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• 3[00:00:42] <SerajewelKS> especially if they are going to take up a taskbar button anyway
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• 7[00:03:09] <RM982> how do I uninstall gnome without removing the whole system in the process?
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• 11[00:03:45] <n4dir> RM982: you won't this way or the other.
• 12[00:04:02] <n4dir> you may remove quite a bit though.
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• 18[00:06:23] <SerajewelKS> i would suggest using aptitude and marking the metapackages for removal, then sift through what else it thinks is unneeded (dependencies that were automatically installed) and mark for installation anything you don't want removed
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• 30[00:14:24] <RM982> thanks, I think I will reconsider the fresh install alternative
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• 36[00:16:10] <n4dir> if you want to do that anyway you could look at something like "dpkg -l | grep gnome | xargs apt-get remove -s " (let's hope i got no error in there).
• 37[00:16:32] <n4dir> -s as in simultate.
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• 39[00:19:06] <SerajewelKS> n4dir: you will have to cut that output a bit because of the columns
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• 45[00:21:17] <n4dir> ah, now i remember. sorry and thanks SerajewelKS ( i think a easy awk would do ).
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• 48[00:21:34] <SerajewelKS> indeed
• 49[00:21:47] <SerajewelKS> dpkg -l | grep ... | awk '{print $2}'
• 50[00:21:47] <dpkg> ii | grep ... | awk '{print $2}' 1.8-4.2 ultra s3kr1t #debian package
• 51[00:21:58] * SerajewelKS rolls eyes
• 52[00:22:31] <n4dir> let me look like a smart guy: | awk '/gnome/ { print $2 }' would work too :-)
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• 65[00:28:25] <Orbstheorem> Hi, I'm looking for bibliography about standarization over monopolization, preferably (but not limited to) software development. Could anyone please shed some light in my road? :)
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• 74[00:32:22] <joepublic> does monopolization not tend to standardize?
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• 80[00:37:06] <jpw> Orbstheorem: do you mean proprietary vs open standards?
• 81[00:37:07] <EdePopede> hint: timestamps on MS's filesystems
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• 83[00:37:35] <Orbstheorem> Yeah, but then monopole holders can control and tailor the market. Which in the context of open source software it's super annoying
• 84[00:37:42] <Orbstheorem> joepublic: ^^
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• 88[00:38:38] <joepublic> I guess catb by esr.
• 89[00:38:39] <Orbstheorem> jpw: That included, but also controlling interests and basically “confining the user” and “leaving them no choice”
• 90[00:39:32] <bdub76> improved openness in wireless would be nice
• 91[00:39:34] <jpw> the closest mantra i can think of is stallman.org. I don't think any documented examples exist outside of anti-trust law suits.
• 92[00:40:34] <Orbstheorem> I got inspired a late-drunk discussion about Google coarsing HTTP/2 on the IETF
• 93[00:41:01] <jpw> there are plenty of anecdotl examples!
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• 97[00:41:27] <Orbstheorem> jpw: I found many {G,A,F,A,M} vs the United stated examples, but astonishingly not so many “serious” research
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• 102[00:42:04] <jpw> mshtml, flash, java, activex etc
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• 108[00:44:06] <joepublic> the ibm pc and pc xt/at had standard isa slots, the market flourished and ibm benefited. next model ibm had micro channel slots, monopoly locked up tight, and ibm became irrelevant faster than you can say no-thank-you
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• 113[00:45:04] <jpw> Orbstheorem: the problem you will find is that when a private comany creates a proprietary format they do so to suuit their own requirements. This is not 'wrong' because the company is trying to solve a previously unsolved problem, this is their business model to recover costs.
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• 115[00:45:47] <jpw> Obviously myself and many others would prefer this was not the case but it is.
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• 120[00:49:04] <Orbstheorem> I suggest moving to #debian-overflow I just realyzed how offtopic this could go
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• 122[00:49:36] <Orbstheorem> Can anyone invite me? ><"
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• 124[00:50:02] <jpw> can you not get in?#
• 125[00:50:06] <jpw> ill try
• 126[00:50:49] <Orbstheorem> Oh, it's -offtopic, not -overflow x)
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• 153[01:04:53] <chomwitt> mutante: thanks very much for the answer. sorry for the delayed response.
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• 217[01:41:05] <nuxil> hi
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• 220[01:45:01] <nuxil> i have a problem i dont understand with my wifi.
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• 222[01:45:59] <nuxil> i got a router that has 5ghz and 2.4ghz band and i would like to prefere to stat on the 2.4ghz as it gives a more stable signal. this wifi card on the pc supports both 5ghz and 2.4.
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• 224[01:46:19] <nuxil> but if i connect to the 2.4ghz band. i can not connect to the internet
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• 227[01:46:41] <nuxil> its nothing wrong with the routersetup. i check with other devices that uses 2.4ghz
• 228[01:47:25] <nuxil> it will only allow me to surf when i use the 5ghz band.
• 229[01:47:34] <slidinghorn> is there a way to find out exactly which maililng lists my email is on? I thought I've unsubbed from them, but I'm still getting mail. I've sent unsub emails but they say I'm not subscribed
• 230[01:47:59] <nuxil> but the weird part is. if i connect to my 2.4ghz .i can login to my router. like.. there is a local net.
• 231[01:48:10] <nuxil> seems like there is some routing issues. isk.
• 232[01:48:12] <nuxil> *idk
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• 236[01:50:07] <nuxil> ideas?
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• 304[02:26:00] <annadane> are there any graphical file managers in debian that allow you to change the background color?
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• 306[02:26:12] <phogg> annadane: the background color of what?
• 307[02:26:23] <phogg> annadane: do you mean the wallpaper of the desktop?
• 308[02:26:27] <annadane> the area where files appear
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• 310[02:27:05] <phogg> annadane: as far as I know, no. You can only change your widget theme (e.g. GTK theme) which would change all windows. I could be wrong, I don't know *every* file manager.
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• 313[02:27:41] <annadane> i use thunar which is my preferred file manager so far but even changing the theme to dark in xfce for instance doesn't change the color
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• 315[02:27:56] <annadane> (thunar is xfce's file manager)
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• 321[02:29:58] <phogg> annadane: I am familiar with thunar.
• 322[02:30:05] * phogg is familiar with a lot of file managers
• 323[02:30:07] <altker128> annadane: You can use Dolphin from KDE
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• 331[02:31:24] <phogg> altker128: how do you change it in Dolphin?
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• 333[02:31:39] <altker128> phogg: It's configurable somewhere
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• 337[02:32:07] <phogg> altker128: I'm not finding it, that's why I asked.
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• 339[02:32:29] <altker128> phogg: Sorry, been awhile since I've used it, not trying to be evasive. It might be in a KDE control panel setting or theme
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• 341[02:33:11] <phogg> altker128: you can definitely change the Qt theme to affect the color, but it's a global effect and not just Dolphin
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• 351[02:36:07] <awal1> annadane, I doubt your purpose is possible bcoz the gtk/qt theme you use applies for the whole X. You may look for a custom 'thunar' theme, if it exists
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• 357[02:37:58] <nuxil> just use mc :p
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• 361[02:38:53] <phogg> altker128: it seems *likely* that you can use custom theme rules for thunar, but it would not have a GUI for setting it up
• 362[02:38:56] <annadane> my problem with mc is you can't see pictures
• 363[02:38:58] <phogg> GTK themes are basically CSS now
• 364[02:39:01] <nuxil> if the app dosnt have its own theming. you best choice is a system theme.
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• 366[02:39:15] <phogg> altker128: I'm not sure about dolphin, but I think something similar would work for that, too.
• 367[02:39:19] <altker128> phogg: I might be mistaken and thinking of Konqueror in KDE 3.x days?
• 368[02:40:27] <nuxil> good old days was better :p both kde and gnome :p
• 369[02:40:39] <phogg> annadane: this replaced-url
• 370[02:40:43] <altker128> I use MATE these days
• 371[02:40:58] <altker128> Wish it had per-vdesktop wallpaper and some other things, but it
• 372[02:41:02] <altker128> 's "OK" at this point
• 373[02:41:09] <phogg> annadane: this gives a snippet of GTK theme code which targets thunar specifically, although not the part you want, and alters the color. Tested and works for me.
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• 375[02:41:52] <annadane> all the file managers either a) don't have enough theming b) have poor controls or c) don't show pictures
• 376[02:42:03] <phogg> annadane: figuring out how to target the area you want is going to be the hard part. Might need to peruse the source code for that
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• 381[02:42:23] <phogg> annadane: mostly file managers don't have theming at all
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• 384[02:42:58] <annadane> i am seriously this motivated to just making my own
• 385[02:43:08] <annadane> this close to motivated*
• 386[02:43:10] <nuxil> krusader
• 387[02:43:19] <awal1> annadane, check if the video in replaced-url
• 388[02:43:24] <nuxil> it has some simple colors stuff
• 389[02:43:53] <awal1> I guess the guy uses an openbox based os , 'crunchbang'
• 390[02:44:06] <phogg> awal1: that URL is 403 for me
• 391[02:44:20] <awal1> oups, not sure why
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• 393[02:44:31] <awal1> opens fine here (chromium)
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• 395[02:45:08] <awal1> dpkg: archlabs
• 396[02:45:08] <dpkg> bugger all, i dunno, awal1
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• 427[03:06:24] <joepublic> offtopic, i guess, but I have never really come up with one centralized way to apply a theme that is picked up by the DE such as lxde/sfce, by GTK and its apps, and by QT and its apps. It's bad enough finding all the places to set things like default application such as browser, much less theming it all.
• 428[03:06:45] <joepublic> someone somewhere has probably solved it, or is working on it.
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• 430[03:07:07] <joepublic> s#lxde/sfxe#lxde/xfce
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• 505[04:04:14] <dr4ken> hello folks, i have an aesthetics problem: i have debian 9 + xfce to the latest, but my desktop icons' text doesnt have shadows, hwo can i enable it?
• 506[04:04:31] <dr4ken> it is theme independant, no matter what theme do i choo it still does happens
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• 514[04:13:01] <siwica> I am currently teaching myself how do build debian packages using the slides in `debian-tutorial`. Since they are already a couple years old: what is the current usage distribution of classic debhelper vs. CDBS vs. dh?
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• 528[04:22:41] <rwp> siwica, AFAICS, The newer dh tends to be the most recommended one now. cdbs is still used historically but now but people aren't starting new with it. Others may have other opinions and all of that.
• 529[04:23:27] <siwica> Ok, thank you, that helps!
• 530[04:23:56] <siwica> I will build new packages so I guess I can safely skip cdbs for now.
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• 532[04:25:11] <rwp> One might think of cdbs as an ancestor in that it was a previous implementation and dh is a newer implementation solving the same problem space.
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• 534[04:26:00] <rwp> I am not versed with the new git package flow but that seems to be the direction that all the cool kids go these days.
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• 550[04:30:29] <ChmEarl> siwica, since its a makefile, all you need to do is:debian/rules binary
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• 552[04:31:26] <ChmEarl> siwica, and if the d/rules has a catch-all referencing dh, then your meme is clear
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• 556[04:32:28] <ChmEarl> catch-all -> @:
• 557[04:32:46] <ChmEarl> no %:
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• 663[05:49:54] <z8z> Why Debian 9 version of vinagre fails to connect to host with domainname.com:port and works with ipaddress:port? I checked and the domainname is pointing to the same IP. Any idea?
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• 798[07:00:23] <siwica> I need to package a couple internal tools for the company I am working at. Would you recomment maintaining the debian directory within the "upstream" git repository or have a separate repository for the packaging? What kind of setup is common in this case?
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• 800[07:00:45] <siwica> *recommend
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• 858[07:36:39] <darxmurf> huuuuu did they finally fix this CIFS issue of missing folders when mounting shares with vers={2,3}?
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• 873[07:51:16] <PaddyF> ah, a CIFS issue caused that
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• 875[07:51:51] <PaddyF> i wonder how it targeted those directories that were the most important to me
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• 893[08:00:18] <darxmurf> I think it was a kernel related issue
• 894[08:00:53] <darxmurf> I did some tests this morning and it looks ok (using kernel 4.18 from backports)
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• 919[08:19:07] <darxmurf> how can I see which version SMB is used when a folder is mounted ? mount command returns only "version=default"
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• 923[08:20:11] <_abc_> Hello. Just reading about package removal for political correctness reasons, weboob.org - unrelated to what it sounds like. Is there a solid debian policy on this? What about mitigating damage caused to people using that package by removing it? Is that also mitigated or is that secondary? I do not use it (yet), this is a policy or principles question. Who knows what else willl be purged next.
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• 1069[10:07:40] <kale> in debian, when i run "virt-install --os-variant list" i do not get the list of available options. Which command will give me that list?
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• 1110[10:28:05] <leorat> man virt-install ?
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• 1115[10:32:35] <kale> the list is not in the manpage
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• 1117[10:33:25] <kale> dpkg -L osinfo-db shows some files, from which you can guess the os-variants chooseable. But there must be a more convenient way of getting the list
• 1118[10:33:25] <dpkg> ii osinfo-db shows some files, from which you can guess the os-variants chooseable. But there must be a more convenient way of getting the list 3.4-1.1 kale's private porn collection
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• 1120[10:33:52] <kale> heh
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• 1122[10:34:24] <leorat> sorry thats all i had, i dont use cli much
• 1123[10:34:51] <kale> leorat: are the variants in a dropdown in the gui?
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• 1126[10:35:27] <leorat> i dont have virt installed
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• 1135[10:41:21] <leorat> is the gui gnome boxes? if so its showing all the iso variants on disk (havent actually used it yet)
• 1136[10:42:02] <kale> i actually do not know, its been years since ive seen the libvirt gui.
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• 1142[10:46:00] <leorat> no its virt-manager or qt-virt-manager sorry
• 1143[10:46:52] <leorat> from here replaced-url
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• 1170[11:11:30] <choice> Good Morning
• 1171[11:11:33] <choice> When I boot my computer, the Update Manager often shows no pending updates. But when I click 'Refresh' it suddenly brings up updates. Isn't that strange?
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• 1173[11:13:07] <tarzeau> choice: update-manager is gnome-software ?
• 1174[11:13:07] <apollo13> no
• 1175[11:13:10] <apollo13> :D
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• 1177[11:13:18] <choice> tarzeau: I guess so.
• 1178[11:13:28] <apollo13> choice: refreshing happens at certain time intervals
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• 1180[11:13:37] <apollo13> after a while it would probably tell you that there are pending updates
• 1181[11:13:39] <tarzeau> maybe somehting with replaced-url
• 1182[11:13:52] <tarzeau> i've hardly ever seen anyone using gnome-software...
• 1183[11:14:07] <choice> apollo13: Yes. But why does the update manager show a green (up to date) symbol after boot without checking? It should be grey imho.
• 1184[11:14:20] <apollo13> choice: *shrug* ;)
• 1185[11:14:50] <apollo13> choice: wouldn't that by definition then mean it should always be grey and never green?
• 1186[11:15:06] <apollo13> like a second after you installed the updates it should go back to grey because it doesn't know if there are new ones
• 1187[11:15:27] <apollo13> and even if it checks and finds no update, a second later you could have updates again
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• 1189[11:15:45] <choice> apollo13: It should be grey when the last check is longer ago then the update cycle.
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• 1193[11:16:22] <choice> green=checked within 1h and up to date. red=checked within 1h and out of date. grey=not checked within the last hour.
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• 1196[11:17:55] <apollo13> mhm, I wish I could care about such things^^
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• 1199[11:19:06] <choice> What do you care for?
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• 1203[11:20:04] <apollo13> only stuff that is critical (for some definition of critical)
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• 1205[11:20:19] <choice> Example?
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• 1207[11:20:54] <kale> coffee on time
• 1208[11:21:02] * JustASlacker nods
• 1209[11:21:03] <apollo13> a site2site vpn loosing packets, a server not booting, dunno
• 1210[11:21:05] <JustASlacker> very critical
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• 1212[11:21:16] <JustASlacker> I go with the coffee thing
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• 1214[11:22:51] <apollo13> choice: for instance I would never want to have update-manager show red for "checked within 1h and out of date." -- if it is not a security update I would probably not care
• 1215[11:23:18] <choice> apollo13: What are updates if not security updates?
• 1216[11:23:43] <kale> choice: functions fixed. like word processor does not work with bold fonts.
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• 1218[11:24:44] <choice> I see.
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• 1248[11:45:57] <High_Priest> hi guys, I have openvpn server installed & configured and everything works fine until I restart my debian stretch box (raspberry pi 3). After a reboot, the service is started but no tun0 interface is brought up UNTIL I manually restart the service with systemctl. Any ideas on why is this happening and how to overcome this issue? Thanks!
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• 1263[11:54:16] <Iridos> what version of debian is this?
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• 1269[11:56:00] <Iridos> replaced-url
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• 1287[12:07:45] <vlt> Hi Priest! Did you `systemctl enable openvpn@your_conf.service`?
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• 1299[12:17:24] <grandfso> Hi, how can I allow a specific user to bind to an IP address / network interface without using sudo or running as a root ?
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• 1307[12:19:50] <Wulf> grandfso: usually that's not restricted to root.
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• 1309[12:20:42] <grandfso> Wulf: I think this may be related to low ports ?
• 1310[12:20:48] <grandfso> I am testing with telnet.
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• 1313[12:20:58] <Fox> port just has to be > 1024
• 1314[12:21:01] <Wulf> telnet doesn't bind
• 1315[12:21:09] <Wulf> oh, it can.
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• 1317[12:21:34] <grandfso> Wulf: yup it can :)
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• 1319[12:22:10] <Wulf> you could set ip_unprivileged_port_start to a lower value (don't!)
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• 1321[12:23:08] <Wulf> or create the socket using root and pass it to your unprivileged process. Systemd got some support for that.
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• 1324[12:24:50] <grandfso> OK, that's some idea. I will follow this lead for now, because I don't think it's possible have a non-root user bypass this limitation -- I tried some time ago and failed miserably.
• 1325[12:25:10] <inch> Try setcap 'cap_net_bind_service=+ep' /path/to/program, but then the program gets to bind low ports,
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• 1327[12:25:37] <inch> the permission is not for the user, but for anybody who is allowed to run the program
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• 1329[12:26:03] <grandfso> inch: the setcap is what I was trying before - I didn't manage to get it to work.
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• 1332[12:27:17] <tarzeau> say i have g1..10, bash variables i can't print them with for a in `seq 1 10`; echo g$a; done
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• 1337[12:31:19] <inch> tarzeau: with eval, you can, for example: a1=b ; n=1 ; eval 'echo ${a'"$n"'}'
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• 1339[12:32:34] <tarzeau> inch: that was what i was looking for. THANKS!
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• 1367[12:59:51] <bluenemo> hi guys. I want to keep some directories synchronous one way using sth like inotify. I found lsyncd - is there another tool you would recommend for the task? I remember that there was sth cooler and newer than lsyncd but I don't remember the name..
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• 1442[14:05:05] <NetTerminalGene> ,kernels
• 1443[14:05:06] <judd> Available kernel versions are: experimental: 4.19.0-trunk-686-pae (4.19.5-1~exp1); sid: 4.19.0-1-686-pae (4.19.9-1); buster: 4.18.0-3-686 (4.18.20-2); stretch-backports: 4.18.0-0.bpo.3-686 (4.18.20-2~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.9.0-8-686-pae (4.9.130-2); jessie-backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.8-686-pae (4.9.110-3+deb9u5~deb8u1); wheezy-
• 1444[14:05:07] <judd> backports: 3.16.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.16.39-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-6-686-pae (3.2.102-1)
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• 1448[14:05:44] <NetTerminalGene> would you suggest to use stretch backport kernel?
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• 1451[14:08:38] <Fox> if you need it yes, if not it's up to you
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• 1461[14:15:10] <muAdmDev> after updating my system I get "apt-get: relocation error: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libapt-pkg.so.5.0" - "GLIBCXX_3.4.21 not defined in file libstdc++.so.6"
• 1462[14:15:36] <muAdmDev> I already reinstalled libstdc++... searched google etc. can't get rid of this :(
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• 1515[14:44:01] <High_Priest> any ideas on my question? thanks
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• 1548[14:56:52] <Nawab> is buster testing or stable?
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• 1554[14:57:45] <n4dir> testing.
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• 1556[14:58:28] <incal> hello, I'm trying to copy my whole home dir to a flash memory as a backup - yeah, I know, what a great backup system - but right now it'll have to do - anyway problem is: "cp: cannot create regular file ... invalid argument" because of wierd chars (I think). How do I copy *everything*, including them, everything in their exact dirs etc?
• 1557[14:58:50] <ayekat> incal: what filesystem is on the flash memory?
• 1558[14:59:06] <incal> ayekat: 1s
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• 1560[14:59:24] <n4dir> cp -a /home/username /media/stick/backup_home; something like that.
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• 1566[15:01:09] <incal> ayekat: vfat with 'df -T'
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• 1568[15:01:38] <ayekat> incal: I doubt FAT has support for all the weird filenames…
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• 1570[15:01:54] <ayekat> (e.g. : in filenames usually causes problems with windows filesystems, IIRC)
• 1571[15:02:11] <n4dir> perhaps tar the whole shebang before storing it on the stick.
• 1572[15:02:27] <n4dir> as i recall the same as ayekat .
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• 1574[15:03:02] <incal> ayekat: oh no! I have tons of it, Usenet kommunication with '+', ":", possibly worse in filenames
• 1575[15:03:08] <incal> *communication
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• 1577[15:03:24] <ayekat> +1 for tarball as suggested by n4dir (the alternative would be to reformat)
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• 1580[15:04:13] <incal> ayekat, n4dir: great idea, I'll do it right now
• 1581[15:04:37] <n4dir> funny enough i didn't come up with that idea when running in the problem myself.
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• 1586[15:07:50] <RandomSerb> hello. How do I check exact model of installed GPU?
• 1587[15:08:02] <tarzeau> RandomSerb: lspci |grep VGA ?
• 1588[15:08:07] <RandomSerb> I tried lspci and utils like lshw, but I can't get exact model
• 1589[15:08:08] <tarzeau> might need an update-pciids
• 1590[15:08:23] <RandomSerb> product: Cedar [Radeon HD 5000/6000/7350/8350 Series] [1002:68F9]
• 1591[15:08:28] <RandomSerb> tarzeau, ^
• 1592[15:08:33] <tarzeau> that is not exact?
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• 1594[15:08:47] <RandomSerb> radeon hd 1 out of 4 series?
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• 1598[15:08:51] <tarzeau> RandomSerb: try adding -v to lspci
• 1599[15:08:53] <RandomSerb> that's exact?
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• 1601[15:09:10] <tarzeau> aha, well the pci id at the end, googling for that?
• 1602[15:09:16] <RandomSerb> tarzeau, lspci -vnn | grep VGA -A 12
• 1603[15:09:21] <RandomSerb> that was the exact command
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• 1605[15:10:28] <RandomSerb> tarzeau, 1002:68f9 ?
• 1606[15:11:31] <tarzeau> RandomSerb: yes that's what you pasted: 15:08 < RandomSerb> product: Cedar [Radeon HD 5000/6000/7350/8350 Series] [1002:68F9] <- here
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• 1616[15:15:18] <LtL> judd: pciid 1002:68F9
• 1617[15:15:19] <judd> [1002:68f9] is 'Cedar [Radeon HD 5000/6000/7350/8350 Series]' from 'Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]' with kernel modules 'snd-hda-intel', 'radeon' in stretch. See also replaced-url
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• 1619[15:16:27] <incal> ayekat, n4dir: 'tar -cpf home-dir.tar home-dir' should do it right?
• 1620[15:16:43] <LtL> RandomSerb: um, that's usually not a good indication from judd regarding your radeon chipset driver wise.
• 1621[15:17:20] <incal> ayekat, n4dir: I have to do it with sudo, that won't influence permissions etc, right?
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• 1624[15:18:58] <ayekat> incal: to be honest, I have never tarred up something for an archive-like backup, so I can't tell if that's the good set of options
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• 1626[15:19:23] <esainane> I'd recommend making a squashfs archive
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• 1629[15:19:47] <incal> ayekat: yeah, I have to do this is like zero time that's why I'm freaking out :)
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• 1632[15:21:26] <incal> ayekat, n4dir: is it smart to tar it from the SD directly to the flash? problem is, almost zero space left on SD
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• 1635[15:22:03] <ayekat> shouldn't be a problem, I'd say
• 1636[15:22:17] <incal> ayekat: cool, I'll do it right now
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• 1641[15:24:30] <incal> ayekat, n4dir: works! thank you both! even tho perhaps trivial thing I was/am too stressed to have figured it out w/o your help
• 1642[15:24:51] <DanteD> How to install GCC-7 to debian stable? (its in testing, but will my system break if I only add that package? )
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• 1644[15:25:43] <PaddyF> !nvidia
• 1645[15:25:43] <dpkg> Where possible, Nvidia graphic processing units are supported using the open source <nouveau> driver on Debian systems by default. To install the proprietary "nvidia" driver, see replaced-url
• 1646[15:25:53] <PaddyF> !nvidia legacy
• 1647[15:25:53] <dpkg> The Nvidia proprietary 304.125 legacy driver supports the GeForce 6xxx and 7xxx GPUs, which are no longer supported by the Nvidia proprietary unified driver. To install, see replaced-url
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• 1654[15:31:00] <irenicus> How do I figure out what GPU drivers I'm using?
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• 1658[15:31:29] <PaddyF> irenicus: look at "lspci -v" e.g.
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• 1661[15:32:00] <LtL> irenicus: lspci -k shows you quite a bit.
• 1662[15:32:01] <irenicus> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation GF108GLM [NVS 5200M] (rev ff) (prog-if ff)
• 1663[15:32:04] <irenicus> !!! Unknown header type 7f
• 1664[15:32:07] <irenicus> Kernel modules: nouveau
• 1665[15:32:30] <irenicus> thanks! so, that means I use the noveau driver, and it's... working?
• 1666[15:32:47] <PaddyF> when you install nvidia-detect it can tell you which driver you need
• 1667[15:33:04] <PaddyF> but its in the non-free repo
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• 1671[15:34:54] <irenicus> arright! Will that thing install the non-free drivers? I'm trying to set up my monitor with hdmi, but atm. it only works with vga. If this is feasible with noveau, I'd rather keep to that..
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• 1673[15:35:13] <cmihai> debian-9.6.0-s390x-netinst.iso fails with "mirror does not support the speified release (stretch)" at : wget --no-verbose replaced-url
• 1674[15:35:46] <cmihai> Exiting to a shell -> wget works fine though. Is this a mirror issue (should I use a specific mirror)?
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• 1676[15:37:33] <irenicus> PaddyF: so, output of nvidia-detect is that my card is supported by all driver versions and it's recommended to install the nvidia-driver package
• 1677[15:38:11] <PaddyF> if you install it then nouveau will be disabled / blacklisted
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• 1679[15:38:26] <PaddyF> you can have only 1 driver installed
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• 1681[15:38:46] <irenicus> PaddyF: ohkay. Thanks. Is that *necessary* in order to ose a monitor with HDMI?
• 1682[15:38:58] <PaddyF> i dont think so
• 1683[15:39:19] *** Joins: citypw (~citypw@replaced-ip)
• 1684[15:39:20] <PaddyF> the proprietary driver has a few advantages. one is speed
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• 1687[15:40:18] <irenicus> yeah, but I've had *so* much trouble with the proprietary drivers in the past.. I don't really need speed or cuda or any of that stuff; I just want to exploit the resolution of my fancy new monitor
• 1688[15:40:26] <irenicus> vga doesn't do it justice
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• 1690[15:40:42] <PaddyF> you can stay with nouveau sure thing
• 1691[15:40:46] <cmihai> Doesn't look like s390x supports 'cd install' either.
• 1692[15:41:07] <irenicus> PaddyF: ok, but how do you make it connect with HDMI?
• 1693[15:41:29] <irenicus> When I insert a vga cable, the monitor shows up. When I insert a hdmi, it does not
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• 1696[15:41:43] <PaddyF> irenicus: what do you mean - connect? you plug in the cable and go?
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• 1699[15:42:27] <irenicus> yeah, if I plug in a new monitor with a vga cable in my laptop, it shows up. My laptop registers that there is a monitor connected, and so does the monitor
• 1700[15:42:36] <irenicus> wiht an hdmi, nothing happens
• 1701[15:42:40] <PaddyF> oh, laptop
• 1702[15:42:57] <irenicus> I've tried five different monitors, so it's not the monitor
• 1703[15:43:04] <irenicus> same for all of them
• 1704[15:43:13] <irenicus> yeah, laptop
• 1705[15:43:14] <bindi> and what about the cable?
• 1706[15:43:27] <irenicus> tried three different cables
• 1707[15:43:42] <irenicus> one of them, from another machine where the screen was connected
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• 1711[15:44:43] <irenicus> could be the hdmi port, I guess, but I have no idea how to check that
• 1712[15:45:06] <PaddyF> i am not sure to be honest, but i would try nvidia-settings and the driver suggested by nvidia-detect
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• 1714[15:45:38] <PaddyF> if that does not work how you like you can remove the stuff and reactivate nouveau again
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• 1716[15:46:25] <irenicus> PaddyF: Oh. Right. Is there a great chance that this will fuck up everything? Last time, I ended up reinstalling the system.
• 1717[15:46:42] <irenicus> but that was a more manual approach with modprobe and stuff involved
• 1718[15:46:50] *** Quits: crazeekennee (~ken_home@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1719[15:46:52] <PaddyF> the nvidia binaries work 95%
• 1720[15:47:59] <irenicus> and all I need to do is a) backup, b) nvidia-settings and install etc. and then c) reboot?
• 1721[15:48:09] <PaddyF> yup
• 1722[15:48:18] <PaddyF> almost full automagic
• 1723[15:48:21] <irenicus> no xorg.conf, ok
• 1724[15:48:28] <PaddyF> not anymore
• 1725[15:48:39] <irenicus> allright, we'll try then!
• 1726[15:48:43] <PaddyF> :)
• 1727[15:48:46] <irenicus> thanks!
• 1728[15:49:00] *** Quits: kirk781 (~kirk781@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 1729[15:49:14] <EdePopede> was there an update to evince recently which installed a crap version which doesn't respect user's choices of desktop settings? the window looks like MS Word now, only without 3 lines of ribbons. where's the titlebar?
• 1730[15:50:13] *** Quits: Pjusur (~Pjusur@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1731[15:50:27] <joepublic> Just want to mention that I use nouveau to drive 4 monitors on my workstation and I am a happy customer.
• 1732[15:50:34] <nemo> EdePopede: evince = the gnome 3 atril right?
• 1733[15:50:36] <EdePopede> can't even finish it with C-q
• 1734[15:50:40] <nemo> or the other way around ☺
• 1735[15:51:06] <EdePopede> nemo: gnome what? using xfce, didn't open evince probably in month.
• 1736[15:51:18] <nemo> joepublic: nice... I haven't had even 3 monitors in a long time. I've been thinking of buying a cheapo $200 4K TV as a massive monitor tho
• 1737[15:51:23] <EdePopede> is this gnome3 design or what?
• 1738[15:51:30] <nemo> gonna guess... yes?
• 1739[15:51:35] <nemo> EdePopede: maybe try atril instead?
• 1740[15:51:36] <nemo> dunno
• 1741[15:51:50] <irenicus> joepublic: and when you connect a new monitor with a hdmi cable it just... connects?
• 1742[15:51:57] <joepublic> nemo: yeah 3 of the monitors are 40" TV sets, but nouveau only gives great results on older cards that can't do 4k
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• 1744[15:52:21] <joepublic> irenicus, plug in hdmi, just connects. I have a GTX 760 kepler which is one of the better supported card families in nouveau
• 1745[15:52:27] <nemo> joepublic: I kinda need to buy a 4K something just 'cause we have more and more Hedgewars users on 4K - and since not a single dev has such a device, the game looks like crap on it
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• 1747[15:52:48] <nemo> joepublic: aaaaand since we are all poor FOSS devs w/ negative cash flow from the project, getting 4K working has been low priority 😉
• 1748[15:52:54] <EdePopede> ouch, that evince dependency really reads like gnome 3: libgnome-desktop-3-12
• 1749[15:52:57] <joepublic> for good performance at 4k nouveau almost certainly isn't going to make you happy.
• 1750[15:53:32] <nemo> joepublic: I reluctantly had to switch back to the nvidia driver just to get one video game I bought working - that linux-compatible witchhunter
• 1751[15:53:44] <nemo> joepublic: but I was hoping to switch back once I got around to finishing the game
• 1752[15:54:09] <joepublic> The radeon 4xx / 5xx cards have great performance with the open source amdgpu driver but require firmware from non-free
• 1753[15:54:32] <nemo> EdePopede: I've been a happy MATE customer ever since it was, well, gnome2 - but unfortunately the power manager has become fail lately - that might drive me back to XFCE
• 1754[15:54:43] <nemo> EdePopede: XFCE has gotten a lot saner config section than in years past
• 1755[15:55:02] <EdePopede> nemo: atril (never heard of it before btw) has some mate dependencies, even mate-desktop-common. do you (or someone else) know about a simple pdf viewer which won't install half of a desktop but still has some basic features like zoom and side-by-side?
• 1756[15:55:17] <nemo> EdePopede: huh. wonder why it requires mate desktop
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• 1758[15:55:26] <nemo> EdePopede: but anyway, atril is gnome 2 evince AFAIK
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• 1760[15:55:43] <nemo> EdePopede: I would think you pulled in gnome3 to get evince if atril requires mate
• 1761[15:55:45] <PaddyF> most things mate are gnome2
• 1762[15:55:56] <EdePopede> nemo: the new times maybe. instead of coding 3 lines look for a framework
• 1763[15:56:00] <nemo> EdePopede: unless someone was being lazy packaging
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• 1766[15:56:14] <nemo> EdePopede: debian occasionally includes unnecessary deps..
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• 1768[15:56:41] <EdePopede> hm, i could install it and breaking the dependency :>
• 1769[15:56:41] <PaddyF> or their reasons are not visible at first
• 1770[15:56:50] <EdePopede> +then
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• 1774[15:57:39] <PaddyF> you could file a bug and see if they change it
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• 1789[16:01:41] <EdePopede> evince has a window with keyboard shortcuts. not a bad idea. no entry for "close all windows", none for "exit programm". but gestures, yeah. another project abandoning desktop users. the kewl kids have an iphone nowadays, correct?
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• 1794[16:02:13] <PaddyF> EdePopede: yup
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• 1796[16:03:50] <PaddyF> revolutionary idea: try Okular
• 1797[16:03:57] <EdePopede> that's why linux will never make it to the desktop in the broad: cli is too heavy for most users, while the desktops go insane at some point.
• 1798[16:04:13] <EdePopede> PaddyF: thanks for the tip. looking at it
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• 1802[16:05:55] <EdePopede> qt based. nice thing that. always preferred it over gtk, only where is the alternative to kde? i know, there's lxqt now. a glimpse of hope.
• 1803[16:06:08] <PaddyF> grrr, bad suggestion then. sorry
• 1804[16:06:31] <EdePopede> ok, it's not qt, it's kde :D
• 1805[16:06:40] <EdePopede> worst dependency list so far ;)
• 1806[16:06:46] * PaddyF launches packagesearch and tries the "related" there
• 1807[16:07:21] <tsglove> Does debian use something like the open build service?
• 1808[16:07:27] *** Quits: super_gollum (~ich@replaced-ip) (Quit: Ex-Chat)
• 1809[16:07:41] <EdePopede> "works-with-format::pdf" would be a starting point. there was a command to search for those... thingies, i remember :D
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• 1813[16:08:01] <PaddyF> ept-cache related? deprecated :(
• 1814[16:08:14] <PaddyF> i use packagesearch now
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• 1817[16:09:36] <PaddyF> eog shows up
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• 1821[16:10:06] <afuentes> ive got a Medion akoya E4241 and ubuntu recognize the wifi card, but debian does not. Can somebody help me understand what package i have to install to make it work?
• 1822[16:10:08] <PaddyF> no, wrong again
• 1823[16:10:17] <EdePopede> > debtags search 'works-with-format::pdf && x11::application'
• 1824[16:10:17] * PaddyF kicks himself out of channel
• 1825[16:10:25] <EdePopede> brings up a list of 20+
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• 1827[16:10:33] <Wulf> afuentes: read the kernel messages
• 1828[16:10:43] <Wulf> afuentes: probably some firmware missing
• 1829[16:10:52] <EdePopede> /sajoin PaddyF #debian
• 1830[16:10:58] <PaddyF> :P
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• 1843[16:16:27] <nemo> EdePopede: Okular sounds good, although I gotta say I rarely even use atril these days - most PDFs are just random things I clicked on in the browser, and PDF.js works pretty well these days
• 1844[16:16:56] <nemo> EdePopede: if I need to fill out some stupid PDF form, okular ain't gonna work so I need to fire up acroread or do some silliness in gimp
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• 1846[16:17:17] <nemo> okular/atril/anything-but-adobe
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• 1850[16:17:54] <nemo> EdePopede: most of my own personal PDFs I switched to HTML for more flexible rendering
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• 1852[16:18:01] <psiconauta> anyone using wireguard?
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• 1855[16:18:36] <EdePopede> nemo: indeed. i preferred opening them in the past in a desktop viewer, but now most times i prefer PDF.js (and guess what: an increasing number of PDFs are served as attachment now)
• 1856[16:18:39] <nkuttler> psiconauta: what is your real question?
• 1857[16:19:14] <afuentes> Wulf, genious! thanks!
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• 1861[16:19:33] <Wulf> psiconauta: planning to.
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• 1863[16:20:14] <psiconauta> yeah, I'm planning to
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• 1865[16:21:58] <nemo> EdePopede: replaced-url
• 1866[16:22:25] <nemo> EdePopede: I haven't tried it since I haven't actually encountered that problem myself
• 1867[16:22:31] <nemo> but seems like it overrides content-disposition
• 1868[16:22:56] <EdePopede> nemo: thanks, was on my todo list to look for something like this
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• 1872[16:24:00] <EdePopede> this forced download seems to be a desease amongst gov sites and similar (where they usually would use docx)
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• 1875[16:24:22] <nemo> EdePopede: they want you to open their glorious pdf in adobe ☺
• 1876[16:24:54] <EdePopede> nemo: they can... well i guess you know what Bender said :D
• 1877[16:25:20] <diogenes_> hello, can someone confirm the weboob package was removed from debian repos?
• 1878[16:25:23] <EdePopede> at least there is pdf-x now
• 1879[16:25:48] *** Quits: foxy3 (d4ed8618@replaced-ip) (Quit: Page closed)
• 1880[16:25:54] <nemo> EdePopede: hm. PDF/X seems a lot like ps...
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• 1882[16:26:12] <nemo> "Active content is not allowed in a PDF/X file. This means that standard PDF features like forms, signatures, comments and embedded sounds and movies are not allowed in PDF/X."
• 1883[16:26:15] <nemo> ♥
• 1884[16:26:57] <nemo> EdePopede: have you seen that PDF that plays pong in pdf readers like google's built-in one? ☺
• 1885[16:27:15] *** Quits: fox4 (d4ed8618@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 1886[16:27:19] <nemo> er. not pong. breakout
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• 1888[16:28:01] <EdePopede> nemo: iirc the idea was to have a usable free subset for daily usage. filling forms was one of the problems with online governing (not sure if -x includes this one too). used to be often like "download acrobat reader (it's free), open our form with it and fill it". tax payer's money at work
• 1889[16:28:13] <EdePopede> whot?
• 1890[16:28:58] <EdePopede> nemo this one? replaced-url
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• 1892[16:29:23] <nemo> yes
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• 1902[16:33:11] <EdePopede> seems it was pdf/a. whatever. it really isn't my preferred document format.
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• 1909[16:37:29] <grandfso> Does anyone see any real reason why one should not run testing (buster) as a daily driver?
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• 1912[16:38:18] <afuentes> grandfso, as long as you save a few time before you run your upgrades, no, it works fine
• 1913[16:38:52] <afuentes> 95% of the times they are smooth, but 5% something stops working
• 1914[16:39:07] <afuentes> Usually easy to fix, but a problem if you upgraded just before a presentation
• 1915[16:39:33] <annadane> grandfso, it really depends on what your needs are, for certain people stable + occasional backports has what they need; testing can break in theory and packages can get removed for policy reasons so make of it what you will
• 1916[16:39:58] <Fox> afuentes: I would say that for sid, for buster I would say that you can be in a real mess once you upgraded, and it won't be easy to fix
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• 1926[16:41:57] <grandfso> afuentes, annadane, Fox: thank you guys. I am tempted by the wayland, but I intend to use it in professional environment, so fixing stuff after each upgrade seems to be a big no-no
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• 1931[16:43:45] <afuentes> fox, i mean easy to fix after a search from another computer. Ive been running testing for a very long time, and when it borks maybe it takes me ~30min to fix if i have access to another computer, sometimes less just by looking at the logs
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• 1933[16:44:31] <afuentes> grandfso, i used testing in my work laptop for a long time. I just upgraded fridays a couple hours before going home. It worked for me(tm)
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• 1939[16:45:43] <fox71> ...
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• 1941[16:47:05] <fox71> I'm having trouble with getting Debian to recognize USB flash drives. lsblk (etc.) shows nothing except my SSD, and not even /var/log/messages shows anything when I plug in/take out the flash drives. All other USB devices (e.g. mouse) works fine. What do to?
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• 1943[16:48:00] <petn-randall> fox71: Is it listed in lsusb?
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• 1946[16:48:22] <fox71> petn-randall: Nope.
• 1947[16:48:37] <petn-randall> fox71: Then I would check if it's broken.
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• 1949[16:48:46] <grandfso> xd
• 1950[16:48:48] <petn-randall> or the specific port.
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• 1954[16:48:57] <fox71> petn-randall: We're talking about ALL my USB flash drives.
• 1955[16:49:10] <ppafin> Is port or drive USB 3.0 ?
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• 1957[16:49:33] <fox71> ppafin: Ordinary USB flash drives, SD cards same problem.
• 1958[16:49:46] <ppafin> On host?
• 1959[16:49:55] <fox71> ppafin: host?
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• 1961[16:50:08] <afuentes> I have a Medion akoya E4241 that very aggresively put the laptop on hibernation (and that frozen the laptop because sometimes debian is not able to awake after that) I dont really know whos responsible. Can i disable it somehow?
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• 1965[16:50:56] <ppafin> is computer USB port USB 2 or 3 ?
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• 1968[16:51:03] <fox71> afuentes: Have you tried checking the EFI/BIOS?
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• 1970[16:51:06] <afuentes> At least i think is hibernation/suspend. It happens after i dont touch the laptopn for a few seconds. Very frequently it does so in the login screen if networking is not working
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• 1974[16:51:27] <afuentes> fox71, yes, bios have just like 3 options, boot order and not much more
• 1975[16:51:30] <afuentes> no bios upgrades either
• 1976[16:51:37] <fox71> hmmm
• 1977[16:51:49] <fox71> afuentes: So only a problem with linux/Debian?
• 1978[16:51:49] <afuentes> maybe the kernel can tell to stop trying to suspend it
• 1979[16:52:02] <afuentes> fox71, i have only tried debian tbh
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• 1983[16:52:17] <afuentes> it didnt happen on an ubuntu usblive
• 1984[16:52:24] <afuentes> if that helps
• 1985[16:52:37] <fox71> afuentes: If you try with another OS, then you can check if it's the computer itself or not
• 1986[16:53:03] <afuentes> well, i worked a whole day from a ubuntu usblive and it didnt froze once
• 1987[16:53:21] <fox71> afuentes: Then it might be Debian, surely.
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• 1989[16:53:52] <afuentes> before i was able to install the wifi drivers, only having a phone with usb tetering allowed me to login into debian
• 1990[16:54:05] <afuentes> otherwise, even moving the mouse on the screen it would try to suspend it
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• 1993[16:54:53] <grandfso> I was running some testing based distro (parrotos) and my PC was freezing when it was woken up. It turned out that the os is up and fine and responsive, but the x server hung (after altgr+prtscr+k the x restared and I was back up). Updating the nvidia drivers helped me.
• 1994[16:55:24] <grandfso> I had black screen* not frozen image
• 1995[16:56:11] <greycat> !parrot
• 1996[16:56:11] <dpkg> Parrot OS (replaced-url
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• 1998[16:58:00] <fox71> Does Debian need certain dependencies to recognize flash drives perse?
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• 2006[17:00:33] <afuentes> grandfso, that might be so, but sometimes it freezes at diferent times, and ssh session freezes as well
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• 2009[17:01:00] <afuentes> sometimes it even fails to start at all, as it freezes in the bootup screen
• 2010[17:01:23] <afuentes> i was hoping about the kenel being able to tell the computer to stop trying to suspend the computer
• 2011[17:01:52] <afuentes> because otherwise i guess theres not much i can do about it
• 2012[17:02:01] <afuentes> i cant even return the computer anymore u.u
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• 2014[17:02:18] <fox71> What version of Debian are we talking about?
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• 2016[17:03:00] <afuentes> it happened on stable and i manage it to upgrade it to testing
• 2017[17:03:00] <grandfso> afuentes: mine was or appeared 'freezing' when something display related happened, e.g. screen goes out cuz of power saving (or goes to sleep), or i plugged in hdmi cable. But it was fine with all other applications. (i'm talking debian testing based parrot os)
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• 2019[17:04:08] <afuentes> the computer stop replying to ping :(
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• 2021[17:04:17] <grandfso> uh
• 2022[17:04:25] <grandfso> So I won't go with testing after all :)
• 2023[17:05:03] <fox71> afuentes: So Stretch.
• 2024[17:05:12] <fox71> weird
• 2025[17:05:21] <afuentes> it happened on stable. if anything testing gave me a chance that something was already fixed u.u
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• 2027[17:05:54] <afuentes> but it wasnt...
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• 2036[17:09:49] <afuentes> I hate dealing with hardware and i hate laptops
• 2037[17:09:56] <fox71> afuentes: Maybe upgrade the kernel, I need to do that too, I guess
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• 2041[17:11:10] <afuentes> Im already running 4.18
• 2042[17:11:17] <afuentes> i guess i can upgrade to 4.19
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• 2047[17:13:00] <fox71> Hmmm
• 2048[17:13:05] <fox71> Try rolling back?
• 2049[17:13:10] <fox71> I gotta go, brb
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• 2062[17:24:28] <codehunter> I have a problem with executables. Everytime I double click on them I am asked what to open them with. When I create a shell script to run the program it will work. How can I fix this so I can just double click on a file to execute it?
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• 2068[17:26:40] <greycat> sounds like you are using some kind of graphical program, perhaps a "file manager". figure out which program you are using. then figure out how to read the documentation for that program. the figure out how to tell that program to do what you want.
• 2069[17:27:59] <codehunter> Yes I use Dolphin file manager
• 2070[17:28:22] <codehunter> I tried that and I am getting nowhere
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• 2073[17:29:11] <neilthereildeil> hi. is there any way to make a snapshot of a Virtual Machine disk file (not LVM volume) in Linux?
• 2074[17:29:45] *** Joins: ddp` (~ddp@replaced-ip)
• 2075[17:30:07] <nemo> neilthereildeil: which kind of virtual machine?
• 2076[17:30:11] <nemo> qemu? vbox? vmware?
• 2077[17:30:31] <neilthereildeil> Xen
• 2078[17:30:40] <blackflow> cp? :)
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• 2085[17:33:35] <neilthereildeil> does lvmcreate work for virtual disk files?
• 2086[17:33:49] <nemo> neilthereildeil: no effin clue then, but just for the hell of it I ran a search, and there was this thingy about snapshotting in xen... replaced-url
• 2087[17:33:54] *** Quits: eamanu (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 2088[17:34:01] <nemo> "This means you can create a snapshot of a volume containing lvm loopback images in your desired state, then run the virtual machine on the snapshot images instead."
• 2089[17:34:16] <nemo> dunno. that seems like your disk files *shrug*
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• 2091[17:36:09] <blackflow> LVM snapshots are a bit different kind of snapshot, they're not designed to be something you'd periodically do for, say, backup. they're for freezing the state of LVs so you can use other means to make a copy atomically, while the diffs go into a temporary "snapshot" volume.
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• 2095[17:37:49] <Nawab> when i dd my iso to the usb, what should i choose...sdb1 or sdb /
• 2096[17:37:51] <Nawab> ?
• 2097[17:38:27] <codehunter> Is there a way to close the terminal after running a program without killing the program?
• 2098[17:38:51] <Brigo> Nawab, sdb, the whole disk, no the partition.
• 2099[17:39:22] <Brigo> codehunter, nohup
• 2100[17:39:33] *** Quits: semeion (~semeion@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 2.3)
• 2101[17:39:43] <codehunter> What is nohup?
• 2102[17:39:57] <PaddyF> the opposite
• 2103[17:40:11] <PaddyF> why not wrap the program in a little bash script?
• 2104[17:40:13] <c|oneman> you use it before runing the programi instead of after, becasse linux is stupid
• 2105[17:40:16] <Nawab> Brigo, what do you mean?
• 2106[17:40:17] <neilthereildeil> nemo, blackflow: i am trying to snapshot so i can make a checkpoint of my VM at different points in time so i can revert to it later
• 2107[17:41:00] <blackflow> neilthereildeil: if I were you, I'd use ZFS and zvol for domU images. unfortunately I have no idea which xen tools can do that, very little experience with xen.
• 2108[17:41:53] <Brigo> Nawab, you have to copy the iso to the whole disk, sdb.
• 2109[17:42:00] <codehunter> PaddyF, if I create a bash script for every executable that will get really annoying really fast, nevermind fill up the drive.
• 2110[17:42:27] <Brigo> codehunter, man nohup, man
• 2111[17:42:47] <codehunter> Whatever that means.
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• 2113[17:43:11] <codehunter> Fine I am out of here.
• 2114[17:43:25] <blackflow> codehunter: it means read the nohup(1) manpage
• 2115[17:43:28] <PaddyF> the german man page of nohup is useless. and i am not surprised
• 2116[17:43:55] <PaddyF> codehunter: sorry for leading in the wrong direction
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• 2125[17:47:26] <c|oneman> nohup ./myprogram &
• 2126[17:48:38] <greycat> You almost never need nohup. It's a legacy from ancient System V systems, where programs launched in the background from a login session were killed upon logout. This is not the case in Linux, or indeed anything with any BSD ancestry.
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• 2131[17:50:59] <blackflow> greycat: actually that's a new (but configurable, methinks OFF by default in Debian) features of systemd logind.
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• 2134[17:51:24] <codehunter> I get no such file or directory or permission denied trying to use nohup
• 2135[17:51:47] <blackflow> it also caused this little drama: replaced-url
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• 2137[17:52:59] <greycat> blackflow: I have been told that systemd implemented something that WORKS A LITTLE BIT LIKE the old system V feature I am referring to, except that it doesn't use SIGHUP, so nohup is STILL irrelevent.
• 2138[17:53:03] <greycat> -ant.
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• 2140[17:53:33] <blackflow> yeah it's irrelevant, one has to use the systemd scoping facility/API for that (on systems where killing all user procs on logout is configured)
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• 2142[17:53:44] <neilthereildeil> nemo: i am going through that xen link you sent me
• 2143[17:54:03] <neilthereildeil> what is "/dev/vga/domU.S" in that example?
• 2144[17:54:19] <neilthereildeil> did they create a new deice in /dev?
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• 2166[18:06:04] <afuentes> is there any gui to create a debian usb live or should i stick to the disk destroyer?
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• 2169[18:07:08] <iosecure> cp file.iso /dev/sdx
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• 2172[18:08:00] <codehunter> The problem seems to be with KDE Plasma. When I tried in TDE, all works fine.
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• 2174[18:09:06] <afuentes> iosecure, should it be unmounted, right?
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• 2176[18:09:25] <iosecure> Yes. Both the iso and the device.
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• 2178[18:10:56] * afuentes crossfingers
• 2179[18:10:57] <afuentes> i hope dont mistype the device
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• 2183[18:11:52] <annadane> wait, what? "unmounted iso"?
• 2184[18:12:26] <iosecure> ISOs can be mounted as loopback devices.
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• 2186[18:12:44] <iosecure> Can't imagine that having one mounted that way would affect copying the ISO to a device, but...
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• 2205[18:26:11] <rwp> iosecure, It would be okay if the iso were mounted somewhere. The source is still read-only and available for another read of it.
• 2206[18:26:49] <iosecure> rwp: Makes sense, thanks.
• 2207[18:27:04] <rwp> Just confirming that you were correct.
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• 2222[18:38:13] <psiconauta> anyone know a VPS provider that allows tor traffic?
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• 2227[18:40:41] <afuentes> Well i think im going to install ubuntu in this laptop (Medion akoya E4241). It freezes all the time in debian and in ubuntu it does not. I tried with debian stable (4.9) and with debian testing (4.18). Ubuntu that im trying now is 18.04.1 (4.15)
• 2228[18:40:48] <afuentes> Before i do, is there anything i can do to help debian work on it?
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• 2230[18:42:22] <afuentes> also in ubuntu recognize and showed the battery %, sound and wifi worked out of the box. In debian i was able to make everything else working but the battery :(
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• 2238[18:45:45] <Brigo> afuentes, about the freezes i don't know, for the battery, sound an wifi, i guess you miss firmware from non-free repository.
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• 2240[18:46:16] <Brigo> you can try backports for using a newer kernel in stable, but it will be almost the same from testing.
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• 2244[18:49:00] <psiconauta> google's recaptcha on firefox is broken... on chrome is a lot easier (wonders why...)
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• 2249[18:50:54] <afuentes> Brigo, yeah i was able to find the missing firmware looking at the logs, i just didnt find the one of the battery. It was showing no error
• 2250[18:51:11] <afuentes> I tried a newer and an older kernel than the one that works on ubunut
• 2251[18:51:20] <afuentes> thats why im out of ideas
• 2252[18:51:53] <afuentes> But more than how to make it work, im asking if should i report the bug somewhere?
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• 2254[18:52:07] <afuentes> Ubuntu is doing something that debian is not, or the other way around
• 2255[18:52:32] <olric> hi i wanna learn that when i enter to same root with different session or with different user what will they have common. are they file different or can we it isolated from each other ?**
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• 2257[18:53:02] <afuentes> im using debian on all my machines, having one with ubuntu makes me feel a little dirty... but im tired of fighting this laptop tbh
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• 2259[18:53:39] <afuentes> i would like to help debugging the issue to somebody that knows whats up to be able to use it with debian in the future... im possible
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• 2261[18:53:42] <afuentes> if*
• 2262[18:53:42] <Brigo> afuentes, you can report the bug, it will help, definetly.
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• 2265[18:54:28] <afuentes> to the linux-image-amd64 package?
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• 2268[18:55:42] <Brigo> afuentes, there are several differents bugs, i think that package is the most fitting.
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• 2291[19:12:49] <nemo> neilthereildeil: heh. asking the wrong dude. it just looked promising
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• 2299[19:19:56] <broseph> What are the risks of updating to the newest stable kernel (4.19.12) in buster?
• 2300[19:20:55] <n4dir> might happen you will have to reboot and boot the old kernel, assuming the new one doesn't work.
• 2301[19:21:05] <greycat> broseph: that is not a "stable" kernel by any definition of that word
• 2302[19:21:26] <greycat> as far as any buster questions go...
• 2303[19:21:26] <broseph> Okay, so when kernel.org says it's stable, what do they mean?
• 2304[19:21:30] <greycat> !debian-next
• 2305[19:21:30] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
• 2306[19:21:38] <broseph> Yeah, I'm in there too.
• 2307[19:21:58] <broseph> You guys were talking about kernels, so it reminded me of that question. Sorry to be off topic.
• 2308[19:22:14] <nkuttler> broseph: upstream stable != debian stable
• 2309[19:22:19] <broseph> Right
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• 2311[19:22:39] <broseph> So when they stable, what distro are they assuming it's stable for?
• 2312[19:22:41] <greycat> I don't know what kernel.org means by "stable", but their most recent "longterm" branch is 4.14, which is the closest approximation to Debian's use of the word "stable".
• 2313[19:22:52] <broseph> Ah
• 2314[19:22:54] <broseph> Okay.
• 2315[19:23:27] *** Quits: behanw (uid110099@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
• 2316[19:23:38] <broseph> This is from kernel.org: mainline: 4.20-rc7 2018-12-16
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• 2318[19:23:57] <greycat> I'm guessing "mainline" approximates Debian unstable.
• 2319[19:24:03] <broseph> Okay, cool.
• 2320[19:24:10] <greycat> But you could ask a Linux channel if you need more precision.
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• 2322[19:24:30] <broseph> me nods
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• 2325[19:24:40] <broseph> Is there an "official" linux irc channel?
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• 2330[19:25:10] <greycat> ##linux has 2293 users
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• 2332[19:25:17] <broseph> Yeah
• 2333[19:25:21] <broseph> I'm in there too ;(
• 2334[19:25:23] <broseph> er ;)
• 2335[19:25:26] <broseph> Wrong parenthesis
• 2336[19:25:30] <n4dir> me thinks he asks about linux the kernel, and i think that would be #kernel
• 2337[19:25:40] <greycat> ##kernel has 247
• 2338[19:25:40] <broseph> Right. So many channels!
• 2339[19:25:47] <broseph> You guys rock, btw.
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• 2398[19:50:42] <AebianWeb> hi there. Whats the easist way to open up a TTY session from a windows box to a debian box? gnome is running on that debian box
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• 2400[19:50:58] <greycat> Install putty.
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• 2409[19:54:38] <PaddyF> when you disabled the root account during the installation but want to ssh-copy-id to root@ to be able to run remote backups later, what would you suggest?
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• 2412[19:55:11] <PaddyF> activate the root account again?
• 2413[19:55:20] <greycat> You can set a temporary password, do your stuff, and then restore the account to its previous password-less state.
• 2414[19:55:38] <greycat> Or you could move the various files around manually.
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• 2417[19:56:45] <mutante> what's the difference between ssh-copy-id and scp ~.ssh/ anyways
• 2418[19:57:02] <mutante> scp to non-root users, ssh, use sudo to copy it to root home?
• 2419[19:57:31] <PaddyF> with user+sudo the permissions are preserved?
• 2420[19:57:39] <greycat> as long as the files end up in the right place, with the right owner/group/perms, it doesn't matter how they get there
• 2421[19:57:43] <psiconauta> better to use sudo perhaps
• 2422[19:57:59] <mutante> ok, i see, it creates .ssh for you if it doesnt exist
• 2423[19:58:09] <greycat> You are, of course, expected to know the correct names, places, owners, permissions, etc.
• 2424[19:58:19] <PaddyF> on the other side i often "sudo -i" for convenience instead of doing multiple sudos
• 2425[19:58:35] <PaddyF> greycat: it seems complicated
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• 2428[19:59:23] <mutante> the easiest to me would seem to just ssh there, become root. open text editor and copy/paste the key via clipboard
• 2429[19:59:44] <mutante> there is more room for failure though, ,fair
• 2430[20:00:14] <PaddyF> its not just the command but the backups too
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• 2433[20:01:01] <PaddyF> i realize that i need to put more thought into it, thanks for the suggestions
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• 2435[20:01:18] <mutante> PaddyF: does backup mean rsync for you?
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• 2439[20:01:55] <PaddyF> indirectly, yes. i use unison
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• 2444[20:04:33] <mutante> PaddyF: i see. i would say: if it's a one-time thing.. copy/paste, if you are going to repeat this many times.. use something like puppet or build your own deb to install the key for you
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• 2485[20:25:23] <jak2000> hi all, good morning, where can download mysql-client for install offline, (i cant do a apt-update because the admin network cant do permission....) thanks
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• 2496[20:32:26] <idlemind> jak2000 you can always add the "dvd" as a repository like the old days
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• 2502[20:34:03] <rwp> jak2000, For continued use offline you might want to look at the apt-offline package. But for one time mysql-client install I would just copy the packages over and install them.
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• 2504[20:34:08] <Tarrasquero> replaced-url
• 2505[20:34:15] <Tarrasquero> o/
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• 2512[20:38:13] <jak2000> rwp i understand, but whre can download ?
• 2513[20:38:19] <Tarrasquero> any opinion?
• 2514[20:38:24] <rwp> apt-get download packagename
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• 2516[20:38:31] <rwp> From any other connected system.
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• 2531[20:41:15] <rwp> The binaries can also be downloaded from the web page. But that seems like the hard way to me. replaced-url
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• 2533[20:42:15] <rwp> The replaced-url
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• 2613[21:19:32] <neilthereildeil> if i just created an LVM volume in a file mounted in /dev/loop0, how do i safely disconnect it from my FS?
• 2614[21:19:59] <neilthereildeil> last command was an lvcreate to create a logical volume. i didnt create any file system on the volume
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• 2622[21:26:09] <mutante> win 9
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• 2624[21:26:20] <karlpinc> altker128: Best to ask the channel.
• 2625[21:26:34] <altker128> karlpinc: You mean re: ferm rules ?
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• 2627[21:26:42] <karlpinc> altker128: Yes.
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• 2630[21:26:56] <airos> Hi there, I need a little help with font install under debian. I purchased a really good looking font which is well installed on windows, but I can only see one of the variants when I'm on my debian
• 2631[21:27:10] <airos> with the same problem with like 10 other fonts
• 2632[21:27:13] <altker128> airos: That probably depends heavily on your desktop environment
• 2633[21:27:29] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: You don't have it attached to the fs, but you can deactivate with lvchange -an so then you can, say work toward removing the physical media.
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• 2635[21:28:33] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: you need to deactivate the vg. Then you can umount the loopback mounted file.
• 2636[21:28:44] <airos> altker128: okay, I was wondering if the problem came from the system or the software on it (wps and pinta do not recognize the fonts), if it's at the DE scale, it will be difficult :-(
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• 2640[21:29:32] <altker128> airos: I think this is one of those areas where Linux DEs lag behind MacOS & Windows.
• 2641[21:29:53] <neilthereildeil> karlpinc: does the word "remove" in lvremove, vgremove and pvremove mean i am deletingg/decomissioning the media, or rather i am just taking it offline?
• 2642[21:30:09] <airos> altker128: but I have two debian at my home, Kali and Deepin, both of them seems to fail with the fonts
• 2643[21:30:10] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: remove means gone forever.
• 2644[21:30:15] <neilthereildeil> ohhh
• 2645[21:30:23] <neilthereildeil> ok, i dont want data loss
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• 2647[21:30:24] <airos> altker128: okay, I will use my Windows VM for this ^^
• 2648[21:30:25] <altker128> airos: Which Desktop Environment?
• 2649[21:30:26] <neilthereildeil> i need this data
• 2650[21:30:26] <neilthereildeil> ok
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• 2652[21:30:51] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: Look at: vgchange -an ...
• 2653[21:30:55] <airos> altker128: kali is with a gnome shell DE and Deepin with Deepin DE
• 2654[21:31:10] <altker128> airos: KDE might work better
• 2655[21:31:32] <airos> altker128: okay I will try it now
• 2656[21:31:55] <airos> thanks
• 2657[21:32:32] <karlpinc> airos: Neither kali nor deepin is debian.
• 2658[21:32:35] <karlpinc> !based on debian
• 2659[21:32:35] <dpkg> Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare replaced-url
• 2660[21:33:04] *** Quits: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2661[21:33:50] <neilthereildeil> karlpinc: should i pass /dev/mapper/myVirtualGroup1-myLogicalVolume1 or /dev/myVirtualGroup1/myLogicalVolume1 to these *change -an commands?
• 2662[21:34:00] <airos> karlpinc: okay sorry
• 2663[21:34:16] <altker128> airos: Try a Debian LiveCD to see what works for you
• 2664[21:34:25] <Wulf> neilthereildeil: should be the same
• 2665[21:34:43] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: I forget. They'll probably both work. (But only if the command expects a logical volume. You need another path for volume groups.)
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• 2667[21:35:15] <Wulf> neilthereildeil: I think lvchange -a n /dev/vg/lv should be enough. Then you can use losetup -d /dev/loop123 afterwards
• 2668[21:35:52] <neilthereildeil> would i also need to use pvchange?
• 2669[21:36:01] <Wulf> don't think so
• 2670[21:36:29] <karlpinc> Wulf: I think the vg should be deactivated also. And doing that will also deactiveate the lvs.
• 2671[21:36:51] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: PVs don't activate. They're just "there".
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• 2673[21:37:04] <Wulf> karlpinc: might be easier if there are multiple LVs
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• 2675[21:37:32] <Wulf> I just tried it. Deactivating the LV is sufficient
• 2676[21:37:33] <neilthereildeil> ok. so my command for disconnecting the file would be something like this: lvchange -an /dev/myVirtualGroup1/myLogicalVolume1 #detach the logical volume && vgchange -an /dev/myVirtualGroup1 #detach the volume group && losetup -d /dev/loop0 #detach the loopback device
• 2677[21:37:38] <neilthereildeil> is that correct?
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• 2679[21:37:48] <Wulf> looks good
• 2680[21:38:02] <Wulf> neilthereildeil: if in doubt, try it on an unimportant system
• 2681[21:38:06] <karlpinc> Looks good to me too.
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• 2683[21:39:37] <neilthereildeil> Wulf, karlpinc: hmm im getting warnings and errors replaced-url
• 2684[21:39:44] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: But you can skip the lvchange because the vgchange takes care of it.
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• 2687[21:40:33] <Wulf> neilthereildeil: are the devices gone from /proc/partitions?
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• 2689[21:40:34] <Wulf> and /dev
• 2690[21:41:04] <Wulf> neilthereildeil: if losetup failed, I assume you called it before.
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• 2693[21:41:42] <neilthereildeil> Wulf: yea, its gone from dev and proc/partitions
• 2694[21:41:51] <Wulf> good, problem solved.
• 2695[21:42:33] <neilthereildeil> how would i mount that file again now?
• 2696[21:42:46] <Wulf> losetup -f file
• 2697[21:42:50] <Wulf> and then mount
• 2698[21:43:12] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: You should be putting a ; before the # character to start a new command. What you have seems to work, but I don't know why.
• 2699[21:43:13] <neilthereildeil> oh wow
• 2700[21:43:34] <neilthereildeil> i just ran the losetup command and the rest of the vg/lv showed up automatically....
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• 2702[21:43:56] <Wulf> it's magic!
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• 2705[21:45:08] <neilthereildeil> Wulf: how does that happen?
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• 2707[21:46:02] <Wulf> it's magic!
• 2708[21:46:17] <karlpinc> neilthereildeil: Something udev-ish is looking for magic numbers, and then comparing to what's in /etc/lvm/.
• 2709[21:46:18] <Wulf> or maybe linux simply scans new block devices
• 2710[21:46:45] <karlpinc> (eventually comparing)
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• 2713[21:48:04] <neilthereildeil> ok i see a bunch of metadata create in /etc/lvm
• 2714[21:48:17] <Wulf> neilthereildeil: I think it works without that
• 2715[21:48:47] <karlpinc> The kernel has to start the process by telling something to look for a PV.
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• 2722[21:53:41] <AebianWeb> greycat: do you have a guide? So I got Putty on that windows box now, I have the TTY settings open, do I need to do anything specific?
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• 2724[21:54:16] <greycat> The debian box should be running openssh-server. Just put in the IP address or hostname of the Debian system and make an ssh connection.
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• 2726[21:54:32] <greycat> Putty on Windows is both a terminal emulator and an ssh client, so it handles both pieces of that.
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• 2730[21:56:03] <AebianWeb> ah ok
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• 2733[21:56:59] <karlpinc> Wulf: You can move PVs between systems, so you're right. What's in /etc/lvm/ is not required.
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• 2739[22:00:35] <AebianWeb> greycat: I'm connected but its just the terminal. However I would like to get to the GUI screen aka TTY session (graphical) if you know what I mean
• 2740[22:01:17] <greycat> TTY means teletype which means terminal.
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• 2742[22:01:44] <greycat> If you actually wanted to see something NON-terminal, then you should have said so....
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• 2746[22:02:46] <greycat> I am absolutely the wrong person to try to help you with VNC or similar stuff.
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• 2749[22:03:38] <AebianWeb> ah ok thx
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• 2751[22:03:39] <karlpinc> AebianWeb: Getting ssh to work is not a bad first step. This lets you secure the connection. You can tunnel your GUI stuff through ssh.
• 2752[22:04:23] <DammitJim> if I am making a change to /etc/systemd/logind.conf
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• 2754[22:04:43] <DammitJim> do I need to reboot the whole machine or is there something else that I can run to "reload" that config?
• 2755[22:05:00] <karlpinc> DammitJim: systemctl daemon-reload
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• 2757[22:05:56] <karlpinc> DammitJim: It does sound like one of those things where you could easily wind up locking yourself out of the box....
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• 2761[22:06:41] <greycat> daemon-reload does *not* sound correct to me; more likely you'd either want to restart the specific service that uses this file, or do nothing.
• 2762[22:07:24] <karlpinc> greycat: Really? Anytime I frob the systemd configs I always seem to need a daemon-reload. Otherwise it does not read my changes.
• 2763[22:07:36] <DammitJim> I keep reading online... things like: "you might need to reboot your server"
• 2764[22:07:37] <shtrb> DammitJim, make sure you have physical access to the machine (a bug there and you are locked out)
• 2765[22:07:53] <DammitJim> it's a VM
• 2766[22:08:10] <DammitJim> and I have a snapshot of it
• 2767[22:08:11] <shtrb> Then you can always mount it and modify
• 2768[22:08:15] <shtrb> even better
• 2769[22:08:19] <DammitJim> ;)
• 2770[22:08:32] <DammitJim> but that still doesn't answer my question about what service I need to restart (if any)
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• 2775[22:09:35] <DammitJim> oh... systemctl systemd-logind restart
• 2776[22:09:54] <greycat> restart goes before the service name, but yeah, that sounds reasonable
• 2777[22:09:57] <karlpinc> Or maybe it's that I'm never editing a file directly, but always adding something to /etc/systemd/system/myservice/...
• 2778[22:10:03] <DammitJim> yeah, sorry
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• 2780[22:10:22] <greycat> and also yes, you use daemon-reload when you're modifying service definition files
• 2781[22:10:37] <karlpinc> DammitJim: Because as a rule you don't edit the original file, but write a new one which extends the config or overwrites only a part of it.
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• 2783[22:10:58] <greycat> logind.conf is "special"
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• 2787[22:11:32] <DammitJim> stop freaking me out greycat !
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• 2798[22:14:39] <karlpinc> Humm. Man page says you can make /etc/systemd/logind.conf.d/*.conf files.
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• 2889[23:12:46] <jak2000> mysql -h 192.168.105.66 -uroot -p say me: ERROR 2003 (HY000): Can't connect to MySQL server on '192.168.105.66' (111 "Connection refused")
• 2890[23:13:05] <jak2000> opening port
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• 2897[23:15:17] <greycat> connection refused means the process is not *listening* on that TCP port (or it's blocked by a kernel-level firewall, but more likely it's just not configured to listen)
• 2898[23:15:41] <greycat> Debian's mysql (or mariadb) does not listen on TCP by default; you have to configure it to do so.
• 2899[23:15:59] <jak2000> ok
• 2900[23:16:02] <jak2000> thx
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• 2914[23:23:20] <greycat> dpkg, connection refused =~ s/running/listening/
• 2915[23:23:20] <dpkg> OK, greycat
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• 2917[23:24:19] <greycat> dpkg, connection refused =~ s/VERY //
• 2918[23:24:19] <dpkg> greycat: OK
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• 2925[23:30:28] <SerajewelKS> i'm pretty sure mariadb does listen to TCP by default, but it binds to 127.0.0.1
• 2926[23:30:51] <SerajewelKS> which means only processes local to the machine can connect to it
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• 2965[23:50:23] <altker128> jak2000: You can use netstat -an to show what's listening on what
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• 2982[23:55:56] <InvisibleRasta> hello
• 2983[23:56:14] <InvisibleRasta> did sudo get removed from debian 9? i cant fid it in repos
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• 2986[23:58:19] <LtL> InvisibleRasta: no, it's in main, and optional.
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