta look like teh matrix
1535[08:39:11] <deego> dark bg is better on my eyes, but whenever
I switch to dark bg, I always have to increase the font size, and
make most fonts bold
1536[08:40:15] <Lady_Aleena> I have a white background in my text
editor, IRC client, and terminal emulator. Some might go blind if
they looked at my monitor. 8)
1537[08:40:22] <deego> I end up giving every app a fullscreen
window, and instead of alt-tabbing, i use 70 workspaces
1591[08:56:09] <Lady_Aleena> jim, my phone adjusts the display by
the time of day, why can't desktop environments?
1592[08:56:23] <jim> as long as I have that backlight, I
don't have to change much about appearance
1593[08:57:18] <Jck_true> Most monitors have a light sensor?
1594[08:57:30] <Lady_Aleena> And I am now going down a rabbit
hole in my head.
1595[08:57:41] <Lady_Aleena> Jck_true, not my ancient one.
1596[08:58:13] <Jck_true> It's actually a little annoying in
my case. Since it only measures in one spot, if there's a
shadow right on the sensor the whole display dims dramatically
1597[08:58:21] <jim> Lady_Aleena, many desktop environments are
themable, maybe you could design themes for different times of the
day, and work out how to change the theme in a cron job
1644[09:10:12] <Lady_Aleena> srged, now include that link in a
general message with things like which version of Debian and what
desktop environment you are using.
1645[09:10:31] <Lady_Aleena> jim, not yet, but soonish.
1652[09:13:41] <Lady_Aleena> srged, just remember, the more you
include in your messages about the problem, the more helpful those
who are very knowledgeable about Debian can be.
1660[09:17:20] <elwisp> i get super heavy lag after the buster
update when applications are sending notifications:
org.kde.knotifications: WaitForName: Service was not registered
within timeout
1668[09:25:51] <Haohmaru> okay, so i have a few packages in my
debian stretch that come from backports.. i *will* have issues with
those when upgrading to debian10?
1703[09:43:00] <pragomer> hi, I am actually creating a script
that does all of my linux setup for me - everything. part of it is
creating my fstab and there are username and password for cifs
mounts. Is there a way to kind of "hash" these passwords,
so that they work, but are not "visible" ?
1712[09:45:59] *** theraspberry_ is now known as theraspberry
1713[09:46:04] *** Quits: tyranny12 (~blarg@replaced-ip) (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
1714[09:46:08] <BCMM> pragomer: not really. and if there was, it
wouldn't be useful, since it would be a "password
equivalent". i.e., mount.cifs has to use *something* which is
adequate to allow authentication with the server, which is just as
bad as a password, if stolen
1722[09:47:31] <pragomer> thought it would be cool if this would
be possible the other way. its because I am creating a setup-script
for my linux-setup. I WOULD be ok if the passphrase stands in the
fstab later, as my systems always
1724[09:47:48] <grady> pretty funny, i trying figuring out why my
9.5 dosnt upgraded to latest stable.. until i remember to really
look the sources list. and yes, it uses codename by default, not
"stable"
1725[09:47:51] <grady> why is that :/
1726[09:48:11] <pragomer> are encrypted.. but I was looking for a
solution that lets me "hash" the value in my setupscript
(that echoes fstab's content to fstab)
1727[09:48:15] <jml2> grady, cuz names are cool
1728[09:48:45] <BCMM> grady: basically, the idea with debian
stable is that breaking changes happen once every two years (whereas
in a rolling-release distro, they could happen at any time)
1729[09:48:56] <jml2> pragomer, dunno why you're trying to
reinvent the wheel -- there's defnitely unattended-tools for
debian/distro setups
1731[09:49:28] <Eryn_1983_FL> so my new buster version of mpd is
not liking my extended m3u playlists..
1732[09:49:29] <BCMM> grady: oldstable->stable is a major
upgrade, there are often questions to be answered, and things might
break. most people want to trigger that manually
1733[09:49:34] <Eryn_1983_FL> and #mpd is a ghost town.
1751[09:54:20] <BCMM> i do think debian should probably have an
official "default" sources.list on the web site somewhere,
especially now that users are not encouraged to manually choose a
mirror...
1752[09:54:21] <Haohmaru> okay, bluh, so i need to improvise on
it
1753[09:54:45] <BCMM> Haohmaru: do you have `deb
replaced-url
1754[09:54:59] <Haohmaru> i normally don't even touch apt or
sources.list.. i've been using synaptic
1755[09:55:21] <Haohmaru> yes
1756[09:55:26] <BCMM> Haohmaru: are you upgrading from stretch to
buster? there's a guide for that...
1781[09:58:43] <jim> well... are you actually running an upgrade
now?
1782[09:58:57] <Haohmaru> no
1783[09:59:09] <jim> Haohmaru, ok, I'd like to see it
1784[09:59:20] <acagastya> I did not change the GNOME shell, from
Debian 9 to Debian 10. I was wondering if it broke for someone else
as well.
1785[09:59:31] <jim> sounds from what you've said it's
pretty standard
1786[09:59:38] <Haohmaru> i got 2 debian9 machines here, one of
them doesn't have exotic packages (from backports) so i'm
trying to upgrade that one first
1787[09:59:47] <Haohmaru> i'm IRCing from the other one
1798[10:02:52] <jim> usually the first step of this kind of
upgrade, is you run an upgrade of the earlier dist (in other words,
without changing the sources.list)
1840[10:09:38] <deego> Haohmaru: where is the upgrade guide you
are reading? is that same as the release notes?
1841[10:10:01] *** Quits: ohwowlol (uid375208@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
1842[10:10:24] <Haohmaru> jml2, uhm, i used synaptic earlier
today and pressed the "reload" button which afaik is
equivalent to apt-get update, isn't it?
1843[10:10:47] <Haohmaru> deego, i'm reading this thing:
replaced-url
1844[10:10:58] <Haohmaru> well, ignore the #backup
1845[10:11:08] <jim> Haohmaru, we can see if anything happened
since then... by running: apt update
1846[10:11:25] <deego> Haohmaru: thanxs
1847[10:11:41] *** Quits: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1848[10:11:51] <jim> likely, it hasn't yet
1849[10:11:51] <Haohmaru> jim, again, it says "all packages
are up to date" *shrug*
1850[10:11:55] *** Quits: theraspberry (~rasp@replaced-ip) (Quit: rasp your drive has died again!)
1851[10:12:13] <jim> Haohmaru, when you did apt update?
1852[10:12:37] *** Quits: oldguy (~oldguy@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1853[10:12:45] <Haohmaru> two times seconds ago as you told me to
1900[10:21:39] <Haohmaru> but afaiu, the main server now has some
fancyness that will decide which mirror to redirect you to, so you
don't have to explicitly choose one, right?
1901[10:22:43] <jim> you don't have to, but you can... for
example, the one I use is on a major university site about 15 mins
away from me... and it's -fast-
1913[10:26:24] <Haohmaru> okayokay, so now, the next step is to
upgrade the packages, and use some script thing to record the
process in case something bad happens
1914[10:26:31] <Haohmaru> do i gotta log out of the desktop?
1916[10:26:32] <BCMM> Haohmaru: yeah, if you just use
deb.debian.org, it should direct you to a mirror automatically
1917[10:27:07] <BCMM> which is nice, because apart from anything
else, it means that if your usual mirror goes down, you'll just
transparently get another mirror instead
1918[10:27:09] <jim> Haohmaru, you can run: apt dist-upgrade
1919[10:27:23] <Haohmaru> btw, crap my root partition is not very
big
1941[10:33:05] <at0m> jim: codename for debian testing since
buster became stable
1942[10:33:09] <at0m> !bullseye
1943[10:33:09] <dpkg> The release following Debian 10
"Buster" is codenamed "Bullseye" (Woody's
horse in Toy Story 2) and will be Debian 11. It is the current
"testing" release. Remember that straight after a stable
release, all sorts of mess suddenly lands in "testing" and
it is best avoided if you don't like debugging things.
replaced-url
1960[10:37:18] <Haohmaru> i got crapdows7 on that machine, the
debian has not been used too much, hence why i decided to try the
upgrade on this machine first
1961[10:37:35] <themill> Haohmaru: have you run "apt-get
clean" recently?
1967[10:38:24] <themill> Haohmaru: I don't recall whether
synaptic cleans the apt cache on its own; perhaps try running that
and then see if you've got more free disk space
1968[10:38:25] <Haohmaru> themill, the upgrade guide didn't
say anything about apt-get clean
1969[10:38:48] <jim> (I thought earlier that you were all set to
upgrade, but now that we see that there's not as much disk
space, we should not go further yet)
1996[10:44:04] <Haohmaru> because one of the programs i got
includes a potentially big library (kicad)
1997[10:44:07] <jim> Haohmaru, it replaces each package
1998[10:44:17] <themill> Haohmaru: most packages will get
replaced so the disk space change is minimal; some packages you end
up with the new and old version both installed until you remove the
old one
2025[10:48:07] <Haohmaru> for everything else i use debian, kicad
on the other machine, librecad, etc..
2026[10:48:20] <Haohmaru> i haven't upgraded my debian at
home yet
2027[10:48:41] <jim> ok, are you at work right now?
2028[10:48:59] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2029[10:49:04] <Haohmaru> but it is in a similar situation as the
2nd debian here (it has some exotic packages, from backports, and
even some games which were installed in a fancy way (quake3))
2030[10:49:08] <Haohmaru> yes
2031[10:49:11] <jim> ok
2032[10:49:22] <Haohmaru> so i'm not in a hurry to upgrade
those
2033[10:49:37] <Haohmaru> i wanna upgrade the less exotic debian
that i don't often use first
2095[11:01:44] <jim> with resizing a filesystem, you only risk
the filesystem itself... but then, when you resize the partition
it's in, you risk EVERYTHING ON THE DRIVE
2096[11:02:03] <Haohmaru> imma only push the "wall"
between the two ext4 partitions (/ and /home) to the left ;P~
2113[11:04:23] <Haohmaru> i know, that machine was originally
with a 39GB hard disk, i've already moved the crapdows and the
linux onto a new HDD, resized them, they survived
2114[11:04:48] <Haohmaru> i even broke the linux first
2115[11:04:57] <Haohmaru> it was a kubuntu, so i'm glad it
broke
2131[11:07:15] <Haohmaru> my 2nd debian was also on a smol HDD,
and i had trouble with running out of space, then i moved it to a
bigger HDD, now there's space on it
2132[11:08:06] *** Quits: Chunkyz (~Chunkyz@replaced-ip) (Quit: COME AT ME, BRUH! o_O)
2216[12:00:25] <Lady_Aleena> Is there a way to compare files
between Debian versions? In GTK, I was using the Redmond theme in
Stretch, however, it appears it is not even working in Buster.
2217[12:00:48] <Lady_Aleena> Several GTK themes appear broken.
2218[12:01:01] <petn-randall> Lady_Aleena: Probably a lot of
things switched from GTK2 to GTK3, and the theme is only providing
for GTK2.
2223[12:01:34] <Lady_Aleena> How do I know what XFCE is using?
2224[12:01:41] <Lady_Aleena> s/know/find out/;
2225[12:01:48] <petn-randall> Though I'd expect them to not
ship in that case. Are the themes still available in buster, or are
those orphaned packages?
2226[12:02:00] *** Quits: BlueByte (~walther@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
2242[12:05:40] <Lady_Aleena> Industrial, Raleigh, and Redmond
appear broken. There may be more, but those are the ones I remember
from my last pass through them all.
2243[12:06:09] <Lady_Aleena> And Xfce-redmondxp is NOT the same
as Redmond.
2319[12:34:15] <Lady_Aleena> Yes. It was hard to look at. While I
use white backgrounds on everything, Redmond is just dark enough
around the edges to relieve my eyeballs from strain.
2320[12:35:15] <Lady_Aleena> Plus for those programs that use
GTK, I have actual scrollbars.
2321[12:35:18] <mureena> Breeze-Dark is bliss on Hexchat
2323[12:36:25] <no_gravity> Would it be possible to add my own
key handler to bash, so that pressing ctrl+, will expand to the last
file in the current dir?
2324[12:36:36] *** Quits: tsujp (~tsujp@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2343[12:46:30] <Jubei> howdy :) I have a bunch of /dev/loop*
interfaces listed when I run the "du" command and I'm
curious what they all are.
replaced-url
2377[12:59:23] <no_gravity> Yeah.. when I add "a() { echo
123 }" I cannot press a anymore.
2378[12:59:45] <HarmtH> no_gravity: If you just want the mappings
in bash and not in other programs that use the readline library, you
can just as well use 'bind'
2379[12:59:57] <no_gravity> HarmtH: How would that work?
2380[13:00:23] * Lady_Aleena sighs, happy dancing is over.
2395[13:03:12] <pja> Lady_Aleena: You can get something /close/
to Helvetica by installing fonts-freefont-ttf, or you can get hold
of a copy of helvetica that you have a legal right to use &
install it yourself.
2410[13:07:04] <no_gravity> Now CTRL+o prints 123 \o/
2411[13:08:20] <themill> Lady_Aleena: what are you trying to
achieve?
2412[13:08:39] <no_gravity> Oh, but that is does not work as I
want...
2413[13:08:48] <Lady_Aleena> themill, I am trying to get my
website to look like it should, and the font should be Helvetica.
2414[13:09:01] <no_gravity> When I type "vim CTRL+o" it
just writes 123 below the current line.
2415[13:09:06] <no_gravity> Not as a command argument to vim
2416[13:09:21] <themill> Lady_Aleena: you are free to pay someone
for Helvetica or to use one of the several free clones that have the
same metrics and are not called Helvetica.
2417[13:09:25] <Lady_Aleena> themill, now I don't know how
long I've been without it. I swear I had it in jessie.
2419[13:10:12] <themill> Considering no visitor to your website
is likelt to have a font actually called Helvetica either, I'm
not sure where you're going with this
2423[13:11:30] <Lady_Aleena> themill, I think I know what is
sending the look of my site out of whack. Firefox no longer as an
actual scrollbar. It has a little teeny tiny line that wants to be a
scrollbar.
2424[13:11:37] <pja> or, if you refer to a standard repo, might
evem have them cached.
2425[13:11:40] *** Quits: fdfsdfsdfs (5b049910@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2427[13:11:53] <Lady_Aleena> s/longer as an/long has an/;
2428[13:11:56] <themill> pja: sure, but installing a local copy
of the font is still not relevant to that
2429[13:12:06] <pja> themill: That
2430[13:12:09] <pja> ’s true.
2431[13:12:38] <Lady_Aleena> Oh forget it! It is past 7am in the
morning and I am too tired to care over much about grammar and
spelling.
2432[13:12:50] <pja> Lady_Aleena: If you’re relying on
having a local commercial font to get your website to look right,
then nobody else will see it the way you do.
2433[13:13:32] <Lady_Aleena> pja, it isn't the font that is
sending my site's look out of whack for me. It is the lack of a
real vertical scrollbar.
2439[13:14:18] <pja> themill: Sure, but if your layout relies on
the Helvetica letter spacing then it’s not going to work on
most people’s browsers.
2440[13:14:28] <pja> (this is why you don’t do that of
course)
2441[13:14:31] <Lady_Aleena> pja, that was from MY site.
2442[13:15:21] <themill> The metrics for helvetica and arial are
close enough to be indistinguishable unless you're working
really hard, and they probably are widely enough supported
2443[13:15:37] <Lady_Aleena> I will stop for now. I had a really
good early morning with setting up Debian and XFCE. I will put off
trying to get a real scrollbar in Firefox after I have slept.
2455[13:18:46] <Lady_Aleena> Have a great day everyone!
2456[13:18:57] <debuser_> Hi. I've just upgraded from
Stretch to Buster, and I've noticed that Linux is powercycling
the disk when entering S3/standby state, as opposed to just spinning
it down. This doesn't happen with the Stretch kernel, and
I'm a bit worried since it's showing up in the SMART disk
wear stats.
2457[13:19:17] <themill> no_gravity: interesting set of
hieroglyphs in the end :)
2458[13:19:39] <no_gravity> I tend to use this now, without nls:
2460[13:19:51] <debuser_> Hi. I've just upgraded from
Stretch to Buster, and I've noticed that Linux is powercycling
the disk when entering S3/standby state, as opposed to just spinning
it down. This doesn't happen with the Stretch kernel, and
I'm a bit worried since it's showing up in the SMART disk
wear stats. Is this intended? what about reverting to the previous
behavior?
2461[13:21:22] <HarmtH> no_gravity: With this one you go to the
end of the line as well: bind -x
'"\C-e":"READLINE_LINE+=$(ls | tail -1);
READLINE_POINT=${#READLINE_LINE}"'
2462[13:21:40] <HarmtH> no_gravity: all on one line
2463[13:23:18] <no_gravity> HarmtH: Yeah, but I'm not sure
that is what I want.
2464[13:23:29] <HarmtH> no_gravity: I don't think you have
to sort ls output, it it sorted by default
2465[13:24:56] <no_gravity> Ah yes, let me remove that!
2466[13:25:07] <no_gravity> I would prefer to map it to ALT+,
instead but not sure how.
2489[13:42:15] <no_gravity> Not that I think about it ...
considering I want to implement the toggle through all files
functionality .. I might better keep it as a function.
2496[13:45:53] *** Quits: starscreamer (~starscrea@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2497[13:46:32] <pja> debuser_: What else would you expect it to
do? S3 is supposed to be power only to RAM to maintain state -
everything else is supposed to be turned off.
2508[13:50:56] <debuser_> pja, well perhaps, but this is new
behavior, I'm quite sure it doesn't happen w/ the stretch
kernel. I'm wondering if there's a way of going back to
the old behavior where the disk is only spun down.
2516[13:52:01] <pja> debuser_: Guessing here, but I would suspect
that previously the kernel wasn’t managing to get into S3 but
only to S1 before, whereas the new kernel maybe has fixed an ACPI
corner case or something & is getting to full sleep.
2520[13:52:43] <pja> Presumably the drive was spinning down
before? It’s spin-up/down cycles that matter, not power cycles
so much anyway, so the only difference you’re seeing is in the
smart stats IMO.
2749[14:19:46] <Jubei> EdePopede thank you for the reply. If
that's the case then why does the guide have a "cp -aux
/dev /mnt/NEW_ROOT_PARTITION" following that command?
2750[14:20:01] <EdePopede> i don't think i ever piped it
like this, but look at the SYNOPSIS in its manpage, it has some
entries with > tar -c [-f ARCHIVE]
2751[14:20:16] <Jubei> I get tar: option requires an argument --
'f'
2752[14:20:29] <EdePopede> looks like it's missing the
source from which it has to unpack
2759[14:21:20] <EdePopede> - would be stdin i guess, and
--show-defaults or the end of --help seem to have the defaults used
when -f is ommited completel
2789[14:27:19] <smsimeon> Just decided to try out Buster, but it
hangs for me on boot
2790[14:27:23] *** Quits: espera_satelita (~espera_sa@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2791[14:27:27] <Jubei> the problem with this tar command is that
it's probably creating some tar archive before copying. But the
reason I'm copying the root filesystem to another disk is
because I don't have space ^_^
2792[14:27:35] <smsimeon> this is the live image I'm trying
2807[14:31:00] <EdePopede> Jubei: but just for safety i'd
start with a test directory tree including extended attributes and
the like to see if the options used fit.
2808[14:31:16] *** Quits: bla (~bla@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2812[14:31:26] <Oksanaa> Power Management configuration module
could not be loaded. And no, I do not see it under "Startup and
Shutdown". How do I return to this computer ability to go into
Suspend/Hibernate?
2813[14:31:44] <colo-work> isn't there a recommended
alternative for easy rebuilds (of existing packages on another
release) available?
2833[14:38:46] <dpkg> pbuilder is, like, "personal package
builder", a package which creates a chroot for building
packages which are optionally targetted at releases other than the
currently installed release. It is useful for checking that a
package has the correct build-dependencies as well. apt-get install
pbuilder && pager /usr/share/doc/pbuilder/README.Debian.
Many pbuilder users end up wishing they had used <sbuild> all
along
2839[14:39:49] <dpkg> The 'sbuild' package provides a
way to build Debian packages within <chroot> environments that
are managed using the <schroot> utility. Building within
sbuild saves installing the build-dependencies on your machine and
also compiles in a clean environment; sbuild is used on the Debian
<buildd> network. See
replaced-url
2887[15:10:16] <han-solo> wondering where can i get that :)
2888[15:11:59] <touki> Hi there. I have an issue with sleeping /
hibernating mode in Debian. The observation is that: the computer
does never sleeps a second time (I can put it to sleep once, but
than, when I reopen it, it does not go to sleep). The issue that
seems to cause that is that the SWAP is full -- as a matter of fact,
the SWAP is about the size of the RAM. Any idea how to address that?
3075[16:36:14] <roylaprattep> greycat: you have any idea about my
question?
3076[16:36:45] <mason> JyZyXEL: I might have a look. It's
easy enough to set it up after the fact with metadata=1.0 but
it'd be nice if the installer did it.
3077[16:37:20] <mason> JyZyXEL: For setting it up after the fact,
I start with the first half as a straight ESP and the second
disk's equivalent being a degraded raid out of the box.
3078[16:37:23] *** Quits: barteks2x (~barteks2x@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3079[16:37:27] <mason> Then once it's booted you can
convert.
3080[16:37:32] <JyZyXEL> mason: yeah metadata 1.0 for sure, but
will it work with grub-install / update-grub
3088[16:43:02] <JyZyXEL> mason: someone suggested to use
--removable with grub-install to prevent efibootmgr from trying to
use the raid array as the location for esp
3153[17:05:19] <markuman> I try to set /etc/timezone to
Europe/Berlin. after running `sudo dpkg-reconfigure -f
noninteractive tzdata`, it is set back to Etc/UTC. any ideas?
(debian buster)
3154[17:05:52] *** Quits: TomyWork (~TomyLobo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3156[17:06:36] <greycat> /etc/timezone is just a one-line text
file. Can you just edit it instead of running dpkg-reconfigure? Or
even echo '...' > file?
3157[17:06:45] *** Joins: ugur (~ugur@replaced-ip)
3158[17:06:47] <mason> markuman: You're asking for something
that wants input and then not letting it interact... Let it be
interactive?
3185[17:12:09] <mason> greycat: You have to accept the future,
where it's all stored in XML and JSON and we use compiled tools
to set values.
3186[17:12:23] <jhutchins_wk> Oh come on, linux always has at
leat three ways to do any given task.
3187[17:12:29] <tarzeau> mason: no thans!
3188[17:12:30] <jhutchins_wk> least
3189[17:12:42] <tarzeau> jhutchins_wk: the unix way, windows ini
file, and?
3190[17:12:43] <mason> jhutchins_wk: We should centralize it all
in... in some kind of... registry...
3191[17:12:49] <jhutchins_wk> mason: Registry!
3192[17:13:01] <tarzeau> that's what gconf/dconf (GNOME
people did)
3193[17:13:09] <greycat> "two ways to do x" is totally
different from "two conflicting, parallel means of implementing
x, each of which is used by half the programs on the system"
3194[17:13:12] <mason> Then we could centralize on *one* tool,
and call that tool regedit!
3195[17:13:12] <tarzeau> and it broke even worse than microsoft
registry
3198[17:13:33] <tarzeau> mason: regedit wasn't as bad as
gconf/dconf
3199[17:13:51] * tarzeau likes defaults best, with GNUstep
3200[17:14:05] <mason> greycat: To be honest, I'm not sure
why /etc/timezone exists or when it came about. I suspect most
things ignore it, but who knows?
3201[17:14:12] <tarzeau> existed since 1989 (NeXTSTEP), no idea
why all suffered by NIH
3219[17:18:18] <greycat> I see a localtime(5) man page but no
timezone(5). Is /etc/timezone documented anywhere?
3220[17:18:25] <themill> lots of things use /etc/timezone,
including cron, glib, firefox, ...
3221[17:18:35] <n1md4> hi. installed unattended upgrades on
debian. what what i can tell it applies upgrades twice daily at 600
and 1800, with a 12h randomiser. what I don't understand is how
it also appeared to run when booted just now (i.e. not at the
scheduled time)
3253[17:32:08] <luna_> Firefox 68 is now out and starts rolling
out to everyone in 29 minutes
3254[17:32:25] <greycat> wut
3255[17:32:58] <diogenes_> Hey guys, is there any
"official" debian desktop environment that is more
polished or supported than others? like for instance Fedora has
gnome as official and all others are respins, ubuntu had unity (now
it's gnome too) and all others are flavors and so on.
3271[17:35:22] <diogenes_> ayekat, the reason i asked is because
gnome is a new verio as well as kde is a new version too and other
DEs (e.g. xdce) is still the older version.
3275[17:35:53] <annadane> xfce is notoriously slow, and debian
just missed the window for xfce 4.14
3276[17:36:12] <annadane> slow in development, i mean
3277[17:36:16] <diogenes_> i see
3278[17:36:24] <greycat> "Debian again ships with several
desktop applications and environments. Among others it now includes
the desktop environments GNOME 3.30, KDE Plasma 5.14, LXDE 10, LXQt
0.14, MATE 1.20, and Xfce 4.12."
3279[17:36:28] <annadane> debian can only do so much concerning
upstream
3280[17:36:30] <greycat> From the buster release notes.
3281[17:36:39] <annadane> well stretch had xfce 4.12.3 and buster
has 4.12.4 *shrug*
3331[17:45:32] <ayekat> petn-randall: cron is launched as a
systemd service, which should have PATH set to some sane value (not
sure what part sets that, though)
3332[17:45:52] <greycat> yeah, I was just looking for that, and
it's not immediately obvious
3333[17:45:54] <ctcx> If wanting to backup USB stick or hard
drive with dd, I can do it either for entire disk or partition,
right?
3335[17:46:44] <greycat> The /usr/sbin/cron process on my buster
is running with
PATH=/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin
according to ps.
3340[17:48:07] <greycat> So, systemd sets cron's default
$PATH as documented, cron keeps it, and (if the man pages are not
lying), crontab jobs inherit it from cron.
3359[17:59:21] <jmcnaught> ctcx: I'm not sure I understand
your question, but you do not want the filesystem mounted if you are
copying the underlying block device whether it is a partition or the
entire drive.
3360[18:00:06] <greycat> (mounted read-only may be OK)
3363[18:02:47] <ctcx> greycat, jmcnaught: when trying to backup
my USB with dd to an iso image, I first unmounted USB, and did
"dd if=/dev/sdb of=/my/folder/image.iso", and dd threw
error
3364[18:02:57] <ctcx> "No data found", or something
like that
3365[18:03:11] <ctcx> Had to mount USB to get it to work for both
partition and entire USB...
3372[18:04:44] <techie28> Hi.. I tried to upgrade to Buster from
Stretch which seem to have completed successfully as I can see
version 10.0 on doing "cat /etc/debian_version"
3373[18:05:31] <techie28> afterwards I again tried to run apt
update && apt upgrade but it shows something like
"gnupg-l10n was installed automatically & no longer
required"
3385[18:08:16] <techie28> instead of "apt-get
autoremove" I used "apt autoremove" which showed the
progress bar completing too but on further doing apt update it shows
the same long list of packages & apt upgrade doesnt seem to do
anything.. I expected it to inform that system is up to date.
3395[18:10:44] <jmcnaught> techie28: did you follow the upgrade
instructions in the buster release notes? 'apt
full-upgrade' is a required step.
3396[18:12:04] <techie28> jmcnaught, I used the sed command to
update the sources.list & then did apt update && apt
upgrade
3397[18:12:20] <dvs> techie28, you're missing that step
3398[18:13:05] <jmcnaught> techie28: you may also want to check
the release notes for things to be aware of and other steps you
might have missed:
replaced-url
3399[18:13:44] <techie28> apt update && apt upgrade seems
to reinstalling the "gnupg-l10n" while still showing me
the long list of packages.
3400[18:14:10] <techie28> jmcnaught, dvs : so I will run the
full-upgrade now I hope it wont break the system?
3401[18:14:38] <dvs> techie28, this is a step on upgrading to
buster
3461[18:31:09] *** Quits: oish (~charlie@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3462[18:32:58] <J_C> Hi. I'm on Debian 10 currently. I
currently have Secure Boot disabled. To enable it, do I simply
install the 'shim' package (and the signed fwupd and
fwupdate packages as I use those too) and then go to by BIOS and
enable secure boot? Or is the process a bit more complex?
3477[18:41:28] <ctcx> jmcnaught: 1) plug USB, gets automounted,
right click -> unmount in file explorer, gets unmounted and /dev
only shows sdb. Plug USB, gets automounted, unmount it with umount
command as root (as normal user I get "operation not
permitted"), gets unmounted, but sdb1 is still visible in /dev
3478[18:41:36] <ctcx> WTH? This is confusion
3479[18:41:57] <ctcx> But, if unmounting with the first method,
when doing dd I get "no medium found"
3480[18:42:04] <ctcx> With second method dd works.
3481[18:42:09] <ctcx> WTH? This is confusion
3482[18:42:10] <greycat> You're saying the file system is on
a partition, but the partition device intermittently vanishes from
/dev?
3483[18:42:16] <jhutchins_wk> J_C since the intent of secure boot
is to prevent you from installing Linux, you might just leave it
off.
3484[18:42:26] <ctcx> NO
3485[18:42:39] <ctcx> I tried 2 methods of unmounting my USB
3499[18:47:08] <ctcx> Well, as I said, I tried those 2 ways of
unmounting. By using "umount /mount/point" it unmounted
and the node at /dev still there.
3500[18:47:45] <ctcx> But, if unmounting via the GUI file
manager, with right click device -> expel, node goes away from
/dev
3507[18:49:19] <makayabou> I'm using a pxe server with
Debian 10. It contains debian repos as local mirror (done with
apt-mirror). When I try to install on a client, I get an error about
packages seahorse, modemmanager and spice-client-glib-usb-acl-helper
having inconsistent sizes. However server and mirror are up to date.
Is there something special about those packages that my preseed
didn't specificly asked for..?
3512[18:50:24] *** Quits: v01d4lph4 (~v01d4lph4@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3513[18:50:37] <greycat> jhutchins_wk: yeah, I wonder if
he's translating the actual words into English on the fly, and
has mistranslated something as "expel" when the intent is
"eject". Because it definitely sounds like an eject to me
also.
3514[18:51:17] <ctcx> greycat: I'm sorry sir, I'm in
the middle of a predicament right now and I'm unable to think
clearly. I know this is no pretext.
3515[18:51:28] <ctcx> greycat: I meant file manager does
"eject"
3544[18:57:32] <ikus060> I just installed debian buster from a
fresh install. Was running stretch before. I have a strange
behaviours with the sound. When I plug a headphone, the
laptop's speaker are making noise. My audio device is Audio
device: Intel Corporation Cannon Lake PCH cAVS. Not sure where to
start to fix this
3545[18:58:01] <greycat> lsjet: if you're old enough to
actually remember why the mount operation is called
"mount", you have my respect. I only know it from reading.
3547[18:59:19] <ctcx> greycat, lsjet: I started with Linux at a
relatively late age; I do remember CDs of course, but floppies,
barely: I was just able to use brain memory when they already began
to be shadowed by CDs...
3574[19:08:30] <greycat> I never used 8" floppies. I did use
a tape-on-a-reel once, but it wasn't with the stand-up cabinet
sized tape drives you see in the movies. It was a weird desktop
enclosure thing, and the tape reel went in lying flat.
3580[19:10:27] <ctcx> lsjet: so, what's the difference
between "umount" and "eject", aside the later
unmounting all partitions and seemingly deleting all nodes in /dev?
3581[19:10:57] <greycat> Your DE's eject apparently tries to
mimic removal of the device to such an extent that the kernel no
longer sees the partition table.
3582[19:11:02] <stryker> Hello, guys! How r u? I'd like to
know one thing: using Synaptic, you can see the option
"Section" which shows you all the packages that belong to
"Debug", "Email", "Languages" etc. How
can I list sections using "APT" or "APT-GET"?
Thank you for your attention.
3584[19:11:22] <greycat> Your guess is better than mine how/why
it does that. It's your DE. (You never even said which one it
is. You just said "GUI".)
3646[19:35:35] <naptastic> ok, I've got a weird situation.
Apt is running in a TTY, and for some unknown reason, I can't
switch to that terminal anymore.
3647[19:35:52] <naptastic> From `ps auxfreplaced-url
3649[19:36:17] <greycat> By TTY, you mean a Linux console?
Ctrl-Alt-Fsomething? If so, which one, and how did you verify this,
and how are you trying to switch to it, and what happens when you
try?
3650[19:36:18] <naptastic> Is there a way to tell it "please
go ahead"? Is there a signal I can send, or something I can
echo into STDIN or something?
3652[19:36:59] <naptastic> greycat, I'm using alt+Fx and it
confirms that I'm on TTY2 (because I've got stuff going
there), 3, 5, and 6.
3653[19:37:14] <greycat> What does your ps command show?
3654[19:37:22] <naptastic> If I request 1, 4, 7, or 8, nothing
happens.
3655[19:37:37] <naptastic> I'm trimming this for brevity
3656[19:37:54] <asafniv> greycat thanks
3657[19:37:59] <naptastic> whiptail --backtitle Package
configuration --title Configuring libssl1.1:amd64 --output-fd 11
--defaultno --yesno -- There are services installed on your system
which need to be restarted when certain libraries, such as libpam,
libc, and libssl, are upgraded. Since these restarts may cause
interruptions of service for the system, you will normally be
prompted on each upgrade for the list of services you wish to
restart.
3658[19:37:59] <naptastic> You can choose this option to avoid
being prompted; instead, all necessary restarts will be done for you
automatically so [...]
3659[19:38:19] <asafniv> looks like i'll have to find
another distro, i want to run something updated on my wii
3660[19:38:19] <greycat> Not the command part. The terminal part.
It should tell you which terminal (tty or pts) the process is on.
3661[19:38:23] <naptastic> greycat, that's the process as
it's listed, minus the stuff on the left.
3662[19:38:40] <naptastic> greycat, OH! How do I tell that?
3663[19:38:42] <greycat> Since you used "u" format, the
tty should be the... 7th field.
3677[19:40:24] <greycat> You don't have access to the
virtual consoles over an ssh session.
3678[19:40:27] <naptastic> damnable enter key being right next to
apostrophe
3679[19:40:49] <naptastic> greycat, yeah, I foolishly started
`apt upgrade` in a local TTY without using screen.
3680[19:41:14] *** Quits: jasonwc (~jason@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3681[19:41:26] <naptastic> It's one of those lessons...
I've been doing this for 14 years and I still forget that
long-running commands should be in screen/tmux. It is one of my most
consistent failures as a sysadmin. :'(
3682[19:41:33] <greycat> So there *was* a monitor/keyboard
attached, and you logged in on that, and started apt-get, and then
disconnected them?
3685[19:42:07] <naptastic> greycat, they're still connected
in the next room. I can still switch TTYs locally; just 1, 4, 5,
and... crap, now I don't remember.
3686[19:42:28] <naptastic> but when I ctrl+alt+Fx for x=[1,4,5,?]
nothing happens.
3687[19:42:51] <naptastic> Switching TTYs is functional for x=[2,
3, 6]
3688[19:42:55] <naptastic> I hope this is making sense
3689[19:43:36] <naptastic> (so, IRC and an SSH session are
running at the terminal where I am now; the server with the problem
is in the next room, and has a console hooked up as well.)
3697[19:45:38] <naptastic> greycat, since I can't get to the
TTY where the process is running, am I likely to cause irreparable
damage if I start sending SIGTERM to things until the Apt lock gets
freed?
3711[19:49:15] <naptastic> greycat, `ps -ft tty1 | awk
'/tty1/{print$2}' | xargs kill -15` did the trick! Thanks
for pointing me in the right direction.
3712[19:49:23] *** fLoo is now known as fLoo_
3713[19:49:29] <greycat> I would've gone slower, but
that's just me.
3716[19:50:20] <humpled> ..takes ahold of teh wand...closes eyes
tightly...
3717[19:50:30] <raidensnake> lightdm just black screens whenever
I try to start it.
3718[19:50:36] <naptastic> Rovanion, I'm pretty sure
Selenium or phantom.js (which uses Selenium under the hood) will do
what you need. Be warned though, they're heavy.
3719[19:51:24] <Rovanion> naptastic: The thing is though: These
can't drive the native GUI widgets that appear when I press
C-p, can they?
3733[19:59:43] <raidensnake> I keep getting these errors with
lightdm
3734[19:59:46] <raidensnake> Error getting user list from
org.freedesktop.Accounts:
GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name
org.freedesktop.Accounts was not provided by any .service files
3735[19:59:55] <raidensnake> Could not enumerate user data
directory /var/lib/lightdm/data: Error opening directory
'/var/lib/lightdm/data': No such file or directory
3748[20:05:10] <jasonwc> Since upgrading to Buster, my syslog has
been flooded with these messages: "ebian-desktop
tracker-miner-f[26163]:
(../../src/libtracker-miner/tracker-monitor.c:765):monitor_event_cb:
code should not be reached"
3752[20:06:05] <jasonwc> Any idea what's causing this? htop
doesn't show unusually CPU activity associated with it. Not
sure if it matters but I'm using ZFS as my root filesystem
3785[20:14:05] <gvth> If I have done no mistake that's the
amount of different images my computer monitor can display when the
resolution is 1280x800, right?
3789[20:15:47] <naptastic> gvth, most video cards prefer 32-bit
color modes to 24-bit, since it's easier to move 4 bytes around
and keep them aligned than 3 bytes. The last byte will be used for
transparency or ignored.
3790[20:16:30] <naptastic> So the size of one buffer = (1200 *
800 * 4) bytes
3792[20:16:48] <naptastic> divide your available video RAM by
that number.
3793[20:17:47] *** Quits: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
3794[20:18:25] <Resilience> gvth, if I don't remeber wrong
16777216^1024000= res -> ln(6777216^1024000)=ln(res) ->
1024000*ln(6777216) = ln(res) -> e^[ 024000*ln(6777216) ] = e^[
ln(res) ] -> res = e^[ 024000*ln(6777216) ], maybe this has
shorter computing time than the rpreviosus one
3821[20:24:06] <ikus060> After some trial and error, figure my
issue with sound it causes by laptop-mode-tools that was installed.
As of today, doesn't is worth it ? I mean doesn installing
laptop-mode-tools make a different in term of power usage with
recent kernel ?
3823[20:24:39] <jadax> that might be shooting in the dark, but
after upgrading from debian 9 to debian 10 - my chrome web browser
takes up much more CPU doing same tasks it did before
3824[20:24:43] <gvth> Generally, the amount of images an
arbitrary monitor can display is (amount of colors a pixel can
display) ^ (resolution). Isn't it?
3859[20:38:21] <jadax> what's the difference between using
buster main contrib vs buster main contrib non-free ?
3860[20:38:29] <greycat> !non-free
3861[20:38:29] <dpkg> [non-free] a component which contains
software that does not comply with the <DFSG>. To add non-free
packages to your packages index, ask me about <non-free
sources>. To see which non-free packages are installed ask me
about <non-free list>.
3862[20:38:43] *** Quits: ikus060 (~ikus060@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3863[20:38:55] <greycat> "contrib" is the weird one --
technically free, but it depends on non-free stuff in a fundamental
way
3909[20:46:36] <lsjet> for many people, non-free software is a
security risk. Closed = untrustworthy
3910[20:47:27] <greycat> lsjet: That's not completely true.
Most of the stuff in non-free is open source, just under a license
that doesn't allow free modification and distribution.
3918[20:48:29] <jadax> I was refering to non-free being security
risk
3919[20:48:30] <greycat> Heartbleed was the name of a security
bug/exploit, not a piece of software.
3920[20:48:47] <Chunkyz> can anyone help me get ipsec running?
3921[20:48:58] *** Quits: jasonwc (~jason@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3922[20:49:06] <jadax> I'm just pointing out that security
risks (potentially even bigger ones) can be in not non-free
3923[20:49:13] <lsjet> jadax, it isn't that open-source =
perfect. It's that closed source = unverifiable. Closed source
can do any malicious thing its owner (not you, the xddeveloper)
wants it to
3924[20:49:36] <greycat> SOME of the stuff in non-free may indeed
be closed source.
3925[20:49:36] <Chunkyz> it asks for my password, I type it and
it doesn't connect?
3926[20:49:57] *** Quits: namedkitten (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3939[20:53:39] <jadax> I have two displays - DisplayPort one and
HDMI one. Previously (before debian 9->10 upgrade) they were
called HDMI-0 and DP-1; now they are called XWAYLAND0 and XWAYLAND1
3940[20:53:44] <jadax> would you know why?
3941[20:54:00] <jadax> I'm having trouble changing
display's resolution from 1920x1200 to 2560x1600
3942[20:54:05] <jadax> the HDMI one
3943[20:54:07] <dvs> jadax, Debian 10 uses Wayland, not Xorg.
3944[20:54:23] <greycat> Debian 10's GNOME uses Wayland by
default, with the option to select an X session instead, at login
time.
3945[20:54:37] <greycat> The rest of Debian 10 doesn't use
Wayland by default.
3946[20:54:38] <jadax> oh, so wayland is alternative X server?
3947[20:54:52] <dvs> yes
3948[20:55:06] <jadax> so xrandr doesn't work with wayland?
3949[20:55:06] <mathisen> some even would say the future... lol
3968[20:57:36] <mathisen> nothing wrong with wayland, just maybe
to early for some use cases. i personaly still waits for sway to be
a bit better still until switching from i3
3969[20:57:42] <miskatonic> wayland does not allow for window
managers such as ratpoison
3977[21:00:07] <lsjet> miskatonic, couldn't a wayland
alternative be developed? I know there's a project to create a
wayland-based alternative to awesomewm written in Rust.
3978[21:00:18] <jadax> so I can switch between Xorg and Wayland
on log-in screen?
4007[21:06:58] <dpkg> The httpredir.debian.org redirector (based
on HTTP 302s) was shutdown on 2017-02-13 and replaced by
<deb.debian.org>. Existing entries in sources.list will keep
working as the DNS entries for httpredir.debian.org have been
pointed to deb.debian.org.
4008[21:07:17] <gvth> lembron: I calculated with bc. The most
significant digits in my result are the same to yours
(14908639104806613...) but the file to which I piped the bc output
has 7.615.705 characters which doesn't go in line with what you
posted (...×10^7398113)
4009[21:07:31] <shtrb> Welp answered to myself then, httpredir is
dead long live deb
4010[21:07:53] <miskatonic> awesomewm can be configured in lua
for mouseless usage, but the default configuaration of the debian
package is heavily mouse-dependant.
4028[21:11:56] <lsjet> One thing I haven't found a good
solution for though is handling the mod key in a qemm vm when both
the host and guest run awesome. I don't want to reconfigure
either OS to use a different key, but finding a VNC client that will
pass the mod key to the guest without reuiring fullscreen mode has
been elusive
4039[21:15:53] <jadax> I have Dell U3011 display (2560x1600
native resoultion) that I'm connecting over HDMI port to Iris
6100 GPU. I have another display connected over DisplayPort. The
DisplayPort one works great, displays native resolution. The HDMI
one displays 1920x1200 only. On debian 9 I used to use xrandr to
--newmode, --addmode, then --output and force 2560x1600
4040[21:15:54] <jadax> resolution that way. Now whatever I do the
HDMI displays stays on 1920x1200
4041[21:16:04] <miskatonic> xdotool is another paramount thing
that has no equivalent on wayland
4042[21:16:05] <jadax> I'm using Xorg on debian 10
4043[21:16:08] <jadax> any suggestions?
4044[21:16:09] <gvth> lembron: are you using wolfram as a desktop
application or an online service?
4045[21:16:44] *** Quits: tf2ftw (~tf2ftw@replaced-ip) (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
4074[21:25:34] <lsjet> Chunkyz, Sorry not everybody runs every
piece of software. Your mileage may vary. In my experience ipsec is
not used nearly as often as openvpn, if a vpn is even what you are
using it for.
4075[21:26:07] <jadax> well, I was happy camper with debian 9 and
HDMI display @ 2560x1600 resolution, now I'm stuck with debian
10 and HDMI @1920x1200
4085[21:28:57] <jadax> so it's working on 30Hz instead of
60Hz but that's good enough
4086[21:29:14] *** milos_ is now known as Guest23449
4087[21:29:53] <HarmtH> Yeah HDMI 1.4 doesn't have enough
bandwidth for that
4088[21:29:59] <lsjet> jadax, this is on a pi? did you back up
the sd card before upgrading?
4089[21:30:10] <jadax> lsjet it's on Intel NUC (Iris 6100
GPU)
4090[21:30:18] <Guest23449> Hello. Can someone tell me, where
binaries for buster are located? I have to download one library,
traversed whole repo, but couldn't find the folder with *deb
pkgs.
4091[21:30:52] <jadax> lsjet and I'm running mini-HDMI cable
from NUC to DVI connector on the display
4139[21:47:17] *** Quits: subopt (~subopt@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
4140[21:47:18] <lsjet> here's something which has bugged me
forever, but never enough to find a solution: How can you change
Debian's networking config (not using network manager) to pass
arguments to dhclient so that it doesn'
4141[21:47:41] <lsjet> ...doesn't hang when starting a
laptop on a wireless network and that network is unavailable?
4142[21:47:59] <greycat> that's the main difference between
"allow-hotplug enfoo" and "auto enfoo"
4186[21:53:04] <tsglove> I just installed debian10. I wanted to
install usermod, yet the package is not found. Inside sources.list I
do have the buster lines buster main. What am I missing?
4211[21:57:10] <greycat> tsglove: "su" changed its
behavior in buster, in a major way. It works like Red Hat now,
instead of like Debian always has before.
4212[21:57:16] <tsglove> Oh yeah, I just did $su -l and with the
new root login, usermod works.
4213[21:57:18] <greycat> tsglove: "sudo -s" is the
closest approximation now
4238[22:03:21] <roflbot> hi guys, on a proliant g7 DL380 with a
Smart Array P410i, how to change replaced disk without shutting down
the whole thing? Not sure what tools are needed that are available
on debian
4239[22:03:37] <roflbot> eh, s/replaced/faulty/
4240[22:03:40] *** Quits: pringau (~pringau@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4277[22:15:52] <mutante> disi: you can't install all
packages at once.. a lot of them will conflict with each other / are
alternatives to other ones doing the same thing
4278[22:16:07] <mutante> disi: also.. people don't want to
install stuff they dont use
4280[22:16:52] <disi> mutante: ok, but that's more about
deployment, right? there could still be one giant repo that
everything gets built from (but not necessarily deployed)
4291[22:20:33] <disi> a big point for me is avoiding implicit
deps. everything in a single source repo can depend on anything else
in that repo implicitly whereas that's harder with smaller
subprojects
4292[22:20:48] <jhutchins_wk> disi: There are almost no
conditions when you want every package available - over 50,000 of
them.
4293[22:20:54] <mutante> disi: i'm sure there are plenty
more reasons.. like permissions. would you want the same people to
have merge rights on the single global repo.. or rather have the
option to give maintainers right to some software but not all
4298[22:21:57] *** Quits: MenschZwoNull (~MenschZwo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4299[22:22:00] *** Quits: cryptodan (~cryptodan@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4300[22:22:06] <jhutchins_wk> disi: the repositories are main,
which is regular DFS packages, contrib, which is packages that may
require non-free dependencies, and non-free, packages that
don't meet the DFSG. The latter includes things like firmware
binaries.
4309[22:23:32] <greycat> apt(8) BEING A COMMAND apparently starts
in jessie
4310[22:23:41] <humpled> the APT system in general seems pretty
well worked out
4311[22:23:44] *** Quits: Soo_Slow (Soo_Slow@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4312[22:23:49] <flipxyz> is debian sid comparable to arch linux
in terms of updated softwares?
4313[22:23:54] <disi> mutante: at the end of the day, there are
maintainers that evetually decide what pacakges get included in
debian tho, right? so those are kind ultra-perms on what goes into
debian? (maybe i need to read the nmg before going further)
4314[22:24:02] <greycat> flipxyz: no.
4315[22:24:08] <tarzeau> why not?
4316[22:24:12] <tarzeau> maybe sid+experimental?
4317[22:24:13] <flipxyz> greycat: whats the difference ?
4318[22:24:16] <jhutchins_wk> flipxyz: No, sid is the repository
where new packages land before being promoted to testing.
4319[22:24:21] <tarzeau> repology.org has features to compare
4320[22:24:42] <tarzeau> in terms of updated software i think
it's comparable
4321[22:24:45] <greycat> Arch is a shrine to the Goddess SNS. Sid
is where Debian developers upload what they want to put into the
next stable Debian release, eventually.
4323[22:25:06] <jhutchins_wk> disi: Actually, it's more a
matter of somebody doing the work to package from upstream and
maintain it that gets a package included.
4324[22:25:19] <flipxyz> greycat: makes sense
4325[22:25:22] <greycat> If your entire identity is the sum of
the version numbers of your installed packages, Debian is not for
you.
4330[22:26:12] <greycat> If you have ever spurned a piece of
software that's less than a year old because it was "too
old", Debian is not for you. I'm looking primarily at
Node.JS, PHP, Python, et al. developers here.
4331[22:27:02] *** Quits: shibboleth (~shibbolet@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4332[22:27:22] <flipxyz> greycat: no, its just because I really
like to have, for example, the lastest version of Firefox and some
other softwares. For me its cool, but recently I started to study
debian packaging in a virtual machine and was thinking about doing a
migration or something
4333[22:27:29] <greycat> !sns
4334[22:27:29] <dpkg> Shiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious
disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time
something new is released. If you have SNS, ask me about
<backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than
upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>.
4335[22:27:48] <tsglove> Wow... and... did anything special
happen to ssh on Buster?
4343[22:28:36] <tsglove> I'm trying to ssh into a fresh
server... yet can't. I uncommented /etc/ssh/sshd_config
PasswordAuthentication yes and then restarted ssh via systemctl
restart
4344[22:28:37] <greycat> could be connectivity with older systems
issue, could be entropy starvation issue, could be anything
4345[22:28:47] <tsglove> Ok, let me try with verbose
4346[22:29:01] <greycat> define what "can't" means
4347[22:29:16] <jhutchins_wk> tsglove: Did you install from a
live disk?
4348[22:29:18] *** Quits: uniqdom (~uniqdom@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4353[22:29:57] <tsglove> Ok, sorry. I tried to connect from
another machine and it worked fine.
4354[22:30:04] <tsglove> Something must be up with my first-try
machine
4355[22:31:21] <greycat> each openssh release deprecates some
older ciphers and stuff, so if your first-try machine is running an
older release or older config...
4356[22:31:39] <tsglove> Ahh.... that... might be it. I'm
still checking...
4371[22:36:19] <tsglove> mason, yeah, I know. Brain-fart on my
side. I was checking for the openssh version when they mentioned the
verbose flags. I crossed-them. =)
4372[22:36:32] <tsglove> er, when you mason mentioned it
4385[22:41:38] <tsglove> yeah. I was super pumped the other day
because I finally *actually* created an ssh tunnel from my local
machine to a remote server.
4416[22:50:34] <jhutchins_wk> tarzeau: Services were transfered
from Solaris to Linux with very little change, I don't know if
they copied the DB binaries or just the databases.
4417[22:50:37] <tarzeau> jhutchins_wk: unless it was java
software :)
4418[22:50:48] * tarzeau ROFLS LOLS i die
4419[22:51:03] <tarzeau> jhutchins_wk: well written source code,
is portable
4426[22:52:05] <BCMM> jhutchins_wk: solaris had a compatibility
layer for linux binaries. is it possible that they were using a
database compiled for Linux on Solaris, before the migration?
4433[22:54:33] <jhutchins_wk> BCMM: MySQL, I think there was a
Solaris verion, I'm not sure.
4434[22:55:00] <mason> So, greycat showed me how to find firmware
images here, but how does someone looking at the web site know how
to find the firmware ISOs?
4463[23:05:17] <Lady_Aleena> I was so happy this morning, I
thought I had all my display issues settled. Then I opened Geany
1.33 in XFCE 4.12.5, and it my display settings didn't take for
that program. apt says it depends on libgtk-3-0, but Geany appears
not to be honoring my settings for it. That is if XFCE's
appearance settings are GTK 3 and not 2.
4474[23:08:39] <jmcnaught> mason: the link is in the paragraph,
not the <li> below it
4475[23:08:49] <noln> free firmware is already in the isos, so
when you say firmware image, you mean image with non-free firmware,
free being defined as freedom to modify the firmware etc. not just
being gratis
4481[23:09:45] <mason> That said, I know it's a political
hotbed, but it's not super easy to find. I wish it were a bit
more obvious, as that'd encourage folks to run free software
regardless of what hardware they've got.
4483[23:10:49] <Lady_Aleena> So, is that a debian issue, #xfce
issue, or a #geany issue?
4484[23:10:50] <mason> Which is to say, encourage people to
become zealots, don't force them to zealously choose hardware
that is fully supported by free software in advance. :)
4496[23:14:52] <brandsti_> Hi! I am writing maintainer scripts
for a two project A and B. A depends on B. the install order is B
and then A. but the remove/purge order is A and B. How I can reverse
the remove order?
4506[23:17:17] <Lady_Aleena> I can't stand programs like
that on the command line. I get frustrated when I have to use nano
to edit config files because it is the only editor I can use as
root.
4507[23:17:32] <tsglove> You can´t use vi as root?
4508[23:17:36] <noln> you want to remove the leaf before the
root. Think about running services, or a crash in the middle of the
removal
4540[23:23:02] <Monodroid> the easier it is, the better it is.
why doing complicated? on the most servers today nano is installed.
i know how to use vi, but i switched to nano
4541[23:23:52] <binaryhermit> I find I quite frequently need to
install it, but I have superuser rights on all the computers I use
nano on
4543[23:24:43] <binaryhermit> and I'd think almost all
sysadmins who have users without superuser rights without it would
be willing to install it because those users tend to be kinda noob-y
4547[23:25:39] <jmcnaught> nano and vim-tiny are both Priority:
important which means they would normally be installed unless
"standard utilities" is not selected in the tasksel stage
of the debian installer
4548[23:25:41] <kawaii> fwiw I've been doing this job for 5
years, and nano is amazing
4549[23:25:58] <Lady_Aleena> So, does my Geany appearance in XFCE
problem stay here, or should I go to #xfce or #geany?
4550[23:26:12] <Monodroid> no beacause the time goes forward and
the it is changing alle time. we can use the time to learn oder do
other interesting things
4571[23:31:14] <binaryhermit> yeah, chrome os is google
4572[23:31:42] <binaryhermit> I've been willingly using it
since 2014 with various things offloaded to linux
"servers"
4573[23:32:32] <Monodroid> google is like cancer
4574[23:32:46] <binaryhermit> I'm going to try to partially
migrate my desktop use to raspbian if my pi4 ever arrives and meets
my needs
4575[23:33:27] <mutante> Monodroid: the most recent one that made
me think that is when the "Gallery" app insisted on
getting my location and contacts or it would not show me my own
photo i made 2 minutes earlier
4583[23:35:16] <mutante> yea, still want to root the S5 and
install LineageOS.. (sorry for offtopic, stopping now)
4584[23:35:22] <Lady_Aleena> LtL, I wouldn't know where to
start on interpreting strace.
4585[23:35:52] <LtL> Lady_Aleena: you won't know until you
try
4586[23:35:58] <jmcnaught> Lady_Aleena: is the problem with Geany
that it is not using the theme you want it to, or is it using the
them you want but pooly somehow?
4587[23:36:09] <mutante> Lady_Aleena: at the very bottom
4588[23:36:40] <Lady_Aleena> jmcnaught, it is NOT using the theme
I want it to use.
4592[23:37:12] <Monodroid> we are really blessed that we have
software like debian. without free software we had not a chance to
feel free in the it world
4593[23:37:19] <mutante> Lady_Aleena: generally if you keep
scrolling past all the noise.. at the bottom you can often find the
real issue.. like f.e. a permission issue when trying to open a file
or what file it is opening before the issue
4594[23:37:50] <Lady_Aleena> mutante, when it comes to Geany (on
the command line) there is no bottom until I use Ctrl-C to stop it.
4595[23:38:00] * sunzero is away: (automatically dead ) [BX-MsgLog Off]
4596[23:38:00] * sunzero is idle, automatically dead [bX(l/on p/off)]
4597[23:38:02] <mutante> Monodroid: i assume the
"droid" in your nick is not for Android then ?:)
4598[23:38:10] <Monodroid> no :)
4599[23:38:12] <mutante> Lady_Aleena: i meant strace
4600[23:38:35] <Monodroid> handys has no possibility to enforce
freedom
4612[23:40:17] <mutante> Monodroid: oh, it's fine. just
profiling you like Google.. just kidding
4613[23:40:30] <Monodroid> hehe
4614[23:40:37] <Lady_Aleena> jmcnaught, Geany depends on
libgtk-3-0. I assumed XFCE -> Appearance was GTK3, but I could be
wrong. It could be GTK2. I am getting lost in all of these widgets.
4618[23:41:04] <dstaring> Monodroid: "the more userfriendly
linux are, the better" <-- That is the exact opposite
philosophy from how Linux people think.
4619[23:41:07] <Monodroid> the disaster begins when you combine
the infos
4621[23:41:30] <Monodroid> easy in usability, deep in the
possibilities
4622[23:41:35] <tarzeau> Monodroid: one can collect a lot of data
and combine them. being not as big as google. not much of
infrastructure is needed for that
4623[23:41:39] <noln> Lady_Aleena, try a theme that covers both
gtk2 and gtk3, e.g. clearlooks-phenix
4668[23:46:58] <Monodroid> for me debian is the best linux distro
4669[23:47:06] <naptastic> I know Kung Fu. # cue dramatically
choreographed fight scene
4670[23:47:06] <EdePopede> how worse? rely on cloud providers,
use foss clients, don't care about server side. trust them if
they tell you that their infrastructure is safe and has no backdoor.
4675[23:47:31] <tarzeau> Monodroid: ubuntu has like 25x more
users than debian (that are popcon registered)
4676[23:47:53] <naptastic> I'm trying to build my own cloud
so I get all the benefits--elasticity and offsite backups
mainly--and it's hard.
4677[23:47:58] <Lady_Aleena> The reason I am thinking is might be
a Geany problem is because Geany's title bar is taking on the
the appearance, but nothing else.
4702[23:50:49] *** Quits: toorop (~toorop@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4703[23:51:00] *** Quits: war9407 (war@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4704[23:51:45] <Monodroid> what the linux devs can do is to
develop the best, userfriendly software. and then is the choice of
each of them if they want to use and remain free or loosing control
over pc
4705[23:51:53] *** Quits: MenschZwoNull (~MenschZwo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)