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• 24[00:17:42] <InvisibleRasta> hey guys i keep gettign this mesage in tty. making it unusable. replaced-url
• 25[00:17:55] <InvisibleRasta> this is from dmesg but i get the same messages repeating in all ttys
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• 29[00:21:52] <edman007> InvisibleRasta, I would question your hardware...
• 30[00:22:07] <edman007> do you have questionable PCI cards?
• 31[00:22:24] *** Joins: kapil____ (uid36151@replaced-ip)
• 32[00:22:26] <edman007> it's either bad hardware or a bad driver, could try a newer kernel, but I doubt that will do anything
• 33[00:24:07] <edman007> maybe a PCI card isn't seated well?
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• 35[00:24:47] <GNU\colossus> it's pretty certainly bad hardware. you can make the pci driver shut up about it if it doesn't affect system stability, however.
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• 39[00:27:28] <snowgoggles> InvisibleRasta: try booting with pci=noaer
• 40[00:27:53] *** Joins: rue_mohr (~rue_mohr@replaced-ip)
• 41[00:28:06] <rue_mohr> is there any archive that will still have lenny packages?
• 42[00:29:13] <rue_mohr> is there any archive that will still have lenny packages?
• 43[00:30:03] <rue_mohr> is there any archive that will still have Lenny packages?
• 44[00:30:10] <nkuttler> rue_mohr: stop spamming
• 45[00:30:14] <rue_mohr> apt find lenny
• 46[00:30:16] <tacocat> replaced-url
• 47[00:30:33] <rue_mohr> nkuttler, no is a valid answer ya know
• 48[00:30:46] <nkuttler> and wrong
• 49[00:31:06] <rue_mohr> ok1
• 50[00:31:16] <rue_mohr> so, where can I find a lenncy archive?
• 51[00:31:44] <tacocat> follow the link I posted
• 52[00:31:55] <rue_mohr> its taken me in 3 circiles so far
• 53[00:32:15] *** Joins: RedSoxFan07 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip)
• 54[00:32:27] <rkw_inspiron> If you can't figure out a webpage you're not entitled to help here
• 55[00:32:47] <nkuttler> reading is hard
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• 58[00:33:31] <rue_mohr> no, it wasn't an ftp listing, so I clicked another link and got confused
• 59[00:33:48] <rue_mohr> src replaced-url
• 60[00:33:55] <EdePopede> do i miss the links to archive on both sitemap and /distrib/?
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• 62[00:34:17] <nkuttler> rue_mohr: go read the page you were linked to
• 63[00:34:22] <rue_mohr> I did
• 64[00:34:30] <nkuttler> ok
• 65[00:34:41] <nkuttler> try reading it again
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• 68[00:35:02] <rue_mohr> replaced-url
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• 74[00:35:34] <rue_mohr> is that the answer you meant?
• 75[00:35:40] <bites> now... continue reading.
• 76[00:35:43] *** Quits: fightthewalrus (~user@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
• 77[00:35:56] <bites> you are almost there.
• 78[00:36:16] <rue_mohr> deb replaced-url
• 79[00:36:19] <rue_mohr> try that
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• 82[00:37:40] <rue_mohr> huh invalid signatures, that could be an interesting problem
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• 85[00:38:24] <rue_mohr> hmm
• 86[00:38:33] <rue_mohr> I broke this good alright
• 87[00:38:56] *** Joins: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip)
• 88[00:39:15] <rue_mohr> can I hide the list of packages the system knows it has installed so it wont have version conflicts and just install overtop of whatever is currently in?
• 89[00:39:27] *** Joins: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip)
• 90[00:39:27] <rue_mohr> (the force flags cant fix this mess)
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• 93[00:40:04] <rue_mohr> oh thats right, were playing "2 hours of showing you where you could have found the answer instead of just telling ya" *sigh*
• 94[00:40:13] <rue_mohr> lets see then
• 95[00:40:17] <rue_mohr> the correct answer would be...
• 96[00:40:33] <rue_mohr> dont ask the support channel, they aren't there to answer questions.
• 97[00:40:37] *** Quits: runlevel7 (~runlevel7@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 98[00:40:37] <rue_mohr> hmm
• 99[00:40:44] <rue_mohr> frustrating
• 100[00:41:26] *** Quits: xet7 (~xet7@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 101[00:41:43] <altker128> rue_mohr: What are you trying to do?
• 102[00:41:53] <nkuttler> !fish
• 103[00:41:53] <altker128> rue_mohr: Lenny packages?
• 104[00:41:53] <dpkg> "Give a man a fish and you'll feed him a day. Teach him how to fish and he'll feed himself for the rest of his life." Instead of asking us to tell you exactly what to do, ask us which documentation to read, read them, then come back and ask specific questions which aren't covered.
• 105[00:42:04] <rue_mohr> well, it looks like this lenny machine has had newer packages installed on it
• 106[00:42:20] <rue_mohr> and now there is a cyclic dependency problem cause I want to update apt
• 107[00:42:27] <rue_mohr> apt-get install apt
• 108[00:42:59] <rue_mohr> nkuttler, "Give a man fire and he's warm for a day, set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life"
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• 112[00:44:39] <rue_mohr> altker128, I'v got this bucket stuck on my foot before
• 113[00:44:51] <rue_mohr> the fix is to do EVIL things
• 114[00:45:13] <rue_mohr> like starting a netboot, switching root fs, and installing newer packages overtop of things
• 115[00:45:28] <rue_mohr> then gradually upgrading everything till its all stable again
• 116[00:45:33] <rue_mohr> or copying binaries
• 117[00:45:46] <rue_mohr> I'm not sure I can do that with apt tho, I think apt has a lot of dependencies
• 118[00:45:52] *** Quits: hypn0 (~h@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 119[00:45:53] <rue_mohr> ... which ld can tell me...
• 120[00:46:02] <altker128> rue_mohr: Do you have to update the host machine to do what you want? Can you use a linux-container (lxc) ?
• 121[00:46:24] <altker128> I've never had good luck mixing packages between versions/distributions
• 122[00:46:25] <rue_mohr> ...not ld...
• 123[00:46:49] <rue_mohr> altker128, the processor cant take a container overhead
• 124[00:47:21] <rue_mohr> whats trickeir is that its an asterisk machine I'm trying not to wreck
• 125[00:47:27] <rue_mohr> (doing a bad job so far)
• 126[00:47:44] <rue_mohr> but I need to install apcupsd on
• 127[00:48:13] <altker128> Can you compile whatever new(er) packages from source rather than installing from packages?
• 128[00:48:34] <rue_mohr> I got apt pretty screwed up right now
• 129[00:48:46] <rue_mohr> it doesn't even want to tell me the time of day without -f install
• 130[00:48:54] *** Joins: snowgoggles (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 131[00:48:58] <altker128> Yeah...at this point I'd consider backing up the config files, putting in a new drive and then doing a fresh install and have it take over old duties
• 132[00:49:05] <rue_mohr> thats pain
• 133[00:49:14] <rue_mohr> more pain? dunno
• 134[00:49:30] <altker128> Also, there's next to no overhead for a Linux container
• 135[00:49:39] <rue_mohr> if I could just tell apt nothing is installed so that it gets everything, I could get past this
• 136[00:49:42] <altker128> It's not like virtualization/paravirtualization
• 137[00:49:49] <altker128> But anyway, that's my suggestion
• 138[00:49:53] <rue_mohr> altker128, for a cellery with 512M of ram?
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• 141[00:50:16] <tacocat> if apt / dpkg doesn't know what's installed, then it can't reliably manage packages
• 142[00:50:23] <rue_mohr> right,
• 143[00:50:26] *** Joins: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip)
• 144[00:50:29] <tacocat> which will probably leave you with more breakage
• 145[00:50:29] <EdePopede> uninstall/purge, then reinstall. there are good reasons why the system keeps a database of installed packages
• 146[00:50:33] <rue_mohr> I want it to install everyting it needs for apt
• 147[00:50:46] <rue_mohr> it wont uninstall or purge without -f install
• 148[00:50:57] <altker128> rue_mohr: Shouldn't matter. LXC basically is like chroot on sterioids. Each container still talks with the same (already loaded and running Linux kernel)
• 149[00:51:14] <rue_mohr> so, part of the problem is that its got packages it wants to finish installing before it'll move on
• 150[00:51:18] <tacocat> is it not possible to reinstall a newer OS version?
• 151[00:51:28] <EdePopede> rue_mohr: `apt-get -s install $package` will simulate and give you a list
• 152[00:51:28] <altker128> rue_mohr: A base Debian Stretch system booted is like 50-70 MB of RAM. A new container takes up 30 MB more of RAM? That's not much
• 153[00:51:43] <rue_mohr> it would take 8 - 12 hour days of rebuilding and configuring asterisk
• 154[00:51:49] <rue_mohr> but yes, I could reinstall
• 155[00:51:51] *** Joins: deehuck (~deehuck@replaced-ip)
• 156[00:52:03] <altker128> Why? Why not just backup your Asterisk configs? You could even build the exact same version you're running now for parity
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• 159[00:52:11] <altker128> Just restore the config files
• 160[00:52:31] <rue_mohr> oh this thing has gone thu more powersupplies and motherboards than you can shake a stick at, backups aren't the issue
• 161[00:52:53] <rue_mohr> and hard drives
• 162[00:53:03] <rue_mohr> I have a pile of them in the kitchen
• 163[00:53:03] <altker128> Sounds like it should be put out to pasture
• 164[00:53:40] <rue_mohr> I keep a tick-score on the front of the machine of all the hardware its eaten
• 165[00:54:06] <rue_mohr> maybe I'll have to put OS' on the list :)
• 166[00:54:13] <altker128> If the only thing it's doing is Asterisk, I can't imagine it's less work to do a fresh Debian install and then install Asterisk and copy the old config , but I'll stop
• 167[00:54:30] <tacocat> ^^ I concur
• 168[00:54:33] <rue_mohr> the asterisk install is as old as the debian install
• 169[00:54:44] <altker128> So?
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• 171[00:54:52] <rue_mohr> asterisk is COMPLETELY different now, and it WOULD take me over a week to reconfigure
• 172[00:55:04] <altker128> You can either A) Install a newer Asterisk or B) Just build the exact same version of Asterisk
• 173[00:55:08] <rue_mohr> I resume I can fix a dependency problem with debain in less than a week
• 174[00:55:11] *** Joins: winem_ (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 175[00:55:24] <rue_mohr> I cant build that version of asterisk again
• 176[00:55:31] <altker128> apt-get build-essential ; git clone <asterisk repo> ; ./configure ; make ; make install
• 177[00:55:44] <rue_mohr> software has dependencies, and I could never get all the right dependencies for that version ever again
• 178[00:55:54] <altker128> I doubt that.
• 179[00:55:58] <tacocat> assuming asterisk is the one in debian... if you haven't upgraded past lenny then you probably have tons of cves?
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• 181[00:56:06] <rue_mohr> well if I wanted to pour a month into it
• 182[00:56:18] <rue_mohr> its not, back then there was no debian asterisk packages
• 183[00:56:40] *** Quits: G3ph4z (~G3ph4z@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 184[00:56:47] <altker128> I have a hard time beliving it's that hard to compile asterisk . But I could be wrong
• 185[00:56:53] <tacocat> is it older or newer than what's in debian now?
• 186[00:57:08] <rue_mohr> :) if it were a completely new install/ setup
• 187[00:57:13] <altker128> I've been cross-compiling COMPILERS, dnsmasq and other programs for Linux & iOS in the past few weeks. A bit of work but not a month
• 188[00:57:26] <rue_mohr> you wouldn't have an issue, cause you would already be putting in a week to configure it
• 189[00:57:39] <rue_mohr> again, I'm looking for a package solution that takes less than a week to perform
• 190[00:57:46] *** Parts: z3rOaCid (acid@replaced-ip) ()
• 191[00:57:57] <altker128> Then install some GUI for Asterisk?
• 192[00:58:21] <rue_mohr> no, the gui cant utilize all of that asterisk can do
• 193[00:58:21] <altker128> Anyway, you'll figure it out
• 194[00:58:40] <rue_mohr> I just need to give apt a labotomy
• 195[00:58:46] <tacocat> either way it's going to be hard for us to help with an OS that's been eol for 6 years
• 196[00:58:49] *** Quits: deehuck (~deehuck@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 197[00:58:53] <rue_mohr> which means I need to know where it keeps its list
• 198[00:59:02] *** Joins: deehuck (~deehuck@replaced-ip)
• 199[00:59:04] <tacocat> _please_ for the sake of your system security upgrade to something supportable
• 200[00:59:20] <tacocat> otherwise you're really doing your clients / partners / whomever a disservice
• 201[00:59:25] <rue_mohr> its behind a firewall, securrity is irrelivent
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• 204[01:00:22] <rue_mohr> what I should do, is make sure apt stays up to date with all my systems
• 205[01:00:29] *** Quits: rkw_inspiron (~rkw_inspi@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 206[01:00:33] <tacocat> ..what?
• 207[01:00:58] <rue_mohr> if it weren't for lenny's apt not being able to handle the newer packages, I'd not have this bucket stuck on my foot
• 208[01:01:03] <altker128> hehe
• 209[01:01:51] *** Quits: roshanavand (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 210[01:01:51] <altker128> That's like saying "It's too bad HDMI doesn't support VGA, too bad it doesn't include analog video capability"
• 211[01:01:52] *** Quits: dear_amomynous1 (~dear_amom@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 212[01:02:02] <tacocat> yikes
• 213[01:02:02] <rue_mohr> even dkpg is confused, it cant understand the .xv compression in the data package
• 214[01:02:18] <rue_mohr> ah but if...
• 215[01:02:22] <rue_mohr> }:]
• 216[01:02:41] <tacocat> I would just call it a day and redo your setup
• 217[01:02:45] <altker128> ^^^
• 218[01:03:01] *** Joins: dear_amomynous1 (~dear_amom@replaced-ip)
• 219[01:03:06] <rue_mohr> I bet I can get dpkg to ram in wheezys apt package...
• 220[01:03:29] <tacocat> please stop
• 221[01:03:40] <rue_mohr> no, if its a writeoff anyhow, I'm full steam ahead
• 222[01:03:49] <rue_mohr> you just told me to reinstall
• 223[01:04:00] <rue_mohr> so nothing I do is not worth it
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• 240[01:14:24] <rue_mohr> I'm gonna bet its a lie that you need tar 1.23, I'm gonna hedge 1.2 is ok
• 241[01:14:54] <altker128> Anyone in here use ferm , the iptables firewall builder?
• 242[01:15:46] *** Quits: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 243[01:15:53] <altker128> Have a question on SNAT / masquerade rules
• 244[01:16:29] <rue_mohr> hahah the oldest I can quickly find is jessie, and they were already using the xv compression I cant handle
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• 246[01:16:50] <Voidablazer> Hey
• 247[01:17:03] *** Joins: Mr_Keyser_Soze (~Mr_Keyser@replaced-ip)
• 248[01:17:03] <rue_mohr> will anyone tell me when debs started using xv compression?
• 249[01:18:02] <Voidablazer> I am using Debian testing, and I did a minimal i3 install. I can startx as root but I can't do that as a normal user, I get xinit unable to connect to x server : connection refused
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• 253[01:19:38] <rue_mohr> somewhere between dpkg 1.14 and 1.17
• 254[01:19:40] <Voidablazer> Any idea?
• 255[01:20:01] <rue_mohr> Voidablazer, sorry, dunno
• 256[01:20:11] <rue_mohr> what have you tried so far?
• 257[01:20:13] <EdePopede> rue_mohr: seems wheezy used gz until ultimo, and that's when i gave it up
• 258[01:20:27] <altker128> Voidablazer: How did you install X? Did you install any desktop environments?
• 259[01:20:37] <EdePopede> no, iceweasel_38.3.0esr-1~deb7u1_amd64.deb has xz
• 260[01:20:39] *** Joins: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip)
• 261[01:20:56] <Voidablazer> altker128: I installed it from the command line. As root it works perfectly using i3
• 262[01:21:13] <Voidablazer> For some reason normal user has no permission to access x server
• 263[01:21:15] <altker128> Voidablazer: Right, I meant, did you just install xorg , or something like mate-desktop-environment ?
• 264[01:21:50] <Voidablazer> No I installed only xorg, i3, xinit
• 265[01:21:54] <Voidablazer> Very minimal here
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• 268[01:22:47] <altker128> Voidablazer: I think when you install a desktop environment, some additional scripts run that give the user permissions / rights
• 269[01:23:02] <Voidablazer> Oh it must be Debian specific
• 270[01:23:16] <Voidablazer> Because in other distros I don't have this issue with minimal install
• 271[01:23:25] *** Quits: dvs (~hibbard@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 272[01:23:40] <Voidablazer> What do I need to modify? Some text file must say who is allowed to startx
• 273[01:23:49] <Voidablazer> Or some special group
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• 278[01:26:09] <altker128> Voidablazer: replaced-url
• 279[01:26:28] <Voidablazer> Yeah possibly
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• 281[01:27:26] <rue_mohr> it looks like liblzma5 came in at jessie
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• 284[01:29:52] <rue_mohr> wait, wtf, the lzma5 package is compressed with the xv extenstion that you need liblzma to decompress
• 285[01:30:17] <rue_mohr> what the heck uncompressed it before that?
• 286[01:30:27] *** Quits: woshty (~woshty@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 287[01:30:39] <rue_mohr> so...
• 288[01:30:53] *** Quits: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 289[01:30:58] <rue_mohr> ok, if I force in the new dpkg without the lzma library...
• 290[01:31:11] <rue_mohr> then binary copy it over from another machine...
• 291[01:31:14] <altker128> rue_mohr: Maybe you can not post your minute by minute updates?
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• 293[01:31:41] <rue_mohr> I need feedback, there is no space left to write on the walls
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• 298[01:35:51] <JPT> today, i learned that lsb_release -a can return "Release: 7" for debian stretch if you forget to delete /etc/lsb-release.
• 299[01:35:53] *** Joins: xSmurf (~MrSmurf@replaced-ip)
• 300[01:36:53] <LtL> JPT: not here, never did that.
• 301[01:37:51] <JPT> Or maybe i messed up the upgrade process on two machines
• 302[01:37:54] <JPT> I don't know
• 303[01:38:04] <rue_mohr> :S ok, now I push in a random binary version of libc6..
• 304[01:38:26] <JPT> But i got a bit angry when this error propagated into my configuration management, which therefore pushed old apt repos to those machines. :<
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• 309[01:39:31] <altker128> I think the minimal Debian install should come with dnsutils & iputils-ping
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• 313[01:41:40] <Voidablazer> replaced-url
• 314[01:41:45] <Voidablazer> I have this issue
• 315[01:41:49] <Voidablazer> It's old bug
• 316[01:41:54] <Voidablazer> But it's similar
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• 324[01:44:11] <rue_mohr> damn I screwed the lib6 change
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• 326[01:46:13] <watchcat> Voidablazer: i usually just install xorg and a de (mate-core), no xinit, and startx works fine without root.
• 327[01:46:16] <rue_mohr> I recon at this point the system slowly comes down to its knees and dies
• 328[01:47:09] <rue_mohr> I wonder if I netboot can save my ass
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• 336[01:50:18] <hawken> o/ I've patched the aic7xxx driver a bit by looking at the changes in the vendor driver
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• 339[01:50:31] <altker128> hawken: Wow, SCSI?
• 340[01:50:37] <hawken> Put it in a github repo and would be nice with some feedback
• 341[01:50:38] <hawken> yea
• 342[01:50:48] <hawken> got an lto-4 drive and I want to play with it
• 343[01:50:51] <altker128> Nice
• 344[01:51:26] <hawken> The 29320LPE doesn't work with linux currently because linux sources have diverged and they missed stuff that apparently is needed with that card
• 345[01:51:36] <hawken> I tried to backport it back into the kernel
• 346[01:52:00] <hawken> I'm talking here because my system is debian and I'm trying to put it in a debian kernel to test it
• 347[01:52:21] <hawken> would be awesome with some code review, and I think I'll manage to test it myself but possibly help with that too
• 348[01:53:33] <hawken> it's a nice pciex1 card, placed just above my gtx1080ti lol
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• 351[01:54:19] <hawken> I'm just gonna plug it replaced-url
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• 355[01:54:59] <j0seph> hawken: sorry for the off-topic nature of this, but your name reminds me of an old video game I used to play of the very same name, haha
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• 357[01:55:26] <rue_mohr> yay restore initfs casue it bailed so many times on me!
• 358[01:55:38] <hawken> :P I had that name long before them!
• 359[01:56:28] <j0seph> should've copyrighted it back in 2010!
• 360[01:56:32] <j0seph> :)
• 361[01:56:40] <j0seph> anyways, carry on :)
• 362[01:56:47] <hawken> thanks :)
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• 373[02:02:46] <altker128> hawken: I think they do make USB<-->SCSI adapters
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• 375[02:03:08] <altker128> hawken: Does your driver build? Does it attach/work?
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• 380[02:05:40] <hawken> altker128: The upstream driver sort of works, I can write for a short while and then it freaks out, the changes are relatively minor so I expect it to work halfways or better :P
• 381[02:06:01] <altker128> Sorry about the freak out!
• 382[02:06:05] <hawken> I'm currently compiling so I don't know yet if it will crash
• 383[02:06:19] <hawken> what, are you sorry that a driver is not working? :3
• 384[02:06:23] <altker128> heh
• 385[02:06:29] <altker128> Cool to see people still working with SCSI
• 386[02:06:49] <altker128> I'm guessing a Fustion-MPT based device would probably also work ; I think they make PCIe versions of that
• 387[02:06:58] <hawken> I threw away the ultra320 pci hba I had because I thought I would never need it, and now I suddenly needed it..
• 388[02:07:03] <altker128> But where's the fun that ?!
• 389[02:07:18] <hawken> ebayed whatever comes in pciex1 form
• 390[02:07:19] <altker128> hawken: Well, I'm not near mine, but I'd send you the ones I have
• 391[02:07:35] <altker128> Fusion-MPT, PCI-X (that's 64-bit / 66 MHz)
• 392[02:07:49] <hawken> I think pci-x is backwards compatible a lot of the time?
• 393[02:07:56] <altker128> Absolutely
• 394[02:08:02] <altker128> It'd do 3.3V / 32-bit / 33 MHz
• 395[02:08:07] <altker128> But I'm not near it :/
• 396[02:08:11] <j0seph> Out of the loop here! Fill me in on what driver this is, what they are for, and an explanation of what that is. :)
• 397[02:08:12] <hawken> Which makes it my plan b, to get a known good one off ebay for pci-x
• 398[02:08:36] <altker128> What kind of capacity does the LTO have? Average throughput?
• 399[02:09:05] *** Quits: terminalator (terminalat@replaced-ip) (Quit: terminalator)
• 400[02:09:27] <hawken> j0seph: driver for Adaptec SCSI Ultra320 controllers, the one I have is pcie x1 and it's the newest of that series, which makes it not work :P
• 401[02:09:28] *** Joins: terminalator (terminalat@replaced-ip)
• 402[02:09:56] <hawken> I'm using it to play with LTO-4 tape drive. The LTO-4 tapes have a raw capacity of 800GB but advertise the double due to hardware compression support
• 403[02:10:04] *** Joins: xSmurf (~MrSmurf@replaced-ip)
• 404[02:10:15] <altker128> Nice! How much was the LTO-4 unit?
• 405[02:10:36] *** Joins: awal1 (~awal1@replaced-ip)
• 406[02:11:02] <hawken> Right now I only have an LTO-3 tape, which is half. The speeds are in theory 80MB/s for lto-3 and 120 for lto-4
• 407[02:11:06] *** Quits: Ruebezahl (~Alf@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 408[02:11:13] <hawken> the unit was, um free. work didn't want it
• 409[02:11:26] <altker128> Gotcha.
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• 411[02:12:25] <hawken> the thing with the drive is that it is made for SCSI and for SAS and I ended up with the SCSI type. Otherwise it would probably just hook up to normal SAS
• 412[02:12:46] <hawken> But the tape throughput will be the bottleneck anyway
• 413[02:13:07] <altker128> Oh, yeah SAS would have been cool
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• 424[02:18:20] <j0seph> hawken: Oh wow, nice! I have no idea what that thing is, but it seems pretty good. Good luck on your venture of making it work, if that's what you're doing!
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• 426[02:19:59] <j0seph> Oh, nevermind, I gave it a quick look-up. I know what it is now. :P
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• 431[02:22:48] <altker128> Question about iptables and masquerading
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• 446[02:28:38] <hawken> I can maybe reply to that altker128 :)
• 447[02:29:07] *** Quits: zeden (~user@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 2.2)
• 448[02:30:37] <altker128> hawken: Well, I'm using ferm to create my iptables rules. I want to enable IP MASQUERADING from a LAN_NET to the WAN_NET ; I'd rather not hard-code the WAN_NET IP in the rules
• 449[02:30:58] <hawken> I have no idea about ferm
• 450[02:31:09] <altker128> What about iptables directly?
• 451[02:31:19] *** Quits: traveltissues (~traveltis@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
• 452[02:31:37] <hawken> I think the usual way is iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -s lan_ip_range -o wan_interface -j MASQUERADE
• 453[02:32:27] <altker128> You don't have to specify the WAN IP, right?
• 454[02:32:30] <altker128> (not normally)
• 455[02:32:38] <hawken> no
• 456[02:32:48] <altker128> Yeah, trying to get ferm to do the same
• 457[02:33:01] <hawken> good luck :)
• 458[02:33:06] *** Quits: NerdTheThird (~NerdTheTh@replaced-ip) (Quit: sham1 sham1 ya, sham1 sham1 yam)
• 459[02:33:10] <altker128> Yeah...feels like square peg / round hole
• 460[02:33:16] <altker128> I think I'd be better off with iptables directly
• 461[02:33:23] <hawken> yesssssss, the new kernel booted
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• 465[02:35:47] <hawken> I see about 50MB/s write throughput to the lto-3 tape
• 466[02:35:57] <hawken> let's see if I can write the full tar before it breaks down this time
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• 469[02:36:25] <hawken> it's not huge, just 10 gigs or so
• 470[02:37:06] <altker128> hawken: With the iptables command, can you specify a physical interface for the LAN as well?
• 471[02:37:12] <altker128> hawken: Err, for MASQUERADE
• 472[02:37:24] <hawken> ff****
• 473[02:37:27] *** Quits: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 474[02:37:30] <hawken> tar: /dev/nst0: Cannot write: Input/output error
• 475[02:37:30] <hawken> tar: Error is not recoverable: exiting now
• 476[02:37:33] <altker128> I'm a bit worried about creating a masquerade rule for a private IP range
• 477[02:37:41] <hawken> [ 339.453573] st 6:0:3:0: [st0] Sense Key : Aborted Command [current]
• 478[02:37:41] <hawken> [ 339.453578] st 6:0:3:0: [st0] Add. Sense: Information unit iuCRC error detected
• 479[02:37:47] <hawken> usually this means check cables etc
• 480[02:37:51] <altker128> hawken: Yeah, termination too
• 481[02:38:01] <altker128> Quality cable? Good terminator?
• 482[02:38:04] <hawken> But I checked and the tape drive has builtin termination
• 483[02:38:11] *** Joins: kever (~quassel@replaced-ip)
• 484[02:38:11] <altker128> Is it enabled?
• 485[02:38:14] <hawken> it's the only thing on the bus
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• 487[02:38:38] <hawken> I think it's gonna do that automatically depending on how you plug it
• 488[02:38:43] <altker128> Termination isn't always enabled by default
• 489[02:38:44] <altker128> No
• 490[02:38:49] <hawken> ugh
• 491[02:38:52] <altker128> The device can sit anywhere on the cable
• 492[02:38:56] <hawken> know specifics about the hp 1840?
• 493[02:39:08] <altker128> Nothing on the SCSI interfaces tells it whether termination has occured
• 494[02:39:15] <hawken> I just put it at the end of the cable
• 495[02:39:18] <altker128> No, but I can check it's manual/DS if it helps
• 496[02:39:20] <altker128> Yeah
• 497[02:39:21] <altker128> That's not good enough
• 498[02:39:28] <hawken> sigh, figures
• 499[02:39:33] <altker128> Hey, this is a GOOD thing
• 500[02:39:35] <hawken> cool if it works
• 501[02:39:39] <altker128> Exactly :)
• 502[02:40:06] <hawken> I have had different problems though. One was this, the other one was some crap that I had to reload the whole module for. if I don't see any of the last ones, the driver may still be fixed now
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• 505[02:40:54] <altker128> No terminator is required for SCSI internal models (assumes use of terminated cable).
• 506[02:41:13] <hawken> this drive is internally mounted
• 507[02:41:21] <hawken> normal u320 cable from controller to drive
• 508[02:41:22] <altker128> Yeah
• 509[02:41:24] <altker128> Notice...
• 510[02:41:25] <hawken> but the cable is dumb
• 511[02:41:27] <altker128> (assumes use of terminated cable)
• 512[02:41:29] <altker128> yeah
• 513[02:41:33] <hawken> ouch
• 514[02:41:51] <altker128> Do you have an inline terminator handy?
• 515[02:41:57] <altker128> Again, I have all this, in a box, not near me
• 516[02:42:03] <bleb> just curious, anyone know why so many people run ubuntu for their servers rather than debian? i never understood the point, always thought of ubuntu as a desktop OS
• 517[02:42:11] <altker128> bleb: Probably don't know any better
• 518[02:42:29] <hawken> I don't but I used to have it :(
• 519[02:42:36] <bleb> i mean cr.yp.to runs ubuntu...
• 520[02:42:38] <hawken> I think it'll be cheap on ebay
• 521[02:42:42] <bleb> i'm like perplexed
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• 523[02:43:11] <hawken> " Does the tape drive need a terminator?
• 524[02:43:13] <hawken> If the tape drive is on a dedicated SCSI bus, it does not require a terminator."
• 525[02:43:26] <hawken> This is the reason I thought I was good
• 526[02:44:20] <altker128> I'd like to ask an iptables question again here about MASQUERADING
• 527[02:44:34] <altker128> The rule basically is from ip-range to an external interface
• 528[02:45:03] <altker128> Any concerns about restricting that ip-range to a given interface, or that shouldn't be required if one blocks non-routable IPs on WAN?
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• 534[02:46:45] <hawken> I think linux by default drops martian packets but I'm not completely sure
• 535[02:46:54] <hawken> If it does, you already got some kind of protection there
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• 538[02:47:43] <hawken> no that's wrong, I don't think linux drops martians
• 539[02:47:47] <altker128> hawken: There's a sysctl to do that
• 540[02:48:10] <hawken> then I'd maybe do it if the network is untrusted. for a home network I'd be happy with blocking invalid IPs from the internet
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• 543[02:48:39] <hawken> I think the sysctl is just to log them, not drop
• 544[02:49:03] <hawken> OOh
• 545[02:49:07] <hawken> you're looking for rp_filter
• 546[02:49:44] <altker128> Also reading about this : replaced-url
• 547[02:50:01] <hawken> replaced-url
• 548[02:50:17] <hawken> rp_filter has some misleading explanations on the internet, so I think this one is a better one to read
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• 554[02:54:12] <hawken> altker128: ordered a terminator now :)
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• 557[02:55:26] <altker128> hawken: YOU'VE BEEN MARKED FOR TERMINATION
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• 559[02:56:03] <hawken> nono, I'll be the one terminating!
• 560[02:56:56] <hawken> with that, I'll be terminating this day and I'll see you guys tomorrow (maybe) :)
• 561[02:57:03] <altker128> oh no!
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• 563[02:57:09] <altker128> How about some iptables help?
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• 567[02:58:47] <Voidablazer> altker128: found the answer
• 568[02:59:24] <Voidablazer> replaced-url
• 569[02:59:36] <Voidablazer> As of Ubuntu 16.04 (Xenial Xerus), you need to install and reconfigure the package xserver-xorg-legacy instead.
• 570[02:59:47] <Voidablazer> See wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Xorg#Rootless_Xorg The legacy wrapper needs more configuration: Edit /etc/X11/Xwrapper.config and add allowed_users=anybody needs_root_rights=yes – 
• 571[02:59:54] <Voidablazer> Did those two and it worked
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• 575[03:02:28] <altker128> Voidablazer: Are you on Ubuntu or Debian?
• 576[03:02:29] <hawken> altker128: the answer is probably that you don't need iptables rules to restrict interfaces to subnets as long as you use rp_filter... as for WAN, with a route of 0.0.0.0/0 depending on the implementation it could still allow spoofing so I'd add those rules anyway, if nothing else they give an idea about how often such packets arrive when you look at the counters :)
• 577[03:02:40] <Voidablazer> altker128: Debian
• 578[03:02:56] <Voidablazer> I didn't have this wrapper before, the legacy xorg one
• 579[03:03:06] <altker128> hawken: Question on BCP38 -- does one filter in ingress or egress? Any idea on that one?
• 580[03:03:24] <altker128> I think it's an amplification attach since the forged IP is the destination, not the source
• 581[03:03:27] <Voidablazer> According to Debian mailing list you need to put those two lines in that file which I did
• 582[03:03:27] <altker128> attack
• 583[03:03:36] <altker128> Voidablazer: Yeah, permissions issue :/
• 584[03:03:36] <Voidablazer> But I didn't have that package
• 585[03:03:54] <Voidablazer> When you install a DE you probably get it
• 586[03:03:56] <Voidablazer> I didn't
• 587[03:04:08] <Voidablazer> Still you have to create that wrapper config I think
• 588[03:04:11] <altker128> Yeah, makes sense. I've only done X on Debian with a DE
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• 637[03:42:17] <annadane> is there a way to set another key than tab for bash completion? i predominantly use xfce4-terminal but don't think that matters
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• 647[03:46:57] <awal1> annadane, why do you want to change it?
• 648[03:47:44] <annadane> really just due to laziness and wanting two keys for completion on either side of the keyboard, though that's dumb in retrospect, it'd just get in the way
• 649[03:47:56] <awal1> you know, you have alternatives: Esc and Ctrl-i does same job as Tab
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• 651[03:48:06] <blastwave> test test ...
• 652[03:48:10] <blastwave> okay that works ...
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• 656[03:48:59] <blastwave> so systemctl says that lightdm failed to start and complains that it can not get a User List from orc.freedesktop.Accounts ... what the heck ?
• 657[03:49:20] <blastwave> what is that complaint ?
• 658[03:49:29] <annadane> are you on stable?
• 659[03:49:44] <annadane> i've had that before with sid and using nouveau...
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• 662[03:51:29] <annadane> and is this nouveau, if you have an nvidia card?
• 663[03:51:45] <awal1> annadane, Esc is two times
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• 665[03:53:44] <awal1> you can use Tab or Esc(2 times) for left side of keyboard and right Ctrl + i for right side of keyboard
• 666[03:53:54] <n4dir> annadane: fiddling around, you could set it in /etc/inputrc. i tried this: "\e[5~": complete
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• 668[03:54:07] <annadane> eh i'll leave it as is
• 669[03:54:13] <n4dir> which was set to: #"\e[5~": history-search-backward
• 670[03:54:16] <n4dir> before.
• 671[03:55:16] <blastwave> hold on .. need to reboot .. this is an arm7 board and it was working .. this is stretch
• 672[03:55:22] <blastwave> going to do a quick reboot
• 673[03:55:24] <blastwave> brb
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• 675[03:55:59] <annadane> !arm7
• 676[03:56:23] <joepublic> armhf, perhaps?
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• 678[03:56:37] <awal1> if fact, in your .inputrc put whatever you want . example: "menu: complete", annadane
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• 680[03:56:46] * annadane still remembers installing debian for the first time, "what architecture am i using????????" "what processor do you have" "intel" "amd64"
• 681[03:56:55] <awal1> where 'menu' is menu key and 'complete' referse for completion
• 682[03:57:25] <annadane> i know arm71 is an arch
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• 685[03:58:57] <blastwave> well .. nope .. that didn't work
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• 689[03:59:55] <annadane> blastwave, do you have an nvidia card (sorry, i don't know how arm works), if so maybe try #nouveau
• 690[04:00:03] <annadane> that's probably not helpful
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• 692[04:00:36] <blastwave> no no .. this is an ASUS TinkerBoard
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• 694[04:00:48] <blastwave> I could run lspci here ...
• 695[04:01:14] <blastwave> nope .. that doesn't work ... hrmmm
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• 697[04:02:05] <blastwave> well .. the ASUS folks made a nice arm7 board with a quad core rockchip
• 698[04:02:18] <blastwave> no idea what the graphics is ... have not seen it work
• 699[04:03:31] <blastwave> I think what I shall do is give up ... re-flash the sdimm and start over
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• 701[04:04:15] <n4dir> before that you could try to run startx instead of ligthdm (or a different display-manager).
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• 704[04:04:24] <blastwave> oh .. beauty
• 705[04:04:40] <blastwave> I am actually using the unit right now ... using irssi
• 706[04:05:07] <blastwave> however I am certain that the pseudo ttys will keep working fine as I mess with startx
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• 708[04:05:18] <quantumman> hello, so I installed the kernel: sudo apt-get install linux-headers-amd64 linux-headers-4.17.0-0.bpo.1-amd64 however when I do uname -a: Linux ethos 4.18.0-0.bpo.3-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.18.20-2~bpo9+1 (2018-12-08) x86_64 GNU/Linux
• 709[04:05:56] * blastwave ponders a xorg conf file
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• 711[04:06:36] <blastwave> anyone with a browser know what options I can pass to startx to get an xterm on the root window ?
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• 713[04:07:21] <n4dir> usually "startx" will start the default window-manager or desktop environment.
• 714[04:07:51] <n4dir> I think the content of ~/.xinitrc would be "exec xterm &" if you want an xterm. (might be the & is wrong)
• 715[04:08:05] <n4dir> i'd first try a simple startx, as said.
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• 719[04:09:57] <blastwave> n4dir: well startx wants to start 1.19.2 however gives can not connect to X server
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• 722[04:10:43] <blastwave> n4dir: I think ... I want rc scripts back ... I don't want systemctl anymore ... can we get that ? :-)
• 723[04:10:58] <n4dir> sure not an expert, but my guess would be then it might well be a missing/wrong graphics driver.
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• 725[04:11:04] <n4dir> ha ha. yes, that would be nice.
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• 728[04:11:52] <blastwave> n4dir: been working on systems for thirty years and I am happy with TWM or a trivial root window X but at the moment lightdm is borked and this is annoying as hell to debug
• 729[04:11:53] <n4dir> the web proposes to use "hwinfo --gfxcard" or "cat /proc/devices" without lspci, on arm
• 730[04:12:08] * blastwave tries that
• 731[04:12:09] <n4dir> also "dmesg"
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• 734[04:12:42] <n4dir> i decided way back to give up on display-managers and just use startx. All they offer for me is problems.
• 735[04:13:23] <blastwave> well there isn't anything special in dmesg ... it all looks great ... I am using the machine now
• 736[04:13:34] <n4dir> however systemctl/systemd does it, make sure lightdm is not running (before service ligthdm stop)
• 737[04:13:54] <blastwave> clearly I have multi-user and network and all the good stuff ... just no gui or X and am working on that
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• 744[04:14:56] <n4dir> if there is, look at ~/.xsession-errors. Also /var/log/Xorg.log (both might be called a bit different).
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• 746[04:15:14] <blastwave> I think I shall grab my laptop which has stable on it and I can check the ASUS specs ... however video is working as I am looking at it now ... just not graphical startup
• 747[04:15:15] <n4dir> usually the error message on the screen after "startx" is clear enough though.
• 748[04:15:26] <blastwave> oh right ... one sec ..
• 749[04:16:12] <n4dir> makes no sense, but for troubleshooting you could try "startx" as root, or quickly create a test-user and try it as him.
• 750[04:16:18] <n4dir> just shooting ideas.
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• 752[04:18:08] <n4dir> !nodm
• 753[04:18:08] <dpkg> In systemd, "systemctl set-default multi-user.target", or remove the DM package(s) with "aptitude remove gdm3 kdm lightdm lxdm nodm sddm slim wdm xdm". "echo false >/etc/X11/default-display-manager" will also disable the DM, or just hit ctrl-alt-fN to get to a console. nodm is the name of a minimal/automatic display manager (replaced-url
• 754[04:18:22] <blastwave> all good ideas and I did try as root and thik I found the issues
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• 758[04:18:30] <n4dir> ah, cool then.
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• 760[04:18:41] <blastwave> I am running on the console now ... working fine with irssi
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• 762[04:19:18] <n4dir> which DE do you use, btw?
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• 764[04:19:31] <blastwave> lxde
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• 766[04:19:36] <n4dir> in other words: is lightdm a must?
• 767[04:19:36] <blastwave> somethng minimal
• 768[04:19:49] <blastwave> hrmmm ... I dunno .. is it :-)
• 769[04:19:54] <blastwave> I am happy to kill it
• 770[04:19:57] <n4dir> i read about problems with lightdm pretty often the last weeks, iirc.
• 771[04:20:09] <blastwave> not sure .. but the real issue may be ... deeper .. a bad lib
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• 774[04:20:31] <blastwave> see replaced-url
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• 776[04:21:03] <blastwave> pretty sure I am looking at a re-install from scratch here
• 777[04:21:33] <blastwave> I did run apt-get update ... upgrade and that pulled in a deck load of updates
• 778[04:21:41] <blastwave> well damn
• 779[04:22:01] <blastwave> time to fish out the laptop and wipe the sdimm
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• 782[04:23:53] <n4dir> ##linux seems slightly more active at this time of the day (or night here)
• 783[04:23:59] <blastwave> pardon me ... switching over to laptop
• 784[04:24:06] <n4dir> yup, good luck.
• 785[04:24:11] <blastwave> brb
• 786[04:24:19] <blastwave> the laptop is debian stretch
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• 800[04:29:18] <blastwave> okay .. on laptop now
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• 802[04:29:56] <blastwave> pulled the sdimm from the ASUS board .. will flush it with dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/foobar bs=8192 count=1048576
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• 806[04:31:45] * blastwave sees mmcblk0: mmc0:59b4 NCard 29.5 GiB
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• 813[04:34:43] <n4dir> hm. the debian wiki says the tinkerboard is similar to the asus C201, and has some info there. replaced-url
• 814[04:34:59] <n4dir> says the ***-fbdev driver should work, but mentions a different one.
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• 817[04:37:41] <blastwave> nah .. not worth debugging ... I am going to drag down a new OS image and start over
• 818[04:37:48] <blastwave> see replaced-url
• 819[04:37:55] <blastwave> there is Android there also
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• 821[04:39:01] <blastwave> ooohh .. .shiney new version dated 2018/11/22
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• 825[04:40:07] <blastwave> I could try Android .. but I have quite enough of that on my cell phones
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• 827[04:40:54] <n4dir> see, here it seems pretty silent right now (and i for one am sure not the person to say much bout graphics :-) ). Try ##linux
• 828[04:41:29] <n4dir> there probably is a channel for debian-arm or arm in general too. Here would be fine, sure, but right now it's silent.
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• 841[04:48:40] <blastwave> n4dir: not a problem ... fairly sure I know what mistake I made ... mixed versions of packages
• 842[04:48:53] <blastwave> always a fine idea to wipe the disk and start over
• 843[04:49:39] <n4dir> also known as : The Sledge Hammer method (oh yes, that TV series *is* old ...)
• 844[04:50:35] <joepublic> "mixed versions of packages" describes lots of fresh manufacturer images for arm* devices
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• 846[04:51:46] <blastwave> well to be more clear I had the initial "linaro" Debian port and that worked fine ... then .. smarty pants that I am .. Ipointed sources.list at an arm repo for Debian bonestock and dragged in updates ... oops
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• 848[04:52:08] <blastwave> so no surprise a few things went sideways
• 849[04:52:23] <blastwave> really I wanted to build my own kernel on this thing ... never got that far
• 850[04:52:47] <blastwave> also I am really not thrilled that ASUS made a 32-bit board where a 64-bit board would have been nice
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• 855[04:55:20] <blastwave> anyways quad-core ARM Cortex-A17 with 4K video ? Believe it when I see it
• 856[04:55:39] <joepublic> wonder how many frames per day
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• 858[04:56:28] <blastwave> well ... it does 1920x1080 wonderfully well
• 859[04:56:31] <altker128> Interesting to see if that SoC is supported by all opensource drivers
• 860[04:56:48] <altker128> blastwave: There are tons of such SoCs that support 4K becuase the decoding is done in HW
• 861[04:57:04] <altker128> blastwave: iPhones, iPads , AppleTVs for example
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• 863[04:57:24] <blastwave> hrmm well I see in the notes on this release Merge Upstream/Rockchip (commit: 40e8774, kernel: 4.4.132
• 864[04:57:50] <blastwave> also Upgrade Mali driver, Add OV5647 overlay whatever that is
• 865[04:58:08] <altker128> OmniVision, probably a camera support
• 866[04:58:31] <blastwave> hrmm .. something I may never use
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• 868[04:59:00] <blastwave> however I do have a Microsoft camera here somewhere ... in a box ... never used more than once ... should be USB 3.0
• 869[04:59:30] <blastwave> or ... whatever it is ... USB 2.0
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• 871[05:00:06] <altker128> n4dir: Nice reference to Sledgehammer! :)
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• 873[05:01:00] <n4dir> :-) youtube proposed it to me these days. laughing so hard.
• 874[05:01:35] <altker128> It was a great show
• 875[05:01:59] <n4dir> not sure if i watched it at all back then.
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• 892[05:15:24] <blastwave> well ... making good progress with this ASUS Tinkerboard Rockchip RK3288 thing ... should have it up and running sooonnish ... need to tweak /etc/network/interfaces etc
• 893[05:16:20] <altker128> What are your plans for it?
• 894[05:16:21] <altker128> *HD & UHD video playback at 30 fps on Tinker Board is currently only available via the included media player. Third-party video players and applications may not offer hardware acceleration, which will result in limited or unstable playback performance. Please refer to the FAQs for more information.
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• 898[05:19:09] <blastwave> altker128: just testing ... really I'd like off the shelf Debian testing to run on it ... not sure if that is reasonable
• 899[05:19:59] <blastwave> altker128: The rpi folks seems to really have the market share for arm stuff and the ASUS folks were just oddball enough that stock debian may not work
• 900[05:22:21] <altker128> Asus just soldered down a Rockchip SoC...don't think they did much here
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• 902[05:23:15] <altker128> Aside, some of the newer wireless routers have some pretty powerful CPUs, some 64-bit capable.
• 903[05:24:06] <blastwave> amazing what fits on a credit card sized board
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• 905[05:24:31] <blastwave> well ... I am going to try to boot this thing ... see what happens .. pardon me .. need to move a network cable
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• 917[05:30:23] <blastwave> okay .. it is running with graphical desktop etc
• 918[05:30:47] <blastwave> automagically logs in as some user named linaro
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• 995[06:28:09] * blastwave returns
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• 997[06:28:27] <blastwave> this ASUS TinkerBoard is a seriously weird borked Debian custom config
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• 1041[06:58:11] <Gigglebyte> Can someone tell me if the Libreoffice in backports is version 6? It has this number in front of it and I don't know what it means: 1:6.1.3-1~bpo9+2
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• 1043[06:58:48] <bites> the one in front is called epoch and is not part of the upstream version number.
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• 1276[10:26:04] <haircode> Does anyone know why a package might not be available on two separate computers, both running unstable? I need libwebkitgtk1.0-0. apt-cache search/apt search both find it on all machines but one - using the same reporistory on both (replaced-url
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• 1278[10:27:04] <at0m> haircode: and both recently apt update'd ?
• 1279[10:27:20] <haircode> at0m: yes
• 1280[10:27:33] <at0m> also, irc.oftc.net/debian-next
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• 1282[10:27:50] <at0m> that channel supports testing/sid
• 1283[10:28:22] <haircode> at0m: ok, thank - will ask over there
• 1284[10:28:29] <haircode> at0m: thanks
• 1285[10:29:28] <at0m> haircode: if you don't want to debug (would be a pitty since running unstable, so expect some of that) just copy over the deb eh
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• 1288[10:30:23] <haircode> at0m: yeah, I will probably do that. This is first step in me debugging so happy to do that.
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• 1319[11:01:34] <no_gravity> Good Morning
• 1320[11:01:44] <no_gravity> What's a good way to list all files in the current dir and the number of files (recursively) they contain?
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• 1325[11:04:45] <diogenes_> no_gravity, ls -a -R but run: ls --help for more info
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• 1327[11:05:16] <no_gravity> diogenes_: That's not what I mean. Let me explain ...
• 1328[11:05:22] <no_gravity> Say current dir has two directories, pics/ and songs/.
• 1329[11:05:26] <no_gravity> Then the output I am looking for is: pics: 32, songs: 20.
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• 1331[11:05:31] <no_gravity> Telling me that pics contains 32 files and songs 20.
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• 1333[11:05:43] <diogenes_> i see
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• 1338[11:07:19] <at0m> no_gravity: wc -l prints line count
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• 1340[11:12:21] <no_gravity> Ok, so this will go into my bashrc:
• 1341[11:12:23] <no_gravity> alias dirFileCount='for i in *; do echo -n "$i "; find $i | wc -l; done'
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• 1344[11:15:31] <blackflow> no_gravity: might wanna add -type f to find, if you wanna count files only
• 1345[11:16:06] <no_gravity> blackflow: I'm fine with counting whatever type.
• 1346[11:16:27] <no_gravity> I'm working on slimming down the Laravel default app. Every file I get rid of is good.
• 1347[11:16:37] <no_gravity> And I use dirFileCount to see my progress.
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• 1414[12:12:12] <kirk781> Debian has an anti harassment team
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• 1430[12:22:38] <blackflow> Well, I never!
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• 1433[12:23:34] <joze> I have not the newest debian on that far remote machine
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• 1435[12:23:58] <joze> upgrading is a hassle I think
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• 1438[12:24:35] <blackflow> jessie -> stretch went smoothly for me.
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• 1441[12:25:09] <joze> what about thew configs?
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• 1443[12:26:14] <blackflow> what about them? of course, you should back up all the data and be prepared in case you need full reinstallation.
• 1444[12:26:34] <joze> hassleed the hoffd
• 1445[12:26:39] <blackflow> I'm sure that depending on what software you have installed, there may be edge or less stable cases.
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• 1454[12:34:20] <areyouloco> i guess updating from oldstable to stable should go smooth
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• 1456[12:34:41] <areyouloco> but yeah backup everything. I learned that
• 1457[12:34:58] <joze> hassletanious!
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• 1459[12:35:33] <blackflow> I successfully upgraded jessie to stretch and before that, wheezy to jessie. and before wheezy I ran new installations from scratch.
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• 1479[12:48:45] <epicmetal> How do I select all recommended packages in a sane way? I know I can use aptitude's Audit Recommendations, but that lists all alternatives instead of the alternatve that would normally be selected. For example, it lists a ton of aspell-foo packages when normally only aspell-en would be selected.
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• 1481[12:49:18] <epicmetal> i.e. "install the packages that would already be installed if I had never set APT::Install-Recommends to false"
• 1482[12:49:41] <epicmetal> apt-get install -f doesn't seem to help either
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• 1510[13:09:42] <Voidablazer> Where is dbus-launch in Debian?
• 1511[13:09:46] <Voidablazer> I can't find it
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• 1513[13:10:28] <bzed> Voidablazer: replaced-url
• 1514[13:10:33] <bzed> Voidablazer: or use apt-file
• 1515[13:11:24] <Voidablazer> Seems it doesn't exist
• 1516[13:12:32] <jasabella> it's in dbus-x11
• 1517[13:12:44] <bzed> Voidablazer: seems you can't use a web form properly :P replaced-url
• 1518[13:13:30] <Voidablazer> jasabella: does this thing exist in testing? I have dbus with all its utilities but for some reason /bin/dbus-launch is missing
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• 1520[13:14:09] <jasabella> $ which dbus-launch : /usr/bin/dbus-launch
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• 1522[13:14:34] <jasabella> and yes it's in testing
• 1523[13:14:47] <jasabella> see the buster link on bzed's page?
• 1524[13:16:43] <Voidablazer> Oh I found it
• 1525[13:17:10] <Voidablazer> That package page is a bit confusing
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• 1528[13:18:17] <jasabella> how so?
• 1529[13:18:22] <Voidablazer> By the way is it recommended to use apt-get or apt for system maintenance?
• 1530[13:18:29] <Voidablazer> I know apt is a front-end
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• 1532[13:19:30] <Voidablazer> jasabella in comparison with the package search pages of other distros it took me a while to figure how to search
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• 1534[13:19:42] <jasabella> apt combines several apt-* commands in one, i believe the offical advice is use whatever you're comfortable with
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• 1538[13:21:12] <Voidablazer> Also another question
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• 1540[13:21:43] <Voidablazer> Is it possible to ditch systemd in Debian? I am doing a very minimal install net install or with a small base system
• 1541[13:22:03] <Voidablazer> I prefer something like open rc or runit or sys v init
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• 1543[13:23:31] <Voidablazer> I mean theoretically I can in Linux. But the installed packages have to offer their init scripts in ways they can work with my new unit init system
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• 1548[13:27:14] <blackflow> Voidablazer: yes. also see: Devuan.
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• 1557[13:35:23] <Voidablazer> I found dbus-launch in that package and used this in my.xinitrc
• 1558[13:35:30] <Voidablazer> exec ck-launch-session dbus-launch --sh-syntax --exit-with-session openbox-session
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• 1560[13:36:47] <Voidablazer> Pulseaudio still doesn't work. And ck-list-sessions says failed to connect to dbus daemon, failed to connect to socket /var/run/dbus/system_bus_socket no such file or directory.
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• 1566[13:40:00] <blackflow> Voidablazer: I'd suggest you perhaps go with Devuan. According to Devuan..... devs.... switching init isn't as simple, and is the whole reason they forked and took so much time to come out with the first release.
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• 1568[13:41:40] <Voidablazer> Will check it out
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• 1655[14:52:26] <SebastianThorn> Hello everyone, i have a server that has lost eth0 from "ip a", where might it have gone? im running debian 8 in this machine
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• 1658[14:54:41] <epicmetal> SebastianThorn: zless /usr/share/doc/udev/README.Debian.gz
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• 1661[14:57:10] <tomreyn> either that or it went on winter holidays.
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• 1669[15:01:57] <SebastianThorn> seems like it went away a long time ago ;)
• 1670[15:02:47] <SebastianThorn> eth0 i defined in the 70-... rule and has allow-hotplug in /etc/network/interface
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• 1672[15:03:56] <SebastianThorn> havn't touched the system in 2 years, if the interface "broke" could i see that somewhere?
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• 1691[15:21:13] <Waxhead> howdy , the survey for the debian buster artwork website is a bit screwed. Both on my phone (Android) and my box (Debian (could you guess) with SeaMonkey installed the selections are stacked on top of each other. Do I need a MICROSOFT browser to be able to use this?!
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• 1706[15:26:51] <SebastianThorn> on a cold-boot, the led's in the interface blinks until the login shows, they do not blink on a reboot
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• 1734[15:48:25] <marataziat> Hi
• 1735[15:48:51] <marataziat> How to run a python script every 2 seconds? Can I use cron for that?
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• 1747[15:55:38] <MichaelOF> marataziat: systemd timer?
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• 1750[15:56:22] <MichaelOF> marataziat: or a simple "while sleep(2)" wrapper? :-)
• 1751[15:56:46] <marataziat> MichaelOF, I think systemd would be better :) replaced-url
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• 1754[15:58:16] <marataziat> Google cloud Compute Engine internet speed is so amazing! It's 50 MB/s with apt install on debian.org !!
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• 1768[16:03:30] <marataziat> What is this "Type" in systemd's [Service]? Type=oneshot
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• 1779[16:07:28] <edman007> marataziat, I suggest reading the man page for systemd...
• 1780[16:07:37] <marataziat> ok
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• 1785[16:09:02] <annadane> i don't find 'oneshot' in my man page
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• 1788[16:09:39] <annadane> replaced-url
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• 1790[16:10:16] <jasabella> (man systemd.service)
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• 1792[16:10:38] <annadane> right, well, i had looked under man systemd
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• 1795[16:10:53] <annadane> systemd.service indeed has it
• 1796[16:11:16] <EdePopede> something as complex as systemd should have a landing page (yes, website language)
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• 1803[16:12:33] <jasabella> i think the systemd manpage sort of is the landing page, it referes to systemd.service(5)
• 1804[16:12:49] <jasabella> (i.e. man 5 systemd.service)
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• 1809[16:13:43] <EdePopede> at the end, yes. default manpage layout, but usually users don't first scroll down to see if there's more on what they expect on the page they were requesting.
• 1810[16:13:54] <jasabella> man -K might help sometimes
• 1811[16:14:51] <EdePopede> like there is cron and crontab, but crontab is clearly for the file, cron for the program. a clear distintion, not so easy in systemd... things
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• 1814[16:15:26] <jasabella> the only thing i've come to expect with manpages is that, aside from the standardised sections, it's hugely dependent on the package/software as to how they're divided into topics/subtopics :(
• 1815[16:15:39] <EdePopede> `man -K systemd` opens inxi here and then continues with other stuff. not really related
• 1816[16:16:24] <jasabella> the number can give you a hint sometimes
• 1817[16:16:50] <EdePopede> the best solution i've seen so far is a local doc server (installed it years ago on suse, but i guess debian has one too)
• 1818[16:17:00] <jasabella> 5 is for config files, 1 and 8 are commands
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• 1820[16:17:34] <EdePopede> was one of the things i memorized when i started with linux. turned out to be a good idea :)
• 1821[16:17:58] <jasabella> if i dont find what i want straight away i usually check the SEE ALSO part
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• 1823[16:19:10] <EdePopede> one of my problems with manpages is the approach. i'm more of a topdown person (you know, the actor entering the stage too late with "shut up, just tell me the name of the piece!")
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• 1908[17:16:22] <nalan> how can i get back the configuration file(s) in /etc/nginx
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• 1910[17:16:27] <nalan> they're gone
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• 1913[17:16:39] <nalan> can i restore to default(s)?
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• 1916[17:18:10] <annadane> !confmiss
• 1917[17:18:10] <dpkg> You have to especially tell the packaging system to reinstall config files because when they are gone, it is assumed that you want them to stay deleted. "aptitude -o DPkg::Options::='--force-confmiss' reinstall $packagename" will restore them (man dpkg for details). If the package uses <ucf> for config file management, ask me about <ucf confmiss>.
• 1918[17:18:15] <annadane> i think that ^ nalan
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• 1923[17:20:08] <papemco> Hello guys, I use jmtpfs to mount my android to the PC, but of late it is becomingrea
• 1924[17:20:28] <papemco> It is becoming really annoyingly slow
• 1925[17:20:43] <papemco> Any advice on what I should do?
• 1926[17:21:04] <papemco> I am running Debian 9.6 stretch
• 1927[17:21:20] <n4dir> not really in mobiles, but you could run a ssh server on the android and mount it with sshfs
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• 1936[17:24:09] <papemco> What I mean by slow is that when I am browsing through my phone files, it takes long to read them and sometimes freezes for sometime trying to load the content of a certain folder
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• 1956[17:36:03] <blackflow> papemco: browsing the phone's sd card?
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• 2029[18:17:13] <csanyipal> Hi,
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• 2031[18:18:13] <csanyipal> I just installed on a very old Toshiba 2540CDS laptop with netinstall iso cd image: debian-31r0-i386-netinst.iso
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• 2033[18:18:53] <csanyipal> I am trying to set up the apt, so I have now the sources.list with only one line, like this:
• 2034[18:19:16] <csanyipal> deb replaced-url
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• 2036[18:20:23] <csanyipal> Now when I run 'apt-get update' I get error messages about it can't to download the package list because: sarge/main Packages 404 Not Found
• 2037[18:20:40] <dvs> !sarge sources.list
• 2038[18:20:40] <dpkg> hmm... sarge sources.list is "deb replaced-url
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• 2040[18:21:09] <csanyipal> Oh.. OK then, I will correct this line then. Thanks!
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• 2044[18:23:29] <csanyipal> It works now.
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• 2047[18:24:40] <csanyipal> Can I, after I set up Sarge, to upgrade it step by step to the current stable Debian release?
• 2048[18:25:27] <csanyipal> Of course, I must then in every step to build a custom kernel, because of the cmov kernel support.
• 2049[18:25:39] <papemco> backflow: yes, browsing the sdcard
• 2050[18:25:54] <abrotman> csanyipal: if you're going to do that, why not start with a newer version?
• 2051[18:25:56] <abrotman> (but yes, you can)
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• 2053[18:26:41] <csanyipal> abrotman: because this laptop is so old, that the newer kernels does not support it's CPU cmov feature.
• 2054[18:27:01] <abrotman> well, how do you think you'll get to newer versions of Debian ?
• 2055[18:27:10] <abrotman> are you going to complie your own?
• 2056[18:27:16] <csanyipal> And it has only 64 MB of RAM, so newer install cd iso images just fail.
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• 2075[18:36:40] <csanyipal> abrotman: with the 'apt-get upgrade' command, and there are certainly some extra steps out there too.
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• 2077[18:38:16] <noln> newer debians depend on kernel features that sarge's kernel (2.4?) might not have. e.g. how can systemd run if cgroups were introduced not before 2006?
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• 2083[18:39:28] <csanyipal> I am using now the kernel 2.6.8-2-386 .
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• 2130[19:05:06] <jhutchins> 3
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• 2142[19:08:40] <jhutchins> csanyipal: There are a few obscure projects out there to develop current versions of linux for archaic hardware, rather than having to run on older, probably less secure versions.
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• 2147[19:09:52] <csanyipal> jhutchins: really? Where?
• 2148[19:10:42] <jhutchins> csanyipal: Given efforts to build distributions for low-end hardware like the Rasberry Pi, they may have made progress recently. They tend to die out as the founder's older hardware fails.
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• 2150[19:11:06] <jhutchins> csanyipal: I do not know of any current projects, but they have been around pretty constantly.
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• 2156[19:12:26] <csanyipal> Oh.
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• 2203[19:46:41] <csanyipal> I think I am going to do steps described here:
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• 2205[19:46:42] <csanyipal> replaced-url
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• 2207[19:47:27] <csanyipal> I do well?
• 2208[19:47:48] <areyouloco> just do: sudo apt update && sudo apt dist-upgrade
• 2209[19:47:52] <areyouloco> should work
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• 2281[20:36:27] * SpeedyG is wondering if anything will break if openjdk-11 is removed from deb-buster... oh well, we'll see...
• 2282[20:37:02] <csanyipal> Thank you all for help.
• 2283[20:37:16] <csanyipal> I will returnk tomorrow. Bye!
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• 2305[20:50:37] <bl4s> hi, i am using a debian server to act as a router and firewall at home. iam planning to setup he.net ipv6 tunnel. can i also assign ipv6 addresses from that range to LAN / WLAN as dhcp? i saw wide-dhcp6-server and radvd. are those sufficent for the task?
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• 2336[21:07:03] <SpeedyG> !es
• 2337[21:07:03] <dpkg> Este canal es de soporte técnico en Inglés para Debian. Si prefiere que el soporte sea en Español, puede ingresar en #debian-es tecleando /join #debian-es en la línea de chat.
• 2338[21:11:28] <joepublic> lol that channel has as part of its topic "THIS IS NOT #ubuntu-es" (in Spanish)
• 2339[21:12:20] <SpeedyG> well, makes sense I guess ;)
• 2340[21:12:29] <SpeedyG> as this is also not #ubuntu ;)
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• 2345[21:15:41] <[sr]> howdy
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• 2347[21:15:52] <[sr]> i need an old package, php5-sqlite3 with version 5.6.22+dfsg-1
• 2348[21:15:57] <btel> Hi All, Are people using iftables now on stretch ? or still iptables ? I'm moving from CentOS(firewalld) to debian so really confused what to do. Can anyone point to some doc or link
• 2349[21:16:08] <[sr]> i've been searching the archives but cant find it, can someone help?
• 2350[21:18:04] <derlg> [sr]: why that package?
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• 2360[21:20:16] <[sr]> derlg: have an old machine that can't touch and need sqlite to add a function, the archives have almost everything, not this one
• 2361[21:20:16] <[sr]> :s
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• 2363[21:20:57] <joepublic> I see 5.2 and 5.3 on archive.debian.org
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• 2366[21:21:24] <[sr]> ya, not 5.6 :(
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• 2376[21:37:25] <Sellerie> joepublic: good evening
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• 2379[21:38:21] <joepublic> Greetings and Salutations
• 2380[21:38:33] <Sellerie> Remember the issue I had last time?
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• 2382[21:38:56] <Sellerie> I did a BIOS update and now I was able to get some more info on it
• 2383[21:39:01] <joepublic> You couldn't boot, right?
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• 2385[21:39:35] <joepublic> Black screen of nothingness before any opportunity to enter password to decrypt storage
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• 2387[21:39:55] <Sellerie> Yes
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• 2391[21:42:16] <Sellerie> After the BIOS update, its still not booting, but I now land on the initramfs shell saying that it cannot find the uuid of the ext4 drive (that is inside the luks container)
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• 2394[21:43:24] <Sellerie> Also that shell does not contain cryptsetup, so apparently that module is missing
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• 2403[21:46:14] <Sellerie> Well it seems like there is a bug that makes this not be included
• 2404[21:48:04] <Sellerie> Is there a place where I can report such a bug?
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• 2411[21:50:01] <_Vi> Which Rust version should I target to increase chances of making my prospective package available in Debian Buster? 1.30.0?
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• 2413[21:50:29] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: do you have a crypttab? did you update the initramfs after creating the crypttab?
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• 2415[21:51:13] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Its a fresh install that was never booted before
• 2416[21:51:14] <SerajewelKS> does the initrd environment even see the physical disk?
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• 2418[21:51:52] <Sellerie> Yes it appears (/dev/sda)
• 2419[21:52:03] <Sellerie> And so does it in GRUB
• 2420[21:52:46] <Sveta> Debian raid hp microserver n54l
• 2421[21:52:46] <Sveta> replaced-url
• 2422[21:53:41] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: i don't know what you mean by that
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• 2425[21:54:40] <Sveta> SerajewelKS the partition type
• 2426[21:54:55] <SerajewelKS> now you're just saying terms
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• 2428[21:55:05] <SerajewelKS> where do you expect to see "logical" or "primary" in that screenshot
• 2429[21:55:10] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: The weirdest thing is that `cryptsetup` is not known to the initramfs shell, therefore there is no way I can unlock the encrypted root with from it
• 2430[21:55:54] <Sveta> Like at replaced-url
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• 2433[21:56:38] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: what timestamp, i'm not watching a 23 minute video
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• 2435[21:57:11] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: hmm. usually that would happen if the initrd is built when there isn't a suitable crypttab
• 2436[21:57:23] <SerajewelKS> but if the installer did it, that shouldn't be the case
• 2437[21:57:44] <Sellerie> This happened with both the Debian Stable and the Debian Testing installer
• 2438[21:58:28] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: you are using the GUI installer and this guy is using the CUI installer, that's likely responsible for the discrepancy
• 2439[21:58:36] <Sveta> SerajewelKS 6:15
• 2440[21:58:40] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: at any rate, it's redundant informations. partitions 1-4 are always primary and partitions 5+ are always logical.
• 2441[21:59:06] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: well except when you're having a GPT
• 2442[21:59:06] <SerajewelKS> information*
• 2443[21:59:20] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: GPT does not have logical partitions
• 2444[21:59:26] <Sellerie> Exactly
• 2445[21:59:36] <Sellerie> Wait, oh
• 2446[21:59:45] <Sellerie> I didnt know that there is no such feature in that
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• 2448[21:59:59] <Sellerie> (Just that its not used there)
• 2449[22:00:02] <SerajewelKS> oh that's probably why, here
• 2450[22:00:12] <SerajewelKS> since the disk is over 2.7TB, msdos disklabel can't be used
• 2451[22:00:35] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: that's what's going on. msdos disklabels have a 2.7TB limit, and your screenshow shows 4TB disks.
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• 2453[22:01:00] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: so the installer used GPT instead, because it does not have that limitation. GPT does not require "logical partitions" and so there is no primary/logical distinction.
• 2454[22:02:21] <SerajewelKS> msdos labels can have at most four partitions. so a hack was devised; we use one of those four as an "extended partition" and this layout allows more partitions. but they are not *true* partitions.
• 2455[22:02:21] *** Quits: Brainium (~brainium@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 2456[22:02:32] <SerajewelKS> they are "logical" partitions within the extended container.
• 2457[22:03:47] *** Quits: SebastianThorn (d540616f@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 2458[22:04:08] <SerajewelKS> GPT does not require such a hack because it allows many more partitions, so there is no need for an extended partition nor any concept of logical partitions. every partition on a GPT is "primary."
• 2459[22:04:37] <Sveta> SerajewelKS Ok
• 2460[22:05:26] <Sveta> It does not let me set bootable to ON
• 2461[22:05:40] *** Quits: tmiland (~c0a80209@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
• 2462[22:06:01] <Sellerie> Yeah because its not MSDOS Partition table
• 2463[22:06:03] <Sveta> Will it use 4tb or only two?
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• 2465[22:06:20] <Sellerie> on GPT there is no such thing as bootable flag afaik
• 2466[22:06:24] <Sveta> Should it be msdos or not?
• 2467[22:06:36] <Sellerie> It depends strongly on your usecase
• 2468[22:06:42] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: if you use msdos then you're limited to 2.7TB of disk space
• 2469[22:06:50] <SerajewelKS> the other 1.3TB of your disk would be unusable
• 2470[22:07:18] <Sveta> Gpt is better here
• 2471[22:07:22] <SerajewelKS> GPT will work fine, anyway
• 2472[22:07:39] <SerajewelKS> however, I would strongly advise you to have a separate /boot partition (RAID1 or raw)
• 2473[22:07:39] <Sveta> I guess it already knows whats bootable?
• 2474[22:07:41] <Sellerie> Can you install GRUB into the GPT MBR?
• 2475[22:07:48] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: yes
• 2476[22:08:14] <Sveta> I have both on / now pretty sure thats wrong
• 2477[22:08:22] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: the concept of a "bootable partition" is a bit outdated anyway, typically you're booting a bootloader from the MBR, and the bootloader already knows what can be booted
• 2478[22:08:43] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: i ran a system with / in LVM in RAID1 in GPT
• 2479[22:08:48] <SerajewelKS> without a separate /boot
• 2480[22:08:58] <SerajewelKS> grub would randomly decide it didn't like that and fail to boot after kernel updates
• 2481[22:09:06] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: So, regarding my issue...what can I do?
• 2482[22:09:10] <SerajewelKS> using a separate /boot in RAID1 in GPT resolved that issue for me
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• 2484[22:09:29] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: i'm not sure, i've not heard of a case where the installer doesn't put cryptsetup in the initrd, if encryption was selected during partitioning
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• 2487[22:09:56] <SerajewelKS> you can try running the installer in rescue mode, chroot into your environment, rebuild the initrd and update grub
• 2488[22:10:03] <SerajewelKS> making sure that the crypttab is sane
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• 2493[22:11:06] <Sveta> SerajewelKS I mean 20gb for os and the rest for data. What are their mount points?
• 2494[22:12:00] <SerajewelKS> wait you have a 20GB partition on each disk "for the OS" outside of RAID
• 2495[22:12:04] <SerajewelKS> how is that even supposed to work?
• 2496[22:12:10] <Sveta> And from your messages i understand it will find a place for grub automatically. Correct?
• 2497[22:12:22] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: yes. though, is your system BIOS or UEFI?
• 2498[22:12:37] <SerajewelKS> because regardless of which, your layout is not correct
• 2499[22:12:42] <Sveta> I put it into raid now hold on i will update screenshot
• 2500[22:13:03] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: let me try this
• 2501[22:13:11] <SerajewelKS> if it's BIOS, grub needs an extra partition to boot from GPT. if it's UEFI, you're missing the EFI system partition.
• 2502[22:13:20] <SerajewelKS> so either way, you need an additional partition
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• 2505[22:15:14] <Sveta> Raid1 installer
• 2506[22:15:14] <Sveta> replaced-url
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• 2509[22:16:04] <Sveta> SerajewelKS idk whether bios or uefi. It is hp proliant microserver n54L
• 2510[22:16:46] <SerajewelKS> ok. you need to figure out which it is.
• 2511[22:16:57] *** Quits: cCkw (~ejakuk@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2512[22:16:57] <SerajewelKS> otherwise grub will not install successfully
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• 2514[22:17:53] <Sveta> Dunno how to check
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• 2517[22:18:40] <SerajewelKS> according to google, /sys/firmware/efi will exist if and only if the system was booted using UEFI
• 2518[22:18:51] <SerajewelKS> so go to the installer shell and ls -l /sys/firmware/efi
• 2519[22:19:08] <SerajewelKS> side note: guided partitioning will create the necessary boot partitions for you
• 2520[22:19:59] <Sveta> That file does not exist
• 2521[22:20:40] <Sveta> Does guided partitioning do raid ?
• 2522[22:21:36] <Sveta> SerajewelKS ^^
• 2523[22:21:58] *** Quits: devbaka (~devbaka@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2524[22:21:58] <SerajewelKS> no, but you could use it to at least get the boot partitions set up, then delete the others
• 2525[22:22:11] <SerajewelKS> if it doesn't exist then you booted as BIOS, so you need a BIOS boot partition for GRUB to work
• 2526[22:22:27] *** Quits: OS-41657 (~OS-41657@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2527[22:22:42] <Sveta> 1gb /boot ?
• 2528[22:23:02] *** Quits: noodlepie (~Phillip@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
• 2529[22:23:04] <SerajewelKS> hmm?
• 2530[22:23:06] *** Quits: cmihai (~cmihai@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2531[22:23:15] <Sellerie> Sveta: This should be fine
• 2532[22:23:28] *** Quits: Mazhive (~Mazhive@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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• 2536[22:24:25] <Sveta> Does it have to be the first partition or it does not matter ?
• 2537[22:24:49] <SerajewelKS> i don't know if it matters, i've always had it be near the start of the disk though
• 2538[22:25:08] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: I just ran `update-initramfs -u` inside the chroot, the crypttab exists, but its still not booting, currently only staying at a blinking cursor at the top left
• 2539[22:25:21] *** Quits: snowgoggles (~snowgoggl@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2540[22:25:34] <Sveta> 20gb for OS on / ? Everything else for data on / ? One of mount points needs to be changed but i do not know to what
• 2541[22:26:03] <Sveta> Sellerie thanks!
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• 2546[22:27:30] <Sellerie> Sveta: 20GB is not alot, but its enough for a successfull installation and a minimal system
• 2547[22:27:49] *** Joins: noodlepie (~Phillip@replaced-ip)
• 2548[22:28:34] <Sveta> The /boot lives only on one disk not both right?
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• 2550[22:29:47] *** Quits: Al_lA (~derwhalfi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2551[22:29:48] <Sellerie> It depends on what you chose to RAID. If its the whole harddrives, /boot will be on both the drives
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• 2554[22:32:05] <Sveta> Ok
• 2555[22:32:28] <Sellerie> But if you do RAID1, that's also what you do want, right?
• 2556[22:32:36] *** Quits: alexandros (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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• 2559[22:34:23] <Sveta> Sellerie if i choose "reserved for bios" instead of "physical volume for raid" then raidvwill not get it
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• 2562[22:34:51] <Sveta> Also i do not get the mount points they can not be both /
• 2563[22:35:06] <Sellerie> Sveta: Of course they can
• 2564[22:35:23] <Sellerie> They're seen as one drive if you put them in RAID1
• 2565[22:35:59] *** Joins: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip)
• 2566[22:36:17] <Sveta> I mean 50gb for os and 3.9tb for data
• 2567[22:36:29] <Sveta> Got to be diff mount points
• 2568[22:36:30] <Sellerie> Oh sorry
• 2569[22:36:35] <Sveta> :)
• 2570[22:36:46] <Sellerie> I misunderstood you there apparently
• 2571[22:36:55] <Sveta> What is it? / and /data ?
• 2572[22:37:03] <Sellerie> What do you mean?
• 2573[22:37:04] <Sveta> No worries
• 2574[22:37:33] <Sellerie> I mean - what is supposed to be on the 3.9tb partition?
• 2575[22:38:10] <Sveta> It probably does not even ask for mount point anymore after i chanfed the partition type to raid
• 2576[22:38:27] <Sveta> Lots of photos videos etc
• 2577[22:38:33] <Sellerie> I see
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• 2581[22:38:53] <Sellerie> Well why not make that thing either a drive under /media/<username>/?
• 2582[22:39:07] *** Joins: orphean (~Orphean@replaced-ip)
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• 2584[22:39:08] <Sellerie> Or directly make it your home and save them in /home/<username>/videos?
• 2585[22:39:15] <Sveta> Not sure where to specify mount point. I will try to configure software raid now maybe it will ask
• 2586[22:39:22] <Sellerie> Uh
• 2587[22:39:33] <Sveta> Yes maybe /home
• 2588[22:39:36] *** Joins: orphean (~Orphean@replaced-ip)
• 2589[22:39:45] <Sveta> Yes maybe /home
• 2590[22:39:55] <Sveta> Hmm
• 2591[22:40:11] <Sellerie> If you dont specifically declare it to be used on a mount point, it will not get mounted or land as an fstab entry
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• 2593[22:41:33] <Sveta> ok
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• 2595[22:42:05] <Sellerie> You can also just configure it after the install if you cannot device yet
• 2596[22:42:17] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: what's the point of having the two partitions?
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• 2601[22:44:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1447
• 2602[22:44:18] <Sveta> The data one wont be used as much
• 2603[22:44:25] <Sveta> Raid1 v3
• 2604[22:44:25] <Sveta> replaced-url
• 2605[22:44:37] <SerajewelKS> that's not really a good reason
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• 2608[22:45:13] <SerajewelKS> the ideal setup IMO would be RAID1 containing LVM containing a single /
• 2609[22:45:20] <Sveta> Easier to reinstall os if data is separate
• 2610[22:45:21] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Well in case its full, the root is still properly, usable, also maybe its just for a better logical disconnection of both
• 2611[22:45:22] <SerajewelKS> with ~5% free space in the LVM for snapshots
• 2612[22:45:42] *** Quits: snowgoggles (~snowgoggl@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2613[22:45:46] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: there's a reservation of free space for root anyway
• 2614[22:45:47] <Sellerie> Also yes, the reason Sveta mentioned
• 2615[22:45:50] <Sveta> not familiar with lvm
• 2616[22:46:03] <noahmg123> When I type (1) in certain text fields, it gets replaced with a 1 in a circle, but it still takes 3 cursor moves to get through.
• 2617[22:46:06] <noahmg123> I think I accidentally installed a package that's doing this, but I don't know which one it is
• 2618[22:46:07] *** Joins: donofrio (~donofrio@replaced-ip)
• 2619[22:46:31] <SerajewelKS> i'm not sure that's really much of a good reason either, you can simply delete everything except /home and then install into the existing volume
• 2620[22:46:39] *** Quits: aspyct (~aspyct@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2621[22:47:00] <SerajewelKS> if you have to reinstall anyway, something else is probably very wrong already, such as your disks failed
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• 2624[22:47:30] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: yeah but its as simple as one forgotten switch (format set to no) that is set to yes by default in case of a reinstallation, I'd also prefer seperating that stuff
• 2625[22:47:35] <SerajewelKS> i mean you can do what you want, but i don't see the point in it. we have several production servers where /var is a separate volume and it's caused us nothing but problems.
• 2626[22:47:56] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: i mean, if you're doing a reinstall, then you already made a backup. right?
• 2627[22:47:58] *** Quits: Tarrasquero (~Tarrasque@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2628[22:48:06] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Not necessarily?
• 2629[22:48:31] <SerajewelKS> then you must not care about the data very much :)
• 2630[22:48:33] *** Quits: stefanc_diff (~stefanc_d@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 2631[22:48:50] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: I am an apprentice, I dont have alot of money
• 2632[22:48:57] <SerajewelKS> you can just as easily accidentally format the /home partition during a reinstall
• 2633[22:49:03] <Sellerie> And local storage is expensive
• 2634[22:49:26] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Yes, but it requires alot more steps to go wrong for this to happen
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• 2636[22:49:39] <SerajewelKS> you can easily backup with restic to B2 for $0.01 per GB-month of storage, not having backups isn't an option in this day and age
• 2637[22:49:46] <Sellerie> B2?
• 2638[22:49:56] *** Quits: Gurty (~princess@replaced-ip) (Quit: Kooll ~o~ datalove <3³\infty)
• 2639[22:50:04] <SerajewelKS> replaced-url
• 2640[22:50:13] <Sellerie> My upload rate is catastrophical
• 2641[22:50:24] <SerajewelKS> that's why you use restic, it deduplicates
• 2642[22:50:40] <Sellerie> Uploading ~10GB should take about one night here
• 2643[22:51:19] *** Quits: Ricardo__ (~rick@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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• 2645[22:52:14] <SerajewelKS> for context, Sveta is installing onto server hardware with 2x 4TB disks, i'm guessing they can afford backups
• 2646[22:52:16] <n4dir> noahmg123: /var/log/apt/history.log
• 2647[22:52:17] *** Quits: Cabanossi (~Cabanossi@replaced-ip) (Quit: Bye, bye...)
• 2648[22:52:24] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Yes
• 2649[22:52:36] *** Joins: snowgoggles (~snowgoggl@replaced-ip)
• 2650[22:52:54] <SerajewelKS> there's still very little reason to have separate / and /home
• 2651[22:53:09] <SerajewelKS> if the argument is "normal users might chew up all of the space" then just increase the free space reservation for root
• 2652[22:53:16] <SerajewelKS> that's much easier to change than the partition layout
• 2653[22:53:17] <Sellerie> Still you maybe want to seperate that stuff logically, maybe there is no reason but I would just prefer it from a subjective stand point
• 2654[22:53:30] *** Joins: Cabanossi (~Cabanossi@replaced-ip)
• 2655[22:53:38] <SerajewelKS> i think it's useless division that will cause problems as soon as / is no longer big enough
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• 2658[22:53:50] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: In case of 20GBs, yes
• 2659[22:54:02] <Sellerie> But IMO not if its e.g. 100GBs
• 2660[22:54:02] <Sveta> The 1gb bios partition mount point is /boot or i do not use it and give it to grub later?
• 2661[22:54:06] *** Joins: snowgoggles (~snowgoggl@replaced-ip)
• 2662[22:54:19] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: yup and "nobody will ever need more than 720kB of RAM" :)
• 2663[22:54:25] <Sellerie> Sveta: make it be /boot, so you can update properly
• 2664[22:54:27] <Sveta> Yay
• 2665[22:54:30] *** Quits: Javabean (~Javabean@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 2666[22:54:31] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: no. noooooo
• 2667[22:54:37] <Sveta> Hmm
• 2668[22:54:39] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: the bios partition should not be formatted
• 2669[22:54:44] <Sellerie> Oh
• 2670[22:54:48] <Sellerie> Dont format it
• 2671[22:54:49] <SerajewelKS> it is not /boot. it is where grub stage2 lives
• 2672[22:55:03] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: in case of uefi, its /boot/efi
• 2673[22:55:05] <Sveta> Ok i select "do not use"
• 2674[22:55:15] <Sellerie> Wait
• 2675[22:55:21] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: no. the BIOS partition is never /boot/efi.
• 2676[22:55:26] <Sellerie> We're talking about different things here right?
• 2677[22:55:27] <SerajewelKS> Sellerie: you're thinking of the EFI system partition
• 2678[22:55:52] *** Quits: sdoubleyou (~sdoubleyo@replaced-ip) (Quit: sdoubleyou)
• 2679[22:55:55] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Yes apparently
• 2680[22:55:56] <SerajewelKS> Sveta: that's the correct option. grub-install will automatically pick it up when you install grub at the end.
• 2681[22:56:30] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: BTW I am currently reinstalling Debian with guided installation with LVM and encryption, lets see if it will boot up
• 2682[22:56:36] <SerajewelKS> note that i'm less against having separate volumes for / and /home when using something like btrfs, which is a storage pool anyway
• 2683[22:56:48] <SerajewelKS> so the free space division doesn't exist
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• 2685[22:57:05] <Sveta> Raid1 v4
• 2686[22:57:05] <Sveta> replaced-url
• 2687[22:57:06] <SerajewelKS> the only times i've needed a separate /home is for technical reasons, e.g. /home is on a second disk.
• 2688[22:57:10] <Sellerie> I'd strongly recommend not using BTRFS for data that you cant afford to lose
• 2689[22:57:28] <Sellerie> e.g. family photos/videos
• 2690[22:57:33] <SerajewelKS> right, i don't use btrfs anyway. i just mean in general, that's one case where i'd be fine with separate filesystems since they share free space.
• 2691[22:57:47] <SerajewelKS> but regardless, you should be taking backups anyway. if you have backups, using more experimental filesystems is fine.
• 2692[22:57:50] <Sveta> Btrfs??
• 2693[22:57:56] *** Quits: hakash (~hakash@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2694[22:57:57] <Sellerie> Sveta: B-Tree Filesystem
• 2695[22:58:00] <SerajewelKS> if you don't have backups..... you don't care much about your data :)
• 2696[22:58:09] <Sveta> I use ext4
• 2697[22:58:14] <noln> btrfs is stable for daily desktop usage on up-to-date debian stretch.
• 2698[22:58:52] <SerajewelKS> noln: Sveta is building a server complete with raid1
• 2699[22:58:57] <Sellerie> noln: I know enough people in my circle of friends that said exactly this
• 2700[22:59:05] <Sellerie> Until they lost all their data
• 2701[22:59:27] <Sellerie> I will make a big bow around BTRFS
• 2702[22:59:38] <SerajewelKS> my trust issues with btrfs have less to do with the filesystem and more to do with the lack of recovery tools. if something goes wrong, you're just fucked without backups.
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• 2704[22:59:44] <Sellerie> This literally happened to 5 people I know
• 2705[22:59:49] <SerajewelKS> but again, you ALWAYS NEED BACKUPS
• 2706[23:00:07] <Sellerie> Yes
• 2707[23:00:19] <Sellerie> But I know a person who'se harddrive died
• 2708[23:00:22] <SerajewelKS> backups are not a luxury, they are a necessary part of owning data
• 2709[23:00:32] <Sellerie> She wanted to restore the backups, and BAM, the backup drive died too
• 2710[23:00:53] <SerajewelKS> that's why you use the 3-2-1 strategy
• 2711[23:01:19] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Yeah but not in a home situation
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• 2713[23:01:28] <SerajewelKS> i am in a home situation and i use it
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• 2717[23:01:45] <Sellerie> I e.g. srsly have better things to do than spend more than half an hour to spend on taking backups per week
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• 2719[23:01:58] <SerajewelKS> i don't spend any time on it, it's all automated in cron
• 2720[23:02:07] <blackflow> word.
• 2721[23:02:07] <SerajewelKS> i check once a week or so to make sure the backups are sane
• 2722[23:02:10] <n4dir> hence the saying: one backup is the same as none backup.
• 2723[23:02:33] <SerajewelKS> the backups are taken automatically and replicated off-site automatically
• 2724[23:02:48] <Sellerie> SerajewelKS: Thats cool and stuff
• 2725[23:03:00] <Sellerie> I also started backing up important data offsite now
• 2726[23:03:07] <Sellerie> s/now/just recently/
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• 2729[23:03:38] <Sveta> Our backup is dvds about one to two dvds a year
• 2730[23:04:08] <blackflow> we do backups every 5 minutes, ZFS snapshots sent offsite
• 2731[23:04:10] <Sveta> Got lots of them now hard to browse as there is no one pc with them
• 2732[23:04:26] <Sveta> Hence the server setup
• 2733[23:04:38] <Sveta> blackflow so pro
• 2734[23:05:02] <blackflow> well the data is that important :)
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• 2736[23:05:18] <SerajewelKS> blackflow: my personal server does backups every hour using restic to S3, and i retain 48 hourly backups, 8 weekly backups, and 24 monthly backups
• 2737[23:05:30] <SerajewelKS> it's insane how little it costs
• 2738[23:05:34] <hypn0> 5 minutes? how much space do you use
• 2739[23:05:36] <blackflow> we do up to 30 daily, due to GDPR
• 2740[23:05:46] <blackflow> hypn0: approaching a TB, so not that mihc
• 2741[23:05:48] <blackflow> *much
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• 2744[23:06:11] <SerajewelKS> hypn0: keep in mind that deduplication in modern backup systems means you only have to back up what changed
• 2745[23:06:34] <blackflow> 12 x 5 minutes, then on midnight a daily is copied, 30x
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• 2747[23:07:00] <hypn0> to restore then, you need all backups?
• 2748[23:07:08] <SerajewelKS> my server volume is 20GB but each backup only adds about 15MB of data
• 2749[23:07:20] <SerajewelKS> hypn0: with restic, no. but i don't know what blackflow uses.
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• 2751[23:07:55] <SerajewelKS> restic allows you to discard backups arbitrarily; the backups don't depend on each other like they do in an incremental system
• 2752[23:08:16] <blackflow> SerajewelKS: ZFS snapshots
• 2753[23:09:11] <Sellerie> joepublic: Interesting, a new installation now just worked
• 2754[23:09:26] <Sellerie> With the new BIOS version
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• 2772[23:22:41] <bl4s> exit
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• 2808[23:41:36] <lilith93> Hi I have some issues with a new external harddrive (WD blue + external housing). When I eject the device in thunar my system freezes
• 2809[23:41:57] <simbalion> I understand the RCs for the installer are being released, is this a good time to upgrade to buster? or is there a better milestone to wait for (on non-essential systems)
• 2810[23:42:34] <lilith93> I read that this can be a kernel bug in 4.9.0-8. Anyone else with similar issues?
• 2811[23:43:14] *** Quits: b0b (~bob@replaced-ip) (Quit: o/)
• 2812[23:44:56] <karlpinc> simbalion: The ultimate milestone is a stable release. :-|
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• 2814[23:45:35] <simbalion> karlpinc: well obviously :) But I'm only thinking about one workstation..
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• 2816[23:45:57] <simbalion> karlpinc: I guess a better question would have been is buster in a freeze now that installer RCs are being tested?
• 2817[23:46:20] <karlpinc> simbalion: The other big milestone, and I don't know where this is, is whether buster is frozen.
• 2818[23:47:02] <simbalion> karlpinc: that's what I was really thinking of.. dunno why I didn't phrase my question that way. It seems like there's no point in waiting once the packages are frozen
• 2819[23:47:45] <jhutchins> ,kernels
• 2820[23:47:46] <judd> Available kernel versions are: experimental: 4.19.0-trunk-686-pae (4.19.5-1~exp1); sid: 4.19.0-1-686-pae (4.19.12-1); buster: 4.18.0-3-686 (4.18.20-2); stretch-backports: 4.18.0-0.bpo.3-686 (4.18.20-2~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.9.0-8-686-pae (4.9.130-2); jessie-backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.8-686-pae (4.9.110-3+deb9u5~deb8u1); wheezy-
• 2821[23:47:47] <judd> backports: 3.16.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.16.39-1+deb8u1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-6-686-pae (3.2.102-1)
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• 2825[23:48:43] <jhutchins> lilith93: You could try the kernel from backports, see if that fixes it.
• 2826[23:49:08] *** himcesjf_ is now known as him-cesjf
• 2827[23:49:43] <lilith93> jhutchins: Do you know about that problem? Is it a generell problem or related to thunar?
• 2828[23:50:15] <jhutchins> simbalion: The end of development is often the time when the developers tackle big, hard to fix bugs, break things seriously and wait for a proper fix before posting it.
• 2829[23:50:20] <simbalion> Ah, buster freeze is in March: replaced-url
• 2830[23:50:24] <lilith93> It's also not clear to me what's the right way is to unmount / eject a drive
• 2831[23:50:46] <jhutchins> lilith93: You mentioned it might be the kernel. Trying the one from backports is simple and reversable.
• 2832[23:50:50] <karlpinc> simbalion: This is a good graph to watch. There is a marked change at freeze.
• 2833[23:50:53] <lilith93> with umount I still see the HDD symbol on the desktop
• 2834[23:50:58] <karlpinc> replaced-url
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• 2836[23:51:18] <simbalion> jhutchins: Thanks, I understand. I was only considering this for my gaming desktop, mostly as a way of testing buster before deploying it to my more important systems later in the year
• 2837[23:51:19] <lilith93> jhutchins: I'll check the previous one
• 2838[23:51:53] <jhutchins> lilith93: thunar should have an eject button next to the drive identifier.
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• 2840[23:52:30] * karlpinc wonders why thunar does not notice a umount.
• 2841[23:52:33] <jhutchins> lilith93: That's always worked for me. If it's automatically mounted, you want to eject it from within the file browser.
• 2842[23:52:53] <jhutchins> karlpinc: fuse
• 2843[23:52:58] *** Quits: mavhc (~mavhc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2844[23:53:22] <lilith93> jhutchins: Yes, but then the system freezes. I wonder if it is save to unplug an external HDD if it is unmounted, but it's still visible on the desktop
• 2845[23:53:30] <karlpinc> jhutchins: Ok. (I never automount, except with autofs.)
• 2846[23:54:07] <jhutchins> karlpinc: thunar, like other file browsers, has some internal code tht mounts USB stuff with fuse.
• 2847[23:54:34] <jhutchins> lilith93: How long are you giving it after hitting eject? Could take a while to write the buffers.
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• 2849[23:54:42] <jhutchins> ,v thunar
• 2850[23:54:43] <judd> Package: thunar on amd64 -- wheezy: 1.2.3-4+b1; jessie: 1.6.3-2; stretch: 1.6.11-1; buster: 1.8.2-1; sid: 1.8.2-1
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• 2861[23:58:02] <lilith93> jhutchins: I have two options in thunar aushängen and auswerfen. The first is unmount I guess, the later eject. Now it eject is greyed out. IIRC that made the system freeze, but now I can't choose it
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• 2864[23:59:35] <annadane> FWIW i also get a full system freeze on "eject" in thunar; i've resorted to just sticking to unmount
• 2865[23:59:39] * lilith93 checks the kernel logs
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